chordal balance on the English concertina
Robert Demaine
As I am beginning to explore the 19th century repertoire for English
concertina I find that it is sometimes difficult to achieve a correct balance
within a chord between the upper and lower registers of the instrument.
The lower notes tend to drown out those above. Is this simply a feature of
my own instrument, a 48 key Wheatstone treble c.1859, or a more general
problem?
Robert Demaine
University of York
Mike Bailey
I have only had my Anglo for 5 days and this is one of the first things I
noticed. The tunes almost sound better (and certainly cleaner) without
the chords. Not only are the chords louder than the melody; playing the
chords drains off bellows air quickly. The 5 fold bellows is totally
inadequate; the 6 fold seems barely adequate and I can see a 7 fold would
be helpful. It seems the instrument is at its best when playing the
melody opposite a single counterpoint note in the lower register. A full
chord drowns everything out. Now I understand why the Irish tunes suite
the instrument so well. Would a small "gateway" port covering the entire
left reed plate help reduce the airflow to the left side and balance
this? I'm sure this has been thought of and disguarded for some reason
which I am too new to understand. For now I am content with the
melodies. :-)
In article <Pine.SGI.3.95L.98051...@ebor.york.ac.uk>,
Joseph Kesselman, yclept Keshlam
Mike Bailey wrote:
>
> I have only had my Anglo for 5 days and this is one of the first things I
> noticed. The tunes almost sound better (and certainly cleaner) without
> the chords.
Note that you don't have to _hold_ the chords. The "English style"
for Anglo (from what I've heard) seems to be a brief, almost
percussive, punch at the chords -- quarter-note at most -- and
alternates them with single notes to further lighten the
accompaniment.
My own ad-hoc style is close to your alternative suggestion:
less chord-oriented than counter-melody, and even there I find
myself starting to do a rhythmic pattern on the left hand in
some places where I would previously have held the key for the
duration, just to get some additional variety and interest in
the sound.
This reminds me of one of my own speculation: Has anyone experimented
with "mute" pads for steel-reeded 'tinas, to bring 'em down to the
volume level of the brass-reed instruments? Seems to me that there's
got to be some way to get both kinds of sound without owning two
instruments.
(Didn't arrive today. Darn. Tomorrow, I hope.)
Marc G. Lamb
In article <3558BA70...@us.ibm.com>, "Joseph Kesselman, yclept Keshlam" <kes...@us.ibm.com> wrote:
>Mike Bailey wrote:
>>
>> I have only had my Anglo for 5 days and this is one of the first things I
>> noticed. The tunes almost sound better (and certainly cleaner) without
>> the chords.
>
>Note that you don't have to _hold_ the chords. The "English style"
>for Anglo (from what I've heard) seems to be a brief, almost
>percussive, punch at the chords -- quarter-note at most -- and
>alternates them with single notes to further lighten the
>accompaniment.
A very common way of playing basses, for both concertinas and accordions. The
better grades of English & Anglo have the individual tone chambers sized to
'balance' the volume of the different-sized reeds. Duets (which are
specifically designed for left-hand accompaniment) frequently have the left
side volume significantly reduced so that the playing of chords &
countermelody does not overpower the melody being played on the right.
>This reminds me of one of my own speculation: Has anyone experimented
>with "mute" pads for steel-reeded 'tinas, to bring 'em down to the
>volume level of the brass-reed instruments? Seems to me that there's
>got to be some way to get both kinds of sound without owning two
>instruments.
?!?!?!? What precisely is a 'mute pad' and how would it mute a reed without
altering its pitch? A more logical way of altering the tone characteristics
would be to have swappable reed pans with a set of brass reeds and tone
chambers sized to fit. But that would cost almost as much as a new
instrument and you would have to break down the instrument to change them out.
And you would have to find a way to prevent them from warping when they were
out of the instrument. Better just to get specific instruments to fulfill
your different needs. Or perhaps reevaluate your needs.
Marc
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Eric Root
We comparative newbies are starting to go afield on the subject of
muting a concertina. A quick Deja search revealed that you guys have
mentioned baffles in passing, but what are they? I haven't seen any
pictures of them in on anybody's web page.
My "new" metal-ended Wheatstone is an extremely powerful, darn
near "rock and roll" machine and is, I hate to admit it, not as
convincing as my Hohner/Bastari on slow airs, waltzes played as
listening pieces, and "songs like Mom used to sing" (in my case, things
like "Bewitched", "I'll be Seeing You", and other good ol' stuff from
the second quarter of this century)
-Eric Root
-REAL guitars, you can see your reflection in 'em!
Joe Kesselman, yclept Keshlam
In <3558c...@news4.his.com>, mgl...@his.com (Marc G. Lamb) writes:
>?!?!?!? What precisely is a 'mute pad' and how would it mute a reed without
>altering its pitch?
Beats me; that's why I asked!
(I was envisaging something equivalent to putting a pillow over the grill --
allowing enough airflow to allow the reeds to sing, but perhaps not as
strongly... and perhaps having enough soft mass to absorb some of the
sound energy. I've no idea whether it would be possible, and I'd bet it
would be uncomfortable, but you're an inventive bunch....)
Otto Smith
Robert Demaine <rl...@york.ac.uk> wrote in article
<Pine.SGI.3.95L.98051...@ebor.york.ac.uk>...
> As I am beginning to explore the 19th century repertoire for English
> concertina I find that it is sometimes difficult to achieve a correct
balance
> within a chord between the upper and lower registers of the instrument.
> The lower notes tend to drown out those above. Is this simply a feature
of
> my own instrument, a 48 key Wheatstone treble c.1859, or a more general
> problem?
>
> Robert Demaine
> University of York
It is my experience that it is a more general problem. Some instruments
have the
opposite problem with the high notes drowning out the lower, (my
ediophone), but
it is more common for the low notes to be louder. One method that I have
used
to counteract the problem is to use different kinds of articulation to make
the
melody notes stand out. Some alternative ways to play big chords are.
1.) roll the chord to the note you wish to stand out, then drop most of the
notes
except the important melody note and possibly octives of it. This is
regularly done
with large chords on the violin. Listen/look at the bach unaccompanied
violin
works where this is frequently done and emulate this style.
2.) Sustain the melody note of the chord for longer than the less important
notes.
In the Molique concerto in G for concertina, this is the only way that we
could
make the "leggiero" section in the second movement work. This part is full
of
three and four note chords. Since the chords are stacatto, it is possible
to hold
the melody note a little longer and make the melody stand out.
3.) Play the important melody note first, then add the chordal
counterpoint.
4.) When you are playing a melody over a counter melody, emphasize the
melody notes with a little more bellows and drop back on notes from the
counter melody.
Techniques 1, 2, and 3 are also used on instruments like the harpsichord
and by some pianists. All pieces have to be interpreted. There is lots of
room for interpretation in all forms of music. Articulation can be done
very
subtlely and can make a great deal of difference. The English system
concertina is my favorite instrument, but two of its drawbacks are:
1. The inability to make one note of a chord louder than the rest, a
technique
which is easily achieved on the piano.
2. The inability to bend notes and perform smooth glisses like the violin
or
the clarinet.
Some of the Bach unaccompanied stuff is great fun on the concertina because
the melody and the counter melody alternate notes. In order to get it to
sound
right the violinist (or the concertina player) has to make the tone and
phrasing
of the instrument change for each note so that the listener can distinguish
between the two melodies and not hear just a jumble. One of the best ways,
in my opinion, to study the concertina is to listen to solo violin, or
fiddle, and
emulate the technique.
DoN. Nichols
In article <6jan4e$cad$1...@newsd-163.iap.bryant.webtv.net>,
Eric Root <er...@webtv.net> wrote:
>We comparative newbies are starting to go afield on the subject of
>muting a concertina. A quick Deja search revealed that you guys have
>mentioned baffles in passing, but what are they? I haven't seen any
>pictures of them in on anybody's web page.
They are internal to the instrument. Some of these days, I'll
photograph the entirity of my Holmwood, which comes with baffles designed to
be swapped out and in at (serious) need. In this case, they are wood,
contoured to match the inside of the endplate, painted black, and provide a
few holes through them compared to the endbox itself, which has *lots* of
them.
Other baffles, though the years:
1) The really old "learner" concertinas (brass reeds, and engraved end
buttons marking the note names), were flat ended, and had a flat
piece of wood mounted below the fretwork (roughly the shape of the
instrument, with a cutout in the center to clear the buttons and
levers.) There was typically something like a 1/16" to 1/8" spacing
between the endbox and the baffle. The design of this was to
minimize the exposure of those nearby to the learning experience. :-)
2) Later instruments tended to have fabric or thin leather mounted in a
similar location. In the case of a fabric, it was usually glued
directly behind the fretwork, while the leather was typically on
spacers. These were typically wooden-ended instruments, and
sometimes the fabric was brightly colored to contrast with the wood
of the ends and show up the fretwork more clearly.
3) The ebony ended ones of the 1920s and thereabouts tended to have a
fine enough fretwork pattern so they did not need baffles to keep
out the bugs, and were usually of a sound level which did not call
for baffles at all. Somewhat later, the fretwork holes opened up
again, and cloth baffles came back into use. I have one McCann duet
from 1957 which has bright red grill cloth behind the ebony ends.
It looks really nice.
3) The metal-ended ones, as you have observed below, were made to be
*loud*. As such, they seldom had baffles of any sort, though
leather ones can be added to an instrument to good effect.
> My "new" metal-ended Wheatstone is an extremely powerful, darn
>near "rock and roll" machine and is, I hate to admit it, not as
>convincing as my Hohner/Bastari on slow airs, waltzes played as
>listening pieces, and "songs like Mom used to sing" (in my case, things
>like "Bewitched", "I'll be Seeing You", and other good ol' stuff from
>the second quarter of this century)
The metal-ended ones tend to be best used in sessions, where you are
otherwise having difficulty hearing your own playing.
The nicest among the steel-reed instruments for quiet playing are
either the ebony-ended ones with the fine fretwork, or the Holmwood boxes
from Hamish Bayne, with the light reeds selected, and the baffles left in
place. Brass sounds *really* nice -- but has reliability problems as well
as response speed problems.
What I would suggest, if you want the metal-ended instrument to
sound quieter would be to fabricate baffles to cover the entirity of the
fretwork from the inside. Make them of fairly thick leather (Tandy Leather
has just about anything that you may need there -- you *may* have other
options, depending on where you live.) Use some small pieces of that as
spacer blocks to hold it spaced off from the metal -- both around the edges,
and if necessary, somewhere in the middle of the larger areas. This has the
advantage of being removable should you need the brighter sound.
Hmm ... instead of using leather blocks -- why not use small velcro
pads to space it from the endplate. That way, you can remove and replace it
at need. (Obviously not too convenient, but doable.) You might even first
experiment with it on the outside, if you think that you'll be needing to
remove and replace it often.
Squeeze On,
DoN.
--
NOTE: spamblocking on against servers which harbor spammers.
Email: <dnic...@d-and-d.com> | Donald Nichols (DoN.)|Voice (703) 938-4564
My Concertina web page: | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
Chris Timson
Eric Root <er...@webtv.net> writes
>We comparative newbies are starting to go afield on the subject of
>muting a concertina. A quick Deja search revealed that you guys have
>mentioned baffles in passing, but what are they? I haven't seen any
>pictures of them in on anybody's web page.
OK, baffles are a layer of leather that goes just inside the
wooden/metal ends of the concertina. They are quite easy to fit. The
trick is to hold them in place with double-sided tape (I can supply
detailed instructions by email if people are interested, or post here if
lots of people are interested). Older instruments frequently had baffles
fitted. The effect is to lower the volume slightly, and to sweeten the
tone quite a lot.
As Anne and I mostly use our concertinas for song accompaniment we see
sweet tone as desirable, and so I have fitted baffles to all our
concertinas exceopt those that already had them. Many band and session
players have the opposite view, preferring that cutting Jeffries sound
that slices through a dozen melodeons. However, if you have an old
instrument with baffles fitted, do not be tempted to remove them as
frequently the spacers inside the action box assumed the existence of
the baffles.
Chris
--
Chris Timson Have concertinas, will travel
and Phone (UK) 01225 863762
Anne Gregson For our home pages and for the Concertina FAQ:
http://www.harbour.demon.co.uk/
Anahata
In article <3558BA70...@us.ibm.com>
kes...@us.ibm.com "Joseph Kesselman, yclept Keshlam" writes:
> This reminds me of one of my own speculation: Has anyone experimented
> with "mute" pads for steel-reeded 'tinas, to bring 'em down to the
> volume level of the brass-reed instruments? Seems to me that there's
> got to be some way to get both kinds of sound without owning two
> instruments.
I've notice a more pronounced difference between wooden ended and metal
ended concertinas.
If you want to do something with an existing box, though, it's common
practice to put a sheet of thin leather inside the ends, directly under
the fretwork. Obviously it's only loosely attached: you don't want to
seal off the airflow completely. It certainly takes the edge off
the sound of any box, perfect if you want it for song
accompaniments rather than leading a dance band.
--
Anahata
ana...@freereed.demon.co.uk http://www.freereed.demon.co.uk/
ana...@locust.ml.org (sends SMS to mobile phone, 8 lines max)
phone 0171 229 6076 home, 0171 638 5577 work, 0976 263827 Orange mobile
Eric Root
Sorry about my previous post. I attempted to use DejaNews to allow me
to quote and snip commentary on Otto Smith's excellent summation of
English concertina technique, but it looks like only half of it came
through and that's a headache-causing mish-mash.
It basically boiled down to:
1) I agree with every thing Otto says.
2) You can also emphasize the lead voice with gracing
3) Pitch and duration are much more easily perceived than
amplitude.
4) We'll just have to fool people about the glisses and
loudness of the different voices.
5) Listen to fiddlers.
er...@webtv.net
In article <01bd7e3b$6b98fb00$efed85c6@otto>, "Otto
Smith" <ot...@olympus.net> wrote:<snippage>> One method
the middle of trying to compose a post myself on trying
to convincingly have more than one voice going, but I
have to say, you really hit the nail on the head. You
should, or let someone else, print this little succinct
lesson on a web page under "How to Play the English
Concertina." One additional method I'd add, which
might not be kosher for classical music, but is actually
another version of your method 1) would be to use greate
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----
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Joe Kesselman, yclept Keshlam
In <gDkCzKAE...@harbour.demon.co.uk>, Chris Timson <ch...@harbour.demon.co.uk> writes:
>OK, baffles are a layer of leather that goes just inside the
>wooden/metal ends of the concertina.
In other words, basically what I was imagining as a "mute" but more agressive
(leather rather than fabric). I'd be interested in details -- how thick, how much
of the grille does it cover, is it solid or provided with vent holes, ...
DoN's suggestion of trying find a way to fit them externally, to avoid the need to
disassemble and reassemble (and to avoid the question of spacers) is interesting
right now, as I'm evaluating a Jeffries at this moment. Love the responsiveness,
impressed with the volume possible... but I do also sing against the beast, and
(as I said earlier in this thread) if there's a way to get both sounds out of
one instrument without wearing out the screw threads, I'm interested.
In addition to velcro, another possibility suggests itself: magnetic rubber
sheeting, which might stay on metal-ended instruments all by itself.
May be too solid a barrier to absorb the high frequencies... but perhaps
magnetically-attached leather would work.
Sounds like someone should do a few experiments.
Marc G. Lamb
In article <6jfpnq$18vs$1...@mdnews.btv.ibm.com>, kes...@alum.mit.edu (Joe Kesselman, yclept Keshlam) wrote:
>In addition to velcro, another possibility suggests itself: magnetic rubber
>sheeting, which might stay on metal-ended instruments all by itself.
>May be too solid a barrier to absorb the high frequencies... but perhaps
>magnetically-attached leather would work.
FWIW, most metal-ended instruments of the Jeffries era have nickel plated
brass ends. No magnets need apply. Personally, I would strongly caution you
against performing any 'customization' or alterations on a Jeffries. If you
want a quiet box, buy a quiet box. The supply of these and other top quality
vintage instruments is finite and I cannot see the need or wisdom of modifying
them beyond normal restoration. If you want to get a quality box with custom
gadgetry, try one of the modern makers such as Jurgen Suttner, John Connor or
Harold Herrington.
Just my opinion.
Chris Timson
Marc G. Lamb <mgl...@his.com> writes
>Personally, I would strongly caution you
>against performing any 'customization' or alterations on a Jeffries.
This is why I like my approach to fitting baffles - using double-sided
tape means the baffles can be fully removed without a sign of their
presence being left. And yes, I agree that I wouldn't get a Jeffries for
song accomaniment (my own treble is a modern Wheatstone, metal ended but
with surprising sweetness of tone). Having said that, a bright noisy
Jeffries is precisely what John Kirkpatrick uses. When I last saw him
(last weekend) I got distortion in my eardrums listening to his playing!
Here are some instructions for fitting baffles I wrote out a couple of
months ago at the request of somebody who offered me some C & S back
issues for them - this is why they read as being addressed to a specific
person. I now present them free to the world!
First you need some leather. I have always bought the leather I need
directly from Colin and didn't know what grade I should use, so I have
just phoned him up and asked. He says you need reasonably stiff
sheepskin (typically as used by organ builders). He also says that such
leather can be dificult to buy in the sort of quantity you need (which
is not much, being basically twice the area of cross section of your
Aeola) and you may be asked to buy say 2 or 3 metres of it, and it's not
cheap. What you could do is contact a concertina specialist such as The
Button Box. Colin said he would be happy to sell you some appropriate
leather if you get in contact with him (his phone no is in the FAQ).
Don't bother to ask Steve Dickinson. For some reason he has a major down
on baffles. The concertina that Colin fitted was a modern Wheatstone
anglo that is my pride and joy. I visited Steve on an unconnected matter
once, and while I was there he asked to look at my anglo to see how it
was doing. As soon as he saw the baffles you could hear the note in his
voice shoot up as he said "Who put these here!!". When I said Colin
Dipper he subsided (there is a certain professional rivalry between the
two, but both have great respect for each other as fellow craftsmen),
but you could see he wasn't very happy about it. I've never been able to
find out from Steve exactly why he doesn't like baffles. It just seems
to be an inbuilt prejudice.
For tools, all you need is a good, sharp modelling knife (it must be
really sharp because you don't want flecks of leather getting into the
reeds. I don't know if you have the brand over there, but I always use
an Olfa knife which allows you to snap off the end of the blade when
it's worn , exposing the next sharp edge) and a pair of scissors for
cutting out paper templates. When Colin cut the baffles he basically did
it by eye, but I am not so skilled, so what I did was to cut paper
templates to fit inside the concertina and then use those as guides when
marking out the leather for cutting. You will also need a marker pen and
some good quality double sided tape. So, here we go:
1) Dismantle one end of the concertina as described in the concertina
FAQ (leaving the reed pan in place as we are not interested in it). Put
everything on one side except the end plate of the concertina, this is
the only bit we are interested in.
2) Using scissors and paper cut out a shape that will fit inside the
end. Since you have an Aeola I guess that means it will be octagonal.
Then cut a hole in the paper for the buttons to fit through when the
instrument is reassembled. Try putting the end plate back onto the
action and trim bits off the paper until everything fits to your
satisfaction.
Guiding principle
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The baffle fits inside the end plate, through which air is drawn when
the concertina is played. If you make the baffles a nice, tight, snug
fit you will find that your concertina will no longer play as the ends
will now be airtight.Therefore don't be exact, leave some space
especially around the button area for air to get through.
3) Once you have the template as you want it then place the template on
the underside of the leather and draw around it with a marker pen. For
appearances sake you want to have the leather so that the shiny side
will be facing outwards when you reassemble the instrument. Then cut out
the leather with the sharp knife.
4) Cut yourself lots of small bits of double-sided tape and stick them
all over the inside of the end plate, between the fretwork and at
various places around the edges. If you use a thick tape this is all the
better as it helps let the air through. You will need quite a lot as
only a few will permit the leather to move and possibly buzz. Strip off
the tape covering, position the leather in place and stick firmly down
(note that if you subsequently decide to remove the baffles you can use
lighter fuel to remove any left over adhesive quite safely).
5) Reassemble the concertina. Try playing the concertina at this point.
You should hear a clear difference between the two ends. The baffled end
should be a bit quieter and significantly sweeter than the unbaffled
end. If the concertina is stiffer to open when playing a note on the
baffled end than the unbaffled end then you may need to trim a little
more leather off the baffle.
6) Do the whole thing again for the other end. You may be able to re-use
your tempate, but you will probably find that the shape of the button
area is different enough that you won't be able to.
And there we are. The beauty of this technique is that you change
nothing permanently. If you subsequently resell the instrument and the
new buyer doesn't like baffles (it's normally only singers like us who
think they're great) then just take them out. It took me about three or
four hours per instrument, but somebody with fewer thumbs than me might
be able to do it quicker.
Anahata
Chris Timson <ch...@harbour.demon.co.uk> writes
>a bright noisy
>Jeffries is precisely what John Kirkpatrick uses. When I last saw him
>(last weekend) I got distortion in my eardrums listening to his playing!
Are you sure about the Jeffries? He's been playing the same Crabb anglo
for years!
Anahata
ana...@freereed.demon.co.uk + http://www.freereed.demon.co.uk/
ana...@locust.co.uk email to mobile phone 8 line messages max
0171 638 5577 (W) 0171 229 6076 (H) 0976 263827 (mobile)
Mike Euritt
>
>In other words, basically what I was imagining as a "mute" but more
agressive
>(leather rather than fabric). I'd be interested in details -- how thick,
how much
>of the grille does it cover, is it solid or provided with vent holes,
Here is what I did, with my wife's expert help, to put baffles in my Jones
and Jefferies.
We took some mesh cloth like the needle point folks use and cut it to fit
inside the end. We glued some pretty red fabric to one side of it and then
cut it to the shape of the concertina, and cut out a big hole for the
buttons, then, having left some small tabs at each core, I think three
corners would really be enough, I laid it into the end, red side to the
grill, and used the screws to hold it in place. I have since removed it from
the Jefferies, but still use it for the Jones. My reason for doing putting
it in was not to cut the sound, but to have 'air cleaners' and that I think
the red is very pretty and adds to the beauty of the Jones.
This morning on Animal Planet there was an English woman, a farmers wife.
Her name was one any anglo player would sit up and take notice of:
Jefferies-Jones
I wonder if she knows?
Mike
Chris Timson
Anahata <Ana...@freereed.demon.co.uk> writes
>Are you sure about the Jeffries? He's been playing the same Crabb anglo
>for years!
Ah um... No I am not sure, it just sounded very like one (but then, see
my earlier comment about Crabb making some Jeffries anglos, so I think
my confusion is understandable).
Joe Kesselman, yclept Keshlam
In <355bc...@news4.his.com>, mgl...@his.com (Marc G. Lamb) writes:
>FWIW, most metal-ended instruments of the Jeffries era have nickel plated
In fact, I agree with you -- which is why I'm exploring purely external (and
non-adhesive) approaches. I'm not about to do anything to the instrument
that might have permanant effects.
Actually, the Jeffries seems to be able to play as quietly as -- or more
quietly than -- my Klingenthal, if I'm gentle with it; part of its greater
responsiveness is that the reeds have a wider _range_ of volume. And
coming down to C does match it to my voice a bit better, which also
helps. So it may be fine without any mucking around. It'll certainly have
no trouble when playing behind a 15-voice chorus.
Eric Root
Like Joe K. says about his Jeffries, my Wheatstone _can_ be played as,
or more, quietly than my Hohner, but the tone is still brash and
trumpetlike. I think I will still experiment with romovable outside
baffling to see if I can sweeten up the timbre. Moleskin (that
sticky-on-one-side stuff you put on your feet to prevent blisters)
sounds good for preliminary prototyping.
Joe Kesselman, yclept Keshlam
In <6jkeqf$p74$1...@newsd-161.iap.bryant.webtv.net>, er...@webtv.net (Eric Root) writes:
>Moleskin (that
>sticky-on-one-side stuff you put on your feet to prevent blisters)
>sounds good for preliminary prototyping.
Be careful; any adhesive is a risk... either of not peeling off cleanly,
or of being too agressive and taking some finish/plating with it. On
the inside where nobody'll look at it, that may not be bad. On the
outside...
(Checked, and sure enough the end plates are nonmagnetic. Darn.
Another beautiful theory killed by an ugly fact.)
Chris Timson
Joe Kesselman, yclept Keshlam <kes...@alum.mit.edu> writes
>Be careful; any adhesive is a risk... either of not peeling off cleanly,
>or of being too agressive and taking some finish/plating with it. On
>the inside where nobody'll look at it, that may not be bad. On the
>outside...
Hint from Colin Dipper (when I had to remove some velcro strip we had
been using to attach Microvox microphones) try soaking off with lighter
fuel.