LightLib is discontinued
Patrice Poirier
«We have discontinued Light Lib.»
Wow!
Patrice Poirier
Montréal, Québec
Mike Borginis
(Light Lib) were no longer supporting VO. I quickly switched to
AccuSoft and haven't regretted it. ImageGear is a far superior product
to Light Lib.
In article <jlh_2.3535$2l4....@wagner.videotron.net>,
--
Mike Borginis
Analogic Software
--== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==--
---Share what you know. Learn what you don't.---
Halldór-Ingi H. Guðmundsson
Do you have a link on the internet?
Best regards,
Halldór-Ingi
explo...@mailcity.com
Thats the problem with 3rd parties... anything can happen.
I wonder when will VO have a built-in graph facility.
In article <jlh_2.3535$2l4....@wagner.videotron.net>,
"Patrice Poirier" <ppoi...@sigma-rh.com> wrote:
> After I ask a question about LightLib to Luxent, I receive this
response...
>
> «We have discontinued Light Lib.»
>
> Wow!
>
> Patrice Poirier
> Montréal, Québec
>
>
JPV
know nothing about them. Everybody can make up it's graphics routines the
way he want them. Are you sure you're using VO ? May your are programming
with VB but found this NG and put all your VB critics here ? Have you check
the boxes to see if Microsoft isn't written somewhere ?
JPV
explo...@mailcity.com
chart.
This has nothing to do with VB or Microsoft.
In article <7hmr8o$a59$1...@news0.skynet.be>,
Will Chapman
explo...@mailcity.com wrote in message <7hnteu$j69$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
|... and write hundreds lines of codes just to draw a basic line chart or
bar
|chart.
|
LightLib was not the only 3rd party graphic library - some of us prefer
GraphicServer and there are a number of others available in the shareware
market (check www.activex.com).
Additionally, it is not that difficult to write your own basic graphics -
see the excellent tutorial on this at the VO Training CVentre (search KnowVO
for the url).
HTH
Will Chapman
explo...@my-dejanews.com
what I am trying to say is that it will be a plus point of VO were to
have its native graphics library... and not just depend on 3rd party
OCX and manually write graphs from the basic API.
well.. as usual.. whenever there is a suggestion to improve VO
you guys will so "NO".
In article <7hojbh$43b$1...@lure.pipex.net>,
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
Philippe Legros
>> LightLib was not the only 3rd party graphic library
And it was certainly not the best, even if it was a french product :-(((
We have one licence, but we stopped to use it a long time ago.
The question I ask today to myself: is it reasoning the aim of VO
applications to create beautiful graphs? Excel do this kind of things so
well, and you can use it a an OLE server (I never do that myself,
however). I have no definitive reply to that question!
PhL
edg...@my-dejanews.com
Philippe Legros <10007...@compuserve.com> wrote:
> The question I ask today to myself: is it reasoning the aim of VO
> applications to create beautiful graphs? Excel do this kind of things so
> well, and you can use it a an OLE server (I never do that myself,
> however). I have no definitive reply to that question!
I'm a cavo freshman user. I think we must be "polyglot" in the sense we have
to catch the best of several languages and use it in constructing our
apps.Connectivity is one of the Windows advantagges.I'snt it?
Second topic:I've found some llibg files on my CAVO cd.It means I may compile
and link llibg commands like in CA5.3?
thanks and regards
edgardo solano
JPV
Philippe,
Yes, but not like Excel who do the job in a close frame, VO allows you to
define your own framework deping on the kind of graphics you want to use. Of
course, you have to design it by yourself or use a third party. In VO 2.5
you will find a very basic graphic sample which shows you how to proceed. I
think, but it's purely personal, that VO doesn't need a -so called- graphic
lib like Excel. It has all the items to let us make it fit "on-size". I've
done my own for the kind of graphics I've to deal with. It's not that
difficult to create your own.
If you really want to, I can indicate how to proceed in a next VO 2.5 topic.
I'm always ready to help VO programmers to improve VO.
Sincerely,
JPV
Will Chapman
explo...@my-dejanews.com wrote in message <7homuh$46h$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
|
|
|what I am trying to say is that it will be a plus point of VO were to
|have its native graphics library... and not just depend on 3rd party
|OCX and manually write graphs from the basic API.
|
|well.. as usual.. whenever there is a suggestion to improve VO
|you guys will so "NO".
|
Well it isn't as straightforward as that - we are just disareeing with you
that it should be something that is built-into VO.
As I understand it the development philosphy for VO (and, indeed, Clipper)
is to produce a powerful database language that is flexible enough for
professional developers to be able to approach any task that their client's
might request.
What that philosphy means is that development time/money will be spent
preferable on strengthening the language (better, development platform)
rather than producing heaps of special controls and auxiliary libraries. The
intention was that the latter would come either from the third party market
or developers themselves.
OK in a Windows development platform it makes sense to build-in the most
basic controls - SLE,MLE,pushbutton, combobox, listbox, radiobutton etc -
but the problem comes where to stop. Should there be 99 different types of
SLE or should the developer (or if there is enough demand, the third party
market) him/her self write their own special flavours?
OK a built-in graphic library would be nice but hardly of universal appeal.
Of all the apps I've written, only two have ever need graphs and so for
those I acquired graphicserver. Why even VB doesn't have a native library -
as far as I recall it bundles GraphicServer.
Also, note that VO does have a built-in Report Writer. Personally, I wish
they'd left it out and spent more time on something more fundamental; Report
Pro and Crystal Reports are much better options (and you can get CR free as
well). Again, does VB have a built-in Report writer; nope it bundles Crystal
reports.
And report writers are much more universally used than graphic libraries;
nope I'd rather see the developers of VO concentrate on keeping the language
upto date for example, giving us the ability to write ActiveX servers (in
2.5).
Will Chapman
Wong
I agree with you.
For software development, we always have limited resource,
and need to decide what is nice to have and what is must
have, and do it good. VO should put the resource to good
used at providing must have(so I don't need to resort to C
or Assembly) and make it correct(less bug), robust(can
detect invalid argument, e.g. DBSEEK(NIL) will not corrupt
memory), extendable(so I can easily add feature I want),
reusable(I don't want I'm the only person using that
feature and only in one application and the only person who
discover all sort of bug in that feature, I like to share
bug with other! :-)).
BTW, Will, as far as I seen, you remain polite to every
body, this is what I need to learn from your.
Regard
Wong
Will Chapman <willc...@dial.pipex.com> wrote in article
<7hpp2j$moa$1...@lure.pipex.net>...
Tracy Thomas
You mentioned getting CR free. Do you have a link or more information
regarding this? Thanks for any infomation you might have.
--
Tracy Thomas
atth...@email.msn.com
Will Chapman
Wong wrote in message <01bea0a5$633ad2c0$070000c0@pkcs>...
|
|BTW, Will, as far as I seen, you remain polite to every
|body, this is what I need to learn from your.
|
Thanks - I do try to remain even handed but I'm sure I too resort to a
slanging match every now and again. However, I don't think emotional
responses get us anywhere; all they usually do is generate another (if not
several) emotional response(s) in return each moving further and further
away from the main purpose of this NG.
Cheers...
Will
Ray Manning
I don't know about the UK source for a free copy of CrystaL Reports,
but a Free copy of Crystal Reports Version 6 was available with thw
Australian PC User magazine (May 1999 edition). Will have to check if
it is only the Standard version or not.
Regards Ray Manning
Melbourne, Australia
>
>
explo...@my-dejanews.com
first.
but then if others are bundling graphics into thiers why not
VO do the same thing. The Light Lib comes with VO is not
really a full package, its more like a demo version... it has
a nag screen.
As for the report writer, I have no complains about the CA-RET...
it is quite a reasonable product. I just wish the bugs are fixed...
but I am still wondering why some of you cliam that the
"Export To RTF" works in the Report Preview Mode.
Or perhaps CA should try bundle in the Report-Pro instead.
In article <7hpp2j$moa$1...@lure.pipex.net>,
explo...@my-dejanews.com
you can write this and that... many of us are capable to write all those
codes... BUT u must also look at those who cant. These people are mostly make
up of beginners and they will get very frustrated when they find it hard to
achieve things that they see their friends able to do with other product at
ease.
Only once they get past the beginners stage.. then only they will
appreciate what you mentioned.
VO can only grow if the number beginners grow.
Graphs may not be much use for most of us... but including them in the
product can bring benefits to VO. Just look at the Grapics that is included
in Delphi... I doubt many people uses it in real-life.. but then Delphi is
heavily promoted and boasted with it.
In article <7houqm$hg3$1...@news1.skynet.be>,
explo...@my-dejanews.com
If CR is free.. why not suggest to CA to bundle CR into
VO 2.5.
In article <P6i03.295$DX.2...@eagle.america.net>,
"Tracy Thomas" <atth...@brantleytel.net> wrote:
> Will,
>
> You mentioned getting CR free. Do you have a link or more information
> regarding this? Thanks for any infomation you might have.
>
> --
> Tracy Thomas
> atth...@email.msn.com
>
>
Will Chapman
Tracy Thomas wrote in message ...
|Will,
|
|You mentioned getting CR free. Do you have a link or more information
|regarding this? Thanks for any infomation you might have.
|
In the UK there have been a number of PC magazine CD's that have contained
'old' but otherwise complete versions of Crystal Reports. I started with 4.5
and recently saw V6.
HTH
Will Chapman
Andrew Harvey
Ray Manning <rman...@alphalink.com.au> wrote in message
news:37422982...@news.alphalink.com.au...
> I don't know about the UK source for a free copy of CrystaL Reports,
> but a Free copy of Crystal Reports Version 6 was available with thw
> Australian PC User magazine (May 1999 edition). Will have to check if
> it is only the Standard version or not.
The same thing happened in the UK with P.C. magazine. It was only the
standard version and you have to register for a code to activate the
software. Having tried it I then moved to Report Pro!
Andy
Dez. 120 StatLA S-H
---- snip ----
> As for the report writer, I have no complains about the CA-RET...
> it is quite a reasonable product. I just wish the bugs are fixed...
> but I am still wondering why some of you cliam that the
> "Export To RTF" works in the Report Preview Mode.
Somewhere it works, somewhere not. At my PC, it does. But of course -
it's a lie, eh?
Tell us what report engine is delivered with VB! You told us "money is
streaming in", for this reason I believe VB has a very good native
database engine and an excellent report generator! So please tell us
more about it!
Andreas
Andreas
Dez. 120 StatLA S-H
>
> If CR is free.. why not suggest to CA to bundle CR into
> VO 2.5.
Ok, suggest it to your local CA office.
Andreas
Will Chapman
explo...@my-dejanews.com wrote in message <7htulc$m87$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
|codes... BUT u must also look at those who cant. These people are mostly
make
|up of beginners and they will get very frustrated when they find it hard to
|achieve things that they see their friends able to do with other product at
|ease.
|
|Only once they get past the beginners stage.. then only they will
|appreciate what you mentioned.
|
|VO can only grow if the number beginners grow.
|
You have some good points here but I think it is a lost cause even thinking
that CA might change its basic marketing philosophy to position bundle in
lots of third party products. They've already been burnt by including
LightLib (who then promptly refused to give support to VO users) and I'm
sure they see no reason to replace CARET because, as an in-house product, it
doesn't cost anything to include it (although one could argue that the
support issue is more problem than it is worth).
Will Chapman
JPV
most of the time when I try to found a third party (except VO2Jet and VOCOM)
it doesn't fit to my needs. I spend less time to write my own libraries than
to try to deal or to adapt third parties. Of course I have not tested all
third parties around VO. For the graphics, a sample will be provided with VO
2.5. It can be used so and let all the beginners learn from it very easily.
Delphi cannot reach VO power so easily.
Sincerely,
JPV
>VO can only grow if the number beginners grow.
>
>Graphs may not be much use for most of us... but including them in the
>product can bring benefits to VO. Just look at the Grapics that is included
>in Delphi... I doubt many people uses it in real-life.. but then Delphi is
>heavily promoted and boasted with it.
>
>
>
>In article <7houqm$hg3$1...@news1.skynet.be>,
> "JPV" <hesop.jp...@skynet.be> wrote:
>>
>> Philippe,
>>
>> Yes, but not like Excel who do the job in a close frame, VO allows you to
>> define your own framework deping on the kind of graphics you want to use.
Of
>> course, you have to design it by yourself or use a third party. In VO 2.5
>> you will find a very basic graphic sample which shows you how to proceed.
I
>> think, but it's purely personal, that VO doesn't need a -so called-
graphic
>> lib like Excel. It has all the items to let us make it fit "on-size".
I've
>> done my own for the kind of graphics I've to deal with. It's not that
>> difficult to create your own.
>>
>> If you really want to, I can indicate how to proceed in a next VO 2.5
topic.
>> I'm always ready to help VO programmers to improve VO.
>>
>> Sincerely,
>>
>> JPV
>>
>>
>
>
Wong
<7huk06$5vt$1...@news0.skynet.be>...
I mean that
> most of the time when I try to found a third party
(except VO2Jet and VOCOM)
> it doesn't fit to my needs. I spend less time to write my
own libraries than
> to try to deal or to adapt third parties.
I agree with you.
Actually I went to extreme, and not using third party
product anymore, after have been burn by bug, version, and
product conflict issue.
I may be wrong, but I always think simple is beauty, if l
can do it using single tool, I will not use multiple. If I
can write it under single programming language, I will not
use multiple.
Regard
Wong
Wong
<7httvp$lk6$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
> but then if others are bundling graphics into thiers why
not
> VO do the same thing. The Light Lib comes with VO is not
> really a full package, its more like a demo version... it
has
> a nag screen.
> Or perhaps CA should try bundle in the Report-Pro
instead.
I think this is due to licencing , and supportting cost.
For Microsoft, they will provide development tools under
the cost, or even free, as long as to make sure software
developer will develop product for MS Windows, but not
other OS. So licencing and supporting cost are not a issue
for them. But for other who provide development tools, they
will concentrate on their market segment only.
> As for the report writer, I have no complains about the
CA-RET...
> it is quite a reasonable product. I just wish the bugs
are fixed...
> but I am still wondering why some of you cliam that the
> "Export To RTF" works in the Report Preview Mode.
I have no hand-on experiance with CA-RET(or VO), and not
qualified to make comment. Sorry!
Regard
Wong
Andreas Janke
money. If your VB has all included, so much the better.
Andreas
--
------------------
"Hi," said the breakfast, "it's me again! Look who is with me!"
Visit me at: http://home.t-online.de/home/A.Janke
explo...@mailcity.com schrieb in Nachricht
<7hnteu$j69$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>... and write hundreds lines of codes just to draw a basic line chart
or bar
>chart.
>
>This has nothing to do with VB or Microsoft.
>
>In article <7hmr8o$a59$1...@news0.skynet.be>,
> "JPV" <hesop.jp...@skynet.be> wrote:
>> Ha, ha ha. This is the proof. VO has it's own graphics facilities but
YOU
>> know nothing about them. Everybody can make up it's graphics routines
the
>> way he want them. Are you sure you're using VO ? May your are
programming
>> with VB but found this NG and put all your VB critics here ? Have you
check
>> the boxes to see if Microsoft isn't written somewhere ?
>>
explo...@my-dejanews.com
I agree that VO is powerful at a pro level.. but at the beginners level
it turn-off a lot of them. CA dont have to include a super expensive
graph charting tools... just something simple for them to play and be
happy with. when they reach your level.. then they can explore many
of the VO's capability. BUT at this moment .. thse beginners find it hard
to accept VO.
In article <7huk06$5vt$1...@news0.skynet.be>,
"JPV" <hesop.jp...@skynet.be> wrote:
> I agree with you. But don't forget that we are at a pro level. I mean that
> most of the time when I try to found a third party (except VO2Jet and VOCOM)
> it doesn't fit to my needs. I spend less time to write my own libraries than
> to try to deal or to adapt third parties. Of course I have not tested all
> third parties around VO. For the graphics, a sample will be provided with VO
> 2.5. It can be used so and let all the beginners learn from it very easily.
> Delphi cannot reach VO power so easily.
>
> Sincerely,
>
explo...@my-dejanews.com
I am still using VO, but we have another team using VB to write
POS system... very effective with VB. I believe they are using
Crystal Reports.
Like I said many times... I have no complains over the CARET...
I am happy with its capability... I am only worry about the "bug"
which is non-existance in your CARET..
The other thing is a simple facility to be able to show management
some pie/bar charts... that they can view on the screen. Unfortunately
the one bundle with VO has a nag screen.
In article <3742A384...@t-online.de>,
statist...@t-online.de (Dez. 120 StatLA S-H) wrote:
> explo...@my-dejanews.com schrieb:
> ---- snip ----
>
> > As for the report writer, I have no complains about the CA-RET...
> > it is quite a reasonable product. I just wish the bugs are fixed...
> > but I am still wondering why some of you cliam that the
> > "Export To RTF" works in the Report Preview Mode.
>
> Somewhere it works, somewhere not. At my PC, it does. But of course -
> it's a lie, eh?
> Tell us what report engine is delivered with VB! You told us "money is
> streaming in", for this reason I believe VB has a very good native
> database engine and an excellent report generator! So please tell us
> more about it!
>
> Andreas
>
> Andreas
>
>
Will Chapman
explo...@my-dejanews.com wrote in message <7i07l2$a5d$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
|
|
|I am still using VO, but we have another team using VB to write
|POS system... very effective with VB. I believe they are using
|Crystal Reports.
|
||The other thing is a simple facility to be able to show management
|some pie/bar charts... that they can view on the screen. Unfortunately
|the one bundle with VO has a nag screen.
|
Then your prayers are answered - there is a sample in VO2.5 that
demonstrates just that functionality.
HTH
Will Chapman
edg...@my-dejanews.com
> VO can only grow if the number beginners grow.
>
here is a beginner asking for help.
read the n.24 message please.
thanks
edgardo solano
Stephane
>in VO, strange thing about our newsgroup.. why nobody interested
>in a wish list ?
You didn't read the white paper last year did ya ?
You're late !!
Just keep on babling with your nonsense, and we'll keep on doing what we
know best....
P R O G R A M M I N G
BTW, please answer this question:
Have you ever been on the VO2 forum on CServe ?
Have you ever expressed on that forum what you express here ?
You want to be heard ? Then go ahead, that forum is where they will listen
to you.
Go on now.
What ? You're still here ?
What are you waiting for ?
Get you're butt over there.
--
========Stephane Hebert========
Remove mypants. to reply via E-mail
explo...@my-dejanews.com wrote in message <7i2gse$vs8$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>
>
>answer to your question...
>
>yes.. you can use all the standard win32 dll with VO 2 besides
>that you can also use any standard OCX with VO.
>
>I feel that the VO platform is still incomplete despite we can get
>the tools from 3rd parties. whether the VO programmer uses
>it or not... it should be included and fully functional.
>
>In addition to the current VO facilities, things I feel should be included
in
>VO are.
>
>1. Report writer... CA-RET ( already there but need to improve )
>if possible Report-Pro...
>
>2. Graphics JPG,GIF,TIF.. ( should be there in VO 2.5 )
>but VO 2.5 does not support GIF... strange thing other tools
>supports GIF
>
>3. Chart Graph.. Light Lib ( but demo version with nag screen )
>maybe should include ChartFX ( might not be the best but usable )
>
>
>of cos there are more things that some of you would like to have
>in VO, strange thing about our newsgroup.. why nobody interested
>in a wish list ?
>
>
>In article <7i0o9e$lsa$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
explo...@my-dejanews.com
explo...@my-dejanews.com
same goes to VO... VO can only be used for windows NT
windows 95 and its variant.
No matter how bad we look at Microsoft... what they are
doing to VB are very effective... even though at many point
of time VB was far inferior but still manage to attract so
many users. Number of users are very important to any
development tool. Number of users grows... more books..
more books, more interest , more interest, more VO apps,
more VO apps, more VO jobs....
VO already have a good foundation... its now whether
we or CA want it to be sucessful or not.
In article <01bea22b$12cef8c0$070000c0@pkcs>,
"Wong" <nsw...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
>
> I think this is due to licencing , and supportting cost.
>
> For Microsoft, they will provide development tools under
> the cost, or even free, as long as to make sure software
> developer will develop product for MS Windows, but not
> other OS. So licencing and supporting cost are not a issue
> for them. But for other who provide development tools, they
> will concentrate on their market segment only.
>
> > As for the report writer, I have no complains about the
> CA-RET...
> > it is quite a reasonable product. I just wish the bugs
> are fixed...
> > but I am still wondering why some of you cliam that the
> > "Export To RTF" works in the Report Preview Mode.
>
> I have no hand-on experiance with CA-RET(or VO), and not
> qualified to make comment. Sorry!
>
> Regard
> Wong
>
>
explo...@my-dejanews.com
No... I will not use the compuserve forum... I will post my message here, if
we continue to use that forum... then CA will never come here. I refuse to
give support for using the compuserve. Compuserve is bad for VO... if you
want more new user for VO... the place is internet and not the compuserve.
Let me ask you...
if the number of VO user is less than 100... do you think CA will be puting
in more money to develope new version of VO after 2.5 ?
if the number of VO user is more than 100,000... do you think CA will be
puting in more money to develope new version of VO after 2.5 ?
In article <gl413.2215$Nq6....@weber.videotron.net>,
"Stephane" <steph...@mypants.videotron.ca> wrote:
> >of cos there are more things that some of you would like to have
> >in VO, strange thing about our newsgroup.. why nobody interested
> >in a wish list ?
>
> You didn't read the white paper last year did ya ?
> You're late !!
>
> Just keep on babling with your nonsense, and we'll keep on doing what we
> know best....
>
> P R O G R A M M I N G
>
> BTW, please answer this question:
>
> Have you ever been on the VO2 forum on CServe ?
> Have you ever expressed on that forum what you express here ?
> You want to be heard ? Then go ahead, that forum is where they will listen
> to you.
> Go on now.
>
> What ? You're still here ?
> What are you waiting for ?
>
> Get you're butt over there.
>
> --
> ========Stephane Hebert========
> Remove mypants. to reply via E-mail
> explo...@my-dejanews.com wrote in message <7i2gse$vs8$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
> >
> >
JPV
I read that -like a dictator- you want to determine CA policies. You know
what is bad or good for VO. We all know what is bad for VO: YOU!
You have a very bad lecture of a funny question. There more than 100 VO
users... in Belgium (pop:10 millions)
CA will put money in every bit of software including Jasmine like VO 2.5.
You complain there's no advertisement for VO and you don't read the existing
ones.
JPV
explo...@my-dejanews.com a écrit dans le message
<7i2um8$8op$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
Stephen Quinn
> No... I will not use the compuserve forum..
CIS is the ONLY guaranteed place where CA people/developers will read your
complaints/wishes/problems about/with VO.
It's their support policy for ALL their products not only VO.
HTH
--
Steve Quinn
BRUTE Computer Services - Australia
http://www.brutecom.com.au
If a stealth bomber crashes in a forest, will it make a sound?
If a turtle doesn't have a shell, is he homeless or naked?
Why don't sheep shrink when it rains?
explo...@my-dejanews.com
Then I feel sorry for VO if CA does not change the stand.
It might benefit you for a short while.. you get great support,
thats good for you... but have u ever thought of long term
VO growth ? we cannot think just for ourself and our own
short term benefits.
In article <7i34m5$p8f$1...@the-fly.zip.com.au>,
Don Andersen
<squ...@brutecom.com.au> wrote (possibly edited):
> Steve Quinn
> BRUTE Computer Services - Australia
> http://www.brutecom.com.au
> If a stealth bomber crashes in a forest, will it make a sound?
> If a turtle doesn't have a shell, is he homeless or naked?
> Why don't sheep shrink when it rains?
If a man speaks in the forest and no woman hears, is he still wrong?
Don
"If you love something, set it free. If it comes back to you, it was
meant to be. If it doesn't, hunt it down and kill it."
Philippe Legros
After VO1, I've heard there will never be a VO2 version.
After VO2, I've heard there will never be a VO2.5 version.
So, your opinion....
PhL
Dez. 120 StatLA S-H
>
> No... I will not use the compuserve forum... I will post my message here, if
> we continue to use that forum... then CA will never come here. I refuse to
> give support for using the compuserve. Compuserve is bad for VO... if you
> want more new user for VO... the place is internet and not the compuserve.
---- rest scrapped, of course ----
Hi,
that sound logical: You don't go to CompuServe, because if we all stay
here, CA will follow us. Ok, next week we should switch to
rec.housing.garden, the week after this to
alt.soc.talk.nonsense.about.vo and so on. No, no: the only reason is you
are a coward, making noise and hiding behind an anonymous account.
You are always messing around "boo boo CA is not listening to me boo
boo", but do you really request they follow *YOU*?
By the way, support here is as least so good as in CS. Thanks to all
members here who are helpful!
Andreas -> real name in a real word, writing real programs with the only
one real programming language: Visual Objects.
explo...@my-dejanews.com
There is no need for me to use "real"? name. I am here to discuss VO
not about private life. You can continue to call me anything u wish..
that does not change my views on Compuserve and various issues on VO.
In article <37455C0E...@t-online.de>,
statist...@t-online.de (Dez. 120 StatLA S-H) wrote:
> Hi,
>
> that sound logical: You don't go to CompuServe, because if we all stay
> here, CA will follow us. Ok, next week we should switch to
> rec.housing.garden, the week after this to
> alt.soc.talk.nonsense.about.vo and so on. No, no: the only reason is
you
> are a coward, making noise and hiding behind an anonymous account.
> You are always messing around "boo boo CA is not listening to me boo
> boo", but do you really request they follow *YOU*?
> By the way, support here is as least so good as in CS. Thanks to all
> members here who are helpful!
>
> Andreas -> real name in a real word, writing real programs with the
only
> one real programming language: Visual Objects.
>
Larry The Lion
not concerned with "Explorer98" 's anonymity. I remain anonymous too, for
good business reasons, and I'm sure a few others do as well. However, I
cannot understand what Explorer98's objective is in coming to this forum,
and complaining about a good software development tool, one that has made a
lot of us a pretty good living. Explorer98, you cannot possibly expect
anyone here to take notice of you when there appears to be no value in your
comments. My attitude towards this tool is that the fewer programmers out
there that know how to use it, the better, because then I have a competitive
advantage. This is not, and never will be, a mainstream development tool -
thank goodness!
The proof is in the pudding, as they say ... you are browsing a forum of
that has collectively delivered many solid, stable apps using this tool (VO
2), judging by the varied comments in this forum. End-users largely do not
care what tool is used, as long as it gets the job done, on time, and on
budget. VO can deliver that kind of satisfaction, so we get paid, a simple
formula for success.
I can therefore only assume that Explorer98 is a VO programmer wanna-be,
i.e., someone who tried to use it, but couldn't make it. So Explorer98 has
to come to the forum to meddle, disrupt threads, in the vain hope that
conversation will come to a halt. Fellow participants, the best, and only,
medicine for Explorer98 and other disruptive elements, is to totally ignore
them. Do not respond to their comments, ever. They will soon tire of the
sport, and go elsewhere, maybe to disrupt a Visual Basic forum or something.
The only other possibility is that Explorer98 represents a competitor to VO,
and all the more reason to be ignored.
Larry The Lion
<explo...@my-dejanews.com> wrote in message
news:7i48ft$6v4$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
Trevor Smith
we could write our own library. I am thinking about a joint effort
from newsgroup users with the source being freely available on KnowVO
perhaps. A bit like Linux!
Any thoughts?
Trevor
Ashdown Software
Southampton, UK
On Mon, 17 May 1999 09:19:14 GMT, explo...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
>
>
>what I am trying to say is that it will be a plus point of VO were to
>have its native graphics library... and not just depend on 3rd party
>OCX and manually write graphs from the basic API.
>
>well.. as usual.. whenever there is a suggestion to improve VO
>you guys will so "NO".
>
>
>
>In article <7hojbh$43b$1...@lure.pipex.net>,
> "Will Chapman" <willc...@dial.pipex.com> wrote:
>>
>> explo...@mailcity.com wrote in message <7hnteu$j69$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>> |... and write hundreds lines of codes just to draw a basic line chart or
>> bar
>> |chart.
>> |
>>
>> LightLib was not the only 3rd party graphic library - some of us prefer
>> GraphicServer and there are a number of others available in the shareware
>> market (check www.activex.com).
>>
>> Additionally, it is not that difficult to write your own basic graphics -
>> see the excellent tutorial on this at the VO Training CVentre (search KnowVO
>> for the url).
>>
>> HTH
>>
>> Will Chapman
>>
>>
>
>-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
>http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
Chris Jones
produces a GIF then they'd be popular.
As for third party graphing libraries, I found (with DGE
and Clipper) that to meet my pernickety requirements I have to draw lines
between pixel positions anyway so for me VO needn't bother with graphing
but provide plenty examples in a "how to" style.
CJ
========= Chris Jones = C...@wimb26.freeserve.co.uk ===============
=================== http://www.wimb26.freeserve.co.uk/warrants/ ====
explo...@my-dejanews.com wrote in message <7i2gse$vs8$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>2. Graphics JPG,GIF,TIF.. ( should be there in VO 2.5 )
>but VO 2.5 does not support GIF... strange thing other tools
>supports GIF ...................
Will Chapman
Larry The Lion wrote in message ...
|conversation will come to a halt. Fellow participants, the best, and only,
|medicine for Explorer98 and other disruptive elements, is to totally ignore
|them. Do not respond to their comments, ever. They will soon tire of the
|sport, and go elsewhere, maybe to disrupt a Visual Basic forum or
something.
I agree - I'm going to stop responding.
Will Chapman
Andrew Harvey
Some of us are unable to use CompuServe. I have always disliked CA's policy
of monitoring only the CompuServe forums. For all those who do not remember
CA did use to have a presence (of sort) on the web. Sean Bucknall provided
useful feedback to many people starting out with VO 1.0.
I would suggest CA take a look at AutoDesk, the company that markets
AutoCAD. The have their own news server at adesknews.autodesk.com with a
newsgroup for each of their products. Each one is monitored. They are all
directly accessible by all.
Andy
Stephen Quinn <squ...@brutecom.com.au> wrote in message
news:7i34m5$p8f$1...@the-fly.zip.com.au...
>
> > No... I will not use the compuserve forum..
> This is a stupid stand to take.
>
> CIS is the ONLY guaranteed place where CA people/developers will read your
> complaints/wishes/problems about/with VO.
>
> It's their support policy for ALL their products not only VO.
>
> HTH
> --
Janno Hordijk
I disagree. if a company only gives support by telephone, you have to use
the telephone. If a company gives support by the internet, then you have to
use the internet.... so, if CA gives support by Compuserve, what do you
think you have to use?
I don't understand all this nagging about CA-support. We have a perfect ng
here and there are lots of members that have access to Compuserve too. So,
if there's a very important request, I know for sure that that request is
propogated to Compuserve as well.
If nothing was sent to CA, why did they make those patches to solve critical
errors? Just by imagination? I DON'T THINK SO!
BTW: If you are able to access the internet then I don't understand why you
can't access CompuServe.
Janno
Andrew Harvey <l...@psilink.co.je> wrote in message
news:37492...@nnrp1.news.uk.psi.net...
Steve Chen
I agree
Regards,
Steve
explo...@my-dejanews.com
just because Compuserve benefits you, you are happy... but this
is a very short-sighted view. Internet is where all the people are...
In article <7ibfrk$hplp$1...@reader3.wxs.nl>,
Janno Hordijk
I didn't say it benefits me. For me it would be EASIER if the support was
via internet. But as I said you have to respect the rules of the supplier.
By the way, in most countries there is a local support office either by CA
or a specialized company. Next: this NG, there are enough people to respond
to every kind of question. The really serious problems must be sent to
CIShowever. And if you don't have CIS you just kindly ask this ng to help to
post it to CIS.
And I am only looking around on CIS because I want to be a beta-tester for
the next release.
Janno
<explo...@my-dejanews.com> wrote in message
news:7id55b$29j$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
explo...@mailcity.com
This is an interesting "supplier rules..." even microsoft is flexible enough
to have support on the internet.
In article <7idi2k$jlhh$1...@reader3.wxs.nl>,
"Janno Hordijk" <Janno....@wxs.nl> wrote:
> No,
>
> I didn't say it benefits me. For me it would be EASIER if the support was
> via internet. But as I said you have to respect the rules of the supplier.
> By the way, in most countries there is a local support office either by CA
> or a specialized company. Next: this NG, there are enough people to respond
> to every kind of question. The really serious problems must be sent to
> CIShowever. And if you don't have CIS you just kindly ask this ng to help to
> post it to CIS.
>
> And I am only looking around on CIS because I want to be a beta-tester for
> the next release.
> Janno
>
Steve Chen
>
>just because Compuserve benefits you, you are happy... but this
>is a very short-sighted view. Internet is where all the people are...
>
internet if you want (no need fot their dailup) Just see it as a service you
have to pay for.
Gerard
Steve Chen
>
>
>just because Compuserve benefits you, you are happy... but this
>is a very short-sighted view. Internet is where all the people are...
>
>
Take a look : http://149.174.183.136/content/phone/country.asp?0
explo...@my-dejanews.com
you people still dont get it...
its not for me, its not for you... it is for everyone, beginners
and those people who has yet to use VO. People who wants to give
VO a try are not likely to subcribe to Compuserve just for the
sake of trying VO out. I once told a friend to try out VO and tell
him the support is in the Compuserve... you know what he tell me ?
he says "dont waste my time" thats less one VO user.
For VO to be sucessful... the market must be there. Internet is
where everyone is.
In article <7idm0t$q94$1...@gloup.linuxfr.org>,
"Steve Chen" <st...@smartram.com> wrote:
>
> For something like $9.95 a month you canhave the same. Access it to
the
> internet if you want (no need fot their dailup) Just see it as a
service you
> have to pay for.
>
> Gerard
>
>
JPV
explo...@mailcity.com a écrit dans le message
<7idnhf$f64$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>
>
>This is an interesting "supplier rules..." even microsoft is flexible
enough
>to have support on the internet.
>
On Netscape ?
explo...@my-dejanews.com
visit this website...
http://search.microsoft.com/us/dev/default.asp
and also try these newsgroup
microsoft.public.vb.*
after you are done with that.. try look at borland
( inprise ) www.inprise.com
All my complains and suggestions are to improve VO.
I still dont get it, why are you people so against
improving VO ? If you like VO so much you should be
more aggressive to improve VO... so that more people
will use VO. The longer we wait.. the more damage
it will do to VO.
You might not know how difficult for the VO team to
fight for VO 2.5 version. If sales for VO 2.5 continue
to slump I fear great danger ahead for VO.
In article <7ie2c1$25p$1...@news0.skynet.be>,
Gerard Daniels
You can download the free trial version 4.5 from Microsoft. If you need the
link, drop me a message.
Regards
Gerard
Tracy Thomas <atth...@brantleytel.net> wrote in message
news:P6i03.295$DX.2...@eagle.america.net...
> Will,
>
> You mentioned getting CR free. Do you have a link or more information
> regarding this? Thanks for any infomation you might have.
>
> --
> Tracy Thomas
> atth...@email.msn.com
>
>
>
Steve Chen
But before tell me where are you ? which country and city ?
Do you know what is compuserve ?
CompuServe offers two pricing plans available on a per member basis. The
Standard Pricing Plan for those light users and the Unlimited Pricing Plan
for those who use the service for longer periods of time. For more details
on pricing, please contact a Sales Representative at 1-800-854-7595 or Click
here for contact information.
Standard Pricing Plan $9.95/5 FREE Hours. For $9.95 per month you will
receive all of CompuServe's regular services, such as e-mail, complete
Internet access, Forums®, technical support, news, financial information,
weather and more. Additional online time is charged at $2.95 per hour.
Unlimited Pricing Plan is $24.95 for unlimited hours.
Steve
Mike Jones
> improving VO ?
they are more often than not flawed (especially the way you tried to
pressgang the sad demise of Mibar into service to support you when you have
absolutely no knowledge of the circumstances surrounding that event), but
more your attitude. You are rude, abrasive and frequently offensive -
basically you don't know how to conduct yourself online. You seem to have a
deluded mental image of yourself as the saviour of VO, but it is a role
that ill becomes you. You are contributing nothing and achieving nothing
with your misconceived tirades. You have alienated practically every
contributor to this newsgroup - it doesn't matter what you say anymore,
no-one will view it positively because you have generated such antipathy to
yourself on a personal level. If I were you, I'd seriously contemplate
whether I should adopt a different strategy to achieve my objective -
unless your objective actually is to make yourself an object of derision
and disdain among the VO community, rather than your stated one of
improving the product. My suggestion would be go away, learn how to
communicate what you have to say to your fellow human beings in a calm,
clear and polite manner, then come back and put it into practice using
another email address - preferably one that isn't anonymous. Face it,
you're a computer programmer, not Zorro.
Regards,
Mike Jones
JPV
At the age of 6 most of those walkers are able to ride a bicycle
At the age of 16 a great majority of them can drive a car
But how many can fly a plane, a jet, a space shuttle ?
Your proposals to improve VO are not serious. You ask not for an upgrade but
for a downgrade.
Everybody here consider VB as a language for junior-programmer. VB is not
bad at all. But not sufficient for the kind of projects most of us drive.
Now imagine that CA listen to you and make the downgrade. For my part, I
prefer to buy VB instead of a sub-product. Being popular doesn't mean
quality. Sometimes what is powerful is a bit more complicated, but with that
powerful tool you can discover a new area. I've no bad opinion on VB or
Delphi or... programmers. Sometimes, I even propose VB instead of VO for
very simple applications. The objectives of VB and VO are like a peer and a
apple, both are fruits, but that's all.
If you are fine with VB or Delphi... Great for you, but now let us work.
We've better to do than to contemps fustrated VB programmers
Let's go play in your play ground and leave us in peace. So the world will
be a better place to live.
JPV
Tracy Thomas
Thanks for the information. I will likely stick with RP, however, some of my
potential users already like CR, since they are bundled with ESRI's ARC
software - just thought it might be a good idea to have the CR option if
necessary.
Thanks for the information, it's been really helpful.
--
Tracy Thomas
Gerard Daniels <ger...@smartram.com> wrote in message
news:7ie5ua$8cr$1...@gloup.linuxfr.org...
Stephane
--
========Stephane Hebert========
Remove mypants. to reply via E-mail
Steve Chen <st...@smartram.com> wrote in message
news:7ie6ns$8sm$1...@gloup.linuxfr.org...
Andreas Janke
<01bea6ba$cbdc68a0$f38f...@MIKE.UUNET.CA>...
Don't rubbish *Zorro*, please, I like him.
<vbg>
Andreas
--
"Hi," said the breakfast, "it's me again! Look who is with me!"
Visit me at: http://home.t-online.de/home/A.Janke
Andreas Janke
<7ie3k0$n0q$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>
>
>you people still dont get it...
>
>its not for me, its not for you... it is for everyone, beginners
>and those people who has yet to use VO. People who wants to give
>VO a try are not likely to subcribe to Compuserve just for the
>sake of trying VO out. I once told a friend to try out VO and tell
>him the support is in the Compuserve... you know what he tell me ?
>he says "dont waste my time" thats less one VO user.
>
>For VO to be sucessful... the market must be there. Internet is
>where everyone is.
It's not for beginners - advising them "format your harddisk" is far
beyond help.
People which want give a try to VO may look in, and with only one
exception they'll find a helpful community, links, ressources and lot of
more, and not for $9,95 /monthly. A link to CIS is established, more
than one time I had read "I'll ask for you in CIS".
You once told a friend to try VO? His answer was "don't waste my time"?
Do you really wonder? If you talk to your friends (if any) like to this
NG .. who wonders.
And, you still have not answered my question: "How's VB? Money still
streaming in?"
Andreas Janke
especially if the complaints are a wild mixture of real and imaginated
"bugs" (as like DataDialogs don't doing things the programmer want, if
you remember ...).
WORKING ALWAYS MAKE THINGS BETTER, sorry, but from YOU I have never seen
a constructive help or at least a TRY to help.
If one asks for help here, you don't hesitate to tell him "reformat your
harddisk", "you are a lier" (even if answers don't fit your imagination,
last week you told a questioner a lyer and so on and so on and so on ...
ad infititum (which is latin)).
You should be *very* carefully with those things you spread. This NG is
for SERVICE and SUPPORT of a quality which some companies like
Micro$oft, Borland or Inprise never achieved. I would not wonder if some
people here have the abuse desk address of your provider handy.
I give my customers *full* phone and EMail support for lifetime (with
exception of callback). There is for each application an "User's
Newsletter", published about quarterly. Some customers don't have an
Internet account - they don't complain if the *printed* copy of the
newsletter is charged.
--
"Hi," said the breakfast, "it's me again! Look who is with me!"
Visit me at: http://home.t-online.de/home/A.Janke
explo...@my-dejanews.com schrieb in Nachricht
<7ie7ft$prf$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>...
>
>
>
>visit this website...
>
>http://search.microsoft.com/us/dev/default.asp
>
>and also try these newsgroup
>microsoft.public.vb.*
>
>after you are done with that.. try look at borland
>( inprise ) www.inprise.com
>
>All my complains and suggestions are to improve VO.
>
>I still dont get it, why are you people so against
explo...@my-dejanews.com
You are saying me being rude... tell me what instance that I have been
rude. the only word I can remember using is "Silly"... how about those
other people calling me "dog"... etc... arent they rude ? Compare
their language and mine.. and tell me honestly who is more rude ?
You are all just simply too carried away with this ego... this ego will not
bring any good to VO. You think you are doing great job protecting VO... but
try realise what u people are doing... you are helping to destroy VO instead.
In article <01bea6ba$cbdc68a0$f38f...@MIKE.UUNET.CA>,
"Mike Jones" <mi...@richsoftware.com> wrote:
> > I still dont get it, why are you people so against
> > improving VO ?
> No, you don't, do you? The problem is not so much your arguments, though
> they are more often than not flawed (especially the way you tried to
> pressgang the sad demise of Mibar into service to support you when you have
> absolutely no knowledge of the circumstances surrounding that event), but
> more your attitude. You are rude, abrasive and frequently offensive -
> basically you don't know how to conduct yourself online. You seem to have a
> deluded mental image of yourself as the saviour of VO, but it is a role
> that ill becomes you. You are contributing nothing and achieving nothing
> with your misconceived tirades. You have alienated practically every
> contributor to this newsgroup - it doesn't matter what you say anymore,
> no-one will view it positively because you have generated such antipathy to
> yourself on a personal level. If I were you, I'd seriously contemplate
> whether I should adopt a different strategy to achieve my objective -
> unless your objective actually is to make yourself an object of derision
> and disdain among the VO community, rather than your stated one of
> improving the product. My suggestion would be go away, learn how to
> communicate what you have to say to your fellow human beings in a calm,
> clear and polite manner, then come back and put it into practice using
> another email address - preferably one that isn't anonymous. Face it,
> you're a computer programmer, not Zorro.
>
> Regards,
> Mike Jones
>
>
Mike Jones
> Don't rubbish *Zorro*, please, I like him.
> <vbg>
Sorry :-) But Zorro had enemies who probably thought of him much like we
think of explorer98. The difference is that Zorro had some supporters as
well.
Mike