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* Hungarian American List Digest * V3 #65

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Mar 8, 1996, 3:00:00 AM3/8/96

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*** Hungarian American List Digest *** Fri, 8 Mar 1996 Vol 03 No 065

ATTENTION! The Hungarian American List Digest mailing list is available!

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In this issue:

HAL: Hungarian Restaurants in New York
HAL: Maria Valeria Bridge
HAL: Re: *** Hungarian American List Digest *** V3 #53
HAL: *** Error messages ***
HAL: What happened...
HAL: To P A Soltesz
HAL: To P A Soltesz
HAL: Sleazy tabloids & foreign owners
HAL: Hungarian get-together in San Francisco, CA, Friday, March 8
HAL: A little fact about Soros is justified
HAL: Re: Soros wrongdoings---a short list
HAL: Anthony Malzanek: Hungarians in Romania (8)
HAL: *** CET On-Line *** Mar/6/95 ***
HAL: *** CET On-Line *** Mar/7/95 ***
HAL: Tanchaz - Hungarian Dance & Music 3/9/96, College Park, MD
Re: HAL: A message for Dr. Odor
HAL: Art Exhibit - Watercolors of Long Island

See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the Hungarian
American List or Hungarian American List Digest mailing lists and on how
to retrieve back issues.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

From: KP...@aol.com
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 02:18:17 -0500
Subject: HAL: Hungarian Restaurants in New York

To All:

Can anyone recommend a good Hungarian restaurant in New York City?

Thanks,

Kalman Pipo

------------------------------

From: ava...@mnsinc.com (A.J. Vadasz)
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 16:23:22 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: Maria Valeria Bridge

I reported some weeks ago re the prospects of rebuilding the Maria Valeria
bridge between Eszetergom and Parkany (Sturovo). I.e. across the Danube
between present-day Hungary and Slovakia. A Magyar Radio broadcast reported
on same, however the poor reception caused some of the details to be lost. I
subsequently asked the interviewer some questions, primarily relating to the
funding. His (Szecsoedy Peter) answer was received today via e-mail:

Kedves Vadasz Ur!
Rettenetesen sajnalom, hogy nem tudok igazan segitsegere lenni, mert
a parkanyi polgarmester neve nem szerepel amagyar nyilvantartasokban.
A hid olyan szeles lesz, mint amilyen volt. A csekely forgalom elire-
lathatoan nem fog torlodni rajta. Az ujjaepiteshez szuekseges oesszeg,
mint az a riportomban is elhangzott, mar megvan. Nagy reszet a
PHARE biztositja. Remelem maskor bivebb valasszal tudok a segitsegere
sietni. Tovabbi jo radiozast kivanok OEnnek. Ismeretlenuel is uedvoezloem.
Szecsidy Peter

(I.e. the money is available and committed Other questions not answered).

Comment; contrary to the many discouraging Slovakia development, at last a
hopeful sign. The bridge will be the only one across the Danube between
Komarom and Budapest and will clearly increase contact possibilities between
the people on both left (Slovak) and right (Hungarian) side of the Danube.
We need to watch it to be sure there are no excuses for delaying the
project. As reported before, much of the credit goes to the mayor of
Sturovo, who - of Slovak parentage- worked hard to raise the funds. (I had
asked for his name, but Mr.Szecsoedy evidently does not have it. If any of
you do, let us know, along with his address.) Andy
A.J. Vadasz
5743 Pignut Mtn. Dr.
Warrenton VA 22186
USA T:540 349 1408

------------------------------

From: hoo...@aol.com
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 16:40:23 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: Re: *** Hungarian American List Digest *** V3 #53

Dear Kelley Ted, I saw your communication concering low airfares for
teachers do you have more information on this.
Koz.
Eric

------------------------------

From: Gotthard Saghi-Szabo <gott...@chem.umd.edu>
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 16:47:09 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: *** Error messages ***

Dear List Members!
We are very sorry about this unfortunate incident. I just realized what
happened when I got up this morning (it occured during the night). We did
not do anything at the list, the Computer Center administrators must have
done something with nameserver, mailalias entries. The error messages you
received should go (and they did go so far, for almost three years) - to
the list owners address - which is currently hung...@glue.umd.edu .
Again, this is our first accident in our third year. The problem seem to
be solved by now. Please, accept my apologies. If you want to know more,
please, contact Joe Sackett <sac...@glue.umd.edu> .
Thank you for your understanding.
Best regards,
Gotthard
- --
mailto:gott...@quartz.ciw.edu
http://mineral.umd.edu/~gotthard/

------------------------------

From: Gotthard Saghi-Szabo <gott...@chem.umd.edu>
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 16:47:27 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: What happened...

Here it is, and, again sooooorrrrrryyyyyyy.....

- ---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 13:53:11 -0500 (EST)
From: Joseph M. Sackett <sac...@Glue.umd.edu>
To: Gotthard Saghi-Szabo <gott...@Glue.umd.edu>
Subject: What happened.

Well, where do I start, first I'm sorry.

What had happened occurred when I made a change to the list that we
hoped would get rid of some of the multiple mailings to users. When I
configured the change, it wanted an address to stick in the From: line,
so I put hun...@glue.umd.edu, however instead of using it as the
From: line it used it as the Sender address. The Sender address, as
you can painfully see, is where the mail gets bounced to. I realized
this after I get the first bounce from my mail that I sent to the list
come back to the list.

I fixed the problem after the first bounce, but for an unrelated
reason, the aliases did not get reloaded until 6 am, leaving all the
mail that bounced go back to the list and so on.

Things seem to be back to normal now, and I'm very sorry for all the
trouble that was caused.

Feel free to send this explanation and most of all my apologies to
the list. At this point, I think they have had enough mail from me.

- - Joe

------------------------------

From: Tibor Odor <od...@math-inst.hu>
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 15:30:39 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: To P A Soltesz

Dear Mr Soltesz,

Please do not deal with my childhood and other personal issues, otherwise
[some note is omitted here].

So, my suggestion is to remain at the subject of my posts. Probably
you have a different concept about the re-settlement question.
I am not sure that I was able to understad your position in this question,
but I think you spoke about Hungarians.

I did not. I spoke about those people who have left Eastern-Europe,
mainly Russia and Ukraina.

Tibor Odor

------------------------------

From: Tibor Odor <od...@math-inst.hu>
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 19:28:06 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: To P A Soltesz

Dear Mr Soltesz,

Please do not deal with my childhood and other personal issues, otherwise
[some note is omitted here].

I did not. I spoke about those people who have left Eastern-Europe,
mainly Russia and Ukraina.

Tibor Odor

------------------------------

From: "Szabo, James J., 1Lt" <Sza...@M105X4.LAAFB.AF.MIL>
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 21:44:26 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: Sleazy tabloids & foreign owners

James Szabo writes:

>>Sandor -- I don't think Americans would care much if the Los Angeles Times

>>were Japanese owned; we already have plenty of Rupert Murdoch owned
tabloids
>>in our grocery stores. I think he's Australian.

In general it is true. But I did hear complaints about Rupert Murdoch,
that he is too involved with politics. (This was on All things Considered"
NPR). And the distrust toward japanese is greater. Also I seemed to have
heard,
(I could be mistaken) that the news media, cannot
be under foreign ownership. Murdoch is an exception, since he does have
a domocile in the US.

Sandor Lengyel
Orange 714-771-2655

About hungarian restaurants in L.A.

Hortobagy on Ventura, in Studio City, Csarda in Los Angeles somwhere,
Sandor's (not I) in Glendora.

Of course St. Stepen's Church on Woodlawn. (Every sunday).

*******The part below has been added by the mailer software *****
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digest version, send the commands (one mail can carry both)
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------------------------------

From: Tony and Celia Becker <bec...@shell.portal.com>
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 21:51:16 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: Hungarian get-together in San Francisco, CA, Friday, March 8

One of these year's I'm going to actually get both notice, and important
details, of an event more than 5 days before--and I'll faint. My apologies
to anyone else for this very late posting, as a result of some details only
becoming known today.

OK, for those who live within the larger northern California metropolitan areas:

The Hungarian Consul-General, Dr. Imre Helyes, will be giving a "state of
Hungary" speech for members (and friends) of the Hungarian American Chamber
of Commerce, San Francisco area chapter, on Friday evening, March 8. A
dinner is included, for those who can and wish to attend that portion.
Dinner costs $23 for members and $26 for non-members.

The location is the Big Sky Ranch Restaurant (old Paprikas Fonos--and it
still has a Hungarian menu in addition to a "western" menu); Ghirardelli
Square, 900 North Point Blvd. (fifth floor,southwest corner of complex).

Reception is at 6 p.m.; dinner at 7 p.m.; speech at 8 p.m.

RSVP is to the honorary consul and current President of HACC, Eva Voisin, at
tel: 415-595-0444; fax: 415-595-3976. If you are intending to come for
dinner, call or fax ASAP--like before noon California time Friday March 8.

EXTRA HIGHLIGHT--IMPORTANT PLEASE NOTE: we have a very strong possibility of
the major Republican candidate running for the 14th Congressional seat being
in attendance at this event. His name is Benjamin Macalester Brink, and he
already has prior interests in Hungary. Besides being a CEO of a small
high-tech start-up company, and having previous high-tech and venture
capital experience; he has also been an officer in the U.S. Navy and
Reserve. He currently still holds the rank of "commander" in the USNR and
has members of his unit currently serving in both Hungary and Bosnia--and he
just trained them for this special assignment. He is also personally a
friend of both William Perry--yes, _that_ William Perry and George
Schultz--yes _that_ George Schultz.

Upon his election in November, Ben could be a powerful voice on behalf of
Hungarian concerns in the U.S. Congress--and have even greater additional
influence through his Naval connections in the Administration... Ben's
campaign office has said they believe he and his wife will be coming to this
event. Thus this will be an excellent opportunity for Hungarian Americans,
particularly from the Southwest SF Bay area to become acquainted with this
candidate, in a smaller group setting, where you might get to enjoy
lengthier conversations than elections usually permit.

Sincerely,

Cecilia L. Fa'bos-Becker
San Jose, CA, USA
e-mail: bec...@shell.portal.com

N0BBS, Cecilia L. Fabos-Becker - bec...@shell.portal.com - San Jose, CA

------------------------------

From: Tibor Odor <od...@math-inst.hu>
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 10:33:52 +0100
Subject: HAL: A little fact about Soros is justified

On March 7 Janos Zsargo <jzs...@ASTRO1.PANET.UTOLEDO.EDU> on the
Hungarian American List (HAL) with Subject: About Soros. wrote:

>Tibor Odor wrote:

>>But you simply ignored the strong points in my argument. There is a strong
>>and easily verifyable statement about the text written to the check mentioned
>>in my previous writing on this issue. You wants facts---naturally,
>>you think, you have only the right to decide what is a fact.
>>
>>I think, this question is very simple. You have to go to the Szabo Ervin
>> Library
>>and to ask a check for the payment of the TOEFL exame. That is all.

>The story about these checks is true (I guess they call them voucher or
>something like that). I paid my TOEFL exam with this check. I had to pay
>the amount in hungarian currency and enclose this voucher to my application.

That is what I wanted to prove.

>But I am sorry I do not understand how does this prove your points? Even if
>Soros does some tax manipulation with these checks it still does not prove
>the other points.

It is true. But after this story no one can regard Soros as a hero.
Here is a small little spot which will increase its size soon.

I think, J. Zsargo's contribution was very valuable. Thanks for that!

Tibor Odor

>I also have to mention here, that I had a very good experience with the
>Soros Foundation. I could go to Canada by the IAESTE three years ago.
>Unfortunatelly I had to pay the travel expenses, which is quite painful
>for a simple student in Hungary. Finally I ended at the Soros Foundation
>and got the necessery money within a week. And I am neither Jewish nor has
>connection to the SZDSZ.
>
>Janos Zsargo

------------------------------

From: sle...@ecad04.calcomp.com (Sandor Lengyel x2495)
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 13:38:06 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: Re: Soros wrongdoings---a short list

>> Whatever Mr Odor says, the simple fact remains that many Hungarians
>>resent Soros "helping" with the finances of the country straight and simply
>>because he is Jewish. No if`s and but`s.

I disagree. I feel that the above statement could be rewritten as:

>> that many Hungarians
>>resent Soros "helping" with the finances of the country straight and simply
>>because he is hungarian and an emigree.

His jewishness is only secondary. :-)

Sandor

------------------------------

From: gott...@chem.umd.edu
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 13:43:30 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: Anthony Malzanek: Hungarians in Romania (8)

For a better understanding of the Hungarian minority in Romania:
( 8th posting: Minority Culture)

THE SITUATION OF MINORITY CULTURE IN ROMANIA
============================================

1. The period between 1918-1944:
============================

After 1918 the Hungarian minority culture in Romania came into being
without the assistance of the Romanian State as a sequel to the
national culture. Its self-organizing institutionalization was hindered and
severely censored.

- The Hungarian University in Cluj Napoca with 56 departments, in 63 new
buildings, with collections, museums and a library consisting of
400,000 books became the property of the Romanian State.
Hungarian language could only be used in teaching Hungarian
language and literature.

- Hungarian literary life in Romania came into being through its own
resources in the circumstances of severe censorship.

- In 1929, out of 1,417 public libraries providing public education
only 147 could function.

- Aproximately 50 statues representing Hungarian or Austrian historical
personalities erected in public places were destroyed or demolished
and became the victims of the anti-Hungarian temper:

- in Arad and Tirgu Mures representing Kossuth Lajos were demolished,
- the statue of Kulcsey in Satu Mare was blown up,
- that in Deva representing David Ferenc disappeared,
- as well as in Cluj Napoca, representing the Hungarian Queen Elizabeth.

Hungarians were deprived of rights that contribute to the preservation of
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
their national identity.
------------------------

2. The period between 1944-1989
============================

Culture became mere placing for censorship and state budget.
-----------------------------------------------------------

- The 1948 nationalization affected the remaining museums, libraries,
archives, houses of culture, religious or laic associations.

-The rich memorial documentation concerning Hungarian history was
taken away from the museums and deposited in warehouses
(e.g.relics of the Revolution of 1848 in Arad),

- Likewise the old Hungarian painting collection (in the cellar of the
Fine Arts Museum in Cluj Napoca there are more than 200 Hungarian oil
paintings dating from the last century) and the ethnographical material.

These are all cultural documents that preserve ethnicity, self-identity
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
and strengthen self-consciousness.
---------------------------------

- Due to the absence of bilingual inscriptions and
catalogues, and that the Hungarian specialists are neglected, the
museums became totally unfamiliar for the Hungarian public in
Transylvania, while for the Romanian visitors the Hungarian population,
living on this territory from beginnings of time, remains unknown.

3. After 1989:
===========

Changes brought about by the 1989 events did not accomplish the
expected abolition of communist nationalist anti-minority policy,
not even on the level of tendencies:

- the state budget allotted to culture is neither distributed in
accordance with the ratio of the ethnic minorities, nor remitted to their
self-administrative organizations;

- refund of formal properties belonging to the reorganized traditional
cultural associations (e.g. Transylvanian Carpathian Association,
the Association of Hungarian Smallholder in Transylvania,
the Transylvanian Hungarian General Educational Association)
is not a question of issue.

- The Transylvanian Museum Association cannot even move into
the building that appears under its name in the land register
(address: Cluj Napoca, 11 Libertatii Square);

- the archive law in preparation does not wish to return the
confiscated archives and makes impossible their study
(they are under the severe control of the Ministry of Interior).

In this way the study of the past history of the minorities, the
----------------------------------------------------------------
preservation of their identity and the self-conscious preparation
-----------------------------------------------------------------
of their own future are hindered.
---------------------------------

4.Minimal rightful requests:
==========================

The rightful request derives from the assessment of the following facts,
namely:

- the creation of an independent center for the study of Hungarians
(Institute for Hungarian studies),

- the foundation ofa museum exhibiting the culture of the Hungarian
minority in Transylvania

- the return of the properties belonging to the different associations

- and the access to study the archives.

(The Hungarian minority in Romania, through its representatives
submitted its rightful demands in a memorandum to the Ministry of Public
Education and to the Minority Council in August, 1993;
after 2 1/2 years: NO ANSWER).

------------------------------

From: Hungarian American List <hun...@glue.umd.edu>
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 14:21:08 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: *** CET On-Line *** Mar/6/95 ***

Posted to Newsgroups: soc.culture.magyar,soc.culture.usa

------------------------------

From: Hungarian American List <hun...@glue.umd.edu>
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 14:21:20 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: *** CET On-Line *** Mar/7/95 ***

Posted to Newsgroups: soc.culture.magyar,soc.culture.usa

------------------------------

From: "Arpad F. Kovacs" <kov...@Glue.umd.edu>
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 16:25:14 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: Tanchaz - Hungarian Dance & Music 3/9/96, College Park, MD

Event on: March 9, 1996

Tanchaz Place:

College Park, MD (USA) - whithin the Washington D.C. Beltway
Starting Point Dance Studio . From I495 take Route 1 South
toward College Park . After passing the UM complex , make a left
onto Calvert Rd. The studio is in the first building on your right,
behind Clean and Lean Laudromat/Fitness Center

Admission: $4 ($3 for Tisza members)

Time: 7:30 pm until 10:30 pm

Contact: Cathy Lamont (301)-929-0120

****Ask about tickets to the Muzsikas - Marta Sebestyen concert!

- --
WWW : http://www.glue.umd.edu/~kovacs
personal email : kov...@Glue.umd.edu

------------------------------

From: "Szabo, James J., 1Lt" <Sza...@M105X4.LAAFB.AF.MIL>
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 15:55:23 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Re: HAL: A message for Dr. Odor

Thank you, GB.

As a new subscriber to this list, I can only comment on the dialogue of the
past two weeks. Please enlighten me if I make any mistakes.

It seems to me that George Soros' actions are understandable, given his
background. As I understand it, he is an American who emigrated from
Hungary around 1956 and made a fortune on the stock market. Now that
communism is dead, Soros has returned to Hungary. It seems he hopes to
support liberal market and political reforms with his substantial personal
fortune, thus ensuring that totalitarians (e.g. communists, fascists) and
racists (like the one's who cooperated with Hitler) never again control the
county of his birth. Someone stated that he "hates Hungarians," which is
absurd given this personal history.

If Hungarians are willing to accept the philanthropy, or whatever you call
it, of George Soros, then they will have to do it on his terms. The
arguement seems to be about whether those terms are unacceptable. It's a
perfectly legitimate auguement.

Some more thoughts: I am disheartened by all this talk of ethnic
minorities. If you wish to end up like Yugoslavia, keep it up.

Sandor -- I don't think Americans would care much if the Los Angeles Times
were Japanese owned; we already have plenty of Rupert Murdoch owned tabloids
in our grocery stores. I think he's Australian.

One more thing: Does anyone know of ANY Hungarian restaurant in Los
Angeles?

J. Szabo
Los Angeles
----------
From: owner-hungary
To: hungary
Subject: Re: HAL: A message for Dr. Odor
Date: Wednesday, March 06, 1996 6:25PM

>Unlike closed societies dominated by the state, open societies are
>characterized by a reliance on the rule of law, the existance of a
>democratically elected government, a diverse and vigorous civil
>society, respect for minorities and minority opinions, and a free
>market economy. A closed society expends most of its energies in
>preserving the existing order, whereas an open society takes law and
>respect for the rights of others as its starting point and creates
>progress and prosperity from that base.
>
>quote taken from "Building Open Societies", Soros Foundations Annual
>Report, 1994.

Communists and fascists in Eastern Europe, proponents of closed
totalitarian regimes, attack Soros exactly for his advocacy of open
society. When Dr. Odor calls this message garbage he puts himself squarely
in the company of the enemies of democracy in Slovakia, Serbia, Rumania,
and in Hungary.

------------------------------

From: jt...@pipeline.com (J. Tar)
Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 16:53:11 -0500 (EST)
Subject: HAL: Art Exhibit - Watercolors of Long Island

(MARCH 1, 1996)

LASZLO TAR EXHIBIT: LONG ISLAND

The Laszlo Tar Gallery is proud to open a new addition to it's fine art
collection, entitled "Watercolors of Long Island".

Laszlo Tar's Long Island collection represents one of his largest, most
interesting and beautiful series of landscapes. He began painting sections
of Long Island in the early 1980's. He and his son would travel the region
by car, often leaving before sunrise. As Mr. Tar painted, his son would
explore the region in search of new scenic spots. In 1989, his son moved to
the town of Huntington, where Laszlo would continue his work.

Organized in three segments -- "Harbors & Marine Scenes", "Village Streets"
and "Village Parks" -- the exhibit journeys the beautiful and scenic north
shore harbor villages of Roslyn, Oyster Bay, Cold Spring Harbor,
Huntington, Centerport, Northport and Port Jefferson.

Mr. Tar has always been attracted to the romance of marine scenes and
village settings. He finds his favorite spots where ships, boats and
villagers are surrounded by the splendid rolling hills of the area.

The Laszlo Tar Gallery is located at Web addresses:

1. http://www.art.net/TheGallery/Tar/exhibit.htm

2. http://www.jtar.com

<END>

------------------------------

End of *** Hungarian American List Digest *** V3 #65
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