1971 - My Top 100
SavoyBG
changes as I discover omissions and maybe a couple of things that were out
before 1971.
While working on this I discovered that the CCR Pendulum LP was out already in
1970, which moved "Have You Ever Seen The Rain into 1970 (# 22). Also "Cruisin'
For A Love" by the J. Geils Band (# 47) was inserted into 1970. The # 100 song
in 1970 is currently "Lay Down" by Melanie.
Here's how 1971 looks right now....some things that will surprise people.
1 ¦ Love Her Madly ¦ Doors
2 ¦ Draggin' The Line ¦ Tommy James
3 ¦ Brown Sugar ¦ Rolling Stones
4 ¦ What's Going On ¦ Marvin Gaye
5 ¦ She's Not Just Another Woman ¦ Eighth Day
6 ¦ Locomotive Breath ¦ Jethro Tull
7 ¦ Family Affair ¦ Sly & The Family Stone
8 ¦ Just My Imagination ¦ Temptations
9 ¦ Mr. Big Stuff ¦ Jean Knight
10 ¦ Whatcha See Is Whatcha Get ¦ Dramatics
11 ¦ Don't Let The Green Grass Fool You ¦ Wilson Pickett
12 ¦ Truckin' ¦ Grateful Dead
13 ¦ Do You Know What I Mean ¦ Lee Michaels
14 ¦ Everybody Knows About My Good Thing ¦ Little Johnny Taylor
15 ¦ Son Of My Father ¦ Giorgio
16 ¦ Have You Seen Her ¦ Chi-Lites
17 ¦ A Horse With No Name ¦ America
18 ¦ Mercy Mercy Me ¦ Marvin Gaye
19 ¦ Chirpy Chirpy Cheep Cheep ¦ Mac & Katie Kissoon
20 ¦ Black Dog ¦ Led Zeppelin
21 ¦ Clean Up Woman ¦ Betty Wright
22 ¦ Let's Stay Together ¦ Al Green
23 ¦ Take Me Home, Country Roads ¦ John Denver
24 ¦ Roundabout ¦ Yes
25 ¦ An Old Fashioned Love Song ¦ Three Dog Night
26 ¦ Stairway To Heaven ¦ Led Zeppelin
27 ¦ American Pie ¦ Don McLean
28 ¦ One Monkey Don't Stop No Show ¦ Honey Cone
29 ¦ Maggie May ¦ Rod Stewart
30 ¦ You Are Everything ¦ Stylistics
31 ¦ Happy Christmas (War Is Over) ¦ John & Yoko & Plastic Ono Band
32 ¦ Rock And Roll ¦ Led Zeppelin
33 ¦ Don't Knock My Love ¦ Wilson Pickett
34 ¦ Get It On (Band A Gong) ¦ T. Rex
35 ¦ It's Too Late ¦ Carole King
36 ¦ I Just Want To Celebrate ¦ Rare Earth
37 ¦ Rock Steady ¦ Aretha Franklin
38 ¦ Theme From Shaft ¦ Isaac Hayes
39 ¦ Drowning In The Sea Of Love ¦ Joe Simon
40 ¦ Signs ¦ Five Man Electrical Band
41 ¦ Keep Playing That Rock And Roll ¦ Edgar Winter's White Trash
42 ¦ Blue Money ¦ Van Morrison
43 ¦ The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down ¦ Joan Baez
44 ¦ Sweet Seasons ¦ Carole King
45 ¦ Day By Day (Every Minute Of The Hour) ¦ Continental 4
46 ¦ Won't Get Fooled Again ¦ The Who
47 ¦ Fire And Water ¦ Wilson Pickett
48 ¦ Funky Nassau ¦ Beginning Of The End
49 ¦ L.A. Woman ¦ Doors
50 ¦ That Evil Child ¦ B.B. King
51 ¦ Uncle Albert/Admiral Halsey ¦ Paul & Linda McCartney
52 ¦ Aqualung ¦ Jethro Tull
53 ¦ Trapped By A Thing Called Love ¦ Denise LaSalle
54 ¦ Imagine ¦ John Lennon
55 ¦ Without You ¦ Nilsson
56 ¦ Respect Yourself ¦ Staple Singers
57 ¦ Sweet City Woman ¦ Stampeders
58 ¦ Move On Up ¦ Curtis Mayfield
59 ¦ Sunshine ¦ Johnathan Edwards
60 ¦ Sweet And Innocent ¦ Donny Osmond
61 ¦ One Fine Morning ¦ Lighthouse
62 ¦ Hot Pants ¦ James Brown
63 ¦ I Am. I Said ¦ Neil Diamond
64 ¦ Sooner Or Later ¦ Grass Roots
65 ¦ Don't Pull You Love ¦ Hamilton, Joe Frank & Reynolds
66 ¦ One Toke Over The Line ¦ Brewer And Shipley
67 ¦ Heavy Makes You Happy ¦ Staple Singers
68 ¦ Thin Line Between Love And Hate ¦ Persuaders
69 ¦ Chick-A-Boom ¦ Daddy Dewdrop
70 ¦ Another Day ¦ Paul McCartney
71 ¦ Day After Day ¦ Badfinger
72 ¦ Love The One You're With ¦ Isley Brothers
73 ¦ Hijackin' Love ¦ Johnny Taylor
74 ¦ Where Did Our Love Go ¦ Donnie Elbert
75 ¦ Stick Up ¦ Honey Cone
76 ¦ Want Ads ¦ Honey Cone
77 ¦ I've Found Someone Of My Own ¦ Free Movement
78 ¦ It Don't Come Easy ¦ Ringo Starr
79 ¦ Right On The Tip Of My Tongue ¦ Brenda & Tabulations
80 ¦ Precious And Few ¦ Climax
81 ¦ Two Divided By Love ¦ Grass Roots
82 ¦ Misty Mountain Hop ¦ Led Zeppelin
83 ¦ Superstar ¦ Carpenters
84 ¦ Peace Train ¦ Cat Stevens
85 ¦ Wild Horses ¦ Rolling Stones
86 ¦ Never Can Say Goodbye ¦ Isaac Hayes
87 ¦ Those Were The Days ¦ Carroll O'Connor & Jean Stapleton
88 ¦ Treat Her Like A Lady ¦ Cornelius Brothers & Sister
89 ¦ Ain't No Sunshine ¦ Bill Withers
90 ¦ Inner City Blues ¦ Marvin Gaye
91 ¦ Smackwater Jack ¦ Carole King
92 ¦ Wild Night ¦ Van Morrison
93 ¦ How Can You Mend A Broken Heart ¦ Bee Gees
94 ¦ I Feel The Earth Move ¦ Carole King
95 ¦ If You Really Love Me ¦ Stevie Wonder
96 ¦ Oh Yoko ¦ John Lennon
97 ¦ Jeepster ¦ T. Rex
98 ¦ I Hear Those Church Bells Ringing ¦ Dusk
99 ¦ Way Back Home ¦ Jr. Walker & All-Stars
100 ¦ Changes ¦ David Bowie
Bruce Grossberg
Sharkny
"SavoyBG" <sav...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20021231235604...@mb-fx.aol.com...
> Okay, what a job, but I'm finally ready to post this. Naturally there will
be
> changes as I discover omissions and maybe a couple of things that were out
> before 1971.
>
> While working on this I discovered that the CCR Pendulum LP was out
already in
> 1970, which moved "Have You Ever Seen The Rain into 1970 (# 22). Also
"Cruisin'
> For A Love" by the J. Geils Band (# 47) was inserted into 1970. The # 100
song
> in 1970 is currently "Lay Down" by Melanie.
>
> Here's how 1971 looks right now....some things that will surprise people.
>
> 1 ¦ Love Her Madly ¦ Doors
Should have been a bigger bath.
Would have dumped all the Doors stuff and put in
1) Blame It On The Pony Express Johnny Johnson & The Bandwagon
Other than that some real classics.
> 2 ¦ Draggin' The Line ¦ Tommy James
> 3 ¦ Brown Sugar ¦ Rolling Stones
> 4 ¦ What's Going On ¦ Marvin Gaye
> 5 ¦ She's Not Just Another Woman ¦ Eighth Day
> 6 ¦ Locomotive Breath ¦ Jethro Tull
> 7 ¦ Family Affair ¦ Sly & The Family Stone
> 8 ¦ Just My Imagination ¦ Temptations
> 9 ¦ Mr. Big Stuff ¦ Jean Knight
> 10 ¦ Whatcha See Is Whatcha Get ¦ Dramatics
> 11 ¦ Don't Let The Green Grass Fool You ¦ Wilson Pickett
12) Hey Girl, Don't Bother Me The Tams
> 13 ¦ Do You Know What I Mean ¦ Lee Michaels
> 14 ¦ Everybody Knows About My Good Thing ¦ Little Johnny Taylor
> 15 ¦ Son Of My Father ¦ Chicory Tip
> 16 ¦ Have You Seen Her ¦ Chi-Lites
> 17 ¦ A Horse With No Name ¦ America
> 18 ¦ Mercy Mercy Me ¦ Marvin Gaye
> 19 ¦ Chirpy Chirpy Cheep Cheep ¦ Mac & Katie Kissoon
Preferred Daddy Dewdrop
> 20 ¦ Black Dog ¦ Led Zeppelin
> 21 ¦ Clean Up Woman ¦ Betty Wright
> 22 ¦ Let's Stay Together ¦ Al Green
> 23 ¦ Take Me Home, Country Roads ¦ John Denver
Preferred Toots & The Maytals but I don't think that was 71
so 23) Neverending Song Of Love - Delaney, Bonnie & friends
> 24 ¦ Roundabout ¦ Yes
Nope
24) My Sweet Lord George & Phil
24) LA International Airport Susan Raye
> 25 ¦ An Old Fashioned Love Song ¦ Three Dog Night
> 26 ¦ Stairway To Heaven ¦ Led Zeppelin
> 27 ¦ American Pie ¦ Don McLean
> 28 ¦ One Monkey Don't Stop No Show ¦ Honey Cone
> 29 ¦ Maggie May ¦ Rod Stewart
> 30 ¦ You Are Everything ¦ Stylistics
> 31 ¦ Happy Christmas (War Is Over) ¦ John & Yoko & Plastic Ono Band
> 32 ¦ Rock And Roll ¦ Led Zeppelin
> 33 ¦ Don't Knock My Love ¦ Wilson Pickett
> 34 ¦ Get It On (Band A Gong) ¦ T. Rex
> 35 ¦ It's Too Late ¦ Carole King
> 36 ¦ I Just Want To Celebrate ¦ Rare Earth
> 37 ¦ Rock Steady ¦ Aretha Franklin
> 38 ¦ Theme From Shaft ¦ Isaac Hayes
> 39 ¦ Drowning In The Sea Of Love ¦ Joe Simon
> 40 ¦ Signs ¦ Five Man Electrical Band
> 41 ¦ Keep Playing That Rock And Roll ¦ Edgar Winter's White Trash
> 42 ¦ Blue Money ¦ Van Morrison
> 43 ¦ The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down ¦ Joan Baez
> 44 ¦ Sweet Seasons ¦ Carole King
> 45 ¦ Day By Day (Every Minute Of The Hour) ¦ Continental 4
> 46 ¦ Won't Get Fooled Again ¦ The Who
> 47 ¦ Fire And Water ¦ Wilson Pickett
> 48 ¦ Funky Nassau ¦ Beginning Of The End
Dump The Doors
49 ) Sunshine Jonathon Edwards
> 50 ¦ That Evil Child ¦ B.B. King
> 51 ¦ Uncle Albert/Admiral Halsey ¦ Paul & Linda McCartney
> 52 ¦ Aqualung ¦ Jethro Tull
> 53 ¦ Trapped By A Thing Called Love ¦ Denise LaSalle
> 54 ¦ Imagine ¦ John Lennon
> 55 ¦ Without You ¦ Nilsson
> 56 ¦ Respect Yourself ¦ Staple Singers
> 57 ¦ Sweet City Woman ¦ Stampeders
> 58 ¦ Move On Up ¦ Curtis Mayfield
> 59 ¦ Sunshine ¦ Johnathan Edwards
> 60 ¦ Sweet And Innocent ¦ Donny Osmond
Donny Osmond was black?
60) Me & You and a Dog Named Boo - Lobo
> 61 ¦ One Fine Morning ¦ Lighthouse
> 62 ¦ Hot Pants ¦ James Brown
> 63 ¦ I Am. I Said ¦ Neil Diamond
> 64 ¦ Sooner Or Later ¦ Grass Roots
> 65 ¦ Don't Pull Your Love ¦ Hamilton, Joe Frank & Reynolds
Stone cold classic
> 66 ¦ One Toke Over The Line ¦ Brewer And Shipley
> 67 ¦ Heavy Makes You Happy ¦ Staple Singers
> 68 ¦ Thin Line Between Love And Hate ¦ Persuaders
> 69 ¦ Chick-A-Boom ¦ Daddy Dewdrop
> 70 ¦ Another Day ¦ Paul McCartney
> 71 ¦ Day After Day ¦ Badfinger
> 72 ¦ Love The One You're With ¦ Isley Brothers
> 73 ¦ Hijackin' Love ¦ Johnny Taylor
> 74 ¦ Where Did Our Love Go ¦ Donnie Elbert
> 75 ¦ Stick Up ¦ Honey Cone
> 76 ¦ Want Ads ¦ Honey Cone
> 77 ¦ I've Found Someone Of My Own ¦ Free Movement
> 78 ¦ It Don't Come Easy ¦ Ringo Starr
> 79 ¦ Right On The Tip Of My Tongue ¦ Brenda & Tabulations
> 80 ¦ Precious And Few ¦ Climax
> 81 ¦ Two Divided By Love ¦ Grass Roots
> 82 ¦ Misty Mountain Hop ¦ Led Zeppelin
> 83 ¦ Superstar ¦ Carpenters
> 84 ¦ Peace Train ¦ Cat Stevens
> 85 ¦ Wild Horses ¦ Rolling Stones
> 86 ¦ Never Can Say Goodbye ¦ Isaac Hayes
> 87 ¦ Those Were The Days ¦ Carroll O'Connor & Jean Stapleton
TMML
> 88 ¦ Treat Her Like A Lady ¦ Cornelius Brothers & Sister
> 89 ¦ Ain't No Sunshine ¦ Bill Withers
> 90 ¦ Inner City Blues ¦ Marvin Gaye
> 91 ¦ Smackwater Jack ¦ Carole King
> 92 ¦ Wild Night ¦ Van Morrison
> 93 ¦ How Can You Mend A Broken Heart ¦ Bee Gees
> 94 ¦ I Feel The Earth Move ¦ Carole King
> 95 ¦ If You Really Love Me ¦ Stevie Wonder
> 96 ¦ Oh Yoko ¦ John Lennon
> 97 ¦ Jeepster ¦ T. Rex
> 98 ¦ I Hear Those Church Bells Ringing ¦ Dusk
> 99 ¦ Way Back Home ¦ Jr. Walker & All-Stars
> 100 ¦ Changes ¦ David Bowie
--
Sharkny
SavoyBG
> 12) Hey Girl, Don't Bother Me The Tams
This is from 1964. I know it was big in the UK as a re-release in 1971, but my
lists go by year of release.
>15 Ś Son Of My Father Ś Chicory Tip
Nice try, the Giorgio is THE version.
>24) My Sweet Lord George & Phil
This is 1970.
>Donny Osmond was black?
Not exactly.
Bruce Grossberg
Geir Hongro
"SavoyBG" <sav...@aol.com> skrev i melding
news:20021231235604...@mb-fx.aol.com...
> 4 ¦ What's Going On ¦ Marvin Gaye
> 18 ¦ Mercy Mercy Me ¦ Marvin Gaye
Surprised to see that your Top 50 includes only the same two tracks from
this album that mine did. I thought this was generally viewed as the best
album of all time within your favourite genre?
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
> >From: "Sharkny"
> >15 ¦ Son Of My Father ¦ Chicory Tip
>
> Nice try, the Giorgio is THE version.
And anyway, Chicory Tip's version wasn't until 1972.
Geir Hongro
SavoyBG
>I thought this was generally viewed as the best
>album of all time within your favourite genre?
My favorite genre is 1950's R & B and rocka nd roll, 1952 - 1957. I like that
much better than 60's and 70's soul.
Bruce Grossberg
Geir Hongro
OK, I guess "What's Goin' On" was too musically complex for you then. :-)
Geir Hongro
SavoyBG
>Surprised to see that your Top 50 includes only the same two tracks from
>this album that mine did.
I think you missed the # 90 song.
90 ¦ Inner City Blues ¦ Marvin Gaye
Bruce Grossberg
Greg Ioannou
> >From: "Sharkny"
>
> > 12) Hey Girl, Don't Bother Me The Tams
>
> This is from 1964. I know it was big in the UK as a re-release in 1971,
but my
> lists go by year of release.
>
>
> >15 Ś Son Of My Father Ś Chicory Tip
>
> Nice try, the Giorgio is THE version.
I never liked the Giorgio version at all, but could tolerate the Chicory
Tip. Can't quite put my finger on the difference. Perhaps the Chicory Tip
recording is a bit poppier?
Not exactly a favourite of mine, either way.
Greg
Geir Hongro
"Greg Ioannou" <gregi...@rogers.com> skrev i melding
news:YDFQ9.118177$E_.1...@news02.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
> I never liked the Giorgio version at all, but could tolerate the Chicory
> Tip. Can't quite put my finger on the difference. Perhaps the Chicory Tip
> recording is a bit poppier?
The only difference I can hear is Chicory Tip's has better audio quality.
Giorgio is awarded several points from me for having made the original
though.
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
No, but I only made a Top 50, so I am comparing Top 50s.
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
"Geir Hongro" <geir...@onlinenospam.no> skrev i melding
news:7QFQ9.6063$Rc7.1...@news2.e.nsc.no...
In fact, I made just a Top 40, but that makes no difference anyway.
Geir Hongro
Taliesyn
From what I read both versions were released at the same time, January
1972. Thus there is no original version.
-Taliesyn
SavoyBG
> From what I read both versions were released at the same time, January
>1972. Thus there is no original version.
Giorgio's was definitely out in late 1971 and he was one of the writers.
Bruce Grossberg
Taliesyn
The Grass Roots charted with "Glory Bound on Dunhill 4302 on the
February 12 issue of Cash Box. "Son of My Father" came out in the
US as Dunhill 4304. Right away that indicates a US 1972 release.
All international release evidence still shows that "Son Of My Father",
either version, was released in Europe in January 1972. A simple check
of various websites for Giorgio Moroder and Chicory Tip will confirm
this. I haven't found one that indicated December 1971. I was looking
for German charts but couldn't find them. I know I've seen them before.
The reason both were released at the same time in the UK was because
Chicory Tip's producer (in Dec. 1971) got an advance copy of the planned
release of Morodor's "Son Of My Father" in the UK (from Moroder's German
record label), asking him if he'd be interested in promoting the record
there when it was released in Jan 1972. Apparently he liked it so much
that he gave it to Chicory Tip and rush released their version in early
January 1972, to coincide with Giorgio's release. I can't guarantee the
accuracy of any info or dates, but that's what I read.
-Taliesyn
Geir Hongro
"Taliesyn" <Tali...@netscape.net> skrev i melding
news:3E133782...@netscape.net...
> From what I read both versions were released at the same time, January
> 1972. Thus there is no original version.
The song was written by Giorgio Moroder himself, and released in Italy in
1971.
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
> All international release evidence still shows that "Son Of My Father",
> either version, was released in Europe in January 1972. A simple check
> of various websites for Giorgio Moroder and Chicory Tip will confirm
> this. I haven't found one that indicated December 1971. I was looking
> for German charts but couldn't find them. I know I've seen them before.
You'd have to find Italian charts to find the answer, as Giorgio was an
Italian act.
Geir Hongro
Sharkny
> >From: "Sharkny"
>
> > 12) Hey Girl, Don't Bother Me The Tams
>
> This is from 1964. I know it was big in the UK as a re-release in 1971,
but my
> lists go by year of release.
>
>
> >15 Ś Son Of My Father Ś Chicory Tip
>
> Nice try, the Giorgio is THE version.
>
>
> >24) My Sweet Lord George & Phil
>
> This is 1970.
In New Zealand, it was 1971.
--
Sharkny
Taliesyn
Nonsense, as he was living in Germany at the time of "Son Of My Father."
Please present your source that it was released in 1971.
-Taliesyn
Sharkny
> >From: "Sharkny"
>
> > 12) Hey Girl, Don't Bother Me The Tams
>
> This is from 1964. I know it was big in the UK as a re-release in 1971,
but my
> lists go by year of release.
>
>
> >15 Ś Son Of My Father Ś Chicory Tip
>
> Nice try, the Giorgio is THE version.
Disagree. In NZ the Giorgio version was a non-starter.
--
Sharkny
Geir Hongro
"Sharkny" <sp...@sharks.net.nz> skrev i melding
news:HsJQ9.5256$F63.1...@news.xtra.co.nz...
> In New Zealand, it was 1971.
If you'd compained about the chronological accuracy of my 79/80 charts,
which includes "I Got You" by Split Enz in 1980 rather than 1979, which was
its NZ release year, then you'd actually had a valid point. :-)
Geir Hongro
SavoyBG
>Nonsense, as he was living in Germany at the time of "Son Of My Father."
>Please present your source that it was released in 1971.
>
The original US 45 has a date of 1971 on it as its original Europeon release.
It's listed as "A Stop International Recording."
I would guess that if Chickory Tip's producer got an advanc copy, so did radio
stations, and it would have been played on the air already somewhere in 1971.
Bruce Grossberg
Sharkny
"Geir Hongro" <geir...@onlinenospam.no> wrote in message
news:ciLQ9.6209$Rc7.1...@news2.e.nsc.no...
I think you're replying to the wrong person.
--
Sharkny
SavoyBG
86 ¦ Hot Pants-I'm Coming, I'm Coming ¦ Bobby Byrd
98 ¦ No One To Depend On ¦ Santana
Everything else dropped accordingly, # 100 is now the Dusk record.
Bruce Grossberg
SavoyBG
26 ¦ Betcha By Golly Wow ¦ Stylistics
Everything drops one notch again. Here's how the bottom looks now...
96 ¦ I Feel The Earth Move ¦ Carole King
97 ¦ If You Really Love Me ¦ Stevie Wonder
98 ¦ Oh Yoko ¦ John Lennon
99 ¦ No One To Depend On ¦ Santana
100 ¦ Jeepster ¦ T. Rex
Bruce Grossberg
Eric A Holeman
Geir Hongro <geir...@onlinenospam.no> wrote:
>this album that mine did. I thought this was generally viewed as the best
>album of all time within your favourite genre?
By whom?
--
---
Eric Holeman eholem1 at uic,edu Chicago Illinois USA
Geir Hongro
"Eric A Holeman" <eho...@icarus.cc.uic.edu> skrev i melding
news:av0nrt$9...@icarus.cc.uic.edu...
> In article <8uEQ9.6022$Rc7.1...@news2.e.nsc.no>,
> Geir Hongro <geir...@onlinenospam.no> wrote:
>
> >this album that mine did. I thought this was generally viewed as the best
> >album of all time within your favourite genre?
>
> By whom?
Voters in various surveys.
"What's Going On" and "Otis Blue" are the two soul albums most often
represented in those "best 100 albums of all time" lists.
Geir Hongro
SavoyBG
>"What's Going On" and "Otis Blue" are the two soul albums most often
>represented in those "best 100 albums of all time" lists.
>
>
Yes, but the voters on those lists are people who like mostly rock, AOR to be
specific. It's crazy to judge what are thought of as the best soul albums,
based on what people who like mostly rock think.
Gaye and Redding are two soul performers that are very big with rock fans.
If you took a vote using just soul fans, the results would be a lot different.
Also, most soul fans are not really album fans, especially with the 60's and
early 70's stuff.
The biggest Gaye cuts with soul fans are "Let's Get It On" and "Distant Lover."
The biggest Redding cuts with soul fans are "These Arms Of Mine" and "My
Lover's Prayer."
Bruce Grossberg
Eric A Holeman
Geir Hongro <geir...@onlinenospam.no> wrote:
>Voters in various surveys.
Ah yes. My favorite one of those was one that played the Top 200 or so
records "of all time" on the radio over a weekend in 1978. Strangely,
Fleetwood Mac took 3 of the top 10.
More recently, there's this one here:
http://www.cnn.com/2000/WORLD/europe/09/03/britain.albums .
Unsurprisingly, a certain English band did rather well in this survey,
though the quote at the end of the article seems to have been a tad
premature.
>"What's Going On" and "Otis Blue" are the two soul albums most often
>represented in those "best 100 albums of all time" lists.
So they're the two R&B/soul albums most recognized and beloved by rock/pop
fans. They're both fine albums, but elevating 'em much beyond that on the
basis of a poll of rock fans seems rather pointless. Particularly with
"What's Going On" there always seems to be a tokenistic pat on the back of
how remarkable it is that a soul album can be as complex a production as a
pop or rock album.
That said, there's nothing wrong with "What's Going On." It's a fine
album, but calling it the pinnacle of soul music is asking a lot of it,
particularly in a period when the soul sound was taking an urban twist on
a lot of fronts, from Donny Hathaway to Marvin to Isaac Hayes.
Eric A Holeman
SavoyBG <sav...@aol.com> wrote:
>The biggest Gaye cuts with soul fans are "Let's Get It On" and "Distant
>Lover."
I like "What's Going On", both the album and the title cut, but for a
stand-alone single, I'd have to say that "Let's Get It On" beats it.
Musically, it seems to do what "What's Going On" doesn't--it stops beating
around the bush.
Brett A. Pasternack
> If you took a vote using just soul fans, the results would be a lot different.
> Also, most soul fans are not really album fans, especially with the 60's and
> early 70's stuff.
Interesting. I'm curious...given all of that, are there any particular
albums that you know or think would be near the top of such a survey?
Geir Hongro
> >From: "Geir Hongro"
>
> >"What's Going On" and "Otis Blue" are the two soul albums most often
> >represented in those "best 100 albums of all time" lists.
> >
> >
>
> Yes, but the voters on those lists are people who like mostly rock, AOR to
be
> specific.
Rock, yes, but not AOR.
> Gaye and Redding are two soul performers that are very big with rock fans.
>
> If you took a vote using just soul fans, the results would be a lot
different.
> Also, most soul fans are not really album fans, especially with the 60's
and
> early 70's stuff.
Understandable, considering "What's Going On" (1971) was the first ever soul
album that was carefully and throughoutly put together to work as a whole.
Before that, soul albums were inferior, containing a couple of hit singles
and otherwise just cover versions of older materiel (and that goes for "Otis
Blue" too)
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
> In article <20030102153707...@mb-mk.aol.com>,
> SavoyBG <sav...@aol.com> wrote:
>
> >The biggest Gaye cuts with soul fans are "Let's Get It On" and "Distant
> >Lover."
>
> I like "What's Going On", both the album and the title cut, but for a
> stand-alone single, I'd have to say that "Let's Get It On" beats it.
As for a stand-alone single, Marvin Gaye's second masterpiece (after "What's
Goin' On", which I also consider a masterpiece as a stand alone track)
arrived late in his career: "Sexual Healing".
Geir Hongro
SavoyBG
>Interesting. I'm curious...given all of that, are there any particular
>albums that you know or think would be near the top of such a survey?
>
Again, albums are not that big, it's more of a songs thing, but here are a few
legendary soul albums....
Jerry Butler - The Ice Man Cometh
Isaac Hayes - Hot Buttered Soul
James Brown - Live At The Apollo
Aretha Franklin - I Never Loved A Man
Aretha Franklin - Lady Soul
Temptations - In A Mellow Mood
Impressions - Keep On Pushing
The Hayes was always in print and sold constantly (mostly on cassette) in all
the years that I worked in the record business.
Bruce Grossberg
Geir Hongro
> More recently, there's this one here:
> http://www.cnn.com/2000/WORLD/europe/09/03/britain.albums .
> Unsurprisingly, a certain English band did rather well in this survey,
> though the quote at the end of the article seems to have been a tad
> premature.
A wonderful book, possibly my favourite book in fact.
I am still waiting for a new edition to arrive. :-)
> So they're the two R&B/soul albums most recognized and beloved by rock/pop
> fans.
More like the general audience. R&B/soul fans vote in those surveys too, but
their typical favourites end up a little bit further down the lists (below
100 that is)
> They're both fine albums, but elevating 'em much beyond that on the
> basis of a poll of rock fans seems rather pointless. Particularly with
> "What's Going On" there always seems to be a tokenistic pat on the back of
> how remarkable it is that a soul album can be as complex a production as a
> pop or rock album.
Well, all albums should be anyway.
Geir Hongro
SavoyBG
>Understandable, considering "What's Going On" (1971) was the first ever soul
>album that was carefully and throughoutly put together to work as a whole.
How would you know that?
Are you telling us that Isaac Hayes didn't "carefully and thoughtfully" put
together "Hot Buttered Soul" as a whole?
Are you telling us that Jerry Butler and Gamble and Huff didn't "carefully and
thoughtfully" put together "The Ice Man Cometh" as a whole?
>Before that, soul albums were inferior,
That's just your opinion, I disagree, and so do loads of soul fans.
>containing a couple of hit singles
>and otherwise just cover versions of older materiel (and that goes for "Otis
>Blue" too)
As if no albums that you ever liked contained cover versions (remakes,
actually).
Here's a remake (covers) from one of your lists.
1974
35.. The Air That I Breathe - The Hollies
I guess if Geir likes it, a cover is okay.
Geir, stick with the crud that you know, and stay out of R & B discussions
please.
Bruce Grossberg
Sharkny
Are you saying that complex equals good?
--
Sharkny
SavoyBG
about Geir Hongro
>Are you saying that complex equals good?
He's been saying that forever in these newsgroups. He thinks only music with
complexity and strong melodies are good.
Bruce Grossberg
Sharkny
But no drums? So that rules out rock,soul,reggae, punk, etc, etc. Words fail
me!
--
Sharkny
Greg Ioannou
> >From: "Brett A. Pasternack"
>
> >Interesting. I'm curious...given all of that, are there any particular
> >albums that you know or think would be near the top of such a survey?
> >
>
> Again, albums are not that big, it's more of a songs thing, but here are a
few
> legendary soul albums....
>
> Jerry Butler - The Ice Man Cometh
> Isaac Hayes - Hot Buttered Soul
> James Brown - Live At The Apollo
> Aretha Franklin - I Never Loved A Man
> Aretha Franklin - Lady Soul
> Temptations - In A Mellow Mood
> Impressions - Keep On Pushing
Wow, if thems the best soul albums I'll stick to prog. Heard 'em all. You
can keep them, thanks. Wouldn't pay a dollar for the pile of them.
Greg
SavoyBG
>Wow, if thems the best soul albums I'll stick to prog. Heard 'em all. You
>can keep them, thanks. Wouldn't pay a dollar for the pile of them.
>
Go join Geir in the chair.
Bruce Grossberg
SavoyBG
36 Ś Hot Rod Lincoln Ś Commander Cody
Album was out in 1971, sungle too I think.
Knocked "Jeepster" out of the top 100.
Bruce Grossberg
Geir Hongro
> >From: "Brett A. Pasternack"
These are all in the Virgin Top 1000 that the article somewhere in this
thread describes:
> Isaac Hayes - Hot Buttered Soul
> James Brown - Live At The Apollo
> Aretha Franklin - I Never Loved A Man
> Aretha Franklin - Lady Soul
Mostly cover versions (I admit Hayes' versions are at times radically
different from the originals), but I guess the R&B buyers hadn't heard the
originals....
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
> Are you saying that complex equals good?
Absolutely.
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
>
> "SavoyBG" <sav...@aol.com> wrote in message
> news:20030102205936...@mb-mk.aol.com...
> > >From: "Sharkny"
> >
> > about Geir Hongro
> >
> > >Are you saying that complex equals good?
> >
> > He's been saying that forever in these newsgroups. He thinks only music
> with
> > complexity and strong melodies are good.
>
> But no drums?
Almost all pop music has drums.
Geir Hongro
Greg Ioannou
> Another damn addition.
>
> 36 Ś Hot Rod Lincoln Ś Commander Cody
>
> Album was out in 1971, sungle too I think.
>
> Knocked "Jeepster" out of the top 100.
Hot Rod Lincoln is a terrific track -- but Jeepster should have been rated
higher than all along.
Greg
Sharkny
"Geir Hongro" <geir...@nospam.online.no> wrote in message
news:hC7R9.6397$CG6.1...@news4.e.nsc.no...
So you'd wipe out Chuck Berry, Early Beatles, All of the Stones,
Elvis,etc,etc.
--
Sharkny
Sharkny
SavoyBG
>Hayes' versions are at times radically
>different from the originals), but I guess the R&B buyers hadn't heard the
>originals....
Ya right, I'm sure they never heard "Walk On By."
Hayes style was revolutionary, a forerunner to artists like Barry White who
were to become superstars later in the 70's.
Bruce Grossberg
Brett A. Pasternack
Makes sense. I've never heard that Tempts album singled out for such
praise, that's interesting.
Geir Hongro
> >From: "Geir Hongro"
>
> >Hayes' versions are at times radically
> >different from the originals), but I guess the R&B buyers hadn't heard
the
> >originals....
>
> Ya right, I'm sure they never heard "Walk On By."
It is actually likely some of them hadn't heard the Beatles tunes that
particularly Otis Redding covered.
> Hayes style was revolutionary,
Possibly. And he also managed to sound melodic, like Marvin Gaye and Al
Green (not to mention Stevie Wonder) after him. Which makes him considerably
better than the rest of the bunch you mentioned.
Plus he is excellent as the voice of Chef. :-)
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
"Brett A. Pasternack" <bret...@erols.com> skrev i melding
news:3E1534...@erols.com...
> Makes sense. I've never heard that Tempts album singled out for such
> praise, that's interesting.
I thought "Cloud Nine" was usually considered their masterpiece album.
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
Early Beatles was actually quite musically complex, doing some harmonic
changes and modulations that were earlier only known from Tin Pan Alley pop
and classical music, as was Stones during their best period (66-67)
As for Elvis, he was _extremely_ overrated, while Chuck Berry (although
harmonically inferior like all 50s rock) should at least have credit for
writing his own material and having a consideraly less annoying singing
style than, say, Little Richard.
Geir Hongro
SavoyBG
> Chuck Berry (although
>harmonically inferior like all 50s rock) should at least have credit for
>writing his own material and having a consideraly less annoying singing
>style than, say, Little Richard.
Little Richard was 100 times the vocalist that Chuck Berry was.
Bruce Grossberg
Louis M. Pecora
<sav...@aol.com> wrote:
> > Chuck Berry (although
> >harmonically inferior like all 50s rock) should at least have credit for
> >writing his own material and having a consideraly less annoying singing
> >style than, say, Little Richard.
Actually, Chuck Berry was doing what Bo Diddly spoke directly about:
using the guitar more as a rhythm/percussion instrumental sound than an
harmonic one. An interesting twist that Dick Dale also came upon,
apparently independently. Lots of 50's and later R&R playing is from
that angle.
--
Lou Pecora
- My views are my own.
Geir Hongro
> >From: "Geir Hongro"
>
> >Understandable, considering "What's Going On" (1971) was the first ever
soul
> >album that was carefully and throughoutly put together to work as a
whole.
>
> How would you know that?
>
> Are you telling us that Isaac Hayes didn't "carefully and thoughtfully"
put
> together "Hot Buttered Soul" as a whole?
It wasn't a concept album. Only concept albums are.
All albums should be concept albums in some way.
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
"Louis M. Pecora" <pec...@anvil.nrl.navy.mil> skrev i melding
news:030120031114143021%pec...@anvil.nrl.navy.mil...
I'm not interested in what happened in the 50s, other than a few Frank
Sinatra records. "Rock" music started with The Beatles in 1963.
Geir Hongro
Louis M. Pecora
<geir...@onlinenospam.no> wrote:
> I'm not interested in what happened in the 50s, other than a few Frank
> Sinatra records. "Rock" music started with The Beatles in 1963.
Makes me wonder why you bother commenting on it then. You open up a
conversation and then say you're not interested.
Zaragon
Though this is getting OT, hasn't it been determined that out of
Rock's founding fathers, Little Richard was THEE one to have actually
invented Rock n' Roll?
TS
Brett A. Pasternack
Well, he'll certainly tell you so. B^)
I don't think that it would ever be correct to say that one artist
invented rock and roll. Rock evolved and there are recordings from the
forties that would have been considered rock and roll if they were
released later. But LR can be forgiven for overstating the case (or
others for overstating it on his behalf), because certainly he was a
very major figure in the development.
As for their singing, there's no question that LR had more power, but to
call him 100 times the vocalist that Berry was severe exaggeration in my
book. LR is a great singer, but CB had a fine, more understated style
which isn't far behind. (And CB was somewhat ahead as a songwriter
although, again, the other was no slouch.)
Brett A. Pasternack
>
> "SavoyBG" <sav...@aol.com> skrev i melding
> news:20030102184043...@mb-mk.aol.com...
> > >From: "Geir Hongro"
> >
> > >Understandable, considering "What's Going On" (1971) was the first ever
> soul
> > >album that was carefully and throughoutly put together to work as a
> whole.
> >
> > How would you know that?
> >
> > Are you telling us that Isaac Hayes didn't "carefully and thoughtfully"
> put
> > together "Hot Buttered Soul" as a whole?
>
> It wasn't a concept album. Only concept albums are.
You're just insane, you know that, don't you? I mean, if you really
believe that. Unless you're just applying it as a tautology (if it's put
together carefully, therefore it's a concept album), in which case I
want to know how you know that Hayes didn't.
Geir Hongro
"Zaragon" <Zara...@hotmail.com> skrev i melding
news:4707a5a8.03010...@posting.google.com...
> Though this is getting OT, hasn't it been determined that out of
> Rock's founding fathers, Little Richard was THEE one to have actually
> invented Rock n' Roll?
I'd say it was Elvis Presley and Sam Phillips. Before that, there were two
different genres. There was R&B and there was country music.
Presley/Phillips merged them and got rock'n'roll.
But was it any GOOD? No, it wasn't!
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
"Greg Ioannou" <gregi...@rogers.com> skrev i melding
news:p37R9.136982$yW.1...@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
> Wow, if thems the best soul albums I'll stick to prog. Heard 'em all. You
> can keep them, thanks. Wouldn't pay a dollar for the pile of them.
Agree in most cases (particularly James Brown and Aretha Franklin). But the
Isaac Hayes album definitely had its moments.
Geir Hongro
Mister Charlie
"Geir Hongro" <geir...@onlinenospam.no> wrote in message
news:iNoR9.6955$Rc7.1...@news2.e.nsc.no...
And there wouldn't have been a Beatles without Elvis...they were raised
and learned in the crucible of 50's rock.
Mister Charlie
Geir Hongro
"Mister Charlie" <smoker...@myway.com> skrev i melding
news:av5fns$cablv$1...@ID-63206.news.dfncis.de...
> And there wouldn't have been a Beatles without Elvis...
There wouldn't have been a Beatles without Music Hall, Vaudeville and Tin
Pan Alley either.
And that is the main difference between them and American acts. The Beatles
had ZERO country influences, instead they had European influenes that were a
lot more complex musically than country music is.
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
> It was a great watershed album, pointing to the later funk to come.
I like it because it is melodic. Other than EWF and late period Kool & The
Gang, no other funk was.
It was closer to the style that Marvin Gaye and Al Green later developed.
Geir Hongro
Mister Charlie
rock and R&B. It was imported but it served them well.
Sharkny
"Geir Hongro" <geir...@onlinenospam.no> wrote in message news:iNoR9.6955$Rc7.1...@news2.e.nsc.no...
>
> "Zaragon" <Zara...@hotmail.com> skrev i melding
> news:4707a5a8.03010...@posting.google.com...
>
> > Though this is getting OT, hasn't it been determined that out of
> > Rock's founding fathers, Little Richard was THEE one to have actually
> > invented Rock n' Roll?
>
> I'd say it was Elvis Presley and Sam Phillips. Before that, there were two
> different genres. There was R&B and there was country music.
> Presley/Phillips merged them and got rock'n'roll.
If that's not revisionism, I don't know what is. There's a disturbing trend coming through in your posts. White good, black bad.
--
Sharkny
Jeff Troutman
"Geir Hongro" <geir...@onlinenospam.no> wrote:
>
> "Zaragon" <Zara...@hotmail.com> skrev i melding
> news:4707a5a8.03010...@posting.google.com...
>
> > Though this is getting OT, hasn't it been determined that out of
> > Rock's founding fathers, Little Richard was THEE one to have actually
> > invented Rock n' Roll?
>
> I'd say it was Elvis Presley and Sam Phillips. Before that, there were two
> different genres. There was R&B and there was country music.
> Presley/Phillips merged them and got rock'n'roll.
>
Um, no.
They don't even make that claim at Graceland.
Jeff Troutman
Taliesyn
John stated "nothing really affected my until Elvis."
George was influenced by Chet Atkins, Buddy Holly and Scotty Moore.
Paul favored Little Richard.
I didn't invent the above statements, they're from respected reference
books. In other words, Geir, these are NOT European influences.
My books either have the pages of their European influences torn out
or Brucie has stolen them. So please go ahead and offer us some of
the European influences (you claim) that have inspired/influenced The
Beatles.
-Taliesyn
Brett A. Pasternack
Zero country influences. Ah, so THAT'S why they worshipped Carl Perkins!
Zero country influences. Ah, so THAT'S why they covered "Act Naturally"!
Zero country influences. Ah, so THAT'S why they wrote "What Goes On" and
"I Don't Want To Spoil The Party"!
Zero country influences. Ah, so THAT'S why Ringo recorded the album
Beaucoups of Blues.
Once again, Geir, you're just making stuff up to fit your preconceptions
without thinking it through at all.
Geir Hongro
> Not true! They did indeed like American country records as much as the
> rock and R&B. It was imported but it served them well.
If they were influenced by country & western, then they would _never_ have
gotten beyond those three chords they used on "Love Me Do" and "I Saw Her
Standing There". Just forget about the brilliant and surprising modulation
from C-major to F-major in "From Me To You" - it could never have happened
because country, blues and R&B were WAY to musically limited for something
as sophisticated as that.
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
"Taliesyn" <Tali...@netscape.net> skrev i melding
news:3E165D78...@netscape.net...
> Geir Hongro wrote:
> > "Mister Charlie" <smoker...@myway.com> skrev i melding
> > news:av5fns$cablv$1...@ID-63206.news.dfncis.de...
> >
> >>And there wouldn't have been a Beatles without Elvis...
> >
> > There wouldn't have been a Beatles without Music Hall, Vaudeville and
Tin
> > Pan Alley either.
> >
> > And that is the main difference between them and American acts. The
Beatles
> > had ZERO country influences, instead they had European influenes that
were a
> > lot more complex musically than country music is.
> >
>
> John stated "nothing really affected my until Elvis."
>
> George was influenced by Chet Atkins, Buddy Holly and Scotty Moore.
>
> Paul favored Little Richard.
That is a limited version of Paul's influences to say the least. Paul
McCartney grew up in a musical family and had _way_ more influences that
that. Including at LOT of non-rock influences that were the one and only
reason why he became such a genius.
Paul McCartney was the one true musical genius in that group.
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
> Geir Hongro wrote:
> >
> > "Mister Charlie" <smoker...@myway.com> skrev i melding
> > news:av5fns$cablv$1...@ID-63206.news.dfncis.de...
> >
> > > And there wouldn't have been a Beatles without Elvis...
> >
> > There wouldn't have been a Beatles without Music Hall, Vaudeville and
Tin
> > Pan Alley either.
> >
> > And that is the main difference between them and American acts. The
Beatles
> > had ZERO country influences, instead they had European influenes that
were a
> > lot more complex musically than country music is.
>
> Zero country influences. Ah, so THAT'S why they worshipped Carl Perkins!
>
> Zero country influences. Ah, so THAT'S why they covered "Act Naturally"!
>
> Zero country influences. Ah, so THAT'S why they wrote "What Goes On" and
> "I Don't Want To Spoil The Party"!
Ringo Starr and George Harrison were never the most important members of
that band anyway.
There was ONE genius in The Beatles and his name is Paul McCartney.
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
Melody good, harmony good, everything else bad.
The trouble is that black musicians WAY too often tend to think the
opposite - if they don't then they make good music.
Only melodic music is good music.
Geir Hongro
Mister Charlie
>
> "Mister Charlie" <smoker...@myway.com> skrev i melding
> news:av5i4g$bh812$1...@ID-63206.news.dfncis.de...
>
> > Not true! They did indeed like American country records as much as
the
> > rock and R&B. It was imported but it served them well.
>
> If they were influenced by country & western, then they would _never_
have
> gotten beyond those three chords they used on "Love Me Do" and "I Saw
Her
> Standing There".
Bullbleep. Vast and unsupportable supposition on your part.
The operative word is "influenced". NOT "soley influenced". Rock n
Roll was pretty pedestrian then as well, chord-wise.
They were tops because they had an instinctive gift that, with a bit of
learning (Paul did take piano for a small time as a child) they could
creatively aply these things in ways no one else was doing.
It's well-known that the early Beatles (Paul especially) were also
inspired by English-music-hall and show tunes. A bit of Latin along
with R&B, C&W and R&R and they had all the ingredients for their own
special recipe.
Mister Charlie
musical genius? Only in cooperation woking with John.
Mister Charlie
every one of them was important for the Beatle gestalt to survive and
grow.
John and Paul both inspired each other to genius. Afterwards, both lost
it.
Geroge was an excellent guitar player. Ringo a great drummer. 4
geniuses would never have been able to work together the same, hence
never being the real Beatles.
Mister Charlie
Geir Hongro
>
> "Geir Hongro" <geir...@nospam.online.no> wrote in message
> news:SvIR9.7046$CG6.1...@news4.e.nsc.no...
> >
> > "Mister Charlie" <smoker...@myway.com> skrev i melding
> > news:av5i4g$bh812$1...@ID-63206.news.dfncis.de...
> >
> > > Not true! They did indeed like American country records as much as
> the
> > > rock and R&B. It was imported but it served them well.
> >
> > If they were influenced by country & western, then they would _never_
> have
> > gotten beyond those three chords they used on "Love Me Do" and "I Saw
> Her
> > Standing There".
>
> Bullbleep. Vast and unsupportable supposition on your part.
>
> The operative word is "influenced". NOT "soley influenced". Rock n
> Roll was pretty pedestrian then as well, chord-wise.
Which proves they had other non-American influences as well. And they were
more important. If they had just aped American music (like Tommy Steele and
Marty Wilde did a few years earlier), then they would never have made it
outside the UK market.
> It's well-known that the early Beatles (Paul especially) were also
> inspired by English-music-hall and show tunes.
And that is the one and only thing that made them special. Paul McCartney
alone should have the honour for that. He was the definite genius in that
band.
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
> Not true. He was the best all-around "musician" of the lot...but
> musical genius? Only in cooperation woking with John.
John managed to come up with several gems between 1963 and 1967 (after which
he lost it completely and never quite regained it), but that must have been
due to Paul teaching him some tricks about using more than just three
chords.
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
> John and Paul both inspired each other to genius. Afterwards, both lost
> it.
John lost it already around the time he met Yoko Ono. Paul lost part of his
sense of quality (seperating good songs from bad ones) when the band broke
up, but even recently, he manages to come up with at least 2-3 really great
songs each time he releases a solo album.
Geir Hongro
Brett A. Pasternack
>
> "Brett A. Pasternack" <bret...@erols.com> skrev i melding
> news:3E1735...@erols.com...
> > > > And there wouldn't have been a Beatles without Elvis...
> > >
> > > There wouldn't have been a Beatles without Music Hall, Vaudeville and
> Tin
> > > Pan Alley either.
> > >
> > > And that is the main difference between them and American acts. The
> Beatles
> > > had ZERO country influences, instead they had European influenes that
> were a
> > > lot more complex musically than country music is.
> >
> > Zero country influences. Ah, so THAT'S why they worshipped Carl Perkins!
> >
> > Zero country influences. Ah, so THAT'S why they covered "Act Naturally"!
> >
> > Zero country influences. Ah, so THAT'S why they wrote "What Goes On" and
> > "I Don't Want To Spoil The Party"!
>
> Ringo Starr and George Harrison were never the most important members of
> that band anyway.
I agree with this...
> There was ONE genius in The Beatles and his name is Paul McCartney.
...and while I don't quite agree with this, I am more of a fan of Paul
than of any of the others.
None of this, however, changes anything. You claimed that the Beatles
had ZERO country influences (capitalization yours) and even if it were
only George and Ringo who were interested in country, your statement
would be patently untrue. At any rate, while Ringo certainly was the
biggest country fan of the group, they all were influenced by country
music, although much of that influence came indirectly through the Sun
rockabilly stuff. I mean, it was Paul liked to sing "Blue Moon Of
Kentucky", for goodness sake.
Brett A. Pasternack
>
> "Mister Charlie" <smoker...@myway.com> skrev i melding
> news:av5i4g$bh812$1...@ID-63206.news.dfncis.de...
>
> > Not true! They did indeed like American country records as much as the
> > rock and R&B. It was imported but it served them well.
>
> If they were influenced by country & western, then they would _never_ have
> gotten beyond those three chords they used on "Love Me Do" and "I Saw Her
> Standing There".
Geir, THINK before you make idiotic statements like this.
Since they *were* influenced by country music, your statement disproves
itself.
Brett A. Pasternack
>
> "Geir Hongro" <geir...@nospam.online.no> wrote in message
> news:0xIR9.7047$CG6.1...@news4.e.nsc.no...
> > > John stated "nothing really affected my until Elvis."
> > >
> > > George was influenced by Chet Atkins, Buddy Holly and Scotty Moore.
> > >
> > > Paul favored Little Richard.
> >
> > That is a limited version of Paul's influences to say the least. Paul
> > McCartney grew up in a musical family and had _way_ more influences
> that
> > that. Including at LOT of non-rock influences that were the one and
> only
> > reason why he became such a genius.
> >
> > Paul McCartney was the one true musical genius in that group.
> >
> >
> Not true. He was the best all-around "musician" of the lot...but
> musical genius? Only in cooperation woking with John.
He didn't have John to make Ram, Band On The Run, Back To The Egg, or
Press To Play. Genius works in my book.
Mind you, I think John was a genius too...
Mister Charlie
Mister Charlie
"Brett A. Pasternack" <bret...@erols.com> wrote in message
news:3E17C2...@erols.com...
I don't believe ANY of the 4 beatle's solo work approaches 'genius'.
The ones you named are crackin' good music, but no genius.
Mister Charlie
Mister Charlie
ragged him mercilessly and put him down for the square taste. Instead
they embraced it and helped bring it to fruition, indicating a healthy
appreciation on ALL their parts for good music, no matter what type.
Mister Charlie
It is the rather broad, sweeping generalization and inaccuracies that
may stimulate threads but don't reflect reality. Just so long as we all
know where the truth lies it's a cool conversational device.
Ike E. Procken
> . . . the brilliant and surprising modulation from
> C-major to F-major in "From Me To You" . . .
FWIW, the chord progression in the bridge of "From Me To You" :
C
Gm7 C7 F C7 F
Am7 D7 G G7aug
C
was great, but it had been used plenty before that. A year earlier,
"Johnny Angel" by Shelley Fabares was a #1 hit, and had essentially the
same progression in the bridge:
C
Gm7 C7 F
Am7 D7 G G7
C
(I'll bet that's where the Beatles picked it up.)
In 1960, there was Etta Jones' Top40 hit "Don't Go To Strangers", whose
bridge was very similar:
C
Gm7 C7 Gm7 C7 F C7 F
Am7 D7 Am7 D7 Dm7 G7
C
And "Surrey With The Fringe On Top" from the musical Oklahoma (1943)
might have been the granddaddy, with a bridge of:
C
Gm7 C7 F Gm7 C7 F
Am7 D7 G Am7 D7 G7
C
This is not any knock against the Beatles. If they didn't use that
pattern first, arguably they used it best. They certainly knew how to
use those great American influences. ;->
Louis M. Pecora
<geir...@nospam.online.no> wrote:
> If they were influenced by country & western, then they would _never_ have
> gotten beyond those three chords they used on "Love Me Do" and "I Saw Her
> Standing There". Just forget about the brilliant and surprising modulation
> from C-major to F-major in "From Me To You" - it could never have happened
> because country, blues and R&B were WAY to musically limited for something
> as sophisticated as that.
Beautiful logic. A well-executed syllogism. But if I may paraphrase a
scientific quote:
"The most beautiful theory can be spoiled by one ugly fact."
I think many others have already posted all the covers and influences
and collaborations of the Beatles with Country and Western music.
--
Lou Pecora
- My views are my own.
Louis M. Pecora
<geir...@nospam.online.no> wrote:
> Melody good, harmony good, everything else bad.
>
> The trouble is that black musicians WAY too often tend to think the
> opposite - if they don't then they make good music.
Huh? Strange statement.
> Only melodic music is good music.
Begs the question. Now you have to search for a good definition of
melodic music. Many times this comes down to "it's the music I like"
for many people.
Geir Hongro
"Ike E. Procken" <flipt...@spammers.com> skrev i melding
news:3E1839B3...@spammers.com...
> Geir Hongro wrote:
>
> > . . . the brilliant and surprising modulation from
> > C-major to F-major in "From Me To You" . . .
>
> FWIW, the chord progression in the bridge of "From Me To You" :
>
> C
> Gm7 C7 F C7 F
> Am7 D7 G G7aug
> C
The most brilliant thing was how they went DIRECTLY from C-major into the
bridge. That is the _clue_ of that song.
Geir Hongro
Geir Hongro
> He didn't have John to make Ram, Band On The Run, Back To The Egg, or
> Press To Play. Genius works in my book.
Out of those, I would only count "Band On The Run" as a genius work.
However, "Tug Of War", "Flowers In The Dirt" and, to some extent, "Venus And
Mars" were genius works.
Geir Hongro
Brett A. Pasternack
Tug Of War is not far behind the ones I listed, but I don't see what so
many fans see in Flowers. Other than "My Brave Face" and "This One", I
find it subpar for McCartney, and there are a few songs which I find
out-and-out dull.
Mister Charlie
Production was actually very good, and This One is alright but certainly
Figure of 8 Put It There and another song or two are pretty good.
The problem with the songs are the start out really well but then
meander off into some weird space. Almost like he's afraid to write a
really good complete song.
Still, one of my fave Paul efforts.