Coloquial English Language Proficiency Not Required
Paul Austin
Today, I noticed a Toyota "TRD" pickemup (Toyota Racing Department, if it
matters).
Don't these people run The New Model Name past at least one American Native
Speaker before approving the name?
Apparently not.
--
"The lack of English proficiency has many consequences including
"occupational segregation" (Chun, 1980). For Asian-Pacific Americans it has
resulted in a narrow focus on college majors such as engineering
and the sciences as opposed to careers in law, journalism, and
social science which require strong communication skills"
Paul F Austin
pau...@digital.net
ML Carle
American companies have a history of not running
names past native speakers when exporting things.
GM had to find out the hard way that Nova was too
close to "No va" (colloquial Spanish for "won't
run") when they started exporting that model to
Latin America. Why should the Japanese or Koreans
be held to a higher standard?
Alan Gore
>A few years ago, I noticed a Hyundai Charade ahead of me on the way home.
>
>Today, I noticed a Toyota "TRD" pickemup (Toyota Racing Department, if it
>matters).
They might want to park this in front of a watering hole called the
"Shit Kicking Bar" in Yokohama.
ag...@qwest.net | "Giving money and power to the government
Alan Gore | is like giving whiskey and car keys
Software For PC's, Inc. | to teenaged boys" - P. J. O'Rourke
http://www.alangore.com
Gerald Belton
>American companies have a history of not running
>names past native speakers when exporting things.
>GM had to find out the hard way that Nova was too
>close to "No va" (colloquial Spanish for "won't
>run") when they started exporting that model to
>Latin America.
Oh, bullshit.
The Nova was one of the best selling cars in Latin America in the 60's
and 70's. "No va" and "Nova" are pronounced differently, and assuming
a Spanish speaker would refuse to buy a Nova is like saying an
American wouldn't buy a dinette set called "Notable," because who want
a dinette set with "No table." And Nova in Spanish means exactly the
same thing it does in English, since both languages share a common
Latin root. Also, Pemex sells gasoline in Mexico under the brand name
"Nova." Why do Mexicans buy gas that will make their car "not go?"
It's rather amusing that people keep using this story as an example of
failure due to ignorance of a foreign language/culture, when in fact
TELLING THIS STORY shows that very same ignorance.
Cite: http://www.snopes.com/business/misxlate/nova.htm
Gerald
--
The TV business is a cruel and shallow money trench, a long plastic hallway
where thieves and pimps run free and good men die like dogs. There's also a
negative side. -- Hunter Thompson
ML Carle
> Oh, bullshit.
>
> The Nova was one of the best selling cars in Latin America in the 60's
> and 70's. "No va" and "Nova" are pronounced differently, and assuming
> a Spanish speaker would refuse to buy a Nova is like saying an
> American wouldn't buy a dinette set called "Notable,"
>
I didn't take the view that no one would buy it
because of the name, since I don't see that
behavior reflected to any great extent in the
habits of American consumers, who in many respects
are fairly stupid. How else to explain SUVs when
there was really nothing wrong with the station
wagon as a moomiemobile? The Daihatsu Charade
wasn't a huge success not because of its name, but
because it was tiny, tinny, gutless, had a
passenger compartment the size of a shoebox, and
zero availability of parts.
So my example turned out to be an UL. Oh, well.
I'm sure there's something else out there that
would better illustrate my point. Or maybe I'll be
shocked to discover that there's an area of
American business behavior that isn't rife with
examples of dunderheadedness, the Peter Principle
notwithstanding.
PF
<ger...@beltonphoto.com>:
>It's rather amusing that people keep using this story as an example of
>failure due to ignorance of a foreign language/culture, when in fact
>TELLING THIS STORY shows that very same ignorance.
So did Rolls Royce really try to sell a Silver Mist in Germany?
----------------------------
PF
Brian Trosko
>>
>>Today, I noticed a Toyota "TRD" pickemup (Toyota Racing Department, if it
>>matters).
> They might want to park this in front of a watering hole called the
> "Shit Kicking Bar" in Yokohama.
Or outside the bar at the new Irish section of Busch Gardens in Virginia,
delightfully called "Grogan's."
Bill
> .The Nova was one of the best selling cars in Latin America in the 60's
> and 70's. "No va" and "Nova" are pronounced differently, and assuming
> a Spanish speaker would refuse to buy a Nova is like saying an
> American wouldn't buy a dinette set called "Notable," because who want
> a dinette set with "No table." And Nova in Spanish means exactly the
> same thing it does in English, since both languages share a common
> Latin root. Also, Pemex sells gasoline in Mexico under the brand name
> "Nova." Why do Mexicans buy gas that will make their car "not go?"
NOVA was not a name they paid to have dreamed up. I think it was part of
the Chevrolet sales pitch to the GM board. They designed one car that could
be produced by four divisions of GM. The N was for the Chevy Nova. The
O was the Oldsmobile Omega. The V was the Pontiac Ventura. And the
A was (memory fade here). And the Nova name stuck to the project.
Don Homuth
wrote:
>And the A was (memory fade here).
Oldsmobile Apollo.
> And the Nova name stuck to the project.
Nice theory. Only problem is, the Nova name was around for years
before those other cars showed up.
Nathan Nagel
>
> On Tue, 18 Jun 2002 05:04:39 -0700, ML Carle <ml...@svn.net> wrote:
>
> >American companies have a history of not running
> >names past native speakers when exporting things.
> >GM had to find out the hard way that Nova was too
> >close to "No va" (colloquial Spanish for "won't
> >run") when they started exporting that model to
> >Latin America.
>
> Oh, bullshit.
>
> The Nova was one of the best selling cars in Latin America in the 60's
> and 70's. "No va" and "Nova" are pronounced differently, and assuming
> a Spanish speaker would refuse to buy a Nova is like saying an
> American wouldn't buy a dinette set called "Notable," because who want
> a dinette set with "No table." And Nova in Spanish means exactly the
> same thing it does in English, since both languages share a common
> Latin root. Also, Pemex sells gasoline in Mexico under the brand name
> "Nova." Why do Mexicans buy gas that will make their car "not go?"
>
> It's rather amusing that people keep using this story as an example of
> failure due to ignorance of a foreign language/culture, when in fact
> TELLING THIS STORY shows that very same ignorance.
>
> Cite: http://www.snopes.com/business/misxlate/nova.htm
>
> Gerald
I imagine the UL got started when someone who spoke just enough Spanish
to be dangerous noticed that their Nova would, indeed, not go. Not an
entirely uncommon occurrence with a GM product.
nate
Peeve: I must be getting stupider in my old age, I actually had to look
up "occurrence." I usually have an amazing memory for words, language,
etc... It still doesn't look right to me. Grr.
Nathan Nagel
Buick Apollo, I believe.
I *think* (memory hazy here) that John DeLorean vectored the "no va"
story in "On A Clear Day You Can See GM" now that I think of it. I have
no idea how the name actually was arrived at.
nate
AB
> A few years ago, I noticed a Hyundai Charade ahead of me on the way home.
Pop Quiz: Elantra, Leganza and Nubira are:
a. The current top three baby names for daughters of African descent
b. Automobiles made in Korea
c. Runner-up names for the product marketed as "Olestra"
d. Output from a Random Pronounceable Password Generator
> Today, I noticed a Toyota "TRD" pickemup (Toyota Racing Department, if it
> matters).
Adding an A was automatic even the first time I saw the logo. Adding
a U instead didn't occur to me 'til now. Y'all are a bad influence.
ObPeeve: "TRD", "Type-R" and other crypto-marketing silliness.
If it ain't Homologation, it's just another trim level.
> Don't these people run The New Model Name past at least one American Native
> Speaker before approving the name?
Do American Native Speakers (sic) even buy those?
Bill
> Oldsmobile Apollo.
Buick Apollo
> > And the Nova name stuck to the project.
> Nice theory. Only problem is, the Nova name was around for years
> before those other cars showed up.
The 62 Chevy II top model was called a Nova. The name was dropped in
66.
In 69 the Nova name replaced the Chevy II name.
In 72 the siblings appeared. It was called the N.O.V.A. project
Paul Austin
"Nathan Nagel" <njn...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:3D0E73BD...@earthlink.net...
> Gerald Belton wrote:
>
> I imagine the UL got started when someone who spoke just enough Spanish
> to be dangerous noticed that their Nova would, indeed, not go. Not an
> entirely uncommon occurrence with a GM product.
>
driver's licensing age. 396 Novas...
--
"To forgive and forget is to surrender dearly bought experience"
Paul F Austin
pau...@digital.net
Steve Daniels
>
>"Nathan Nagel" <njn...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
>news:3D0E73BD...@earthlink.net...
>> Gerald Belton wrote:
>>
>> I imagine the UL got started when someone who spoke just enough Spanish
>> to be dangerous noticed that their Nova would, indeed, not go. Not an
>> entirely uncommon occurrence with a GM product.
>>
>A fambly down the street built Novas for each of the sons as they approached
>driver's licensing age. 396 Novas...
Wow.
Were they Catholic?
Don Homuth
<pau...@digital.net> wrote:
>A fambly down the street built Novas for each of the sons as they approached
>driver's licensing age. 396 Novas...
Their mother was overbearing, apparently.
Roy G. Ovrebo
> A few years ago, I noticed a Hyundai Charade ahead of me on the way home.
>
> Today, I noticed a Toyota "TRD" pickemup (Toyota Racing Department, if it
> matters).
>
> Don't these people run The New Model Name past at least one American Native
> Speaker before approving the name?
>
> Apparently not.
A few months ago, a story made the newspapers.
Honda was going to release a new model in Europe. The car was
going to be named Fitta. Probably a good-sounding name to
English-speakers, but they decided to change it.
"Fitta" is Norwegian and Swedish for "cunt".
--
Roy G. Ovrebo
Barry R. Reef
Adrian Smith
> "Paul Austin" <pau...@digital.net> wrote:
>
> >A few years ago, I noticed a Hyundai Charade ahead of me on the way home.
> >
> >Today, I noticed a Toyota "TRD" pickemup (Toyota Racing Department, if it
> >matters).
>
> They might want to park this in front of a watering hole called the
> "Shit Kicking Bar" in Yokohama.
Japanish is a way of life. My gf has an mp3 on her iBook with the
charming and evocative title 'Endless Summer Nude'.
--
Adrian Smith
Angus McIntyre
"Roy G. Ovrebo" <bur...@c2i.net> wrote:
> Honda was going to release a new model in Europe. The car was
> going to be named Fitta. ... "Fitta" is Norwegian and Swedish
> for "cunt".
The Mitsubishi Pajero, a kind of jeep-like thing, causes wry smiles in
Argentina. Going by the dictionary, 'pajero' is Spanish for
"straw-carrier", a name that the Mitsubishi execs apparently decided was
sufficiently brash and manly and hard-working to go well with the image
they wanted to project. Unfortunately in Argentina (and possibly
elsewhere) 'pajero' is also slang for 'wanker'.
Given the kind of people who buy 4WDs to run around town in, it's
perhaps not inappropriate, but Mitsubishi might not have intended it
quite that way.
Angus
--
an...@pobox.com http://pobox.com/~angus
"... and on any Sunday, you can see a whole convoy of them leaving
the Wealth Belt and driving up to National Park. Which is around
about four and a half kilometres from the GPO, and you can well
understand why they need a four-wheel drive to get there."
[John Schumann]
Peter Stickney
Well, there's a reliable source! "On a Clear Day" is interesting
reading, but, as his later ventures were to prove, Mr DeLorean was not
one to let the truth stand in the way of a good story. (Especially
one told to investors) When you consider that Malcom Bricklin has a
better success rate as an independant...
--
Pete Stickney
A strong conviction that something must be done is the parent of many
bad measures. -- Daniel Webster
E Varden
Nathan Nagel wrote:
.
.
.
.
> Peeve: I must be getting stupider in my old age, I actually had to look
> up "occurrence." I usually have an amazing memory for words, language,
> etc... It still doesn't look right to me. Grr.
"Apparently" has been the bitch for me. WTF is the e doing there?
Every (correct) time? Where's the a go?
And howcum "coloquial" doesn't have a double ell? H'MMM?
COLLOQUIAL has three ells, God Damn it! I KNOW THIS! I JUST
FUCKING KNOW IT, OK?
Pe
E Varden
Steve Daniels wrote:
> >>
> >A fambly down the street built Novas for each of the sons as they approached
> >driver's licensing age. 396 Novas...
>
> Wow.
>
> Were they Catholic?
Mormon. They drove a Rambler, themselves IIRC.
Pe
Gerald Belton
wrote:
>I imagine the UL got started when someone who spoke just enough Spanish
>to be dangerous noticed that their Nova would, indeed, not go. Not an
>entirely uncommon occurrence with a GM product.
That's very likely. Which makes it a JOKE, akin to "Fix Or Repair
Daily," or "Fix It Again, Tony."
Gerald Belton
wrote:
>In article <slrnagt0a5...@strassenwaffe.no>,
> "Roy G. Ovrebo" <bur...@c2i.net> wrote:
>
>> Honda was going to release a new model in Europe. The car was
>> going to be named Fitta. ... "Fitta" is Norwegian and Swedish
>> for "cunt".
>
>The Mitsubishi Pajero, a kind of jeep-like thing, causes wry smiles in
>Argentina. Going by the dictionary, 'pajero' is Spanish for
>"straw-carrier", a name that the Mitsubishi execs apparently decided was
>sufficiently brash and manly and hard-working to go well with the image
>they wanted to project. Unfortunately in Argentina (and possibly
>elsewhere) 'pajero' is also slang for 'wanker'.
That was about the same time they introduced the "Starion," wasn't it?
The tale is that it was a competitor for the Mustang, and was supposed
to be called "Stallion," but then Engrish reared it's ugly head...
Gerald Belton
>How else to explain SUVs when
>there was really nothing wrong with the station
>wagon as a moomiemobile?
Ah, that one's easy. Blame it on the CAFE standards. A Station Wagon
brings down the manufacturer's overall average Mile per Gallon rating,
because it counts as an automobile. An SUV counts as a truck, so it
doesn't bring down the rating.
Excession
>The Mitsubishi Pajero, a kind of jeep-like thing, causes wry smiles in
>Argentina. Going by the dictionary, 'pajero' is Spanish for
>"straw-carrier", a name that the Mitsubishi execs apparently decided was
>sufficiently brash and manly and hard-working to go well with the image
>they wanted to project. Unfortunately in Argentina (and possibly
>elsewhere) 'pajero' is also slang for 'wanker'.
In general, Americans have no clue what 'wanker' means. Of course, in
adfp that isn't the case, but I thought I would throw it in the ring.
www.zone.com (the microsoft windows only gaming area) is fully populated
with idjits who literally have no idea that saying 'nice move, wanker'
at them is *not* a term of affection. Ooh, double negatives. Fuck it.
Dac
--
David Andrew Clayton # Please rot13 my email address
q...@cpht.bet.nh # before sending email replies.
I post therefore I am. # uggc://jjj.cpht.bet.nh/~qnp <-- rot13
ML Carle
>
> Ah, that one's easy. Blame it on the CAFE standards. A Station Wagon
> brings down the manufacturer's overall average Mile per Gallon rating,
> because it counts as an automobile. An SUV counts as a truck, so it
> doesn't bring down the rating.
>
Yes, but what has that to do with me as an
automotive consumer? It gives automakers a reason
to promote SUVs, but it gives me no reason to
fall for the advertising. Bottom line still looks
like stupidity to me.
Robert Sneddon
<dac...@do.not.send.replies.here.bigpond.net.au> writes
>
>In general, Americans have no clue what 'wanker' means. Of course, in
>adfp that isn't the case, but I thought I would throw it in the ring.
Probably Urban Legend (unfortunately)[1] but there was a late and
lamented American computer company who planned a European customer
service publicity campaign with the memorable tagline "Wang Cares".
[1] Under the principle "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably
isn'y."
--
Robert Sneddon nojay (at) nojay (dot) fsnet (dot) co (dot) uk
Alan Gore
>Japanish is a way of life. My gf has an mp3 on her iBook with the
>charming and evocative title 'Endless Summer Nude'.
For serious students of Japlish, I recommend:
ag...@qwest.net | "Giving money and power to the government
Alan Gore | is like giving whiskey and car keys
Software For PC's, Inc. | to teenaged boys" - P. J. O'Rourke
http://www.alangore.com
Alan Gore
>COLLOQUIAL has three ells, God Damn it! I KNOW THIS! I JUST
>FUCKING KNOW IT, OK?
"The one-l lama
He's a priest
The two-l llama
He's a beast
And I'll bet you
A silk pajama
There isn't any three-l lllama!"
-O. Nash
Steve Glover
<no...@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes
> Probably Urban Legend (unfortunately)[1] but there was a late and
>lamented American computer company who planned a European customer
>service publicity campaign with the memorable tagline "Wang Cares".
>
> [1] Under the principle "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably
>isn'y."
Similarly, Siemens are alleged to have had a British HQ a stop past
Ashford on Network Southeast...
!peeve: got my interrail ticket, so off around Europe next week
Steve
--
Steve Glover, Fell Services Ltd. Available
LiveJournal at http://akicif.livejournal.com
Weblog at http://weblog.akicif.net/blogger.html
Home: steve at fell.demon.co.uk, 0131 551 3835
Gerald Belton
Because it's hard to buy a station wagon when all the automakers have
quit making them. If you need to haul stuff around, you either buy a
minivan or an SUV. And who wants to drive a minivan?
ML Carle
>
> Because it's hard to buy a station wagon when all the automakers have
> quit making them. If you need to haul stuff around, you either buy a
> minivan or an SUV. And who wants to drive a minivan?
>
> Gerald
>
There were still 1 or 2 American station wagons
until fairly recently. There are also station
wagons being made by foreign manufacturers. All
you have to do is buy one. People haven't been.
This would indicate to me a successful effort to
manipulate the demand side of the equation. And
why wouldn't you want to drive a minivan? It
handles like shit and has enormous blind spots. So
do SUVs, and because there's this useless
transaxle weighing down the front end, SUVs are
likely to get worse fuel economy.
Bod
>lamented American computer company who planned a European customer
>service publicity campaign with the memorable tagline "Wang Cares".
There's a Jack Vance book, "Servants of the Wankh". I'm told that nobody
told him until it had been in print a while.
--
Bod
"Give a man enough coffee and he's capable of anything."
-- Malcolm Gladwell
PF
<bur...@c2i.net>:
>A few months ago, a story made the newspapers.
>Honda was going to release a new model in Europe. The car was
>going to be named Fitta. Probably a good-sounding name to
>English-speakers, but they decided to change it.
>
>"Fitta" is Norwegian and Swedish for "cunt".
That brings a new edge to a particularly annoying TV advert we have, for
a franchise that fits brakes, exhausts and the usual automotive
ephemera.
To a background of hunky chaps dancing in blue overalls, goes the
irritating refrain that "you can't fit quicker than a Kwik Fit fitter".
----------------------------
PF
Julian Macassey
Sold in the U.S. as the Panjero.
> Argentina. Going by the dictionary, 'pajero' is Spanish for
> "straw-carrier", a name that the Mitsubishi execs apparently decided was
> sufficiently brash and manly and hard-working to go well with the image
> they wanted to project. Unfortunately in Argentina (and possibly
> elsewhere) 'pajero' is also slang for 'wanker'.
>
> Given the kind of people who buy 4WDs to run around town in, it's
> perhaps not inappropriate, but Mitsubishi might not have intended it
> quite that way.
In Pakistan, the Panjero is the SUV of choice of drug
barons and politicians. Not that there is any connection of
course.
--
To grasp the true meaning of socialism, imagine a world where everything is
designed by the post office, even the sleaze. - P.J. O'Rourke (1989)
Julian Macassey
Chinese restaurant call the Wan King. They even had a meny item,
the "Wan King Special".
Also in Santa Minica a Brit style pub called "J Arthur's"
Somewhat ironically, I note a headhunting firm called
"The J. Arthur Group".
Do they know what it means?
For those of you in suspense, a "J. Arthur" is cockney
rhyming slang for wank - J. Arthur Rank = Wank.
Nathan Nagel
> I think they do that to make their titles more search-engine
> friendly. I discovered in approximately, no shit, ten seconds,
> that "Endless Summer Nude" was released in 1997 by a group called
> the Magokoro Brothers on Sony Records.
>
> Just try doing that with, for example, the song "I Will Survive".
> You get lots of Abused Women and the like, but it took googling
> for "lyrics" in addition to find the words to, uh, Cake's
> rendition. (I didn't even know that Cake did a version. Boggle!)
You're joking, right? Cake is IMHFO one of the biggest !peeve bands of
the last decade. I can't figure out whether or not they are just
unintentionally hilarious or if they've got ultra-dry (as in tip the
vermouth bottle at the glass dry) senses of humor, but either way I've
bought all but one of their CD's, and enjoy them all. "Fashion Nugget"
is still a favorite at work (although when we move to a new office, with
Many Uptight Corporate Types, it will sadly probably get taken out of
rotation, as the chorus to "Nuggets" - a really catchy song - goes
something like "Shut the f**k up... right now, learn to buck up" etc.
etc. and so on in that vein.) Their choice of songs to cover (they do
one or two an album) is, um, eclectic at best but they're still all
listenable, which is a hell of a lot more than you can say for a lot of
bands.
nate
Peeve: Buying a CD because the song you heard on the radio was so
killer, and finding out the rest of the CD is mindless filler. (hey,
that rhymes!)
Peeve^2: Missing a *FREE* outdoor Cake show in DC on Sunday simply
because I had too much stupid little crap to catch up on.
Peter Stickney
Robert Sneddon <no...@nospam.demon.co.uk> writes:
> In article <7vcugusk4175qhi6q...@4ax.com>, Excession
> <dac...@do.not.send.replies.here.bigpond.net.au> writes
>>
>>In general, Americans have no clue what 'wanker' means. Of course, in
>>adfp that isn't the case, but I thought I would throw it in the ring.
>
> Probably Urban Legend (unfortunately)[1] but there was a late and
> lamented American computer company who planned a European customer
> service publicity campaign with the memorable tagline "Wang Cares".
>
> [1] Under the principle "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably
> isn'y."
Oh, no. it certainly can be believed. (There was lotsa Wang up here.)
Just before they Died the True Death, one of their short-lived slogans
was "Put your Wang to work".
ObPeeve: The Wang Tower, the tallest edifice in teh City of Lowell,
MA. (Keep you Freudian thoughts to yourself) was sold off at a price
that, had I but known, would not have been impossible for me to have
drummed up.
Wang managed to lead teh way in defining how to make a computer
company fail. They had a lot of Very Bright People developing
advanced products that, just before release, would be cancelled.
Thus, they managed to spend all teh overhead money and not amortize a
cent.
Many Wang Managers then went to work for DEC, and Bull, and Nixdorf,
and HP/Apollo, thus spreading their wisdom throughout the indistry.
Peter Stickney
ag...@qwest.net (Alan Gore) writes:
> E Varden <jp...@mungeinterlog.com> wrote:
>
>>COLLOQUIAL has three ells, God Damn it! I KNOW THIS! I JUST
>>FUCKING KNOW IT, OK?
>
> "The one-l lama
> He's a priest
> The two-l llama
> He's a beast
> And I'll bet you
> A silk pajama
> There isn't any three-l lllama!"
>
> -O. Nash
To further quote Mr. Nash "It has been brought to the attention of the
Author that there is a form of conflagration lnown as a Three-Alarmer.
Pooh."
Peter Stickney
Nathan Nagel <njn...@earthlink.net> writes:
>(although when we move to a new office, with
> Many Uptight Corporate Types, it will sadly probably get taken out of
> rotation, as the chorus to "Nuggets" - a really catchy song - goes
> something like "Shut the f**k up... right now, learn to buck up" etc.
> etc. and so on in that vein.)
There can be Much Fun to Be Had in such situations. Ferinstance,
about a month after they announced the plans to shut down the R&D
facility I was at, somebody replaced the Hold Music CD in the PBX
system with a copy of Warren Zevon's "Excitable Boy". For some reaon,
"Mohammed's Radio" and "Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money" were duplicated
a couple of times, making them Number 1 on the Hit Parade.
Adrian Smith
> Peeve: Buying a CD because the song you heard on the radio was so
> killer, and finding out the rest of the CD is mindless filler.
Never come across the 'single with 11 B-sides' theory of album
production before? Where have you *been*?
--
Adrian Smith
Bog Watcher
> Speaker before approving the name?
Tell me about it. I'm 45, never had a driver's license: born at the end
of June, I'm waiting for the manufacturer's of the Taurus to come out
with a model called the Cancer.
Steve Glover
stic...@worldnet.att.net> writes
>To further quote Mr. Nash "It has been brought to the attention of the
>Author that there is a form of conflagration lnown as a Three-Alarmer.
>Pooh."
There used to be a company in Edinburgh called 3L. Attempts to get them
to sponsor a Latin American ungulate at Edinburgh Zoo were, regrettably,
unsuccessful.
Steve
--
Steve Glover, Fell Services Ltd. Travelling
LiveJournal at http://akicif.livejournal.com
Weblog at http://weblog.akicif.net/blogger.html
Away: steve.glover at ukonline.co.uk, 07940 584 653
Art Walker
> A few months ago, a story made the newspapers.
> Honda was going to release a new model in Europe. The car was
> going to be named Fitta. Probably a good-sounding name to
> English-speakers, but they decided to change it.
I've often thought the German automakers had the right idea by not
naming their models, instead referring to them via numeric designation
(A4, 330i, C230, etc.).
- Art
Art Walker
Pete Young
>Similarly, Siemens are alleged to have had a British HQ a stop past
>Ashford on Network Southeast...
The Ashford on Network Southeast that I know is in Kent.
You presumably are referring to the Plessey building in Staines,
which was aquired by Siemens when they took over that company?
If this were a.f.u, I'd give it a 'believed true'. A story in
Computer Weekly at the time suggested that telephonists who had
been in the habit of answering callers with a chipper "Plessey,
Staines" were undergoing some retraining as a consequence of the
takeover.
Pete
--
____________________________________________________________________
Pete Young pe...@antipope.org
"Just another crouton, floating on the bouillabaisse of life"
Pete Young
>... campaign with the memorable tagline "Wang Cares".
Indeed. In Brighton, they had a subsidiary called 'Wang Kerr', where
a friend of mine worked for a time.
The one that always puzzled me was 'Nothing sucks like an Electrolux'.
Surely that usage predated the vacuum cleaner?
Nathan Nagel
>
> In article <3D0FBA56...@earthlink.net>,
> Nathan Nagel <njn...@earthlink.net> writes:
> >(although when we move to a new office, with
> > Many Uptight Corporate Types, it will sadly probably get taken out of
> > rotation, as the chorus to "Nuggets" - a really catchy song - goes
> > something like "Shut the f**k up... right now, learn to buck up" etc.
> > etc. and so on in that vein.)
>
> There can be Much Fun to Be Had in such situations. Ferinstance,
> about a month after they announced the plans to shut down the R&D
> facility I was at, somebody replaced the Hold Music CD in the PBX
> system with a copy of Warren Zevon's "Excitable Boy". For some reaon,
> "Mohammed's Radio" and "Send Lawyers, Guns, and Money" were duplicated
> a couple of times, making them Number 1 on the Hit Parade.
I've thought about doing just that (with the Cake album,) also using
that Godsmack song that starts off "I don't need your shit today"
(besides the lyrics, it's got a nice crunchy riff) only problem is
looking at the phones crosswise usually makes them stop working, so I
could quite easily turn a prank into a company-wide disaster.
nate
Peeve: ever since the power went out in a storm last week, the phones
have been more or less unusable - transferred calls get lost, people on
hold don't appear on all phones, and the sound quality is about the same
as an old 78 that's been used as a Frisbee.
!Peeve: hopefully this will All Go Away when we move out of the ghetto -
last I heard it was supposed to happen within a few months. There's
already a "for rent" sign in front of the building...
Nathan Nagel
Ah, but see, the problem is, the name says nothing about the car. If
you have a 330ci and your neighbor has a M3, which one of you should be
jealous? Don't get me wrong, I love German cars, but sometimes they are
just a little too unimaginative.
nate
(BTW, the answer is "you.")
Angus McIntyre
Nathan Nagel <njn...@earthlink.net> wrote:
> > I've often thought the German automakers had the right idea by not
> > naming their models, instead referring to them via numeric designation
>
> Ah, but see, the problem is, the name says nothing about the car. If
> you have a 330ci and your neighbor has a M3, which one of you should be
> jealous?
And if you have a Volkswagen Inguina, and your neighbour has a Ford
Detritus, and the guy down the road has a Honda Frottage, do any of you
(without peeking), know who should be jealous of whom?
I don't see that numbers are more or less informative than names in such
cases.
Peeve: The lack of any reliable naming scheme among computer hardware
manufacturers. Over the past few years, Apple have smeared about four
product names over some thirty distinct products, leaving ordinary
mortals at a loss trying to distinguish them (which is not just an
academic exercise for hopelessly sad nerds, but sometimes essential when
you're trying to figure out what you can connect to what). The result
has been the evolution of a kind of informal naming system that mixes
years of release with physical features with obscure development names
that have seeped into the public consciousness through some arcane
channels. The result, as you might expect, is Babel.
So is that PowerBook G3 a Pismo or a Bronze, and how can you tell? Your
iBook, is that one of the ones that looks like a toilet seat crossed
with a lollipop or is it a twin-USB and, if so, does it have the 12" or
the 14" screen? Is that a Blue G3/350, or a Graphite G4/400? Do you have
an original iMac, a second series iMac, or that thing like an Anglepoise
lamp on steroids? And when you say 'eMac', do you really mean 'eMac' or
are you a French person trying to say 'iMac'?
And don't even get me started on the names of processors, especially
Intel and its competitors.
This is the fault of marketing (as most things are). Engineers would
want things named informatively. An engineer's ideal product name would
be a fourteen-letter code that indicated precisely when something was
made, how fast it went, and what options it had. Another engineer,
looking at the product code, would instantly know everything they needed
to know about it.
Unfortunately, this won't fly with marketing, so the informative name
goes out the window, to be replaced with something from whatever
codebook they're currently working to - 'vowel-names' (such as iMac,
eMachine, eDouche), 'hooker names' (anything that ends in 'a' that
hasn't been trade-marked already, such as Fellatia or Deliria), or
'Masters of the Universe' names (Pentium, Athlon, Matrox).
The engineers are momentarily placated by the thought that they can
learn to make the mental mapping from a feature set to whatever
dysphonious tag marketing have hung on their pride and joy. But that
doesn't last either. Either marketing will want to _continue_ to apply a
particularly successful name to radically different products ("OK, that
was a CPU, and this is a whirlpool bath, but we've built a strong brand
identity around Pentium, so we want to call our new bathroom product
range the Pentium 8 series, and let the punters figure it out"), or they
will try to revive a slow seller by demanding some trivial change to the
feature set and hanging a new name on it ("Sales of the new Speculum III
chip have been slower than expected, so we've asked engineering to
solder another two rows of pins on it and make the clock frequency an
odd multiple of pi before we relaunch it as the Defibrillaton VI").
eGus
--
an...@pobox.com http://pobox.com/~angus
"I am here by the will of the people ... and I "Metrophage"
will not leave until I get my raincoat back." Richard Kadrey
Excession
>Excession writes
>>
>>In general, Americans have no clue what 'wanker' means. Of course, in
>>adfp that isn't the case, but I thought I would throw it in the ring.
>
> Probably Urban Legend (unfortunately)[1] but there was a late and
Empirical evidence is the best:
if you have a Windows machine, and preferably a .NET passport already at
your beck and call, go into www.zone.com, choose a lobby with a few
hundred people, and start hurling 'you're all a mob of clueless wankers'
at the collected audience. Nobody will bat an eyelid, and I'm sure
someone will say 'what is a wanker'?
On rec.arts.mystery they have been edjumacated on the meaning of the
term, and have adopted 'Anal-retentive wanker' as the derogatory term of
the moment; to which newbies come along and say 'erm, I know what
Anal-retentive means, but what is a wanker?', to much mirth from the
easily amused crowd.
Dac
--
David Andrew Clayton # Please rot13 my email address
q...@cpht.bet.nh # before sending email replies.
I post therefore I am. # uggc://jjj.cpht.bet.nh/~qnp <-- rot13
Bill
> I've often thought the German automakers had the right idea by not
> naming their models, instead referring to them via numeric designation
> (A4, 330i, C230, etc.).
It is not always that way. Mercedes Benz was just a Benz before they
named it after the daughter of some Italian count who had cars made by
Benz. Porsche Carrara is still for sale. The BMW Bravaria circa 74 was
the first car completely sold out before they started production. Audi
Quartro had only that name originally. And there was the Auto Union
Cistilia
designed by Herr Dr Ferdnand war criminal Porsche. Or the NSU Prinz
with the first Wankel engine. How about the DKW Wanderer. (DKW
gained most of their fame as the largest motorcycle company in the world
and merged with Audi into Auto Union along with Horch ) But I can't
seem to come up with any name for a VW other than things like Cabriolet.
Nate Nagel
> In article <3D105F7D...@earthlink.net>,
> Nathan Nagel <njn...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> > > I've often thought the German automakers had the right idea by not
> > > naming their models, instead referring to them via numeric designation
> >
> > Ah, but see, the problem is, the name says nothing about the car. If
> > you have a 330ci and your neighbor has a M3, which one of you should be
> > jealous?
>
> And if you have a Volkswagen Inguina, and your neighbour has a Ford
> Detritus, and the guy down the road has a Honda Frottage, do any of you
> (without peeking), know who should be jealous of whom?
Once upon a time, yes. You just had to remember a few key words
and/or letter combinations and the Cars Worth Having were obvious,
even without a serious study of product offerings (I'd wager that *I*
could probably tell you something about just about every car on the
market right now, but I'm a hopeless car geek.)
Case in point: which simply *sounds* like more fun, a Ford Fairlane
or a Ford Galaxie 500 7-Litre? A Dodge Dart or a Dodge Dart GTS?
Plymouth Valiant, or Plymouth Duster 340? Any car without "Hemi" in
its name, or any car with? Sadly, it's not always so easy now;
once-proud names like "R/T," "GT" and "Sport" seem to be hung on just
about any breadbox with wheels and a kewl stripe on the hood in an
effort to boost sales. About the only moniker with any meaning at all
is "turbo" - any manufacturer calling a car a "turbo" without actually
hanging a turbocharger on the manifold would soon be humiliated out of
existence. It's not an *entirely* new phenomenon though, just last
week my GF was perusing the automotive classifieds (I'm so proud!) and
pointed out to me a late '60s Dart GT... which got me all excited
until, when I read the ad, I realized that it had a lowly 225 slant
six under the hood. DOH!
To get back on track though - I will give the Germans this: once
you've cracked the code, BMW names for the most part make a lot of
sense. Any car with three digits has the first digit denoting the
chassis (3=small, 5=big, 7=f'ing huge) and the next two denoting
engine size in liters (330 = a 3 series with a 3.0 liter engine - more
or less. They sometimes fudge a bit.) "c" = coupe, "x" = all wheel
drive, and "i" = fuel injection (now redundant) Anything with "M" in
the name is worth having. The Z3 is just... well, the Z3. See, even
BMW doesn't always make sense. I suppose they figured if they called
it the 225 Roadster it wouldn't sell.
nate
Bill
> To get back on track though - I will give the Germans this: once
> you've cracked the code, BMW names for the most part make a lot of
> sense. Any car with three digits has the first digit denoting the
> chassis (3=small, 5=big, 7=f'ing huge) and the next two denoting
> engine size in liters (330 = a 3 series with a 3.0 liter engine - more
> or less. They sometimes fudge a bit.) "c" = coupe, "x" = all wheel
> drive, and "i" = fuel injection (now redundant) Anything with "M" in
> the name is worth having. The Z3 is just... well, the Z3. See, even
> BMW doesn't always make sense. I suppose they figured if they called
> it the 225 Roadster it wouldn't sell.
What is the difference is size of the engine of a 530, 535, M5
A 318 has a 2 lt engine and a 325 originally had a two liter engine
also but 2 more cylinders. Then there is the 525 and 528 with the
528 having the same displacement but a long stroke engine. Then
there are such things as a 325CSi or 325ssi or 325isl, 325is.
Since you found the Z3, what was the first and second company to use the
Z designation for special or sporty cars.
Robert Sneddon
<william...@verizon.net> writes
>
>What is the difference is size of the engine of a 530, 535, M5
>A 318 has a 2 lt engine and a 325 originally had a two liter engine
>also but 2 more cylinders. Then there is the 525 and 528 with the
>528 having the same displacement but a long stroke engine. Then
>there are such things as a 325CSi or 325ssi or 325isl, 325is.
>Since you found the Z3, what was the first and second company to use the
>Z designation for special or sporty cars.
Well BMW's first supercar was the M1 -- I recall being in Guildford
when they were introduced (1980?) and I saw two of them passing each
other in the street. Given that there were only four hundred of the damn
things planned as a homologation exercise I always thought that was kind
of neat.
The Z3 was actually an attempt to apply modern engineering and safety
features to BMW's 328 roadster from the Thirties; this little beauty was
the Luftwaffe pilot's favourite sports car by far.
--
Robert Sneddon nojay (at) nojay (dot) fsnet (dot) co (dot) uk
Jesper Lauridsen
>Japanish is a way of life.
Knock yourself out:
http://www.mitsuoka-motor.com/mitsuoka/docs/mc1_e.html
Don't miss the kit car version (link at the bottom).
Nathan Nagel
To expose myself as a pathetic car pedant: most modern (post-aircooled)
VW's have names related in some way to wind (Scirocco, Golf, Jetta,
etc.) the Rabbit was a US-only rename of the Golf I so that doesn't
count. (I guess they thought we'd confuse it with that boring game.)
The GTI and GLI are actually called Golf GTI and Jetta GLI respectively
in Europe, it's only here that they are separate models (and parts
counter guys won't know what the hell you're talking about if you ask
for parts for a GTI anyway, even if it's a GTI specific engine part.
Most books just lump them in with Golfs. I know this.)
Now if you ask me to explain Type 3 or 411/412... I can't. I assume
those are internal codes that made their way into production because
nobody had enough imagination to change them.
nate
!peeve: VW cars from the mid-70's to the early 90s.
peeve: VW's are now morphing into boring econoboxes... their "best" new
model (the GTI 1.8T) is still not as fun to drive as an old Scirocco or
Corrado - and I should know, all three are in my driveway right now.
Sure, it's got more grunt than both the S and the C together but it is
also big, heavy, and has power everything. Why did I buy it? Well, I
needed *one* car that didn't need constant TLC and I couldn't afford a
new Z06 or S2000.
Bob O`Bob
>
> A few years ago, I noticed a Hyundai Charade ahead of me on the way home.
>
> Today, I noticed a Toyota "TRD" pickemup (Toyota Racing Department, if it
> matters).
>
> Don't these people run The New Model Name past at least one American Native
> Speaker before approving the name?
It ain't just the furriners...
"My imaginary friends bought cars this week -- a Charade, a Mirage, and a Shadow"
- Steven Wright, I think
Bob O`Bob
--
Pete Young
>That brings back a dim memory - one of you fools once posted
>on a website a photo of a restaurant somewhere in the
>Bay Aryan called "Ho Lee Fuk".
There was a restaurant of that name at one end of the Kings Rd
in Chelsea. AFAIK it's still there. Guess the Bay Area is
spreading further than we had previously imagined.
>for the upcoming "shagging contest". We had a hell
>of a time convincing him that shagging was a regional
>dance done to R&B music.
I seem to recall a movie called 'The Shag' which drew a predictable
response over heyah. Best line "I've got ma shagging shoes on!".
E Varden
Bill wrote:
>> Since you found the Z3, what was the first and second company to use the
>> Z designation for special or sporty cars.
I think I know. Datsun 240Z and Camaro Z28.
Pe
Don Homuth
<no...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> Well BMW's first supercar was the M1 -- I recall being in Guildford
>when they were introduced (1980?) and I saw two of them passing each
>other in the street....
Ausgezeichnet!
Clever those Krauts. Bad enough they came up with engineering, but
now they're screwing with the spacetime continuum as well.
Bill
The Abarth'ed engine Simca was the first that I knew of circa 1954
and then the Alfa Romeo Zagato was the second circa 59. These
cars were from different designers but they both had bubbles on the
roof to provide more headroom inside. I think the first Ferrari Dino
also had the bubble roof. The Z definitely stood for some Italian
word and how the Japs picked up on it is a mystery to me.
Roy G. Ovrebo
>> Don't these people run The New Model Name past at least one American Native
>> Speaker before approving the name?
>
> Tell me about it. I'm 45, never had a driver's license: born at the end
> of June, I'm waiting for the manufacturer's of the Taurus to come out
I've seen that one called the Pisces.
> with a model called the Cancer.
Man, that would be unfortunate naming...
--
Roy G. Ovrebo
Roy G. Ovrebo
> Bill wrote:
>>
>> Art Walker wrote:
>>
>> > I've often thought the German automakers had the right idea by not
>> > naming their models, instead referring to them via numeric designation
>> > (A4, 330i, C230, etc.).
>>
>> It is not always that way. Mercedes Benz was just a Benz before they
>> named it after the daughter of some Italian count who had cars made by
>> Benz.
Um, no. There was the Daimler company which produced a car called
Daimler, until said count got the marque named for his daughter
Mercedes (in 1914, IIRC).
When Daimler and Benz joined in 1925, the resulting Daimler-Benz
company produced the Mercedes-Benz car.
>> Porsche Carrara is still for sale.
Carrera (after Carrera Panamericana) was originally a designation for
the higher-powered versions of the 356 and later the 911. Sometime in
the 1970s the factory realized that even the most pedestrian version 911
had more power than a mid-60s Carrera, so the name was applied to all.
>> The BMW Bravaria circa 74 was
>> the first car completely sold out before they started production.
The Bavaria was a US-only stripped version of the 2500, but with
the 2.8 engine and sold at a (relatively) low price (a 2800 had more
equipment as standard besides the bigger engine). Most Bavarias were
optioned up to near 2800-spec anyway, according to the websites I've read.
>> Audi
>> Quartro had only that name originally.
The quattro (small q, it's a trademark) was something rather special...
[snip]
> To expose myself as a pathetic car pedant:
My name is Roy and I'm a pathetic car pedant.
[VW model names]
> Now if you ask me to explain Type 3 or 411/412... I can't. I assume
> those are internal codes that made their way into production because
> nobody had enough imagination to change them.
Type 1: The ordinary Käfer (Beetle, Bug)
Type 2: Transporter, Bus
Type 3: Notchback, Fastback, etc. (allegedly including the Karmann Ghia)
Type 4: 411/412 Saloon
Types 3 and 4 were replacements for the Beetle...
--
Roy G. Ovrebo
John Kimball
wad in Message id: <4b6d2dd6.02061...@posting.google.com>:
>once-proud names like "R/T," "GT" and "Sport" seem to be hung on just
>about any breadbox with wheels and a kewl stripe on the hood in an
>effort to boost sales.
Not to mention SS, but I will.
--
begin trash harddisk.vbs
I'm a signature virus. Copy me! Look here why:
http://support.microsoft.com/support/kb/articles/Q265/2/30.ASP
end
Anton Sherwood
"Dave Brown" <dagb...@lart.ca> wrote:
> Remember, kids, if you want to start a band, make your name
> search engine friendly like the Japanese rock groups. Zard, Glay,
> Thee Michelle Gun Elephant, King Fucker Chicken and the Mad Capsule
> Markets (I am not making *any* of those up) know what they're doing
> there. The The, on the other hand--well...
I used to keep a log of ideas for band names (or album titles).
I've just tested a bunch of them with Google; the only ones that aren't
on hundreds of pages are:
"Return to Porlock" (51, of which Google shows 7 in the first pass)
"A Wellmeaning Oaf" (zero, to my mild surprise)
"The Campfire Effect" (only 21, to my great surprise)
"Everybody's a snob about something" (zero, though there are a few hits
for paraphrases, which was a bit deflating)
If you use one of these you owe me a lunch.
--
Anton Sherwood, http://www.ogre.nu/
Art Walker
> Ah, but see, the problem is, the name says nothing about the car. If
> you have a 330ci and your neighbor has a M3, which one of you should be
> jealous? Don't get me wrong, I love German cars, but sometimes they are
> just a little too unimaginative.
When it comes to automotive badging, I like unimaginative.
As far as I'm concerned, for the particular Nissan I drive, I'd just as
soon have the model and trim-level badges omitted. I'll bow to marketing
and let 'em leave a *small* Nissan badge on the back trunk lid, but that's
it.
- Art
Art Walker
> I used to keep a log of ideas for band names (or album titles).
> I've just tested a bunch of them with Google; the only ones that aren't
> on hundreds of pages are:
>
> "Return to Porlock" (51, of which Google shows 7 in the first pass)
> "A Wellmeaning Oaf" (zero, to my mild surprise)
> "The Campfire Effect" (only 21, to my great surprise)
> "Everybody's a snob about something" (zero, though there are a few hits
> for paraphrases, which was a bit deflating)
"Homicidal Foliage" (Zero hits on Google).
- Art
Natural Born Cereal Killer
>"Homicidal Foliage" (Zero hits on Google).
"Miss Conception" (Zero hits).
"Desecrated Sacrifice" <another zero).
But those are boring names for a rock band. What we need
are names of one word, around three syllables or so, with an "o" or
"u" in it for the gratuitous placement of umlauts.
Just place two dots above an "o" or "u" in the following
non-descript words and you'll see they become great names for a
rock band, and if the band tends towards metal they're even better.
Fortune. (bonus point for both an "o" and "u")
Europe (taken, but proves the point)
Yurrip (America's answer to Bono and U2)
Slobber (I'm thinking more of a punk garage band here)
Ravioli (Album includes the hit single, "Sleeping wit' da fishes")
Slobber Donkey (as one word it wouldn't fit on the jewel case)
Apoplexy (bonus point for most kids thinking it's a disease)
Given a bit of time and a fair amount of beer, either
piping /usr/dict into a shell script or slight modifications to
the Automatic Geoff Miller should, within minutes, provide
enough unused band names to last for hundreds if not thousands
of years. Where is Claudio when you need him?
- Dan
--
* Dan Sorenson DoD #1066 ASSHOLE #35 BOTY 1997 vik...@svtv.com *
* Vikings? There ain't no vikings here. Just us honest farmers. *
* The town was burning, the villagers were dead. They didn't need *
* those sheep anyway. That's our story and we're sticking to it. *
Angus McIntyre
Art.W...@veriomail.com (Art Walker) wrote:
> When it comes to automotive badging, I like unimaginative ... I'd just as
> soon have the model and trim-level badges omitted. I'll bow to marketing
> and let 'em leave a *small* Nissan badge on the back trunk lid, but that's
> it.
One of the neatest coups ever pulled off by the marketing weasels was
clothing that has the maker's name plastered all over it in foot-high
letters. Whoever it was that realized that people would voluntarily turn
themselves into walking billboards and would even pay extra for the
privilege must have been some kind of twisted genius.
Angus
Nathan Nagel
>
> In article <slrnaha6rn.4...@lavalamp.flippydoo.com>,
> Art.W...@veriomail.com (Art Walker) wrote:
>
> > When it comes to automotive badging, I like unimaginative ... I'd just as
> > soon have the model and trim-level badges omitted. I'll bow to marketing
> > and let 'em leave a *small* Nissan badge on the back trunk lid, but that's
> > it.
>
> One of the neatest coups ever pulled off by the marketing weasels was
> clothing that has the maker's name plastered all over it in foot-high
> letters. Whoever it was that realized that people would voluntarily turn
> themselves into walking billboards and would even pay extra for the
> privilege must have been some kind of twisted genius.
>
> Angus
What I don't understand is how people with generally impeccable taste
(Ralph Lauren, for one) agree to this idea that you explain above as
tasteful... or perhap$ they ju$t don't care.
nate
Barry R. Reef
wrote:
>One of the neatest coups ever pulled off by the marketing weasels was
>clothing that has the maker's name plastered all over it in foot-high
>letters. Whoever it was that realized that people would voluntarily turn
>themselves into walking billboards and would even pay extra for the
>privilege must have been some kind of twisted genius.
>
>Angus
I think it was Andy Warhol that started the trend with that Can of
Campbels soup. Of course many will say it was Levi Straus who started
it in 1853 when he riveted that leather label to the outside of his
jeans.
AB
> Angus McIntyre wrote:
[branding one's war-pony]
>>
>> One of the neatest coups ever pulled off by the marketing weasels was
>> clothing that has the maker's name plastered all over it in foot-high
>> letters. Whoever it was that realized that people would voluntarily turn
>> themselves into walking billboards and would even pay extra for the
>> privilege must have been some kind of twisted genius.
I don't believe The Motor Company* originated this, but having made
enough money from brand accessories to save their engineering and
manufacturing divisions, they are generally recognized as the great
masters of the practice.
> What I don't understand is how people with generally impeccable taste
> (Ralph Lauren, for one) agree to this idea that you explain above as
> tasteful... or perhap$ they ju$t don't care.
Despite the aesthetic blight, one can enjoy the irony. And like
designer baseball caps, they function quite effectively as Dumbass
Indicators, a valuable function indeed whether dodging pedestrians or
picking a hangout.
ObHmm: Fellow 'round here is trying to unload a darling '61
Studebaker Lark VI 2dr hardtop that looks and sounds dynamite.
He'd likely go under $2,000.
If I had use for a car, and a spare garage to keep it in...
*A certain large American motorcycle company well-known for ardently
policing the use of its name, bar-and-shield logo, exhaust sound etc.
Nathan Nagel
> ObHmm: Fellow 'round here is trying to unload a darling '61
> Studebaker Lark VI 2dr hardtop that looks and sounds dynamite.
> He'd likely go under $2,000.
> If I had use for a car, and a spare garage to keep it in...
If you take the plunge, drop me a line off-group. This address is the
one I actually check semi frequently. I'll hook you up with the right
people to get parts etc. (I'm working on a '62 Daytona myself right
now) Actually the big National meet is getting going right now as I
type this (I'm leaving for South Bend on Tuesday)
You do know that "VI" stands for the number of cylinders right? Just as
long as you don't expect it to be fast...
nate
!Peeve: the fact that Studebaker-Packard is no more means that I can buy
reprints of factory service manuals, parts books, etc. for dirt cheap.
Makes working on them a sheer joy.
Nathan Nagel
>
> ObHmm: Fellow 'round here is trying to unload a darling '61
> Studebaker Lark VI 2dr hardtop that looks and sounds dynamite.
> He'd likely go under $2,000.
> If I had use for a car, and a spare garage to keep it in...
Head over to alt.autos.studebaker - unless "round here" is somewhere
really obscure, there's probably someone local to you who'll be willing
to check the car out for you for half a case of beer. Really the most
useful of the automotive groups I frequent. There's surprisingly good
parts support for those old sleds too.
nate
E Varden
Angus McIntyre wrote:
>
> One of the neatest coups ever pulled off by the marketing weasels was
> clothing that has the maker's name plastered all over it in foot-high
> letters. Whoever it was that realized that people would voluntarily turn
> themselves into walking billboards and would even pay extra for the
> privilege must have been some kind of twisted genius.
>
It seems to me that started with the engine-oil additive STP
ObPathetic: this, across the top of the windshield of a Prelude:
"POWERED BY HONDA"
Pe - who knows how to spell "colloquial".
PF
<jp...@mungeinterlog.com>:
>ObPathetic: this, across the top of the windshield of a Prelude:
>"POWERED BY HONDA"
Shame, though Honda make bloody good engines.
It took them years to learn how to make cam-chain tensioners that worked
in bike engines, but they really got it right with the VTEC car lumps.
Not to mention that ultimate spine-tingler, the 250-6.
----------------------------
PF
Robert Sneddon
<De...@devce.SP*M.demon.co.uk> writes
>It took them years to learn how to make cam-chain tensioners that worked
>in bike engines,
You just had to keep the chains adjusted to the book tension, replace
them at the specified interval and sacrifice the occasional virgin to
them when the stars were right.
> but they really got it right with the VTEC car lumps.
>Not to mention that ultimate spine-tingler, the 250-6.
Seen at a model engineering exhibit -- a 50cc V-8 four-stroke engine.
Ticked over at about 6000 rpm, top whack about 30k apparently.
Art Walker
> It seems to me that started with the engine-oil additive STP
Which, if memory serves, stands for "Sludge That's Patented".
- Art
E Varden
Robert Sneddon wrote:
.
.
.
>
> Seen at a model engineering exhibit -- a 50cc V-8 four-stroke engine.
> Ticked over at about 6000 rpm, top whack about 30k apparently.
What next, a 200hp Timex?
Pe (at least the slanty bastards are taking the two-stroke pollution
thing seriously)
Bill
> Seen at a model engineering exhibit -- a 50cc V-8 four-stroke engine.
> Ticked over at about 6000 rpm, top whack about 30k apparently.
Wonder if they put roller bearings on the crank and cam shaft like the
Japs did on those little 500cc sports cars that they built early on.
Elaine Richards
Segues into another peeve... I just don't get why someone would go through
the bother of getting a vanity license plate that simply reiterates the
brand names of the cars they drive. I have also seen things indicating that
it is a car and it belongs to the driver. Well, golly.
E Varden
Elaine Richards wrote:
>
> Segues into another peeve... I just don't get why someone would go through
> the bother of getting a vanity license plate that simply reiterates the
> brand names of the cars they drive. I have also seen things indicating that
> it is a car and it belongs to the driver. Well, golly.
!Jellus Peeve: On the back of a Ford Explorer, in small print
Toys Go Here
|
|
|
V
-- pointing to a hefty trailer-hitch below.
Pe
PF
<no...@nospam.demon.co.uk>:
>
> Seen at a model engineering exhibit -- a 50cc V-8 four-stroke engine.
>Ticked over at about 6000 rpm, top whack about 30k apparently.
Ooh, I got shivers.
Now hook five or six of those babies up in a bike frame.
It would have a sound that Harley would give up potatoes for.
----------------------------
PF
PF
<jp...@mungeinterlog.com>:
>What next, a 200hp Timex?
How about a 1000cc V8 that revs to 19,000 in road form?
Available to buy for reasonable money, too.
----------------------------
PF
Robert Sneddon
<De...@devce.SP*M.demon.co.uk> writes
Remembering stuff from the data sheet on the exhibit, the builder had
used parts from eight 6cc model aircraft engines, machined up a
crankcase and crank and made it work. I *think* the design was
sidevalve, so I suppose he could build a single camshaft to time
everything off. I've certainly seen the same "multiplex a single-
cylinder engine" concept used to build model rotary engines too.
Nathan Nagel
> Segues into another peeve... I just don't get why someone would go through
> the bother of getting a vanity license plate that simply reiterates the
> brand names of the cars they drive. I have also seen things indicating that
> it is a car and it belongs to the driver. Well, golly.
Well... in the case of an obscure car, it may help to deflect a lot of
stupid questions. I personally like to run year or manufacture plates
on my car just to avoid the "whut year is dat thang?" that inevitably
follows every time I need gas.
!peeve: just got back from the Studebaker Driver's Club national meet in
South Bend. Sure, it's halfway across the country, but where else can
you hang out with a bunch of nutballs and drag race 40 (or more!) year
old cars? (and not even care about the timeslips)
big !peeve: a guy I know who built a really nice '54 Stude coupe street
rod not only won best of show but was spotted taking passes at the strip
in said street rod. And was found drinking beer in the parking lot with
us afterwards. It's that kind of club.
nate
(tired, sunburned, poor, and grinning from ear to ear)
Anton Sherwood
>> Similarly, Siemens are alleged to have had a British HQ
>> a stop past Ashford on Network Southeast...
On or about Wed, 19 Jun 2002 03:03:53 -0700,
"Pete Young" <pe...@antipope.org> wrote:
> The Ashford on Network Southeast that I know is in Kent.
And beyond it is Pedlinge.
Anton Sherwood
"Bod" <b...@erstwhile.demon.co.uk> wrote:
> There's a Jack Vance book, "Servants of the Wankh". I'm told
> that nobody told him until it had been in print a while.
It sold surprisingly well in Britain, they say.
For the new edition, Jack considered renaming the Wankh "Wannish".
I hope he dropped that idea; the Wankh obviously ought to have
a monosyllabic name.
M Holmes
: On or about Tue, 18 Jun 2002 12:59:11 -0700,
: "Bod" <b...@erstwhile.demon.co.uk> wrote:
:> There's a Jack Vance book, "Servants of the Wankh". I'm told
:> that nobody told him until it had been in print a while.
: It sold surprisingly well in Britain, they say.
Hey, I read that. Wasn't it part of some "alien adventures" trilogy?
FoFP
Adrian Smith
Rings a bell. "Cities of the Chasch"?
No, it's gone. I keep thinking "The adventures of c'Onan" for some
reason. When do we get to buy Charlie's book?
?Peeve : "Tomoe Gozen" by Jessica Amanda Salmonson (1981). She might
have improved since then, though.
--
Adrian Smith
Uncle Gargoyle
It was one of four comprising the "Planet of Adventure" series,
protagonist Adam Reith:
"City of the Chasch"
"Servants of the Wankh"
"The Dirdir"
"The Pnume"
ObPedanticBibliographicAside: I have a copy of the second title
entitled simply "Wankh" and giving the series name as "Tschai"
after the fictional planet that is the scene of the action.
ObGushofEnthusiasm: While this series has perhaps the single
worst series title imaginable, it is imho among Vance's best
extended work. In it his great powers for description of
imaginary scenes are given full rein, and there are passages of
quite poetic, indeed, moving, visual beauty. I have long thought
that were this series filmed straight from the book, it would
make an absolute blockbuster of a movie in terms of visual
effects. No need for spoken dialogue, actually: the hisses of
dismay, the body language (all in the books) would suffice to
communicate the plot.
Among Vance's other extended (i.e. multi-volume) works that are
worth note are: the "Demon Princes" series (five titles); "The
Cadwal Chronicles" (three titles); and "Lyonesse" (three titles).
Of these, the Demon Princes bears a strong formal resemblance to
Planet of Adventure, in that the plotting tends to be episodic,
and the protagaonist is a loner who spends his time upsetting
many an applecart or comfortable monopoly.
The Cadwal Chronicles also chronicle, I believe, Vance's descent
into blindness. Each of the three volumes is successively
shorter, though each is precisely the right length for the
material in it. Since the completion of this tripartite work,
Vance's later novels (Night Lamp, Ports of Call) have impressed
me as being incompletely fleshed out: the effort of doing so is
perhaps beyond him, so his last books come across as rather
skeletal, almost outlines for much longer works.
"Lyonesse" is one of the truly great works of fantasy, and cocks
a snoot at the paucity of imagination shown by the endless and
innumerable Tolkienoid fantasies that have plagued the field
since the late 1960's when LotR fell into the hands of the hoi
polloi. (a la AOL arriving on the internet)
Both Cadwal and Lyonesse have extended plots that span all
volumes in the respective series, but individual titles stand on
their own quite well.
Peevers who enjoy "imaginative fiction" would do much worse than
to dip into Jack Vance, if they haven't already done so.
--
Uncle Gargoyle
AB
[modern pulp]
> ?Peeve : "Tomoe Gozen" by Jessica Amanda Salmonson (1981). She might
> have improved since then, though.
Grabthar, no. Thankfully, she's moved on to selling rare editions of
the books she once cribbed from. She inhabits a handful of froups as
"Paghat", and did a fine turn as a whack-a-mole here a while ago.
Peeve: Journal-writing disguised as scholarly work. Been reading
_The Starter Marriage and the Future of Matrimony_ by Pamela Paul.
It was started shortly after the demise of the author's own short
marriage, and seems to be about a year's worth of "processing" padded
with interviews and surveys of the author's acquaintances.
Thank goodness (and Ben Franklin) it's a library book.
As Dick Teresi commented in his review of _The Turk_, "The unreliable
narrator is a technique not found often in serious nonfiction."
M Holmes
:> Hey, I read that. Wasn't it part of some "alien adventures" trilogy?
: It was one of four
Ah, an SF tilogy right enough.
FoFP
Adrian Smith
> Adrian Smith <adrian_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> [modern pulp]
> > ?Peeve : "Tomoe Gozen" by Jessica Amanda Salmonson (1981). She might
> > have improved since then, though.
>
> Grabthar, no. Thankfully, she's moved on to selling rare editions of
> the books she once cribbed from. She inhabits a handful of froups as
> "Paghat", and did a fine turn as a whack-a-mole here a while ago.
Yeah, sorry, I'd recently been discussing her performance at that time
with one (and possibly the whole) of her a.f fan base. She made a more
spirited attempt than many, I thought.
> Peeve: Journal-writing disguised as scholarly work. Been reading
> _The Starter Marriage and the Future of Matrimony_ by Pamela Paul.
> It was started shortly after the demise of the author's own short
> marriage, and seems to be about a year's worth of "processing" padded
> with interviews and surveys of the author's acquaintances.
> Thank goodness (and Ben Franklin) it's a library book.
It is astonishing what you can sell if you've got the contacts.
--
Adrian Smith
Paul Austin
"Adrian Smith" <adrian_...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:b9ae8e0f.02070...@posting.google.com...
> AB <aaro...@eskimo.com> wrote in message
news:<7o8rfa...@aaronb.pacifier.com>...
> > Adrian Smith <adrian_...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > [modern pulp]
> > > ?Peeve : "Tomoe Gozen" by Jessica Amanda Salmonson (1981). She might
> > > have improved since then, though.
> >
> > Grabthar, no. Thankfully, she's moved on to selling rare editions of
> > the books she once cribbed from. She inhabits a handful of froups as
> > "Paghat", and did a fine turn as a whack-a-mole here a while ago.
>
> Yeah, sorry, I'd recently been discussing her performance at that time
> with one (and possibly the whole) of her a.f fan base. She made a more
> spirited attempt than many, I thought.
>
"Tomoe Gozen".
--
Eat a live toad in the morning
and nothing worse will happen to you all day.
-------------------------------------
Paul F Austin
pau...@digital.net
Jesper Lauridsen
>Case in point: which simply *sounds* like more fun, a Ford Fairlane
>or a Ford Galaxie 500 7-Litre? A Dodge Dart or a Dodge Dart GTS?
>Plymouth Valiant, or Plymouth Duster 340? Any car without "Hemi" in
>its name, or any car with?
I have no idea.
>To get back on track though - I will give the Germans this: once
>you've cracked the code, BMW names for the most part make a lot of
>sense. Any car with three digits has the first digit denoting the
>chassis (3=small, 5=big, 7=f'ing huge) and the next two denoting
>engine size in liters (330 = a 3 series with a 3.0 liter engine - more
>or less.
I can't see how that is harder to figure out than the names mentioned
earlier. On the contrary, it uses our sense of numbers. What's biggest,
325 or 535? Easy. You might argue that the answer for 330 versus 520
is the other way around, but that's a matter of preference. And as
you've shown above, its very easy to understand. As a bonus BMW have
now been using that system for 30 years, which should have given
everyone who cares ample of time to get used to it.
Jesper Lauridsen
>And
>why wouldn't you want to drive a minivan? It
>handles like shit and has enormous blind spots. So
>do SUVs, and because there's this useless
>transaxle weighing down the front end, SUVs are
>likely to get worse fuel economy.
I was looking at a list of car specs[1] the other day, and
once again I wondered why ordinary people buy SUVs/trucks/
off-roaders. Let's take an example: The Jeep Grand Cherokee
with a 4.7l V8. That's an expensive car with a big engine.
What does it have to show for it: 220hp - nice, but a bit
on the low side for a V8. 0-100km/h in 8.3s, ok, but a lot
of cars can beat that. Top speed 196km/h, even my 12 year
old 2l Citröen portable living room can beat that.
Unsurprisingly that finishing touch is fuel comsumption.
6.4 km/l. That's beyond bad. It's horrible. It's downright
criminal. Owners ought to install a fuel pump in the garage,
so the car could be refueled overnight, like electric cars.
Why would anyone buy such a beast? It's expensive, slow and
needs constant refueling. If you really want a V8, at least
put it in a car, where you might actually notice it.
[1] The list dates from late 2000.