Lynch's Spoiler Review: "The Host"
Timothy W. Lynch
week's TNG episode, "The Host". Those not wanting to know plot details,
opinions, or the atomic weight of popcorn had best stop here.
Hmm...very, very, *different*. For the most part, pretty good.
No, I'm not _really_ going to give the atomic weight of popcorn. :-)
I'm really not sure how I'm going to rate this one. I guess I'll find out
before too long, though. Here's a synop:
Beverly's life has taken a turn for the better--she's in love with Ambassador
Odan, a negotiator of the Trill race, who's on board to get to a dispute
between two moons of a world (sorry, didn't catch the name). However, Odan
isn't quite what he seems--Troi keeps getting "fluctuations" of emotion from
him, and when he's alone, we see..._something_...moving around in his stomach.
The trip is for the most part uneventful, marked only by Bev receiving a bit
of ribbing from Deanna about her new flame. Once they arrive at the planet in
question, however, things happen very fast. Odan and Riker attempt to shuttle
down to the planet (Odan claiming he's not comfortable with transporters), but
the shuttle is fired on. Riker manages, barely, to get it back to the
Enterprise, but Odan is critically injured. Or rather, Odan's *host body* is
critically injured--as it happens, the Trill are a joint species, and the
"parasite" within the host body is the true Odan.
The body dies, and a replacement host from the Trill is 40 hours away, far
longer than Odan could survive alone, even in stasis. Since Odan _might_ be
able to survive in a human host, Riker volunteers to be that host temporarily.
The process is a little bumpy, but it works.
The aftermath is a problem, however. First, Riker/Odan must convince both
Governor Leka and the two representatives of the factions that he's
legitimate. Secondly, Riker's body is slowly but surely rejecting Odan, and
it's unclear how long he can last. Thirdly, Beverly is very...uncomfortable
with this situation, particularly when Riker/Odan says he still loves her, and
still wants her.
All three problems are resolved, more or less. Odan is accepted as negotiator
by all three parties, and Beverly manages to accept that the man she loves is
still there, inside Riker's body. Unfortunately, the rejection continues, and
Odan makes Beverly swear to remove him at the end of the day's negotiations,
regardless of whether the new host has arrived.
Fortunately, his negotiations are successful, and while Odan has to spend a
little time in stasis between hosts, both Odan and Riker survive. The
change of hosts, however, becomes too much for Beverly, especially when she
finds that the new Trill host is a woman. Saying "I can't keep up," she tells
Odan that although she still loves him and will never forget him, it's over.
Well, that should do. (I'm not sure I'm entirely pleased with the way that
synopsis came out, but it seems accurate enough.) Now, on to some commentary.
As I said, I'm not sure what this will end up getting. It had a lot of good
points to be sure, and my primary opinion is positive--but it had some rather
unpleasant elements as well.
Surprisingly, the problems were _not_ in either of Frakes's or McFadden's
performances. Considering that they are, in my opinion, two of the weaker
performers on the show (though both are usually better than Sirtis), I was
somewhat worried that a show featuring the two of them wouldn't work well at
all. Fortunately, I was wrong, _especially_ where Jonathan Frakes was
concerned--as Odan, he was more interesting to watch than I've found him in a
considerably long time.
In fact, one thing which was extremely well done was the continuity of Odan's
personality from body to body. It's easy enough to make situations like this
fraught with unbelievable character jumps, but that didn't happen. Quite the
contrary--I found it all TOO easy to believe that this was the same person in
all three cases (yes, even Kareel at the end). I'm not sure who should get
the credit for that, though--the director, or all three performers. I'll go
with some of each, I guess.
Gates did a fairly good job as well, though not her best by any means.
(I'm not sure where her best was, but she did better in "Remember Me" than she
did here.). Most of her scenes with Odan were pretty convincing, and nearly
all of her scene in Ten-Forward with Deanna was excellent.
The main problems I had with the show, I guess, were one or two of the other
scenes with her in them, though. In particular, most of the scene in the
salon with Deanna was really, _really_ awkward for me. I don't think I can
put my finger on anything in particular, but it all felt wrong somehow. Maybe
it was Marina, doing one of her least interesting performances in a while (in
that scene, that is; she was fine for the rest of the show). It felt a little
"soapish" to me, I guess. (Some of the scene with Data in the teaser didn't
thrill me, either--way too sitcomlike for my blood. I liked the bits IN the
lift, but not after they left.)
Some of the scenes were extremely well done, though. The one example I can
remember offhand is the end of the scene in 10-Forward. Bev finally turns
around to look at Riker/Odan, and we get her head slowly turning, then a long,
rather lingering shot of Frakes, then back to a rather teary Bev. I don't
know why, but something about that sequence really got to me. Nice work.
Plotwise, I was happy. It was both solid _and_ interesting; I, at least,
found the whole concept of the Trill race interesting, if unoriginal. (The
elements of the dispute between the two moons was also interesting--using the
planet's magnetic field as an energy source? Hmm...I like it.) No real
complaints--they've had more interesting plots, certainly, but they've had
much LESS interesting ones as well.
One bit of the credits I don't usually pay attention to is the name of
whoever's composing the music--was this week's music person new? Much of the
music got my attention this time. I suppose that isn't new--but it KEPT my
attention for a while, which is a little more rare. That and the small battle
(nice-looking ship) should kick the show upstairs a little. (It might be a
full point were it not for the somewhat uninteresting makeup and the REALLY
unrealistic effects in the surgery.)
I sincerely hope that the last few minutes of the show don't start a rampaging
homosexuality debate (that's "rampaging debate", not "rampaging homosexuality"
:-) ) on r.a.s again. While I would agree that Bev wasn't just having trouble
"keeping up" with the changes and was probably uneasy about Odan now being
female, I don't personally see that it's implying homophobia of any sort. She
gave no sign of thinking it was wrong, just not right _for her_--and that
qualifier makes all the difference, methinks. (It certainly does in my own
case--while I can't think of a single thing I find wrong with homosexuality,
I'm simply not attracted to men. 'nuff said.) Since I'm sure there will be
lots of discussion of this before long, I thought I'd try to head off the
flamewars at the start. Why do I have my doubts it's not going to work?
I think that's more or less everything I've got to say. This seems shorter
than usual, but I'm in a little bit of a hurry (work to do), and I don't
really feel all that motivated to say a lot. I enjoyed it--it wasn't perfect,
but it was very watchable.
So, with that, the numbers:
Plot: 7. Nothing special, but better than average.
Plot Handling: 8. A couple of the scenes were too awkward, but a lot of the
rest was very nice indeed.
Characterization: 8. Hats off to Frakes, and decent performances from
everyone else.
So, jumping it up a little as a technical bonus, that's an 8. Hmm--that's a
little better than what I expected going in. Sounds fairly close to right,
though.
NEXT WEEK: A rerun of "The Wounded". Sounds good to me.
Tim Lynch (Cornell's first Astronomy B.A.; one of many Caltech grad students)
BITNET: tlynch@citjuliet
INTERNET: tly...@juliet.caltech.edu
UUCP: ...!ucbvax!tlynch%juliet.ca...@hamlet.caltech.edu
Why are there so many songs about rainbows, and what's on the other side?
R.I.P. Jim Henson, 1936-1990; we shall never see your like again.
(has it already been a year? it feels like yesterday...)
Betsy Ramsey
tly...@nntp-server.caltech.edu (Timothy W. Lynch) writes:
>WARNING: The following post contains spoiler information relevant to this
>week's TNG episode, "The Host".
[My Control-L's usually get eaten by the mailer.]
>The main problems I had with the show, I guess, were one or two of the other
>scenes with her in them, though. In particular, most of the scene in the
>salon with Deanna was really, _really_ awkward for me. I don't think I can
>put my finger on anything in particular, but it all felt wrong somehow. Maybe
>it was Marina, doing one of her least interesting performances in a while (in
>that scene, that is; she was fine for the rest of the show). It felt a little
>"soapish" to me, I guess.
I had more of a problem with Bev in that scene. It's unlike her to be
_that_ unsure of her feelings. (For instance, compare that scene with her
scene with Picard in "Allegiance".) I thought Deanna was fine.
>I sincerely hope that the last few minutes of the show don't start a rampaging
>homosexuality debate (that's "rampaging debate", not "rampaging homosexuality"
>:-) ) on r.a.s again. While I would agree that Bev wasn't just having trouble
>"keeping up" with the changes and was probably uneasy about Odan now being
>female, I don't personally see that it's implying homophobia of any sort. She
>gave no sign of thinking it was wrong, just not right _for her_--and that
>qualifier makes all the difference, methinks.
I don't even think Bev implied that Odan's gender wasn't right for her.
That's what I was worried that they were going to do. Instead, she just
said that the frequency of the changes in host body were too much for her to
cope with. I think they went out of their way to avoid doing anything that
even remotely smacked of homophobia.
I wasn't particularly thrilled with the actress playing Odan, although it
was quite effective when she kissed the inside of Bev's wrist.
In all, I was very pleased with the way they handled this potentially
controversial situation.
-------
Betsy Ramsey, Catholic University of America, Washington DC
Internet: RAM...@CUAVAX.DNET.CUA.EDU or
RAMSEY%CUAVA...@NETCON.CUA.EDU
Bitnet: RAMSEY@CUA
All opinions expressed here are my own.
Timothy W. Lynch
>In article <1991May16.0...@nntp-server.caltech.edu>
> tly...@nntp-server.caltech.edu (Timothy W. Lynch) writes:
>>WARNING: The following post contains spoiler information relevant to this
>>week's TNG episode, "The Host".
>>The main problems I had with the show, I guess, were one or two of the other
>>scenes with her in them, though. In particular, most of the scene in the
>>salon with Deanna was really, _really_ awkward for me. I don't think I can
>>put my finger on anything in particular, but it all felt wrong somehow. Maybe
>>it was Marina, doing one of her least interesting performances in a while (in
>>that scene, that is; she was fine for the rest of the show). It felt a little
>>"soapish" to me, I guess.
>I had more of a problem with Bev in that scene. It's unlike her to be
>_that_ unsure of her feelings. (For instance, compare that scene with her
>scene with Picard in "Allegiance".) I thought Deanna was fine.
I wasn't thrilled with either in that particular scene. Both have done far
better. You're right, though, in that it wasn't JUST Marina.
>>I sincerely hope that the last few minutes of the show don't start a
>>rampaging homosexuality debate (that's "rampaging debate", not "rampaging
>>homosexuality" :-) ) on r.a.s again. While I would agree that Bev wasn't
>>just having trouble "keeping up" with the changes and was probably uneasy
>>about Odan now being female, I don't personally see that it's implying
>>homophobia of any sort. She gave no sign of thinking it was wrong, just not
>>right _for her_--and that qualifier makes all the difference, methinks.
>I don't even think Bev implied that Odan's gender wasn't right for her.
>That's what I was worried that they were going to do. Instead, she just
>said that the frequency of the changes in host body were too much for her to
>cope with. I think they went out of their way to avoid doing anything that
>even remotely smacked of homophobia.
If they tried to avoid it entirely, I think they blew it, because it certainly
seemed to me that while the frequency of the changes were part of her
discomfort, she was rationalizing up a storm to claim that it was the ONLY
reason. If it were, I don't see why she would have reacted so visibly when she
first saw the new host. But this is a moot point.
>I wasn't particularly thrilled with the actress playing Odan, although it
>was quite effective when she kissed the inside of Bev's wrist.
I actually thought she was fairly good--she did a good enough job, at least,
that I could still believe that it was Odan in there.
Tim Lynch (Cornell's first Astronomy B.A.; one of many Caltech grad students)
BITNET: tlynch@citjuliet
INTERNET: tly...@juliet.caltech.edu
UUCP: ...!ucbvax!tlynch%juliet.ca...@hamlet.caltech.edu
"With the first link, a chain is forged. The first speech censured, the first
thought forbidden, the first freedom denied, chains us all irrevocably."
Otto Hack-Man Heuer
>performances. Considering that they are, in my opinion, two of the weaker
Agree and disagree. I thought Frakes was good, and e's been good in quite a
few of the other eps he's been in (but not all of them by any means), but I
thought Gates did about as well as she usually does--bland and uninteresting.
>In fact, one thing which was extremely well done was the continuity of Odan's
>personality from body to body. It's easy enough to make situations like this
>fraught with unbelievable character jumps, but that didn't happen. Quite the
>contrary--I found it all TOO easy to believe that this was the same person in
>One bit of the credits I don't usually pay attention to is the name of
>whoever's composing the music--was this week's music person new? Much of the
>music got my attention this time. I suppose that isn't new--but it KEPT my
It got my attention too. Though probably not for the same reason it caught
yours. I couldn't hear a sizable portions of he dialog because of the blaring
music! Loud music is all right when people aren't speaking, but when it
drowns out the actors, itis definitely a "minus" and not a "plus".
No, I didn't see who did the music on this ep, but I have no great wish to see
them do any more (though it probabl isn't their fault -- someone else probably
mixes it in and had the volume set waaaaaaaay wrong for the whole episode; and
that person should be fired :-)
>full point were it not for the somewhat uninteresting makeup and the REALLY
Hmmm... I thought it was one of the more interesting makeup jobs. Would you
care to elaborate on what you didn't like about it? I belive I've heard you
complain about aiens ooking too human and also about aliens that are energy
beings, and this one was about as close to the middle ground as TNG has got.
I'm looking forward to hearing what you didn't like about this one.
--HACK-MAN
--
_____ _________ _ Ignor missng charctrs, as pnet's edtr tends to eat thm
| ___|| _______|| | INET: hac...@pnet51.orb.mn.org
| |__ | |___ ___| | crash
| __| |___ || _ | UUCP: >-------->!orbit!pnet51!hackman
| | _______| || |_| | tcnet Otto E. Heuer, CEO
|_||_________||_____| "The innovator for software solutions." FSD, Inc.
Otto Hack-Man Heuer
Not sure how I always seem to see a few dozen follow-ups to Lynch's review
before his original review shows up this site, but I'll get to the points that
don't appear HERE when I see his full review...
>>>that scene, that is; she was fine for the rest of the show). It felt a little
>>>"soapish" to me, I guess.
Heh. At least I wasn't the only one complaining about this ep being "too soap
opera-ish". :-)
>>>I sincerely hope that the last few minutes of the show don't start a
>>>rampaging homosexuality debate (that's "rampaging debate", not "rampaging
Oh, good. We reviewers are starting to think WAAAAAAAAY too much alike.
Either that or the "homosexuality scene" wasn't buried very deeply in the
"plot".
Michael Rawdon
>In article <1991May16.0...@nntp-server.caltech.edu>
> tly...@nntp-server.caltech.edu (Timothy W. Lynch) writes:
>>WARNING: The following post contains spoiler information relevant to this
>>week's TNG episode, "The Host".
>>homosexuality debate (that's "rampaging debate", not "rampaging homosexuality"
>>:-) ) on r.a.s again. While I would agree that Bev wasn't just having trouble
>>"keeping up" with the changes and was probably uneasy about Odan now being
>>female, I don't personally see that it's implying homophobia of any sort. She
>>gave no sign of thinking it was wrong, just not right _for her_--and that
>>qualifier makes all the difference, methinks.
>I don't even think Bev implied that Odan's gender wasn't right for her.
I disagree with this very strongly. Her reaction when the female host first
showed up pretty much said to me "Bev just realized that Odan is about to
become female, and she can't deal with that event." Not that I could blame
her.
>That's what I was worried that they were going to do. Instead, she just
>said that the frequency of the changes in host body were too much for her to
>cope with. I think they went out of their way to avoid doing anything that
>even remotely smacked of homophobia.
I agree. I saw no homophobia in the show either.
>I wasn't particularly thrilled with the actress playing Odan, although it
>was quite effective when she kissed the inside of Bev's wrist.
I was underwowed with the actress as well. She seemed remarkably unemotive,
which seemed odd, considering how Odan had behaved in his other two bodies...
--
Michael Rawdon Internet: raw...@rex.cs.tulane.edu
Tulane University, New Orleans, Louisiana Bitnet: CS6FECU@TCSVM
Then the Fool said "Oh you Wise men, you really make me laugh,
With your talk of vast persuasion and searching through the past,
There is only greed and evil in the men who fight today,
The Song of the Crusader has long since gone away."
- Chris De Burgh, "Crusader"
Timothy W. Lynch
>tly...@nntp-server.caltech.edu (Timothy W. Lynch) writes:
Spoilers for "The Host"...
>>Surprisingly, the problems were _not_ in either of Frakes's or McFadden's
>>performances. Considering that they are, in my opinion, two of the weaker
>Agree and disagree. I thought Frakes was good, and e's been good in quite a
>few of the other eps he's been in (but not all of them by any means),
I wouldn't even say "quite a few". I can think of maybe half a dozen where
I've really liked his performance--"A Matter of Honor" comes to mind, along
with BOBW (both, although 1 more so), and no doubt a few others that don't
come up immediately, but not even close to the percentage many others get.
>>One bit of the credits I don't usually pay attention to is the name of
>>whoever's composing the music--was this week's music person new? Much of the
>>music got my attention this time. I suppose that isn't new--but it KEPT my
>It got my attention too. Though probably not for the same reason it caught
>yours. I couldn't hear a sizable portions of he dialog because of the blaring
>music! Loud music is all right when people aren't speaking, but when it
>drowns out the actors, itis definitely a "minus" and not a "plus".
I had no problems hearing any of the lines. Maybe it was a local problem.
>>full point were it not for the somewhat uninteresting makeup and the REALLY
>Hmmm... I thought it was one of the more interesting makeup jobs. Would you
>care to elaborate on what you didn't like about it? I belive I've heard you
>complain about aiens ooking too human and also about aliens that are energy
>beings, and this one was about as close to the middle ground as TNG has got.
>I'm looking forward to hearing what you didn't like about this one.
I don't recall entirely, but they struck me as being "humanoids with weird
skin problems" again, for the most part. Just one Horta--ONE! In six
seasons. That's all I ask. :-)
j...@ceres.physics.uiowa.edu
>
>
> Hmmm... I thought it was one of the more interesting makeup jobs. Would you
> care to elaborate on what you didn't like about it? I belive I've heard you
> complain about aiens ooking too human and also about aliens that are energy
> beings, and this one was about as close to the middle ground as TNG has got.
> I'm looking forward to hearing what you didn't like about this one.
>
>
If I may add what I don't like about these makeup jobs, every time
ST:TNG wants to invent a new species, alls they do is add a wrinkle or
a ridge to the nose, and add some bony ridges on top of the head. It
seems like every new species we've seen is like this. Although, they've
come a long ways since they just smeared actors with brown shoe polish
to make them Klingons.
Jeff Kouba
Dept. of Physics and Astronomy
University of Iowa
INET: j...@ceres.physics.uiowa.edu
Betsy Ramsey
Rawdon) writes:
>In <1991May16.1...@cec1.wustl.edu> ram...@wucs1.wustl.edu
>(Betsy Ramsey) writes:
>>In article <1991May16.0...@nntp-server.caltech.edu>
>> tly...@nntp-server.caltech.edu (Timothy W. Lynch) writes:
>>>WARNING: Theiler information relevant to this
>>>week's TNG episode, "The Host".
[My mailer eats Ctrl-L's]
>>I don't even think Bev implied that Odan's gender wasn't right for her.
>I disagree with this very strongly. Her reaction when the female host first
>showed up pretty much said to me "Bev just realized that Odan is about to
>become female, and she can't deal with that event." Not that I could blame
>her.
Having watched the episode a second time, I agree with you. As Bev
turned to greet the new host body, she was smiling warmly. That smile
faded instantly when she saw the gender of the new host.
>>That's what I was worried that they were going to do. Instead, she just
>>said that the frequency of the changes in host body were too much for her to
>>cope with. I think they went out of their way to avoid doing anything that
>>even remotely smacked of homophobia.
>I agree. I saw no homophobia in the show either.
Except for Bev's (as you say, somewhat understandable) inability to
dea with the new host's gender. Although I can't fault the handling
of the issue in the final scene between Bev and Odan, her initial
reaction was disappointing to me.
>>I wasn't particularly thrilled with the actress playing Odan, although it
>>was quite effective when she kissed the inside of Bev's wrist.
>I was underwowed with the actress as well. She seemed remarkably unemotive,
>which seemed odd, considering how Odan had behaved in his other two bodies...
Yes, that's it...
Marc Wiz
j...@ceres.physics.uiowa.edu writes:
> If I may add what I don't like about these makeup jobs, every time
> ST:TNG wants to invent a new species, alls they do is add a wrinkle or
> a ridge to the nose, and add some bony ridges on top of the head. It
> seems like every new species we've seen is like this. Although, they've
> come a long ways since they just smeared actors with brown shoe polish
> to make them Klingons.
>
At the recent CreationCon in Austin, Marina Sirtis and Jonathon Frakes
were asked when they were going to stop using humanoids as aliens.
Marina's reply was something to the effect when they find some real aliens.
Marc Wiz MaBell (512)823-4780
Yes that really is my last name.
The views expressed are my own.
ma...@aixwiz.austin.ibm.com
or
uunet!cs.utexas.edu!ibmchs!auschs!ekhomeni.austin.ibm.com!marc
Otto Heuer #3
>
> >>Surprisingly, the problems were _not_ in either of Frakes's or McFadden's
> >>performances. Considering that they are, in my opinion, two of the weaker
>
> >Agree and disagree. I thought Frakes was good, and e's been good in quite a
> >few of the other eps he's been in (but not all of them by any means),
>
> I wouldn't even say "quite a few".
I would. (And, gee, look--I *did*! :-)
> I can think of maybe half a dozen where
> I've really liked his performance--"A Matter of Honor" comes to mind, along
> with BOBW (both, although 1 more so), and no doubt a few others that don't
> come up immediately,
As I said, I think Frakes has been good in quite a few episodes, this one
included (The Host). By "quite a few", I'd say 20 or so of the near-100 eps.
Now, you had to go and list my favorite Riker-episodes in aMoH and tBoBW (&2)..
:-) I'd say in these three episodes, his performance is *outstanding* (which
is something I rarely say about television performers).
> but not even close to the percentage many others get.
As far as "good performances" (which is what we were originally talking about,
I'd disagree again. Like I said, Frakes has had about 20 "good" preformances.
In comparison, I'd say Stewart has had maybe a dozen, Spiner about 60 or 70,
Sirtis 1 or 2, McFadden 1 or 2, Wheaton 1 or 2, Burton 10 or 15, and Crosby
maybe 3 or 6.
As far as "outstanding performances" (which is what I brought up starting
with this posting), I'd say Frakes has 3 or 5, Stewart 0, Spiner 12 or 18,
Sirtis 0, McFadden 0, Wheaton 0, Burton 0, Crosby 0 (maybe a half for
"Yesterday's Enterprise", in which her performance was probably closer to
"good" than "outstanding").
> >>One bit of the credits I don't usually pay attention to is the name of
> >>whoever's composing the music--was this week's music person new? Much of the
> >>music got my attention this time. I suppose that isn't new--but it KEPT my
>
> >It got my attention too. Though probably not for the same reason it caught
> >yours. I couldn't hear a sizable portions of he dialog because of the blaring
> >music! Loud music is all right when people aren't speaking, but when it
> >drowns out the actors, itis definitely a "minus" and not a "plus".
>
> I had no problems hearing any of the lines. Maybe it was a local problem.
Could be, though I'm not sure how the local station could have raised the
music level so much or decreased the voices so much without effecting the
volume of the other...
> Just one Horta--ONE! In six
> seasons. That's all I ask. :-)
What is this obsession everyone on ras (and net.startrek, if I remember the
topics from way back then) has with Hortae? Did they appear in some novels
where people could really warm up to them, or have they only been in the
*extremely* lame TOS episode "Devil in the Dark"? If the latter, I don't see
why rassers want them back any more than they do the tree that was in the
background of the episode "Shore Leave"...
--
--Otto "HACK-MAN" Heuer
C, Pascal, Fortran, BASIC, Assembly Language, Snobol, Ada, APL, Prolog, LISP
Unix, MS-DOS, ProDOS . . . .... . . . . . . . Audio/Video
ot...@cfsmo.honeywell.com :..: .:.:. : :.' .. :`.': .:.:. :`. : Star Trek
hac...@pnet51.orb.mn.org : : : : :... : `. : : : : : `: Apple IIgs
------I speak for me and not my boss--Honeywell's gain and Usenet's loss.------
Eric Glover
Glover's
377 Message Late But Irrepressible, Irresponsible
"Hey, Who Asked You" Top Ten List Review For THE HOST
*** Warning Spoliers Follow In 1.5 Screens So Leave Now ***
Do You Ever Get The Feeling That The Writers Of Season 4 of Star Trek: The
Next Generation Where The Rejects From The L.A. Law Writing Pool...
Although The Season Finale For L.A. Law Aired Last Week, Fans Of The Series
Can Now Get Their Favorite Show On Another Favorite Show. Presenting the
Spolier less review of The Host
How Does It Rank In The Last 10 Shows I've viewed
On the Glover Top Ten?
1. First Contact or "Hey, A Good Episode"
2. The Nth Degree or "Hey, Were On A Roll"
3. Identity Crisis or "Old Blue Eyes"
4. Night Terrors or "One Moon-Two Moon,Red Moon-Blue Moon"
5. Qpid or "Iam NOT a MERRY Man"
6. Drumhead or "The Trial Of An X-Borg"
7. Clues or "This Episode Never Happened"
8. Galaxy's Child or "Sucker For A Pretty Starship"
9. Half A Life or "Honey I Hurled the Kids"
10. The Host or "Francis the Talking Pancreous"
***Spoilers Follow After The Bogus Top Ten****
And A bogus Top Ten Thrown in for no good reason
Top 10 Ways To Die In The Star Trek Universe
10. Gun in Most Toys
09. Absorbed By Tar of Evil
08.Hacked In Half By Evil Worf Sword
07.Watch The Host 10+ times
06.Ship Caught in Genesis wave
05.Star Bagel from Doomesday Machine
04.Fool around with Micro Brains in Home Soil
03.Be On Borg Cube
02.Centi-Eeels eat your brain
01.Head Blown Clean off by Riker and Picard
***Spoilers Warning Warning Warning***
Top Ten Things About THE HOST
10. :( Nice And Bogus Attempt A Little Intercharacter Tension By Making
The Host Take Over Riker. Nice Attempt At A TOS Series Episode Like All Our
Yesterdays (I Believe is the TOS Episode that ploy reminded me of, AOY is
the episode with the life forces trapped in the glass balls. A Much Better
Episode Than The Host.
09. :( I Am Starting To Agree With The Net Theory That Every Bridge
Characther Must Make A Token Appearence In Every Episode.
08. :) Nice Role Reversal For Bev And Troi After the "Toes Curl" line of
The Price. (But Once Again The Price Was a Better Episode)
07. :) Fairly Cool Looking Aliens, Nice MakeUp Job.
06. :) Not Bad Music For TNG.
05. :( We Get To See The New And Improved Barbershop Set,
OOOH Ah. Another Help, Im Trapped On A Starship Episode.
04. :( What A Lamer Of A Storyline. I Really Wanted To Know More About The
Dispute. Here's Another A Funny Thing Happend On The Way To The
Negotiation. The Riva Episode With Troi, (Loud As A Whisper --I Think) Was
Much, Much, Much Better.
03. :( Nice recyling of ships; I could have sworn I saw the paklid ship and
one of the ships from I believe--the outrageous Okona.
02. :) Hey Did you notice how Odan looked like the creature from THE HIDDEN
(A darn good movie). But the Creature was still fairly cool looking. Yes I
know its been mentioned already but when this was written, It was new an
resfreshing to say.
01. :( The UnAuthrized Use Of C.J.Lamb on TNG. I mean come on, that ending
has got to go. Nice try at being topical --bar. The L.A. Version was much
better. Was it just me or wer you expecting Odan to say "See you tommorrow
Abby"
And The patented "Hey Overall what does this all mean."
Score At HalfTime
:( 6 :) 4
so they nays have it even with a bit of stretching to accentuate the
positive
Glover
Eric Glover
>ott...@CFSMO.HONEYWELL.COM (Otto Heuer #3) writes:
>
>[on Frakes]
>
>>Tim Lynch writes:
>
>>> I can think of maybe half a dozen where
>>> I've really liked his performance--"A Matter of Honor" comes to mind, along
>>> with BOBW (both, although 1 more so), and no doubt a few others that don't
>>> come up immediately,
>
>>As I said, I think Frakes has been good in quite a few episodes, this one
>>included (The Host). By "quite a few", I'd say 20 or so of the near-100 eps.
>
>particularly good record to me. (I'm not even sure I'd come up with 20
>shows where I've really enjoyed Frakes's work, but I probably could.)
>
>>> but not even close to the percentage many others get.
>
>>As far as "good performances" (which is what we were originally talking about,
>>I'd disagree again. Like I said, Frakes has had about 20 "good" preformances.
>>In comparison, I'd say Stewart has had maybe a dozen, Spiner about 60 or 70,
>>Sirtis 1 or 2, McFadden 1 or 2, Wheaton 1 or 2, Burton 10 or 15, and Crosby
>>maybe 3 or 6.
>
>Stewart's is far, far, *FAR* too low (he's most likely up in the high 80s/low
>90s), and Gates and Wil are both too low as well.
>
I really dont think you can rank how many good performances TNG charcaters
have in a vaccum. Yeah Maybe Burton has had 10 or 15 but he's really
been "in" 5 or 6 stories. The rest of the time he's a glorified extra.
[Which not IMO, but in reality is pretty darn bogus.]
Yeah maybe Spiner has had 80/90 good performances but how many episodes
dont have a pretty hefty chunk of neat stuff just for him to do. [Another
pretty bogus aspect, too much data does a long way].
McFadden, maybe she could be good if she was not another glorified extra.
Overall Id Say It would be something like
Sirtis 4 for 40 Best In Loud as A Whisper
McFadden 5 for 40 Best In The Highroad
Stewert 70 for 95 Best In Sarek
Frakes 50 for 95 Best In The Episode About the Clan Wars
Spiner 60 for 95 Best In Brothers
Wheaton 25 for 50 Best In Final Mission [Regardless of how dumb
His Char was]
Crosby 6 for 3 Best In Encounter At Far Point
Burton 15 for 5 Best In Booby Trap
Dorn 95 for 85 Best In Emessary
The Utmost worst actors on the show are Obrien and Keiko, they both
just eat it. If they where actually dying from a bullet wound and I
shot the gun, I wouldnt Believe them.
>>> Just one Horta--ONE! In six seasons. That's all I ask. :-)
>
>>What is this obsession everyone on ras (and net.startrek, if I remember the
>>topics from way back then) has with Hortae? Did they appear in some novels
>>where people could really warm up to them, or have they only been in the
>>*extremely* lame TOS episode "Devil in the Dark"?
Devil In The Dark Was A pretty *good* episdoe IMO.
Metamorphasis and Transtrangulations are *extremly* Lame
Near Text Book Definitions of Extremely Lame Oh but wait
there's the Royale what was I thinking.
Glover
Timothy W. Lynch
[on Frakes]
>Tim Lynch writes:
>> I can think of maybe half a dozen where
>> I've really liked his performance--"A Matter of Honor" comes to mind, along
>> with BOBW (both, although 1 more so), and no doubt a few others that don't
>> come up immediately,
>As I said, I think Frakes has been good in quite a few episodes, this one
>included (The Host). By "quite a few", I'd say 20 or so of the near-100 eps.
I don't think I'd classify 20% as "quite a few". Doesn't seem like a
particularly good record to me. (I'm not even sure I'd come up with 20
shows where I've really enjoyed Frakes's work, but I probably could.)
>> but not even close to the percentage many others get.
>As far as "good performances" (which is what we were originally talking about,
>I'd disagree again. Like I said, Frakes has had about 20 "good" preformances.
>In comparison, I'd say Stewart has had maybe a dozen, Spiner about 60 or 70,
>Sirtis 1 or 2, McFadden 1 or 2, Wheaton 1 or 2, Burton 10 or 15, and Crosby
>maybe 3 or 6.
Not from where I sit...Spiner's is probably about right or a little low,
Stewart's is far, far, *FAR* too low (he's most likely up in the high 80s/low
90s), and Gates and Wil are both too low as well.
[on nonhumanoid aliens]
>> Just one Horta--ONE! In six seasons. That's all I ask. :-)
>What is this obsession everyone on ras (and net.startrek, if I remember the
>topics from way back then) has with Hortae? Did they appear in some novels
>where people could really warm up to them, or have they only been in the
>*extremely* lame TOS episode "Devil in the Dark"?
1) I wouldn't call DitD lame.
2) You haven't read any of Diane Duane's novels, it seems. Go look for
Ensign, later-Lieutenant, Naraht, the first Horta in Starfleet.
I'd be happy with a Horta. I'd be even happier with a Hamalki, but there
isn't even a ghost of a chance of that ever happening.
Tim Lynch
Just another theatre geek.....
As you said, you can't rate Trek acting in a vacuum. Scripting
DOES have an effect on the acting job. Not a whole lot of people can do a
great acting job when the scripting is bad; it's like getting blood out of
a turnip (the fact that Patrick Stewart seems to be running a blood bank
is the exception that proves the rule......)
>The Utmost worst actors on the show are Obrien and Keiko, they both
>just eat it.
Rosalind Chao is a perfect example of this. Compare her work on
TNG to the superb job she did in the feature film, 1000 PIECES OF GOLD.
Like night and day.
--
-----
Roger Tang, gwan...@milton.u.washington.edu
Middle-class weenie, art nerd and all-around evil nasty spermchucker
Rebecca Radnor
Patrick Stewart could read a phone book and make it dramatic -- how
significant could it be to him how good his scripts were?
--
Rebecca Radnor \\ I know everything,
Northwester University \\ I know nothing,
Anthropology Department \\ I used to put sticks under the back porch
\\ and wait for them to petrify.