my experience at CN :)
MC324525
both the Techwood and Williams Street campuses.
The Techwood campus (which is actually on 10th Street, go figure) is quite
decorated. They've got a very fancy building with a sleek new inside. The walls
are decorated with characters, character models and such. Williams Street, on
the other hand, is pretty run down. The outside and the hallways are plain like
white bread, but inside the rooms it's more furnished up.....to an extent.
Really the fanciest looking room is the Film/Video Room, where most of your
favorite televised anime gets doctored! This room is the only one in the
building (that I saw) with a metal/glass door. They have various types of
computers in there too.
I wasn't able to ask a LOT of questions, but I did get some answers from both
buildings. Since this is RAAM, I'll only point out the anime related stuff:
-------------------
Short story of AS's history with the BS&P:
CN originally planned to run Cowboy Bebop and Yu Yu Hakusho completely
uncensored. However, this decision was made before the Bureau of Standards and
Practices got involved (aka BS&P (what an ironic acronym)). The problem with
Adult Swim, and the biggest reason it's not allowed to thrive the way
programming wants it to, is the BS&P has Cartoon Network labeled as a
children's network. This is due to the majority of the programming being able
to be viewed by children, even though Cartoon Network is a cable network and
thus not bound by the Children's Programming Act. So when the BS&P decides to
get involved with Adult Swim, they take the youth viewing audience into
consideration, and thus CB and YYH had to be edited. The people at programming
gave into these demands, and really, AS wasn't hit TOO hard, but there were
still some edits made that were utterly ridiculous (covering Faye's cleavage,
the invisible man, etc.).
In the early days of Adult Swim, the BS&P were really getting their way the
whole time. Pretty much every decision fell into their hands and they came out
winning in the end. Eltingville and Saddle Rash both had to be cleaned up a
little but neither show really minded. But along came a man named Don
Hertzfeldt and his short "Rejected." This was supposed to run uncensored too,
until BS&P had a problem with one of the scenes (a character says "Sweet
Jesus"). Don refused to let his Academy Award nominated short be edited, and
finally after months of fighting, Don came out the victor, and "Rejected" will
soon be the first program on CN to be rated TV-MA (current decision on the
rating).
The same thing happened to "Mission Hill" recently. MH ran just fine on the WB
Network because the BS&P has WB labeled as an adult network. That didn't cut it
on CN at first, and MH got delayed while more arguments between programming and
BS&P took place. Once again, BS&P gave into their demands. In exchange, Mission
Hill's rating TV-14 will be present throughout the whole show for the first 2
weeks.
The people at programming are hoping that the BS&P will soon change CN's status
of being a children's network specifically for Adult Swim.
--------------------------
Inconsistancies in Editing
You're probably aware that most shows edited by Williams Street have
inconsistant editing. This could be for a number of reasons. Sometimes the
people who list the content needed to be edited just miss something (this
doesn't happen often). Sometimes, and this is usually the biggest reason, the
staff is strapped for time/money and they're allowed to let a few edits go to
save it and it isn't a problem. They only re-edit content if they receive
formal complaints/threats about it. Otherwise, it's not a big deal. (and
sometimes, but not often, edits are intentionally let go for the older viewers,
wink wink)
-------------------------
Short Questions and Facts:
- Don't worry, WS knows about the Trigun demand. ;)
- All acquisitions being discussed upon are "top secret," but I can say a deal
over Inu-Yasha will soon be complete. And there's Big O 2 of course :). And
G-Gundam.
- Sometimes anime edited by WS is done outside WS. This is usually if they're
doing more than one show.
- The reason ASAction has Toonami shows in it is because if ASA wasn't started
when it was, another block of programming would've taken the timeslot, and ASA
might not have ever been able to start because of it. The Thursday time had to
be sacrificed of course.
- I saw one of the producers leave. He had the Cowboy Bebop soundtrack blasting
out of his car. O_O
- WS is clueless as to why their guidelines are stricter (it's assumed to be
money related though). While we watch the single deaths of the limited cast in
0083 get cut or toned down, soon we'll be seeing Majin Buu on DBZ eliminate the
human race by impaling them with lasers in its unedited glory.
- Williams Street will no longer be editing shows for CN, and it will be up to
the distributors from now on. However, they will make an exception if they feel
they can do much better than the distributor will (this shouldn't happen
though).
- Williams Street, while they may make suggestions, are not in charge of
programming for either of their blocks of shows.
- The Toonami/AS producers wonder what's wrong with this country too.
And that's all I have to say. :) There's more non-anime related material I
found out, but that's a whole `nother newsgroup.
elsie
network, are you talking about network censoring offices for these two
networks, a corporate censoring office at AOL/Time Warner which monitors all
its networks, or a government agency such as the FCC?
laurie
Joey and his Akane Hammer
>deal
>over Inu-Yasha will soon be complete. And there's Big O 2 of course :). And
>G-Gundam.
Inu Yasha would do fantastically on CN *_*;;
_________
-RoninJoey, aspiring future Go champion(although he's not very good at it) who
STILL doesn't have a plush;_; Just send an email if you want a game!
MC324525
elsie
paper about network editing practices, with a lot of attention to CCS/CC and
the CN toonami and AS editing. The difference between KidsWB and CN editing
interests me in particular. If one office is overseeing standards for all
the corporation's networks, then that's an important thing to know.
laurie
"MC324525" <mc32...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020518195134...@mb-fi.aol.com...
Kyle Thomas Pope
Akane Hammer) wrote:
>Inu Yasha would do fantastically on CN *_*;;
Depends on where they put it. Inuyasha has quite a few dark and
violent episodes. If they run it on Adult Swim then it might survive
though some of the edits won't be pretty. If they run it on Toonami
forget it. the show will be virtually unwatchable to anyone who's seen
the original version.
-----
Kyle
"I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed or numbered!" - No. 6
Poster formerly known as anonymous
>
> Thanks. That clarifies things a lot for me. I'm planning to do an academic
> paper about network editing practices, with a lot of attention to CCS/CC and
> the CN toonami and AS editing. The difference between KidsWB and CN editing
> interests me in particular. If one office is overseeing standards for all
> the corporation's networks, then that's an important thing to know.
>
> laurie
>
Pick up a copy of Paul Dini's book 'Batman: Animated', which contains a
number of comparisons between BS&P's of the Fox and WB networks (turns
out WB is pretty loose). Some of the Fox memos are downright funny:
"It'll break Alan's heart, but Penguin's joke about 'picking up all the
soap' in prison is out."
At $40, its a little expensive just for research. But the artwork is
fantastic (design sketches, concepts, backgrounds, title cards), and it
contains a lot of great info for anyone interested in animation production.
Nargun
> Thanks. That clarifies things a lot for me. I'm planning to do an academic
> paper about network editing practices, with a lot of attention to CCS/CC and
> the CN toonami and AS editing. The difference between KidsWB and CN editing
> interests me in particular. If one office is overseeing standards for all
> the corporation's networks, then that's an important thing to know.
>
> laurie
If you really want to, you *might* want to consider picking up madman's
release of Cardcaptors, which has the international edit [ie, much less].
Plus an english language version of Catch You, Catch Me...
But it won't be cheap, and it won't be NTSC.
Louis ["Me an Lee gonna catch some cards...", IIRC]
--
Louis Patterson l.patt...@ugrad.unimelb.edu.au
"If you are asked to pass the butter, always remember to pass
the plate as well" - Lennie Lower, "Etiquette without tears"
Derek Janssen
>
> >Inu Yasha would do fantastically on CN *_*;;
>
> Depends on where they put it. Inuyasha has quite a few dark and
> violent episodes. If they run it on Adult Swim then it might survive
> though some of the edits won't be pretty. If they run it on Toonami
> forget it. the show will be virtually unwatchable to anyone who's seen
> the original version.
Maison Ikkoku would do even better, especially for the college-freshman
CN demographic (and not much adult content, except for the perpetually
lushed supporting characters), but then it gets complicated:
If Viz *thought* they could finally squeeze a few dimes out of their
"liability", they'd fall down, kiss CN's feet and BEG them to show it
(we might even scrape up enough "viable" profit to finally get the darn
things out on disk)--
Only problem, though: Even though it's CN-licensed anime, no spaceships
in it--It's a comedy, not an action. Which means finally crossing that
artistic picket-fence over into Saturday ASComedy. Right next to "Aqua
Teen Hunger Force", "Home Movies" and "Welcome to Eltingville".
...So, which one would be for the chopping block to make room, and who's
next after that? >: )
Derek Janssen (darn, we SHOULD have asked Williams Street that question)
dja...@ultranet.com
elsie
"Poster formerly known as anonymous" <anon...@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:3CE774EF...@ev1.net...
Thanks. I'll take a look at it.
laurie
Geoffrey L. W.
>release of Cardcaptors, which has the international edit [ie, much less].
>Plus an english language version of Catch You, Catch Me...
>
>But it won't be cheap, and it won't be NTSC.
>
>Louis ["Me an Lee gonna catch some cards...", IIRC]
Do you mean that there's *another* English dub of Cardcaptor Sakura? I'm
confused now ^_^;
-Geoff (remove Bob to e-mail)
"Why do they lock gas station bathrooms? Are they afraid someone will clean
them?"
"Atheism is a nonprophet organization." --Steve Wright
"Yeah, whatever. And all your base are belong to us, too." ---Patches on raam
Derek Janssen
>
> If you really want to, you *might* want to consider picking up madman's
> release of Cardcaptors
>
> But it won't be cheap, and it won't be NTSC.
Too much trouble--How 'bout an MP3, instead?
Derek Janssen
dja...@ultranet.com
Lord Craxton
"Derek Janssen" <dja...@ultranet.com> wrote in message
news:3CE7C235...@ultranet.com...
Honestly, probably MI itself. Granted, I've never seen it myself, but from
what I hear about it, it's no better then a mediocre sitcom and has trouble
keeping an audience even amongst hardcore fans...
-Lord Craxton
Delirious Writer
Yu Yu and Bebop, but I would imagine with their recent victories with the BS&P,
they're getting closer to their goal.
And that's also probably why they're keeping their new acquisitions a secret.
Probably trying to clear them with BS&P first.
- Matt
Derek Janssen
>
> > Maison Ikkoku would do even better, especially for the college-freshman
> > CN demographic (and not much adult content, except for the perpetually
> > lushed supporting characters), but then it gets complicated:
> >
> > If Viz *thought* they could finally squeeze a few dimes out of their
> > "liability", they'd fall down, kiss CN's feet and BEG them to show it
> > (we might even scrape up enough "viable" profit to finally get the darn
> > things out on disk)--
> >
> > next after that? >: )
>
> Honestly, probably MI itself. Granted, I've never seen it myself
(ahem)....WELL, THEN--
> but from
> what I hear about it, it's no better then a mediocre sitcom and has trouble
> keeping an audience even amongst hardcore fans...
I'll take "mediocre" over "incoherent", any day.
Derek Janssen (at least the characters *move*)
dja...@ultranet.com
Nargun
> >If you really want to, you *might* want to consider picking up madman's
> >release of Cardcaptors, which has the international edit [ie, much less].
> >Plus an english language version of Catch You, Catch Me...
> >
> >But it won't be cheap, and it won't be NTSC.
> >
> >Louis ["Me an Lee gonna catch some cards...", IIRC]
>
>
> Do you mean that there's *another* English dub of Cardcaptor Sakura? I'm
> confused now ^_^;
There is *one* dub [same cast, same people made it, etc].
There are two rather different edits of this dub.
One of these is the US edit, which cut & reshuffled galore, the other is
the "international" edit, which basically kept the original episode order,
although the content cuts are basically the same [I think. If I can hire
copies of AUS CS, I'll go through them and check; I'm not going to pay
more than I have to.]
In the UK, this edit was broadcast with the US/canadian OP, but in
australia we kept the original OP, with a crappy dub. I have no specific
knowledge either way of any other difference between these two versions.
The pretty certain conclusion you're forced to come to is that almost all
the changes to CCS in the US were forced by the US network after the dub
was completed; Nelvana's original plan was fairly equal in artistic
integrety to DiC Sailor Moon [which is, regardless of what you think of
it, better-handled than US CardCaptors].
What *is* of interest is that CardCaptors tanked here; the videos and
merchandise basically aren't moving, I believe. Whether a
fundamentally-uncut version would have sold better is still unclear.
Louis
Nargun
> Nargun wrote:
> >
> > If you really want to, you *might* want to consider picking up madman's
> > release of Cardcaptors
> > Plus an english language version of Catch You, Catch Me...
> >
> > But it won't be cheap, and it won't be NTSC.
>
> Too much trouble--How 'bout an MP3, instead?
Don't have the technology.
Louis
Tomar
> Lord Craxton wrote:
>>
>> > Maison Ikkoku would do even better, especially for the
>> > college-freshman CN demographic (and not much adult content, except
>> > for the perpetually lushed supporting characters), but then it gets
>> > complicated:
>> >
>> > If Viz *thought* they could finally squeeze a few dimes out of their
>> > "liability", they'd fall down, kiss CN's feet and BEG them to show it
>> > (we might even scrape up enough "viable" profit to finally get the
>> > darn things out on disk)--
>> >
>> > ...So, which one would be for the chopping block to make room, and
>> > who's next after that? >: )
>>
>> Honestly, probably MI itself. Granted, I've never seen it myself
>
> (ahem)....WELL, THEN--
No comment either. ^_-
>> but from
>> what I hear about it, it's no better then a mediocre sitcom and has
>> trouble keeping an audience even amongst hardcore fans...
>
> I'll take "mediocre" over "incoherent", any day.
But "incoherent" sells a lot better these days. Strange
isn't it?
Tomar
--
Tomar:aka to...@electrontrap.org |"Women who know swordplay
--- A slightly mysterious net entity --- | should be treated very
http://www.electrontrap.org/ | kindly..."
Chris Sobieniak
wrote:
For CN to be considered a "general" network is a challenging one.
Animation has hardly broke out of the children's medium on television.
We need to let these people know that this is not always the case.
Domo Arigatoo Gozaimasu!
From the Master of Car-too-nal Knowledge...
Christopher M. Sobieniak
--"Fightin' the Frizzies since 1978"--
Lord Craxton
> Lord Craxton wrote:
> >
> > > Maison Ikkoku would do even better, especially for the
college-freshman
> > > CN demographic (and not much adult content, except for the perpetually
> > > lushed supporting characters), but then it gets complicated:
> > >
> > > If Viz *thought* they could finally squeeze a few dimes out of their
> > > "liability", they'd fall down, kiss CN's feet and BEG them to show it
> > > (we might even scrape up enough "viable" profit to finally get the
darn
> > > things out on disk)--
> > >
> > > ...So, which one would be for the chopping block to make room, and
who's
> > > next after that? >: )
> >
> > Honestly, probably MI itself. Granted, I've never seen it myself
>
> (ahem)....WELL, THEN--
>
*cough cough* #^_^#
What I mean is, from what I've heard, and the fact that MI apparently can't
scrape together enough of a following to get finished stateside... I don't
see why someone would want to scrap an innovative and popular series in
favor of an average sitcom...
-Lord Craxton
Chris Sobieniak
rating during the broadcast.
Jorge R. Frank
news:ac9up5$91s$1...@bob.news.rcn.net:
> What I mean is, from what I've heard, and the fact that MI apparently
> can't scrape together enough of a following to get finished
> stateside...
That's more due to Viz' marketing ineptitude than MI's appeal. A release
plan of 48 tapes at $30/tape would doom even the most popular anime series.
--
JRF
Reply-to address spam-proofed - to reply by E-mail,
check "Organization" (I am not assimilated) and
think one step ahead of IBM.
Derek Janssen
>
> > > Honestly, probably MI itself. Granted, I've never seen it myself
> >
> > (ahem)....WELL, THEN--
>
> scrape together enough of a following to get finished stateside...
What you've heard is what you've heard from Viz...Who's still trying to
sell the darn thing on VHS. At two episodes a tape.
...Yes, "still".
Nobody knows why.
Derek Janssen (data results may not accurately reflect reality)
dja...@ultranet.com
Derek Janssen
>
> "Lord Craxton" <cra...@erols.com> wrote in
> news:ac9up5$91s$1...@bob.news.rcn.net:
>
> > What I mean is, from what I've heard, and the fact that MI apparently
> > can't scrape together enough of a following to get finished
> > stateside...
>
> That's more due to Viz' marketing ineptitude than MI's appeal. A release
> plan of 48 tapes at $30/tape would doom even the most popular anime series.
Which's why it'd be an easy road for Viz to use their CN ties as an excuse--
They get paid for the license, the show gets exposure, and they get a
more REALISTIC look at sampling for the correct audience brackets,
without having to pump out the expense of a single hard product.
...And "mediocre" or not, I GUARANTEE more laughs than Mission Hill.
Derek Janssen (needless to say, it lasted longer)
dja...@ultranet.com
Metlhd3138
Kevin dressed as a gangsta was funny though.
Derek Janssen
>
> Chris Sobieniak wrote:
> >
> > Obviously, CN is still serious about Mission Hill, leaving the TV-14
> > rating during the broadcast.
>
Believe this was the one pulled from WB BEFORE airing, setting the new
all-time record for "shortest prime-time slacker animated".
Derek Janssen (admittedly, that record's going to be hard to beat)
dja...@ultranet.com
Chris Sobieniak
(Ethan Hammond) wrote:
>Chris Sobieniak wrote:
>>Obviously, CN is still serious about Mission Hill,
>>leaving the TV-14 rating during the broadcast.
>Has it ever aired before today?
Nope, last night was the first episode I think.
S.t.A.n.L.e.E
> On Mon, May 20, 2002, 8:33am (EDT+4), esha...@worldnet.att.net
> (Ethan Hammond) wrote:
> >Chris Sobieniak wrote:
> >>Obviously, CN is still serious about Mission Hill,
> >>leaving the TV-14 rating during the broadcast.
> >Has it ever aired before today?
>
> Nope, last night was the first episode I think.
>
I thought I saw it before, probably WB.
Or maybe it was just the previews....
Laters. =)
Stan
--
_______ ________ _______ ____ ___ ___ ______ ______
| __|__ __| _ | \ | | | | _____| _____|
|__ | | | | _ | |\ | |___| ____|| ____|
|_______| |__| |__| |__|___| \ ___|_______|______|______|
__| | ( )
/ _ | |/ Stanlee Dometita sta...@cif.rochester.edu
| ( _| | U of Rochester cif.rochester.edu/~stanlee
\ ______| _______ ____ ___
/ \ / \ | _ | \ | |
/ \/ \| _ | |\ |
/___/\/\___|__| |__|___| \ ___|
Blade
>"Lord Craxton" <cra...@erols.com> wrote in
>news:ac9up5$91s$1...@bob.news.rcn.net:
>
>> What I mean is, from what I've heard, and the fact that MI apparently
>> can't scrape together enough of a following to get finished
>> stateside...
>
>That's more due to Viz' marketing ineptitude than MI's appeal. A release
>plan of 48 tapes at $30/tape would doom even the most popular anime series.
For instance, notice how badly Ranma 1/2 and Evangelion bombed.
OBVIOUS PROOF.
Blade
*******
Also Known As: Chris McNeil, The Annoying Jerk, The Enemy of Democracy,
"That Guy That Can't Write A Lunch Menu Without Pantyhose Tarou Being In It Somewhere"
All web pages, except my Evil Zone one, down
till further notice. Bleahh. >_<
"Oh, come on. Being printed "in English" is no reason to choose a particular spelling. If
it were, we'd all be saying "Captain Herlock."" - Trish Ledoux on the Ah!/Oh My Goddess
controversy, 14/09/93
Ethan Hammond
>
> On Mon, 20 May 2002 05:38:19 GMT, "Jorge R. Frank" <jrf...@ibm-pc.borg> wrote:
>
> >"Lord Craxton" <cra...@erols.com> wrote in
> >news:ac9up5$91s$1...@bob.news.rcn.net:
> >
> >> What I mean is, from what I've heard, and the fact that MI apparently
> >> can't scrape together enough of a following to get finished
> >> stateside...
> >
> >That's more due to Viz' marketing ineptitude than MI's appeal. A release
> >plan of 48 tapes at $30/tape would doom even the most popular anime series.
>
> For instance, notice how badly Ranma 1/2 and Evangelion bombed.
>
> OBVIOUS PROOF.
Its true!!!!
Who are you who is so wise in the ways of science?
--
All Purpose Cultural Randomness
http://www.angelfire.com/tx/apcr/index.html
Robert Hutchinson
> Jorge R. Frank wrote:
> >Lord Craxton wrote:
> >> What I mean is, from what I've heard, and the fact that MI apparently
> >> can't scrape together enough of a following to get finished
> >> stateside...
> >
> >That's more due to Viz' marketing ineptitude than MI's appeal. A release
> >plan of 48 tapes at $30/tape would doom even the most popular anime series.
>
> For instance, notice how badly Ranma 1/2 and Evangelion bombed.
>
> OBVIOUS PROOF.
All right, where are you hiding the other 70 Evangelion episodes?
--
Robert Hutchinson |
| "Butterflies are real asses."
| -- Conan O'Brien
|
deep within the bowels of aohell
is great news!! I'm really suprised that they wanted to show CB completely
unedited at first. They have a lot more guts than I thought! It does anwser
one question for me once and for all: Is anime at CN handeled by real anime
fans? From what you have said that anwser is a resounding yes. I'm espscaily
gald that they know that everybody would like to see Trigun on AS. Maybe one
day Cartoon Network will not be know as only a children's network.
-
Alan
Cowboy BeBop quotes:
"Hey Mister, this here's the stairway to heaven. You know that don't cha'?"
"Obnoxious little frog." - Spike
"Bonsai, wise guy, bath toy, water boy, light shines bright in the old town
tonight!" - Ed
MC324525
>fans?
It certainly is. And video game fans. In fact, when it comes to editing a show,
they have to know every bit of that show from front to rear (read more on
Kyle's interview on ANN). They also get to watch anime for free just to see if
it's a good show for air (only catch: they must watch the dub).
Blade
>Blade says...
>> Jorge R. Frank wrote:
>> >Lord Craxton wrote:
>> >> What I mean is, from what I've heard, and the fact that MI apparently
>> >> can't scrape together enough of a following to get finished
>> >> stateside...
>> >
>> >That's more due to Viz' marketing ineptitude than MI's appeal. A release
>> >plan of 48 tapes at $30/tape would doom even the most popular anime series.
>>
>> For instance, notice how badly Ranma 1/2 and Evangelion bombed.
>>
>> OBVIOUS PROOF.
>
>All right, where are you hiding the other 70 Evangelion episodes?
Mwah-ha. YOU'LL never know.