Do flat burr grinders produce a more consistent grind than conical?
lee berry
commercial grinders tend to use flat burrs. But this could be for achieving
greater volume while producing less heat.
I am curious because I am in the market for a grinder. I have been perfectly
happy with my first burr grinder, a cheapy made by an Italian company called
XS. It is entirely stainless steel, has a conical burr, and countless
settings. My only problem with it is that it is extraordinarily hard to
clean, and makes a racket. Also, the hopper is all cracked up from
vibration. (the hopper is obviously not stainless ;-)) Gosh it sounds like a
bomb when I put it that way.
Anyhow, some grinders that I'm looking at buying are:
Nuova Simonelli MFC (flat burr) $384 from
http://www.espressostore.com/0mcfgrinder.htm
Gaggia MDF (flat?, I dunno) $199 from
http://aabreecc.site.yahoo.net/aabreecc/gagmmburcofg.html
La Pavoni Professional (conical, they say it's better) $159 from
http://aabreecc.site.yahoo.net/aabreecc/lapavprofbur.html
And any that anyone may care to recommend. There is a bit of a range of
prices there, but if it makes a significant difference, I'll pay the extra.
I'd rather skimp on my next espresso machine. When the grind is perfect,
I've made fabulous coffee with a $200 Krups. (The story of another post)
Since I can't really test these grinders, I'd appreciate any feedback, and
I'd be more than happy to post what I learn on my quest. One of the things
that excites me about the Nuova Simonelli (apart from the cool name ;-)) is
the cast aluminium body. Even the Stainless body of my XS is flimsy, and is
the source of some much despised vibration. All the other grinders appear to
be made of plastic.
As you've probably gathered, the consistency of the grind is of paramount
importance to me, I'm even prepared to put up with a doser for a more
consistent grind. (I hate dosers, because for some reason they get in
between the grinder and my filter cup ;-))
Thanks in advance for any advice...
Lee 8^)
Umberto Bonfante
>
> My research has been unable to turn up an answer to this one. I do know that
> commercial grinders tend to use flat burrs. But this could be for achieving
> greater volume while producing less heat.
>
> I am curious because I am in the market for a grinder. I have been perfectly
> happy with my first burr grinder, a cheapy made by an Italian company called
> XS. It is entirely stainless steel, has a conical burr, and countless
> settings. My only problem with it is that it is extraordinarily hard to
> clean, and makes a racket. Also, the hopper is all cracked up from
> vibration. (the hopper is obviously not stainless ;-)) Gosh it sounds like a
> bomb when I put it that way.
Both flat and conical burr espresso grinders produce equally even
grinds. Because of their funnel-shaped blade design with larger grinding
surface and "teeth", conical burr grinders generally have motors that
spin at lower speeds than flat burr models. Therefore, they tend to
generate less heat - which can potentially affect the quality of ground
coffee after extended periods of operation - and do not require
replacement as often as flat burrs. Conical models are usually more
expensive and sell in far smaller numbers than flat grinders to
commercial foodservice operations. They make sense in locations where
large batches of coffee must be ground often. In the average bar or
restaurant, a flat burr model does just fine.
At home, where you don't grind that much coffee at a time to begin with,
both types should prove equally valid as long as the grinder built
around the blades is solid, and the "conical" or "flat" claim is, IMHO,
mostly a marketing tool designed to sell more units (in fact, some
grinders claiming to have conical burrs in their promotional material,
have actually been "caught" sporting plain-vanilla, flat burrs). If you
are concerned about the evenness of the grind, given the proper setting
either design will do an impeccable job. The question should be: for
how long? The design and sturdiness of the grinder and its housing,
hopper, and dispenser (if you need one), the range of manual adjustments
allowed by the grinding blades, even the availability of replacement
burrs (and other spare parts) should be a more important consideration
than the design of the blades.
I would also add the Rancilio Rocky to your list of candidates. It is a
very competent grinder for home use, and well within the price range you
are currently considering. Last time I opened one up, the Rocky had flat
burrs, although some of the literature around also claims it has conical
burrs (see what I mean?) Its body is made of heavy plastic, but
vibrations are minimal and, aside from a few flimsy details (lids and
base), it's a solidly built and looking grinder. Our salespeople carry
them around in their trunk for occasional, on-the-fly demos, and despite
the countless beatings they keep on ticking.
The Nuova Simonelli seems, indeed, like the heavy-duty choice among the
units you are considering. If the info on the web site is correct, the
housing and motor are identical to the ones found in countless coffee
bars, and parts are readily available through commercial dealers. But,
it costs twice as much as the others, and consider whether you can live
with its considerable bulk, too. For that much money you could buy a
couple of the capable offerings from other brands and probably be just
as happy. Do you really grind that much coffee at home?
Oh, all grinders come with plastic bean hoppers, and most do make quite
a racket when they get going...<g>, don't expect that to improve much (a
little, maybe) over your existing unit, regardless of price. Here's a
money-saving idea: if you are happy with the results produced by your
current Italian cheapy, have you considered giving it a "second wind"
with new shoes (blades) and a new hopper? You may squeeze a few more
years of great ground espresso out of it, at a fraction of the cost of a
new, glitzy unit.
--
Umberto B - Gardena, CA
Sovrana Trading Corporation
Corporate Site: http://sovrana.com
Online Store: http://st1.yahoo.com/sovrana
Email: umb...@sovrana.com
Phone/Fax: (310) 323-3357 / 217-1832
Umberto Bonfante
> (...)
>
> The Nuova Simonelli seems, indeed, like the heavy-duty choice among the
> units you are considering. If the info on the web site is correct, the
> housing and motor are identical to the ones found in countless coffee
> bars, and parts are readily available through commercial dealers. But,
> it costs twice as much as the others, and consider whether you can live
> with its considerable bulk, too. For that much money you could buy a
> couple of the capable offerings from other brands and probably be just
> as happy. Do you really grind that much coffee at home?
>
> Oh, all grinders come with plastic bean hoppers, and most do make quite
> a racket when they get going...<g>, don't expect that to improve much (a
> little, maybe) over your existing unit, regardless of price. Here's a
> money-saving idea: if you are happy with the results produced by your
> current Italian cheapy, have you considered giving it a "second wind"
> with new shoes (blades) and a new hopper? You may squeeze a few more
> years of great ground espresso out of it, at a fraction of the cost of a
> new, glitzy unit.
>
Blah, blah, blah... what the heck? After re-reading my reply, I thought
I was browsing an issue of Consumer Reports... hey, it's your money. If
you can afford it, by all means buy the Simonelli and toss the cheapy!
<VBG>
Kirt Thomas
<l...@airNOnet-gloBOTSbal.com> wrote:
> My research has been unable to turn up an answer to this one. I do know that
> commercial grinders tend to use flat burrs. But this could be for achieving
> greater volume while producing less heat.
> Anyhow, some grinders that I'm looking at buying are:
>
> Nuova Simonelli MFC (flat burr) $384 from
> http://www.espressostore.com/0mcfgrinder.htm
>
> Gaggia MDF (flat?, I dunno) $199 from
> http://aabreecc.site.yahoo.net/aabreecc/gagmmburcofg.html
>
> La Pavoni Professional (conical, they say it's better) $159 from
> http://aabreecc.site.yahoo.net/aabreecc/lapavprofbur.html
I'd add to this list the Rancilio Rocky (@ $200 US), a fairly quiet
machine with flat burrs. I'll agree with your analisys vis a vis grind -
I mainly use a Krups Novo 3000, I like the machine, and it is all in the
grind :) As a side note, because of the portafilter architecture, I'd say
it's nearly impossible to pull a good single shot from this machine, but
it does great doubles.
I'm not sure what the Simonelli has over the Gaggia or the Rancilio - (I
have no experience with the La Pavoni).
--
ki...@sky.net ICQ 16135841
ki...@nownder.com http://www.nowonder.com
-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^-^
PGP Public Key at: http://pgpkeys.mit.edu:11371
David A. Ross
>I would also add the Rancilio Rocky to your list of candidates.
[...snip...]
>Its body is made of heavy plastic, but
Some paint has chipped off the base of my Rocky, and the exposed
material is definitely metal, according to my ohmmeter - this is the
corner of the white part near the switch, of course all the black
parts are plastic and it is not impossible that the exposed bit is
part of a brace and that the rest of the white is plastic as well.
- David R.
lee berry
to look out for. However I might take Umberto's advice and try to obtain a
hopper for my XS grinder. It produces an excellent grind, and while it's a
bit noisy, hard to clean, and very messy, I think I may have just described
all coffee grinders.
I have no Idea where I might obtain a hopper... I bought it in Australia
from a coffee shop that imported it themselves. I'm living in Washington
state now and have had no luck tracking down an importer.
Is it just my imagination, or are there not many Italian companies on the
web?
Thanks again everybody,
Lee
Larry Larson
news:Mw0n3.701$sA.3...@monger.newsread.com...
...
> It produces an excellent grind, and while it's a
> bit noisy, hard to clean, and very messy, I think I may have just
described
> all coffee grinders.
Not all. For some of us fanatical types with more disposable income than
sense, a commercial grinder can be extremely quiet, very very consistent,
and perfectly repeatable. I blew big bucks on a Ditting, and have never
regretted it -- even the recommended grind settings on the
numerically-calibrated dial are right on the mark for paper filters and
espresso.
-- Larry