Yesdirt

Steven Sullivan

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Apr 16, 2002, 2:37:55 PM4/16/02

to

According to a fellow on Southside, who has connections to the Chicago
tour promotion business 9and hwose name is not HAGRID), one thing that is
currently holding up tour annoucnements is that Yes is asking for more
money from promoters to tour with Wakeman, than they did for touring with
an orchestra (he says they asked $20K per gig for that).

--

-S.
"Get real, you lazy, stupid,skeptic. The truth is the obvious: Sullivan
is anti-christ just because it's his job." - Chet Klock

MRasicci

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Apr 16, 2002, 3:05:40 PM4/16/02

to

>From: Steven Sullivan

>According to a fellow on Southside, who has connections to the Chicago
>tour promotion business 9and hwose name is not HAGRID), one thing that is
>currently holding up tour annoucnements is that Yes is asking for more
>money from promoters to tour with Wakeman, than they did for touring with
>an orchestra (he says they asked $20K per gig for that).
>

Hey Steven,

That guy posted to another list. From what I got out of it was that the $20K
fee was just for orchestra. Maybe that's what your saying too. Basically Yes
with Wakeman are now asking more than total of last years fee of Yes plus
orchestra combined. So Yes with Wakeman fee this year is more than Yes with
orchestra fee last year. Chicago promoter doesn't feel Yes with Wakeman will
draw more fans than last year. He says another promoter will probably pick it
up if this one passes.

MARK

MRasicci

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Apr 16, 2002, 3:31:43 PM4/16/02

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>From: mras...@aol.com (MRasicci)

>Chicago promoter doesn't feel Yes with Wakeman will
>draw more fans than last year. He says another promoter will probably pick it
>up if this one passes.
>

I forgot to add my main point for posting.
I'll bet the promoters will be asking higher prices for tickets so I don't
think Yes is out of line asking for more jack.

MARK

dan

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Apr 16, 2002, 3:46:23 PM4/16/02

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I don't know about that....

Tickets at the Hollywood Bowl for Symphonic tour were $90. Upcoming shows at
Universal are $75. Another YES show - PRICELESS!

Steven Sullivan

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Apr 16, 2002, 3:47:43 PM4/16/02

to

MRasicci <mras...@aol.com> wrote:
:>From: Steven Sullivan

:>According to a fellow on Southside, who has connections to the Chicago
:>tour promotion business 9and hwose name is not HAGRID), one thing that is
:>currently holding up tour annoucnements is that Yes is asking for more
:>money from promoters to tour with Wakeman, than they did for touring with
:>an orchestra (he says they asked $20K per gig for that).
:>
:
: Hey Steven,

: That guy posted to another list. From what I got out of it was that the $20K
: fee was just for orchestra. Maybe that's what your saying too. Basically Yes
: with Wakeman are now asking more than total of last years fee of Yes plus
: orchestra combined.

Yes, that's what I meant. the fee payed last year ($20K /gig) was for Yes
+ orchestra. Yes want more than that this year, for Yes + Wakeman.
It's giving at least one promoter pause.

MRasicci

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Apr 16, 2002, 4:27:45 PM4/16/02

to

>> I forgot to add my main point for posting.
>> I'll bet the promoters will be asking higher prices for tickets so I don't
>> think Yes is out of line asking for more jack.
>>
>> MARK

>From: dan da...@yahoo.com

>I don't know about that....
>
>Tickets at the Hollywood Bowl for Symphonic tour were $90. Upcoming shows at
>Universal are $75. Another YES show - PRICELESS!

Well, that's cool, prices going down.
I bet on Rams in Superbowl, so what do I know.

MARK

She Devil With A Rubber Chicken

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Apr 16, 2002, 4:34:17 PM4/16/02

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In article <20020416153143...@mb-md.aol.com>,

Neither do I, especially after the lack of promotion the CD got.

Theus

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Apr 16, 2002, 6:27:25 PM4/16/02

to

"Steven Sullivan" <sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu> wrote in message
news:7c_u8.2637$hi5....@grover.nit.gwu.edu...

> According to a fellow on Southside, who has connections to the Chicago
> tour promotion business 9and hwose name is not HAGRID), one thing that is
> currently holding up tour annoucnements is that Yes is asking for more
> money from promoters to tour with Wakeman, than they did for touring with
> an orchestra (he says they asked $20K per gig for that).
>

So Wakeman costs more than an entire orchestra? He must be trying to
make some money after his unfortunate divorce.

--
Michael E.J. Smith

Kevin Caffrey

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Apr 16, 2002, 6:54:39 PM4/16/02

to

>Subject: Yesdirt
>From: Steven Sullivan sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu

>
>According to a fellow on Southside, who has connections to the Chicago
>tour promotion business 9and hwose name is not HAGRID), one thing that is
>currently holding up tour annoucnements is that Yes is asking for more
>money from promoters to tour with Wakeman, than they did for touring with
>an orchestra (he says they asked $20K per gig for that).

Yikes.

They must plan on calling this the "Still Out of Touch Tour."

Kevin
http://members.aol.com/kevincaffrey

Henry Potts

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Apr 16, 2002, 7:49:39 PM4/16/02

to

Steven Sullivan <sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu> wrote [...]

>Yes, that's what I meant. the fee payed last year ($20K /gig) was for Yes
>+ orchestra. Yes want more than that this year, for Yes + Wakeman.
>It's giving at least one promoter pause.

Of course, if none of the promoters paused, Yes would be selling
themselves cheap. Then again, if the promoters all pause and then stop,
Yes have over-priced themselves. (I guess this observation wouldn't get
me that far as a band manager...)
--
Henry

Yes and Yes members news: <http://www.bondegezou.demon.co.uk/wh_now.htm>

DannyOb343

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Apr 16, 2002, 9:25:37 PM4/16/02

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$20K? I'd pay that for a private concert.

Theus

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Apr 16, 2002, 9:28:41 PM4/16/02

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"DannyOb343" <danny...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020416212537...@mb-cg.aol.com...

> $20K? I'd pay that for a private concert.

You'll be hearing from Yes management shortly, I'm sure.

--
Michael E.J. Smith

KMCPro615

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Apr 16, 2002, 10:01:28 PM4/16/02

to

>That guy posted to another list.

That guy is me.....my point is that if you are the promoter and the band that
didn't sell out a medium sized auditorium last year is asking for a raise,
wouldn't you be skeptical about risking your money on re-booking them?

Under normal circumstances we would already know what's up with summer dates.
My theory is that perhaps this is a tougher sell than Yes and it's management
in it's infinite wisdom had counted upon.

On the other hand...if I'm Rick Wakeman, I'm glad I didn't give up my day
job....

Kurt Michaels

Nic Caciappo

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Apr 16, 2002, 10:15:00 PM4/16/02

to

Steven Sullivan wrote:

> According to a fellow on Southside, who has connections to the Chicago
> tour promotion business 9and hwose name is not HAGRID), one thing that is
> currently holding up tour annoucnements is that Yes is asking for more
> money from promoters to tour with Wakeman, than they did for touring with
> an orchestra (he says they asked $20K per gig for that).

That's all? I am surprised that is all Yes wants for a fee. Heck, I should
book them!

Nic

KMCPro615

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Apr 16, 2002, 10:33:17 PM4/16/02

to

>That's all? I am surprised that is all Yes wants for a fee. Heck, I should
>book them!

No...that was not Yes' fee. That's how much it cost to contract the orchestral
players for the night. My understanding is that Yes' fee is considerably higher
than that.

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Apr 16, 2002, 11:22:11 PM4/16/02

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Theus <mejs...@sympatico.ca> wrote in article
<ed4v8.9740$132.1...@news20.bellglobal.com>...

| "DannyOb343" <danny...@aol.com> wrote in message
| news:20020416212537...@mb-cg.aol.com...
| > $20K? I'd pay that for a private concert.
|
| You'll be hearing from Yes management shortly, I'm sure.

Everyone here could chip in. Who has a *really* big living room?

--
gmelin

The end move in politics is to pick up a gun.
-- Buckminster Fuller

Ron Federico

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Apr 17, 2002, 12:07:51 AM4/17/02

to

I do and I already have a Baby Grand there and a Roland Electronic drum kit
I could move from the den. 20k is really dirt cheap! Wedding bands cost
about that now don't they?
"gmelin" <gme...@earthlinkNOSPAM.net> wrote in message
news:01c1e5be$f45d80c0$9ff9fc9e@computer...

MRasicci

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Apr 17, 2002, 12:16:28 AM4/17/02

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>From: kmcp...@aol.com

>>That guy posted to another list.
>
>That guy is me...

Kurt, that's you! Just to set the record straight. The $20K was just for
orchestra and not part of Yes' fee.

>my point is that if you are the promoter and the band that
>didn't sell out a medium sized auditorium last year is asking for a raise,
>wouldn't you be skeptical about risking your money on re-booking them?

That would be a big concern, for sure.

MARK

Ron Federico

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Apr 17, 2002, 12:36:18 AM4/17/02

to

I think the reason is, that they have to pay Rick 1k per song that he don't
like to play and 5k per TFTO song. The only ones he's willing to play for
scale are from Fragile, CTTE and GFTO. He's bringing Adam for The Yes Album
Stuff. He's offered to let Alan play his keyboards for Mag songs only if
Tony Fernandez can play Drums!

Of course he will give all the money back if he can Produce the next Yes CD
and is aloud to remix TORMATO!

"Henry Potts" <he...@REMOVETOEMAILbondegezou.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:TJ2ltOBT...@bondegezou.demon.co.uk...

Theus

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Apr 17, 2002, 7:27:24 AM4/17/02

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"gmelin" <gme...@earthlinkNOSPAM.net> wrote in message
news:01c1e5be$f45d80c0$9ff9fc9e@computer...
>
>

> Theus <mejs...@sympatico.ca> wrote in article
> <ed4v8.9740$132.1...@news20.bellglobal.com>...
> | "DannyOb343" <danny...@aol.com> wrote in message
> | news:20020416212537...@mb-cg.aol.com...
> | > $20K? I'd pay that for a private concert.
> |
> | You'll be hearing from Yes management shortly, I'm sure.
>
> Everyone here could chip in. Who has a *really* big living room?
>

Who has a big backyard. We can have Yes and a BBQ.

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Apr 17, 2002, 11:46:19 AM4/17/02

to

reds...@liii.com (She Devil With A Rubber Chicken) writes:

[Backyard BBQ-party]:

|
| We could invite them, and not the management or the record companies,
| and give them the money directly. ;-7
|

No way! Jon would claim he should have at least 70% of the money since he is
the lead singer. Chris would claim at least 80% since he has kept the band
alive all these years. Steve would claim that it wouldn't sound like Yes
without him, so he should have the majority of the money. Finally, Alan would
claim he wrote most of the themes in the songs, so he should at least get 40%,
but since he's such a nice guy he could satisfy with 35%.

You wanna take that responsibility? ;)

Besides, it all would end up with Rick running off with all of the money
since he's just a hired hand.....

--
-Elf-
NEW MAIL: e...@elfworld.org URL: http://www.mo.himolde.no/~elf/ IRC: Elf/Alv

Linux user: "Ok, the GUI sucks, but see how fast and reliable it is?"
Windows user: "It hasn't crashed since yesterday!"
Mac-user: "Look, how it matches the furniture!"

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Apr 17, 2002, 12:57:27 PM4/17/02

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Steven Sullivan <sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu> wrote in article
<gJhv8.2669$hi5....@grover.nit.gwu.edu>...

| There's a guy here who says he'd pay them $20 K for a private
| show...someone should contact Left Bank.
|
|
| (Hey--would 20 of us here put up 1K for a show? 40 of us put up $500?)

This has already been discussed at length here (jokingly, of course).
Aren't you the one who gets all pissy when someone brings up a subject you
have already opined on? Perhaps if you didn't have everyone in your
killfile you'd be able to keep up.

Paul Goodwin

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Apr 17, 2002, 12:59:02 PM4/17/02

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"Steven Sullivan" <sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu> wrote in message
news:gJhv8.2669$hi5....@grover.nit.gwu.edu...

> >
>
> (Hey--would 20 of us here put up 1K for a show? 40 of us put up $500?)
>

A private Yesshow for 20 people? Yeah I'd put up a grand for that in a
heartbeat.

2 grand if I get to be a backing vocalist too hehe ;-)

--

Paul

YESONGS

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Apr 17, 2002, 1:02:21 PM4/17/02

to

>Subject: Re: Yesdirt
>From: Steven Sullivan sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu

>(Hey--would 20 of us here put up 1K for a show?

Can we pick the setlist?

Taping allowed?

:)

Eddie

She Devil With A Rubber Chicken

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Apr 17, 2002, 1:47:21 PM4/17/02

to

In article <sdu1qam...@yme.mo.himolde.no>,

Hogne B. Pettersen <e...@elfworld.org> wrote:
>reds...@liii.com (She Devil With A Rubber Chicken) writes:
>
>[Backyard BBQ-party]:
>|
>| We could invite them, and not the management or the record companies,
>| and give them the money directly. ;-7
>|
>
>No way! Jon would claim he should have at least 70% of the money since he is
>the lead singer. Chris would claim at least 80% since he has kept the band
>alive all these years. Steve would claim that it wouldn't sound like Yes
>without him, so he should have the majority of the money. Finally, Alan would
>claim he wrote most of the themes in the songs, so he should at least get 40%,
>but since he's such a nice guy he could satisfy with 35%.
>
>You wanna take that responsibility? ;)

Sure! I'll set up a portable above ground pool about 10 feet in diameter.
I'll fill it with chocolate pudding. I will issue all the band members
little tiger striped bikinis. Then I'll sell tickets. Winner gets the
pot. :D

(This negotiation shit is serious buisness, you know...)

Robert Dubnicka

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Apr 17, 2002, 1:59:46 PM4/17/02

to

Steven Sullivan wrote:
>
> KMCPro615 <kmcp...@aol.com> wrote:
> :>That guy posted to another list.
>
> : That guy is me.....my point is that if you are the promoter and the band that
> : didn't sell out a medium sized auditorium last year is asking for a raise,
> : wouldn't you be skeptical about risking your money on re-booking them?
>
> There's a guy here who says he'd pay them $20 K for a private
> show...someone should contact Left Bank.
>
> (Hey--would 20 of us here put up 1K for a show? 40 of us put up $500?)
>

I'm in.

MRasicci

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Apr 17, 2002, 2:29:37 PM4/17/02

to

>From: yes...@aol.com (YESONGS)

>>Subject: Re: Yesdirt
>>From: Steven Sullivan sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu
>
>>(Hey--would 20 of us here put up 1K for a show?
>
>Can we pick the setlist?
>

That'd be way cool, Eddie. I think the price would really go way up considering
they'd have to rehearse a lot of songs not on their normal setlist.

MARK

Cherie

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Apr 17, 2002, 2:40:50 PM4/17/02

to

Go for the gold- take over the lead vocals! ;-)

(Hey, do you sing any Metallica tunes?)

Exit light.........Enter Niiiiiight
Taaaaaaake my hand, 'roff to never-never land...........

~Cherie
<a href="http://www.portraitsofanimals.com">Pet Portraits by Cherie</a>
<a href="http://www.petslates.com">Personalized Pet Slates</a>

Cherie

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Apr 17, 2002, 2:43:45 PM4/17/02

to

> > Who has a big backyard. We can have Yes and a BBQ.
>
> We could invite them, and not the management or the record companies,
> and give them the money directly. ;-7
>
> We could always invite management and record company execs for a good
>old fashioned sacrificial burning.

I'll bring my George Foreman Grill ;-)

Paul Goodwin

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Apr 17, 2002, 2:59:56 PM4/17/02

to

"Cherie" <summ...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020417144345...@mb-cu.aol.com...

> > I'll bring my George Foreman Grill ;-)
>

I was looking at one of those on the weekend at Wal-Mart, are they any good?
How do burgers turn out, pan fried taste or charbroiled?

--

Paul

Jeff Troutman

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Apr 17, 2002, 2:51:10 PM4/17/02

to

"Steven Sullivan" <sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu> wrote:
>
> There's a guy here who says he'd pay them $20 K for a private
> show...someone should contact Left Bank.
>
>
> (Hey--would 20 of us here put up 1K for a show? 40 of us put up $500?)
>
>

I'd go in on it.

Jeff Troutman

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Apr 17, 2002, 2:52:29 PM4/17/02

to

I think that if we're paying for it, we could probably get that in the
contract.

Could 20 of us agree on a setlist?

Jeff Troutman

gmelin

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Apr 17, 2002, 3:15:06 PM4/17/02

to

Jeff Troutman <yourhe...@starpower.net> wrote in article
<a9kgse$blv$1...@bob.news.rcn.net>...

Er. . . so much for that plan.

michael burg

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Apr 17, 2002, 3:19:54 PM4/17/02

to

I'll put in $5000.00

Zorknapp

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Apr 17, 2002, 4:27:48 PM4/17/02

to

>From: Steven Sullivan sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu
>Date: 4/17/02 12:50 PM Eastern Daylight Time
>Message-id: <gJhv8.2669$hi5....@grover.nit.gwu.edu>

>
>KMCPro615 <kmcp...@aol.com> wrote:
>:>That guy posted to another list.
>
>: That guy is me.....my point is that if you are the promoter and the band
>that
>: didn't sell out a medium sized auditorium last year is asking for a raise,
>: wouldn't you be skeptical about risking your money on re-booking them?
>
>
>There's a guy here who says he'd pay them $20 K for a private
>show...someone should contact Left Bank.
>
>
>(Hey--would 20 of us here put up 1K for a show? 40 of us put up $500?)

That's getting awful close to Patrick Moraz's "Will Play for Food" tour a few
years back...

But sure, I'd pony up the cash for a small private concert with some other
people.

Could we have veto power over the 40 people? :)

Mike

Steven Sullivan

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Apr 17, 2002, 4:38:47 PM4/17/02

to

Zorknapp <zork...@aol.com> wrote:
:>From: Steven Sullivan sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu

:>Date: 4/17/02 12:50 PM Eastern Daylight Time
:>Message-id: <gJhv8.2669$hi5....@grover.nit.gwu.edu>
:>
:>KMCPro615 <kmcp...@aol.com> wrote:
:>:>That guy posted to another list.
:>
:>: That guy is me.....my point is that if you are the promoter and the band
:>that
:>: didn't sell out a medium sized auditorium last year is asking for a raise,
:>: wouldn't you be skeptical about risking your money on re-booking them?
:>
:>
:>There's a guy here who says he'd pay them $20 K for a private
:>show...someone should contact Left Bank.
:>
:>
:>(Hey--would 20 of us here put up 1K for a show? 40 of us put up $500?)
:
: That's getting awful close to Patrick Moraz's "Will Play for Food" tour a few
: years back...

Actually, it's a little known fact (though it has been publicized in
People magazine) that major stars do play private shows if the money is
right. Corporations have hired people like Bob Dylan and Sheryl Crow; I
read last year about a guy who had N'Sync (or was it hte Backstreet
Boyz?) at his kid's bar mitvah.

Nonny

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Apr 17, 2002, 5:15:00 PM4/17/02

to

Jeff Troutman writes:

<< Could 20 of us agree on a setlist? >>

No. We'd just have to make them play their entire catalog!

--
A. Nonny-Muss
Iron Chef Vegetarian
~
The Yes Chronicles
www.geocities.com/blackfedora3/yeshome.html
~

Peace through liberty
www.libertarians4peace.net

ShorThing7

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Apr 17, 2002, 5:22:14 PM4/17/02

to

>The left Bank.

The name alone destroys any optimism. Sounds like the liberal wing of the
Israeli people who wish Arafat would just stop it! or the bank that will use
you interest for govt programs

She Devil With A Rubber Chicken

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Apr 17, 2002, 5:35:08 PM4/17/02

to

In article <a9kglu$42ugp$1...@ID-46095.news.dfncis.de>,

These things *rock*. We get great results with ours. They turn out way
tasty. Don't taste fried, closer to broiled but without the char. You
won't get any kind of a smoked flavor, on the other hand it really does
get a lot of the fat off the meat. I got some German-cut steaks (cut
about 2 inches thick) and they came out perfectly medium rare. It's a
lot easier to clean than a regular grill, too.

She Devil With A Rubber Chicken

unread,

Apr 17, 2002, 5:37:03 PM4/17/02

to

In article <01c1e644$0c438240$75f9fc9e@computer>,

NQ!

Paul Goodwin

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Apr 17, 2002, 5:55:34 PM4/17/02

to

"She Devil With A Rubber Chicken" <reds...@liii.com> wrote in message
news:a9kpqc$q1j$1...@eri0.s8.isp.nyc.eggn.net...

> In article <a9kglu$42ugp$1...@ID-46095.news.dfncis.de>,
> Paul Goodwin <pgoodwin2N...@cogeco.ca> wrote:
> >
> >"Cherie" <summ...@aol.com> wrote in message
> >news:20020417144345...@mb-cu.aol.com...
> >> > I'll bring my George Foreman Grill ;-)
> >
> >I was looking at one of those on the weekend at Wal-Mart, are they any
good?
> >How do burgers turn out, pan fried taste or charbroiled?
>
> These things *rock*. We get great results with ours. They turn out way
> tasty. Don't taste fried, closer to broiled but without the char. You
> won't get any kind of a smoked flavor, on the other hand it really does
> get a lot of the fat off the meat. I got some German-cut steaks (cut
> about 2 inches thick) and they came out perfectly medium rare. It's a
> lot easier to clean than a regular grill, too.

I'm sold. It'll fit right in with the popcorn popper, waffle maker, sandwich
maker, toaster oven, toaster, can opener, juice machine & bag maker/sealer.
My counter top looks like Jennifers on WKRP lol ;-)

--

Paul

Tom Russell

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Apr 17, 2002, 6:18:42 PM4/17/02

to

That must be it. Howe is technically incapable of playing Rabins stuff.

What Ever!

third...@aol.complexity (Nonny) wrote in message news:<20020417093226...@mb-fo.aol.com>...
>
> ...or, easier=able to play.

>
>
>
>
> --
> A. Nonny-Muss
> Iron Chef Vegetarian
> ~
> The Yes Chronicles
> www.geocities.com/blackfedora3/yeshome.html
> ~

> Peace is patriotic!
> www.libertarians4peace.net

Theus

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Apr 17, 2002, 6:38:55 PM4/17/02

to

"gmelin" <gme...@earthlinkNOSPAM.net> wrote in message
news:01c1e623$fc4049c0$12f8fc9e@computer...
>
>
> Theus <mejs...@sympatico.ca> wrote in article
> <y_cv8.11122$5J3.1...@news20.bellglobal.com>...
> | > | You'll be hearing from Yes management shortly, I'm sure.
> | >
> | > Everyone here could chip in. Who has a *really* big living room?

> | >
> | Who has a big backyard. We can have Yes and a BBQ.
>

> Make sure the sign doesn't say "BBQ and Yes." And Yes gets the bigger
> dressing room.
>
Also Squire has stipulated that he gets unlimited runs at the buffet.

--
Michael E.J. Smith

Hagrid

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Apr 17, 2002, 7:53:44 PM4/17/02

to

"gmelin" <gme...@earthlinkNOSPAM.net> wrote in message news:<01c1e630$d25fd8c0$12f8fc9e@computer>...

> Steven Sullivan <sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu> wrote in article
> <gJhv8.2669$hi5....@grover.nit.gwu.edu>...
> | There's a guy here who says he'd pay them $20 K for a private
> | show...someone should contact Left Bank.
> |
> |
> | (Hey--would 20 of us here put up 1K for a show? 40 of us put up $500?)
>
> This has already been discussed at length here (jokingly, of course).
> Aren't you the one who gets all pissy when someone brings up a subject you
> have already opined on? Perhaps if you didn't have everyone in your
> killfile you'd be able to keep up.

HILARIOUSLY FUNNY ...AND SO TRUE OF THAT PERSON...

DannyOb343

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Apr 17, 2002, 8:48:04 PM4/17/02

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>2 grand if I get to be a backing vocalist too hehe ;-)

I was the one. But I think Yes would pay me $2K not sing backup!!!!!!

DannyOb343

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Apr 17, 2002, 8:57:46 PM4/17/02

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We might have a deal!

>I'll split it with you ;->
>
>TM

Nonny

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Apr 18, 2002, 9:42:46 AM4/18/02

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Tom Russell writes:

<<
That must be it. Howe is technically incapable of playing Rabins stuff.
>>

Look, I think Howe was *awesome* in his prime, and just brilliant in his
versatility and creativity that was so key in developing the Classic Yes sound
we all love so much. But his playing these days is not just unimaginative, it's
slower and it's a LOT sloppier. Listening to his work on the live "Gates" from
the bonus _Mag_ CD, just as one example, is cringe-inducing. So yes, I *do*
think Howe is technically incapable of playing Rabin's stuff, because he can't
even play a lot of his *own* stuff very well anymore.

That said, I thought Howe did a great job on _Mag_, because for once he didn't
try to play beyond his current limitations (*and* didn't try to crowd everyone
else out), and he actually came up with some very pleasant-sounding, fresh, and
*listenable* material for the first time in a very long time.

And no, I am not gmelin's twin brother. :-)

--
A. Nonny-Muss
Iron Chef Vegetarian
~
The Yes Chronicles
www.geocities.com/blackfedora3/yeshome.html
~

Peace through liberty
www.libertarians4peace.net

Tom Russell

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Apr 18, 2002, 2:12:58 PM4/18/02

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I'll be the first to admit that Howe is not the player he used to be.
Let me rephrase that. He is not the *artist* he used to be. Why, I'm
not sure. I for one think he still has the chops. I'm not sure he has
the desire.

He certainly doesn't have any desire to play Rabins parts. Stuck up
bastard that he is.

TWR

third...@aol.complexity (Nonny) wrote in message news:<20020418094246...@mb-mq.aol.com>...

HRMMGY

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Apr 18, 2002, 5:49:07 PM4/18/02

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Asking Howe to play rabins parts is like asking Bruford to play like Tommie
lee--or Picasso to draw like peter max---Why would he want to do something like
that? It's silly--besides on the Ladder tour what purpose did billy's 200
pounds of flesh have --if not to play rabins "solos"?? Howe is still God and
his gorgeous,versatile playing on Mag is proof of that-rabin is and will always
be an "also ran" in rock guitar history-MM

Zorknapp

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Apr 18, 2002, 5:52:42 PM4/18/02

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>From: Steven Sullivan sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu
>Date: 4/17/02 4:38 PM Eastern Daylight Time
>Message-id: <r3lv8.2675$hi5....@grover.nit.gwu.edu>

>
>Zorknapp <zork...@aol.com> wrote:
>:>From: Steven Sullivan sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu
>:>Date: 4/17/02 12:50 PM Eastern Daylight Time
>:>Message-id: <gJhv8.2669$hi5....@grover.nit.gwu.edu>
>:>
>:>KMCPro615 <kmcp...@aol.com> wrote:
>:>:>That guy posted to another list.
>:>
>:>: That guy is me.....my point is that if you are the promoter and the band
>:>that
>:>: didn't sell out a medium sized auditorium last year is asking for a
>raise,
>:>: wouldn't you be skeptical about risking your money on re-booking them?
>:>
>:>
>:>There's a guy here who says he'd pay them $20 K for a private
>:>show...someone should contact Left Bank.
>:>
>:>
>:>(Hey--would 20 of us here put up 1K for a show? 40 of us put up $500?)
>:
>: That's getting awful close to Patrick Moraz's "Will Play for Food" tour a
>few
>: years back...
>
>
>Actually, it's a little known fact (though it has been publicized in
>People magazine) that major stars do play private shows if the money is
>right. Corporations have hired people like Bob Dylan and Sheryl Crow; I
>read last year about a guy who had N'Sync (or was it hte Backstreet
>Boyz?) at his kid's bar mitvah.

I know the N'Sync thing is right, because if my memory is serving me right, my
brother was at that bar mitvah.

I think it was one of the guys who owns AOL.

Mike

Nonny

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Apr 19, 2002, 12:46:26 PM4/19/02

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HRMMGY writes:

<< Asking Howe to play rabins parts is like asking Bruford to play like Tommie

lee--or Picasso to draw like peter max--- Why would he want to do something
like
that? >>

Oh, I don't know. Maybe to be a bit of a "team player"? And the fact remains
that SH probably *cannot* play many of TR's parts.

<<It's silly--besides on the Ladder tour what purpose did billy's 200
pounds of flesh have --if not to play rabins "solos"?? Howe is still God>>

Hoo, boy.

<<and
his gorgeous,versatile playing on Mag is proof of that -rabin is and will

always
be an "also ran" in rock guitar history >>

Well, in all honesty, I don't think either Rabin or Howe will be remembered in
the long run, by the arbiters of such things, as among the "greatest"
guitarists in rock history. Still, I like a lot of what they both do and
*dislike* a lot of what they both do. They each brought something different to
the Yes pallette--TR brought technical precision and flash; SH brought artistry
and versatility. TR will never be able to play with SH's artistic heart and
soul, nor will SH ever be able to shred like TR. Doesn't make either one of
them a lesser guitarist in my eyes (but if you want to delve into which is a
nicer *person,* all bets are off).

So why *was* Billy there on the _Ladder_ tour? In part, it was just as you
suggest--to play Rabin's stuff. Why? Well, SH can go on all he wants about not
*wanting* to play TR's parts, but the likely reality is that he simply *cannot*
play something like the "OoaLH" guitar solo. He just doesn't possess the
dexterity to do it, at least not anymore, if he ever did.

As I've stated before, this is why I like SH's work on _Mag_ so much--it's
precisely *because* he doesn't try to play anything that he can't play...and
that hasn't been the case on other recent Yes albums, where he tries to be
SH-in-his-prime but just comes off sounding forced, behind-the-beat, brittle,
and sloppy.

With the possible exception of Chris, I think *everybody* in the band has lost
a little of their abilities--or at least their edge--and that's understandable
at their ages. The difference between them and SH is that they realize their
limitations and don't try to play or sing beyond them. SH, with _Mag_, seems to
have *just* figured this out.

Steven Sullivan

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Apr 19, 2002, 2:09:49 PM4/19/02

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Nonny <third...@aol.complexity> wrote:
: Well, in all honesty, I don't think either Rabin or Howe will be remembered in

: the long run, by the arbiters of such things, as among the "greatest"
: guitarists in rock history.

But Howe has a hell of a better shot at it than Rabin.

Theus

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Apr 19, 2002, 11:54:07 PM4/19/02

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"Steven Sullivan" <sull...@gwis2.circ.gwu.edu> wrote in message
news:N3Zv8.2783$hi5....@grover.nit.gwu.edu...

> Nonny <third...@aol.complexity> wrote:
> : Well, in all honesty, I don't think either Rabin or Howe will be
remembered in
> : the long run, by the arbiters of such things, as among the "greatest"
> : guitarists in rock history.
>
> But Howe has a hell of a better shot at it than Rabin.
>

NQ

--
Michael E.J. Smith

Zen Cat36

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May 5, 2002, 3:26:38 PM5/5/02

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<<>The left Bank.

The name alone destroys any optimism.>>

You've never been to Paris Shorthing? The Left Bank is a beautiful, romantic
area near the Seine.. full of bookshops that sell Shakespearean manuscripts,
artisan booths, and bakeries that make raspberry tarts. Try it sometime!

Zen Cat36

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May 5, 2002, 3:27:42 PM5/5/02

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<< I especially liked Howe's respectful comments about Peter Banks, that he
found it easier (=more enjoyable) to play Banks' stuff.<<

Like Mozart describing Salieri..