Four Questions for "Anton" Huber (Round 3)
Ken McVay OBC
Archive/File: pub/people/h/huber.a/huber-10q
First-published: 1996/03/21
Last-Modified: 1996/04/08
Mr. Huber, during the course of your journey through the
sewers of digital messaging, you have provided a number of
frauds, insults, deceits and outright lies, all aimed at
defaming Jewish people.
Now that I have clearly and unequivocably called you a blatant
liar, you can prove me wrong by answering the following
questions. In the event you suffer from memory failures, I
will be considerate enough to continue to republish these
questions from time to time so that you will not be denied the
fair and public opportunity to respond, and clear your, er,
good name.
Perhaps Prodigy users will be kind enough to post this series
of questions to your favourite Prodigy discussion groups, so
that you will be certain to see them, and internet users will
forward them to aard...@ios.com as well.
Question 1
---------------------
On January 29, 1996, you made the following statement:
"We have long known that the WIESENTHAL center for pagan
studies has doctored so-called holocaust pictures. Go to
the so-called holocaust museum in DC & they'll show you
thousands of smelly shoes of so-called victims. Makes you
wonder, though, how so-called victims had shoes & sneakers
made in China in 1955......." (Huber, Air Photos)
Although you have been asked to provide proof that the
Simon Wiesenthal Center has doctored Holocaust pictures,
you have failed to do so. Not surprisingly, although you
were also asked to provide proof that the United
States Holocaust Memorial Museum included shoes made in
China in 1955 as evidence of the Holocaust, you have shown
yourself either unwilling or unable to do so.
(I toured the USHMM on March 26, 1996, and inspected the
display of shoes from Maidanek. Alas, I was unable to
determine where these "Chinese shoes and sneakers" are.
The Museum, however, provides a photograph of these
shoes, so perhaps you will examine it and circle those
shoes which came from China, so I can locate them.)
Please demonstrate that you are not a fraud and a liar,
and prove that your assertions are true, or admit, here
and now, that you are a liar, and retract them.
Question 2
----------
On February 1, 1996, you refered to the Holocaust as
"alleged:"
"No sooner does someone deny the alleged holocaust,
than you label them as dispassionate & disinterested."
(Huber, Gas Chambers, Feb. 1)
In response to the following query:
"Can those of you who deny the Holocaust explain
where the Jews of Eastern Europe went?"
You replied:
"They have been known to wander, hence the term 'Wandering
j*w'. Also the term from inbreeding , known as wandering eye."
(Huber, 27th Question)
One day later, you commented about "another holocaust,"
which suggests that you do, in fact, believe the historical
record, (Huber, Air Photos, Feb. 5) and you also speak
of the Holocaust as historical reality in your exchanges
on Prodigy (See huber.0295).
You seem confused about the Holocaust, denying it on
one day, and affirming it on the next. Please explain
this seeming contradiction.
Question 3
----------
In your UseNet articles, you never spell the word "Jew."
Instead, you insert an asterisk where the 'e' belongs.
In March 1996, you stated, "NEVER capitalize, never
spell j*w." In a February 1995 Prodigy article, however,
we find you writing the following:
"Fazel, I am still awaiting your offer to post the article
about the Jews killing 30,000 Germans in cold blood after
the Russian breach of the border." (huber.0295)
As both spelling the full word and capitalizing the word
is obviously your practice on Prodigy, but not on UseNet,
it would be instructive if you would explain why you have
deliberately misrepresented your practice.
Question 4
----------
On March 7, 1996, you published an article attributed to
James Brolin, of the "Cicero Gazette." You included the
following claim:
"Two dozen spies were named, from the sect'y to walter
LIPPMAN to alger HISS, klaus FUCHS, "MLAD", War Dept.
official william ULLMAN, intelligence official joseph JULIUS,
Treas Dept.'s harold GLASSER, the Air Forces's george
SILVERMAN, and nathan SILVERMASTER of the Bd. of Economic
Warfare.
ALL BUT TWO ARE jewish. Even as Hitler ravaged Europe, even
as millions of Britains, Americans, Poles & French were dying
to subdue the holocaust, jews spying on America and were giving
up American secrets for Russian & German shekels, dooming their
brothers in the gas-chambers of Auschwitz to death."
(Huber, "a jewish" "NIZKOR should" and others)
To which, William Anderson replied:
"Mr. Huber, above, lists nine people accussed of spying
for the Soviet Union, and claims that all but two of them
are Jewish. The nine are:
1) The secretary to Walter Lippmann. Mr. Huber does not
name the secretary, because "Lippmann" sounds Jewish, but
the secretaries name, May Price, does not.
2) Alger Hiss. Scion of one of Baltimore's oldest protestant
families. Not a Jew by any stretch of the imagination.
3) Klaus Fuchs. Son of German Quakers. Not a Jew.
4) Mlad. Mlad is a code name for a physicist who worked on
the Manhattan project and may have passed information to the
Soviets. Huber does not tell you this physicist's name,
because "Mlad" sounds vaguely foreign and potentially Jewish,
and "Theodore Hall" does not. (Anderson, real
revisionism)
Anderson goes on to point out that you, Mr. Huber, lied
when you made the claim "All but two are Jewish," and
establishes this fact beyond all dispute. The question,
therefore, is why?
Why did you tell this blatant lie, Mr. Huber?
Work Cited
Huber, A. UseNet alt.politics.white-power. Subject: "Re: AIR PHOTOS
PROVE 'GAS CHAMBERS' ARE PROPAGANDA LIES," January 29, 1996.
Message-ID: 4eis3q$h...@usenetp1.news.prodigy.com
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/h/huber.a/huber.0196
--------. UseNet alt.politics.nationalism.white. Subject:
"Re: AIR PHOTOS PROVE "GAS CHAMBERS" ARE PROPAGANDA LIES,"
Feb 1, 1996, Message-ID: 4epopo$r...@usenetp1.news.prodigy.com
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/h/huber.a/huber.0296
--------. UseNet alt.politics.white-power. Subject: "
Re: 27th question," Feb 4, 1996, Message-ID:
4f10lf$15...@usenetp1.news.prodigy.com
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/h/huber.a/huber.0296
-------. UseNet alt.politics.white-power. Subject: "Re: AIR PHOTOS
PROVE 'GAS CHAMBERS' ARE PROPAGANDA LIES," Feb 5, 1996.
Message-ID: 4f3u71$23...@useneta1.news.prodigy.com
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/h/huber.a/huber.0296
-------. UseNet alt.politics.white-power. Subject: "Re: AIR PHOTOS
PROVE 'GAS CHAMBERS' ARE PROPAGANDA LIES," Feb 5, 1996.
Message-ID: 4f3u71$23...@useneta1.news.prodigy.com
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/h/huber.a/huber.0296
-------. UseNet alt.politics.white-power. Subject: "Re: A
jewish dilemna!," Mar 7, 1996. Message-ID:
4hmp5u$12...@useneta1.news.prodigy.com
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/h/huber.a/huber.0396
--------. UseNet alt.politics.nationalism.white, Subject: "traitors
in the US of A," Mar 7 1996, Message-ID:
4hmoad$11...@useneta1.news.prodigy.com; UseNet alt.politics.white-power,
Subject: "NIZKOR should post this treachery," Mar 7 1996,
Message-ID: 4hmovb$1l...@useneta1.news.prodigy.com; UseNet
alt.politics.white-power, Subject: "Re: A jewish dilemna!,"
Mar 7 1996, Message-ID: 4hmpc6$d...@useneta1.news.prodigy.com;
UseNet alt.revisionism, Subject: "traitors amongst us," Mar 7,
1996, Message-ID: 4hmnr8$s...@useneta1.news.prodigy.com;
UseNet alt.conspiracy, Subject: "treachery at new heights,"
Mar 7, 1996, Message-ID: 4hmn5l$b...@useneta1.news.prodigy.com;
UseNet alt.skinheads. Subject: "laugh of the day/j*ws
supported holocaust," Message-ID: 4hn51u$8...@useneta1.news.prodigy.com
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/h/huber.a/huber.0396
Anderson, William C. UseNet alt.revisionism. Subject: "Re: real
revisionism,WASHINGTON POST style," Mar 7 1996, Message-ID:
4hn8fb$1...@larry.cc.emory.edu
Posted & emailed.
--
The Nizkor Project (Canada) - An Electronic Holocaust Educational Resource
Over 100Megs of data: http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?
Europe: ftp://nizkor.iam.uni-bonn.de/pub/nizkor/
Nizkor Web: http://www.almanac.bc.ca/ (Under construction - permanently!)
Mike Curtis
kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca (Ken McVay OBC) wrote:
>Question 3
>----------
> In your UseNet articles, you never spell the word "Jew."
> Instead, you insert an asterisk where the 'e' belongs.
> In March 1996, you stated, "NEVER capitalize, never
> spell j*w." In a February 1995 Prodigy article, however,
> we find you writing the following:
> "Fazel, I am still awaiting your offer to post the article
> about the Jews killing 30,000 Germans in cold blood after
> the Russian breach of the border." (huber.0295)
> As both spelling the full word and capitalizing the word
> is obviously your practice on Prodigy, but not on UseNet,
> it would be instructive if you would explain why you have
> deliberately misrepresented your practice.
Ken, since I know the usual comment from Mr. Huber is complete
silence, allow me to comment on this. I recieved a silly and stupid
e-mail from one Dave Harmon. Mr. Harmon also pulled the "j*ws" tactic.
How many names does this Huber have? Or how many copy-cats are there?
Andrew Mathis
Funny thing--I read little ol' Reuben Logsdon's internet strategy tips
recently, which Mr/Mrs/Ms Huber(s) have (all) taken quite to heart.
It's cowardly advice? Never write out the word JEW in completion,
since then your posts will be easy to find in DejaNews.
Enlightening....URL for those of you who are very good.
mi...@aimetering.com (Mike Curtis) wrote:
>kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca (Ken McVay OBC) wrote:
>>Question 3
>>----------
>> In your UseNet articles, you never spell the word "Jew."
>> Instead, you insert an asterisk where the 'e' belongs.
>> In March 1996, you stated, "NEVER capitalize, never
>> spell j*w." In a February 1995 Prodigy article, however,
>> we find you writing the following:
>> "Fazel, I am still awaiting your offer to post the article
>> about the Jews killing 30,000 Germans in cold blood after
>> the Russian breach of the border." (huber.0295)
>> As both spelling the full word and capitalizing the word
>> is obviously your practice on Prodigy, but not on UseNet,
>> it would be instructive if you would explain why you have
>> deliberately misrepresented your practice.
>Ken, since I know the usual comment from Mr. Huber is complete
>silence, allow me to comment on this. I recieved a silly and stupid
>e-mail from one Dave Harmon. Mr. Harmon also pulled the "j*ws" tactic.
>How many names does this Huber have? Or how many copy-cats are there?
-------------------------------------
"If they give you ruled paper,
Write the other way."
--Juan Ramon Jimenez
Ken McVay OBC
>Funny thing--I read little ol' Reuben Logsdon's internet strategy tips
>recently, which Mr/Mrs/Ms Huber(s) have (all) taken quite to heart.
>It's cowardly advice? Never write out the word JEW in completion,
>since then your posts will be easy to find in DejaNews.
Funny that it never occured to the white power rangers that
one could search for "j*w" just as easily, but then they
aren't known for their intelligence, are they?
Logsdon, a food service worker, should leave the speculations
to UT students - they, at least, would have seen the logical
flaws in his thinking :-)
Jeanne Kowalewski
In article <4o4ogu$i...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>, kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca
(Ken McVay OBC) wrote:
* In article <4o04nj$5...@news1.panix.com>, fr...@panix.com (Andrew Mathis)
wrote:
*
* >Funny thing--I read little ol' Reuben Logsdon's internet strategy tips
* >recently, which Mr/Mrs/Ms Huber(s) have (all) taken quite to heart.
* >It's cowardly advice? Never write out the word JEW in completion,
* >since then your posts will be easy to find in DejaNews.
*
* Funny that it never occured to the white power rangers that
* one could search for "j*w" just as easily, but then they
* aren't known for their intelligence, are they?
*
* Logsdon, a food service worker, should leave the speculations
* to UT students - they, at least, would have seen the logical
* flaws in his thinking :-)
Yes. I just received a nice message today from a UT student who had just
seen my _Save A Rube_ webpage:
comment1:
Love your "Rube treatment"........I was absolutely shocked when i
surfed into this dude that goes to UT and is one of those skinhead
motherfuckers.....i mean, this kind of shit makes white people look
like fucking idiots......i hate racism and i hate racists.......
this motherfucker needs to clear out of UT.....hope you dont think
all texans are like this!!!!!!
Later!!!!
BTW, my WP satire pages have been moved to:
http://rio.com/~jeannek/jaundice/jaundice.html
Look for the links under _Goose-Stepping for God and Other Obsessions_.
New stuff has been added, and all "racialist aware" material is now
appropriately featured with a cowardly yellow background.
* --
* The Nizkor Project (Canada) - An Electronic Holocaust Educational Resource
* Over 100Megs of data: http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?
* Europe: ftp://nizkor.iam.uni-bonn.de/pub/nizkor/
* Nizkor Web: http://www.almanac.bc.ca/ (Under construction - permanently!)
--
Rev. Jeanne K. | SISTER JEANNE!
Ordained Minister, ULC | Official Melchizedek Priest of McChurch
http://ulc.org/ulc/ | http://mcchurch.org
"There are many humorous things in the world: among them the white
man's notion that he is less savage than the other savages."
‹ Mark Twain
Danny
>* Logsdon, a food service worker, should leave the speculations
>* to UT students - they, at least, would have seen the logical
>* flaws in his thinking :-)
Isn't Logsdon the same guy who posted about two years ago how Jews were
keeping him from buying lunch (an allusion to a kosher tax)? Something
poetic in his chosen career, don't you think?
daniel david mittleman
===========================================================================
Quoth the H*ber: "Never! More!"
Jeanne Kowalewski
In article <25MAY199...@cmi.arizona.edu>, dmitt...@cmi.arizona.edu
(Danny) wrote:
* >In article <4o4ogu$i...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>, kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca
* >(Ken McVay OBC) wrote:
*
* >* Logsdon, a food service worker, should leave the speculations
* >* to UT students - they, at least, would have seen the logical
* >* flaws in his thinking :-)
*
* Isn't Logsdon the same guy who posted about two years ago how Jews were
* keeping him from buying lunch (an allusion to a kosher tax)? Something
* poetic in his chosen career, don't you think?
You can read it again at http://rio.com/~jeannek/jaundice/saverube.html.
* daniel david mittleman
* ===========================================================================
* Quoth the H*ber: "Never! More!"
Joe Lockhart
Before I decided to get on the 'net' I watch a CBC show called 'Cyber
Hate.' This was the first time I had ever heard of Ken McVay. Ken made
some statements on that show that he now seems to have modified.
McVay on Government prosecution of 'though criminal'.:
"I did at that time approve [of] Canadian actions against Zundel against
Keegstra, ah it was sort of a gut reaction because they offended me so
deeply I said good shut them up put them in jail do what ever it takes, ...no
free speech."
ECDL:
Instead of locking them up, it now appears that McVay likes to have them
deported. You still have not answered why Ernst Zundel deserves to be
sent to a country to serve time in jail for something that is not against the
law in this country? (not yet)
Please explain??
McVay continues....
"4 years on the InterNet has changed my..my thinking on that issue
totally."
ECDL:
Has it? When I asked you to define free speech you told me that "free
speech is everything except hate speech." I asked you to tell me who
defines 'hate' speech, and you refused.
Who does define 'hate' speech Mr. McVay? And don't tell me the
government of Canada does. You know as well as I do, the government of
Canada can't even wipe its own ass before getting advice from the self-
proclaimed 'human rights' groups.
McVay on government InterNet censorship:
"Their going to get millions of people upset with them, main-stream,
normal run-of-the-mill, middle-class working folks, who had a modem for
six months are going to get real upset when they discover that if they say
the wrong thing somebodies going to come along and knock on the door
and take away their computer."
ECDL:
You're right McVay, but where were you when the Simon Wiesenthal
Center called for a "InterNet ban on hate groups' messages?" (NYT Jan
10,1996) What's wrong? Don't want to bite the hand that feed you?
McVay continues...
"Once you let the government start deciding what's correct and what's not
correct... ah. they may decide its your turn next month and tell you that
what you're saying is unacceptable..and that's what scare me that scare me
a lot more than the fact that someone may say something on the Net that
deeply offend you."
ECDL:
The government of Canada has passed a private members bill banning
'Hate Propaganda,' on the InterNet, what do you have to say about M.P.
Ray Pagtakhan's bill?
McVay: "Once you let the government start deciding what's correct and
what's not correct... ah. they may decide its your turn next month...."
(NOTE: the secession of periods after the word month.... means the quote
is not complete, this is not a lie McVay... but you already knew that didn't
you)
Well McVay.. The government has decided what's correct and what's not
correct. What are you going to do about it? Are you going to back-up
words right from your mouth, or are you just another liar??
What has happened to your nation-wide stance on free speech? How come
you now state that there should be certain limits to free speech?
Now I have asked you many questions McVay. Will you answer?
The Euro-Christian Defence League
P.O. Box 345 Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
R3C 2H6 (204) 775-0878
Visit our Web site at:
http:/www.pathcom.com/~freedom/ecdl/homepage.html
Or visit the Freedom-Site at:
Ken McVay OBC
In article <1996May27.0...@wpg.ramp.net>,
Joe Lockhart <ec...@wpg.ramp.net> wrote:
>"I did at that time approve [of] Canadian actions against Zundel against
>Keegstra, ah it was sort of a gut reaction because they offended me so
>deeply I said good shut them up put them in jail do what ever it takes, ...no
>free speech."
>ECDL:
>Instead of locking them up, it now appears that McVay likes to have them
>deported. You still have not answered why Ernst Zundel deserves to be
>sent to a country to serve time in jail for something that is not against the
>law in this country? (not yet)
>Please explain??
The government of Canada has designated Ernst Zundel as a
threat to the security of the country. As the SIRC hearings
have only just begun, neither I, nor anyone else (outside
CSIS) can explain why.
Ernst Zundel, it would seem, is not fit to be a citizen of
this country - that is the CSIS position, as I understand it.
Unless SIRC reverses that position, Mr. Zundel deserves
deportation on that merit alone.
For the record, and for the nth time, I am opposed to the
German legislation, but I am not going to moralize about
Germany's position. Given the background from which these laws
sprung, I don't think anyone on this side of the pond can
possibly understand.
Will I lose sleep if Ernst Zundel spends time in a German
prison? No, Mr. Lockhart, I will not.
>McVay continues....
>"4 years on the InterNet has changed my..my thinking on that issue
>totally."
>ECDL:
>Has it? When I asked you to define free speech you told me that "free
>speech is everything except hate speech." I asked you to tell me who
>defines 'hate' speech, and you refused.
>Who does define 'hate' speech Mr. McVay? And don't tell me the
>government of Canada does. You know as well as I do, the government of
>Canada can't even wipe its own ass before getting advice from the self-
>proclaimed 'human rights' groups.
The Supreme Court of Canada has defined it quite clearly Mr.
Lockhart. I suggest you begin there.
>McVay on government InterNet censorship:
>"Their going to get millions of people upset with them, main-stream,
>normal run-of-the-mill, middle-class working folks, who had a modem for
>six months are going to get real upset when they discover that if they say
>the wrong thing somebodies going to come along and knock on the door
>and take away their computer."
>ECDL:
>You're right McVay, but where were you when the Simon Wiesenthal
>Center called for a "InterNet ban on hate groups' messages?" (NYT Jan
>10,1996) What's wrong? Don't want to bite the hand that feed you?
The Wiesenthal Center did not call for government censorship,
but for ISP self-regulation. Ergo, government is not involved,
and the issue is moot, as is your question. Every ISP has the
right to determine what will or will not appear on his system.
Customers who want what one denies will vote with their
pocketbooks and move elsewhere.
>McVay continues...
>"Once you let the government start deciding what's correct and what's not
>correct... ah. they may decide its your turn next month and tell you that
>what you're saying is unacceptable..and that's what scare me that scare me
>a lot more than the fact that someone may say something on the Net that
>deeply offend you."
>ECDL:
>The government of Canada has passed a private members bill banning
>'Hate Propaganda,' on the InterNet, what do you have to say about M.P.
>Ray Pagtakhan's bill?
I have made my opinion clear to Mr. Pagtakhan on three
separate occasions, as several readers here can attest. I
suggest that you call Mr. Pagtakhan and ask him what I had to
say. (He will tell you, if he speaks to you at all, that he
and I disagree completely on the issue.)
>McVay: "Once you let the government start deciding what's correct and
>what's not correct... ah. they may decide its your turn next month...."
>(NOTE: the secession of periods after the word month.... means the quote
>is not complete, this is not a lie McVay... but you already knew that didn't
>you)
>Well McVay.. The government has decided what's correct and what's not
>correct. What are you going to do about it? Are you going to back-up
>words right from your mouth, or are you just another liar??
If you had watched me testify before the Standing Committee in
April, you would already know the answer. Sorry you missed it.
The transcripts will eventually be published on the web, and
you can catch up on your homework, and deal with your
ignorance at the same time.
>What has happened to your nation-wide stance on free speech? How come
>you now state that there should be certain limits to free speech?
No nation on earth exists without limits on speech, Mr.
Lockhart.
>Now I have asked you many questions McVay. Will you answer?
Sure.
Matt Giwer
kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca (Ken McVay OBC) wrote:
>In article <1996May27.0...@wpg.ramp.net>,
>Joe Lockhart <ec...@wpg.ramp.net> wrote:
>>"I did at that time approve [of] Canadian actions against Zundel against
>>Keegstra, ah it was sort of a gut reaction because they offended me so
>>deeply I said good shut them up put them in jail do what ever it takes, ...no
>>free speech."
>>ECDL:
>>Instead of locking them up, it now appears that McVay likes to have them
>>deported. You still have not answered why Ernst Zundel deserves to be
>>sent to a country to serve time in jail for something that is not against the
>>law in this country? (not yet)
>>Please explain??
>The government of Canada has designated Ernst Zundel as a
>threat to the security of the country. As the SIRC hearings
>have only just begun, neither I, nor anyone else (outside
>CSIS) can explain why.
It would appear Canada is a very insecure country. You folks
must be hiding a very unstable government through control of the
media.
I can just see the headlilnes, Nutcase endangers the security of
Canada.
What a primitive country you have.
>Ernst Zundel, it would seem, is not fit to be a citizen of
>this country - that is the CSIS position, as I understand it.
Singlehandly he is a threat to Canada. He must certainly be
impressed with his power and influence. At least as much as the
government of Canada is. I laughed my ass off when our
government declared that Linda Thompson was a threat to the
security of the Waco siege. But of course I have to take this
one seriously.
>Unless SIRC reverses that position, Mr. Zundel deserves
>deportation on that merit alone.
If he is not removed Canada will be plunged into chaos. Everyone
will have to speak French under penalty of a terrible taunting.
Real biblical proportion disasters are in store if he is allowed
to remain.
---------------------------------------------------------------
Live fast, love well, and have a glorious Website.
http://www2.combase.com/~mgiwer/
Commentary from the right side of the curve
Maintaining http://www2.combase.com/~mgiwer/tech/ (tips and tricks for webs)
http://www2.combase.com/~mgiwer/mgiwer4/ (eye candy, blantant advertising)
http://www2.combase.com/~matt/ (my son)
http://www2.combase.com/~matt/mega/ (for internet advertising)
Joe Lockhart
From: kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca (Ken McVay OBC)
Newsgroups:
alt.revisionism,alt.politics.white-power,alt.politics.nationalism.white,alt.conspiracy,alt.skinheads
,talk.politics.misc,alt.censorship,can.politics
Followup-To: can.politics,talk.politics.misc
Subject: Re: Here is some questions for you McVay
Date: 27 May 1996 12:44:48 -0700
Organization: The Nizkor Project
Message-ID: <4od0ng$2...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>
References: <4nus3o$f...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca> <4o04nj$5...@news1.panix.com>
<4o4ogu$i...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca> <1996May27.0...@wpg.ramp.net>
In article <1996May27.0...@wpg.ramp.net>,
McVay:
"The government of Canada has designated Ernst Zundel as a
threat to the security of the country. As the SIRC hearings
have only just begun, neither I, nor anyone else (outside
CSIS) can explain why. "
ECDL:
McVay, you KNOW why CSIS has deemed Zundel a threat
to so-called national security, why not admit it? And you have the
nerve to call me a liar? CISI thinks he is a threat because of his
politics. Remember it's a crime to ask questions about the '6'
million.
McVay continues...
"Ernst Zundel, it would seem, is not fit to be a citizen of
this country - that is the CSIS position, as I understand it.
Unless SIRC reverses that position, Mr. Zundel deserves
deportation on that merit alone."
ECDL:
O.K. So then you agree that in Germany 1939 the then
government deemed Jews as a 'threat' to national security
and deported them. The Jews according to you 'deserved
deportation on that merit alone.' I see you agree with Nazi
policy, I understand..
McVay:
"For the record, and for the nth time, I am opposed to the
German legislation, but I am not going to moralize about
Germany's position. Given the background from which these laws
sprung, I don't think anyone on this side of the pond can
possibly understand."
ECDL:
You cannot 'moralize' about it because you know as well as I
do it is amoral.
McVay stated:
"Will I lose sleep if Ernst Zundel spends time in a German
prison? No, Mr. Lockhart, I will not."
ECDL:
Seems a far-cry from your statements on CBC Ken!
McVay on CBC:
"I did at that time approve [of] Canadian actions against Zundel against
Keegstra, ah it was sort of a gut reaction because they offended me so
deeply I said good shut them up put them in jail do what ever it takes, ...no
free speech."
"4 years on the InterNet has changed my..my thinking on that issue
totally."
ECDL:
Yes McVay, you're right.
McVay on the definition of hate speech:
"The Supreme Court of Canada has defined it quite clearly Mr.
Lockhart. I suggest you begin there."
ECDL:
Here is McVay in his own words:
"Once you let the government start deciding what's correct and what's not
correct... ah. they may decide its your turn next month and tell you that
what you're saying is unacceptable..and that's what scare me that scare me
a lot more than the fact that someone may say something on the Net that
deeply offend you."
ECDL:
You stated the Supreme Court of Canada has defined hate speech. Well I
submit to you that the Canadian Jewish Congress has defined what 'hate'
speech is, the SCC just happen to unfortunately agree with them, and it now
appears that you do as well.
McVay on the Wiesenthal Center bit to censor the Net:
"The Wiesenthal Center did not call for government censorship,
but for ISP self-regulation. Ergo, government is not involved,
and the issue is moot, as is your question. Every ISP has the
right to determine what will or will not appear on his system.
Customers who want what one denies will vote with their
pocketbooks and move elsewhere."
ECDL:
1)The Wiesenthal Center did not call for government censorship...
It didn't need to. They know through intimidation they could circumvent the
government and do it faster themselves.
McVay:
"..but for ISP self-regulation."
ECDL:
Against anything they deem unacceptable.
What about all the filth on the InterNet? No cry to censor of that?
What about stuff like "Craig's Shit Page," Is that acceptable to
the SWC?
McVay:
"...government is not involved...,"
ECDL:
No yet, but if the ISP's don't get their act together that ADL in true
form will cry to the government for help in countering all this
free speech, oops.. I ment 'hate speech.'
McVay:
"...Every ISP has the right to determine what will or will not appear
on his system. Customers who want what one denies will vote with
their pocketbooks and move elsewhere."
ECDL:
Just like Marco Polo magazine in Japan had the 'right' to free speech
until they pissed-off God's chosen ones.
Did the SWC, or the ADL ask the government of Japan to act, no, they
simply went after their advertisers. No advertisers no magazine
But I guess you will find some way to explain how that was a good
thing too right McVay?
McVay on the government of Canada's new InterNet hate law introduced by
M.P. Ray Pagtakhan in a private members bill.
McVay:
"I have made my opinion clear to Mr. Pagtakhan on three
separate occasions, as several readers here can attest. I
suggest that you call Mr. Pagtakhan and ask him what I had to
say. (He will tell you, if he speaks to you at all, that he
and I disagree completely on the issue.)"
ECDL:
Why would he not speak to me McVay? Are you special?
Perhaps you disagree, but it seems the people who agree like the CJC
are more important than you.
(NOTE: The CJC has not publicly stated their position on this issue, one
can assume they are in favour of this new law because they have remained silent)
McVay:
"If you had watched me testify before the Standing Committee in
April, you would already know the answer. Sorry you missed it.
The transcripts will eventually be published on the web, and
you can catch up on your homework, and deal with your
ignorance at the same time."
ECDL:
Ignorance of what? Your clever hypocrisy? While you claim to be against
censorship, it would seem that you favour censorship through deportation.
And you favour censorship through ISP intimidation.
You know as well as I do, your FTP site will one day be used in a court
of 'thought police' against some poor person who thought they
had freedom of speech. You true to form will complain that they have the
'right' to free speech, and then hand over the files to 'ze' big brother.
I understand..
McVay of free speech:
"No nation on earth exists without limits on speech, Mr.
Lockhart."
ECDL:
Wrong, the United States of America has no limits on free speech.
(as long as you're not advocating the commission of a crime)
In the next few days I will post an example of American free
speech, you will see what is legal in the States and what is illegal
in Canada, there is a big difference.
The Euro-Christian Defence League
P.O. Box 345 Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada, R3C 2H6
24 Hr Hotline (204) 775-0878
Join the fight for freedom of our people..
Ken McVay OBC
In article <1996May29....@wpg.ramp.net>,
Joe Lockhart <ec...@wpg.ramp.net> wrote:
>McVay:
>"The government of Canada has designated Ernst Zundel as a
>threat to the security of the country. As the SIRC hearings
>have only just begun, neither I, nor anyone else (outside
>CSIS) can explain why. "
Lockhart:
>McVay, you KNOW why CSIS has deemed Zundel a threat
>to so-called national security, why not admit it? And you have the
>nerve to call me a liar? CISI thinks he is a threat because of his
>politics. Remember it's a crime to ask questions about the '6'
>million.
No, Mr. Lockhart, I do not know, and neither do you. It is
not, by the way, a crime to ask questions about the Holocaust
(the number, Mr. Lockhart, is twelve million, not six). If
you, unlike every other Canadian, have evidence with regard to
why CSIS has pronounced Mr. Zundel a threat to Canada's
national security, do feel free to post it here, Mr.
Lockhart. (How long have you had this telepathic ability, Mr.
Lockhart?)
>McVay continues...
>"Ernst Zundel, it would seem, is not fit to be a citizen of
>this country - that is the CSIS position, as I understand it.
>Unless SIRC reverses that position, Mr. Zundel deserves
>deportation on that merit alone."
Lockart:
>O.K. So then you agree that in Germany 1939 the then
>government deemed Jews as a 'threat' to national security
>and deported them. The Jews according to you 'deserved
>deportation on that merit alone.' I see you agree with Nazi
>policy, I understand..
The Nazis murdered twelve million innocent civilians, Mr.
Lockhart. Roughly half of them were Jews. Murder, Mr.
Lockhart, murder. No crime had been committed, no law broken -
they were simply murdered.
Evangelical Christians
Homosexuals
Gypsies
Jews
Soviet Moslems
Polish intelligencia
Murdered, Mr. Lockhart. Your silly word games cannot change
the fact of those murders.
>McVay:
>"For the record, and for the nth time, I am opposed to the
>German legislation, but I am not going to moralize about
>Germany's position. Given the background from which these laws
>sprung, I don't think anyone on this side of the pond can
>possibly understand."
Lockhart:
>You cannot 'moralize' about it because you know as well as I
>do it is amoral.
When you have spent a lifetime in Germany, and lived through
the Nazi era and its aftermath, then you can moralize, Mr.
Lockhart. Until then, it's all smoke and mirrors.
>McVay stated:
>"Will I lose sleep if Ernst Zundel spends time in a German
>prison? No, Mr. Lockhart, I will not."
Lockart:
>Seems a far-cry from your statements on CBC Ken!
No, it isn't, and I appreciate your posting my quote to prove
it:
>McVay on CBC:
>"I did at that time approve [of] Canadian actions against Zundel against
>Keegstra, ah it was sort of a gut reaction because they offended me so
>deeply I said good shut them up put them in jail do what ever it takes, ...no
>free speech."
Now, Mr. Lockhart, please try and equate my comment about
German prisons and Canadian actions against Zundel.
>McVay on the definition of hate speech:
>"The Supreme Court of Canada has defined it quite clearly Mr.
>Lockhart. I suggest you begin there."
Lockhart:
>Here is McVay in his own words:
>"Once you let the government start deciding what's correct and what's not
>correct... ah. they may decide its your turn next month and tell you that
>what you're saying is unacceptable..and that's what scare me that scare me
>a lot more than the fact that someone may say something on the Net that
>deeply offend you."
Lockhart:
>You stated the Supreme Court of Canada has defined hate speech. Well I
>submit to you that the Canadian Jewish Congress has defined what 'hate'
>speech is, the SCC just happen to unfortunately agree with them, and it now
>appears that you do as well.
The Canadian Jewish Congress does not control the Supreme
Court of Canada, Mr. Lockhart, except perhaps in your feverish
fantasy world.
(Your position seems to be that there should be no law at all,
is that correct, Mr. Lockhart?)
>McVay on the Wiesenthal Center bit to censor the Net:
>"The Wiesenthal Center did not call for government censorship,
>but for ISP self-regulation. Ergo, government is not involved,
>and the issue is moot, as is your question. Every ISP has the
>right to determine what will or will not appear on his system.
>Customers who want what one denies will vote with their
>pocketbooks and move elsewhere."
Lockhart:
>1)The Wiesenthal Center did not call for government censorship...
>It didn't need to. They know through intimidation they could circumvent the
>government and do it faster themselves.
Translation: OK, I lied, and you pointed it out. I will do my
best to recover by inventing some new and devious motive, and
hoping no-one will notice.
>McVay:
>"..but for ISP self-regulation."
Lockhart:
>Against anything they deem unacceptable.
>What about all the filth on the InterNet? No cry to censor of that?
>What about stuff like "Craig's Shit Page," Is that acceptable to
>the SWC?
What filth, Mr. Lockhart? The report to the Minister of
Industry, Trade and Commerce pointed out that 95% of the
so-called "pornography" on the net is legal in Canada, and
existing law has already resulted in the arrest of a Canadian
pedophile.
I find it fascinating that you seem to think that I speak for
the Wiesenthal Center, or that I would have an idea of what is
"acceptable" to them and what is not. Do you also think that
I speak for the Canadian Jewish Congress, the Jewish Defense
League, and McGill's Hillel, Mr. Lockhart? Perhaps you should
be asking me what's acceptable to them as well, eh?
>McVay:
>"...government is not involved...,"
Lockhart:
>No yet, but if the ISP's don't get their act together that ADL in true
>form will cry to the government for help in countering all this
>free speech, oops.. I ment 'hate speech.'
Projecting, are we? First you ask me about ISP
self-regulation, which you call censorship, and when I tell
you that the government is not involved, so I don't oppose
such self-regulation, you then project imminent government
involvement. Interesting.
What has the ADL got to do with it, Mr. Lockhart? There is no
ADL in Canada. (If there were, you would quickly learn that
they are not in favour of government censorship of the
internet.)
>McVay:
>"...Every ISP has the right to determine what will or will not appear
>on his system. Customers who want what one denies will vote with
>their pocketbooks and move elsewhere."
Lockhart:
>Just like Marco Polo magazine in Japan had the 'right' to free speech
>until they pissed-off God's chosen ones.
They lost advertisers because they printed something their
advertisers didn't agree with. What's new, Mr. Lockhart?
>Did the SWC, or the ADL ask the government of Japan to act, no, they
>simply went after their advertisers. No advertisers no magazine
>But I guess you will find some way to explain how that was a good
>thing too right McVay?
Advertisers talk with their wallets, Mr. Lockhart. That is how
the system works, and it is also why television shows come and
go with all the regularity of morning coffee.
<yawn>
>McVay on the government of Canada's new InterNet hate law introduced by
>M.P. Ray Pagtakhan in a private members bill.
>McVay:
>"I have made my opinion clear to Mr. Pagtakhan on three
>separate occasions, as several readers here can attest. I
>suggest that you call Mr. Pagtakhan and ask him what I had to
>say. (He will tell you, if he speaks to you at all, that he
>and I disagree completely on the issue.)"
Lockhart:
>Why would he not speak to me McVay? Are you special?
Are you asking me to read his mind, Mr. Lockhart? Amazing!
First you suggest that I know what the Simon Wiesenthal thinks
is acceptable on the Internet, and now you attribute to me
magic powers of telepathy. I'm flattered.
>Perhaps you disagree, but it seems the people who agree like the CJC
>are more important than you.
People who agree with what, Mr. Lockhart? (Translate this
into English, please.)
>(NOTE: The CJC has not publicly stated their position on this issue, one
>can assume they are in favour of this new law because they have remained silent)
One can assume nothing, Mr. Lockhart, until the CJC takes a
public position. Frankly, I don't think that the CJC has a
position just yet, although I know that they have a committee
actively working to develop one. (It is interesting, however,
to watch your mind at work.)
>McVay:
>"If you had watched me testify before the Standing Committee in
>April, you would already know the answer. Sorry you missed it.
>The transcripts will eventually be published on the web, and
>you can catch up on your homework, and deal with your
>ignorance at the same time."
Lockhart:
>Ignorance of what? Your clever hypocrisy? While you claim to be against
>censorship, it would seem that you favour censorship through deportation.
>And you favour censorship through ISP intimidation.
Mr. Zundel has been deemed unfit for Canadian citizenship. If
SIRC upholds that finding, that is why he will be deported. I
do not believe it will be because he denies the Holocaust, Mr.
Lockhart, whatever you might say.
I have yet to learn of a single ISP who has been intimidated
by the Wiesenthal Center, Mr. Lockhart, and I defy you to
produce one. I do, however, know of several who have rejected
the Wiesenthal request in no uncertain terms, and I also know
of several who have censored their newsfeeds for years,
without any requests from anyone... strange that you do not
seem interested in them.
>You know as well as I do, your FTP site will one day be used in a court
>of 'thought police' against some poor person who thought they
>had freedom of speech. You true to form will complain that they have the
>'right' to free speech, and then hand over the files to 'ze' big brother.
>I understand..
Projecting again, Mr. Lockhart. What's it like to live with
such ugly paranoia seething in your head? The files here are
"handed over" 150,000 times a month, Mr. Lockhart; do you not
believe the things you have said? Are you not proud of your
public utterings? Are you ashamed of them, Mr. Lockhart? Would
you rather no-one knew what you had to say?
>McVay of free speech:
>"No nation on earth exists without limits on speech, Mr.
>Lockhart."
Lockhart:
>Wrong, the United States of America has no limits on free speech.
>(as long as you're not advocating the commission of a crime)
Sorry, Mr. Lockhart, but you are not correct. The United
States does indeed have limits on free speech. Try libel,
slander, and related matters, or try the classic, and yell
"Fire!" in a crowded theatre, when there is no fire, and see
how long your "free speech" lasts.
Try standing on a street corner at two in the morning, in a
residential neighborhood, and yelling at the top of your lungs
for an hour or two... see how far your "free speech" gets you.
Try reciting national secrets on a street corner, Mr.
Lockhart...
>In the next few days I will post an example of American free
>speech, you will see what is legal in the States and what is illegal
>in Canada, there is a big difference.
Wow! Canada and the United States are <<different>>, Mr.
Lockhart? Golly! Gee! I had NO idea!
Posted, emailed.
Joe Lockhart
McVay Re: CISI and the deportation of Ernst Zundel.
"No, Mr. Lockhart, I do not know, and neither do you. It is
not, by the way, a crime to ask questions about the Holocaust
(the number, Mr. Lockhart, is twelve million, not six). If
you, unlike every other Canadian, have evidence with regard to
why CSIS has pronounced Mr. Zundel a threat to Canada's
national security, do feel free to post it here, Mr.
Lockhart. (How long have you had this telepathic ability, Mr.
Lockhart?)"
ECDL:
Well McVay we only ever hear about the so-called '6'
million. McVay, either your simple or an absolute liar. Which is it?
Zundel is a model citizen. He has no criminal record
and pays his taxes.
I know you have stated that you will not speculate why CISI
has deemed him a 'threat' but, you know as well as I do, he
is a threat to the holohoax. This some how makes him a
threat to the national security of Canada. (oh boy)
Just admit it McVay, don't be a coward man.
McVay continues...
"Ernst Zundel, it would seem, is not fit to be a citizen of
this country - that is the CSIS position, as I understand it.
Unless SIRC reverses that position, Mr. Zundel deserves
deportation on that merit alone."
ECDL:
O.K. So then you agree that in Germany 1939 the then
government deemed Jews as a 'threat' to national security
and deported them. The Jews according to you 'deserved
deportation on that merit alone.' I see you agree with Nazi
policy, I understand..
McVay's temper tantrum:
"The Nazis murdered twelve million innocent civilians, Mr.
Lockhart. Roughly half of them were Jews. Murder, Mr.
Lockhart, murder. No crime had been committed, no law broken -
they were simply murdered."
ECDL:
Don't skirt the issue with your hyperbole McVay, what you won't
admit is that the government of Canada is doing the same
thing that the Nazis' did in Germany. Today they will deport
people, who knows about tomorrow.
McVay:
Evangelical Christians
Homosexuals
Gypsies
Jews
Soviet Moslems
Polish intelligencia
Murdered, Mr. Lockhart. Your silly word games cannot change
the fact of those murders.
ECDL:
And your hyperbole can't change the fact that the government of Canada's
CISI is working at the behest of special interest groups to deport
a man for no other reason except he won't be intimidated into
following the party line of the '6' million McVay.
<SNIP>
McVay on CBC:
"I did at that time approve [of] Canadian actions against Zundel against
Keegstra, ah it was sort of a gut reaction because they offended me so
deeply I said good shut them up put them in jail do what ever it takes, ...no
free speech."
McVay:
Now, Mr. Lockhart, please try and equate my comment about
German prisons and Canadian actions against Zundel.
ECDL: Gladly,
"Ernst Zundel, it would seem, is not fit to be a citizen of
this country - that is the CSIS position, as I understand it.
Unless SIRC reverses that position, Mr. Zundel deserves
deportation on that merit alone."
<SNIP>
McVay:
I find it fascinating that you seem to think that I speak for
the Wiesenthal Center, or that I would have an idea of what is
"acceptable" to them and what is not. Do you also think that
I speak for the Canadian Jewish Congress, the Jewish Defense
League, and McGill's Hillel, Mr. Lockhart? Perhaps you should
be asking me what's acceptable to them as well, eh?
ECDL:
It would appear that you vehemently defend them, I'm just
trying to see where you're coming from.
>McVay:
>"...government is not involved...,"
McVay making tracks.
"rojecting, are we? First you ask me about ISP
self-regulation, which you call censorship, and when I tell
you that the government is not involved, so I don't oppose
such self-regulation, you then project imminent government
involvement. Interesting."
What has the ADL got to do with it, Mr. Lockhart? There is no
ADL in Canada. (If there were, you would quickly learn that
they are not in favour of government censorship of the
internet.)
ECDL:
The ADL is the Anti Defamation League of the B'nai Brith.
Or are you going to make a fool out of yourself by telling the
world the US ADL has nothing to do with the Canadian B'nai
Brith?
Are you then going to tell the world that you're not biased even
after receiving an award from the B'nai Brith?
McVay:
"...Every ISP has the right to determine what will or will not appear
on his system. Customers who want what one denies will vote with
their pocketbooks and move elsewhere."
ECDL:
Just like Marco Polo magazine in Japan had the 'right' to free speech
until they pissed-off God's chosen ones.
MCVay:
"They lost advertisers because they printed something their
advertisers didn't agree with. What's new, Mr. Lockhart?"
Did the SWC, or the ADL ask the government of Japan to act, no, they
simply went after their advertisers. No advertisers no magazine
But I guess you will find some way to explain how that was a good
thing too right McVay?
McVay:
"Advertisers talk with their wallets, Mr. Lockhart. That is how
the system works, and it is also why television shows come and
go with all the regularity of morning coffee."
ECDL:
McVay, you're so full of crap, I suggest you go to the washroom
because the crap is coming through the screen and not out of your
ass.
The rest of your sorry-ass excuses for oppression and censorship
have been deleted, I just hate puking in the middle of reading one
of your ass-kissing posts defending the undefendable.
Why don't you just come out and say you would rather lie on the
InterNet than sell milk for a living.
How can you sleep at night?
The Euro-Christian Defence League
P.O. Box 345 Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada, R3C 2H6
24 Hr Hotline (204) 775-0878
Visit our Web Site at:
http://www.pathcom.com/~freedom/ecdl/homepage.html
Or visit the Freedom Site at:
http://www.pathcom.com/~freedom/
Ken McVay OBC
In article <1996May31.2...@wpg.ramp.net>,
Joe Lockhart <ec...@wpg.ramp.net> wrote:
>In article <1996May29....@wpg.ramp.net>,
>Joe Lockhart <ec...@wpg.ramp.net> wrote:
>McVay Re: CISI and the deportation of Ernst Zundel.
>"No, Mr. Lockhart, I do not know, and neither do you. It is
>not, by the way, a crime to ask questions about the Holocaust
>(the number, Mr. Lockhart, is twelve million, not six). If
>you, unlike every other Canadian, have evidence with regard to
>why CSIS has pronounced Mr. Zundel a threat to Canada's
>national security, do feel free to post it here, Mr.
>Lockhart. (How long have you had this telepathic ability, Mr.
>Lockhart?)"
>ECDL:
>Well McVay we only ever hear about the so-called '6'
>million. McVay, either your simple or an absolute liar. Which is it?
Who is this "we," Mr. Lockhart? Around here - alt.revisionism,
that is - the number is 12 million... it is usually the denial
set that concentrates on estimated Jewish dead. If your
knowledge of the Holocaust is so scant as to believe that
there were only 6 million victims, it is your ignorance that
is at fault, not my reportage, Mr. Lockhart. I suggest you
educate yourself... just for a change in pace.
>Zundel is a model citizen. He has no criminal record
>and pays his taxes.
>I know you have stated that you will not speculate why CISI
>has deemed him a 'threat' but, you know as well as I do, he
>is a threat to the holohoax. This some how makes him a
>threat to the national security of Canada. (oh boy)
>Just admit it McVay, don't be a coward man.
What "holohoax" might that be, Mr. Lockhart? Do you have some
_facts_ to back up your "Christian" Identity claptrap?
>McVay continues...
>
>"Ernst Zundel, it would seem, is not fit to be a citizen of
>this country - that is the CSIS position, as I understand it.
>Unless SIRC reverses that position, Mr. Zundel deserves
>deportation on that merit alone."
>ECDL:
>
>O.K. So then you agree that in Germany 1939 the then
>government deemed Jews as a 'threat' to national security
>and deported them. The Jews according to you 'deserved
>deportation on that merit alone.' I see you agree with Nazi
>policy, I understand..
>McVay's temper tantrum:
>"The Nazis murdered twelve million innocent civilians, Mr.
>Lockhart. Roughly half of them were Jews. Murder, Mr.
>Lockhart, murder. No crime had been committed, no law broken -
>they were simply murdered."
>ECDL:
>Don't skirt the issue with your hyperbole McVay, what you won't
>admit is that the government of Canada is doing the same
>thing that the Nazis' did in Germany. Today they will deport
>people, who knows about tomorrow.
Who, one must ask, has the Canadian government murdered, Mr.
Lockhart? Where are the gas chambers, the mobile gas vans, the
execution squads? Such prattle, Mr. Lockhart.. it must
embarrass you.
>McVay:
>Evangelical Christians
>Homosexuals
>Gypsies
>Jews
>Soviet Moslems
>Polish intelligencia
>Murdered, Mr. Lockhart. Your silly word games cannot change
>the fact of those murders.
>ECDL:
>And your hyperbole can't change the fact that the government of Canada's
>CISI is working at the behest of special interest groups to deport
>a man for no other reason except he won't be intimidated into
>following the party line of the '6' million McVay.
You continue to encourage speculation, Mr. Lockhart, and I am
not going to play that game. I will wait....
...and the number is still twelve million, Mr. Lockhart, not
six.
>McVay on CBC:
>"I did at that time approve [of] Canadian actions against Zundel against
>Keegstra, ah it was sort of a gut reaction because they offended me so
>deeply I said good shut them up put them in jail do what ever it takes, ...no
>free speech."
>McVay:
>Now, Mr. Lockhart, please try and equate my comment about
>German prisons and Canadian actions against Zundel.
>ECDL: Gladly,
>"Ernst Zundel, it would seem, is not fit to be a citizen of
>this country - that is the CSIS position, as I understand it.
>Unless SIRC reverses that position, Mr. Zundel deserves
>deportation on that merit alone."
Please try again, Mr. Lockhart... better luck next time. If
SIRC upholds CSIS, then Mr. Zundel will be ejected - the slap,
if you will, heard round the world. Tough luck. We have every
right to deport those deemed unfit to hold citizenship,
whether you like it or not.
>McVay:
>I find it fascinating that you seem to think that I speak for
>the Wiesenthal Center, or that I would have an idea of what is
>"acceptable" to them and what is not. Do you also think that
>I speak for the Canadian Jewish Congress, the Jewish Defense
>League, and McGill's Hillel, Mr. Lockhart? Perhaps you should
>be asking me what's acceptable to them as well, eh?
>ECDL:
>It would appear that you vehemently defend them, I'm just
>trying to see where you're coming from.
Horsepucky, Mr. Lockhart - you seem to have this hardon for
the Center, and somehow connect me with them. Sorry, Charley,
but they speak for themselves, as I act for myself. Your
delusions won't change that.
>>McVay:
>>"...government is not involved...,"
>McVay making tracks.
Please show us how the government would be involved in ISP
self-regulation, Mr. Lockhard. What's that? You can't? Tough,
Charley.
>"Projecting, are we? First you ask me about ISP
>self-regulation, which you call censorship, and when I tell
>you that the government is not involved, so I don't oppose
>such self-regulation, you then project imminent government
>involvement. Interesting."
>
>What has the ADL got to do with it, Mr. Lockhart? There is no
>ADL in Canada. (If there were, you would quickly learn that
>they are not in favour of government censorship of the
>internet.)
>ECDL:
>The ADL is the Anti Defamation League of the B'nai Brith.
>Or are you going to make a fool out of yourself by telling the
>world the US ADL has nothing to do with the Canadian B'nai
>Brith?
Yes, Mr. Lockhart, that is exactly what I am going to tell
you. In case you don't know it, the Anti-Defamation League is
not affiliated with B'nai B'rith... they declared their
independance some time ago, your delusions notwithstanding.
>Are you then going to tell the world that you're not biased even
>after receiving an award from the B'nai Brith?
You continue to connect B'nai Brith (Canadian spelling) with
the (American) ADL, even though there is no connection. Are
you really that ignorant, Mr. Lockhart?
>McVay:
>"...Every ISP has the right to determine what will or will not appear
>on his system. Customers who want what one denies will vote with
>their pocketbooks and move elsewhere."
>
>ECDL:
>
>Just like Marco Polo magazine in Japan had the 'right' to free speech
>until they pissed-off God's chosen ones.
>
>MCVay:
>"They lost advertisers because they printed something their
>advertisers didn't agree with. What's new, Mr. Lockhart?"
>Did the SWC, or the ADL ask the government of Japan to act, no, they
>simply went after their advertisers. No advertisers no magazine
>But I guess you will find some way to explain how that was a good
>thing too right McVay?
Are you suggesting that the SWC, or the ADL. or BOTH, have so
much influence that Ford (built by a notorious Jew-hater)
would immediate cease advertising on their complaints? Sheesh,
but your delusions are amazing!
>McVay:
>
>"Advertisers talk with their wallets, Mr. Lockhart. That is how
>the system works, and it is also why television shows come and
>go with all the regularity of morning coffee."
>
>ECDL:
>
>McVay, you're so full of crap, I suggest you go to the washroom
>because the crap is coming through the screen and not out of your
>ass.
How nice to hear from you, Mr. Lockhart. By the way, you never
did tell me if you sent those two sorry-assed punks to the
Winnipeg Convention Center the night I was there... if they
are your Noble Identity Future, you're in more trouble than I
thought you were... they were invited inside for dinner, but
they were shaking so hard as they "whitepower'd" out the door
they couldn't seem to find their appetites...
>The rest of your sorry-ass excuses for oppression and censorship
>have been deleted, I just hate puking in the middle of reading one
>of your ass-kissing posts defending the undefendable.
How nice of you to write.
>Why don't you just come out and say you would rather lie on the
>InterNet than sell milk for a living.
I'd rather bring you out of the closet, Mr. Lockhart. I take
absolute delight in watching your reactions.
>How can you sleep at night?
With great comfort, Mr. Lockhart, with great comfort. I know
that you and your friends will never, ever, control this
wonderful nation, and that's enough to make any man sleep in
peace.
>The Euro-Christian Defence League
Garbage by any other name smells just as bad, Mr. Lockhart.
--
The Nizkor Project (Canada) - An Electronic Holocaust Educational Resource
[Ftp] http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?
Joe Lockhart
adm...@escape.ca (The Bathtub Admiral) wrote:
>Joe Lockhart <ec...@wpg.ramp.net> in message
><1996May31.2...@wpg.ramp.net>
>launched into a drum solo and said:
>
><snip>
>
>Joe:
>
>"Say what you have to say and when you come to a sentence
>with a grammatical ending, sit down. - Winston Churchill"
>
>NGs & follow-ups reset (ain't free-speech wonderful<g>).
>
>
Did you write that all by your little self?
You should stop playing with your rubber duck..
Chuck
Anyone who fears free speach must have something to hide. Mr.McVay is
working hard to stiffle free speech in Canada and is in support of a
Soviate style hearing. This is a real threat to Canada and her citizens.
Today it's Zundel for debate on the holocaust,tommorow its others for
tax protest and practicing Christianity. Don't think so ? There is a
major drive in the Jewish community to equate the Bible with hate and
there for out law it in some countries. This movemant is hell bent
because Jesus in John 8:41-45 calls jews the devils people.
Wake up !
P.S. So much for the choosen people myth that Billy Grahm and Pat
Robertson preach. I wonder how the can explain John 8:41-45 ?
Ken Lewis
In article <4p3t13$5...@news.ios.com>, wel...@wrg.2jq.uk.com says...
>
>
> Anyone who fears free speach must have something to hide. Mr.McVay is
>working hard to stiffle free speech in Canada and is in support of a
Strange, that. I know of nobody who works harder in defence of free speech than
Ken McVay. If you had checked your facts a little harder you would have found
that Ken has appeared on T.V. in defence of free speech on the Internet.
Once again it would seem that the truth has little to do with facts as
presented by your ilk.
Ken Lewis
protest and practicing Christianity. Don't think so ? There is a
>major drive in the Jewish community to equate the Bible with hate and
>there for out law it in some countries. This movemant is hell bent
>because Jesus in John 8:41-45 calls jews the devils people.
Do you have any documentation for this rediculous statement or are you just
pissing in the wind?
I am sure the 'people of the book' would be surprised that they are in the
forefront of a movement to abolish it.
Perhaps you can crawl back under your rock now.
Ken McVay OBC
In article <4p3t13$5...@news.ios.com>, Chuck <wel...@wrg.2jq.uk.com> wrote,
from his forged address:
> Anyone who fears free speach must have something to hide. Mr.McVay is
>working hard to stiffle free speech in Canada and is in support of a
>Soviate style hearing. This is a real threat to Canada and her citizens.
The word is "Soviet."
The word is "Stifle."
Aside from that, of course, I will simply join others who have
already offered to bet you $100.00 that you cannot provide
proof of your contention, above.
$100 from me, if you can.
$100 from Jamie McCarthy, if you can.
$200 from you, if you can't.
Go ahead, make my day. Prove that I am "working hard to" stifle "free
speech in Canada."
> Today it's Zundel for debate on the holocaust,tommorow its others for
>tax protest and practicing Christianity. Don't think so ? There is a
Please provide proof that Zundel has been declared a threat to
Canadian security because of his views on the Holocaust -
debate certainly isn't the issue, because Mr. Zundel refuses
to debate Holocaust issues here on the net, where we've been
doing just that for nearly five years. He is a coward in that
respect, not to mention a hypocrite.
>major drive in the Jewish community to equate the Bible with hate and
>there for out law it in some countries. This movemant is hell bent
>because Jesus in John 8:41-45 calls jews the devils people.
The word is "movement."
The phrase should be "to equate the Bible with hate and they're
for outlawing it..."
Now that you have demonstrated your lack of basic educational
achievement (you must be a Noble Aryan Warrior - see the
thread on "How to spot an aryan," available in many
newsgroups), perhaps you can redeem yourself in the eyes of
your audience by providing proof that there is a "major drive"
in the Jewish community, or anywhere else, to outlaw the
Bible.
...or, perhaps, you should simply return to elementary school,
where any sixth-grader can show you how to make more
convincing forged addresses.
Poor Winnipeg.
Jamie McCarthy
Chuck <wel...@wrg.2jq.uk.com> wrote:
> Anyone who fears free speach must have something to hide. Mr.McVay is
> working hard to stiffle free speech in Canada
I've got $100 that says you are lying and that you can't back up your lie
with a single piece of evidence.
Think you can collect? Post your documentation and cc me in email.
Posted/emailed. Followups to alt.revisionism and alt.censorship.
--
Jamie McCarthy http://www.absence.prismatix.com/jamie/
ja...@voyager.net Co-Webmaster of http://www.almanac.bc.ca/
Unless you specify otherwise, I assume pro-"revisionism" email
to be in the public domain. I speak only for myself.
Rich Graves
Followups set.
In article <4p3t13$5...@news.ios.com>, Chuck <wel...@wrg.2jq.uk.com> writes:
>
> Anyone who fears free speach must have something to hide. Mr.McVay is
Like their real address, "Ron"?
Forged troll deleted.
-rich
http://www.c2.org/~rich/
Ken Lewis
In article <4p4kda$f...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>, kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca
says...
>$100 from me, if you can.
>$100 from Jamie McCarthy, if you can.
>$200 from you, if you can't.
>
>Go ahead, make my day. Prove that I am "working hard to" stifle "free
>speech in Canada."
<SNICKER> A bet as safe as this? I'll throw my $100 in too.
Keith Morrison
Matt Giwer
Chuck <wel...@wrg.2jq.uk.com> wrote:
> Anyone who fears free speach must have something to hide. Mr.McVay is
>working hard to stiffle free speech in Canada and is in support of a
>Soviate style hearing. This is a real threat to Canada and her citizens.
> Today it's Zundel for debate on the holocaust,tommorow its others for
>tax protest and practicing Christianity. Don't think so ? There is a
>major drive in the Jewish community to equate the Bible with hate and
>there for out law it in some countries. This movemant is hell bent
>because Jesus in John 8:41-45 calls jews the devils people.
> Wake up !
>P.S. So much for the choosen people myth that Billy Grahm and Pat
>Robertson preach. I wonder how the can explain John 8:41-45 ?
You don't think he would go in for book burning do you?
Or would you put anything beneath him to silence what he does not
want to hear?
Mike Beebe
Keith Morrison (t0...@unb.ca) wrote:
: I'm in.
: --
: Keith Morrison
: t0...@unb.ca
Put me in for a C, too.
Mike Beebe
--
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro."
-- Dr. Hunter S. Thompson
Rich Graves
Oh, all right. But followups set to alt.cascade and alt.revisionism ONLY.
The Nizkor Project is discussed at, among other places,
news:alt.revisionism
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/contributors/mcvay-ken.html
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/~kmcvay/
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/m/mcvay.ken
http://haven.uniserve.com/~hostrov/24hours.html
http://www.cyber24.com/htm/4_217.html
be...@scd.hp.com (Mike Beebe) writes:
>Keith Morrison (t0...@unb.ca) wrote:
>: Ken Lewis wrote:
>: >
>: > In article <4p4kda$f...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>, kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca
>: > says...
>: >
>: > >$100 from me, if you can.
>: > >$100 from Jamie McCarthy, if you can.
>: > >$200 from you, if you can't.
>: > >
>: > >Go ahead, make my day. Prove that I am "working hard to" stifle "free
>: > >speech in Canada."
>: >
>: > <SNICKER> A bet as safe as this? I'll throw my $100 in too.
>
>: I'm in.
>
>: --
>: Keith Morrison
>: t0...@unb.ca
>
> Put me in for a C, too.
$100 from Rich Graves, if you can.
-rich
http://www.c2.org/~rich/
Bud
Chuck wrote:
>
> Anyone who fears free speach must have something to hide. Mr.McVay is
> working hard to stiffle free speech in Canada and is in support of a
> Soviate style hearing. This is a real threat to Canada and her citizens.
> Today it's Zundel for debate on the holocaust,tommorow its others for
> tax protest and practicing Christianity. Don't think so ? There is a
> major drive in the Jewish community to equate the Bible with hate and
> there for out law it in some countries. This movemant is hell bent
> because Jesus in John 8:41-45 calls jews the devils people.
>
> Wake up !
>
> P.S. So much for the choosen people myth that Billy Grahm and Pat
> Robertson preach. I wonder how the can explain John 8:41-45 ?
Chuck. Although I do not favor bigotry or racism, I do agree with the
fact that the Jews of today are (in most cases) NOT the so-called "chosen
people." I am a Christian, and like the reformers taught (a teaching now
seemingly lost within political correctness) the Christians are (and this
is easily gotten from the New Testament) the "chosen" people and heirs
according to the promise! I have posted to Alt.Revisionism several times
my conviction that most of the modern day Jews are NOT from the tribe of
Judah or the lineage of Shem, but are in fact from the Khazars of Asia
and Turkey, and some parts of Europe. I have read where some of the
movements from some Jewish quarters are attempting to "revise" the New
Testament, I do not believe they are attempting to also do the same to
the Old Testament. I am attaching a file for you to read, most of the
material for which came from "The Christiand News" which I believe to be
one of the best (truthful) Christian publications around today. However,
as Christians, please lets also agree to pray that God will sovereignly
lead whom He will to the truth of the true Messiah, Jesus Christ. I hope
you agree.
Ron
kle...@awinc.com (Ken Lewis) wrote:
>In article <4p4kda$f...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>, kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca
>says...
>
>>$100 from me, if you can.
>>$100 from Jamie McCarthy, if you can.
>>$200 from you, if you can't.
>>
>>Go ahead, make my day. Prove that I am "working hard to" stifle "free
>>speech in Canada."
>
><SNICKER> A bet as safe as this? I'll throw my $100 in too.
>
in your face attacks.
Hilary Ostrov
Wrong little fella! Maybe you should learn to read before you engage
your keyboard. First of all, just cast your eyes upwards slightly on
the page. Do you see the words:
Go ahead, make my day. Prove that I am "working hard to" stifle "free
speech in Canada."
Now what do you suppose those words mean? I'll give you a hint: the
topic under discussion has nothing to do with Mr. McVay's debating
skills (which are excellent, btw; however, given your reading
difficulties, I'll make allowances for the high probability that much
of what Mr. McVay says - whether he is debating or not - is far beyond
your obviously limited comprehension skills)
And here's another hint: If you have any proof that Mr. McVay is
"working hard to" stifle "free speech in Canada", provide it.
But in the meantime (uh Mr. McKane, is it?), I'll add my $100 to this
pot. Are you prepared to put _your_ money where your mouth is?!
Do have a nice day!
hro
=======================
Hilary Ostrov
e-mail: hos...@uniserve.com
http://haven.uniserve.com/~hostrov/
Co-Webmaster - The Nizkor Project http://www.almanac.bc.ca/
Ken McVay OBC
>kle...@awinc.com (Ken Lewis) wrote:
>>In article <4p4kda$f...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>, kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca
>>says...
>>>$100 from me, if you can.
>>>$100 from Jamie McCarthy, if you can.
>>>$200 from you, if you can't.
>>>Go ahead, make my day. Prove that I am "working hard to" stifle "free
>>>speech in Canada."
>><SNICKER> A bet as safe as this? I'll throw my $100 in too.
> How old are you guys ? Mr. McVay,you do not debate,you play childish,
> in your face attacks.
Translation from the aardvarkese: "I can't prove you are doing
anything to stifle free speech. So, while I will take
exception to what you are doing, I sure as hell won't put my
money where my mouth is."
--
The Nizkor Project (Canada) - An Electronic Holocaust Educational Resource
[Ftp] http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?
[Europe] ftp://nizkor.iam.uni-bonn.de/pub/nizkor/
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/ (Under construction - permanently!)......unlearn
Ronald C. Schoedel
Ron <rMc...@Gramercy.ios.com> wrote:
> How old are you guys ? Mr. McVay,you do not debate,you play childish,
> in your face attacks.
<yawn> So what's new? I go away for five months and hope that maybe just
maybe McOyVay might have at least grown up a bit, but alas, still the same
old childish Kenny "waaaaaaaaaaaaah" McOyVay.
Rev. Ron
Ken McVay OBC
In article <4psu6n$2...@liberator.concentric.net>,
><yawn> So what's new? I go away for five months and hope that maybe just
>maybe McOyVay might have at least grown up a bit, but alas, still the same
>old childish Kenny "waaaaaaaaaaaaah" McOyVay.
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/hweb/people/s/schoedel-ronald/
Matt Giwer
"Ronald C. Schoedel" <scho...@alaska.net> wrote:
>Ron <rMc...@Gramercy.ios.com> wrote:
>> How old are you guys ? Mr. McVay,you do not debate,you play childish,
>> in your face attacks.
><yawn> So what's new? I go away for five months and hope that maybe just
>maybe McOyVay might have at least grown up a bit, but alas, still the same
>old childish Kenny "waaaaaaaaaaaaah" McOyVay.
>Rev. Ron
>http://www.alaska.net/~schoedel
Consider for the moment that he is the idol, the role model, the
DIRECTOR of Nizkor.
Consider his five or six adoring fans in the Nizkor Gang of
Contributors.
Consider this is the best the defense of holocaust orthodoxy has to
offer.
This is the gas station attendant defenders of the true faith.
This is the leader of a gang of future gas station attendents who can
not master the basics of setting up and running a website resulting in
one of the slowest sites on the web despite the lack of enhancements.
Consider them as the lilies of the field, neither do they sow nor do
they reap nor do they say anything comprehensible.
Lary Myles
In article <4prgia$2...@news.ios.com>, rMc...@Gramercy.ios.com says...
>
>kle...@awinc.com (Ken Lewis) wrote:
>>
>><SNICKER> A bet as safe as this? I'll throw my $100 in too.
>>
> in your face attacks.
Believe it or not, this McVay loser is about the same age as me (48)!! I was
astounded that this embarrasment to the Jews was over 12 years old..as his
message quality leaves much to be desired. I caught his act in person during
one of those lame holocaust seminars--and as I stated earlier..he's even an
embarrasment to the Jews he's supposed to be sniggling up to.
Might even be something in his upbringing that leaves a bit desired..as some
time ago he went on the offensive on behalf of a guy (Karl Pollack) who, on
the strength of his own 100+ messages is squarely on the side of pedophiles
and their rights. So..beware.
larry
Lary Myles
In article <4ps4bd$n...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>, kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca
says...
>anything to stifle free speech. So, while I will take
>exception to what you are doing, I sure as hell won't put my
>money where my mouth is."
Ahhh...it's Mr. OiMcVay!! Still beating up on little folks I see. As far as
you not putting up your money where your mouth is...what a surprise. But then
again, as you continue to waste your time embarrasing the Jews in our
community, I guess that comes as no surprise.
I'm really not that surprised to see that you are an anti-Freedom of Speecher
as well.
Goes with the territory. I'm curious..are you still on the side of Karl
Pollack..the guy who is pro-pedophile?
larry
Lary Myles
In article <4ps8m7$l...@atlas.uniserve.com>, hos...@uniserve.com says...
>
>
>Wrong little fella! Maybe you should learn to read before you engage
>your keyboard. First of all, just cast your eyes upwards slightly on
>the page. Do you see the words:
>
>skills (which are excellent, btw; however, given your reading
Whoa now, babe..
Of course you are going to be on the side of Lamester McVay..after all, both
of you are working together on the alleged holocaust theory. Shame, shame.
larry
Lary Myles
In article <4psu6n$2...@liberator.concentric.net>, scho...@alaska.net says...
>
>
><yawn> So what's new? I go away for five months and hope that maybe just
>maybe McOyVay might have at least grown up a bit, but alas, still the same
>old childish Kenny "waaaaaaaaaaaaah" McOyVay.
Wish all you want, but this old grey beard is *still* into combatting young
users with his lame argumentes. And every once in awhile, he unleashes the
ditz that works for him. Hah! Somehow he thinks the babe backing him up gives
him credibility. Even in the Jewish community this guy is considered a kook.
larry
Lary Myles
In article <4ptqbr$h...@dfw-ixnews5.ix.netcom.com>, mgi...@ix.netcom.com
says...
>
> Consider for the moment that he is the idol, the role model, the
>DIRECTOR of Nizkor.
>
Look..you can't fault the fool for finding something where he can cadge a few
bucks. I'm doing some work right now with an advocacy group as well..but we
are a hell of a lot slicker than this buffoon. Direct mailing lists, 900
numbers and over $1M canadian bucks to make it all fly. So, although McVay
is small potatotes, at least he has a wrinkle that if worked properly can
make him some money.
> Consider his five or six adoring fans in the Nizkor Gang of
>Contributors.
Hey! Nothing wrong with the wing-nut having a hard core of contributors...for
if he didn't have those guys, he would be out on his duff. I'm just amazed
that he picked this kind of overworked theme to use for fund-raising. There
are some great areas..mainly south of the border that could make him
millions. I'll wager though,that he just doesn't have the smarts to make
something like that fly.
Consider this is the best the defense of holocaust orthodoxy has to
>offer.
>
> This is the gas station attendant defenders of the true faith.
>
> This is the leader of a gang of future gas station attendents who
Tsk-tsk..so, is Nutty McVay a gas jockey! At his age...well, in defense of
that, at least the loser isn't so lame as to be collecting welfare.
can
>not master the basics of setting up and running a website resulting in
>one of the slowest sites on the web despite the lack of enhancements.
A website! Hell, our gang just got our server up and running, selected target
markets and have a crew of tele-marketers all ready to go. The poor bastard,
now I can see why he is so bitter.
> Consider them as the lilies of the field, neither do they sow nor do
>they reap nor do they say anything comprehensible.
Nah..McVay isn't that bad. Not at all. Within the Jewish community, he's
either pitied or tolerated. Sad..as at his age, it would be nice if he had
succeeded at his little ploy.
larry
Matt Giwer
Lmy...@direct.ca (Lary Myles) wrote:
>In article <4ps4bd$n...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>, kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca
>says...
>>anything to stifle free speech. So, while I will take
>>exception to what you are doing, I sure as hell won't put my
>>money where my mouth is."
>Ahhh...it's Mr. OiMcVay!! Still beating up on little folks I see. As far as
>you not putting up your money where your mouth is...what a surprise. But then
>again, as you continue to waste your time embarrasing the Jews in our
>community, I guess that comes as no surprise.
>I'm really not that surprised to see that you are an anti-Freedom of Speecher
>as well.
Actually he is very much in favor of free speech. He simply wants to
deport those who exercise it so they can speak freely some place else.
Matt Giwer
At 07:15 PM 6/15/96 -0700, you wrote:
>In article <4ptqbr$h...@dfw-ixnews5.ix.netcom.com>, mgi...@ix.netcom.com
>says...
>>
>> Consider for the moment that he is the idol, the role model, the
>>DIRECTOR of Nizkor.
>>
>
>Look..you can't fault the fool for finding something where he can cadge a few
>bucks. I'm doing some work right now with an advocacy group as well..but we
>are a hell of a lot slicker than this buffoon. Direct mailing lists, 900
>numbers and over $1M canadian bucks to make it all fly. So, although McVay
>is small potatotes, at least he has a wrinkle that if worked properly can
>make him some money.
So where are you hiding it? Even in Canadian that is real
money.
>> Consider his five or six adoring fans in the Nizkor Gang of
>>Contributors.
>
>Hey! Nothing wrong with the wing-nut having a hard core of contributors...for
>if he didn't have those guys, he would be out on his duff. I'm just amazed
>that he picked this kind of overworked theme to use for fund-raising. There
>are some great areas..mainly south of the border that could make him
>millions. I'll wager though,that he just doesn't have the smarts to make
>something like that fly.
It is like putting up a porn site and then bragging about the
hits. It sells in some markets.
> Consider this is the best the defense of holocaust orthodoxy has to
>>offer.
>>
>> This is the gas station attendant defenders of the true faith.
>>
>> This is the leader of a gang of future gas station attendents who
>
>Tsk-tsk..so, is Nutty McVay a gas jockey! At his age...well, in defense of
>that, at least the loser isn't so lame as to be collecting welfare.
At least it is honest work. What I can fault is his apparent
reluctance to discuss it. If he were a pimp I could understand.
>>can
>>not master the basics of setting up and running a website resulting in
>>one of the slowest sites on the web despite the lack of enhancements.
>A website! Hell, our gang just got our server up and running, selected target
>markets and have a crew of tele-marketers all ready to go. The poor bastard,
>now I can see why he is so bitter.
My son and a friend got an entire ISP up in less than a month
while doing their primary jobs at the shop. I didn't know how to spell
HTML last August and my site went up in October. I have know idea why
they think they have accomplished anything.
>> Consider them as the lilies of the field, neither do they sow nor do
>>they reap nor do they say anything comprehensible.
>
>Nah..McVay isn't that bad. Not at all. Within the Jewish community, he's
>either pitied or tolerated. Sad..as at his age, it would be nice if he had
>succeeded at his little ploy.
He appears to have found a way to sucker in at least one
congregation.
Daniel Keren
[Followup = alt.revisionism]
mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer)
writes:
[About Ken McVay]
# Actually he is very much in favor of free speech. He simply
# wants to deport those who exercise it so they can speak freely
# some place else.
To the best of my knowledge, Mr. McVay does not at all support
deporting anyone.
Unless you can prove that he does, we will have another proof that
you are a pathological liar.
-Danny Keren.
Ronald C. Schoedel
mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer) wrote:
> It is like putting up a porn site and then bragging about the
>hits. It sells in some markets.
The problem though, is that McOyVay's website is sooooooo sluggish and poorly
put together, I can never get through. Even when I try to check the crap
URL's he posts, I can't get through. Now, there is no way he can say it's because
so many other people are getting through. I get through to the website at
cnn.com just fine numerous times a day, and somehow I think more people are
checking cnn.com than zinkor.crap. The truth is, Kenny's website (or lack
thereof) is lousily put-together, looks like a first-grader's demonstration
of what he learned in HTML today, and contained nothing of any real substance last
time I did get through.
>>Tsk-tsk..so, is Nutty McVay a gas jockey! At his age...well, in defense of
>>that, at least the loser isn't so lame as to be collecting welfare.
>
> At least it is honest work. What I can fault is his apparent
>reluctance to discuss it. If he were a pimp I could understand.
Prior to ringing up slurpees and plunging toilets and pumping gas, Ken McVay GSA
was collecting government money, according to someone else who said he said it himself
somewhere. I would check and get the exact quote, but I can't get through to that
damn crappy website of his.
As for his apparent reluctance to discuss it: that's because all his friends here
continually make fun of so-called "white trash". His friends here mock menial labour.
Kenny McVay is the epitome of both. Not to mention a childish, whiny liar. He asks
his 20 questions game, and when he doesn't like the answers given him,. he whines and
pouts and sends the same 20 questions another gazillion times...all the meanwhile,
IGNORING anything asked of him.
As for being a pimp...actually, Kenny is nothing more than a PROSTITUTE, to be
honest. A white-trash, race-traitor, gas-pumping, candy-bar ringing-upping paid
prostitute of the synagogue boys.
>>A website! Hell, our gang just got our server up and running, selected target
>>markets and have a crew of tele-marketers all ready to go. The poor bastard,
>>now I can see why he is so bitter.
And a slow, poorly-designed website at that...
> My son and a friend got an entire ISP up in less than a month
>while doing their primary jobs at the shop. I didn't know how to spell
>HTML last August and my site went up in October. I have know idea why
>they think they have accomplished anything.
If they weren't doing this for "the chosen people" no one would pay any attention
ti the Zinkor project. It offers nothing of worth. it's only because it's on
behalf of "twelve millions souls ruthlessly destroyed by Adolf Hitler" (a number
even more laughable than the already over-inflated false figure of 6 million...
talking about cooking the numbers, whew boy!) that anyone even recognizes the lousy
site.
Ken McVay GSA's (a/k/a Ken McVay OBC - Odour of British Columbia) website has
accomplished nothing other than bilking a few dumb souls out of some money, wasting
internet bandwidth, and actually contributing to the cause of "anti-semitism"!
Cheers,
Rev. Ron
Lary Myles
In article <4q039v$2...@dfw-ixnews4.ix.netcom.com>, mgi...@ix.netcom.com
says...
>
>>I'm really not that surprised to see that you are an anti-Freedom of
Speecher
>>as well.
>
to
>deport those who exercise it so they can speak freely some place else.
Yes, well..he and his pro-pedophile buddy, Karl Pollack are in the same boat
there. pedo-Pollack bleats about being on the side of FoS, but when someone
used to challenge the crackpot on Fido, he'd give them the boot. As it is
now, a friend at our server company has told me that the reason I can't get
my posts on BC.Politics is that pedo-Pollack bleated and complained that I'm
'terrorizing' him with my constant references to his pro-peodophile stance.
So much for FoS.
Now as far as OiVay goes..a sad man, who is possibly the worst market man in
the advocacy business. Bitter,inept and an actual embarrasment to the very
community that he tells us he serves.
I feel only pity for this wing-nut.
larry
pgroff
On 14 Jun 1996 23:56:07 GMT, "Ronald C. Schoedel"
<scho...@alaska.net> wrote:
>Ron <rMc...@Gramercy.ios.com> wrote:
>> How old are you guys ? Mr. McVay,you do not debate,you play childish,
>> in your face attacks.
>
>
><yawn> So what's new? I go away for five months and hope that maybe just
>maybe McOyVay might have at least grown up a bit, but alas, still the same
>old childish Kenny "waaaaaaaaaaaaah" McOyVay.
>
>Rev. Ron
>
(Rev's address snipped)
Say Rev, with you having been gone all of five months, I would have
though _YOU_ would have smartned up and accepted the fact that you
were a lying fool before and you are now, seems you just can't grow up
now can you. Rev?? yeah right.
_______________________________________________________________________
Mr. Giwer is, as far as I can determine, a troller whose only
interest is in causing fights. While he can sound superficially
plausible, he has lied about what has been said in exchanges (while
accusing others of lying), refused to document claims, pretended not to
see posts which contain documented refutation of his claims (even when
they have been emailed to him), engaged in actual libel, and generally
conducted himself with such complete lack of intellectual and factual
integrity that there seems to be no point in taking the time to read and
respond. For detailed and documented evidence of this, please refer to
_______________________________________________________________________
URL http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/g/giwer.matt
P. GROFF
Jamie McCarthy
"Ronald C. Schoedel" <scho...@alaska.net> wrote:
> The problem though, is that McOyVay's website is sooooooo sluggish and
> poorly put together, I can never get through. Even when I try to
> check the crap URL's he posts, I can't get through. Now, there is no
> way he can say it's because so many other people are getting through.
I might just say that, actually, since 700 or so people stop by our web site
each day, and they're all accessing it through a 28.8 modem.
That's not a secret, by the way. http://www.almanac.bc.ca/stats/
> I get through to the website at cnn.com just fine...
Well, that would be the difference between a 28.8 modem and a T3.
> ...Ken McVay GSA was collecting government money, according to someone
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> else who said he said it himself somewhere.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Heh! Mr. Schoedel, you say the darndest things. If that doesn't typify
the racist/religious-wacko/Jew-hating/Holocaust-denier attitude, I don't
know what does.
You know it must be true, because you heard it from:
"...someone else...
...who said he said it himself...
...somewhere."
Gorgeous.
> As for being a pimp...actually, Kenny is nothing more than a
> PROSTITUTE, to be honest. A white-trash, race-traitor, gas-pumping,
> candy-bar ringing-upping paid prostitute of the synagogue boys.
Good quote, Mr. Schoedel.
Let's not forget another good quote of yours:
I make no bones about the fact that the filthy jews, the
subhumans who are the spawn of satan, will be utterly wiped
out...every last one of them.
I invite readers to see more of Mr. Schoedel's wit and wisdom at:
http://www.almanca.bc.ca/hweb/people/s/schoedel-ronald/
Posted/emailed.
Lary Myles
>The problem though, is that McOyVay's website is sooooooo sluggish and
poorly
>put together, I can never get through. Even when I try to check the crap
>URL's he posts, I can't get through. Now, there is no way he can say it's
because
>so many other people are getting through. I get through to the website at
>cnn.com just fine numerous times a day, and somehow I think more people are
>checking cnn.com than zinkor.crap. The truth is, Kenny's website (or lack
>thereof) is lousily put-together, looks like a first-grader's demonstration
>of what he learned in HTML today, and contained nothing of any real
substance last
>time I did get through.
Ahhh...well, then the rumors are true. McVay is an ex-Welfarian with ZERO
skills. I had to wonder a while ago, as to what this obvious loon was doing
working the Holocaust pitch. First of all, it's been done to death, and
second of all, he needs to get more involved in the Jewish Community. As it
stands now, here in Vancouver at least, he's little else than an
embarrasment.
>Prior to ringing up slurpees and plunging toilets and pumping gas, Ken McVay
GSA
>was collecting government money, according to someone else who said he said
it himself
>somewhere. I would check and get the exact quote, but I can't get through
to that
>damn crappy website of his.
Yes, that is what I have heard. I was actually defending this wing-nut this
morning, but an ex-sysop called me and told me that McVay wasn't worth all
the print he's getting,...and the (strong) rumor is that he's a whiner, a
no-account and has\had his hand in the public purse. Why am I not surprised?
>As for his apparent reluctance to discuss it: that's because all his
friends here
>continually make fun of so-called "white trash". His friends here mock
menial labour.
This pisses me off. If McVay is working his day-job to the best of his
ability, then he needs not be mocked. As stated, at least..he is not a
Welfarian piece of trash.
>Kenny McVay is the epitome of both. Not to mention a childish, whiny liar.
He asks
>his 20 questions game, and when he doesn't like the answers given him,. he
whines and
>pouts and sends the same 20 questions another gazillion times...all the
meanwhile,
>IGNORING anything asked of him.
That is just a bargaing\debating ploy. Guys like him usually find this
formula and then stick to it...come hell or high water.
>Ken McVay GSA's (a/k/a Ken McVay OBC - Odour of British Columbia) website
has
>accomplished nothing other than bilking a few dumb souls out of some money,
wasting
>internet bandwidth, and actually contributing to the cause of
"anti-semitism"!
Well, all's fair in love and war. I think that if Oi McVay can cadge a few
bucks from his lame little pitch..more power to him. But if its the advocacy
game that he is looking to milk, there are a lot more sweeter cows out there
than the old and hoary holocaust issue. BUT..then, it takes money to really
do the job right. Setting up a web site is only one teeeny area. He will need
mailing lists and 900 numbers and an infrastructure as well as a marketing
plan. I'm doing one now, and will let you know down the road how it goes.
Can't really get into it now, as part of the deal is a nine month
non-disclosure or discussion clause.
larry
Matt Giwer
"Ronald C. Schoedel" <scho...@alaska.net> wrote:
>mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer) wrote:
>> It is like putting up a porn site and then bragging about the
>>hits. It sells in some markets.
>The problem though, is that McOyVay's website is sooooooo sluggish and poorly
>put together, I can never get through. Even when I try to check the crap
>URL's he posts, I can't get through. Now, there is no way he can say it's because
>so many other people are getting through. I get through to the website at
>cnn.com just fine numerous times a day, and somehow I think more people are
>checking cnn.com than zinkor.crap. The truth is, Kenny's website (or lack
>thereof) is lousily put-together, looks like a first-grader's demonstration
>of what he learned in HTML today, and contained nothing of any real substance last
>time I did get through.
It is unexplainably slow. Almost as though they were feeding it with a
28.8 rather than a T1 line. But if you really want to take a look
around, run your browser in the background while answering the mail.
>>>Tsk-tsk..so, is Nutty McVay a gas jockey! At his age...well, in defense of
>>>that, at least the loser isn't so lame as to be collecting welfare.
>>
>> At least it is honest work. What I can fault is his apparent
>>reluctance to discuss it. If he were a pimp I could understand.
>Prior to ringing up slurpees and plunging toilets and pumping gas, Ken McVay GSA
>was collecting government money, according to someone else who said he said it himself
>somewhere. I would check and get the exact quote, but I can't get through to that
>damn crappy website of his.
>As for his apparent reluctance to discuss it: that's because all his friends here
>continually make fun of so-called "white trash". His friends here mock menial labour.
>Kenny McVay is the epitome of both. Not to mention a childish, whiny liar. He asks
>his 20 questions game, and when he doesn't like the answers given him,. he whines and
>pouts and sends the same 20 questions another gazillion times...all the meanwhile,
>IGNORING anything asked of him.
Don't be so hard on him. It took him years to put the questions
together. You can't expect variety from someone like that.
>As for being a pimp...actually, Kenny is nothing more than a PROSTITUTE, to be
>honest. A white-trash, race-traitor, gas-pumping, candy-bar ringing-upping paid
>prostitute of the synagogue boys.
>>>A website! Hell, our gang just got our server up and running, selected target
>>>markets and have a crew of tele-marketers all ready to go. The poor bastard,
>>>now I can see why he is so bitter.
>And a slow, poorly-designed website at that...
>> My son and a friend got an entire ISP up in less than a month
>>while doing their primary jobs at the shop. I didn't know how to spell
>>HTML last August and my site went up in October. I have know idea why
>>they think they have accomplished anything.
>If they weren't doing this for "the chosen people" no one would pay any attention
>ti the Zinkor project. It offers nothing of worth. it's only because it's on
>behalf of "twelve millions souls ruthlessly destroyed by Adolf Hitler" (a number
>even more laughable than the already over-inflated false figure of 6 million...
>talking about cooking the numbers, whew boy!) that anyone even recognizes the lousy
>site.
>Ken McVay GSA's (a/k/a Ken McVay OBC - Odour of British Columbia) website has
>accomplished nothing other than bilking a few dumb souls out of some money, wasting
>internet bandwidth, and actually contributing to the cause of "anti-semitism"!
Give the server, they are not wasting much bandwidth. They might as well
be using a normal phone line.
Andy Walton
In article <4q1ajl$b...@liberator.concentric.net>, "Ronald C. Schoedel"
<scho...@alaska.net> wrote:
:The problem though, is that McOyVay's website is sooooooo sluggish and poorly
:put together, I can never get through. Even when I try to check the crap
:URL's he posts, I can't get through. Now, there is no way he can say it's
:because so many other people are getting through. I get through to the
:website at cnn.com just fine numerous times a day, and somehow I think more
:people are checking cnn.com than zinkor.crap.
Probably so. CNN.com is an outlet of a massive media organization
committed to maintaining a massive presence on the 'net, and thus has the
funding to maintain several high-powered servers. You will find that the
Microsoft, Netscape, Apple, Intel, and Yahoo sites are generally among the
fastest around.
Ken, I assume, is running on much more modest hardware and bandwidth. Even
with far, far less traffic, his site is more effected by it; Greyhound can
carry millions of passengers a day, but my car with a dozen people in it
will be sluggish.
I've tried many of the URLs Ken has posted recently, and they've worked
for me; I keep odd hours, though. Try again during less busy hours.
:Prior to ringing up slurpees and plunging toilets and pumping gas, Ken McVay
:GSA was collecting government money, according to someone else who said he
:said it himself somewhere.
Now THERE's an unimpeachable source.
:I would check and get the exact quote, but I can't get through to that
:damn crappy website of his.
What URL? I'd be glad to forward it to the group.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
"We were once so close to heaven, Peter came out and gave us medals
declaring us the nicest of the damned." --They Might Be Giants
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andy Walton * att...@mindspring.com * http://www.mindspring.com/~atticus
Ken McVay OBC
In article <atticus-1606...@atticus.mindspring.com>,
att...@mindspring.com (Andy Walton) wrote:
[teeny-bopper complaining about sluggish Nizkor web site snipped]
>Ken, I assume, is running on much more modest hardware and bandwidth. Even
>with far, far less traffic, his site is more effected by it; Greyhound can
>carry millions of passengers a day, but my car with a dozen people in it
>will be sluggish.
Yup. Nizkor.almanac.bc.ca is a simple 486 Dx25, connected via
28.8 Kb PPP link. It is barely able to keep up with the 700 to
900 daily visitors it gets now, and our stats
(http://www.almanac.bc.ca/stats/) suggest that we have max'd our bandwidth.
>I've tried many of the URLs Ken has posted recently, and they've worked
>for me; I keep odd hours, though. Try again during less busy hours.
Well, as noted, hundreds of people do get their files, but
then perhaps teeny-bopper has a problem with timing... I guess
he'll just have to get used to always being at the end of the
line, at least until late summer.
Nizkor, however, would not want even Mr. Schoedel to miss
getting an education, and we have taken some positive steps to
alleviate the problem. Our German mirror site,
ftp://nizkor.iam.uni-bonn.de/pub/nizkor/, was the first one,
but we assume that Mr. Schoedel doesn't know how to use such a
resource.
In a very short time, just to keep Mr. Schoedel's rigii happy,
Nizkor will open two full-mirror Nizkor web sites. One of
them will operate out of Toronto, the other from San Antonio,
Texas. At about the same time the Texas server comes on-line,
nizkor.almanac.bc.ca, reconfigured in a 150MHz Pentium box,
will be upgraded to fibre.
Until then, Mr. Schoedel will just have to keep trying :-)
He may wish to continue until he retrieves
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/hweb/people/s/schoedel-ronald/
which is, after all, dedicated to his words and his words
alone :-)
Lynn Diana Gazis
Lary Myles (Lmy...@direct.ca) wrote:
: In article <4ps4bd$n...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>, kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca
: says...
: >anything to stifle free speech. So, while I will take
: >exception to what you are doing, I sure as hell won't put my
: >money where my mouth is."
: Ahhh...it's Mr. OiMcVay!! Still beating up on little folks I see. As far as
: you not putting up your money where your mouth is...what a surprise. But then
This is as dishonest a way of quoting a Usenet posting as I've ever
seen. You know darn well, having seen the rest of the post this was
snipped from, that the beginning of this says that Ken McVay's accusers
can't show that he is doing anything to stifle free speech, and that it
is them he is charging with not being willing to put their money where
their mouth is.
Given your obvious dishonesty in the way you pulled and interpreted this
quote, I'm hardly going to believe you on your other insinuations.
Follow-ups trimmed appropriately.
Lynn Gazis-Sax
Matt Giwer
att...@mindspring.com (Andy Walton) wrote:
>In article <4q1ajl$b...@liberator.concentric.net>, "Ronald C. Schoedel"
><scho...@alaska.net> wrote:
> :The problem though, is that McOyVay's website is sooooooo sluggish and poorly
> :put together, I can never get through. Even when I try to check the crap
> :URL's he posts, I can't get through. Now, there is no way he can say it's
> :because so many other people are getting through. I get through to the
> :website at cnn.com just fine numerous times a day, and somehow I think more
> :people are checking cnn.com than zinkor.crap.
>Probably so. CNN.com is an outlet of a massive media organization
>committed to maintaining a massive presence on the 'net, and thus has the
>funding to maintain several high-powered servers. You will find that the
>Microsoft, Netscape, Apple, Intel, and Yahoo sites are generally among the
>fastest around.
>Ken, I assume, is running on much more modest hardware and bandwidth. Even
>with far, far less traffic, his site is more effected by it; Greyhound can
>carry millions of passengers a day, but my car with a dozen people in it
>will be sluggish.
Good sir, leave the technical knowledge to those who have it. You can
get my website (www2.combase.com/~mgiwer) as fast as you can get
cnn.com. Combase has a single T1 line. You can't get any less than a
T1 line and call yourself an ISP.
The best thing for them would be to be hosted on a decent ISP. I would
guess the one they are using has everything stuffed onto one machine
instead of partitioning it into multiples as anyone who knows what they
are doing would do. They may have done that but bought the cheapest
LANs they could get.
Matt Giwer
kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca (Ken McVay OBC) wrote:
>In article <atticus-1606...@atticus.mindspring.com>,
>att...@mindspring.com (Andy Walton) wrote:
>[teeny-bopper complaining about sluggish Nizkor web site snipped]
>>Ken, I assume, is running on much more modest hardware and bandwidth. Even
>>with far, far less traffic, his site is more effected by it; Greyhound can
>>carry millions of passengers a day, but my car with a dozen people in it
>>will be sluggish.
>Yup. Nizkor.almanac.bc.ca is a simple 486 Dx25, connected via
>28.8 Kb PPP link. It is barely able to keep up with the 700 to
>900 daily visitors it gets now, and our stats
>(http://www.almanac.bc.ca/stats/) suggest that we have max'd our bandwidth.
Bingo! Exactly what I said. You don't even have a T1 line. Am I right
or am I right!?!
You have a primitive piece of shit computer over a phone line exactly as
I said. My son set that up for himself in half an hour just for
conveniece at home. So who gave you the fixed IP address and at what
price?
>>I've tried many of the URLs Ken has posted recently, and they've worked
>>for me; I keep odd hours, though. Try again during less busy hours.
>Well, as noted, hundreds of people do get their files, but
>then perhaps teeny-bopper has a problem with timing... I guess
>he'll just have to get used to always being at the end of the
>line, at least until late summer.
Webcom or Combase can do better for you in an instant.
crw...@netins.net
Following is some disscussion about access to Nizkor. All of my words are
here at the at the front.
I have never seen any serious delay in reading Ken's pages. This morning
it loaded quickly, and just now it loaded in about the same time as my ISP's
page.
In any case the content and quality is more important than the hardware
it runs on.
Charles R Ward
crw...@netins.net
Hilary Ostrov
In <4pvppf$p...@orb.direct.ca>, Lmy...@direct.ca (Lary Myles) wrote:
[snip]
>Of course you are going to be on the side of Lamester McVay..after all, both
>of you are working together on the alleged holocaust theory. Shame, shame.
>larry
"Alleged holocaust theory"? Are you attempting to elevate the
denier/distortionist myths and lies to the status of a "theory"? The
shame, Mr. Myles - as all reasonable people are fully aware - is all
yours.
Hilary Ostrov
In <4pvq0r$p...@orb.direct.ca>, Lmy...@direct.ca (Lary Myles)
demonstrates his mastery of "revisionist scholarship":
>In article <4ps4bd$n...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>, kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca
>says...
>>anything to stifle free speech. So, while I will take
>>exception to what you are doing, I sure as hell won't put my
>>money where my mouth is."
>Ahhh...it's Mr. OiMcVay!! Still beating up on little folks I see. As far as
>you not putting up your money where your mouth is...what a surprise. But then
Actually what Mr. McVay wrote was a response to the following:
How old are you guys ? Mr. McVay,you do not debate,you play
childish, in your face attacks.
The full text of Mr. McVay's response is as follows:
Translation from the aardvarkese: "I can't prove you are doing
anything to stifle free speech. So, while I will take
exception to what you are doing, I sure as hell won't put my
money where my mouth is."
>again, as you continue to waste your time embarrasing the Jews in our
>community, I guess that comes as no surprise.
Wrong again, Mr. Myles! The only people Mr. McVay embarrasses in our
community are the deceptive ignorant bigots whom he regularly exposes
as the blight on humanity that they invariably prove themselves to be.
>I'm really not that surprised to see that you are an anti-Freedom of Speecher
>as well.
If indeed that is what you "see", Mr. Myles, may I suggest either some
remedial reading classes or a visit to your optometrist.
hro
Matt Giwer
crw...@netins.net wrote:
>Charles R Ward
>crw...@netins.net
Shut off your disk cache and see what happens. Delete the entire cache.
He has clearly posted that his connection is via a 28.8 modem. If it
comes in as fast as you would expect from a real server, you are looking
at your cache.
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Where smoke and flame stories come from
From: mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer)
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 22:16:02 GMT
1/12/85
According to the Toronto Globe and Mail, Arnold Friedman swore
under oath that he had
seen "fourteen foot flames" shooting out of the chimneys of
crematorium at Auschwitz, and
that he was able to tell whether the Nazis were burning fat Jewish
Hungarians or skinny
Jewish Poles by looking at the different colors of the smoke and
flames coming out of the
crematorium. On cross-examination, however, Mr. Friedman reversed
himself upon being
presented with details of crematorium operation, and was forced to
agree that perhaps
Jews were not being burned in crematoria buildings. Mr. Friedman
then made the startling
confession that his entire testimony was based on what he had been
told by others.
Mike Curtis
Lmy...@direct.ca (Lary Myles) wrote:
>Well, all's fair in love and war. I think that if Oi McVay can cadge a few
>bucks from his lame little pitch..more power to him. But if its the advocacy
>game that he is looking to milk, there are a lot more sweeter cows out there
>than the old and hoary holocaust issue. BUT..then, it takes money to really
>do the job right. Setting up a web site is only one teeeny area. He will need
>mailing lists and 900 numbers and an infrastructure as well as a marketing
>plan. I'm doing one now, and will let you know down the road how it goes.
>Can't really get into it now, as part of the deal is a nine month
>non-disclosure or discussion clause.
This is a new approach. Because Ken McVay is not liked by deniers,
racists, and antisemites the Holocaust didn't happen. What a bunch of
stupid morons. This kind of attack dog sniping does nothing to promote
you guys in the eyes of anyone. In fact it kind of make Mr. McVay
appear to be a martyr.
Matt Giwer
hos...@uniserve.com (Hilary Ostrov) wrote:
So you are laying McVay. The pictures becomes more clear.
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: Not close inded! Keren bullshits again
From: mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer)
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 21:43:39 GMT
Hey, Keren! Where is your story about the Polish "spies" not getting
close this time?
" The second building [at Treblinka] consists of three chambers and a
boiler-room. The steam
generated in the boilers is led by means of pipes to the chambers. There
are terracota floors in
the chambers which become very slippery when wet ... All victims had to
strip off their clothes and
shoes, which were collected afterwards, whereupon all victims, women and
children first, were
driven into the death chambers. Those too slow or too weak to move
quickly were driven on by
rifle butts, by whipping and kicking...Many slipped and fell, the next
victims pressed forward and
stumbled over them. Small children were simply thrown inside. After
being filled up to capacity the
chambers were hermetically closed and steam was let in. In a few minutes
all was over. "
IMT XXXII - pp. 156-157.
Matt Giwer
hos...@uniserve.com (Hilary Ostrov) wrote:
>In <4pvppf$p...@orb.direct.ca>, Lmy...@direct.ca (Lary Myles) wrote:
>[snip]
>>Of course you are going to be on the side of Lamester McVay..after all, both
>>of you are working together on the alleged holocaust theory. Shame, shame.
>>larry
>"Alleged holocaust theory"? Are you attempting to elevate the
>denier/distortionist myths and lies to the status of a "theory"? The
>shame, Mr. Myles - as all reasonable people are fully aware - is all
>yours.
>=======================
>Hilary Ostrov
>e-mail: hos...@uniserve.com
>http://haven.uniserve.com/~hostrov/
>Co-Webmaster - The Nizkor Project http://www.almanac.bc.ca/
Myths like this description of the steaming equipment you mean?
Matt Giwer
mcu...@eden.com (Mike Curtis) wrote:
>Lmy...@direct.ca (Lary Myles) wrote:
That is what he wants, is it not? Consider the great personal sacrifice
he makes to do this.
========
Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
Subject: What a clever way to kill people
From: mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer)
Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 21:48:00 GMT
"PAUL WALDMANN: In this small room [at Sachsenhausen] there was a slot
in the wall,
approximately 50 centimeters in length. The prisoner of war stood with
the back of his head
against the slot and a sniper shot at him from behind the slot. In
practice this arrangement did not
prove satisfactory, since the sniper often missed the prisoner. After 8
days a new arrangement
was made. The prisoner, as before, was placed against the wall; an iron
plate was then slowly
lowered onto his head. The prisoner was under the impression that he was
being measured for
height. The iron plate contained a ramrod which shot out suddenly and
poleaxed the prisoner with
a blow on the back of the head. He dropped dead. The iron plate was
operated by a foot lever in
a corner of the room. "
IMT VII - p. 377.
Andy Walton
In article <4q3bn2$k...@dfw-ixnews6.ix.netcom.com>, mgi...@ix.netcom.com
(Matt Giwer) wrote:
:Bingo! Exactly what I said. You don't even have a T1 line. Am I right
:or am I right!?!
:
:You have a primitive piece of shit computer over a phone line exactly as
:I said. My son set that up for himself in half an hour just for
:conveniece at home. So who gave you the fixed IP address and at what
:price?
Unfortunately, you've punctured one of the central tenets of the
WPRangers' objections to Ken's site -- the assumption that his site must
be funded by the Great Jew Conspiracy (tm).
He's got a 486DX25 on a dedicated 28.8 line. Assuming that 'net access is
as plentiful in the frigid hinterlands as it is here in Georgia, and that
his 486 is a home-build, Ken's total cost -- setup plus one year's
operating expenses -- runs about US$2,000. And that's a generous estimate.
In other words, Ken must be accepting money from the Elders of Zion (r),
because he spends a bit more than I do on our respective hobbies.
:>>I've tried many of the URLs Ken has posted recently, and they've worked
:>>for me; I keep odd hours, though. Try again during less busy hours.
:
:>Well, as noted, hundreds of people do get their files, but
:>then perhaps teeny-bopper has a problem with timing... I guess
:>he'll just have to get used to always being at the end of the
:>line, at least until late summer.
:
: Webcom or Combase can do better for you in an instant.
Doubt it. If he's serving 700+ pages/day over a 28.8 POTS line, he's
getting pretty close to optimal perfomance. He could use better bandwidth;
I don't know about ISDN availability in British Columbia, but it varies
widely within the U.S.
Matt Giwer
att...@mindspring.com (Andy Walton) wrote:
>In article <4q3bn2$k...@dfw-ixnews6.ix.netcom.com>, mgi...@ix.netcom.com
>(Matt Giwer) wrote:
> :Bingo! Exactly what I said. You don't even have a T1 line. Am I right
> :or am I right!?!
> :
> :You have a primitive piece of shit computer over a phone line exactly as
> :I said. My son set that up for himself in half an hour just for
> :conveniece at home. So who gave you the fixed IP address and at what
> :price?
>Unfortunately, you've punctured one of the central tenets of the
>WPRangers' objections to Ken's site -- the assumption that his site must
>be funded by the Great Jew Conspiracy (tm).
>He's got a 486DX25 on a dedicated 28.8 line. Assuming that 'net access is
>as plentiful in the frigid hinterlands as it is here in Georgia, and that
>his 486 is a home-build, Ken's total cost -- setup plus one year's
>operating expenses -- runs about US$2,000. And that's a generous estimate.
>In other words, Ken must be accepting money from the Elders of Zion (r),
>because he spends a bit more than I do on our respective hobbies.
Actually that is why I asked about the price for a fixed IP. I know of
few places offering it and usually only in connection with a dedicated
phone line. Those are cheaper than a T1 line but a long way from the
usual $20 per month el cheapo basic rate.
On the other hand, were it hosted on an ISP this set up could be had for
about $120US a month, counting the megabytes. There are six or seven
listed contributors, divide.
> :>>I've tried many of the URLs Ken has posted recently, and they've worked
> :>>for me; I keep odd hours, though. Try again during less busy hours.
> :
> :>Well, as noted, hundreds of people do get their files, but
> :>then perhaps teeny-bopper has a problem with timing... I guess
> :>he'll just have to get used to always being at the end of the
> :>line, at least until late summer.
> :
> : Webcom or Combase can do better for you in an instant.
>Doubt it. If he's serving 700+ pages/day over a 28.8 POTS line, he's
>getting pretty close to optimal perfomance. He could use better bandwidth;
>I don't know about ISDN availability in British Columbia, but it varies
>widely within the U.S.
ISDN providers will not be dropping the per minute cost in the US until
around the end of the year. It appears to depend upon cable company
competition in offering phone lines.
As to optimal performance, ONLY if the hits are averaged.
Of course the good news is that from the US one can get better service
from the mirror site in Germany.
Lary Myles
>
>"Alleged holocaust theory"? Are you attempting to elevate the
>denier/distortionist myths and lies to the status of a "theory"? The
>shame, Mr. Myles - as all reasonable people are fully aware - is all
>yours.
I'll give you a full mark for asking. Thank you. Your a lot smarter than the
idiot you toil for.
Loser McVay never did ask why I felt I had to preface holocaust with the word
'alleged'. Now, you've asked, I'll tell you.
One of my friends--who McVay would blow to have his support within the Jewish
community--and I were discussing some moron by the name of Ernst Zundel. At
the time, this idiot seemed to be getting a lot of press by saying that the
holocaust did NOT happen!! I'm sure that we all know that the incident was
in fact a real occurence. I mean, after all...did not our governments tell us
it was so. Were there not warehouses full of photo's on what the conditions
were like in the camps? Were there not (in the fifties at least) legions of
actual eye-witness survivors, ready to tell us the tales of horror? Etc.etc.
So, when this ninnie, Zundel got taken to court and his Freedom of Speech
trampled, my Jewish friend and I agreed that it was a black day for that
Freedom. In my protest against the action against Zundel, I have little
choice in using the word 'alleged' before the word holocaust.
You see...when the courts took away this total nutcase's right to freedom of
speech, there were skinners, dweebs, feebs and malcontents who were ripe for
his (Zundel) next pitch. And that pitch was that if he were so wrong in his
mission, why were the governments beating up on him? If he would have been
ignored in the first place, his star would not have risen. He would still be
some yokel, no different than the ones who run around with signs saying the
world is coming to an end.
If audiences would have shown up and politely listened to his pitch..for at
least two minutes,and then broke up laffing and guffawing...if this happened
over and over again, how long do you think it would have taken this idiot
before he would have sat down? And as long as we are on the topic of
idiots...
What would have happened in pre-Nazi Germany, if audiences would have shown
up and giggled at the ex-wallpaper hanger, and chuckled at his silly brown
uniforms..and out and out pissed themselves laffing when his storm troopers
goose stepped by on the streets.
Each time that we, as a government, sig, society take clowns too seriously
there are cadres of morons that come out of the woodwork and claw around to
share some of the moron's limelight.
Anyhow, thanks for asking...
larry
Lary Myles
>
> Myths like this description of the steaming equipment you mean?
>
Hey Matt.
I'm not sure what side of the holocaust issue that you are on. I gotta figure
that just by the sheer weight of the evidence that of course it was a hideous
reality of WWII. No doubt in my mind...
What is really interesting is how the Jews managed to market this affair
fifty years later. It's *still* a good way to hustle a buck..holocaust
advocacy. Mind you, from vistiing McVay's site, I gotta figure he's just
small spuds in the whole scheme of things.
I'd like to see some marketing done with the slaughter of the millions of
Ukranians by Stalin. Now, that was a first class--and low-tech--affair.
larry
Lary Myles
In article <4q4o6u$d...@boris.eden.com>, mcu...@eden.com says...
>
>Lmy...@direct.ca (Lary Myles) wrote:
>
>This is a new approach. Because Ken McVay is not liked by deniers,
>racists, and antisemites the Holocaust didn't happen. What a bunch of
>stupid morons. This kind of attack dog sniping does nothing to promote
>you guys in the eyes of anyone. In fact it kind of make Mr. McVay
>appear to be a martyr.
Well, from strictly a marketing slant on it all...McVay is simply an
underfunded amateur. When I asked some of the Jewish Mafia about his nibs,
all that I got was head-shakes. He's considered an embarrasment.
larry
william c anderson
Lary Myles (Lmy...@direct.ca) wrote:
: Well, from strictly a marketing slant on it all...McVay is simply an
: underfunded amateur. When I asked some of the Jewish Mafia about his nibs,
: all that I got was head-shakes. He's considered an embarrasment.
Wow! You know Meyer Lansky?
I thought he was dead...
Bill
Matt Giwer
Lmy...@direct.ca (Lary Myles) wrote:
>> Myths like this description of the steaming equipment you mean?
>Hey Matt.
>I'm not sure what side of the holocaust issue that you are on. I gotta figure
>that just by the sheer weight of the evidence that of course it was a hideous
>reality of WWII. No doubt in my mind...
WW II may be described as a hideous reality.
>What is really interesting is how the Jews managed to market this affair
>fifty years later. It's *still* a good way to hustle a buck..holocaust
>advocacy. Mind you, from vistiing McVay's site, I gotta figure he's just
>small spuds in the whole scheme of things.
As has been observed, the USHMM would be no different, with or without
the gassing. It is simply that it would not be there at all without the
gassing.
>I'd like to see some marketing done with the slaughter of the millions of
>Ukranians by Stalin. Now, that was a first class--and low-tech--affair.
1) We do not have a large Ukranian population.
2) They know that remembering it will neither change it nor prevent it
from happening again.
3) They are not professional victims.
Dave Martindale
mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer) writes:
> Actually that is why I asked about the price for a fixed IP. I know of
>few places offering it and usually only in connection with a dedicated
>phone line. Those are cheaper than a T1 line but a long way from the
>usual $20 per month el cheapo basic rate.
Well, as another data point: I have a fixed IP address when I'm connected.
My connection is via dialup SLIP using an ordinary 28.8 modem. I pay
nothing at all for the service - I get it for being part of the computer
science department at UBC. A student at that, not faculty or staff.
The actual address assignment seems to be done by the Annex terminal
server that I dial into. This is normal for everyone in the department
that uses dialin SLIP or PPP. So fixed IP addresses are not technically
difficult, it would appear.
The fact that commercial ISPs in your area do not normally offer fixed
IP addresses does not necessarily mean anything about practices in
another city (and probably another country).
Dave
Keith Morrison
Matt Giwer wrote:
> It is unexplainably slow. Almost as though they were feeding it with a
> 28.8 rather than a T1 line.
They *are* running off a 28.8, you moron.
--
Keith Morrison
t0...@unb.ca
Jamie McCarthy
att...@mindspring.com (Andy Walton) wrote:
> He's got a 486DX25 on a dedicated 28.8 line. Assuming that 'net access is
> as plentiful in the frigid hinterlands as it is here in Georgia, and that
> his 486 is a home-build, Ken's total cost -- setup plus one year's
> operating expenses -- runs about US$2,000. And that's a generous estimate.
Ah -- significantly more than that, actually. UnixWare alone set us
back about $1000, I think. And we got it over a year ago, when 486s
weren't _quite_ so cheap as now. We spent somewhat into five digits for
the current setup.
But, excepting the bandwidth, it's not a bad setup. :-)
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/other-sites/correspondence/zuendelsite/cor-4.html
> Doubt it. If he's serving 700+ pages/day over a 28.8 POTS line, he's
> getting pretty close to optimal perfomance. He could use better bandwidth;
> I don't know about ISDN availability in British Columbia, but it varies
> widely within the U.S.
We're serving 700+ _people_ per day. Average access per person is
running about 4.5 pages, so roughly 3000 pages/day. Factor in non-HTML
hits (home page GIFs, mostly) and all the other traffic we don't count
(robots, webmasters) and we're well over 4000 hits/day. And that's not
counting the FTP site! All in all we're shoving roughly a gig a month
out that modem. We're way beyond optimal performance; we're into
"creaking under the strain" performance.
Never fear, though. Matt Giwer and Ron Schoedel alerted us (snort) to
the fact that we have a bandwidth problem. Thanks to their eagle eyes,
we've decided to do something about it. Don't worry, we'll figure out
something.
Posted/emailed; followups to a.r please.
Lary Myles
In article <4q6upp$m...@sjx-ixn5.ix.netcom.com>, mgi...@ix.netcom.com says...
Yup. And right after, what Joe Stalin did to the Ukranians wasn't too pretty
either. All this patter over a disputed number of Jews buying the farm is
really interesting...but only from a marketing point of view. I mean, decades
later we come up with a tear-jerking, well made..movie, Schindlers List. And
it's a prize winner! Hah! Good for the Jews and their superior marketing
ability. Hell, if they were smart, they'd get into the Ukranian mind-set and
offer to cut them in for allowing them to front their massacre as well.
And..as *I* am talking about marketing...take a look at the pathetic McVay
and how he has managed to screw up getting his end out of this still fat cow
of cash.
>>I'd like to see some marketing done with the slaughter of the millions of
>>Ukranians by Stalin. Now, that was a first class--and low-tech--affair.
>
> 1) We do not have a large Ukranian population.
Yes, well...blame that on Joey Stalin. We lose a few million Jews and the
wailing continues over 50 years later. We lose almost an entire nation of
Ukranians and not a peep. Leads one to wonder what would have happened if
Adolfo had been able to eradicate ALL the Jews. I guess then, the French
would have jumped into the breech and we'd be watching horror movies of
croissant recipes being diddled with.
Or who knows, maybe the Germans could have made a bigger deal out of the
Allied bombing of Dresden. A piece of shit work that defied all logic.
larry
Lary Myles
In article <4q50gl$j...@dfw-ixnews7.ix.netcom.com>, mgi...@ix.netcom.com
says...
>
> That is what he wants, is it not? Consider the great personal
sacrifice
>he makes to do this.
Actually..McVay is neither compelling on stage in speech nor in his
appearance. If he wants to continue to sell into the market of Jewish
Carnival, then he must re-invent his packaging. As to McFailure wanting to
be a martyr..sure, as to who knows what goes on in the brain of an aging and
self-deluded failure.
larry
Lary Myles
In article <4q6qmi$7...@lendl.cc.emory.edu>, lib...@larry.cc.emory.edu says...
Yup, he is dead. But if you aren't aware of the diamond syndicate working out
of New York, and who runs that bit of checkerboarded business, then you are
not up with the times.
And..we'll just check and see if there are any police dudes looking over our
shoulder..and if so, they might remember one of Meyer's canadian
runners...Walter Link.
larry
Mike Curtis
mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer) wrote:
>mcu...@eden.com (Mike Curtis) wrote:
>>Lmy...@direct.ca (Lary Myles) wrote:
>>>Well, all's fair in love and war. I think that if Oi McVay can cadge a few
>>>bucks from his lame little pitch..more power to him. But if its the advocacy
>>>game that he is looking to milk, there are a lot more sweeter cows out there
>>>than the old and hoary holocaust issue. BUT..then, it takes money to really
>>>do the job right. Setting up a web site is only one teeeny area. He will need
>>>mailing lists and 900 numbers and an infrastructure as well as a marketing
>>>plan. I'm doing one now, and will let you know down the road how it goes.
>>>Can't really get into it now, as part of the deal is a nine month
>>>non-disclosure or discussion clause.
>>This is a new approach. Because Ken McVay is not liked by deniers,
>>racists, and antisemites the Holocaust didn't happen. What a bunch of
>>stupid morons. This kind of attack dog sniping does nothing to promote
>>you guys in the eyes of anyone. In fact it kind of make Mr. McVay
>>appear to be a martyr.
> That is what he wants, is it not? Consider the great personal sacrifice
>he makes to do this.
Yes, some of us make a great personal sacrifice to deal with boobs
like you. <sigh>
Mike Curtis
White Wolf
In article <4q1t9a$s...@dfw-ixnews6.ix.netcom.com>, mgi...@ix.netcom.com
(Matt Giwer) wrote:
> "Ronald C. Schoedel" <scho...@alaska.net> wrote:
>
> >mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer) wrote:
>
> >> It is like putting up a porn site and then bragging about the
> >>hits. It sells in some markets.
>
> >The problem though, is that McOyVay's website is sooooooo sluggish and poorly
> >put together, I can never get through. Even when I try to check the crap
> >URL's he posts, I can't get through. Now, there is no way he can say
it's because
> >so many other people are getting through. I get through to the website at
> >cnn.com just fine numerous times a day, and somehow I think more people are
> >checking cnn.com than zinkor.crap. The truth is, Kenny's website (or lack
> >thereof) is lousily put-together, looks like a first-grader's demonstration
> >of what he learned in HTML today, and contained nothing of any real
substance last
> >time I did get through.
It doesn't work well with a Timex-Sinclair. Try upgrading. Maybe a Kaypro....
Hilary Ostrov
[snip]
>Actually..McVay is neither compelling on stage in speech nor in his
>appearance. If he wants to continue to sell into the market of Jewish
>Carnival, then he must re-invent his packaging. As to McFailure wanting to
>be a martyr..sure, as to who knows what goes on in the brain of an aging and
>self-deluded failure.
Ah, Mr. Myles, I see that you must be enrolled in the Zundel school of
marketing. Their motto (and they seem to live by it quite faithfully,
as you would appear to by your posts):
"Promote yourself to the hilt by attempting to smear and spreading
lies about others" Guaranteed to bring results! Watch those ignorant
societal misfits hanging on to your every word!
Forget all about facts though - Never use 'em, whatever you do. The
results are disastrous: people will mistakenly think you are an
honest person, instead of a money-grubbing shiller of swill."
Do keep up the good work though, and once you've mastered this, you
will be able to enrol in Denier 101 and then you can keep Mr. Moran
company - I'm sure he's quite lonely.
hro
Ken Lewis
[Lary Myles (Lmy...@direct.ca) wrote:
[Well, from strictly a marketing slant on it all...McVay is simply an
[underfunded amateur. When I asked some of the Jewish Mafia about his nibs,
[all that I got was head-shakes. He's considered an embarrasment.
..Wow! You know Meyer Lansky?
..I thought he was dead...
..Bill
The revisionists will deny that.
Hilary Ostrov
[snip]
>So, when this ninnie, Zundel got taken to court and his Freedom of Speech
>trampled, my Jewish friend and I agreed that it was a black day for that
>Freedom. In my protest against the action against Zundel, I have little
>choice in using the word 'alleged' before the word holocaust.
Let's stick to the facts, shall we, Mr. Myles? Zundel was prosecuted
and _convicted_ under the provisions of a long-standing (but
subsequently repealed) law prohibiting the spreading of "false news".
As Zundel himself noted at the time, he revelled in the publicity - so
much so that he _chose_ to go the path of two trials prior to even
appealing the law under which he was charged.
It seems to me that if Zundel were so concerned that his right to
"freedom of speech" was being curtailed he would have appealed the law
in the first place. It sure would have been a lot less costly for the
taxpayer, wouldn't it?! But then he would have had to forego the
chance to market himself, wouldn't he? Yep, that's good ol Ernie, any
trick in the book that will get him some attention!
Whenever I think of him, I think of the little kid who keeps taunting
another saying "Hit me! Hit me!" If at first he doesn't succeed, he
"escalates" the provoking behaviour and the taunts. And when his
victim finally can take it no more, and obliges by hitting, this
taunting bully turns around and wails to all who will listen "He hit
me". I don't know about you, and maybe it is very uncharitable of me,
but somehow I can't find an iota of sympathy for an adult who behaves
in this fashion.
In any event, Mr. Myles, unless you yourself were taken in by "this
ninnie" there is really no reason for _you_ to be using the word
"alleged" before the word "Holocaust". The "protest" excuse you gave
is very, very lame at best - and highly illogical and unintelligent at
worst.
>You see...when the courts took away this total nutcase's right to freedom of
>speech, there were skinners, dweebs, feebs and malcontents who were ripe for
>his (Zundel) next pitch. And that pitch was that if he were so wrong in his
>mission, why were the governments beating up on him? If he would have been
>ignored in the first place, his star would not have risen. He would still be
>some yokel, no different than the ones who run around with signs saying the
>world is coming to an end.
Indeed, apart from the fact that his right to freedom of speech was
not taken away, there are many who would concur with part of this
hypothesis. But "mission"? What mission - apart from the
aggrandizement of Ernst Zundel through publication and promotion of
his lies.
>If audiences would have shown up and politely listened to his pitch..for at
>least two minutes,and then broke up laffing and guffawing...if this happened
>over and over again, how long do you think it would have taken this idiot
>before he would have sat down? And as long as we are on the topic of
>idiots...
In an ideal world, that might have been a possible outcome, Mr. Myles.
However, the reality is we do not live in an ideal world (whether
virtual or real!). A case in point being that of a witless troll
whose current pitch is to flood alt.revisionism with his patent lies
and wastes of bandwidth in the hope of attracting the attention of
societal misfits.
Whether his hope has been realized, I do not know (nor do I care);
however, while the laughter he has evoked should long ago (according
to your theory) have caused him to "sit down" (and disappear into the
ether), he just keeps trolling and trolling and trolling.
The reality is, Mr. Myles, people like Zundel (and the troll) wrap
themselves in the flag of "freedom of speech" solely for the purpose
of abusing the privilege in a civilized society of reasonable people.
Like the little taunting bully, they can't stop saying "Hit me! Hit
me!"
And the other reality is that as long as they keep playing that game,
somewhere in the world they will _always_ find someone to "hit" them,
so they can turn around and wail, "He hit me."
So, you see Mr. Myles, it's not quite as cut and dried as you would
like to think. And since you - as a skilled marketer - are quite
aware, peddling lies to those who, through no fault of their own, are
innocent or uninformed (not to mention fuelling the fires of those who
choose the path of ignorance and bigotry) can do a lot of damage and
cannot be ignored. But Mr. McVay does an excellent job of exposing
the peddlers and their lies for exactly what they are - regardless of
what your "alleged" friend might have to say.
Ronald C. Schoedel
mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer) wrote:
> Good sir, leave the technical knowledge to those who have it. You can
>get my website (www2.combase.com/~mgiwer) as fast as you can get
>cnn.com.
And mine as well. If Kenny wants to be taken seriously as an internet
resource, why does he not use a real ISP that has, like, a real net
connection? I do.
>Combase has a single T1 line. You can't get any less than a
>T1 line and call yourself an ISP.
>
> The best thing for them would be to be hosted on a decent ISP.
But that would cost money, and ya know, those gas pumpers just don't
make that much!!! Especially tight-wad jewish proselytes!
Rev. Ron
http://www.alaska.net/~schoedel - one of the fastest sites around!
Ronald C. Schoedel
Keith Morrison <t0...@unb.ca> wrote:
>Matt Giwer wrote:
>
>> It is unexplainably slow. Almost as though they were feeding it with a
>> 28.8 rather than a T1 line.
>
>They *are* running off a 28.8, you moron.
Wait aminute, Matt merely identifies the crappy connection, and HE is the moron,
instead of the cheapskate McOyVay who doesn't use a real ISP or connection?
Rev. Ron
Via a beautiful T1 line: http://www.alaska.net/~schoedel
Matt Giwer
da...@cs.ubc.ca (Dave Martindale) wrote:
>mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer) writes:
>> Actually that is why I asked about the price for a fixed IP. I know of
>>few places offering it and usually only in connection with a dedicated
>>phone line. Those are cheaper than a T1 line but a long way from the
>>usual $20 per month el cheapo basic rate.
>Well, as another data point: I have a fixed IP address when I'm connected.
That only counts when you are connected. It is different every time you
connect. You could set up a server (having a good enough machine) if
you has an IP that is the same every time you call. That is the only
way you particular server address could be resolved.
>My connection is via dialup SLIP using an ordinary 28.8 modem. I pay
>nothing at all for the service - I get it for being part of the computer
>science department at UBC. A student at that, not faculty or staff.
Excuse me but if you are saying that it is thrown in by the department
you are saying nothing of interest here. If Nizkor is getting something
as a courtesy also, that is fine. If it is a commercial site, it is
normal to charge for the extra service as it makes your machine part of
the net.
>The actual address assignment seems to be done by the Annex terminal
>server that I dial into. This is normal for everyone in the department
>that uses dialin SLIP or PPP. So fixed IP addresses are not technically
>difficult, it would appear.
It is not difficult at all. It is simply a matter of getting one.
>The fact that commercial ISPs in your area do not normally offer fixed
>IP addresses does not necessarily mean anything about practices in
>another city (and probably another country).
Why would you compare a .com to an .edu? Commercial providers have to
make a profit rather than be subsidized for their losses. Once you hand
out fixed IPs you have tied up assets that may go unused for long
periods requiring more facilities.
Random IP is the same principle as rollover on multiple phone lines. I
have heard reports as high as 25 users per phone line without customer
complaints.
Matt Giwer
Lmy...@direct.ca (Lary Myles) wrote:
>In article <4q50gl$j...@dfw-ixnews7.ix.netcom.com>, mgi...@ix.netcom.com
>says...
>>
>> That is what he wants, is it not? Consider the great personal
>sacrifice
>>he makes to do this.
>Actually..McVay is neither compelling on stage in speech nor in his
>appearance. If he wants to continue to sell into the market of Jewish
>Carnival, then he must re-invent his packaging. As to McFailure wanting to
>be a martyr..sure, as to who knows what goes on in the brain of an aging and
>self-deluded failure.
So what does he do to get on stage? Never heard of him on this side of
the border.
Matt Giwer
Keith Morrison <t0...@unb.ca> wrote:
>Matt Giwer wrote:
>> It is unexplainably slow. Almost as though they were feeding it with a
>> 28.8 rather than a T1 line.
>They *are* running off a 28.8, you moron.
I am not running a server. You do understand the difference, do you not?
White Heart
> In article <4q50gl$j...@dfw-ixnews7.ix.netcom.com>, mgi...@ix.netcom.com
> says...
> >
> > That is what he wants, is it not? Consider the great personal
> sacrifice
> >he makes to do this.
>
> Actually..McVay is neither compelling on stage in speech nor in his
> appearance. If he wants to continue to sell into the market of Jewish
> Carnival, then he must re-invent his packaging. As to McFailure wanting to
> be a martyr..sure, as to who knows what goes on in the brain of an aging and
> self-deluded failure.
>
> larry
How much is the gas?
Matt Giwer
"Ronald C. Schoedel" <scho...@alaska.net> wrote:
>mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer) wrote:
>> Good sir, leave the technical knowledge to those who have it. You can
>>get my website (www2.combase.com/~mgiwer) as fast as you can get
>>cnn.com.
>And mine as well. If Kenny wants to be taken seriously as an internet
>resource, why does he not use a real ISP that has, like, a real net
>connection? I do.
Can't master FTP?
>>Combase has a single T1 line. You can't get any less than a
>>T1 line and call yourself an ISP.
>>
>> The best thing for them would be to be hosted on a decent ISP.
>But that would cost money, and ya know, those gas pumpers just don't
>make that much!!! Especially tight-wad jewish proselytes!
>Rev. Ron
>http://www.alaska.net/~schoedel - one of the fastest sites around!
And according to the lastest post, they think a 486DX25 was expensive a
year ago.
What a bunch of newbies.
Matt Giwer
hos...@uniserve.com (Hilary Ostrov) wrote:
>In <4q6io1$2...@aphex.direct.ca>, Lmy...@direct.ca (Lary Myles) wrote:
>[snip]
>>So, when this ninnie, Zundel got taken to court and his Freedom of Speech
>>trampled, my Jewish friend and I agreed that it was a black day for that
>>Freedom. In my protest against the action against Zundel, I have little
>>choice in using the word 'alleged' before the word holocaust.
>Let's stick to the facts, shall we, Mr. Myles? Zundel was prosecuted
>and _convicted_ under the provisions of a long-standing (but
>subsequently repealed) law prohibiting the spreading of "false news".
>As Zundel himself noted at the time, he revelled in the publicity - so
>much so that he _chose_ to go the path of two trials prior to even
>appealing the law under which he was charged.
>It seems to me that if Zundel were so concerned that his right to
>"freedom of speech" was being curtailed he would have appealed the law
>in the first place.
The great legal and fat strategist speaks.
And country with any law restricting "false news" is a disgrace to
civilization. But in reference to Canada, that is redundant.
Ron
mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer) wrote:
>mcu...@eden.com (Mike Curtis) wrote:
>
>>Lmy...@direct.ca (Lary Myles) wrote:
>
>
>
>>>Well, all's fair in love and war. I think that if Oi McVay can cadge a few
>>>bucks from his lame little pitch..more power to him. But if its the advocacy
>>>game that he is looking to milk, there are a lot more sweeter cows out there
>>>than the old and hoary holocaust issue. BUT..then, it takes money to really
>>>do the job right. Setting up a web site is only one teeeny area. He will need
>>>mailing lists and 900 numbers and an infrastructure as well as a marketing
>>>plan. I'm doing one now, and will let you know down the road how it goes.
>
>>>Can't really get into it now, as part of the deal is a nine month
>>>non-disclosure or discussion clause.
>
>>This is a new approach. Because Ken McVay is not liked by deniers,
>>racists, and antisemites the Holocaust didn't happen. What a bunch of
>>stupid morons. This kind of attack dog sniping does nothing to promote
>>you guys in the eyes of anyone. In fact it kind of make Mr. McVay
>>appear to be a martyr.
>
>he makes to do this.
>
>Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
>Subject: What a clever way to kill people
>From: mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer)
>Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 21:48:00 GMT
>
>
>"PAUL WALDMANN: In this small room [at Sachsenhausen] there was a slot
>in the wall,
>approximately 50 centimeters in length. The prisoner of war stood with
>the back of his head
>against the slot and a sniper shot at him from behind the slot. In
>practice this arrangement did not
>prove satisfactory, since the sniper often missed the prisoner.
As an ex Mairne Sniper I find this hard to believe. The German Military
of that time was one of the best in the world. Their snipers were
fantastic. Much of what modern armies,including the Israeli, take from
them.
After 8
>days a new arrangement
>was made. The prisoner, as before, was placed against the wall; an iron
>plate was then slowly
>lowered onto his head. The prisoner was under the impression that he was
>being measured for
>height. The iron plate contained a ramrod which shot out suddenly and
>poleaxed the prisoner with
>a blow on the back of the head. He dropped dead. The iron plate was
>operated by a foot lever in
>a corner of the room. "
>IMT VII - p. 377.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Ron
>>says...
>
>>>anything to stifle free speech. So, while I will take
>>>exception to what you are doing, I sure as hell won't put my
>>>money where my mouth is."
>
>
>>Ahhh...it's Mr. OiMcVay!! Still beating up on little folks I see. As far as
>>you not putting up your money where your mouth is...what a surprise. But then
>>again, as you continue to waste your time embarrasing the Jews in our
>>community, I guess that comes as no surprise.
>>I'm really not that surprised to see that you are an anti-Freedom of Speecher
>>as well.
>
> Actually he is very much in favor of free speech. He simply wants to
>deport those who exercise it so they can speak freely some place else.
>
>
I will ad to serve a 5 year prison term for debating history. That good
old German government acting like Communists in order to avoid being
Nazi.
Ron
What a bigoted title.
Ron
propaganda. It's the Jews who do the denying. They deny the contents of
the Talmud.
Ron
kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca (Ken McVay OBC) wrote:
>In article <4prgia$2...@news.ios.com>, H*ber <rMc...@Gramercy.ios.com> wrote:
>
>>kle...@awinc.com (Ken Lewis) wrote:
>>>says...
>
>>>>$100 from me, if you can.
>>>>$100 from Jamie McCarthy, if you can.
>>>>$200 from you, if you can't.
>
>>>>Go ahead, make my day. Prove that I am "working hard to" stifle "free
>>>>speech in Canada."
>
>>><SNICKER> A bet as safe as this? I'll throw my $100 in too.
>
>> How old are you guys ? Mr. McVay,you do not debate,you play childish,
>> in your face attacks.
>
>Translation from the aardvarkese: "I can't prove you are doing
>anything to stifle free speech. So, while I will take
>exception to what you are doing, I sure as hell won't put my
>money where my mouth is."
>
>--
>The Nizkor Project (Canada) - An Electronic Holocaust Educational Resource
> [Ftp] http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?
> [Europe] ftp://nizkor.iam.uni-bonn.de/pub/nizkor/
>http://www.almanac.bc.ca/ (Under construction - permanently!)......unlearn
Ron
Mr McVay,you are in favor of having Mr Zundel sent to Germany were
he will go to prison for debate. That is anti free speach,so pay up.
You owe me a 100 bucks.
Ken McVay OBC
My first reaction to this, Bobby, was that even you could not
be this stupid. I quickly realized, of course, that you _are_
this stupid, and changed my mind.
Who has said that Mr. Zundel will be sent to Germany for "debate?"
(Other than Zundel, that is)
Has CSIS said that?
Has SIRC said that?
Have _I_ said that?
In order now, Bucky: No, No, No.
PS - the word is spelled "speech." Do think about returning to
school, won't you?
Matt Giwer
Ron <rMc...@Gramercy.ios.com> wrote:
Meyer Lansky, Bernard "Bugsy" Siegel, none of them ever existed.
Matt Giwer
Ron <rMc...@Gramercy.ios.com> wrote:
>>========
>>Newsgroups: alt.revisionism
>>Subject: What a clever way to kill people
>>From: mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer)
>>Date: Thu, 13 Jun 1996 21:48:00 GMT
>>
>>
>>"PAUL WALDMANN: In this small room [at Sachsenhausen] there was a slot
>>in the wall,
>>approximately 50 centimeters in length. The prisoner of war stood with
>>the back of his head
>>against the slot and a sniper shot at him from behind the slot. In
>>practice this arrangement did not
>>prove satisfactory, since the sniper often missed the prisoner.
> As an ex Mairne Sniper I find this hard to believe. The German Military
>of that time was one of the best in the world. Their snipers were
>fantastic. Much of what modern armies,including the Israeli, take from
>them.
I am certain it will turn out to be just a "minor" translation problem.
That appears to be the latest dodge.
> After 8
>>days a new arrangement
>>was made. The prisoner, as before, was placed against the wall; an iron
>>plate was then slowly
>>lowered onto his head. The prisoner was under the impression that he was
>>being measured for
>>height. The iron plate contained a ramrod which shot out suddenly and
>>poleaxed the prisoner with
>>a blow on the back of the head. He dropped dead. The iron plate was
>>operated by a foot lever in
>>a corner of the room. "
>>IMT VII - p. 377.
But don't you like this clever method? And there it is right in the
official record as an accusation.
Matt Giwer
Ron <rMc...@Gramercy.ios.com> wrote:
>mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer) wrote:
>>Lmy...@direct.ca (Lary Myles) wrote:
>>
>>>In article <4ps4bd$n...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca>, kmc...@nizkor.almanac.bc.ca
>>>says...
>>
>>>>anything to stifle free speech. So, while I will take
>>>>exception to what you are doing, I sure as hell won't put my
>>>>money where my mouth is."
>>
>>
>>>Ahhh...it's Mr. OiMcVay!! Still beating up on little folks I see. As far as
>>>you not putting up your money where your mouth is...what a surprise. But then
>>>again, as you continue to waste your time embarrasing the Jews in our
>>>community, I guess that comes as no surprise.
>>>I'm really not that surprised to see that you are an anti-Freedom of Speecher
>>>as well.
>>
>> Actually he is very much in favor of free speech. He simply wants to
>>deport those who exercise it so they can speak freely some place else.
> I will ad to serve a 5 year prison term for debating history. That good
>old German government acting like Communists in order to avoid being
>Nazi.
One would think Jews would be the first to speak out against such
things. But then, it fits the form that they do not but rather
encourage more such laws.
Matt Giwer
"Ronald C. Schoedel" <scho...@alaska.net> wrote:
>mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer) wrote:
>> And according to the lastest post, they think a 486DX25 was expensive a
>>year ago.
>>
>> What a bunch of newbies.
>Whew boy, is it getting weird in here...expensive 486's, lack of FTP skills,
>whoa, is it any wonder the Zinkor website is totally unaccesible to me and surely
>others...these guys don't know a thing about computers. (Actually, I must admit:
>maybe it IS accessible to me, but I always cancel my request for info to the Zinkor
>site if it's been more than two minutes and the page hasn't been transferred. So
>far, within two minutes, I can SOMETIMES get the first few k of the homepage.
If you really want to look around put your browser in a second window
and have something time consuming to do in the first. I found a lovely
collection of things there.
And I forgot to remind you, they paid "over $1000" for UnixWorks instead
of $50 for Linux. Some one must have seen them coming.
>I'm sorry, but content aside, the technical aspects of the Zinkpr website are
>sorely lacking.
>I almost feel sorry for them with their computer ineptitude. But not quite.
Hell, if they paid real money instead of Canadian, I'd help them out.
I love a fair fight.
Ronald C. Schoedel
mgi...@ix.netcom.com (Matt Giwer) wrote:
> And according to the lastest post, they think a 486DX25 was expensive a
>year ago.
>
> What a bunch of newbies.
Whew boy, is it getting weird in here...expensive 486's, lack of FTP skills,
whoa, is it any wonder the Zinkor website is totally unaccesible to me and surely
others...these guys don't know a thing about computers. (Actually, I must admit:
maybe it IS accessible to me, but I always cancel my request for info to the Zinkor
site if it's been more than two minutes and the page hasn't been transferred. So
far, within two minutes, I can SOMETIMES get the first few k of the homepage.
I'm sorry, but content aside, the technical aspects of the Zinkpr website are
sorely lacking.
I almost feel sorry for them with their computer ineptitude. But not quite.
Rev. Ron
Jamie McCarthy
"Ronald C. Schoedel" <scho...@alaska.net> wrote:
> Whew boy, is it getting weird in here...expensive 486's
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl?people/g/giwer.matt/lies/lie-expensive-486
> lack of FTP skills
Um, Poindexter? Who do you think _wrote_ the CGI gateway you'll be using
when you access that URL? Duh.
Posted/emailed.
--
Jamie McCarthy http://www.absence.prismatix.com/jamie/
ja...@voyager.net Co-Webmaster of http://www.almanac.bc.ca/
Unless you specify otherwise, I assume pro-"revisionism" email
to be in the public domain. I speak only for myself.
Ken McVay OBC
In article <4qcfrp$g...@liberator.concentric.net>,
> Whew boy, is it getting weird in here...expensive 486's,
> lack of FTP skills, whoa, is it any wonder the Zinkor website
> is totally unaccesible to me and surely others
We have taken note of the "reverend" Schoedel's inability to
access our site, and his lack of patience, and given thanks that
the _other_ 800 or so who do manage to obtain the 3000 pages they
request daily are able to do so.
We have become deeply concerned over the inability of some
users to access the "reverend" Schoedel's very own Nizkor
pages, and have taken steps to solve the problem.
In the meantime, those with tireless patience, and a desire to
see the "reverend" Schoedel in full cry, are urged to explore
URL http://www.almanac.bc.ca/hweb/people/s/schoedel-ronald/
We will announce appropriate solutions to the "reverend"
Schoedel's problem within a short time. Until then, we urge
the "reverend" to enjoy himself and have a nice day.
As to Mr. Schoedel's lack of ftp skills, we can only wonder.
With two ftp sites available, perhaps tutoring from his local
ISP might be in order, so that he might find one of them;
http://www.almanac.bc.ca/cgi-bin/ftp.pl? and
ftp://nizkor.iam.uni-bonn.de/pub/nizkor/ work as they
should, for those who understand how to configure and utilize
their software.
(The last time we checked, Europe was still on the net, altho
we concede the "reverend's" unlikely to be able to find it.)