The Enterprise versus the Millenium Falcon: Who Would Win?
Egg Troll
Enterprise. Would the Millenium Falcon be able to defeat Captain Kirk?
I'm pretty sure the Millenium Falcon would easily be able to defeat
the Enterprise. Really, the Enterprise is a sluggish science vessel
whose captain was more interested in chasing alien pussy than anything
else. All it did was chug along on a straight course, and could do
none of the fancy aerobatics that the Millenium Falcon was capable of.
This doesn't even bring up the fact that photon torpedos and phasers
don't exist; they're literary constructs without any basis in science.
Not to mention that Han Solo was much more cunning and skillful than
Captain Kirk. Plus who would you want as your sidekick: Chewbacca, or
Doctor Spock - a man who basically sounds like a HP-48 calculator come
to life? Also, the Enterprise was burdened with Scottie, a man who was
always first to freak out whenever the Enterprise was asked to do
anything more than idle. But that's the English for ya! In any event,
do you really think the skill of someone who spent half his time
trapped in the holodeck could outwit a man of Han Solo's skill?
I think not.
Really the only thing that the Enterprise had going for it were the
transporters. I'm sure the Millenium Falcon's shields would repel
these like rain off oiled canvas.
All in all, it seems like the Enterprise would have a hard time
fending off the Millenium Falcon.
Thank you,
Egg Troll
TK311
stomach of a big ass asteroid worm? hehe...
"Egg Troll" <eggt...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com...
storyt...@surfree.com
I don't have a date for Saturday night either.
The Falcon uses LASERS, which would not even be able to penetrate the
Enterprises' deflector beam. Phasers are a lot more powerfuls. Lasers are no
match.
"Egg Troll" <eggt...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com...
Aaron Meyer
Scott
> All in all, it seems like the Enterprise would have a hard time
> fending off the Millenium Falcon.
A brilliant troll. Probably a 200 message thread at least. Note the
crosspost too. lol What fun.
The Enterprise is a heavy cruiser, while the Millenium Falcon is at best a
scout-class vessel. The Enterprise, by weight, is probably 100x the
displacement of the Falcon and has 100x the crew at least.
The Enterprise is equipped with highly advanced communications, data
processing, tracking, weapons, power, manuevering and defensive systems,
all of which are more advanced, more reliable and more powerful than those
of the Falcon.
While Han Solo is arguably a capable pilot and tactician, the Enterprise is
far too heavily armed and armored to be vulnerable to any of the Falcon's
weapons.
The Millenium Falcon has no heavy weapons, nor does it have the ability to
defend itself against a boarding action (which the Enterprise would launch
immediately upon engaging). The Enterprise is equipped with
tractor beams which would likely crush the Falcon at full power. The
Enterprise has four banks of heavy weapons, and numerous banks of phasers
which can fire in groups at any point in a 360 degree sphere.
Not to mention the fact the Enterprise can probably outrun the Falcon, and
has a greater and more reliable gross power output. The only possibility
for the Millenium Falcon would be to get a heavy weapons system (mines,
torpedos, whatever) manuever into an asteroid field and hope the Enterprise
makes a mistake AND hope the first shot does enough damage to cripple the
Enterprise. Then run.
It's the boxer vs. the wrestler. If the Enterprise brings its heavy
weapons to bear...
"Farewell and adieu... to you fair Spanish ladies...."
--
Scott
Stephen Edwards
Trying to stir up trouble in the two main Nerdocracies I see.
*CHOMP!*
> Imagine, if you will, Han Solo suddenly found himself beseiged by the
> Enterprise. Would the Millenium Falcon be able to defeat Captain Kirk?
Are you nuts?!@#
How? The Millenium Falcon has old and outdated blaster technology.
And the deflectors that most craft use in the Star Wars universe
are divided into sections, and only last for a few direct hits
from intermittent laser discharges.
The Enterprise, on the other hand, uses energy dissapation shields,
which would easily absorb the Falcon's pathetic laser discharges.
On top of that, phasers, which fire a continuous stream of energy
would quickly wear down the Falcon's deflectors on any section and
within seconds penetrate its hull, exposing its insides to space,
and killing the crew inside instantly.
There is no contest here. The only option for the Falcon would be
to run, since it was designed for speed.
> I'm pretty sure the Millenium Falcon would easily be able to defeat
> the Enterprise. Really, the Enterprise is a sluggish science vessel
And because it often ventures into uncharted space, it's armed to
the teeth in case of conflict.
> whose captain was more interested in chasing alien pussy than anything
^^^^^^^^^^^
Oh sure. It's easy to have that attitude when you haven't had any
alien pussy at all yourself. Don't knock it until you... well, actually,
go ahead and knock it, since you probably aren't getting any action.
> else. All it did was chug along on a straight course, and could do
What? Are you daft? The Enterprise always followed parabolic course
headings.
> none of the fancy aerobatics that the Millenium Falcon was capable of.
Sure, aerobatics which defied the natural physics of space. How many
spacecraft could really actually get along with a single rear burner?
The Enterprise uses several impulse engines to guide its drift in space,
so it's far more manueverable.
> This doesn't even bring up the fact that photon torpedos and phasers
> don't exist; they're literary constructs without any basis in science.
Yes. I agree, since it's quite obvious that "laser blasters", "droids",
and "deflector technology" are ubiquitous in scientific discussions
today.
</SARCASM>
> Not to mention that Han Solo was much more cunning and skillful than
> Captain Kirk. Plus who would you want as your sidekick: Chewbacca, or
Are you kidding? Kirk had extensive military training. Solo was just
a smuggler in shiny knee-high boots.
> Doctor Spock - a man who basically sounds like a HP-48 calculator come
Between the contemptuous Vulcan and the smelly dog-man, I'll take
the Vulcan.
> to life? Also, the Enterprise was burdened with Scottie, a man who was
> always first to freak out whenever the Enterprise was asked to do
He only freaked out when Kirk asked him to push the Enterprise past
its specified tolerances.
> anything more than idle. But that's the English for ya! In any event,
How dare ye! Callin' a Scotsman a stankin' English. 'eel 'ave yer
'ead 'ee will!
> do you really think the skill of someone who spent half his time
> trapped in the holodeck could outwit a man of Han Solo's skill?
> I think not.
>
> Really the only thing that the Enterprise had going for it were the
> transporters. I'm sure the Millenium Falcon's shields would repel
> these like rain off oiled canvas.
The Falcon didn't have shield technology, as I stated earlier.
> All in all, it seems like the Enterprise would have a hard time
> fending off the Millenium Falcon.
>
> Thank you,
I almost feel like I'm supposed to end this reply with a childish
response like:
"I'm gonna hack your computer, you Star Wars bitch!" :-D
--
if (strcmp(Microsoft, "alive") == 0) && (strcmp(you, "PC monkey") == 0) {
strcpy(username, "01100001 01101110 01100001 01101101"); // Decode binary
strcat(username, " 01101111 01110010 01110000 01101000"); // to contact me.
} // % set HOST="extremezone.com"; cat whining | apathy > /dev/null; logout
mikey769
@cyclic.aux.net:
>
> Are you kidding? Kirk had extensive military training. Solo was just
> a smuggler in shiny knee-high boots.
Han Solo was actually in the Imperial Navy before turning Smuggler.
>
>> Doctor Spock - a man who basically sounds like a HP-48 calculator come
>
> Between the contemptuous Vulcan and the smelly dog-man, I'll take
> the Vulcan.
That was Mister Spock, not Doctor.
Ray Drouillard
<storyt...@surfree.com> wrote in message
news:alrk7a$fmk$1...@slb4.atl.mindspring.net...
> I can't believe I am letting myself be drawn into this nerd debate,
but hey,
> I don't have a date for Saturday night either.
It's not just a nerd debate. It's a blatant troll.
Ray Drouillard
"Aaron Meyer" <aaron...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:ZDcg9.3665$Os3.2...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> OT?
Not really -- just stupid.
Captain Beyond
ROTFLMAO!!!!
FVD.
_________________________________
"Can we have everything louder than everything else?" - Ian Gillan.
ICQ: 22319903
"Egg Troll" <eggt...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com...
Captain Beyond
probably as big as a Star Destroyer so instead how about the Defiant against
the Falcon. Who would win?
FVD.
_________________________________
"Can we have everything louder than everything else?" - Ian Gillan.
ICQ: 22319903
"Egg Troll" <eggt...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com...
Johnny1A
> I don't have a date for Saturday night either.
>
> The Falcon uses LASERS, which would not even be able to penetrate the
> Enterprises' deflector beam. Phasers are a lot more powerfuls. Lasers are no
> match.
That depends entirely on how _much energy_ can be put into each beam.
Phasers might be more efficient per given gigawattage, but the
evidence of the TV shows and the movies is that the SW ships carry a
lot more gigawattage.
Ironically, though, of all the _Enterprises_, I'd give the original
one the best change against the _Falcon_, though it's odds are poor.
Shermanlee
Patrick James
(in message <4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com>):
[snip it all]
Can they both lose? Please?
--
Si hoc legere scis nimium eruditionis habes
Stan
>...Plus who would you want as your sidekick: Chewbacca, or
> Doctor Spock -
Dr Spock the baby doctor? WTF does that have to do with sci-fi?
Stan.
Anybody
<stan...@delete-upto-the-last-dash-xprt.net> wrote:
Have you read any of his theories?? ;-)
Chris Wright
some way drawn us into a ridiculous discussion, but they probably don't
realise that this is the sort of thread that makes these boards interesting,
so we win. yaay for us.
The Enterprise has another advantage - technobabble! With an endless armoury
of tachyon pulses, reversed polarity deflector beams, phased torpedoes etc.,
the Enterprise would soon make mincemeat out of the Falcon.
Or alternatively, they could use their tractor beam, which the Millennium
Falcom is hopeless against if the Death Star is anything to go by. tractor
beam the small Falcon into a cargo bay, scan it for life forms to find out
that they're hiding in the secret compartments, then send in Data and Worf
to kick their heads in.
"Egg Troll" <eggt...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com...
George William Herbert
>Dr Spock???????
"Janet!"
"Rocky!"
*Grunt*
-george william herbert
gher...@retro.com
"When Abatis Attack!"
Thomas
news:eaeg9.5931$Y3.12...@news.xtra.co.nz...
> I wouldn't put the Enterprise again the Falcon as I reckon the Enterprise
is
> probably as big as a Star Destroyer so instead how about the Defiant
against
> the Falcon. Who would win?
>
> FVD.
That would be ever funnier, as the Defiant far outclasses the Enterprise A.
Ablative armour, plus shields, plus pulse lasers. We'd be betting how many
seconds the Falcon would last.
Karl M. Syring
news:0001HW.B9A6E7D9...@enews.newsguy.com...
> On Thu, 12 Sep 2002 20:40:43 -0500, Egg Troll wrote
> (in message <4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com>):
>
> [snip it all]
>
> Can they both lose? Please?
You only need one Imperial star destroyer (does it really destroy
stars?) to zap the Enterprise. The author of
http://www.stardestroyer.net does seriously contemplate the
ramifications.
Karl M. Syring
alumnos de system
dark...@hotmail.com.wrote this mensage.I am spanish.
TK311 <tk...@blah.com> escribió en el mensaje de noticias
H5cg9.300078$aA.52832@sccrnsc02...
alumnos de system
darth...@ameritech.net
are we talking Enterprise original, A, B, C, D, or E?
Stewart Hellen
matter/anti-matter warhead. Also Scotty was a Scotsman. Typical fucking
American thinking Scottish is English.
"Egg Troll" <eggt...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com...
phobos
> I don't have a date for Saturday night either.
>
> The Falcon uses LASERS, which would not even be able to penetrate the
> Enterprises' deflector beam. Phasers are a lot more powerfuls. Lasers are no
> match.
Yet the Death Star's main laser is capable of destroying a planet.
It's really just a matter of gigawattage. Maybe a phaser is a more
efficient design, but there's no reason why, from a perspective of
sheer power, a laser couldn't be ramped up to any level of damage you
like.
I'd just about bet on the Falcon against Kirk, largely due to its
superior manoeuvrability, and certainly against Archer, but not
against Picard. The Enterprise-D would turn the Millennium Falcon into
ionised vapour in about two minutes (that being the time taken for the
traditional Starfleet battle doctrine of 'shields holding sir',
'damage report', 'shields down to 80%', 'lock phasers', 'shields at
50%, damage on decks 4, 5 and 6', 'fire!').
Now, Death Star vs. Borg Cube, that's more interesting. Obviously a
sphere is inherently more efficient than a cube, from a surface area /
volume ratio perspective, and that megalaser could take out a Borg
cube without much trouble, just as the 8472 planet-destroying beams
did (destroying a planet, we may presume, is equally difficult in both
universes) but is the Death Star simply too slow? A cube might simply
orbit the Death Star making damn sure it stays on the opposite
hemisphere to the megalaser, and gradually pulverise the surface...
By the way, why isn't this in alt.startrek.vs.starwars? :-)
Matthias Warkus
Egg Troll <eggt...@yahoo.com>:
> Imagine, if you will, Han Solo suddenly found himself beseiged by the
> Enterprise. Would the Millenium Falcon be able to defeat Captain Kirk?
I don't care, and neither should you.
mawa
--
"The feminist agenda is not about equal rights for women. It is a
socialist, anti-family political movement that encourages women to
leave their husbands, kill their children, practice witchcraft,
destroy capitalism and become lesbians." -- Pat Robertson
Stuart Johnson
Stuart Johnson
stuart@_SPAM_BLOCK_inetnebr.com
Stuart's Castle http://incolor.inetnebr.com/stuart/
Henshin Hall Of Fame http://henshin.250x.com/
Dave Leigh
> Photon torpedoes actually do have a basis in science. They use an
> matter/anti-matter warhead. Also Scotty was a Scotsman. Typical fucking
> American thinking Scottish is English.
America refuses to accept responsibility for that guy. Nor do I suggest any
other country do so... he's in a world of his own.
--
Dave Leigh, Consulting Systems Analyst
Cratchit.org
Ray Drouillard
"dath_...@ameritech.net" <darth...@ameritech.net> wrote in message
news:bhkg9.8707$2E6.4...@newssvr28.news.prodigy.com...
> Egg Troll wrote:
>
> are we talking Enterprise original, A, B, C, D, or E?
He's obviously talking about the Enterprise that Captain Kirk commanded.
Oh, right... there were two of them.
Dave Leigh
> I'd just about bet on the Falcon against Kirk, largely due to its
> superior manoeuvrability, and certainly against Archer, but not
> against Picard.
Here's how that works:
Picard calls for open hailing frequencies and begins to orate, "We are from
the United Federation of Planets. We come on a mission of peace with
respect for all life forms, including a unique species of fungus found in
my Aunt Patricia's refrigerator..." blah, blah, blah, drone, drone, drone.
Han smashes the communications device, but due to a highly unlikely but
necessary-to-the-plot confluence of events involving the particle of the
week, the Enterprise's subspace radio has set up a harmonic resonance with
the Falcon's hull, with the end result that the incessant monotone voice is
now coming from all directions. Four days later Picard finishes his
introduction to a response of total silence (In space, no one can hear
crickets chirp). Riker beams over to the Falcon with a glad-to-be-away team
and discovers Solo and Chewbacca swinging from nooses fashioned from the
Wookie's bandolier and wiring stripped from a small rolling dustbin and a
brass mannequin.
Bob Smith
Bob
Thomas
news:af26c87a.02091...@posting.google.com...
> I'd just about bet on the Falcon against Kirk, largely due to its
> superior manoeuvrability, and certainly against Archer, but not
> against Picard. The Enterprise-D would turn the Millennium Falcon into
> ionised vapour in about two minutes (that being the time taken for the
> traditional Starfleet battle doctrine of 'shields holding sir',
> 'damage report', 'shields down to 80%', 'lock phasers', 'shields at
> 50%, damage on decks 4, 5 and 6', 'fire!').
I don't know about that, the Millenium falcon probably doesn't have the
shield capabilities to stand up to even one phaser burst from any of the
enterprises.
Deathwalker
> Enterprise. Would the Millenium Falcon be able to defeat Captain Kirk?
>
> the Enterprise. Really, the Enterprise is a sluggish science vessel
> whose captain was more interested in chasing alien pussy than anything
> else. All it did was chug along on a straight course, and could do
> none of the fancy aerobatics that the Millenium Falcon was capable of.
> This doesn't even bring up the fact that photon torpedos and phasers
> don't exist; they're literary constructs without any basis in science.
Yeah right unlike hyperdrive.
hmm
self propelled torpedo or rocket with an anti matter payload. Also with a
guidance system. All the technology except is in use except antimatter as
explosive. Antimatter has basis in science, has been created in a lab,
small amount thought to have exploded above a russian forest in 1930s.
Massive explosion for its size.
As for manauverability, something that sodding big can remain stationary and
point its guns in any direction. Get a torpedo lock and thats that.
> Not to mention that Han Solo was much more cunning and skillful than
> Captain Kirk.
Someone is flamebating.
Deathwalker
"Stuart Johnson" <stu...@inetnebr.com> wrote in message
news:3d81dac7....@news.inetnebr.com...
> One torpedo and its good bye Falcon.
of the enterprise and the m falcon,
Some Guy
"Egg Troll" <eggt...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com...
> Imagine, if you will, Han Solo suddenly found himself beseiged by the
> Enterprise. Would the Millenium Falcon be able to defeat Captain Kirk?
>
> I'm pretty sure the Millenium Falcon would easily be able to defeat
> the Enterprise. Really, the Enterprise is a sluggish science vessel
> whose captain was more interested in chasing alien pussy than anything
> else. All it did was chug along on a straight course, and could do
> none of the fancy aerobatics that the Millenium Falcon was capable of.
> This doesn't even bring up the fact that photon torpedos and phasers
> don't exist; they're literary constructs without any basis in science.
>
> Doctor Spock - a man who basically sounds like a HP-48 calculator come
> to life? Also, the Enterprise was burdened with Scottie, a man who was
> always first to freak out whenever the Enterprise was asked to do
> anything more than idle. But that's the English for ya! In any event,
> do you really think the skill of someone who spent half his time
> trapped in the holodeck could outwit a man of Han Solo's skill?
>
> I think not.
>
> Really the only thing that the Enterprise had going for it were the
> transporters. I'm sure the Millenium Falcon's shields would repel
> these like rain off oiled canvas.
>
> All in all, it seems like the Enterprise would have a hard time
> fending off the Millenium Falcon.
>
> Thank you,
>
> Egg Troll
...UGH!... ...BATTLESTAR GALACTICA take 'em both... ...Vipers kell
xwings... ...Cylons be ruling th borg 'fore long.... an what about
ANDROMEDA, or BABYLON FIVE?... ...gurgle, snort! Guess that'll put a bee
in their bonnet!
Ray Drouillard
"Dave Leigh" <dave....@cratchit.org> wrote in message
news:uo3nj87...@corp.supernews.com...
> Stewart Hellen wrote:
>
> > Photon torpedoes actually do have a basis in science. They use an
> > matter/anti-matter warhead. Also Scotty was a Scotsman. Typical
fucking
> > American thinking Scottish is English.
>
> America refuses to accept responsibility for that guy. Nor do I
suggest any
> other country do so... he's in a world of his own.
I don't think I like Stewart's prejudiced attitude, either.
Paul Richardson
"Aaron Meyer" <aaron...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:ZDcg9.3665$Os3.2...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
> OT?
No, it's definitely not on topic, it's more on Care in the Community
--
Paul R
Overworked of Borg, you will be assimilated when I can get round to it
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.386 / Virus Database: 218 - Release Date: 09/09/2002
Paul Richardson
"Thomas" <ethe...@nospaminext.co.za> wrote in message
news:alsdjq$bh2$1...@ctb-nnrp2.saix.net...
Joseph Haig
eggt...@yahoo.com (Egg Troll) wrote in message news:<4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com>...
> Also, the Enterprise was burdened with Scottie, a man who was
> always first to freak out whenever the Enterprise was asked to do
> anything more than idle. But that's the English for ya!
Scottie? English? I know a number of Scots who would kindly remove a
number of your teeth if you refered to them as English. Hint - the
clue is in the name.
Mind you, given Scottie's improbable Scottish accent, I suppose most
Scots would be happy to disown him.
Bye,
Joe
Dave Leigh
I had a friend from Scotland who ranted about Lt. Cmdr. Montgomery Scott,
aka "Scotty", a SCOT, FROM SCOTLAND!!!
As for the accent... well... improbable today, sure, but Scottie's accent
is from the future and has been tempered by 200 additional years of the
BBC, ITV, and Channel Four. (Hmm. I wonder. Do the Brits of Kirk's time
period have to buy Transporter Tax stamps at the Post Office?)
Warr
Yeah it was funny to listen to him in clear English while speaking from his
home town in Vancouver Canada.
warr
Wim Lewis
Patrick James <patj...@newsguy.com> wrote:
>On Thu, 12 Sep 2002 20:40:43 -0500, Egg Troll wrote
>(in message <4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com>):
>
>[snip it all]
>
>Can they both lose? Please?
Well, the OP said that the Millennium Falcon mysteriously popped into
the Enterprise's space. Presumably this means that the MF is suddenly
subject to the physical laws of the Trek universe, which are very different
from the laws of the SW universe. In particular, there are vastly more
subatomic particles --- a new one is mentioned almost every episode ---
and therefore a large number of unfilled energy states in the matter that
makes up the Falcon. The Falcon's substance will immediately and
energetically decay into these newly-available states, converting it
and its occupants into a burst of nearly every particle possible in
the Trekiverse. The resulting searing blast of coruscating polychromatic
refulgence will doubtless overwhelm the Enterprise's meagre shields,
annihilating it and probably sterilizing the entire galaxy.
You're welcome.
(By the way, I notice some newsgroups were left out of the original
troll. Um ... does the software that runs B5's life support run on
Linux or Windows? Also, do the Shadows use a BSD-style license, or do
they use a GPL-style license?)
--
Wim Lewis <wi...@hhhh.org>, Seattle, WA, USA. PGP keyID 27F772C1
freefall
>Imagine, if you will, Han Solo suddenly found himself beseiged by the
>Enterprise. Would the Millenium Falcon be able to defeat Captain Kirk?
>
Of course neither would stand a chance against Stanley Tweedle and the
LEXX.
Edward Rosten
> self propelled torpedo or rocket with an anti matter payload. Also with a
> guidance system. All the technology except is in use except antimatter as
> explosive. Antimatter has basis in science, has been created in a lab,
> small amount thought to have exploded above a russian forest in 1930s.
Er, that's rather... speculative, don't you think? I thopught the
contending theories were an exploding asteroid and a large gas
explosion.
> Massive explosion for its size.
e=mc^2, of course, where m is twice the mass of the antimatter,
assuming it all gets destroyed.
-Ed
mlw
Interesting thought. Space is a vacuum, a few particles of matter per square
foot. For the device to be useful, 1/2 of the mass has to be anti-matter and be
allowed to consume itself efficiently. Unless of course, using the vacuum of
space and the velocity of the torpedo, it expels the anti-matter onto the
offending ship, causing the some portion of the ship to cancel out against the
anti-matter.
Interesting, ridiculous.
>
> -Ed
Mark Kent
> "Deathwalker" <ian-l...@blueyonder.co.ukspam> wrote in message news:<82ng9.2749$o16.31...@news-text.cableinet.net>...
>
>> self propelled torpedo or rocket with an anti matter payload. Also with a
>> guidance system. All the technology except is in use except antimatter as
>> explosive. Antimatter has basis in science, has been created in a lab,
>> small amount thought to have exploded above a russian forest in 1930s.
>
> Er, that's rather... speculative, don't you think? I thopught the
> contending theories were an exploding asteroid and a large gas
> explosion.
>
Hmm, not sure we even have the technology to isolate any amount of
anti-matter even now, let alone in the 1930s. Afaik, it takes a serious
particle accelerator to even make it. Since you can't let it come into
contact with oppositely charged matter, ever, you'd need to keep it in
something like a good EM field, and then be able to release it. Since
a really good EM field needs a lot of power input, you'd need something
like a reactor to make all the power...
--
| Mark Kent -- Take out the ham to mail me. |
In an orderly world, there's always a place for the disorderly.
Mark Blunden
> I can't believe I am responding to his STUPID thread.
Likewise - and worse still, am about to reveal my former sad geekiness.
In my youth, I used to read the various Star Trek Technical Manuals. IIRC
the TNG one mentions that, while early torpedoes would indeed be fairly
inefficient - the initial explosion flinging some of the antimatter clear
before it could annihilate with matter - more advanced designs abandoned a
single large magnetic-containment chamber in favour of many very small ones
in a matrix of regular matter, so that simultaneous deactivation of the
containment fields would leave plenty of surrounding matter for all the
antimatter to collide with, resulting in much higher efficiency.
--
Mark.
mark.b...@ntlworld.com
* This isn't happening, it only thinks it's happening
phobos
Or Enterprise NX-01? Or STS Enterprise?
Millennium Falcon beats all Enterprises before NCC-1701. Against 1701
itself and 1701-A there's room for intelligent (as if...) debate.
Against 1701-B, the Falcon wins, because if ever there was a truly
incompetent captain that was the ship he was on. 1701-C and later the
technology starts to tell, and you're looking at a Spanish man-o-war
against a nuclear submarine.
Michael Vester
> Stewart Hellen wrote:
>
> > Photon torpedoes actually do have a basis in science. They use an
> > matter/anti-matter warhead. Also Scotty was a Scotsman. Typical
> > fucking American thinking Scottish is English.
>
> America refuses to accept responsibility for that guy. Nor do I
> suggest any other country do so... he's in a world of his own.
>
Actually, Jame Doohan is Canadian. And very little of Star Trek is
based on science.
--
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Robert Williams
short, the Millenium Falcon would win, quite easily.
Rob
Will
In Star Trek, "General Order 24" is to destroy a planet's surface within a
certain period of time (unless countermanded). If the Enterprise has the
ability to destroy a planet, then the Millenium Falcon is toast, isn't it?
In any case, whenever the Enterprise has fired a photon torpedo it hones in
on it's target until it is destroyed (re: "The Undiscovered Country").
Contrast that to the Falcon, where they have to line up the target in the
little crosshairs before pressing the button to fire...
But I agree that the Borg Cube verses the Death Star makes a more
interesting contrast.
Or, how about, THE BORG verses THE EMPIRE! What if an Imperial Destroyer
happened into Borg space and got their attention? Ohhhh.....
Will
Dave Leigh
> Or, how about, THE BORG verses THE EMPIRE! What if an Imperial Destroyer
> happened into Borg space and got their attention? Ohhhh.....
Resistance is futile.
You will be adapted to service us.
Your mitichlorians will be added to our own.
Will
Oh, oh...
"Dave Leigh" <dave....@cratchit.org> wrote in message
news:uo7bdmc...@corp.supernews.com...
Jeff DeWitt
Galactic Empire from Asimov's Foundation series (before it fell of
course?).
Jeff DeWitt
Bill Kohlleppel
> Two words: Photon Torpedos.
>
> In Star Trek, "General Order 24" is to destroy a planet's surface within a
> certain period of time (unless countermanded). If the Enterprise has the
> ability to destroy a planet, then the Millenium Falcon is toast, isn't it?
>
> In any case, whenever the Enterprise has fired a photon torpedo it hones in
> on it's target until it is destroyed (re: "The Undiscovered Country").
>
Not necessarily. Spock and McCoy had rigged that photon torpedo with a special
ionized gas detention/seeking package. A regular photon torpedo does not have
tracking on it. It is basically a line-of-sight missle.
>
> Contrast that to the Falcon, where they have to line up the target in the
> little crosshairs before pressing the button to fire...
>
> But I agree that the Borg Cube verses the Death Star makes a more
> interesting contrast.
>
> Or, how about, THE BORG verses THE EMPIRE! What if an Imperial Destroyer
> happened into Borg space and got their attention? Ohhhh.....
>
> Will
This whole ST v SW debate is rather stupid. They are based on totally
different set of technological principles, so who cares which technology could
beat the other. It is all made up, it isn't real you guys. That is why it is
called Space Sci-fi..... Space Science-Fiction. Which a great emphasis on the
fiction, i.e. meaning it is made up, not real....FAKE!
And quite cross-posting! Thank you
--
Rebel Alliance Lt. Commander Aramys Strael
http://www.livejournal.com/~bkohlleppel
http://kohlleppel.home.attbi.com/ <still under construction>
http://www.geocities.com/mgunner75/ <still under construction>
http://www.strael.home.attbi.com/
Mark Kent
Hash: SHA1
Jeff DeWitt <JeffD...@nc.rr.com> espoused:
> Never mind the Borg vs the Empire ... how about the Empire vs the
> Galactic Empire from Asimov's Foundation series (before it fell of
> course?).
>
I don't really recall much detail about the militaristic capabilities
of Asimov's Galactic Empire, to be honest, but I do recall it being
very, very big.
Trantor did seem to be the model for Star Wars 1.
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--
| Mark Kent -- Take out the ham to mail me. |
The worst cliques are those which consist of one man.
-- G.B. Shaw
Paul Richardson
"Edward Rosten" <u98...@ecs.ox.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:fad1751d.02091...@posting.google.com...
in Tunguska High St.
Paul Richardson
"Mark Kent" <ma...@NOHAM.otford.kent.btinternet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:enn1ma...@otford.kent.btinternet.co.uk...
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Jeff DeWitt <JeffD...@nc.rr.com> espoused:
> > Never mind the Borg vs the Empire ... how about the Empire vs the
> > Galactic Empire from Asimov's Foundation series (before it fell of
> > course?).
> >
>
> I don't really recall much detail about the militaristic capabilities
> of Asimov's Galactic Empire, to be honest, but I do recall it being
> very, very big.
Covered the whole known universe, fairly big, bigger than Milton Keynes at
least
>
> Trantor did seem to be the model for Star Wars 1.
Valid point
phobos
> Never mind the Borg vs the Empire ... how about the Empire vs the
> Galactic Empire from Asimov's Foundation series (before it fell of
> course?).
How long before it fell? The Galactic Empire (Asimov) had a fairly
unified command structure for most of its history, and could call on
the resources of a whole settled galaxy with a population of about one
quintillion. The Galactic Empire (Star Wars) is really a loose
confederation; with no Senatorial bureaucracy, the governors have
direct control over their territories, and fear keeps them in line.
The humans, though apparently a majority, are just one of many
species, and it seems that most of these aliens owe little allegiance
to Coruscant. Mustering a large battle-fleet is difficult for this
Empire, hence the construction of the Death Star. Against the Trantor
empire at its height, the Coruscant empire would be smashed.
In Seldon's time, however, the Empire is so decrepit that funding
cannot be found even to maintain the basic infrastructure and civil
security of Trantor itself. Such neglect would be unthinkable on
Coruscant. The Star Wars empire, on the other hand, is dynamic and
vigourous; after the disaster at Yavin, it launches a massive hunt for
the perpetrators followed by heavy military reprisals against the
terrorists responsible. The Empire strikes back, and hard. Then it
begins a hugely expensive project to construct a _second_ Death Star
more powerful than the first. Can we possibly imagine the Galactic
Empire that caved in before Anacreon's assertion of independence doing
anything remotely like that?
Of course, if it really did come to war, chances are that Daneel would
quietly have Darth Vader bumped off :-)
Other thoughts: Could a First Foundation mentalic shield block out
Force powers? Could a Second Foundation psi specialist modify a Jedi's
mind, or vice-versa?
Mr. Berserker
> Enterprise. Would the Millenium Falcon be able to defeat Captain Kirk?
>
> the Enterprise. Really, the Enterprise is a sluggish science vessel
> whose captain was more interested in chasing alien pussy than anything
> else. All it did was chug along on a straight course, and could do
> none of the fancy aerobatics that the Millenium Falcon was capable of.
Yeah, but Captain Kirk, with his hokey fighting scenes and rolling
around, could've easily dodged anything the MF could've thrown at him.
> This doesn't even bring up the fact that photon torpedos and phasers
> don't exist; they're literary constructs without any basis in science.
As well are the ion cannons from Star Wars. And the troops that were
standing in the vacuum on a platform on the Death Star.
>
> Not to mention that Han Solo was much more cunning and skillful than
> Captain Kirk. Plus who would you want as your sidekick: Chewbacca, or
> Doctor Spock - a man who basically sounds like a HP-48 calculator come
> to life?
Reminds me of the User Friendly series with the Hewlett Packard RPN
calculator.
Also, the Enterprise was burdened with Scottie, a man who was
> always first to freak out whenever the Enterprise was asked to do
> anything more than idle. But that's the English for ya!
Hee-hee; ask Roy about how the English are "wussies."
In any event,
> do you really think the skill of someone who spent half his time
> trapped in the holodeck could outwit a man of Han Solo's skill?
>
> I think not.
>
> Really the only thing that the Enterprise had going for it were the
> transporters. I'm sure the Millenium Falcon's shields would repel
> these like rain off oiled canvas.
>
> All in all, it seems like the Enterprise would have a hard time
> fending off the Millenium Falcon.
>
> Thank you,
>
> Egg Troll
That was strange.
#--MOGWAI--#
wrote:
Scottie was Scottish!
And as for the English being wussies.... who went into 2 world wars at
least 3 years before the Yanks! & more recently bailed the Yanks out
in the Afghan Mountains :-)
Will
> Will wrote:
>
> > Two words: Photon Torpedos.
> >
> > In Star Trek, "General Order 24" is to destroy a planet's surface within
a
> > certain period of time (unless countermanded). If the Enterprise has the
> > ability to destroy a planet, then the Millenium Falcon is toast, isn't
it?
> >
> > In any case, whenever the Enterprise has fired a photon torpedo it hones
in
> > on it's target until it is destroyed (re: "The Undiscovered Country").
> >
>
> Not necessarily. Spock and McCoy had rigged that photon torpedo with a
special
> ionized gas detention/seeking package.
Wrong. It was rigged in that movie only to track the gas, because the ship
was invisible and the "torpedoes sensors had nothing to track"
> A regular photon torpedo does not have tracking on it. It is basically a
line-of-sight missle.
Wrong. See above. You came into this debate lacking in the sufficient
background to properly participate, didn't you?
>
> >
> > Contrast that to the Falcon, where they have to line up the target in
the
> > little crosshairs before pressing the button to fire...
> >
> > But I agree that the Borg Cube verses the Death Star makes a more
> > interesting contrast.
> >
> > Or, how about, THE BORG verses THE EMPIRE! What if an Imperial Destroyer
> > happened into Borg space and got their attention? Ohhhh.....
> >
> > Will
>
> This whole ST v SW debate is rather stupid. They are based on totally
> different set of technological principles, so who cares which technology
could
> beat the other. It is all made up, it isn't real you guys. That is why it
is
> called Space Sci-fi..... Space Science-Fiction. Which a great emphasis on
the
> fiction, i.e. meaning it is made up, not real....FAKE!
Duh. It's an intellectual exercise. Aerobics for the brain. Sorry if it
makes you perspire too much.
>
> And quite cross-posting! Thank you
O.K. Maybe you should have taken your own advice on your original post?
LOL!!!!
Will
Will
Everyone knows that once Solo & Kirk made video contact, they'd recognize
each other for the space dogs that they are(!) and after they dropped
shields they'd both go hunting for space chicks on Risa.
Seriously, both Kirk and Solo encompass the "romantic rogue" character
important for these storylines (ST-TNG has Riker). The romantic rogue
character is noticably missing from the last two Star Wars movies.
Roddenberry did a character based upon Han Solo in the ST-TNG in "The
Magnificant Oconna(sp?)". Picard didn't like him (of course), but he gave
Troi and a lot of other chicks on the Enterprise the nice warm fuzzys.
Will
Mike.
Author: Mr. Berserker <Eldrid...@yahoo.com>
Date: 15 Sep 2002 09:43:16 -0700
Newsgroup: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Partial reproduction follows:
> eggt...@yahoo.com (Egg Troll) wrote in message
> news:<4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com>...
>> This doesn't even bring up the fact that photon torpedos and phasers
>> don't exist; they're literary constructs without any basis in
>> science.
> As well are the ion cannons from Star Wars. And the troops that were
> standing in the vacuum on a platform on the Death Star.
According to alt.folklore.urban, being an unprotected human in space
isn't anywhere near as catostrophic as it's generally made out to be
in the movies and whatnot:
http://www.urbanlegends.com/death/bodies_explode_in_space.html
It's quite plausible that the Death Star could provide a sufficient,
if somewhat light, atmosphere for the troops on the platform. It is
a rather large, er... spaceship?, after all.
--
Mike. Remove "-spam" to mail me. Better yet, don't mail me. ;-)
Graham Kennedy
> "Bill Kohlleppel" wrote
>
>>Will wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Two words: Photon Torpedos.
>>>
>>>In Star Trek, "General Order 24" is to destroy a planet's surface within
>>
> a
>
>>>certain period of time (unless countermanded). If the Enterprise has the
>>>ability to destroy a planet, then the Millenium Falcon is toast, isn't
>>
> it?
>
>>>In any case, whenever the Enterprise has fired a photon torpedo it hones
>>
> in
>
>>>on it's target until it is destroyed (re: "The Undiscovered Country").
>>>
>>
>>Not necessarily. Spock and McCoy had rigged that photon torpedo with a
>
> special
>
>>ionized gas detention/seeking package.
>
>
> Wrong. It was rigged in that movie only to track the gas, because the ship
> was invisible and the "torpedoes sensors had nothing to track"
>
>
>>A regular photon torpedo does not have tracking on it. It is basically a
>
> line-of-sight missle.
>
> Wrong. See above. You came into this debate lacking in the sufficient
> background to properly participate, didn't you?
If you watch Voyager's "Message in a Bottle", when
the two EMHs fight against the Romulans one fires
a torpedo which loops around a bit and then hits a
Defiant class. The other reprimands him, saying that
you're supposed to tell the torps what to aim at.
Also, in TNG's "Genesis", Worf is testing out a new
homing system for the torpedoes.
--
Graham Kennedy
Creator and Author,
Daystrom Institute Technical Library
http://www.ditl.org
Ray Drouillard
"#--MOGWAI--#" <not_...@noway.co.uk> wrote in message
news:72j9oukdkis65rmeo...@4ax.com...
> On 15 Sep 2002 09:43:16 -0700, Eldrid...@yahoo.com (Mr. Berserker)
> wrote:
>
> >eggt...@yahoo.com (Egg Troll) wrote in message
news:<4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com>...
> And as for the English being wussies.... who went into 2 world wars at
> least 3 years before the Yanks! & more recently bailed the Yanks out
> in the Afghan Mountains :-)
Hmmm... let me get this straight.
We are wussies because we joined two wars later than you did.
We are also wussies because you joined a third (smaller) war later than
we did.
OK, I have it now. Thanks.
;-)
Ray
Kweeg
news:h_9h9.54816$AR1.2...@bin2.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com...
>
> > And as for the English being wussies.... who went into 2 world wars at
> > least 3 years before the Yanks! & more recently bailed the Yanks out
> > in the Afghan Mountains :-)
>
> Hmmm... let me get this straight.
>
> We are wussies because we joined two wars later than you did.
>
> We are also wussies because you joined a third (smaller) war later than
> we did.
>
> OK, I have it now. Thanks.
>
> ;-)
>
>
> Ray
Yep....'bout sums it up.
...and lets not forget the rest of the Commonwealth, Canada was declared war
against Japan immediately after the attack 7/11/41, the US took 'till the
next day.
None of the Allies were wussies, it just took longer for some politicians to
figure it out...
--
QaPla'
Kweeg
http://members.shaw.ca/iksbloodoath
jjamesge
it seems to have the ability to deploy additional smaller ships to help
defend itself.
Plus, the Voyager is such a large ship, that the Falcon probably would be
like a mosquito trying to bite an elephant.
"Johnny1A" <sherm...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:b3030854.02091...@posting.google.com...
> <storyt...@surfree.com> wrote in message
news:<alrk7a$fmk$1...@slb4.atl.mindspring.net>...
> > I can't believe I am letting myself be drawn into this nerd debate, but
hey,
> > I don't have a date for Saturday night either.
> >
> > The Falcon uses LASERS, which would not even be able to penetrate the
> > Enterprises' deflector beam. Phasers are a lot more powerfuls. Lasers
are no
> > match.
>
> That depends entirely on how _much energy_ can be put into each beam.
> Phasers might be more efficient per given gigawattage, but the
> evidence of the TV shows and the movies is that the SW ships carry a
> lot more gigawattage.
>
> Ironically, though, of all the _Enterprises_, I'd give the original
> one the best change against the _Falcon_, though it's odds are poor.
>
> Shermanlee
#--MOGWAI--#
NEVER said you Yanks were wussies!
Don't assume or you make An aSS out of U and ME! -:)
Paul Richardson
"jjamesge" <jjam...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:rXch9.59448$AR1.2...@bin2.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com...
> Actually, I'd give Voyager the best shot against the Falcon, mainly
because
> it seems to have the ability to deploy additional smaller ships to help
> defend itself.
> Plus, the Voyager is such a large ship, that the Falcon probably would be
> like a mosquito trying to bite an elephant.
>
smaller than a Galaxy class like Enterprise
--
Paul R
Overworked of Borg, you will be assimilated when I can get round to it
>
> "Johnny1A" <sherm...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:b3030854.02091...@posting.google.com...
> > <storyt...@surfree.com> wrote in message
> news:<alrk7a$fmk$1...@slb4.atl.mindspring.net>...
> > > I can't believe I am letting myself be drawn into this nerd debate,
but
> hey,
> > > I don't have a date for Saturday night either.
> > >
> > > The Falcon uses LASERS, which would not even be able to penetrate the
> > > Enterprises' deflector beam. Phasers are a lot more powerfuls. Lasers
> are no
> > > match.
> >
> > That depends entirely on how _much energy_ can be put into each beam.
> > Phasers might be more efficient per given gigawattage, but the
> > evidence of the TV shows and the movies is that the SW ships carry a
> > lot more gigawattage.
> >
> > Ironically, though, of all the _Enterprises_, I'd give the original
> > one the best change against the _Falcon_, though it's odds are poor.
> >
> > Shermanlee
>
>
Dave Leigh
>
> "jjamesge" <jjam...@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:rXch9.59448$AR1.2...@bin2.nnrp.aus1.giganews.com...
>> Actually, I'd give Voyager the best shot against the Falcon, mainly
> because
>> it seems to have the ability to deploy additional smaller ships to help
>> defend itself.
>> Plus, the Voyager is such a large ship, that the Falcon probably would be
>> like a mosquito trying to bite an elephant.
>>
> Don't make me laugh, Voyager gets knocked out by a lump of cheese and it's
> smaller than a Galaxy class like Enterprise
That doesn't mean much. The Galaxy class Enterprise was an oversized
Winnebago, full of non-essential personnel, schools, and playgrounds. It
also had an unfortunate tendency to bump into planets. Good riddance to it.
The Ghost In The Machine
<eggt...@yahoo.com>
wrote
on 12 Sep 2002 18:40:43 -0700
<4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com>:
> Imagine, if you will, Han Solo suddenly found himself beseiged by the
> Enterprise. Would the Millenium Falcon be able to defeat Captain Kirk?
[rest of highly speculative missive snipped]
But what OS did both of them use? That's the *real* important stuff. :-)
--
#191, ewi...@earthlink.net
It's still legal to go .sigless.
Mark Kent
Hash: SHA1
phobos <pho...@hotmail.com> espoused:
I recall that during the Foundation vs Empire battles, the Empire
was still hugely powerful (this is well after Seldon died), but what
prevents the Empire from using this might and power is the politics
associated with its continued decline.
>
> Of course, if it really did come to war, chances are that Daneel would
> quietly have Darth Vader bumped off :-)
Hehe - or more probably just used his unique capabilities to
influence Vader back to the, err, light side?
>
> Other thoughts: Could a First Foundation mentalic shield block out
> Force powers? Could a Second Foundation psi specialist modify a Jedi's
> mind, or vice-versa?
Indeed, is there a difference?
Would the Mule have beaten a Jedi Knight?
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--
| Mark Kent -- Take out the ham to mail me. |
A bird in the bush usually has a friend in there with him.
Paul Richardson
tosser.
--
Paul R
Overworked of Borg, you will be assimilated when I can get round to it
John M. Dollan
anyone want to address the hard science issues of such a battle?
In essence, both ships would be floating about in space, impotent, because
somebody realized that the physics they run on are completely inapplicable
to the real universe. Kirk's floating about on his bridge, regretting
having 430-odd people because they're consuming all of the food and oxygen
at an alarming rate. Solo is floating about on his ship, glad that his air
might last a bit longer with only his co-pilot on board, but still rather
nervous at the Wookie's rumbling tummy and his obviously carnivorous dental
array.
Even ignoring all of this (I know, some of you will claim that there are
different physical laws in these universes, which really opens up an
entirely different can of quantum worms), best to ask the question first:
WHY are they fighting each other? Is Solo pissed because Kirk got more
alien babes at the last space port? Does Chewie really care to be blown up
so his boss can get even on some obscure point? Is Kirk upset just a tad
because Solo flew by and dinged the Enterprise's bumper? Why is the rest of
the crew allowing him to make war on a compeltely unidentified ship? In the
end and in essence, aren't these guys on the same side?
C'mon folks, think a little!
(note: irrelevant newsgroups have been deleted from the address bar:
comp.os.linux.advocacy and alt.babylon5.uk -- I'm keeping
rec.arts.sf.science in because it is the group where I found the thread, but
I will delete it upon request)
...John...
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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Some Guy
"Boris Badenov" <bb...@frostbite.falls.state.mn.us> wrote in message
news:am4vd...@drn.newsguy.com...
> In article <4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com>,
eggt...@yahoo.com
> says...
>
>
> >All in all, it seems like the Enterprise would have a hard time
> >fending off the Millenium Falcon.
>
>
to
> say that the Skylark of Valeron is still the baddest ship in any galaxy...
>
> __________
Just be careful not to get sucked into a vortex!
Some Guy
Steve
> Enterprise. Would the Millenium Falcon be able to defeat Captain Kirk?
You're a pretty sad example of a geek.
The millenium falcons best speed was called "light speed" aka speed of light.
The enterprise had warp 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 ( and more in special circumstances ).
Each warp represeneted a multiple of of the speed of light.
alex
light squared
alex
"Steve" <steves...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:6f8cb8c9.02091...@posting.google.com...
Ray Drouillard
Squaring a speed is meaningless -- unless you are specifying a specific
unit. Essentially, you'll come up with something like m^2 / x^2, which
is not a velocity unit.
Ray
"alex" <lowbaemaSP...@ameritech.net> wrote in message
news:U%wh9.9076$2E6.4...@newssvr28.news.prodigy.com...
Some Guy
"Some Guy" <sum...@attbi.com> wrote in message
news:nEvh9.297617$kp.9...@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att.net...
Mark Fergerson
>
> Well, since some bonehead cross posted this into rec.arts.sf.SCIENCE, does
> anyone want to address the hard science issues of such a battle?
Oh, if you insist.
> In essence, both ships would be floating about in space, impotent, because
> somebody realized that the physics they run on are completely inapplicable
> to the real universe.
Not to mention completely incompatible
with each other.
> ... Kirk's floating about on his bridge, regretting
> having 430-odd people because they're consuming all of the food and oxygen
> at an alarming rate. Solo is floating about on his ship, glad that his air
> might last a bit longer with only his co-pilot on board, but still rather
> nervous at the Wookie's rumbling tummy and his obviously carnivorous dental
> array.
Okay, I take it you've assumed they're
both somehow (magically, anyone?)
transported to this Universe. Don't
forget that Kirk's dilithium will come
apart because such (pseudo?)crystalline
structures can't exist here. It'll
likely do so noisily. Also, his
antimatter containment is probably
inadequate, which ought to light things
up briefly. Meanwhile, Solo's
"radioactive liquid fuel" probably is
violently unstable here, so it'd go off
all at once too.
So we have two bright flashes, and a
tiny, new nebula that will annoy NASA no
end, assuming we can see it from here.
> Even ignoring all of this (I know, some of you will claim that there are
> different physical laws in these universes, which really opens up an
> entirely different can of quantum worms), best to ask the question first:
> WHY are they fighting each other? Is Solo pissed because Kirk got more
> alien babes at the last space port? Does Chewie really care to be blown up
> so his boss can get even on some obscure point? Is Kirk upset just a tad
> because Solo flew by and dinged the Enterprise's bumper? Why is the rest of
> the crew allowing him to make war on a compeltely unidentified ship? In the
> end and in essence, aren't these guys on the same side?
Oh, now that takes all the fun out of
it.
> C'mon folks, think a little!
Well, lessee; assuming the hardware
doesn't assert its incompatibility with
our spacetime, there's the fact that
Solo's running around in an unregistered
(as far as Kirk's concerned) spacecraft,
and almost certainly has something Kirk
will consider contraband aboard. At the
very least, Kirk'll try to arrest Solo.
That ought to be fun to watch. If Solo's
hyperdrive is indeed limited to
lightspeed, Kirk'll have a hell of a
time, because c is on the "expensive"
side of the warp power curve. Kirk can
outrun Solo, but can he _catch_ him?
Mark L. Fergerson
Simon Hibbs
> "Bill Kohlleppel" wrote
> > A regular photon torpedo does not have tracking on it. It is basically a
> line-of-sight missle.
>
> Wrong. See above. You came into this debate lacking in the sufficient
> background to properly participate, didn't you?
What a charming way to make your point.
While it does appear that at some point Photon (or later Quantum)
torpedoes do seem to gain the ability to track targets (they certainly
can in TNG and Voyager), they don't seem to be able to in the old
series, or in the earlier films. Photon Torpedoes are regularly shown
narrowly missing their targets without deviating from their courses,
and flying off in streight lines. They still do this occasionaly in
TNG and Voyager too.
It seems that Star Trek photon/quantum torpedoes are homing when it suits
the script writer, and not homing when it doesn't.
Simon Hibbs
Graham Kennedy
> "Will" <now...@nospaam-yahoo.com> wrote in message news:<sn4h9.39467$KN3....@nwrddc01.gnilink.net>...
>
>>"Bill Kohlleppel" wrote
>
>
>>>A regular photon torpedo does not have tracking on it. It is basically a
>>
>>line-of-sight missle.
>>
>>Wrong. See above. You came into this debate lacking in the sufficient
>>background to properly participate, didn't you?
>
>
> What a charming way to make your point.
>
> While it does appear that at some point Photon (or later Quantum)
> torpedoes do seem to gain the ability to track targets (they certainly
> can in TNG and Voyager), they don't seem to be able to in the old
> series, or in the earlier films. Photon Torpedoes are regularly shown
> narrowly missing their targets without deviating from their courses,
> and flying off in streight lines. They still do this occasionaly in
> TNG and Voyager too.
Can you give us one example of a photon torpedo missing its
target in TOS? (the series, not the movies)
> It seems that Star Trek photon/quantum torpedoes are homing when it suits
> the script writer, and not homing when it doesn't.
You do know that even homing weapons miss their
targets sometimes, yes?
Anthony Buckland
_Seriously_ intergalactic travel, if we take "far, far away" to
mean way outside our local cluster of galaxies. Of course, the
MF was constructed "long, long ago," so it may have been
updated with the technological advances of the reborn Republic,
including an intergalactic drive. And that would presumably
include major weaponry advances. Maybe this is the MF-D,
or MF-ZZ or whatever, with about as much relevance to the
original MF as the Enterprise D has to the WWII US carrier.
And even long, long ago the Empire had magnetic shielding
impervious to weaponry, so the MF facing the Enterprise is
going to be like one of the Independence Day alien fighters,
with unstoppable weapons and no vulnerabilities as long as
the shields aren't sabotaged.
Bet on the MF.
I wonder if that choice of initials was an accident.
John M. Dollan
Mark Fergerson <mferg...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:3D870150...@cox.net...
> Oh, if you insist.
Oh, I do! ;)
> So we have two bright flashes, and a
> tiny, new nebula that will annoy NASA no
> end, assuming we can see it from here.
Actually, a friend of mine in the physics department says that if something
from another universe appears in ours (never mind how, that's another
problem), and that other universe's laws are even SLIGHTLY different from
ours, then the object appearing will simply cease to exist. He was a bit
vague on just what this entails. Disintegration into
our-universe-compatible components, a massive explosion, or simple "poof",
take your pick, I suppose.
> Oh, now that takes all the fun out of
> it.
I'm such a pedantic stick in the quantum foam!
> Well, lessee; assuming the hardware
> doesn't assert its incompatibility with
> our spacetime, there's the fact that
> Solo's running around in an unregistered
> (as far as Kirk's concerned) spacecraft,
> and almost certainly has something Kirk
> will consider contraband aboard. At the
> very least, Kirk'll try to arrest Solo.
> That ought to be fun to watch. If Solo's
> hyperdrive is indeed limited to
> lightspeed, Kirk'll have a hell of a
> time, because c is on the "expensive"
> side of the warp power curve. Kirk can
> outrun Solo, but can he _catch_ him?
Hmm, now there's a thought. Would it be more advantageous to send a few
shuttles after him? Of course, assuming that we "even out" the two
technologies and that their disparate weapons can be accurately compared
without resorting to whole arguments on the meaning of mega-watt lasers and
high yield phaser banks or shielding, the shuttles would probably be toast,
though both tpes of ships seem fairly maneuverable.
Of course, a well timed series of phaser hits would pretty much end the
whole matter, if they could be fired just before the Falcon went into light
speed -- (but is it light speed, or just beyond light speed. Magical
hyperdrive or not, to go at light speed you still need an infinite amount of
energy; I assume going beyond light speed can only entail some kind of
actual shortcut so that the local space the ship is in is being stretched
faster than light, but the ship itself is not traveling faster than that).
I'm getting a headache.
...John...
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.389 / Virus Database: 220 - Release Date: 9/16/02
The Ghost In The Machine
<steves...@yahoo.com>
wrote
on 16 Sep 2002 19:47:13 -0700
<6f8cb8c9.02091...@posting.google.com>:
> eggt...@yahoo.com (Egg Troll) wrote in message
> news:<4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com>...
>> Imagine, if you will, Han Solo suddenly found himself beseiged by the
>> Enterprise. Would the Millenium Falcon be able to defeat Captain Kirk?
>
> You're a pretty sad example of a geek.
>
> The millenium falcons best speed was called "light speed" aka
> speed of light.
You mean they didn't have ridiculous or ludicrous speed, like
the ship Spaceball 1 did? :-) I wonder what ridiculous speed
looks like. (Ludicrous speed was plaid; light speed was very like
the Falcon's, with straight star streaks. Maybe ridiculous speed
is multihelix, or possibly pointillist. We'll never know unless
they make a sequel...)
As for Millennium Falcon's top speed -- good question. All we know
is that it could make the Kessel run in 12 parsecs. (Because
"parsec" is actually a unit of distance -- about 3.26 light years,
if memory serves -- this never made any sense.)
>
> The enterprise had warp 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 ( and more in
> special circumstances ). Each warp represeneted a multiple of
> of the speed of light.
The old Enterprise has been apparently clocked at warp 14.1, if
memory serves. (Nomad had increased the efficiency of the engines.
Or was that the one where Scotty stuck himself in a tube with a
slightly jammed magnetic probe, after the Enterprise had been
"misassembled" out of phase?)
The old Enterprise also could sustain a speed of warp 11, again
with modifications. (This was the episode where they were essentially
hijacked by aliens from Andromeda galaxy, who took human form. Kirk
convinced them that they'd be human by the time they reached
Andromeda, so they turned around and went home. :-) )
The highest cruising speed appears to be warp 6, with warp 8 for
a short time -- for various definitions of "short", admittedly.
Presumably something would overheat after a time.
_The Making Of Star Trek_ was not horribly clear on the matter of
how fast the Enterprise would go, but it wasn't linear; if I
recall it was intended to be cubic -- not that that would make a lot
of sense anyway, what with the time/space distortion necessitated
by relativity going on in the interim. (Besides, were the Enterprise
to actually travel at 1.000c, it could flit across the Universe in
exactly 0 seconds. It just *looks* a lot longer from an outside
viewpoint... :-) )
Of course the sad fact of the matter is that "warp factor" meant
precisely what the writers required at the time... :-)
ObBabylon: Ships traveling through jump gates would probably beat
both of 'em... :-)
ObDrWho: Depends on whether the Type 40 malfunctions again.
Because it's a time machine, it's a meaningless
question in some respects. Now where was that Zero
room again? (Maybe that's where he left his sonic
screwdriver...)
ObRedDwarf: Did they ever land anywhere?
ObLostInSpace: Depends on whether anyone can *find* them, or
vice versa. Maybe that cute girl dressed in green
can give them directions, if she can stop teasing
Dr. Smith.... :-) Maybe he and Lister can compare notes...
ObVoyager: Make that Lister, Dr. Smith, and Captain Janeway...
ObNextGeneration: We'll just follow Captain Kirk, and maybe
take a side trip or two into alternate universes
where Tasha Yar is still alive. Racing? Sure.
As soon as we've defeated the Borg cube...
ObThisIslandEarth: Did we find the ship in the ocean yet?
ObIsaacAsimov: In _I, Robot_, the ship traveled 300,000 parsecs
to another galaxy, with a short delay (hyperspace
jumps do weird things to human perception). However,
it's not clear how long that delay is -- although
the storyline suggests a few minutes, just enough to
have The Brain put in a few humorous ditties about death
to Gregory Powell and Michael Donovan.
All other Asimov stories hypothesize a trifling kick
or jar when jumping some light-years.
ObDune: Sorry, that's up to the Guild. We have no idea.
ObStarshipTroopers: Probably middle of the pack. Besides, they were too
busy fighting Bugs to race anyone.
ObForeverWar: Slowpoke of the pack, but they cheat by using collapsars.
ObQuark: Where are the trash bins again?
ObFarscape: Unclear. Moya can starburst but it's not clear how fast.
ObStargate: I'm not familar enough with the series to know. There was
one episode, though, where they got stuck in a time loop.
ObAlien[s]: What lightspeed capability? They were too busy either
admiring Sigourney Weaver (with or without hair) or
getting out of the way of (or eaten by) Mister Toothy....
ObPlanetOfTheApes: The slow one of this pack. I'm not sure who would
win, the Earth ship or Star Trek's SS Botany Bay, another
sleeper ship.
ObEnterprise: We'll get back to you; we're still testing.
Ob3rdRock: Naaaah.
ObTenchiMuyo: Might be fast enough, if Mihoshi can program the computer
properly; it was, after all, a police vessel. Or maybe
they could just feed Ryo-oki a hot pepper instead.
MeeeeeeeeeeeeeYOOOOOWWWWWWWWWW!!!!!!!!!
ObGundam: Unknown, but there's lots of pretty explosions.
ObOutlawStar: Unknown.
ObDragonballZ: Amazing that Gohan (Goku?) didn't get squished into a flat
little pancake at 100g.
(Did I miss any?)
--
#191, ewi...@earthlink.net -- and where *did* they get all that antimatter?
Paul Richardson
"The Ghost In The Machine" <ew...@sirius.athghost7038suus.net> wrote in
message news:0t08ma...@lexi2.athghost7038suus.net...
Funny how on Voyager, no one had broken Warp 10 without going into Transwarp
and when Paris went through the Warp 10 barrier his biochemistry altered.
>
> ObBabylon: Ships traveling through jump gates would probably beat
> both of 'em... :-)
>
> ObDrWho: Depends on whether the Type 40 malfunctions again.
> Because it's a time machine, it's a meaningless
> question in some respects. Now where was that Zero
> room again? (Maybe that's where he left his sonic
> screwdriver...)
>
> ObRedDwarf: Did they ever land anywhere?
Starbug landed, the Red Dwarf only bumped into things
>
> ObLostInSpace: Depends on whether anyone can *find* them, or
> vice versa. Maybe that cute girl dressed in green
> can give them directions, if she can stop teasing
> Dr. Smith.... :-) Maybe he and Lister can compare notes...
>
> ObVoyager: Make that Lister, Dr. Smith, and Captain Janeway...
>
> ObNextGeneration: We'll just follow Captain Kirk, and maybe
> take a side trip or two into alternate universes
> where Tasha Yar is still alive. Racing? Sure.
> As soon as we've defeated the Borg cube...
>
> ObThisIslandEarth: Did we find the ship in the ocean yet?
>
> ObIsaacAsimov: In _I, Robot_, the ship traveled 300,000 parsecs
> to another galaxy, with a short delay (hyperspace
> jumps do weird things to human perception). However,
> it's not clear how long that delay is -- although
> the storyline suggests a few minutes, just enough to
> have The Brain put in a few humorous ditties about death
> to Gregory Powell and Michael Donovan.
> All other Asimov stories hypothesize a trifling kick
> or jar when jumping some light-years.
>
> ObDune: Sorry, that's up to the Guild. We have no idea.
Instantaneous translation from one point in space to another point in space.
>
> ObStarshipTroopers: Probably middle of the pack. Besides, they were too
> busy fighting Bugs to race anyone.
>
> ObForeverWar: Slowpoke of the pack, but they cheat by using collapsars.
>
> ObQuark: Where are the trash bins again?
>
> ObFarscape: Unclear. Moya can starburst but it's not clear how fast.
>
> ObStargate: I'm not familar enough with the series to know. There was
> one episode, though, where they got stuck in a time loop.
>
> ObAlien[s]: What lightspeed capability? They were too busy either
> admiring Sigourney Weaver (with or without hair) or
> getting out of the way of (or eaten by) Mister Toothy....
>
> ObPlanetOfTheApes: The slow one of this pack. I'm not sure who would
> win, the Earth ship or Star Trek's SS Botany Bay, another
> sleeper ship.
>
> ObEnterprise: We'll get back to you; we're still testing.
>
> Ob3rdRock: Naaaah.
>
> ObTenchiMuyo: Might be fast enough, if Mihoshi can program the computer
> properly; it was, after all, a police vessel. Or maybe
> they could just feed Ryo-oki a hot pepper instead.
> MeeeeeeeeeeeeeYOOOOOWWWWWWWWWW!!!!!!!!!
>
> ObGundam: Unknown, but there's lots of pretty explosions.
>
> ObOutlawStar: Unknown.
>
> ObDragonballZ: Amazing that Gohan (Goku?) didn't get squished into a flat
> little pancake at 100g.
>
Fireball XL5, sublight
Space Patrol, sublight
Star Smashers of the Galaxy Rangers (book only) Instantaneous using the
Chedite Projector mounted on the Pleasantville Eagle
Skylark of Space (book only), so fast the only thing that kept up with it
was EE "Doc" Smith's ability to write in superlatives
Any more?
--
Paul R
Overworked of Borg, you will be assimilated when I can get round to it
---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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Timothy Little
>Skylark of Space (book only), so fast the only thing that kept up
>with it was EE "Doc" Smith's ability to write in superlatives
Hmm: Seaton (as of the end of the series) vs Q?
- Tim
Coridon Henshaw <(chenshaw<RE<MOVE>@(T
news:alu01s$1d1$0...@216.39.137.108:
> Also, do the Shadows use a BSD-style license, or do
> they use a GPL-style license?)
That's a silly question. Everyone knows the Shadows are the end result of
giving Microsoft a few million years of 'freedom to innovate.' Microshadow
bought the rights to the universe and licenced the right to live back to
its inhabitants on a subscription basis. Under the Shadow subscription
model, licences for use of Microshadow Universe<tm> are payable in blood on
a thousand year basis.
And as for the Vorlons, let's just say Microshadow won't again make the
mistake of operating an autonomous development/marketing division aimed at
cornering the market on religion...
Followups restricted to the group I happen to be reading at the moment.
--
"We're Americans. Fuck you." -- Paraphrase of contemporary US foreign
policy.
Coridon Henshaw / http://www3.sympatico.ca/gcircle/csbh
Boris Badenov
|Hmm: Seaton (as of the end of the series) vs Q?
No contest - Q. Now, Marc C. Duquesne, however......
Dave Leigh
> As for Millennium Falcon's top speed -- good question. All we know
> is that it could make the Kessel run in 12 parsecs. (Because
> "parsec" is actually a unit of distance -- about 3.26 light years,
> if memory serves -- this never made any sense.)
If my memory serves correctly, I once read an interview claiming that this
was a corruption (whether due to transcription error or due to Harrison
Ford's lazy accent, I don't know) of the invented word, "parasec"... which
still makes no sense (Still, "parasec" sounds slightly less twisted than
the god-awful time measurements used in Battlestar: Galactica (centon,
micron, yaren, etc.))
At least you can rationalize "parasec" on the basis that some objective
measurement is necessary when traveling at relativistic speeds. I surmise
that the Kessel Run would properly have been clocked at sublight speeds.
Several times in the SW series it's been demonstrated that once a ship...
ANY ship, including a rusty rebel transport... engages hyperdrive it's not
worth chasing... so the trick to outrunning the big Corellian ships is to
avoid capture until you get to a point where you're clear enough from the
planet's gravitational field to engage the hyperdrive (presumably
hyperdrive somehow avoids time dilation). Han's boast makes sense only in
the context of sublight speed, the Kessel Run figures don't tell us
anything, and we've got absolutely no idea how fast the hyperdrive is.
> The old Enterprise has been apparently clocked at warp 14.1, if
> memory serves. (Nomad had increased the efficiency of the engines.
> Or was that the one where Scotty stuck himself in a tube with a
> slightly jammed magnetic probe, after the Enterprise had been
> "misassembled" out of phase?)
Between TOS and TNG they re-calibrated the scale. Now Warp 10 represents
the theoretical limit of speed. IOW, they simply raised the "speed of
light" to some value that allowed travel to other stars. Of course, they
promptly broke that rule when Q snapped his fingers and tossed the
Enterprise D over to Borg space. Then there are the "Traveler" episodes
tossing the theoretical upper limit of speed right back into the mud. Bah!
I far prefer Doc Smith's method of getting things done... he simply
temporarily did away with the ship's inertia. No inertia, no speed limit.
How? Who cares?
<snip>
> (Did I miss any?)
Well, there was Klaatu's seamless saucer from "The Day the Earth Stood
Still". And the "S.S. Minnow" seems to have traveled awfully far from
Hawaii in only three hours... I wonder how fast it went, too.
Coridon Henshaw <(chenshaw<RE<MOVE>@(T
> we've got absolutely no idea how fast the hyperdrive is.
Calculations based on canon data yield hyperdrive speed estimates ranging
from 600,000c to 50 million c. The rationale behind these estimates can
be found at
http://www.stardestroyer.net/Empire/Tech/Propulsion/Propulsion2.html .
> Between TOS and TNG they re-calibrated the scale. Now Warp 10
> represents the theoretical limit of speed. IOW, they simply raised the
> "speed of light" to some value that allowed travel to other stars. Of
> course, they promptly broke that rule when Q snapped his fingers and
> tossed the Enterprise D over to Borg space.
Not quite. In the TNG warp scale, warp 10 represents infinite velocity.
There is no inherent speed limit in the warp scale; any velocity between
warp 9 and infinity can be represented using non-integer warp factors
greater than 9 (e.g. warp 9.99999999). The reference to IIRC warp 13 in
TNG:All Good Things suggests that saner heads ultimately prevailed in
Starfleet (at least in that timeline) and the warp scale was redesigned
away from this rather nutty idea of 10=infinity.
Voyager's Warp 10 and associated <cough> 'evolution' is IMO just Yet
Another Voyager Screwup.
> I far prefer Doc Smith's method of getting things done... he simply
> temporarily did away with the ship's inertia. No inertia, no speed
> limit.
I'm not really sure if that'd work. Reducing mass to zero yields travel
at c. Eliminating inertia might have the same effect.
Personally, I prefer long-range teleport drives, a la Moving Mars. No
pesky time-of-light considerations here. :-)
Distribution limited to groups where SF propulsion is on-topic.
GerardS
| The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
| And the "S.S. Minnow" seems to have traveled awfully far from
| Hawaii in only three hours... I wonder how fast it went, too.
(I can't believe I'm writing this...) No, the S.S. Minnnow set
sail for a 3 hour cruise. It hit a storm, and then went off course.
I don't believe it was ever said/told how long they were at sea
before landfall (or shipwreck). ___________________________Gerard S.
The Ghost In The Machine
<paulszoo...@blueyonder.co.uk>
wrote
on Tue, 17 Sep 2002 21:56:44 +0100
<am84uq$3jm1p$1...@ID-121537.news.dfncis.de>:
>
> "The Ghost In The Machine" <ew...@sirius.athghost7038suus.net> wrote in
> message news:0t08ma...@lexi2.athghost7038suus.net...
[snip for brevity]
>> ObDragonballZ: Amazing that Gohan (Goku?) didn't get squished into a flat
>> little pancake at 100g.
>>
> Fireball XL5, sublight
>
> Space Patrol, sublight
Hmm...what was the one where the pilot -- a fairly tall blonde woman --
had to lie in a prone [*] position somewhat like a weird bombadier?
Or is this the one where the suburbs were out in space and the police
were, too? (A somewhat interesting, if short-lived, series -- but
I'm not sure if there's a lot they could do with it that's not already
been done by 'COPS'. :-) )
>
> Star Smashers of the Galaxy Rangers (book only) Instantaneous using the
> Chedite Projector mounted on the Pleasantville Eagle
>
> Skylark of Space (book only), so fast the only thing that kept up with it
> was EE "Doc" Smith's ability to write in superlatives
>
> Any more?
>
> --
> Paul R
>
> Overworked of Borg, you will be assimilated when I can get round to it
>
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.389 / Virus Database: 220 - Release Date: 16/09/2002
>
>
[*] as opposed to supine. For some reason the ship had to be
controlled in this fashion, as opposed to a more conventional
seating arrangement such as one might see in, say, a F-18 or
a Lear jet. IIRC, they also had jumpgates.
--
#191, ewi...@earthlink.net
Mark Blunden
> The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
>
>> As for Millennium Falcon's top speed -- good question. All we know
>> is that it could make the Kessel run in 12 parsecs. (Because
>> "parsec" is actually a unit of distance -- about 3.26 light years,
>> if memory serves -- this never made any sense.)
>
> If my memory serves correctly, I once read an interview claiming that
> this was a corruption (whether due to transcription error or due to
> Harrison Ford's lazy accent, I don't know) of the invented word,
> "parasec"... which still makes no sense (Still, "parasec" sounds
> slightly less twisted than the god-awful time measurements used in
> Battlestar: Galactica (centon, micron, yaren, etc.))
One of the Star Wars novels comes up with an explanation for this - I don't
know if it's canonical now. Basically, the smuggling run out from the spice
mines at Kessel passes a really massive star (blue giant or similar). If you
go too far out around the star, you'll run into Imperial patrols, but too
close and its gravity will prevent you escaping. The faster your ship, the
closer you can get to the star and still reach escape velocity - and thus,
the shorter the route. The Falcon managed to skim closer to the star than
any previous vessel, completing the run in less than twelve parsecs -
distance, not speed.
--
Mark.
mark.b...@ntlworld.com
* So much time, so little to do
Simon Hibbs
> Can you give us one example of a photon torpedo missing its
> target in TOS? (the series, not the movies)
No, but it happens several times in the early films - are you suggesting
their technology regressed between the two?
> You do know that even homing weapons miss their
> targets sometimes, yes?
Of course, but it beggars belief that they can miss at a variety of ranges
by only a few dozen metres, without deviating from a streight line course.
The best example of this is probably Wrath of Khan, in which neither side
can shoot for toffee.
Simon Hibbs
pervect
"Timothy Little" <t...@freeman.little-possums.net> wrote in message
news:slrnaofab...@freeman.little-possums.net...
LOL.
The Skylark equivalent of Q was IMO obviously the pure intellectuals.
Apparently defeated by Seaton in an earlier novel, they come back in the
last. Since they've had their fun, they don't bother to actually bother to
demataterialize Seaton, which was never really their intention. Apparently
they (the pure intellectuals) just wanted to watch him squirm.
So I'd have to go with Q :-)
pervect
"Egg Troll" <eggt...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4e2f159f.0209...@posting.google.com...
> Imagine, if you will, Han Solo suddenly found himself beseiged by the
> Enterprise. Would the Millenium Falcon be able to defeat Captain Kirk?
I think a race between the two vessels (over the Kessel run, perhaps?) would
be more interesting. Of course, the Enterprise would win by arriving before
it left :).
Westman
"Dave Leigh" <dave....@cratchit.org> schreef in bericht
news:uo3olni...@corp.supernews.com...
> phobos wrote:
>
> > I'd just about bet on the Falcon against Kirk, largely due to its
> > superior manoeuvrability, and certainly against Archer, but not
> > against Picard.
>
> Here's how that works:
>
> Picard calls for open hailing frequencies and begins to orate, "We are
from
> the United Federation of Planets. We come on a mission of peace with
> respect for all life forms, including a unique species of fungus found in
> my Aunt Patricia's refrigerator..." blah, blah, blah, drone, drone, drone.
> Han smashes the communications device, but due to a highly unlikely but
> necessary-to-the-plot confluence of events involving the particle of the
> week, the Enterprise's subspace radio has set up a harmonic resonance with
> the Falcon's hull, with the end result that the incessant monotone voice
is
> now coming from all directions. Four days later Picard finishes his
> introduction to a response of total silence (In space, no one can hear
> crickets chirp). Riker beams over to the Falcon with a glad-to-be-away
team
> and discovers Solo and Chewbacca swinging from nooses fashioned from the
> Wookie's bandolier and wiring stripped from a small rolling dustbin and a
> brass mannequin.
The Ghost In The Machine
<dave....@cratchit.org>
wrote
on Tue, 17 Sep 2002 19:34:23 -0500
<uoffil8...@corp.supernews.com>:
> The Ghost In The Machine wrote:
>
>> As for Millennium Falcon's top speed -- good question. All we know
>> is that it could make the Kessel run in 12 parsecs. (Because
>> "parsec" is actually a unit of distance -- about 3.26 light years,
>> if memory serves -- this never made any sense.)
>
> If my memory serves correctly, I once read an interview
> claiming that this was a corruption (whether due to
> transcription error or due to Harrison Ford's lazy accent,
> I don't know) of the invented word, "parasec"... which
> still makes no sense (Still, "parasec" sounds slightly
> less twisted than the god-awful time measurements used in
> Battlestar: Galactica (centon, micron, yaren, etc.))
Heh...completely forgot about Commander Adama's bunch. But
they're not that fast. (I'm not sure they're that memorable
either....)
And then there's the Tiger's Claw and its fighter retinue.
Somebody did actually bother making a movie of that; I saw
a snatch of it as I flipped through channels once. The fighters
were all Gatling gun, artistically speaking; that much
I remember. Unfortunately I can't remember the title of
the movie, of course...
And I'd be quite remiss in not bringing in "The Last
Starfighter". A rather silly premise, admittedly ("local
trailer-park kid gets very good on a video game that turns
out to be a recruitment tool for an alien fighter group;
the kid rejects the first overture after seeing the base,
which subsequently gets wiped out while he's back on Earth,
so he gets to be the lone hero while dodging an evil clone
flying a new improved version of the ship in real life with
an alien sidekick to help him"), but I happen to like it.
Unfortunately I have no idea how any of the ships would
fare in a theoretical race or battle.
And then there's "Dark Star", which was just -- weird.
But they'd probably out-argue everyone else philosophically,
because of the "smart bomb". (Unfortunately, they'd not be
able to outrace anyone; the "smart bomb" eventually convinced
itself to blow up while still stuck in the bay.)
Or one can try to figure out how to steer Earth's Moon in
"Space: 1999". How they got so far into interstellar
space without Walter Matthaw (?) and Barbara Bain going gray
and dying first is beyond me. :-)
>
> At least you can rationalize "parasec" on the basis that
> some objective measurement is necessary when traveling at
> relativistic speeds.
Assuming the Kessel run is a loop.
> I surmise that the Kessel Run would
> properly have been clocked at sublight speeds. Several times
> in the SW series it's been demonstrated that once a ship...
> ANY ship, including a rusty rebel transport... engages hyperdrive
> it's not worth chasing... so the trick to outrunning the big
> Corellian ships is to avoid capture until you get to a point
> where you're clear enough from the planet's gravitational field
> to engage the hyperdrive (presumably hyperdrive somehow avoids
> time dilation). Han's boast makes sense only in the context of
> sublight speed, the Kessel Run figures don't tell us anything,
> and we've got absolutely no idea how fast the hyperdrive is.
Makes some sense. Isaac Asimov hints that one can track Jumps
if one does so carefully -- but it has to be done carefully,
lest the pursuer wind up parsecs out of position, especially
near the galactic center where the stars are more thickly
clustered. The Enterprise had some sort of subspace longrange
scanner network. Doctor Who had his wits. :-) (And occasionally
a sonic screwdriver and an actually competent helper, as opposed
to, say, an airline stewardess who gets stuck on the Tardis. :-) )
Of course, if the Corellian ships' captains were smart enough they
could make a guess at where the rebel was going and jump there,
themselves.
>
>> The old Enterprise has been apparently clocked at warp 14.1, if
>> memory serves. (Nomad had increased the efficiency of the engines.
>> Or was that the one where Scotty stuck himself in a tube with a
>> slightly jammed magnetic probe, after the Enterprise had been
>> "misassembled" out of phase?)
>
> Between TOS and TNG they re-calibrated the scale.
That figures. :-/
> Now Warp 10 represents the theoretical limit of speed. IOW,
> they simply raised the "speed of light" to some value that
> allowed travel to other stars. Of course, they promptly broke
> that rule when Q snapped his fingers and tossed the Enterprise D
> over to Borg space. Then there are the "Traveler" episodes
> tossing the theoretical upper limit of speed right back into the
> mud. Bah! I far prefer Doc Smith's method of getting things
> done... he simply temporarily did away with the ship's inertia.
> No inertia, no speed limit. How? Who cares?
Heh. Not familiar with Doc Smith -- unless one's referring to
Dr. Zachary "I'm so pathetic it's laughable" Smith. :-)
(Poor Jonathan Harris, to have a sharp-tongued "bubble-headed
booby" as a sidekick. :-) )
I'll admit TNG felt a bit like used chewing gum, although the
sets were prettier. (Deanna Troi, Tasha Yar, and Dr. Byerly --
I'd have to look up the actress' names -- weren't bad looking
either. Even 7 of 9 has her plusses -- although one of them
isn't that strange looking eyepiece. :-) )
>
> <snip>
>
>> (Did I miss any?)
>
> Well, there was Klaatu's seamless saucer from "The Day the
> Earth Stood Still".
Haven't seen that classic.
> And the "S.S. Minnow" seems to have traveled awfully far from
> Hawaii in only three hours... I wonder how fast it went, too.
It was a *very long* three hour tour..... :-) Mind you, at least
in the Hawaii island group they might have a chance at washing up
at an uncharted desert isle. Whether it would have cocoanuts and
other such things suitable for making the Professor's many
inventions (everything *but* a VLF transmitter that they could have
used to call for rescue -- Hawaii might be a little out of the way
but they're not *that* primitive), I can't say.
You'd think they could at least have tried to salvage the engines
or something and make a powered raft. I don't know how hard
that would be to do on a boat the size of a small yacht, though.
--
#191, ewi...@earthlink.net