Most dangerous dance move?
Kiran Wagle
that get out of hand, not that there ARE any of thouse of course) in the
contra dance repertoire?
I have something in mind, but I wondered what others thought.
~ Kiran <gr...@netcom.com>
Paul Balliet
My vote goes to the roving swing with chicken wing elbows.
The usual result is a sharp elbow in the back. I'm usually happy
if I can steer my partner out of the way. As a caller, I'm
not sure how to prevent this...
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/ ) /) / ) /) /) )
/--'__. , , / /-< __. / / o . -+-'
/ (_(__(_/__/(_ /___) (_(__/(__/(__(__(/__(_
Peter Renzland
>So folks, what is the most dangerous dance move (not counting flourishes
>that get out of hand, not that there ARE any of thouse of course) in the
>contra dance repertoire?
>I have something in mind, but I wondered what others thought.
1. Arches. Especially alternating arches (dip/dive). Most especially,
rushed, running arches over all the men's or women's heads, combined
with rushed gallops down the set right after everyone is (almost) finished
swinging. Someone called such a dance, which brings out all the worst
in beginners and dance warriors. This resulted in a fall. To my
astonishment the same caller called the same dance somewhere else
a few weeks later, resulting in similar chaos.
2. Promenades in closely spaced squares. Defensive hold (R in R, L in L,
in front) is highly recommended. And watch out for those varsouvian
elbows from counter-rotating neighbouring squares.
3. Swings with straight arms (locked elbows) and joined fists at face
level on crowded floors or with dancers who have little control.
4. my all-time-worst-ever-total-insanity-bozo-manoeuver:
at a general public thanksgiving fair square dance (people didn't expect
there to be dancing, and most people there were not dancers).
the caller would "demonstrate" a "favourite" swing hold, by picking
some woman who (probably) had not done much dancing, take her in
position X, and proceed to rotate with her wildly, causing her
to loose her footing, and probably considerable neck/back pain the next
day. Here's position X:
face each other. take hands. bend L arm and straighten R arm.
you are now R shoulders together. now raise L hands over and behind your
own head. and now start turning ...
Yes, centrifugal force will contort your spine and pull infrequently used
muscles. And, yes, this configuration takes up an awful lot of floor space,
and even more head space, and the danger of counter-rotating heads banging
together at high speed is great.
At the time I was too much of an outsider to do more than make sure none
of the dancers tried this folly (which was easy, there were never more
than two sets, and I just showed them an easy safe swing hold).
Nowadays I would take the caller aside and put the fear of God (and
litigation) into him.
--
, @ _{)_ , Je danse
@__{) Peter Renzland Pe...@Renzland.Org \/( )\/"\/\ /\/ donc je suis
(>~(] Toronto Traditional Social Dance /=\ /==\ tanztoll EntP
/\ /| Calendar - Network - Archive /___\ |/\| 416 323-1300
/( (\ finger / mail Da...@Renzland.Org _/ \_ \# _# Kia Ora!
MSchway
wrote:
> So folks, what is the most dangerous dance move (not counting flourishes
> that get out of hand, not that there ARE any of thouse of course) in the
> contra dance repertoire?
I remember a (square) dance in Seattle about 12 years ago called by visiting
caller, Kate Charles (is she still around?).
Just before the allemande left and right and left grand, she inserted the call:
"kiss your corner".
Now *that's* dangerous!! ;-)
--Mike Schway
Jim Kahan
Tuesday night. For my teaching, I used a nice tune with a moderate
tempo. Then, during the evening, the DJ selected the fastest Hambo
record they had. What with a batch of people new to the dance and a
fairly slick floor, I commented that it could be dangerous out there.
To which the DJ replied that dancing was a hazardous recreation and
that if I didn't want to take the risk, I should find another hobby!
Keith 'Elmo' Eldridge
In article <grooCo4...@netcom.com>, Kiran Wagle (gr...@netcom.com) writes:
>So folks, what is the most dangerous dance move (not counting flourishes
>that get out of hand, not that there ARE any of thouse of course) in the
>contra dance repertoire?
The most dangerous dance move I have come accross has to be the basket. It is
more of an English move than a Contra one. It is essentially a swing for four
dancers, the men (or somtimes all four people) pur their arms round the
waists of the people next to them in the ring, and all four buzz-step around.
While this move can be an elegent, balanced, smooth manover the danger lies in
the two men (who are usually physically larger) grabbing to tightly lifting the
lighter dancers of the floor. Unfortunatly I have seen this at English
Ceilidhs far too often. It resembles a helicopter, and is as difficult to land.
Due to variations in the weight of the so-called-dancers a basket (helicopter)
rairly stays in one spot. There is a real risk of breaking either the legs of
the (sometimes unwilling) participants or the head of some one in the next set,
not to mention catching the flying footware.
Luckily I have never been at a dance where someone has broken a leg and I hope
I never am. Twistes ankles and arguments with Morris sticks is another matter.
Elmo (with both feet nearer to the ground)
+-----------------------+---------------------------------+-------------------+
| Keith 'Elmo' Eldridge | | 40 Lindsay Avenue |
| | INTERNET : el...@gwt.win-uk.net | West Point |
| Dancer and Caller | CompuServe: 73064,1164 | Manchester |
| | | M19 2AG |
| | Phone&Fax : (061) 225 1048 | UK |
+-----------------------+---------------------------------+-------------------+
Echo 01
writes:
Referancing the Califonia bread 'basket' swing which is very dangerious.
That move should be left to demo groups who practice it as a team move.
Also if You look at the first picture in Lloyd Shaw's book 'Cowboy Dances'
you will see five baskets going at one time. The group was a demo group.
Linda Golder
> > that get out of hand, not that there ARE any of thouse of course) in the
> > contra dance repertoire?
I dislike moves which make me blindly back up in a crowded hall. This
includes "all do-si-do partner across the set"... too easy to trip over
your neighbor, who is also backing up toward me. Falling over someone else
is *not* elegant.
- Linda <lgo...@mbl.edu> Woods Hole, MA, USA
Gavin On Jones
> So folks, what is the most dangerous dance move (not counting flourishes
> that get out of hand, not that there ARE any of thouse of course) in the
> contra dance repertoire?
The dreaded "Hey for four with backflips."
-Jonathan
Gregory E. Frock
>
>I remember a (square) dance in Seattle about 12 years ago called by visiting
>caller, Kate Charles (is she still around?).
Just for info, Kate is alive and well and living in Baltimore. She has been
taking voice lessons for the last couple of years to the benefit of her
singing squares :)
Greg Frock
Gavin On Jones
> face each other. take hands. bend L arm and straighten R arm.
> you are now R shoulders together. now raise L hands over and behind your
> own head. and now start turning ...
>
> Yes, centrifugal force will contort your spine and pull infrequently used
> muscles. And, yes, this configuration takes up an awful lot of floor space,
> and even more head space, and the danger of counter-rotating heads banging
> together at high speed is great.
>
This definitely seems like the all time stupidist variations on a
traditional swing. But what do people think of others?
Such as:
The "same-sex" swing: Right arm around the other persons waist, left hands
joined between at about stomach level
The "sexy" swing: Same as above, except the left arms are raised above the
dancer's heads
The "no arm" swing: Traditional swing, except the outside hands, instead of
being joined, are seperated, and the arms are free to do things such as: be
placed behind your own back, flail about wildly and attempt to hit other
dancers, or just dangle gently at your side. -Jonathan
stic...@miranda.cc.vanderbilt.edu
wrote:
> 2. Promenades in closely spaced squares. Defensive hold (R in R, L in L,
> in front) is highly recommended. And watch out for those varsouvian
> elbows from counter-rotating neighbouring squares.
What is a "varsouvian elbow"?
Here's position X:
> face each other. take hands. bend L arm and straighten R arm.
> you are now R shoulders together. now raise L hands over and behind your
> own head. and now start turning ...
This sounds roughly like what I call a "jitterbug swing"; it can be fun and
safe if you know what you're doing.
A backwards dishrag has my vote for a potentially dangerous
but occasionally deliciously fun contra move. Don't try it without
lots of space.
Henry
Nancy Mamlin
>caller, Kate Charles (is she still around?).
Yep, Kate is still around, and still asking us every now and then to "kiss
our corners". She lives in Baltimore, MD.
Nancy Mamlin
***NOTE: After May 20th, I'm outta here! However, I should still have
the same email address: nm...@umail.umd.edu Don't write to me at this
address! I only read netnews here!***
--
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Jim Saxe
stic...@miranda.cc.vanderbilt.edu (stic...@miranda.cc.vanderbilt.edu)
writes:>> [Description of "bull-by-the-tail" swing omitted]
>This sounds roughly like what I call a "jitterbug swing"; it can be fun and
>safe if you know what you're doing.
[Ascend soapbox]
No. Bad. Wrong. Don't do it.
Besides the awkward posture, there are several things that make this
kind of swing particularly dangerous. First, the swinging couple
presents a very elongated floor pattern as viewed from above, in
contrast with the nearly circular floor pattern of dancers doing a
more compact swing. A circle always occupies the same space as it
rotates about its center; dancers dong a bull-by-the-tail swing are
constantly sweeping through space that they do not already occupy, and
that might just have become occupied by someone else. Second, neither
dancers is in a very good position to see the space towards which the
other dancer's unprotected face is heading. Third, the way the
dancers are connected makes it awkward to put on the brakes, take
evasive action, signal your partner to take evasive action, or steer
your partner out of harm's way if an impending collision is sensed.
For example, in the usual swing position, if my peripheral vision
senses danger, I might momentarily pull my partner a little closer to
me than usual, and this move is fairly easy to signal. From the
bull-by-the-tail position there's no easy way to shift quickly into a
more compact position.
A number of years ago, I was at a dance in New England where a
long-time musician got up and delivered a stern lecture about
bull-by-the-tail swings. He mentioned having been at a dance where
two women smashed into each other's faces and ended up in the
hospital. He also mentioned callers he knew who would have the band
stop playing if they saw bull-by-the-tail swings in progress.
Admittedly, contradancing, like any vigorous physical activity, always
involves some element of risk. Nonetheless, I think there are some
variations--lifts and bull-by-the-tail swings being the top common
examples on my list--that we can recognize as particularly dangerous
and that we should do our best to discourage (and certainly not
actively encourage, either by teaching or by example).
[Descend soapbox]
--Jim Saxe <sa...@src.dec.com>
Peter Renzland
>[what do people think of swing variations] Such as:
>The "same-sex" swing: Right arm around the other persons waist, left hands
>joined between at about stomach level
This is the traditional square dance swing here in Ontario
Note that it has an easy transition into the hands-in-front promenade
favoured here.
Actually, the more towny version of this has the lady put herR hand on the
gent's L shoulder.
>The "sexy" swing: Same as above, except the left arms are raised above the
>dancer's heads
It's a nice variation. I do it often with women who crave variety. I rarely
initiate it.
>The "no arm" swing: Traditional swing, except the outside hands, instead of
>being joined, are seperated, and the arms are free to do things such as: be
>placed behind your own back, flail about wildly and attempt to hit other
>dancers, or just dangle gently at your side. -Jonathan
I like this one (except the flailing bits:-). I do it with partners who are
excellent dancers and who are playful. It often results from starting out with
fumbling hands, trying to meet in different holds, and I playfully just give up
on it. I only ever do it with partners who I know enjoy dancing close with me.
(Generally, not making a contact that is expected can easily offend - such as
declined eye-contact or declined handshake (where it's customary in R<),
etc.)
My favourite is the Scandinavian hold -- hands behind shoulder blades or
several variants. Take a look at page 148 of Ted Sannella's "Balance and
Swing". It's strongly connected, it's balanced, takes little space, promotes
good posture, and makes it possible to correct minor problems. It permits a
wide range of adjustments in angle, closeness, and contact points. I like to
think of the no-arm swing as a variation on this, rather than on the standard
ballroom (waltz-hold) swing. Towards the end of the swing you can place the
woman's R hand into your own R hand behind her back, ready to lead into a
twirl coming out of the swing. I believe Larry Jennings talks about this.
[looking for Zesty Contras ... yes, page 15 -- woman rolls off, man catches
her L hand. Very nice if done well and in time. (Note that the roll-off
can be accomplished without the lead I described, and when in doubt,
probably should be, if at all.)
My least favourite swing is the "Toronto Swing". It alone provides ample
incentive for all my dance gypsy travels;-) It's done in semi-closed (rather
than closed) ballroom position. This means that the shoulders aren't parallel,
but form a V. It also means that as the man moves forward the woman moves
backward (and sideways). And then she leans back and to one side from the
waist, so as to prevent any balance or stability, while working hard to bend
the man's wrist backward and having her back sheer away.
(I just noticed another nice illustration of a swing hold on the front of Zesty
Contras.)
Peter Renzland
>In article <Co5D7...@renzland.org>, pe...@renzland.org (Peter Renzland)
>wrote:
>> 2. Promenades in closely spaced squares. Defensive hold (R in R, L in L,
>> in front) is highly recommended. And watch out for those varsouvian
>> elbows from counter-rotating neighbouring squares.
>What is a "varsouvian elbow"?
Varsouvianna Position -- R in R, L in L, gent's R arm behind (not on) lady's
shoulder. The lady's R elbow, or the gent's L elbow can easily protrude and
hit your partner, if you're in Skater's Position (Courtesy Turn Hold).
When in "hands in front" Promenade Hold, you can avert danger by raising your
joined hands to block such errant elbows.
Denys Proteau
Hi all.
From: Jonathan_...@brown.edu (Gavin "On" Jones)
>This definitely seems like the all time stupidist variations on a
>traditional swing. But what do people think of others?
>Such as:
>The "same-sex" swing: Right arm around the other persons waist, left hands
>joined between at about stomach level
>The "sexy" swing: Same as above, except the left arms are raised above the
>dancer's heads
>The "no arm" swing: Traditional swing, except the outside hands, instead of
>being joined, are seperated, and the arms are free to do things such as: be
>placed behind your own back, flail about wildly and attempt to hit other
>dancers, or just dangle gently at your side. -Jonathan
I like the "same sex" swing alot when I'm doing it with someone who
recognizes it and can get in to it quickly, and I think it's even safer
that the "ballroom" position swing.
Less often I occasionally like the "no arm" swing (or a better term
would be "one free arm") when I think conditions are right.
I don't think I've ever done or noticed anyone else doing the "sexy"
swing describe above (except maybe by performance dance groups?), but I
do occasionally use this hold in Hambo.
My real preferance though is a hold that is only slightly different
than the "ballroom" position: I like for the joined hands to both be
palm facing down, with the man's left hand above the woman's right and
his fingers wrapped around the outside of her hand and into her palm.
Now that I think of it though, I realize I've never tried this from the
woman's role, so I don't know whether there is enough contact with
bottom of the woman's hand for it to be satisfying for her (or me being
"her").
Denys
Dana Nau
>
> ... But what do people think of others?
> Such as:
> <descriptions of three different swing positions>
OK, you asked for it! :-)
Some of these come from a list posted to rec.folk-dancing three or
four years ago, by James Williams (zo...@sava.st-andrews.ac.uk). The
rest I either learned at contra dances, or created myself. I'm not
completely sure that all the names are correct---let me know if you
see any errors.
1. Ballroom position.
2. Like ballroom position, but grasping the other's fingers rather
than their hand.
3. Like ballroom position, but holding your partner's forearm rather
than their hand.
4. Butterfly: like ballroom position, except that the man's left hand
and woman's right hand are free.
5. Like ballroom position, except that the man puts his left arm
behind his back, and the woman takes it with her right.
6. Nottingham swing: cup partner's right elbow with the right hand
(without putting the thumb on the inside of the elbow---that
hurts), and join left hands underneath.
7. Irish: join right hands with elbows bent, and cup your partner's
right elbow with your left hand.
8. Northumberland: hold your partner's right shoulder with your right
hand. Join left hands underneath.
9. Hold your partner's right shoulder with your right hand. Join
left hands at face level.
10. Hold your partner's right shoulder with your right hand. Join
left hands above your heads.
11. Hold your partner's right shoulder with your right hand, and your
partner's left shoulder with your left hand. Thus your right and
left arms are crossed, and so are your partner's.
12. Manx: crosshands hold, with arms bent so elbows are together.
13. One partner clasps his/her hands together; the other cups hands
around those of the first partner. Both partners have elbows bent.
14. Man's hands crossed, with woman's hands coming up from underneath
to grasp the man's.
15. Like above, with roles reversed.
16. Woman's hands on the man's shoulders, his hands on her back.
17. Both partners hold each others arms or shoulders (depending on
the relative length of the arms), with elbows slightly bent.
18. One partner's hands are on the other's back. The other's hands
are free.
19. Each partner has his/her hands around the other's neck.
20. Welsh: right hands on each other's backs, left hands joined
underneath.
21. Right hands on each other's backs, left hands joined above your
heads.
22. Tulloch or Hullichan: Stand right shoulder to right shoulder with
your partner. Put your left hand behind your back and your right
hand behind your partner's back. Take your partner's left hand
with your right hand, and your partner's right hand with your
left.
23. Nose Swing: Link right elbows, with forearms pointing up, and
hold your nose with your right hand. Hold left hands underneath.
24. Ear-Nose Swing: Like the nose swing, but hold your partner's
right ear with your left hand.
25. Stand right shoulder to right shoulder with your partner, link
right elbows, and take your partner's left hand with your left
hand.
26. Same as above, but with your left hands behind your backs.
27. Back cross: the man puts his left hand behind his back, and the
woman takes it with her left. The woman puts her right hand
behind her back, and the man takes it with his right.
28. Cuddle-up (from a swing dance position of the same name): Start
out holding both hands (right in left, left in right). The man
raises his left arm and turns the woman under, without letting go
of either hand.
--
Dana S. Nau
Computer Science Dept. Internet: n...@cs.umd.edu
University of Maryland UUCP: uunet!mimsy!nau
College Park, MD 20742 Telephone: (301) 405-2684
Toby Koosman
>Varsouvianna Position -- R in R, L in L, gent's R arm behind (not on) lady's
>shoulder. The lady's R elbow, or the gent's L elbow can easily protrude and
>hit your partner, if you're in Skater's Position (Courtesy Turn Hold).
>When in "hands in front" Promenade Hold, you can avert danger by raising your
>joined hands to block such errant elbows.
Uh oh. I thought "Skater's position" _was_ the "hands in front" promenade.
Is this a term that has different regional definitions, or have I been
using it incorrectly?
Toby Koosman koo...@utkvx.utk.edu
University of Tennessee
Knoxville, Tennessee USA
Dan Pearl
>
>pe...@renzland.org (Peter Renzland) writes...
>>Varsouvianna Position -- R in R, L in L, gent's R arm behind (not on) lady's
>>shoulder. The lady's R elbow, or the gent's L elbow can easily protrude and
>>hit your partner, if you're in Skater's Position (Courtesy Turn Hold).
>>When in "hands in front" Promenade Hold, you can avert danger by raising your
>>joined hands to block such errant elbows.
>
>Uh oh. I thought "Skater's position" _was_ the "hands in front" promenade.
>Is this a term that has different regional definitions, or have I been
>using it incorrectly?
Here's how I understand it:
All the following positions feature L in L, R in R
1. (Front) Skater's Position: All hands in front, near waist level. L over R
2. Back/Rear Skater's Position: All hands in back, near waist level.
3. Varsouvienne Position [variations noted in spelling]: hands joined above
W's shoulders.
4. New England Style Promenade Position: L extended in front, R on W's R hip.
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dan Pearl ** Stratus Computer, Inc. ** pe...@spectacle.sw.stratus.com
Denys Proteau
dance move? by Dana N...@cs.umd.edu
> In article
<Jonathan_van_Gie...@caswell-229.caswell.brown.edu> Jona
> than_va...@brown.edu (Gavin "On" Jones) writes:
> >
> > ... But what do people think of others?
> > Such as:
> > <descriptions of three different swing positions>
>
> OK, you asked for it! :-)
>
> Some of these come from a list posted to rec.folk-dancing three or
> four years ago, by James Williams (zo...@sava.st-andrews.ac.uk). The
> rest I either learned at contra dances, or created myself. I'm not
> completely sure that all the names are correct---let me know if you
> see any errors.
>
Then Dana Nau lists descriptions for 28 positions.
I admit that I'm tempted to try all of the ones that I haven't tried
before, even the hold you nose and hold you ear ones! Or did Dana just
put those in to see if anyone would read them?
Still, many or most of those positions strike as ok as turn positions
but not too good swing positions. To help you understand my view on
this, I'll just say that in my opinion a (contra) swing should have a
greater tension between the two dances and a faster rotation than an in
place turn. To try to generate similar tension or rotational speed with
some of these hold seems to me (as I sit here pondering them) dangerous
or uncomfortable.
But now I want to go dance and I still have HOURS and HOURS to wait! Arghh!
Denys
Kiran Wagle
> I admit that I'm tempted to try all of the ones that I haven't tried
>before, even the hold you nose and hold you ear ones! Or did Dana just
>put those in to see if anyone would read them?
*laugh* I learned the "hold your nose" one in San Francisco, from a
wonderful dancer who grew up (I think) in Berea, KY and danced back east
for years. It's enormously fun.
I'l have to practice from that list. <grin>
~ Kiran <gr...@netcom.com>
Jim Saxe
> ..., if you're in Skater's Position (Courtesy Turn Hold).
>When in "hands in front" Promenade Hold, ....
tako...@utkvx.utk.edu (Toby Koosman) responds:
>Uh oh. I thought "Skater's position" _was_ the "hands in front" promenade.
>...
pe...@spectacle.sw.stratus.com (Dan Pearl) offers:
>Here's how I understand it:
>
>All the following positions feature L in L, R in R
>
>1. (Front) Skater's Position: All hands in front, near waist level. L over R
>2. Back/Rear Skater's Position: All hands in back, near waist level.
>3. Varsouvienne Position [variations noted in spelling]: hands joined above
> W's shoulders.
>4. New England Style Promenade Position: L extended in front, R on W's R hip.
I checked a few books.
Some define "skater's position" (or "skaters'" or "skaters" or
"skating" position) as number 1 on Dan's list (Toby's interpretation).
Examples include _Dance A While: Handbook of Folk, Square, Contra, and
Social Dance_, by Jane A. Harris, Anne M. Pittman, and Marlys S.
Waller (7th edition, Macmillan, New York, 1994, page 51) and _Square
and Folk Dancing: A Complete Guide for Students Teachers and Callers_,
by Hank Greene (Harper and Row, New York, 1984, page 312).
Others define it as number 4 on Dan's list (Peter's interpretation).
Examples include _Fun Dance Rhythms_, by Alma Heaton (Brigham Young
University Press, Provo, Utah, 1976, page 28) and _Roundance Manual
for Callers, Teachers, Club Committees, Dancers_, by Frank Hamilton
(Revised Edition, Sets in Order American Square Dance Society, Los
Angeles, 1975, page 79).
In _International Folk Dancing U.S.A._, by Betty Casey (Doubleday,
Garden City, NY, 1981, page 337), both of the above interpretations
are offered.
So if you want to be unambiguous (and you don't happen to know that
your audience is a group of trained Round Dancers), don't just say
"skaters' position" without further explanation. The same may be said
for "promenade position" or "traditional promenade position."
--Jim Saxe <sa...@src.dec.com>
Keith 'Elmo' Eldridge
In article <NAU.94Ap...@frabjous.cs.umd.edu>, Dana Nau (n...@cs.umd.edu) writes:
>...
>Some of these come from a list posted to rec.folk-dancing three or
>four years ago, by James Williams (zo...@sava.st-andrews.ac.uk). The
>rest I either learned at contra dances, or created myself. I'm not
>completely sure that all the names are correct---let me know if you
>see any errors.
I would suggest an amendment to the list of swings, because two of the names /
descriptions have been transposed :
6. *Irish*: cup partner's right elbow with the right hand
(without putting the thumb on the inside of the elbow---that
hurts), and join left hands underneath.
7. *Nottingham swing*: join right hands with elbows bent, and cup your
partner's
right elbow with your left hand.
Also an couple of additions :
n :-) Under the Knee: lift right knee, put right arm under right knee and join
right hands, left hands hold partner's left elbow, and hop (together and in time
to the music.)
n+1 ;-) Under the Knee Backwards: as Under the Knee but left arm under left
knee.
Stewart Kramer
>pe...@renzland.org (Peter Renzland) writes:
>> ..., if you're in Skater's Position (Courtesy Turn Hold).
>>When in "hands in front" Promenade Hold, ....
This is the way I learned them:
All the "Skater's" positions have Lefts joined together in front.
"Full Skater's" has Rights joined above the lefts, so that the arms cross.
"Half Skater's" has Rights joined in back, on the woman's right hip.
"Skirt Skater's" is a variation on Half-Skater's, with the woman holding her
skirt with her right hand, and the man's right hand around her waist.
"Varsouvienne Skater's" differs from Varsouvienne in that the left hands are
held in front, rather than above the woman's shoulder.
---
Stewart Kramer
David Pritchard
In article
<Jonathan_van_Gie...@caswell-229.caswell.brown.edu>,:
:> face each other. take hands. bend L arm and straighten R arm.
:> you are now R shoulders together. now raise L hands over and
:behind your
:> own head. and now start turning ...
:>
:> Yes, centrifugal force will contort your spine and pull
:infrequently used
:> muscles. And, yes, this configuration takes up an awful lot of
:floor space,
:> and even more head space, and the danger of counter-rotating
:heads banging
:> together at high speed is great.
:>
:
:
:This definitely seems like the all time stupidist variations on a
:traditional swing.
This is in fact a VERY common Cajun Jitterbug move. It is called the
Boston Strangler and is typically used as part of a sequence to
change from the open hand hold to a crossed hand hold (... drop L hands,
slide R hands from shoulder to partner hand, join L hands). It is not
usually done to the normal pivot step of a swing, but to the more gentle
limping Cajun step. The centrifugal forces are no worse than anything
else, but (as with anything odd) not for situations other than BOTH
dancers
experienced and prepared. And, as mentioned above, be aware of space
implications in contra/etc situations.
This should not be taken to mean I would approve of this move in any
situation whatever outside its natural environment (whatever that is).
--
Dr David J. Pritchard
Electronics and Computer Science tel (+44 703) 592722
University of Southampton fax (+44 703) 593045
Southampton SO17 1BJ <= Note Change
David Pritchard
In article <NAU.94Ap...@frabjous.cs.umd.edu>, n...@cs.umd.edu
(Dana Nau) writes:
:In article
:<Jonathan_van_Gie...@caswell-229.caswell.brown.edu>
:Jonathan_...@brown.edu (Gavin "On" Jones) writes:
:7. Irish: join right hands with elbows bent, and cup your partner's
: right elbow with your left hand.
I have always regarded THIS as Manx. Maybe it is generic Celtic?
I dont think the following was in the list - unless I
misses/misinterpreted
something.
29. Irish Ceili hold: R arm around partner (as for Ballroom), L hands
joined under. Very common (often "compulsory"), but can be a bit awkward
with incompatible heights, or excessive girths.
David Pritchard
In article <lgolder-12...@smac13.mbl.edu>, lgo...@mbl.edu
(Linda Golder) writes:
:I dislike moves which make me blindly back up in a crowded hall. This
:includes "all do-si-do partner across the set"... too easy to trip over
:your neighbor, who is also backing up toward me. Falling over
:someone else
:is *not* elegant.
This may be why we on this side of the Atlantic get quite a lot of stress
at workshops/etc on awareness of lines and dancing as a set of people
rather
than as individuals. If the initial lines are OK, and the
back-to-back
returns to the original place, then you will not fall over anyone
else. QED.
Unfortunately, where this breaks down is in all those dances which start
a phrase with "Fall back a double" - quaranteed splat because we never
look behind ourselves.
Phil Katz
>
>> This may be why we on this side of the Atlantic get quite a lot of
stress
> at workshops/etc on awareness of lines and dancing as a set of people
> rather
> than as individuals. If the initial lines are OK, and the
> back-to-back
> returns to the original place, then you will not fall over anyone
> else. QED.
>
> Unfortunately, where this breaks down is in all those dances which start
> a phrase with "Fall back a double" - quaranteed splat because we never
> look behind ourselves.
>
> --
motivations behind English dance. I always thought the _purpose_ of 'all
those dances (done in facing lines) which start a phrase with "Fall back a
double" ' was the guaranteed splat! :-)
Linda Golder
Pritchard) wrote:
> In article <lgolder-12...@smac13.mbl.edu>, lgo...@mbl.edu
> (Linda Golder) writes:
> :I dislike moves which make me blindly back up in a crowded hall. This
> :includes "all do-si-do partner across the set"... too easy to trip over
> :your neighbor, who is also backing up toward me. Falling over
> :someone else is *not* elegant.
>
> This may be why we on this side of the Atlantic get quite a lot of stress
> at workshops/etc on awareness of lines and dancing as a set of people
> rather than as individuals. If the initial lines are OK, and the
> back-to-back returns to the original place, then you will not fall over anyone
> else. QED.
>
> Unfortunately, where this breaks down is in all those dances which start
> look behind ourselves.
I've been learning English Country Dance. Sure enough, awareness of space
is a necessary ingredient, as many "backing up" moves are included. Not to
say that contra wouldn't improve with more awareness of personal space.
I'm feeling a bit bruised & mangled from flailing, stomping & spinning
contra dancers at NEFF. And I was doing "defensive dance" to stay out of
their way!
Anyway, I've noticed that most English dances *start* with much more space
around each individual... & much more room between sets. Don't know if
this is simply an artifact of less populated dances, or whether it is an
accomodation to a more sweeping & space-using style.
David Pritchard
In article <lgolder-28...@smac4.mbl.edu>, lgo...@mbl.edu
(Linda Golder) writes:
:Anyway, I've noticed that most English dances *start* with much more
:space
:around each individual... & much more room between sets. Don't know
:if
:this is simply an artifact of less populated dances, or whether it is
:an
:accomodation to a more sweeping & space-using style.
:
We dance our contras in the more sweeping and space-using style too! We
dance the way we like it, and get told we are doing it "wrong". And vice
versa I suppose.
I find that English dances get crowded - try a Playford Ball with
several hundred people packed like sardines BEFORE they start dancing.
Whereas the rare Contra events have lots of space.
It's all relative.
Linda Golder
Pritchard) wrote:
> In article <lgolder-28...@smac4.mbl.edu>, lgo...@mbl.edu
> (Linda Golder) writes:
> :I've noticed that most English dances *start* with much more space
> :around each individual... & much more room between sets. Don't know if
> :this is simply an artifact of less populated dances, or whether it is
> :an accomodation to a more sweeping & space-using style.
> We dance our contras in the more sweeping and space-using style too! We
> dance the way we like it, and get told we are doing it "wrong". And vice
> versa I suppose.
>
> I find that English dances get crowded - try a Playford Ball with
> several hundred people packed like sardines BEFORE they start dancing.
> Whereas the rare Contra events have lots of space.
Space, the final frontier! I noticed at NEFFA, which brings together
people from many different geographical areas, that many of the dancers had
an open, space-using style of Contra. Unfortunately, this was highly
inappropriate in the crowded halls. Result - lots of bashing & bruising, &
close lines which intersected & dissolved into each other. I didn't hear
any of the callers address this issue with warnings or advice ("keep those
'wings' clipped", "avoid unnecessary twirling", "be aware of your space"),
but then, I ducked out of most contra events after the first dance or two.
Space & non-space dancing can be radically different. "Defensive dancing"
is useful in crowds!
Peter Renzland
>Space, the final frontier! I noticed at NEFFA, which brings together
>people from many different geographical areas, that many of the dancers had
>an open, space-using style of Contra. Unfortunately, this was highly
>inappropriate in the crowded halls. Result - lots of bashing & bruising, &
>close lines which intersected & dissolved into each other. I didn't hear
>any of the callers address this issue with warnings or advice ("keep those
>'wings' clipped", "avoid unnecessary twirling", "be aware of your space"),
>but then, I ducked out of most contra events after the first dance or two.
Hm. I recall during one contra I was in the wake of a tall exuberant
limb-flailing dancer. It was a pass-thru progression, and the single time when
I actually had a new neighbour to dance with in time with the music was at the
very bottom of the set. ;-)
>Space & non-space dancing can be radically different. "Defensive dancing"
>is useful in crowds!
Indeed. At last year's NEFFA I was impressed with how skilfully dancers
mastered the art of spacial parsimony. This year it seemed less crowded,
but somehow more aggressive. My conjecture -- perhaps a lot of the more
defensive/considerate dancers were daunted by the spectre of record high
crowds and stayed away, making more room for others who perhaps were less
aware or less interested in the intricacies of dancing in a finite space.
Saturday seemed to be particularly frenetic, with Fri night naturally more
relaxed, and Sunday's dancers seeming both more sociable and more skillful.
Probably just a subjective impression. :-)
>- Linda <lgo...@mbl.edu> Woods Hole, MA, USA
--