Call for an Impeachment Inquiry of Bush and Cheney
Chris Croughton
Get Congress to Take Action
Sign our online Petition and read below for more information:
http://www.votenader.org/get_involved/impeach.php
HEY DUDE WHERE'S MY BUDDY!!!???
COME BACK HOME MICHAEL!!!
Ok Michael, you've had your realpolitik fling with ex-General Wesley
Clark. Your endorsed Presidential candidate in the Democratic Primaries
has withdrawn. It is time for you to come home, to join your buddies and
resume your only genuine role which is that of defiance and resistance.
Compliance and assistance with the Democrats does not accord with your
past, your character, your bold writings and, most memorably, your long
corrosive assaults on the Party that betrayed the working classes and
plunged our country into corporate globalization. Remember, Michael,
you're the flinty man from Flint, Michigan. You've never forgotten your
roots. The heady Hollywood, Manhattan scene with the celebrities and
Academy Awards have never gotten to your head but rather have gotten
into your deserving pockets. How we all recall your standing before one
billion people in Los Angeles at the televised Academy Awards in 2003
and, breaking the customary cant of the awardees, throwing the gauntlet
down to George W. Bush and his "fictitious" war mongering.
Now the War has become a quagmire, with both Republicans and Democrats
complicit (check the votes in Congress). The Draft may be on the way. So
what are you doing going on the Al Franken Show very nearly breaking
down when Al Gore (he of the pro NAFTA/GATT, anti-worker, regime-change,
Iraq-bombing, lethal sanctions on half a million children
Administration) called and thought you were apologizing. You have
nothing to apologize for, Michael. Gore has a lot to apologize
for-blowing the election he won in Florida and the country as a whole
and for blowing, with Bill Clinton, the many opportunities the
rich-booming Nineties and the collapse of the Soviet Union gave this
country to turn a peace dividend into a pro-worker, pro-environment,
pro-consumer and anti-poverty resurgence.
Come back and join our Presidential campaign, Michael. Talk to those
"Reagan Democrats"-those 35% of union members who still vote Republican
and against their own interests-as only you can. Michael, if you go
pumping for the Democratic Party this year, just what are you going to
say to the unemployed steelworkers near Sparrows Point in Maryland? To
the megathousands of laid off textile and furniture workers in North and
South Carolina? To the abandoned auto workers waiting and waiting near
their empty factories that went to repressive countries? To the millions
of blue-collar workers, who fought our wars, only to learn that the two
parties won't fight for their company pensions and health insurance? Are
you going to tell them how the Democratic Party pushed through the WTO,
let their pensions erode or disappear, were too busy collecting checks
from the corporate bosses to pay attention to the corporate crime wave
that looted and drained trillions of dollars from millions of workers,
their retirement and small investments? Will you tell them that the
cowardly Democrats, who couldn't win the fewer elections they are now
not losing without the labor vote, won't even mount a determined drive
to repeal the notorious, union-blocking Taft Hartley Act?
How can you be free to be what you are, or to depress Bush's vote, to
jolt into consciousness the moribund Democratic Party?
Hey Dude, join your real buddies! The ones you may be thinking about
just don't fit either your message, your vision, or our website
VoteNader.org.
Come back home Michael. The workers and the youth of America are looking
for you.
Best regards,
Ralph Nader
P.S. Will you put this invitation on your website and see how your fans
react to Michael Moore returning to the Nader 2004 presidential
campaign? Patti Smith will reserve a big singing spot, for you, on the
stage for the customary finale, PEOPLE HAVE THE POWER.
Wednesday April 14, 2004
Join the Call for an Impeachment Inquiry of Bush and Cheney
Help us Get Congress to Take Action
You can help the call for an impeachment inquiry of President Bush and
Vice President Dick Cheney. Sign our online Petition.
http://www.votenader.org/get_involved/impeach.php
George W. Bush and Dick Cheney should be impeached for two reasons:
They led the United States into an illegal, unconstitutional war in Iraq.
They misled the Congress and the American people with five falsehoods that led to war.
All it takes is one Member of the House of Representatives to call for
an Impeachment Inquiry to start the process to investigate the two
grounds. If the House then votes by a simple majority for Articles of
Impeachment, the Senate would then undertake a trial of the President
and Vice President. They would only be convicted, and impeached, if
two-thirds of the Senate agrees.
--
destruction of property worth
millions of rupees. In 1996, the year the insurgency commenced, 82 people
were killed. This figure included insurgents, security forces, personnel and
civilians. During the next year, total killings came down by half - 38
people died. The following year, in 1998, after the Maoists intensified
their program of violence, 408 people were killed - nearly an elevenfold
increase in the number of deaths over the previous year. Ever since, the
death toll has been on the rise. By late 2000 the death toll has risen to
over 2,100. As of August 2002, nearly 5,000 lives have been lost to the
insurgency "
Shining Path sent congratulations to RIM for its first anniversary in May of
1985. The Central Committee wrote, "...the people's war in our country
continues to blaze defiantly, expanding, spreading its roots and preparing
for newer and higher tasks, guided always by Marxism-Leninism-Maoism,
battling for the emancipation of our people for the purpose of and at the
service of the world revolution. Thus we are contributing and will
contribute to the tasks of the RIM, more and more willing and able to aid in
every possible way our glorious common cause: the emancipation of the
proletariat and communism prevailing though out the earth.
"Comrades, the Communist Party of Peru is part of the Revolutionary
Internationalist Movement and feels honored to be so, honored to serve in
such a far-reaching and historic vanguard battle, as well as to have the
comrades in arms found in our Movement's ranks; and furthermore, the Party
feels fortified and augmented by the repeated expressions of support, of
proletarian internationalism, which it receives from the very outstanding
fraternal communist parties and organizations, and very especially from the
Committee of the Revolutionary Internationalist Movement to which we extend
our revolutionary gratitude for its constant encouragement and support. All
this, comrades, increases our proletarian i
Dirtnap
Bob Cowell
go crawl back under your rock dipshit !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Phil
realized you couldn't be intellegent enough to spell OT if you were supporting that
ideology..
John N. Kessler
But I'll vote for him just to keep you nut cases out of the Whitehouse.
opinions will vary, JK
jeboba
going to accomplish by running is get Bush elected again....dumb shit!
"Chris Croughton" <ch...@keristor.org> wrote in message
news:7ffddb6a...@host-69-48-73-244.roc.choiceone.net...
C.O.Jones
"Chris Croughton" <ch...@keristor.org> wrote in message
news:7ffddb6a...@host-69-48-73-244.roc.choiceone.net...
> Get Congress to Take Action
You mean like they did with that lying, womanizing, adulterous draft dodger?
Frank Forsten
> COME BACK HOME MICHAEL!!!
Wer sich wundert, was hier kreuzweise versendet wurde, mag kann dort
http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/0,1518,295800,00.html nachschauen.
Grüße, Frank
jeboba
about WMD, etc. and people are dieing in the thousands. Read Woodward's new
book written from interviews with Bush and then tell me you still support
the lieing SOB!
"C.O.Jones" <ifyou...@yougotit.com> wrote in message
news:jC8gc.2400$2e6.729@lakeread01...
Phil
those lies, Clinton lobbed a couple of cruise missles because of OBL and IRAQ,
Clinton thougth there were WMD's in Iraq. Gees even the Iraq solders with
their chemical suits did.
jeboba
Woodward's book lies, then you are calling Bush a liar. I'm afraid your boy
has been caught this time! Bush is going down! Wait til the news media
FINALLY picks up on the administrations ties to the "Project for New
American Century" which was founded by Cheney, Rumsfeld, Pearl, Rove, Jeb
Bush, and others. It started advocated the invasion of Iraq in 1997! You
think those guys didn't get into office with plans for Iraq LONG before the
election? THEY picked Bush as the president because they knew he was too
dumb to object to anything they told him to do!
"Phil" <pminm...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:4081493F...@msn.com...
jeboba
Iraq because they thought they could believe the President regarding WMD's,
etc. Bush was briefed repeatedly before the invasion that there were no
WMD's, no connection to plutonium from Africa, no connection to al qaida and
more. All turned out to be lies from Bush and then he throws it in the Dem's
faces that they voted in favor of the war. Talk about disingenuous and spin!
Bush couldn't even handle simple questions in his press conference the other
day. He stumbled and stammered all over the place. This guy's a loser. If
you want a Republican in office, then fine. But find one with some honesty
and honor like McCain! The one's that are really being taken advantage of by
Bush are the soldiers. They are following orders and doing their best and I
have the greatest admiration and support for them. Unfortunately, they are
being made to fight an illegitimate war so Cheney and his boys can profit
from it.
"Phil" <pminm...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:4081493F...@msn.com...
Paul McIntosh
like Saddam claims, or given to the Jordanians (just as likely).
--
Paul McIntosh
http://www.rc-bearings.com
"Phil" <pminm...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:4081493F...@msn.com...
Klaus D. Mikkelsen
>
> Lets see CBS, Woodwards book, Clarks Book, all owned by Viacom, HMMM. Oh yea
> those lies, Clinton lobbed a couple of cruise missles because of OBL and IRAQ,
> Clinton thougth there were WMD's in Iraq. Gees even the Iraq solders with
> their chemical suits did.
Get the fuck out of de.rec.modelle.bahn !!!!
ratdog
news:40815FFF...@du.kan.finde.den:
so, anybody building any ships?
Sisyphus
Bush. Ask the Sudanese how many died after clinton bombed their
medical facility that produced all of their medicine- not to mention
the poor bastards who were there at the time. Ask the people of
Kosovo how many Clinton had killed. Clinton also murdered a host of
American citizens....
Supporting Bush and Co. is JUST AS BAD as supporting Kerry and Co.
You have fallen for the hegelian dialectec (google) and will remain a
fool as long as you play their game.
"jeboba" <jeb...@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<Upagc.5320$L31....@nwrddc01.gnilink.net>...
C.O.Jones
> about WMD, etc. and people are dieing in the thousands. Read Woodward's
new
> book written from interviews with Bush and then tell me you still support
> the lieing SOB!
Here's a fact for you. Saddam has used WMD on his own people and the
Iranians. Proof of that is out there to include the mass graves.
Fact: Saddam believed he had WMD as did his military to include the brass.
Fact: Saddam had programs intended to developed and produce WMD.
Fact: Our Army worked in an area for three months before they discovered
three FULL SIZE fighter aircraft hidden under the sand. Two Mig-25's and an
SU-25. Now how long do you think it might take to find the much smaller
deposits of WMD in an area the size of California? Assuming they're not
someplace else like Syria.
As the old joke goes, Patience Ass! Patience!
C.O.Jones
> Woodward's book was written from INTERVIEWS WITH BUSH HIMSELF! If you call
> Woodward's book lies, then you are calling Bush a liar. I'm afraid your
boy
> has been caught this time! Bush is going down! Wait til the news media
> FINALLY picks up on the administrations ties to the "Project for New
> American Century" which was founded by Cheney, Rumsfeld, Pearl, Rove, Jeb
> Bush, and others. It started advocated the invasion of Iraq in 1997! You
> think those guys didn't get into office with plans for Iraq LONG before
the
> election?
You think the military doesn't already have invasion plans for every nation
on the planet? Are you really that stupid?
C.O.Jones
"Sisyphus" <sisyph...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:29d496cb.04041...@posting.google.com...
> Oh bullpucky! Pay attention.... Clinton bombed more countries than
> Bush. Ask the Sudanese how many died after clinton bombed their
> medical facility that produced all of their medicine- not to mention
> the poor bastards who were there at the time. Ask the people of
> Kosovo how many Clinton had killed. Clinton also murdered a host of
> American citizens....
Clinton deployed more American Military to more places, more often than any
other President to include Bush!
>
> Supporting Bush and Co. is JUST AS BAD as supporting Kerry and Co.
> You have fallen for the hegelian dialectec (google) and will remain a
> fool as long as you play their game.
Yeah! Better to support someone who hasn't a snowballs chance in hell of
ever being elected. Of course then you can keep on whining. Think I'll go
to the barn. The air is better there.
Frank Forsten
> Now how long do you think it might take to find the much smaller
> deposits of WMD in an area the size of California?
If you're too stupid to stop posting to de.rec.models.railroad, you're
probably too dumb to find WMDs even if they would be strapped to your
ass :-(
Paul McIntosh
--
Paul McIntosh
http://www.rc-bearings.com
"C.O.Jones" <ifyou...@yougotit.com> wrote in message
news:93ugc.2824$2e6.1950@lakeread01...
The Natural Philosopher
Well given their ability to actually find the odd al q'aeda terrorist in
california, not high.
However WMD do in fact have to be pit there by someone and are rather
more obvious than the odd person walking around San Jose...
Saddam didn't have WMD. It left him defenceless. So he pretended he had.
End of matter.
The evisdnece avialable at the time of going to war was patently obvious
to me that very few, if any, potentually useable WMD's existed, or the
means to deliver them.
However I am not a mentally defective politician with an axe to grind,
and I did listen to the available evidence.
The Natural Philosopher
Are you? At best one might have a strategic overview of how one MIGHT
invade any country, useful in determining forward planning as far as
ordering new types of weaponry goes.
But even there teh US military has a huige problem. Plenty of remote
controlled bomnbs, and totally inadequate troops to invade and HOLD the
country they now occupy.
I can now see that you are in fact living a complete fantasy, and have
never been close to anyone involved in policy planning in either the
civil or military spheres.
>
>
The Natural Philosopher
I note you have cross posted this to a german model ship group. As have
I. But I knew I did it.
The further evidnce of your inability to understand almost anything is
now overwhelming.
Eckhart Wörner
Frank Forsten schrieb:
> Wer sich wundert, was hier kreuzweise versendet wurde, mag kann dort
> http://www.spiegel.de/politik/ausland/0,1518,295800,00.html nachschauen.
hm, und da wundert man sich noch, wenn die Amerikaner den Ruf haben,
überheblich zu sein und so zu tun, als ob ihnen die ganze Welt gehört.
Gruß, Eckhart
Frank Forsten
> I note you have cross posted this to a german model ship group. As have
> I. But I knew I did it.
I'm posting FROM de.rec.modelle.bahn, which is a german model railroad
group as I'm feed up with the crap you and your co-writers continue to send.
> The further evidnce of your inability to understand almost anything is
> now overwhelming.
Nice words, but more posts from you to de.rec.modelle.bahn (3 yet) show
that you're too stupid to piss a hole in the snow.
C.O.Jones
"The Natural Philosopher" <a@b.c> wrote in message
news:40827E47.8040703@b.c...
>
> Are you? At best one might have a strategic overview of how one MIGHT
> invade any country, useful in determining forward planning as far as
> ordering new types of weaponry goes.
>
> But even there teh US military has a huige problem. Plenty of remote
> controlled bomnbs, and totally inadequate troops to invade and HOLD the
> country they now occupy.
>
> I can now see that you are in fact living a complete fantasy, and have
> never been close to anyone involved in policy planning in either the
> civil or military spheres.
And I see you have a gross under-estimation of what this country can and is
ready to do. But then, I expect such from your inebriated views.
C.O.Jones
but................
"Frank Forsten" <fr...@forsten-online.de> wrote in message
news:c5u3cg$eg8$01$1...@news.t-online.com...
Paul McIntosh
--
Paul McIntosh
http://www.rc-bearings.com
"Frank Forsten" <fr...@forsten-online.de> wrote in message
news:c5u3cg$eg8$01$1...@news.t-online.com...
Phil
"Jordan's King Abdullah revealed on Saturday that vehicles reportedly
containing chemical weapons and poison gas that were part of a deadly al-Qaida
bomb plot came from Syria, the country named by U.S. weapons inspector David
Kay last year as a likely repository for Iraq's weapons of mass destruction."
Sisyphus
seem clearer there.
How is this.... 'I am an american, so I dont vote my conscience by
choosing the candidate who's beliefs are close mine.... I will vote
for some bag-of-pooh who represents the lesser of the evils that have
a strong chance of winning an election, because it is not about
citizens choosing their officials and form of government... It is all
about supporting my favorite jersey color and cheering like an idiot
for the guy who wears it so that I can feel like my vote counts for
something.
Americans should not be weak of principle and servile to their
appointed rulers. Americans have a responsibility to envision a
better America, and make some effort to achieve it.
I have news for you.... Your vote is only 1/280000000 th of america's
opinion, so don't think that you are going to swing an election.
The Natural Philosopher
Im smart enough not to try when the temperature outside is 15C. :-)
MJC
your magic twanger, Froggy.
MJC
Sport_Pilot
court. Not just about Monica but also Paula Jones. You can't impeach
a President for lying to the public, which Clinton also did, bigtime.
Chris Croughton <ch...@keristor.org> wrote in message news:<7ffddb6a...@host-69-48-73-244.roc.choiceone.net>...
> Call for an Impeachment Inquiry of Bush and Cheney,
> Get Congress to Take Action
>
> Sign our online Petition and read below for more information:
>
> http://www.votenader.org/get_involved/impeach.php
>
> HEY DUDE WHERE'S MY BUDDY!!!???
> COME BACK HOME MICHAEL!!!
>
> Ok Michael, you've had your realpolitik fling with ex-General Wesley
> Clark. Your endorsed Presidential candidate in the Democratic Primaries
> has withdrawn. It is time for you to come home, to join your buddies and
> resume your only genuine role which is that of defiance and resistance.
> Compliance and assistance with the Democrats does not accord with your
> past, your character, your bold writings and, most memorably, your long
> corrosive assaults on the Party that betrayed the working classes and
> plunged our country into corporate globalization. Remember, Michael,
> you're the flinty man from Flint, Michigan. You've never forgotten your
> roots. The heady Hollywood, Manhattan scene with the celebrities and
> Academy Awards have never gotten to your head but rather have gotten
> into your deserving pockets. How we all recall your standing before one
> billion people in Los Angeles at the televised Academy Awards in 2003
> and, breaking the customary cant of the awardees, throwing the gauntlet
> down to George W. Bush and his "fictitious" war mongering.
>
> Now the War has become a quagmire, with both Republicans and Democrats
> complicit (check the votes in Congress). The Draft may be on the way. So
> what are you doing going on the Al Franken Show very nearly breaking
> down when Al Gore (he of the pro NAFTA/GATT, anti-worker, regime-change,
> Iraq-bombing, lethal sanctions on half a million children
> Administration) called and thought you were apologizing. You have
> nothing to apologize for, Michael. Gore has a lot to apologize
> for-blowing the election he won in Florida and the country as a whole
> and for blowing, with Bill Clinton, the many opportunities the
> rich-booming Nineties and the collapse of the Soviet Union gave this
> country to turn a peace dividend into a pro-worker, pro-environment,
> pro-consumer and anti-poverty resurgence.
>
> Come back and join our Presidential campaign, Michael. Talk to those
> "Reagan Democrats"-those 35% of union members who still vote Republican
> and against their own interests-as only you can. Michael, if you go
> pumping for the Democratic Party this year, just what are you going to
> say to the unemployed steelworkers near Sparrows Point in Maryland? To
> the megathousands of laid off textile and furniture workers in North and
> South Carolina? To the abandoned auto workers waiting and waiting near
> their empty factories that went to repressive countries? To the millions
> of blue-collar workers, who fought our wars, only to learn that the two
> parties won't fight for their company pensions and health insurance? Are
> you going to tell them how the Democratic Party pushed through the WTO,
> let their pensions erode or disappear, were too busy collecting checks
> from the corporate bosses to pay attention to the corporate crime wave
> that looted and drained trillions of dollars from millions of workers,
> their retirement and small investments? Will you tell them that the
> cowardly Democrats, who couldn't win the fewer elections they are now
> not losing without the labor vote, won't even mount a determined drive
> to repeal the notorious, union-blocking Taft Hartley Act?
>
> How can you be free to be what you are, or to depress Bush's vote, to
> jolt into consciousness the moribund Democratic Party?
>
> Hey Dude, join your real buddies! The ones you may be thinking about
> just don't fit either your message, your vision, or our website
> VoteNader.org.
>
> Come back home Michael. The workers and the youth of America are looking
> for you.
>
> Best regards,
> Ralph Nader
>
>
> P.S. Will you put this invitation on your website and see how your fans
> react to Michael Moore returning to the Nader 2004 presidential
> campaign? Patti Smith will reserve a big singing spot, for you, on the
> stage for the customary finale, PEOPLE HAVE THE POWER.
>
>
> Wednesday April 14, 2004
>
> Join the Call for an Impeachment Inquiry of Bush and Cheney
> Help us Get Congress to Take Action
>
> You can help the call for an impeachment inquiry of President Bush and
> Vice President Dick Cheney. Sign our online Petition.
>
> http://www.votenader.org/get_involved/impeach.php
>
>
> George W. Bush and Dick Cheney should be impeached for two reasons:
>
> They led the United States into an illegal, unconstitutional war in Iraq.
> They misled the Congress and the American people with five falsehoods that led to war.
>
> All it takes is one Member of the House of Representatives to call for
> an Impeachment Inquiry to start the process to investigate the two
> grounds. If the House then votes by a simple majority for Articles of
> Impeachment, the Senate would then undertake a trial of the President
> and Vice President. They would only be convicted, and impeached, if
> two-thirds of the Senate agrees.
>
> --
> destruction of property worth
> millions of rupees. In 1996, the year the insurgency commenced, 82 people
> were killed. This figure included insurgents, security forces, personnel and
> civilians. During the next year, total killings came down by half - 38
> people died. The following year, in 1998, after the Maoists intensified
> their program of violence, 408 people were killed - nearly an elevenfold
> increase in the number of deaths over the previous year. Ever since, the
> death toll has been on the rise. By late 2000 the death toll has risen to
> over 2,100. As of August 2002, nearly 5,000 lives have been lost to the
> insurgency "
>
> Shining Path sent congratulations to RIM for its first anniversary in May of
> 1985. The Central Committee wrote, "...the people's war in our country
> continues to blaze defiantly, expanding, spreading its roots and preparing
> for newer and higher tasks, guided always by Marxism-Leninism-Maoism,
> battling for the emancipation of our people for the purpose of and at the
> service of the world revolution. Thus we are contributing and will
> contribute to the tasks of the RIM, more and more willing and able to aid in
> every possible way our glorious common cause: the emancipation of the
> proletariat and communism prevailing though out the earth.
>
> "Comrades, the Communist Party of Peru is part of the Revolutionary
> Internationalist Movement and feels honored to be so, honored to serve in
> such a far-reaching and historic vanguard battle, as well as to have the
> comrades in arms found in our Movement's ranks; and furthermore, the Party
> feels fortified and augmented by the repeated expressions of support, of
> proletarian internationalism, which it receives from the very outstanding
> fraternal communist parties and organizations, and very especially from the
> Committee of the Revolutionary Internationalist Movement to which we extend
> our revolutionary gratitude for its constant encouragement and support. All
> this, comrades, increases our proletarian i
Sport_Pilot
source for everything he made up?
"jeboba" <jeb...@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<Upagc.5320$L31....@nwrddc01.gnilink.net>...
> Yeah, but a blowjob didn't kill anybody! Bush has lied and lied and lied
> about WMD, etc. and people are dieing in the thousands. Read Woodward's new
> book written from interviews with Bush and then tell me you still support
> the lieing SOB!
>
> "C.O.Jones" <ifyou...@yougotit.com> wrote in message
> news:jC8gc.2400$2e6.729@lakeread01...
> >
> > "Chris Croughton" <ch...@keristor.org> wrote in message
> > news:7ffddb6a...@host-69-48-73-244.roc.choiceone.net...
> > > Call for an Impeachment Inquiry of Bush and Cheney,
> > > Get Congress to Take Action
> >
Sport_Pilot
"C.O.Jones" <ifyou...@yougotit.com> wrote in message news:<Q%tgc.2823$2e6.1844@lakeread01>...
Sport_Pilot
>about supporting my favorite jersey color and cheering like an idiot
>for the guy who wears it so that I can feel like my vote counts for
>something.
I especialy enjoy painting a big Blue B on my belly and chant for Bush
while dancing like a queer.
ME
Your a brainless idiot! Please do not reproduce.
" <jeb...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:G6cgc.11568$G_....@nwrddc02.gnilink.net...
> Woodward's book was written from INTERVIEWS WITH BUSH HIMSELF! If you call
> Woodward's book lies, then you are calling Bush a liar. I'm afraid your
boy
> has been caught this time! Bush is going down! Wait til the news media
> FINALLY picks up on the administrations ties to the "Project for New
> American Century" which was founded by Cheney, Rumsfeld, Pearl, Rove, Jeb
> Bush, and others. It started advocated the invasion of Iraq in 1997! You
> think those guys didn't get into office with plans for Iraq LONG before
the
> election? THEY picked Bush as the president because they knew he was too
> dumb to object to anything they told him to do!
ME
They voted to go to war by reading the same Intel reports that bush did
that said he had WMD. Hell, even Kerry said so in one of his interviews.
Were do you get this crap that the Intel brief's said there were no WMD's
before the war? ""No connection to al quida"", more miss informed crap
coming out of your pie hole.Saddam was paying a reward to the family's of
the bomber's is CLEARLY a connection as well as more of a reason to do
something to remove him. Listen dumb ass! Unless your claiming a verifiable
source within the Whitehouse, and that would have to be very close to the
President to know what's in those briefing's shut up your false and baseless
claims are showing you to be a fool and nothing more than a puppet for the
Democratic bid for President.
Your a uninformed idiot and
PLONKED!
"jeboba" <jeb...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:dccgc.11628$G_.1...@nwrddc02.gnilink.net...
> And congress, including Kerry and lots of other Dems voted for the war in
> Iraq because they thought they could believe the President regarding
WMD's,
> etc. Bush was briefed repeatedly before the invasion that there were no
> WMD's, no connection to plutonium from Africa, no connection to al qaida
and
> more. All turned out to be lies from Bush and then he throws it in the
Dem's
> faces that they voted in favor of the war. Talk about disingenuous and
spin!
> Bush couldn't even handle simple questions in his press conference the
other
> day. He stumbled and stammered all over the place. This guy's a loser. If
> you want a Republican in office, then fine. But find one with some honesty
> and honor like McCain! The one's that are really being taken advantage of
by
> Bush are the soldiers. They are following orders and doing their best and
I
> have the greatest admiration and support for them. Unfortunately, they are
> being made to fight an illegitimate war so Cheney and his boys can profit
> from it.
>
> "Phil" <pminm...@msn.com> wrote in message
> news:4081493F...@msn.com...
> > Lets see CBS, Woodwards book, Clarks Book, all owned by Viacom, HMMM.
Oh
> yea
> > those lies, Clinton lobbed a couple of cruise missles because of OBL and
> IRAQ,
> > Clinton thougth there were WMD's in Iraq. Gees even the Iraq solders
with
> > their chemical suits did.
> >
> > jeboba wrote:
> >
> > > Yeah, but a blowjob didn't kill anybody! Bush has lied and lied and
lied
> > > about WMD, etc. and people are dieing in the thousands. Read
Woodward's
> new
> > > book written from interviews with Bush and then tell me you still
> support
> > > the lieing SOB!
> > >
> > > "C.O.Jones" <ifyou...@yougotit.com> wrote in message
ME
news:<Upagc.5320$L31....@nwrddc01.gnilink.net>...
> > Yeah, but a blowjob didn't kill anybody!
This has to be the stupidest line of 2004!
So, any crime where there's no death isn't that bad? If your claim is true
then ones like rape, child abuse?
Besides Clinton lied over and over!
ME
"Sport_Pilot" <hppil...@cs.com> wrote in message
news:3b550ea2.04041...@posting.google.com...
> As I recall Clinton was impeached for perjury,
impeached we wouldnt have had him full term, he would have lost his license
to practice law ect.
that's lying to the
> court. Not just about Monica but also Paula Jones. You can't impeach
> a President for lying to the public, which Clinton also did, bigtime.
Yes you can, google for Star's final report and read it.
Jack Goff
"ME" <dontbo...@nospam.com> wrote:
>
> "Sport_Pilot" <hppil...@cs.com> wrote in message
> news:3b550ea2.04041...@posting.google.com...
> > As I recall Clinton was impeached for perjury,
> Nope, the vote split down party lines and he got away with it. Had he been
> impeached we wouldnt have had him full term, he would have lost his
license
> to practice law ect.
Clinton WAS impeached. Look up the meaning.
Jack
Dave Thompson
"Jack Goff" <cg...@sc.com> wrote in message
news:zS_gc.36622$04.8...@twister.southeast.rr.com...
In addition, he was disbarred in Arkansas and from the US Supreme Court.
--
Dave Thompson
jeboba
the tapes and will produce them if necessary. Bush and the white house are
not denying anything. Tonight on Larry King, he and Woodward talked to the
Saudi Ambassador, Prince Bandar. He said everything Woodward wrote was true.
Sorry, the Bush gang really pooped in their mess kit this time. You can try
to argue your way out of it but by doing so, you will be calling your hero
draft dodging mamma's boy a liar too! What a dilemma for you!
"ME" <dontbo...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:1088mjd...@corp.supernews.com...
jeboba
"ME" <dontbo...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:1088mjd...@corp.supernews.com...
Klaus D. Mikkelsen
>
> My, you repugnacunts are getting scared aren't you!? About time!
Helloooooo, where are you brains ?
Would you keep your fucking discussion i relevant groups ??
Frank Forsten
> hm, und da wundert man sich noch, wenn die Amerikaner den Ruf haben,
> überheblich zu sein und so zu tun, als ob ihnen die ganze Welt gehört.
Wenn man so mitliest, wie es in rec.models.rc.air abgeht, dann erinnert
es mich stark an so manche OT-Diskussion in de.rec.modelle.bahn - das
scheint also keine nationale Besonderheit zu sein.
Auffällig hingegen das massive Aufkommen von TOFU, vermutlich verursacht
durch die unreflektierte Verwendung St. Bills Software :-)
Grüße, Frank
Erik Meltzer
Frank Forsten wrote:
> Auffällig hingegen das massive Aufkommen von TOFU, vermutlich verursacht
> durch die unreflektierte Verwendung St. Bills Software :-)
Das hat mit der Software nix zu tun, das ist einfach Dummheit,
Ignoranz oder bestenfalls Ahnungslosigkeit. Auch zum richtigen
Quoten ist es sinnvoll, wenn der Cursor am Anfang oben steht.
Und das tut er auch bei allen mir bekannten Mailprogrammen und
Newsreadern (was zugegebenermaßen nicht allzuviele sind).
Liebe Grüße,
Erik.
--
Aus Platin die Lok
Doch wozu solch ein Motor?
Fahren wird sie nie
-- Haikus für den Marktführer, Teil 5
Frank Forsten
> ... Dummheit, Ignoranz oder bestenfalls Ahnungslosigkeit ...
Genau das verstehe ich unter unreflektiert - ohne Sinn und Verstand :-)
Grüße, Frank
C.O.Jones
> source for everything he made up?
Ah! Yep! That's the current, credible source for the Dems! Maybe they'll
call this one BJ! Oh yeah! That one has been used already by the Clintons!
Erik Meltzer
Ja. Aber mit Outlook Excess hat das trotzdem nix zu tun.
Klar, die winzigweiche Virenschleuder hat mehr Fehler als
ein 1945er Käfer (von dem selbst Nordhoff sagte, er habe
mehr davon als ein Hund Flöhe [1]), und einige davon sind
auch für Benutzer anderer Newsreader nervig bis zum Erbrechen
-- aber Vollquottel können sich nicht auf OjE als Ursache
berufen.
Liebe Grüße,
Erik.
[1] Am Rande: ein paar Jahre später meinte er in einem
Interview auf die Frage, warum man immer noch Käfer baue,
man erschieße schließlich keine Hund, nur weil er Flöhe
habe ;-)
--
"Wie war das noch, wenn man Zucker auf die Anlage streut, hat man bald
maßstäbliche Modelle von durch Genmanipulation auf das 87-fache
gewachsenen Ameisen?"
-- Sven Herzfeld in d.r.m.b.
Johnboy
nobody here needs your fighting!!! Beat it !!!
"C.O.Jones" <ifyou...@yougotit.com> wrote in message
news:lo6hc.8793$2e6.1823@lakeread01...
Harald Brosch
You are totally OT here
This theme isn´t welcome in a german MRR group.
with unfriendly greetings
harald
Sport_Pilot
post what we do where we do. And no doubt some will say if you don't
want to read it dont click on the subject. etc. etc. Good for a few
day's of jollys.
"Johnboy" <jon...@knology.net> wrote in message news:<108fmo5...@corp.supernews.com>...
Harald Brosch
Shut up boys
With this theme you are totally OT in a german MRR group like de.rec.modelle.bahn.
Please don´t post there anymore
This postings are not welcome -totally OT
Greetings from germany :-)
Harald
Frank Forsten
> Ohhhh! Good one. Now we can spend a few days posting about why we
> post what we do where we do.
Das ist mir eigentlich ziemlich wurscht. Aber offensichtlich seid Ihr zu
dämlich, das Crossposting in den deutschsprachigen Raum einzustellen.
Aber das ist wohl Teil Eurer Kultur, die Welt ohne Rücksicht auf
Verluste mit Euren Ansichten zu beglücken.
Frank
Get off de.rec.modelle.bahn asap
C.O.Jones
All this cross posting was started by a clueless drunk from the UK. I have
made an effort to keep it to just the one group. Again, my apologies for
all the cross posting. But I do suspect you have seen only a portion of it.
Chuck
"Harald Brosch" <har...@williwinsen.de> wrote in message
news:ae95cd18.04042...@posting.google.com...
Roger Schwentker
> Das ist mir eigentlich ziemlich wurscht. Aber offensichtlich seid Ihr zu
> dämlich, das Crossposting in den deutschsprachigen Raum einzustellen.
Mich hat mal ein Ami als "Nazi" angepöbelt, weil er meinte, "de"
stände für "Detroit" und dort würde verdammt nochmal englisch
geschrieben.
> Aber das ist wohl Teil Eurer Kultur, die Welt ohne Rücksicht auf
> Verluste mit Euren Ansichten zu beglücken.
Kultur und Amerika? Wie kann das zusammen in einem Satz stehen?
Gruß
Roger
Matt Lang
> In de.rec.modelle.bahn Frank Forsten <fr...@forsten-online.de> wrote:
> > Das ist mir eigentlich ziemlich wurscht. Aber offensichtlich seid Ihr zu
>
>
> Mich hat mal ein Ami als "Nazi" angep belt, weil er meinte, "de"
> st nde f r "Detroit" und dort w rde verdammt nochmal englisch
> geschrieben.
Koestlich! Habe selten so gelacht :)
Man muss bedenken dass es fuer serh viele amerikaner nicht immer
bekannt ist dass es ausserhalb amerikas nennenswerte zivilisation
gibt. Also kann das .de ja nur fuer detroit stehen ;)
Matt
The Natural Philosopher
:-)
>
> Gruß
> Roger
>
Dave Thompson
news:408942AE.8000402@b.c...
Culture and American in the same sentence?
Sort of like Germany and Hitler stand together in the same sentence.
Sort of like Germany and the gassing and incineration of millions can stand
together in the same sentence.
Sort of like Germany and Germany and Neo-Nazis can stand together in the
same sentence.
--
Dave Thompson
Frank Forsten
> Mich hat mal ein Ami als "Nazi" angepöbelt...
Was anderes fällt denen auch heute nicht ein, siehe weiter unten ...
Grüße, Frank
Dave Thompson
"Frank Forsten" <fr...@forsten-online.de> wrote in message
news:c6bjag$8pl$00$1...@news.t-online.com...
> Dave Thompson schrieb:
>
> > Sort of like Germany and Hitler stand together in the same sentence.
> > Sort of like Germany and the gassing and incineration of millions can
stand
> > together in the same sentence.
> > Sort of like Germany and Germany and Neo-Nazis can stand together in the
> > same sentence.
>
> minds. Bush matches that exactly.
>
> How unfair that Iraq is more complex.
>
> Frank
>
> BTW: I care as much for your Nazi talk as you fell guilty for the mass
> murder of red indians by your anchestors ...
Glad to hear there is no national guilt in Germany.
You are absolutely correct that Iraq is much more complex. The world fully
understands Germany's and France's angst at having Saddam removed. The
massive contracts and loans from both in violation of UN sanctions were
suddenly null and void.
Complex? The rest of Europe is slowly waking up to the sham that the EU has
become. It appears that Germany and France want to dominate the Pax Europa.
The smaller members are beginning to ask why they should subjugate
themselves to those two, especially since Schroder keeps busting EU deficit
limits.
We now return you to your normal programming of rec.models.rc.air.
--
Dave Thompson
Frank Forsten
> You are absolutely correct that Iraq is much more complex. The world fully
> understands Germany's and France's angst at having Saddam removed. The
> massive contracts and loans from both in violation of UN sanctions were
> suddenly null and void.
Hmm, hasn't your "mission not accomplished" Mr. Rumsfeld been
hand-shaking with Saddam when Iraq was fighting Iran? And didn't he
allow US companies to deliver bacteria to Iraq? And who gave all the
Stinger missiles to the Taliban? Oh, memory may be so selective.
If Angst would control German politics, how to you explain that German
soldiers are securing Kabul? Having holidays in sunny countries?
That's your way: Go there like Terminator III, bomb all down but having
no idea what to do afterwards. And when you have made your mess, you
call for UNO like a baby needing pampered ...
> Complex? The rest of Europe is slowly waking up to the sham that the EU has
> become. It appears that Germany and France want to dominate the Pax Europa.
> The smaller members are beginning to ask why they should subjugate
> themselves to those two, especially since Schroder keeps busting EU deficit
> limits.
The new members including hero country Poland pay about 6 bil. Euro
anually to EU but will receive 23 bil. Euro. From 1995 till 2002 ex-hero
country Spain got 25 bil. Euro more from EU than they paid.
Guess where the money comes from? Germany pays half of the money EU is
giving to others. From 1957 till 2002 Germany paid 250 bil. Euro more
than received.
We should have kept the money instead - no problem to avoid any deficit
then.
But even with busting the EU deficit limits - compared with Bush's world
record spending our deficit is little money.
Frank
Lars P. Wolschner
> "The Natural Philosopher" <a@b.c> wrote in message
> news:408942AE.8000402@b.c...
>>>> Aber das ist wohl Teil Eurer Kultur, die Welt ohne Rücksicht
>>>> auf Verluste mit Euren Ansichten zu beglücken.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Kultur und Amerika? Wie kann das zusammen in einem Satz
>>> stehen?
>>
>> :-)
>
> Culture and American in the same sentence?
>
> Sort of like Germany and Hitler stand together in the same
> sentence. Sort of like Germany and the gassing and incineration
> of millions can stand together in the same sentence.
They do usually when americans talk about germany. And you're
developing, starting with Guantanamo Bay.
But when do americans talk about Vietnam, faschist dictators all
over the world supported by the USA, the predecessor of Khomeini
supported by the USA and last but not least Saddam supported by the
USA?
> Sort of like Germany and Germany and Neo-Nazis can stand
> together in the same sentence.
Well, but in germany they rather not become members of government.
SCNR
--
Lars P. Wolschner lars.wo...@nexgo.de
Bernardstraße 11b lars.wo...@nikocity.de
D-63067 Offenbach am Main
Fon & Fax: +49 69 80068670 Mobil: +49 163 8122462 (eplus)
The Natural Philosopher
Hmm. now we see why the original comment is ironically so true...
> --
> Dave Thompson
>
>
>
The Natural Philosopher
> Dave Thompson schrieb:
>
>> You are absolutely correct that Iraq is much more complex. The world
>> fully
>> understands Germany's and France's angst at having Saddam removed. The
>> massive contracts and loans from both in violation of UN sanctions were
>> suddenly null and void.
>
>
> Hmm, hasn't your "mission not accomplished" Mr. Rumsfeld been
> hand-shaking with Saddam when Iraq was fighting Iran? And didn't he
> allow US companies to deliver bacteria to Iraq? And who gave all the
> Stinger missiles to the Taliban? Oh, memory may be so selective.
>
> If Angst would control German politics, how to you explain that German
> soldiers are securing Kabul? Having holidays in sunny countries?
Well it will stop them pinching ALL the beach towels in Majorca maybe :-)
>
> That's your way: Go there like Terminator III, bomb all down but having
> no idea what to do afterwards. And when you have made your mess, you
> call for UNO like a baby needing pampered ...
>
Don't pull any punches there, will you....
The Natural Philosopher
> "Dave Thompson" <daveth...@cmeforit.us>:
>
>
>>"The Natural Philosopher" <a@b.c> wrote in message
>>news:408942AE.8000402@b.c...
>>
>
>>>>>Aber das ist wohl Teil Eurer Kultur, die Welt ohne Rücksicht
>>>>>auf Verluste mit Euren Ansichten zu beglücken.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>Kultur und Amerika? Wie kann das zusammen in einem Satz
>>>>stehen?
>>>>
>>>:-)
>>>
>>Culture and American in the same sentence?
>>
>>Sort of like Germany and Hitler stand together in the same
>>sentence. Sort of like Germany and the gassing and incineration
>>of millions can stand together in the same sentence.
>>
>
> They do usually when americans talk about germany. And you're
> developing, starting with Guantanamo Bay.
>
> But when do americans talk about Vietnam, faschist dictators all
> over the world supported by the USA, the predecessor of Khomeini
> supported by the USA and last but not least Saddam supported by the
> USA?
>
>
>>Sort of like Germany and Germany and Neo-Nazis can stand
>>together in the same sentence.
>>
>
> Well, but in germany they rather not become members of government.
>
Indeed. Once was patently enough.
However you want to interpret that :-)
Actually I think you have upset those Yanks too much. They did a number
on your model trains, but they missed by about 8000 miles and got one in
Korea instead. :-)
> SCNR
>
Bernardo
"Matt Lang" <web...@shaw.ca> wrote in message
news:a0e12e54.04042...@posting.google.com...
> > > Das ist mir eigentlich ziemlich wurscht. Aber offensichtlich seid
Ihr zu
> > > d mlich, das Crossposting in den deutschsprachigen Raum
einzustellen.
> >
> > Mich hat mal ein Ami als "Nazi" angep belt, weil er meinte, "de"
> > st nde f r "Detroit" und dort w rde verdammt nochmal englisch
> > geschrieben.
>
> Koestlich! Habe selten so gelacht :)
>
> Man muss bedenken dass es fuer serh viele amerikaner nicht immer
> bekannt ist dass es ausserhalb amerikas nennenswerte zivilisation
> gibt. Also kann das .de ja nur fuer detroit stehen ;)
To Read in English, Please Scroll Down:
Ich finde es laecherlich, euer Verhalten!
Ihr quatscht da so los, irgend nen Schmarn ueber Amerika und
keine Kultur, und wie dumm die Amerikaner sind, u.s.w. u.s.f...
Ich hab fast mein ganzes Leben in Deutschland verbracht, als
"Einwanderer" aus Italien. Jetzt studiere ich seit etwas weniger
als einem Jahr in den Vereinigten Staaten. In der ganzen Zeit in der
ich in Deutschland war hab ich es nicht ein einziges mal geschafft von
den Menschen dort "Menschlich" behandelt zu werden! (siehe
Beispiel eure unmenschliche Art und Weise hier ploetlich
ueber eine Dummheit ein "Voelkerstreit" auszuloesen)...
Dagegen bin ich seit nur weniger als 11 Monaten in den Vereinigten
Staaten und ich habe mich bereits in das Volk verliebt. Jeder is offen,
Menschlich (gross geschrieben!!!), und immer Hilfsbereits gewesen.
Ich hab null Probleme gehabt mich hier anzugewoehnen, jeder den ich
getroffen hab hat stehts alles moegliche gemacht um mir dabei zuhelfen,
sei es auf dem Universitaet's Campus oder ueberall wo ich gewesen bin.
Ich bin es satt von ungebildeten Ignoranten wie euch, die kein anderen
Ort gesehen haben als ihr eigenes Bauerndorf, erklaert zu bekommen wie
die bloed, dumm, boese, unkultiviert, u.s.w. die Amerikaner sind!
Und erzaehlt mir nix von ich seih Pro-Bush oder son schmarn. Es is mir
wurscht ob ich Pro-Busch bin, ob mein bester Amerikanischer Freund
Pro-Busch ist oder ob er Pro-Marx ist... Die Amerikaner sind ein
beneidenswertes, interessantes und freundliches Volk, und vorallem
ihr Deutsche koenntet sehr viel von ihnen lernen!
Wollte ich nur mal loswerden....
Bernardo Fanti
English:
I find your behaviour to be ridiculous!
You speak some incoherent crap about how stupid Americans are,
how they have no culture etc.
I have lived most of my life in Germany as an "immigrant" from Italy.
Now I'm studying at a College in the United States, and I've been here
for
less than a year. In all the time I had been in Germany I have not once
been
treated "humanly" (e.g. your unhuman and incoherent way to start a "war
between nations")...
In contrast, I've only been less than 11 months in the United States so
far,
and I have already come to love this Nation. Everybody is open, human!!,
and always ready to help. I haven't had any trouble so far getting used
to
a totally new culture, language, and way of life, and everybody I've met
both on-campus and off-campus has always been willing to help in every
possible way.
I'm tired to be told by uneducated ignorants like you how Americans
suck,
how they're so stupid, so uncultured, so.... You haven't been anywhere
else
but in your little hometown in the middle of nowhere! And don't tell me
anything about "you're Pro-Bush!!" or bullshit like that. I don't care
if I am
pro-busch or if my best friend here is pro-bush or pro-communism...
The Americans are an enviable, interesting, and friendly Nation, and
especially
YOU Germans could learn a lot from them!
Bernardo Fanti
Frank Forsten
> Die Amerikaner sind ein
> beneidenswertes, interessantes und freundliches Volk, und vorallem
> ihr Deutsche koenntet sehr viel von ihnen lernen!
Zum Beispiel unsere nationalen Interessen ohne Rücksicht auf Verluste
gegen andere Länder durchsetzen? Das hatten wir schon mal ...
Auch interessant, daß die Aufforderung, bitte nicht mehr nach
de.rec.modelle.bahn x-posten innerhalb kurzer Zeit mit "Nazi"
beantwortet wird?
Schön für Dich, wenn es Dir dort gefällt. Ich kann mir "Vorne
freundlich, hinten bigott" sparen. Aber als "Ja-Sager" wird man dort
sicher nett behandelt.
FF
Markus Hoffmann
Frank, Du siehst das viel zu Oberflächlich und Pauschal !
Gruß, Markus
Markus Hoffmann
das kann nur jemand verstehen, der jemals Drüben war.
Du hast aber leider Recht, der normale Durchschnittsdeutsche ist nur
so schlau wie sein Dorf und die deutsche Volkszeitung BILD :-/
Wer USA = Bush = USA tönt, beweißt nur, daß er nicht intelligenter ist
!!!
Gruß, Markus
Frank Forsten
> Frank, Du siehst das viel zu Oberflächlich und Pauschal !
Was gibt es an den Vorwürfen "Deutschland = Nazi" und "Deutschland =
Feige / Angst" zu differenzieren?
FF
Markus Hoffmann
Wenn Du es nicht selber schaffst das zu Differenzieren, dann tust Du
mir irgendwie leid. Meines Wissens war das lediglich eine Stimme die
das sagte, aber die USA bestehen aus vielen Millionen Stimmen und
nicht alle singen das gleiche Lied, also kann man nicht den ganzen
Kontinent in eine Ecke drängen.
Wenn 5 Jugendliche in MeckPomm des Nächtens Sieg Heil gröhlend durch
die Strassen ziehen und einen Ausländer verdreschen, ist dann gesamt
Deutschland gleich neo-nationalsozialistisch ? Ist der gesamte Islam
eine terroristische Vereinigung, nur weil eine Hand voll Wahnsinniger
Anschläge verübt ?
Gruß, Markus
Frank Forsten
> Wenn Du es nicht selber schaffst das zu Differenzieren, dann tust Du
> mir irgendwie leid...
Seltsam, wenn einer Deiner geliebten Amis hier pauschalisiert, dann
schweigst Du ... aber die Demutshaltung gegenüber den USA scheint auch
so ein Reflex zu sein.
FF
Dave Thompson
Americans are watching you expose yourself as a pompous ass.
--
Dave Thompson
Dave Thompson
Oh, yes; Os americanos observam-no executar como um pomposo como.
Frank Forsten
> Americans are watching you expose yourself as a pompous ass.
So they watch you too? OK, cite:
"Culture and American in the same sentence?
Sort of like Germany and Hitler stand together in the same sentence.
Sort of like Germany and the gassing and incineration of millions can
stand together in the same sentence.
Sort of like Germany and Germany and Neo-Nazis can stand together in the
same sentence."
That's what came to your mind regarding Germany.
Here is what comes to my mind regarding USA:
http://www.forsten-online.de/frames/8002-en.htm (damit wieder OnTopic)
Now who is the pompous ass?
FF
jeboba
Wir Verstehen Nicht!
"Markus Hoffmann" <markus_...@t-online.de> wrote in message
news:60904834.04042...@posting.google.com...
Ronald Felix
"Dave Thompson" <daveth...@cmeforit.us> schreef in bericht
news:iiAic.31220$L75.28182@fed1read06...
Dave Thompson
"Ronald Felix" <ronald...@pi.be> wrote in message
news:c6fkar$avdu4$1...@ID-172357.news.uni-berlin.de...
Since the arrogant cross posting started from de.rec.modelle.bahn, replies
will continue until the cross posting stops. When I no longer see it in
rec.models.rc.air the replies will stop.
Haben Sie einen netten Tag.
--
Dave Thompson
Oliver Zoffi
> Wenn Du es nicht selber schaffst das zu Differenzieren, dann tust Du
> mir irgendwie leid. Meines Wissens war das lediglich eine Stimme die
> das sagte, aber die USA bestehen aus vielen Millionen Stimmen und
> nicht alle singen das gleiche Lied, also kann man nicht den ganzen
> Kontinent in eine Ecke drängen.
> Wenn 5 Jugendliche in MeckPomm des Nächtens Sieg Heil gröhlend durch
> die Strassen ziehen und einen Ausländer verdreschen, ist dann gesamt
> Deutschland gleich neo-nationalsozialistisch ? Ist der gesamte Islam
> eine terroristische Vereinigung, nur weil eine Hand voll Wahnsinniger
> Anschläge verübt ?
>
Klar doch - das nennt man Vorurteile! Die haben wir doch alle irgendwie ;)
Es sind auch nicht die 10, die "Gutes tun", die genannt werden, sondern
immer
der Eine, der negativ auffällt, der offenbar repräsentativ für alle steht
...
Aber auch das ist offenabr in der ganzen Welt "normal".
Das Blödeste daran aber ist, dass viele wen in eine "Ecke" stellen, aber
gar nicht wissen was diese Ecke eigentlich ist, weil sie nur nachplappern,
was sie irgendwo aufgeschnappt haben.
@All:
Eines wundert und ärgert mich auch etwas:
wenn ich in einem englisch sprachigen Forum oder NG in deutsch schreibe,
bleibe ich
meist alleine - unbeantwortet - ignoriert - klar die armen "Amis" (um nur
*ein*
englisch sprachiges Volk zu nennen) können halt nicht deutsch, muss man
verstehen ...
Hier, in eine deutsch sprachigen Forum antworten wir auf englische Postings
ebenfalls in englisch! So als müssen ALLE deutschsprachigen Leser dem
Englisch mächtig sein ... selbstverständlich oder?
Ja schlimmer noch, viele der Ursprungsposter geben sich gar keine Mühe auch
nur
ein Wort in deutsch zu schreiben, oder versuchen ihr Anliegen mithilfe einer
Übersetzungsmaschine zu unterstützen.
Warum ist das so? Weil die deutsche Sprache dermaßen unbedeutend ist?
Weil als "Weltsprache" Englisch definiert ist und daher eh alle englisch
können
müssen - ah geh, wirklich?
Oder einfach, weil sie uns bewust ignoriern? Denn wenn wer hier postet, dann
wird er vermutlich auch hier mitlesen - auf deutsch. Daher nehme ich an,
dass
ihm unserer Sprache nicht gänzlich fremd ist. Dann kann er auch in DEUTSCH
posten - oder? DAS dies geht, können wir ja immer wieder lesen, denn einige
Amis, Engländer, Schweden etc. geben sich sehr wohl Mühe und posten in einem
deutschen Forum auch deutsch - geht doch!
Die Anderen, die das nicht tun und die Selbstverständlichkeit voraussetzen,
man
hätte sie gefälligst zu verstehen, halte ich für sehr überheblich - ja fast
möchte ich
sie schon in die Ecke der Nazis stellen. Und wir, die wir uns *darüber* in
englisch
dann aufregen unterstützen dass auch noch ...
Allerdings fallen mir derartige "Zwistigkeiten" immer wieder nur in diversen
NGs auf.
In webbasierenden Foren geht es (zumindestens in denen ich verkehre)
großteils
"gesitteter" zu - ist das Usenet offenbar ein "Magent" für derartige Leute
und Themen?
Auch darüber wundere ich mich immer wieder.
Abschließend möchte ich Euch alle auffordern aufzuhören mit Dreck zu werfen
und uns
gegenseitig des Unvermögens und Schlimmeren zu bezichtigen. Bringt doch
nichts - ausser
wieder einem Ellenlangen Thread ;)
lg
Oliver, der meint "gebt's Euch die Hand"
Markus Hoffmann
> Americans are watching you expose yourself as a pompous ass.
Could you explain your thoughts or are these simple polemic words in
redneck manner ? There are many americans out there with the same
exposition of there pompouse asses !!!
Frank Forsten
> Hier, in eine deutsch sprachigen Forum antworten wir auf englische Postings
> ebenfalls in englisch!
In diesem Fall war es ein cross-posting, vermutlich ist den Jebobas,
Pauls, usw. nicht aufgefallen, daß sie auch nach de.rec.modelle.bahn
versenden - und falls doch, dann wohl nicht mit der Erkenntnis, daß es
sich um ein deutschsprachiges Forum handelt.
Grundsätzlich werden wir uns damit abfinden müssen, daß Deutsch die x-te
Geige hinter Englisch, Spanisch, Chinesisch, Russisch usw. spielt. Falls
hier jemand auf Englisch anfragt und es dabei um Modellbahn nach
deutsch(sprachigem) Vorbild geht, dann freue ich mich, daß es auch im
Ausland Interesse an dem Thema gibt und antworte gerne in Englisch.
Man muß ja nicht versuchen, den Sprachimperialismus unserer Verbündeten
mit Gleichem zu vergelten, sondern sich eher die Vielsprachigkeit der
Niederländer zum Vorbild nehmen.
Grüße, Frank
Frank Forsten
englischem Titel ("blockdispatching by hand") - aus welchem Grund auch
immer.
Grüße, Ingrid, äh Frank
Lars P. Wolschner
> "Dave Thompson" <daveth...@cmeforit.us> wrote in message
> news:<iiAic.31220$L75.28182@fed1read06>...
>> Americans are watching you expose yourself as a pompous ass.
>
> Could you explain your thoughts or are these simple polemic
> words in redneck manner ?
Dave Thompson just wanted to provide an example of american culture
in discussions.
CU
Markus Hoffmann
Ich habe keine Demutshaltung gegenüber den USA, nur kann ich
differenzieren zwischen einem Idioten der nur rumtönt und Stunk machen
will, und mehr tat der Ersteller des Ursprungspostings nicht.
Ob ein dummer Redneck mich mich als Nazi usw bezeichnet ist doch
völlig irrelevant und gibt noch lange nicht das Recht ein gesamtes
Volk zu verdammen.
Im Gegensatz zu vielen anderen war ich einige Male in den Staaten und
behaupte mal mehr über Land und Leute zu wissen, als diejenigen, die
aus ihrem Kaff kaum rauskommen und ihrer "Weisheiten" aus der
Regenbogenpresse haben. Solche Leute stehen für mich auf der selben
Stufe wie der Redneck, deren das Internet nur dazu dient ihre Dummheit
der Menschheit mitzuteilen !
Deine anti-amerikanische Haltung ist spührbar und Dein Ding, solltest
aber mal darüber nachdenken !
Markus Hoffmann
> Markus,
> Wir Verstehen Nicht!
It doesn´t matter, I too ;-)))
A.Lange
>
> markus_...@t-online.de (Markus Hoffmann):
>
> > "Dave Thompson" <daveth...@cmeforit.us> wrote in message
> > news:<iiAic.31220$L75.28182@fed1read06>...
>
> >> Americans are watching you expose yourself as a pompous ass.
> >
> > Could you explain your thoughts or are these simple polemic
> > words in redneck manner ?
>
> Dave Thompson just wanted to provide an example of american culture
> in discussions.
Und, war er erfolgreicher als die Pappnasen, die in deutschen NG zu
Demos für Kerry aufrufen oder um unsere Teilnahme an
Amtsendhebungsverfahren nachsuchen?
Mist, keine Umlaute...
Gruß
Andreas
Frank Forsten
> ... gibt noch lange nicht das Recht ein gesamtes
> Volk zu verdammen.
Hat das jemand hier getan?
> Deine anti-amerikanische Haltung ist spürbar und Dein Ding, solltest
> aber mal darüber nachdenken!
Ach ja, die typischen Kategorien: Kritik an der israelischen Politik =
Antisemitismus, Kritik an der amerikanischen Politik = Antiamerikanismus.
"Aber das ist wohl Teil Eurer Kultur, die Welt ohne Rücksicht auf
Verluste mit Euren Ansichten zu beglücken." - genau das war und ist
meine Kritik an der Art und Weise, wie sich die USA auf dem
internationalen Parkett bewegt.
Wäre ich anti-amerikanisch, dan würde ich wohl kaum Broschüren aus dem
Kalmbach-Verlag empfehlen, Gebäude von Walthers verwenden und meine
Homepage zweisprachig aufziehen.
Aber klar: Da ich Amerika nur aus der "Regenbogenpresse" kenne (Spiegel,
ZEIT, ARD, Verwandte in den USA, usw.), habe ich mir im Gegensatz zu Dir
kein Urteil zu erlauben.
Schöne Grüße, Frank
X-posting nach rec.models.rc.air entfernt
C.O.Jones
> Dave Thompson schrieb:
>
> > You are absolutely correct that Iraq is much more complex. The world
fully
> > understands Germany's and France's angst at having Saddam removed. The
> > massive contracts and loans from both in violation of UN sanctions were
> > suddenly null and void.
>
> Hmm, hasn't your "mission not accomplished" Mr. Rumsfeld been
> hand-shaking with Saddam when Iraq was fighting Iran? And didn't he
> allow US companies to deliver bacteria to Iraq? And who gave all the
> Stinger missiles to the Taliban? Oh, memory may be so selective.
Yep! Stinger missiles to the Taliban! For the same reason we gave them to
YOU! Or have you so soon forgotten the old days of East and West Germany
and the Soviet Army around Berlin?
I spent 8 1/2 years in your beutiful country. Too bad it's littered with
the likes of you. I say pull out ALL American troops from Germany. And the
American dollar too!
C.O.Jones
"The Natural Philosopher" <a@b.c> wrote in message
>
> Actually I think you have upset those Yanks too much. They did a number
> on your model trains, but they missed by about 8000 miles and got one in
> Korea instead. :-)
>
Typical DH! Wanting to blame the US for the worlds ills! Back to your
bottle you dip shit!
Lars P. Wolschner
> Markus Hoffmann schrieb:
>> Deine anti-amerikanische Haltung ist spürbar und Dein Ding,
>> solltest aber mal darüber nachdenken!
Vollkommen lächerlich.
> Ach ja, die typischen Kategorien: Kritik an der israelischen
> Politik = Antisemitismus, Kritik an der amerikanischen Politik =
> Antiamerikanismus.
>
> "Aber das ist wohl Teil Eurer Kultur, die Welt ohne Rücksicht
> auf Verluste mit Euren Ansichten zu beglücken." - genau das war
> und ist meine Kritik an der Art und Weise, wie sich die USA auf
> dem internationalen Parkett bewegt.
> Aber klar: Da ich Amerika nur aus der "Regenbogenpresse" kenne
> (Spiegel, ZEIT, ARD, Verwandte in den USA, usw.), habe ich mir
> im Gegensatz zu Dir kein Urteil zu erlauben.
Dem kann ich nur vollumfänglich zustimmen.
Michael Koch
>@All:
>Eines wundert und ärgert mich auch etwas:
>wenn ich in einem englisch sprachigen Forum oder NG in deutsch schreibe,
>bleibe ich
>meist alleine - unbeantwortet - ignoriert - klar die armen "Amis" (um nur
>*ein*
>englisch sprachiges Volk zu nennen) können halt nicht deutsch, muss man
>verstehen ...
Nun ja, Englisch ist nun mal Weltsprache, gefolgt von Spanisch. Fast
alle deutschsprachigen Schulen lehren auch Englisch. Deutsch ist
dageben kaum in englischsprachigen Gegenden ein Fach, schon gar kein
Pflichtfach, soweit ich weiss.
>Hier, in eine deutsch sprachigen Forum antworten wir auf englische Postings
>ebenfalls in englisch! So als müssen ALLE deutschsprachigen Leser dem
>Englisch mächtig sein ... selbstverständlich oder?
Ich bin ja nun deutschsprachig und sehe folgendes: Die
deutschsprachigen haben (offenbar) kein Selbstvertrauen mehr in ihre
Sprache. Viel zu vieles wird durch englischsprachige Begriffe
ausgedrückt, wir unterwerfen uns der anderen Sprache, deutsche
Wörterbücher müssen jedes Jahr um "Neudeutsche" Begriffe ergänzt
werden. Warum heißen Kinder "Kids", Aufgaben "todo's", Ereignisse
"Events" usw.? Warum muss ich vorgestern in Bremerhaven vor der
Strandhalle (Restaurant) auf einer Fahne lesen "Place of best fish"?
Was soll der Scheiß? Klingt beispielsweise "Platz für besten Fisch"
irgendwie steif? Ich finde, der englischsprachige Text klingt
wesentlich bekloppter, mal abgesehen davon, das viele der besuchenden
Rentner diesen englischen Spruch eh nicht lesen können...
In der Hinsicht haben wir deutschsprachige nach meiner Überzeugung ein
echtes Problem. Und englische Postings, äh Nachrichten, die zu einer
deutschsprachigen Mail geschrieben werden, würde ich
selbstverständlich immer wieder in deutsch beantworten, wenn ich sie
denn überhaupt zur Kenntnis nehme bzw. nehmen kann.
Mut zur deutschen Sprache sage ich!
--
Michael Koch
http://www.mk-welt.de
Frank Forsten
> I say pull out ALL American troops from Germany.
Good idea. Take your young boys who drive drunken across our roads
> And the American dollar too!
Hmm, which American dollar? Did you ever come across a term called
"deficit"? That means that other countries (e.g. Arabia, Japan, Europe)
money is taken to the USA, no the other way around.
Welcome to the real world of global economy.
FF
BTW: removed x-posting to de.rec.modelle.bahn
Frank Forsten
> In der Hinsicht haben wir deutschsprachige nach meiner Überzeugung ein
> echtes Problem.
>
> Mut zur deutschen Sprache sage ich!
Ich sehe es etwas anders: Die Beherrschung der Muttersprache wird
vernachlässigt, der Wortschatz verarmt. Leider werden dann entstandenen
Lücken mit scheinbar geeigneten Begriffen aus dem Englischen gefüllt -
hört sich dann toll an, aber keiner weiss so recht, was eigentlich
gemeint ist. Das findet man besonders häufig in der Wirtschaft, wenn
Entscheider und Berater das eigene Unvermögen mit englischen
Schlagwörten verschleiern. Auch in der Werbebranche ist die Fähigkeit,
mit der eigenen Sprache umzugehen, leider nicht sehr ausgeprägt.
Ausnahmen wie "Nicht immer, aber immer öfter" oder "Geiz ist geil" sind
in der Minderheit.
Aber keine Frage von Mut, sondern von Sprachgewandheit.
Unter diesen Voraussetzungen halte ich es für ein Zeichen von
Höflichkeit und Gastfreundschaft, anderen, die nicht Deutsch sprechen,
entgegen zu kommen - und nicht für ein Zeichen von Schwäche.
Schöne Grüße, Frank
A.Lange
>
> Yep! Stinger missiles to the Taliban! For the same reason we gave them to
> YOU! Or have you so soon forgotten the old days of East and West Germany
> and the Soviet Army around Berlin?
>
> I spent 8 1/2 years in your beutiful country. Too bad it's littered with
> the likes of you. I say pull out ALL American troops from Germany. And the
> American dollar too!
Ziemlich große Fresse für den Angehörigen eines Vereins, die von
halbverhungerten "vertikal Geforderten" in Schlafanzügen und
Badelatschen die Jacke vollgekriegt habe. :-)
Gruß
Andreas
Markus Hoffmann
> Markus Hoffmann schrieb:
>
> > ... gibt noch lange nicht das Recht ein gesamtes
> > Volk zu verdammen.
>
> Hat das jemand hier getan?
Nicht wörtlich.
> > Deine anti-amerikanische Haltung ist spürbar und Dein Ding, solltest
> > aber mal darüber nachdenken!
>
> Ach ja, die typischen Kategorien: Kritik an der israelischen Politik =
> Antisemitismus, Kritik an der amerikanischen Politik = Antiamerikanismus.
Kommt immer darauf an wie man es sagt/kritisiert, wobei Israel/Juden
ein sehr spezielles Thema ist.
> "Aber das ist wohl Teil Eurer Kultur, die Welt ohne Rücksicht auf
> Verluste mit Euren Ansichten zu beglücken." - genau das war und ist
> meine Kritik an der Art und Weise, wie sich die USA auf dem
> internationalen Parkett bewegt.
Ohne Rücksicht auf Verluste sehe ich nicht, hier in Europa ist man
doch viel zu phlegmatisch geworden. Anstatt mal mit der Faus auf den
Tisch zu hauen, debattiert man lieber ob man darf oder nicht, wärend
im Rücken Unschuldige krepieren bzw. übt man sich in ängstlicher
Gefallsucht anstatt mal zu zeigen wo der Frosch die Locken hat.
Die Informationspolitik der derzeitigen US-Regierung stütze ich nicht,
aber was den Irak und das ganze Gesocks da unten betrifft ist man noch
viel zu zimperlich !
Das es nur um Öl geht, war doch von vornherein klar und auch
Deutschland/Frankreich ging es dabei nur ums liebe Öl, der Rest war
doch nur geheuchelt um besser dazustehen.
> Wäre ich anti-amerikanisch, dan würde ich wohl kaum Broschüren aus dem
> Kalmbach-Verlag empfehlen, Gebäude von Walthers verwenden und meine
> Homepage zweisprachig aufziehen.
Anhand so einer billigen Broschüren erklärst Du dann den
US-Bahnverkehr für veraltet und rückständiger als eine deutsche
Nebenbahn.
Die Gebäude sind aber Made by Danmark und da die halbe Welt englisch
spricht, ist es logisch eine HP 2-sprachig zu gestalten.
Keine gute Ausrede ;-)
> Aber klar: Da ich Amerika nur aus der "Regenbogenpresse" kenne (Spiegel,
> ZEIT, ARD, Verwandte in den USA, usw.), habe ich mir im Gegensatz zu Dir
> kein Urteil zu erlauben.
Das habe ich so nie behauptet !!! Wenn Du Dir die Jacke anziehst,
nicht mein Problem.
>
> Schöne Grüße, Frank
>
> X-posting nach rec.models.rc.air entfernt
ebenso, Markus
Peter Popp
>Since the arrogant cross posting started from de.rec.modelle.bahn, replies
>will continue until the cross posting stops. When I no longer see it in
>rec.models.rc.air the replies will stop.
oh, it's great: this cross posting started from outside the group,
where the thread came from. I just can't imagine how this works...
I beg all who want to continue this tread: please do not Post to
de.rec.modelle.bahn further!
@deutsche Modellbahner: Die Diskussion ist sinnlos,
meint
--
Peter Popp
email:peter...@arcor.de
Vorbild und Modell auf:
http://www.peter-popp.de/bahn/
Frank Forsten
> Anhand so einer billigen Broschüren erklärst Du dann den
> US-Bahnverkehr für veraltet und rückständiger als eine deutsche
> Nebenbahn.
Das Originalzitat aus einem Beitrag von mir:
"Markus schrieb:
> Der Güterverkehr an sich unterscheidet sich in keinster Weise
> von unseren Verfahrensweisen, lediglich Zettelschreiber gibt es
> nicht und das Entkuppeln ist einfacher.
Das, was J. Armstrong in "Track Planning for Realistic Operation"
beschreibt, erinnert mich höchstens an den vereinfachten
Nebenbahnbetrieb bei uns."
In dem Zusammenhang ging es um Komplexität und Nachspielbarkeit. Da war
an keiner Stelle von veraltet und rückständig die Rede, sondern vielmehr
von simpel, gemäß dem KISS-Prinzip: keep it simple, stupid.
Weiterhin würde ich ein Standardwerk von J.Armstrong, das seit 1963 bis
heute zig-mal neu aufgelegt wurde, nicht als billige Broschüre bezeichnen.
Aber klar, Du hast als einziger den Durchblick - auch wenn Du dazu
Aussagen anderer vorsätzlich verfälschen mußt. Dafür verleihe ich Dir
den Mittelinitialen "W." ehrenhalber.
Frank