Bought a house
Ryan Ginstrom
official. We now own a house in Japan.
We had been thinking of a few options on how to buy a house. We thought
about buying a really cheap place with cash, or getting permanent residence
for me. In the end, we had my wife apply for the loan. To prepare, I've been
paying her a "salary" out of my income for a few years.
Interestingly, I am the joint guarantor on the loan, and have half the house
in my name. It seems like you just need the Japanese citizenship/perm
residence to get things rolling, after that they don't care who the hell
pays for it.
Right now interest is dirt cheap -- our rate is 1.975%. It's variable
though -- we decided against fixed because a fixed 10-year interest rate was
higher than the variable rate has been in years.
The house itself is pretty cool. It's on a kind of slope, with the ocean
below. It's on 140-odd tsubo of land, and the house takes up a fair part of
it. View of the ocean is 180 degrees, and it's really very pretty. I've
already got the spot for my hammock picked out.
--
Regards,
Ryan Ginstrom
Ronnie Corporon
your letter how expensive it is to get a house over there?
Julie
"Ryan Ginstrom" <gins...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:bld3r2$au9el$1...@ID-101276.news.uni-berlin.de...
The 2-Belo
>Well, the final word on the loan came through yesterday, so I guess it's
>official. We now own a house in Japan.
Welcome home, is the phrase I should use.
>We had been thinking of a few options on how to buy a house. We thought
>about buying a really cheap place with cash, or getting permanent residence
>for me. In the end, we had my wife apply for the loan. To prepare, I've been
>paying her a "salary" out of my income for a few years.
>
>Interestingly, I am the joint guarantor on the loan, and have half the house
>in my name. It seems like you just need the Japanese citizenship/perm
>residence to get things rolling, after that they don't care who the hell
>pays for it.
Yup. I went through this in 1999, although under more stressful circumstances
(my future wife's house burned down). Since everything was destroyed, we had to
procure enough funds to pay for the house *and* all furniture and appliances
inside; I eventually went with getting half the money from a bank and the other
half from the 住宅金融公庫. I ended up getting 3,000,000 yen in this fashion,
and it was barely enough (we had to pay property taxes upon changing the
ownership of the land, too... fuckers).
As it turns out, I was the only one in the entire family who was qualified to
get a loan at all, so it's all in my name with my wife as guarantor. The house
ended up being something like 99.4% in my name or something like that.
>Right now interest is dirt cheap -- our rate is 1.975%. It's variable
>though -- we decided against fixed because a fixed 10-year interest rate was
>higher than the variable rate has been in years.
>
>The house itself is pretty cool. It's on a kind of slope, with the ocean
>below. It's on 140-odd tsubo of land, and the house takes up a fair part of
>it. View of the ocean is 180 degrees, and it's really very pretty. I've
>already got the spot for my hammock picked out.
Have fun planting grass. I spent all summer tending the yard... next summer
it'll be juuuuuuust right for holding barbeques.
Are you going to take pics of you and your wife jumping up and down in front of
it, like Debito did?
--
The 2-Belo
the2belo[AT]msd[DOT]biglobe[DOT]ne[DOT]jp
news:alt.alien.vampire.flonk.flonk.flonk (mhm21x20)
news:alt.fan.karl-malden.nose (Meow.)
http://www.godhatesjanks.org/ (God Hates Janks!)
Processing failed. Hit any user to continue.
The 2-Belo
Correction: 30,000,000 yen. Forgot a zero.
mr.sumo snr.
news:bld3r2$au9el$1...@ID-101276.news.uni-berlin.de...
Congratulations Ryan!
Welcome to thirty years of "a reason to work" apart from securing funds in
order to buy brown water.
We were fortunate with our loans in that my business was able to take out a
20% of the total cost loan, the substantive loan that was a joint affair.
(I'm still only on the 3-year spouse visa, and "sumo jnr." wasn't even a
glint in the milkman's eye at that time.)
We both signed the loan documents (if I remember correctly there were about
36 name-stamp marks required - each - including even the spine of the
folder) and had the money in the bank about a month before my wife quit her
nursing job. We made no secret of her plans to leave - but neither of the
banks seemed particularly bothered about how that might affect our financial
situation.
Of course, being an uptight Brit, both the mortgage rate and the entire
property cost was very cheap compared to something similar in semi-rural
Worcestershire or Warwickshire.
--
jonathan
--
"Never give a mortgage to ducks"
Travers Naran
>
> Correction: 30,000,000 yen. Forgot a zero.
I would imagine so! At 3,000,000 yen, I'd consider buying one with just
an equity loan on my current place!
--
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Travers Naran | Visit the SFTV Science Blunders
F/T Programmer,P/T Meddler In Time&Space | Hall of Infamy!
New Westminster, British Columbia, |
Canada, Earth, Milky Way, etc. | <www.geocities.com/naran500/>
"Stand Back! I'm a programmer!" |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dave Fossett
> Welcome to thirty years of "a reason to work" apart from securing funds in
> order to buy brown water.
30 years!? Ha... I've still got 30 years to go... :-(
--
Dave Fossett
Saitama, Japan
Ryan Ginstrom
news:PAoeb.2388$r.48...@news20.bellglobal.com...
> Congratulations on buying a house in Japan! Don't think you mentioned in
> your letter how expensive it is to get a house over there?
>
> Julie
Much, much cheaper than San Francisco.
--
Regards,
Ryan Ginstrom
Brett Robson
>
>Well, the final word on the loan came through yesterday, so I guess it's
>official. We now own a house in Japan.
>
Well done.
I've bought two apartments, lived in them for 2 years them moved, first time
interstate then international. I think I'll hang on two the one in Sydney
though.
I often get flyers for manshions and I was trying to work out the repayments.
eg 16,000,000 yen manshion, borrow eg 13,000,000.
at two percent interest over 30 years
monthly payment = [ (13,000,000 * 0.02 * 30years / 2) + 13,000,000 ] / (30years
* 12 months)
= 47,000 a month.
That is for an apartment twice the size of what I am paying 90,000 for.
----
"I went to Japan once, and was very dissapointed in what I saw."
quote from Japan Today forums.
Ryan Ginstrom
"The 2-Belo" <the2...@msd.biPOKPOKglobe.ne.jp> wrote in message
news:3f7a1a96$0$2944$df06...@news.sexzilla.net...
> Yup. I went through this in 1999, although under more stressful
circumstances
> (my future wife's house burned down). Since everything was destroyed, we
had to
I forget, are her parents living with you?
> Have fun planting grass. I spent all summer tending the yard... next
summer
> it'll be juuuuuuust right for holding barbeques.
Just lay down some freaking sod squares, what's the big hassle? But BBQs
will definitely be a big part of the equation -- the house is perfect for
it.
> Are you going to take pics of you and your wife jumping up and down in
front of
> it, like Debito did?
I have to find an angle where none of you psychos can figure out where I
live.
--
Regards,
Ryan Ginstrom
Ryan Ginstrom
> Correction: 30,000,000 yen. Forgot a zero.
I hate it when I do that.
We'll probably go a little over that, including the addition on the house
and remodeling we're planning.
--
Regards,
Ryan Ginstrom
Ryan Ginstrom
"mr.sumo snr." <mr_...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:bldaih$atuq7$1...@ID-141600.news.uni-berlin.de...
> Congratulations Ryan!
Thanks! feels good.
> Welcome to thirty years of "a reason to work" apart from securing funds in
> order to buy brown water.
We actually chose a 20-year loan. Even if interest rates stay the same, we
will save 3 million yen that way -- more if they go up.
> We both signed the loan documents (if I remember correctly there were
about
> 36 name-stamp marks required - each - including even the spine of the
> folder)
Yep, there were quite a few. The bank had to huddle for a bit, and make a
couple phone calls, before they decided how I should write my name. In the
end, it was name as appearing on passport, in all caps, with my gaigin card
katakana above it:
ライアン ジンストロム
RYAN FRANCIS GINSTROM
I wrote that about 10 times, along with my address & phone number several
times, plus seal stamps galore. I think they just stamp everywhere they can
think of, just in case.
It was like an assembly line. I write, pass to my wife who writes, she
passes to the loan official who starts letting fly with the stamps.
>and had the money in the bank about a month before my wife quit her
> nursing job. We made no secret of her plans to leave - but neither of the
> banks seemed particularly bothered about how that might affect our
financial
> situation.
I guess it just shows that the banks know what is up, and are just playing
the government reg game enough to keep the govt boys happy (government
employees have a ring of hell reserved for them just above the needle-hiding
surgeons)
> Of course, being an uptight Brit, both the mortgage rate and the entire
> property cost was very cheap compared to something similar in semi-rural
> Worcestershire or Warwickshire.
It was fairly cheap here too, compared to the mainland (and dirt cheap
compared to San Francisco).
--
Regards,
Ryan Ginstrom
The 2-Belo
>
>"The 2-Belo" <the2...@msd.biPOKPOKglobe.ne.jp> wrote in message
>news:3f7a1a96$0$2944$df06...@news.sexzilla.net...
>> Yup. I went through this in 1999, although under more stressful circumstances
>> (my future wife's house burned down). Since everything was destroyed, we had to
>
>I forget, are her parents living with you?
Yep. Mom, Dad, niece, and a grandmother who crawls around in the hallway banging
doors open and shut while moaning for food and attention at 4 o'clock in the
morning.
>> Have fun planting grass. I spent all summer tending the yard... next summer
>> it'll be juuuuuuust right for holding barbeques.
>
>Just lay down some freaking sod squares, what's the big hassle?
Then the fun begins. Fend off hordes of stray cats using the new sod as a
litterbox. Battle growths of angry weeds and brown patches. Clip every Sunday.
Repeat until irritated. I was just recently able to put a lawn chair out there
and vegetate for a while.
>But BBQs will definitely be a big part of the equation -- the house is perfect for
>it.
Mmmmmmmmmmm. SAAAAAAAAAAAAAUSages.
>> Are you going to take pics of you and your wife jumping up and down in
>> front of it, like Debito did?
>
>I have to find an angle where none of you psychos can figure out where I live.
Just mosaic out the rest of the scenery, like on the news. This is the digital
age, remember.
The 2-Belo
>"mr.sumo snr." <mr_...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Welcome to thirty years of "a reason to work" apart from securing funds in
>> order to buy brown water.
>
>30 years!? Ha... I've still got 30 years to go... :-(
28 for me.
As an aside: The fact that I've willingly tied myself financially to this
country for most of the rest of my life apparently amuses new Japanese
acquaintances to no end. I could start a comedy routine that consisted of the
line, "I just bought a new house, and took out a 30-year home loan... now I
couldn't go back to the US even if I wanted to!" They crack up every time.
The 2-Belo
>The 2-Belo wrote:
>>
>> Correction: 30,000,000 yen. Forgot a zero.
>
>I would imagine so! At 3,000,000 yen, I'd consider buying one with just
>an equity loan on my current place!
Heh. I reread my post, and thought, "Hang on, that was the price of my goddamned
*car*."
mr.sumo snr.
>
> "mr.sumo snr." <mr_...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:bldaih$atuq7$1...@ID-141600.news.uni-berlin.de...
> > Congratulations Ryan!
>
> Thanks! feels good.
>
> > Welcome to thirty years of "a reason to work" apart from securing funds
in
> > order to buy brown water.
>
> We actually chose a 20-year loan. Even if interest rates stay the same, we
> will save 3 million yen that way -- more if they go up.
>
A 20 or even 25-year loan was just going to be a wee bit tougher than we
could manage - AND have a life which involves international vacations, new
cars, and beer. It would only have been possible if my wife had remained in
full-time employment. She was tired of nursing after 21 years, and - as we
have subsequetly proved to be the case - felt that getting and staying
pregnant was not going to happen whilst she was still doing shift work.
We get the odd comment, from both local Japanese and gaijin-lifers that the
house is too big and too 'expensive' for just 3 people. I generally just
smile and ask them how they'll feel in 25 years time trying to keep warm in
their poorly insulated, non-centrally air-conditioned, by that stage
probably falling down houses. I built with the future in mind - a future
that for me at least does not involve building another house in my
life-time - at least NOT in Japan.
> > We both signed the loan documents (if I remember correctly there were
> about
> > 36 name-stamp marks required - each - including even the spine of the
> > folder)
>
> Yep, there were quite a few. The bank had to huddle for a bit, and make a
> couple phone calls, before they decided how I should write my name. In the
> end, it was name as appearing on passport, in all caps, with my gaigin
card
> katakana above it:
>
> ライアン ジンストロム
> RYAN FRANCIS GINSTROM
>
> I wrote that about 10 times, along with my address & phone number several
> times, plus seal stamps galore. I think they just stamp everywhere they
can
> think of, just in case.
>
> It was like an assembly line. I write, pass to my wife who writes, she
> passes to the loan official who starts letting fly with the stamps.
>
I had to actually go down to City Hall and register a fresh name-stamp.
Fortunately, every time you take out an insurance policy in this country
they seem to present you with the gift of a 'hanko'. I have about 4 katakana
'jonasan' stamps. My original 'kanji' stamp just read as 'jona', which
wasn't good enough for the loan companies. They thought that I could
somehow default on the loan if my name-stamp wasn't an accurate
representation of my name - bugger the fact that as far as the local
tax-office is concerned my name is "Jonathan H."
So anyway, once all that was sorted I had to re-stamp several documents with
a cheap 'katakana' stamp that could be picked up in a 100-yen shop.
--
jonathan
--
"Never give a hanko to ducks"
Ryan Ginstrom
> As an aside: The fact that I've willingly tied myself financially to this
> country for most of the rest of my life apparently amuses new Japanese
> acquaintances to no end. I could start a comedy routine that consisted of
the
> line, "I just bought a new house, and took out a 30-year home loan... now
I
> couldn't go back to the US even if I wanted to!" They crack up every time.
Maybe they know something you don't (or do, which is even scarier...)
--
Regards,
Ryan Ginstrom
Ryan Ginstrom
we
> > will save 3 million yen that way -- more if they go up.
> >
>
> A 20 or even 25-year loan was just going to be a wee bit tougher than we
> could manage - AND have a life which involves international vacations, new
> cars, and beer.
Lucky for us, cost of living is pretty cheap down here.
Of course we have already scoped out the eating & drinking establishments
near our new house. One place has a deal going, until 7pm nama beer is 190
yen, all kushi are 100 yen until 8pm, sashimi is always cheap -- 5 varieties
for 1,000 yen. (And they get it from the fishing harbor just down the road)
> probably falling down houses. I built with the future in mind - a future
> that for me at least does not involve building another house in my
> life-time - at least NOT in Japan.
Okinawan houses today are pretty sturdy -- steel-reinforced concrete for the
most part. They have to be that way, to stand up to the hurricanes. Don't
need heating either, or too much AC (the summers are actually milder than
Nagoya, and less humid. Plus the new house has a nice ocean breeze).
> I had to actually go down to City Hall and register a fresh name-stamp.
Heh, my wife had to, because she had been using mine all this time. It's
really cool now, though. The guy punches in the characters on his PC, then
the USB device hooked up to it carves out the hanko. My first one was carved
out by hand by a dude who looks like he's been hitting the shochu more often
than the shuji practice. The only problem I see is that it will now be much
easier to counterfeit these things.
--
Regards,
Ryan Ginstrom
Ryan Ginstrom
> Ryan Ginstrom and fj.life.in-japan is a baaaaaaaaaaad combination:
>
> Then the fun begins. Fend off hordes of stray cats using the new sod as a
> litterbox.
The two dogs should take care of that. Now we just need to take care of the
two dogs.
> Battle growths of angry weeds and brown patches.
That is a hassle. Luckily we will have two aging roomers who love to work in
gardens and need to be kept busy.
Plus we plan on putting a deck over most of the current garden.
>Clip every Sunday.
Before we had our weed whacker, my father in law spent two days cutting our
lawn by hand, with a kama. The dude is a freaking nut.
> Repeat until irritated. I was just recently able to put a lawn chair out
there
> and vegetate for a while.
I'll just string up my hammock so I don't dent the grass.
> >But BBQs will definitely be a big part of the equation -- the house is
perfect for
> >it.
>
> Mmmmmmmmmmm. SAAAAAAAAAAAAAUSages.
Mmmm ... MEAT! Another good thing about Okinawans is they know how to enjoy
a good BBQ.
--
Regards,
Ryan Ginstrom
The 2-Belo
[...]
>>Clip every Sunday.
>
>Before we had our weed whacker, my father in law spent two days cutting our
>lawn by hand, with a kama. The dude is a freaking nut.
Wheesh. Someone should at least have introduced him to spring-loaded clippers.
>> >But BBQs will definitely be a big part of the equation -- the house is perfect for
>> >it.
>>
>> Mmmmmmmmmmm. SAAAAAAAAAAAAAUSages.
>
>Mmmm ... MEAT! Another good thing about Okinawans is they know how to enjoy
>a good BBQ.
Heh. Here, we have people holding elaborate barbeques under bridge overpasses.
Such is Honshu, I guess.
Dick Muhfukkin Bagswing
Congratulations!
I hope all goes well.
Brian
cc
"Brett Robson" <jet...@deja.com> wrote in message
> I often get flyers for manshions and I was trying to work out the
repayments.
>
> eg 16,000,000 yen manshion, borrow eg 13,000,000.
I don't get the same flyers. In Osaka, that's the price for the 1k not
conveniently situated
( that are rented 40 000 yen/month the first 10 years, then 35 000 yen or
less when the building and flats look grotty).
For 100 % of the flyers, the repayment of the loan on 30 years is equivalent
to the rent you'd pay for that place. (sometimes you can rent or buy in the
same building, that's exactly the same price). And don't forget the charges.
Well that would still be interesting if the building were built like in
Europe, after 30 years, you'd own a flat, if you renovate it progressively,
it's still nice.
But here ? I have visited over 60 of those "mansions" built 30 years ago,
and they are all in a bad shape. Rebuying a new one and renovating cost the
same (except if you are extremely lucky , you bought in a once cheap area
that became fashionable in 30 yrs).
They don't have the same logic. The place where I live is 20 yr old, and
looks relatively nice, because the owner is in the building business, so
every 3 years, they repaint, change the bricks on the wall, the stairs, etc.
Every time a person leaves a flat, the next day, they change the wall
panels, the tatami, the ceiling panel, the flooring, the unit bath, the
windows, the kitchen block, the electric wire, the door. No wonder they use
so cheap quality material.
In France, I had a flat in a building of the 16th century, there were still
the original walls, doors that had 200 yrs, the bathroom had been built in
the fifties (the tub, the toilet and the tiles were still nice). The taps
and windows are changed every 20 yrs, the decoration every 10 yrs. That sort
of flat you buy, live in 5 years, resell the same value. My father didn't
lose one eurocent in the bargain, I lived there for the interests of the
loan. That seems to be on another planet.
> That is for an apartment twice the size of what I am paying 90,000 for.
Is it possible that you are overpaying ?
CC
Ryan Ginstrom
"cc" <cpasune...@spam.com> wrote in message
news:blgis3$br3$1...@bgsv5647.tk.mesh.ad.jp...
>
> "Brett Robson" <jet...@deja.com> wrote in message
>
> > I often get flyers for manshions and I was trying to work out the
> repayments.
> >
> > eg 16,000,000 yen manshion, borrow eg 13,000,000.
>
> I don't get the same flyers. In Osaka, that's the price for the 1k not
> conveniently situated
> ( that are rented 40 000 yen/month the first 10 years, then 35 000 yen or
> less when the building and flats look grotty).
We thought (very briefly) about buying a condo. The problem is that in
Japan, basically the only value is in the land. A building can even be a
liability, because in many cases you will have to tear it down. Since with a
manson you don't own the land, essentially you own nothing. You've just got
a relatively low rent, that you are locked into for 20-30 years. Plus you've
got those kanrihi and misc. charges, and are subject to the whims of the
owners' group (think chounaikai x 10).
Another problem is that 99% of the manshons out there have very shoddy
construction. I'm sure you've all seen those high-rise apartments get thrown
up in a month or two. And in addition to actually emitting a slew of harmful
chemicals, the way that they are built makes many manshons breeding grounds
for molds and fungi. Pretty nasty stuff.
If you do think about buying a manshon, I would recommend you investigate
the construction very thoroughly. If possible, visit the site while the
construction is ongoing, and check what type of insulation they are using,
what type of "cross" (wallpaper) they are using, etc. Remember, it's almost
impossible to sue for slipshod construction in Japan unless the building
actually falls down around your ears.
--
Regards,
Ryan Ginstrom
cc
"Ryan Ginstrom" <gins...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> We thought (very briefly) about buying a condo.
Really ? You didn't move to the islands to live in a condo !
>The problem is that in
> Japan, basically the only value is in the land.
I think exactly like you. In addition, when you have your house built or
reformed, you can select the material yourself and decide about the
construction.
> If you do think about buying a manshon, I would recommend you investigate
> the construction very thoroughly.
Nobody would lend me 10 000 yen, so now, all I can afford is a parking lot
( at least it's land !).
Anyway, for a manshon I'd investigate a lot, and I'd buy it second-hand when
the flat has lost lot of its value. They equip the new flats with tons of
useless gadgets in the kitchen, bathroom, broadband in each bedroom, make
expensive communication, I wouldn't want to pay for that waste. Then I'd put
4 gaigins in it and charge them 4 rents.
CC
Ryan Ginstrom
>
> "Ryan Ginstrom" <gins...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>
> > We thought (very briefly) about buying a condo.
>
> Really ? You didn't move to the islands to live in a condo !
Well, it took us a few years to be confident we could live in Okinawa.
Before then, we looked around mainland Japan for houses as well.
We also did some research, and found out about how shoddy construction was
in Japan (in general). But I guess anyone could figure that out when they
see houses getting torn down and rebuilt every 20-30 years.
> >The problem is that in
> > Japan, basically the only value is in the land.
>
> I think exactly like you. In addition, when you have your house built or
> reformed, you can select the material yourself and decide about the
> construction.
Yep, but the problem is that a reform can cost as much as building a new
house!
> Anyway, for a manshon I'd investigate a lot, and I'd buy it second-hand
when
> the flat has lost lot of its value.
Yes. The good side of housing being treated as a consumable, along the lines
of a car, is that you can get some good bargains if you search very well.
--
Regards,
Ryan Ginstrom