[Q] Opening date for Batman at SF/St. Louis
Jeff Miller
Louis? -Jeff Miller
Brian A. Plencner
April 21st. The park will open next Sunday (3-26) at 10 am. I know
that the park has put a LOT of hype into the ride, so they are trying to
get it to open on time. I have not heard how the construction/testing
of the ride has been going. I am planning on going to the park on the
22nd of April and would like to ride it. Any one out there with info on
the ride, and if it will be ready on the date that they orginally said?
I hope that this help you out, and thanks in advance for any new
info.
Brian Plencner
mu...@uxa.ecn.bgu.edu
ACERGUY
be invited to
the dedication ofr the Batman in late April, according to the pitch for
the season pass
from Six Flags, Mid America
Conn Berkenbile, ACERGUY
RobertW581
SF/STL opens Saturday (3-25), not Sunday.
Batman will undergo static testing beginning around the first week of
April, with deadload testing scheduled for the second week of April.
Certification by both the State of Missouri and St. Louis County should be
done sometime around April 16th or 17th, with test rides by park employees
on the 19th and 20th.
This information came from the Operations department at SFSTL (or SFoMA
for those of you still on the old name plan).
Dave McCracken
> Batman will undergo static testing beginning around the first week of
> April, with deadload testing scheduled for the second week of April.
> Certification by both the State of Missouri and St. Louis County should be
> done sometime around April 16th or 17th, with test rides by park employees
> on the 19th and 20th.
I've seen a reference to an ACE event in mid-July centered around Batman.
Can anyone give more information about just what this event will entail? Will
it include ERT on Batman? How much? Will it also include ERT on any of the
other rides in the park? How crowded is SFMA expected to be at that time of
year?
We're planning a driving trip that may pass near the park in about that time
frame, and would like to know if this will be worth scheduling our visit around.
Thanks,
--
--------
Dave McCracken WHAM Engineering and Software
d...@wham.com 9020-II Capital of Texas Highway N, Suite 440
512 345-9925 Austin, TX 78759-7232
ROLLER10
>I've seen a reference to an ACE event in mid-July centered around Batman.
>Can anyone give more information about just what this event will entail?
Will
>it include ERT on Batman? How much? Will it also include ERT on any of
the
>other rides in the park? How crowded is SFMA expected to be at that time
of
>year?
Batman the Event is being scheduled for July 13-15 Six Flags
StLouis(MidAmerica) note: this will be a Thursday-Saturday event. There
will be ride sessions on Batman the Mirror Image and the Screamin' Eagle,
and maybe others. The event is being organized by the park with the
assistance of Gary Slade of Texas. It will be similar to The Texas Giant
Celebration. The Saturday portion of the event will be a morning ride
session only, so the crowds should not be too bad. An event flyer is at
the printer so cost and other details should be out soon in Ace News and
Inside Track.
Robert
RobertW581
From what I've seen, it is the same configuration as the one at SFGAm,
and SFMM.
ROLLER10
> Why does everyone keep calling the Batman at SFStL "Mirror Image"?
> From what I've seen, it is the same configuration as the one at SFGAm,
>and SFMM.
Look at the pictures in Inside Track and ACE news. They both show that the
first drop turns right instead of left.
Robert
ROLLER10
referred to as Batman the Event. Gary Slade just gave me the event flyer
and here are the details:
Name: Coaster Celebration
Dates: July 13-15
Cost: 25.00 in advance, 35.00 after July 1
Special for advance registering: Event Souvenir
E R T: 8 hours total on 3 coasters. 2 hours on the Screamin' Eagle in the
dark without lights. Ride sessions will now be Friday and
Saturday, with times in both the morning and night. (this is a
change for Saturday night)
Other: BBQ picnic, 2 days admission
Contact person: Tammy Stankey SFOMA/StL 314-938-5300 in P R dept.
Flyers will be going out in ACE news, Inside Track, MACC, etc. shortly.
Robert
ACE regional rep, Texas
Donald Bates
writes:
>
> Why does everyone keep calling the Batman at SFStL "Mirror Image"?
>
> From what I've seen, it is the same configuration as the one at SFGAm,
>and SFMM.
>
The ride is, in fact, a "mirror image." Instead of dropping off of the
lift hill to the left, it goes to the right. On this version, to ride
in the front seat, you'll have to turn left in the station instead of
right. Just go to Chicago and hold a mirror up to the ride from behind
you.
Bird Rendell H.
ROLLER10 <roll...@aol.com> wrote:
>Look at the pictures in Inside Track and ACE news. They both show that the
>first drop turns right instead of left.
I don't know if we can judge by photos in a magazine. They often get
reversed when the time for final printing comes around (and *don't* ask
how I know these things!!) :-) :-)
To the best of my feeble memory BOTH SFGAm's and SFMM's "Batman"s
(Batmen?) turn to the left after the lift hill.
As a matter of fact, I can' think of a B&M coaster that I have
ridden that turns to the right; not PGA's Top Gun or Vortex, not Kumba,
etc.
Can anyone think of a B&M coaster which turns to the right at the
top of the lift hill?
--Rendell
Bill Buckley
>>ROLLER10 <roll...@aol.com> wrote:
>>Look at the pictures in Inside Track and ACE news. They both show that the
>>first drop turns right instead of left.
>r...@ucs.usl.edu (Bird Rendell H.) replied:
>I don't know if we can judge by photos in a magazine. They often get
>reversed when the time for final printing comes around (and *don't* ask
>how I know these things!!) :-) :-)
>
>To the best of my feeble memory BOTH SFGAm's and SFMM's "Batman"s
>(Batmen?) turn to the left after the lift hill.
>
>As a matter of fact, I can' think of a B&M coaster that I have
>ridden that turns to the right; not PGA's Top Gun or Vortex, not Kumba,
>etc.
>
>Can anyone think of a B&M coaster which turns to the right at the
>top of the lift hill?
>
>--Rendell
Sure ... Dragon Kahn, for one. Their mid-80s stand-up design and new
portable Inverted design (both produced for/marketed by Intamin AG)
turn to the right off the lift.
...also the new BATMAN THE RIDE at Six Flags St. Louis. Yes indeed,
Rendell, this is a true "mirror image" coaster of the first three BTRs.
I think the new twist should be exciting -- I mean, I feel the Cyclone
clone coasters "feel" different when you ride a mirror image version
(like GA Cyclone) over the original profile (Psyclone).
Happy rails, ....
Buck .++++++++.\
-- .+++. .+++++++++++++++.\
... .+++++++. .+++++++++++++++++++++.\
.+++++. .+++++++++++. .+++++++++++++++++++++++++++.
.+++++++++. .++++++ William J. Buckley, Jr. +++++++++++++++++++.
.+++++++++++++...++++++++ buc...@powdml.enet.dec.com ++++++++++++++++++++++.
----------------------------- Coast...@aol.com ---------------------------
----- Support an American Tradition ... RIDE MORE ROLLER COASTERS !!!!! -----
RobertW581
The opening of BTR at St. Louis is pushed back into early May (per a
discussion with a ride supervisor on 4/12/95 at the park).
Markus Marbach
buc...@powdml.enet.dec.com (Date: 12.04.95) wrote ...
b> Sure ... Dragon Kahn, for one. Their mid-80s stand-up design and new
b> portable Inverted design (both produced for/marketed by Intamin AG)
b> turn to the right off the lift.
My informations are:
Dragon Khan was produced and marketed by B&M only (built by Giovanola with
trains designed by B&M).
Intamin designed and built the trains for the Inverter. Giovanola is
building the track for this coaster. (The coaster will be finished in
July.)
Because B&M don't want to build coasters who are transportable Intamin
got the order from Oscar Bruch.
True for both coasters Dragon Khan and Inverter is that they turn to the
right at the top of the lift.
BUT the difference is that the Inverter will turn to the right because
every transportable coaster did it! Since the first transportable coaster
has built in 1909 in Germany! The reason could be same why carousels turns
clockwise.
The one and only transportable coaster who turns to the left is the left
half of the 'Twin Wild Mouse' builded by Mack and Maurer. (All single
versions who were built turns to the right!)
P.S.: INVERTER is my name for this coaster. I don't know the real name at
this moment.
Ciao
Markus
>E-Mail: Markus_...@Ol2.maus.de
Dave Althoff
all portable coasters turn to the right (which I won't argue with...all
the ones I've seen do...), and that perhaps there is a similar reason for
why carousels all go clockwise.
First of all, in the U-S, almost all carousels go COUNTER-clockwise.
English roundabouts almost all go clockwise, as do many European
carousels. Since the previous poster's address ends in ".de", he's
excused 8-)
AS I UNDERSTAND IT (and this may well be legend), the earliest carousels
went clockwise. A right-handed person normally mounts a horse from the
left-hand side, since if said right-hander is armed with a sword, that
keeps the weapon from getting jammed in between the horse and rider. In
any case, it is generally considered good equestrian practice to mount
from the left, even though most of us no longer carry swords. If the
carousel is turning clockwise, guess which side is on the outside!
Eventually, the idea of the ring-catching game caught on in the U-S.
Since the ring machine is mounted along the outside of the carousel, it is
most convenient if right-handed riders may use their right hands to catch
the rings. This because "most" people are right-handed. To put the
right-hand side of the horse (and rider) on the outside of the carousel,
guess which way the ride has to turn: counter-clockwise.
Apparently, the ring game never caught on in Europe the way it did in the
U-S, so the European carousels continue to turn clockwise.
This is the story I've heard. De-bunking is welcomed...
--Dave Althoff, Jr.
--
/-\ _ _ |\
/XXX\ /X\ /X\_ _ | \XX
/XXXXX\ /XXX\ _/XXXX\_ /X\ XXXXX (hard hat area... )
_/XXXXXXX\__/XXXXX\/XXXXXXXX\_/XXX\_/XXXXXXX (.sig under construction)
Arnoud W. Morsink
: Eventually, the idea of the ring-catching game caught on in the U-S.
: Since the ring machine is mounted along the outside of the carousel, it is
: most convenient if right-handed riders may use their right hands to catch
: the rings. This because "most" people are right-handed. To put the
: right-hand side of the horse (and rider) on the outside of the carousel,
: guess which way the ride has to turn: counter-clockwise.
Sounds very ehr, plausible :). When you mentioned that (most) European
carousels turn clockwise, I was about to jump up and scream:
"No way! When I was a kid, I used to ride one in France a lot, and it
definitely turned *counter*clockwise!". The reason I so distinctly
remember, though - they had kind of a ring-catching game there as well.
(Although they didn't use rings, but some undefinable object, that was
swung back and forth on a fishing rod-like thingy by the ride operator.
Meaning, that shouldn't have had any influence on the clockwise/counter
clockwise decision. Oh well :) .)
--
Arnoud W. Morsink // http://www.xs4all.nl/~arnoudwm/
Amsterdam \\ // arn...@amiga1.xs4all.nl, arno...@xs4all.nl
The Netherlands \X/ "When in doubt, ride for stats"
Bill Buckley
>In a previous article, Markus_...@ol2.maus.de (Markus Marbach) writes...
>b> buc...@powdml.enet.dec.com (Date: 12.04.95) wrote ...
>b>
>b> Sure ... Dragon Kahn, for one. Their mid-80s stand-up design and new
>b> portable Inverted design (both produced for/marketed by Intamin AG)
>b> turn to the right off the lift.
>My informations are:
>Dragon Khan was produced and marketed by B&M only (built by Giovanola with
>trains designed by B&M).
>
>Intamin designed and built the trains for the Inverter. Giovanola is
>building the track for this coaster. (The coaster will be finished in
>July.) Because B&M don't want to build coasters who are transportable
>Intamin got the order from Oscar Bruch.
>
>Ciao
>Markus
RE: Dragon Kahn at Port Aventura--
When you say "built by Giovanola", are you referring to track fabrication?
Becuase if so, that's true -- B&M, as a company, does not manufacture their
own track/supports -- that work is subcontracted. B&M does build and supply
their own rolling stock, as well as design, and market, their rides.
I don't see where you apparently dispute in your post that Dragon Kahn is a
"B&M" ride?!?
In terms of the Intamin Inverted coaster -- I had read that Intamin had
worked with the B&M folks in regards to the *design* (and apparently also
regarding some licensing agreements). I had read also that a similar
approach was taken with Intamin's "7-up Shockwave" stand-up coaster for
Drayton Manor last year. We know from the Drayton Manor project that
the rolling stock was supplied by Intamin, but look closely at the design
of the rolling stock and the loop elements (esp. the gun-barrel roll).
HarlanR
carousel is that a carousel goes counter-clockwise while a merry-go-round
goes clockwise.
Can anybody confirm/deny this theory?
HR
All Hail Marx and Lennon!
----------------------------------------------------------
"Life is what happens / "Outside of a dog,
while you're making / a book is man's best friend.
other plans." / Inside of a dog,
-John Lennon / it's too dark to read."
/ - Groucho Marx
Ian J. Gordon
>From: arno...@xs1.xs4all.nl (Arnoud W. Morsink)
>Subject: Re: Why carousels go [counter] clockwise...
>Date: 18 Apr 1995 10:21:18 GMT
>Dave Althoff (dal...@freenet.columbus.oh.us) wrote:
>: Eventually, the idea of the ring-catching game caught on in the U-S.
>: Since the ring machine is mounted along the outside of the carousel, it is
>: most convenient if right-handed riders may use their right hands to catch
>: the rings. This because "most" people are right-handed. To put the
>: right-hand side of the horse (and rider) on the outside of the carousel,
>: guess which way the ride has to turn: counter-clockwise.
Here's a theory: It has to do with the rotation of the Earth. In the northern
hemisphere it's easier for the machinery to rotate ccw. For the same reason,
we run around a running track ccw as well. It's easier for us.
Just a theory...
Ian
----------------------------------------------------
Ian J. Gordon | 101 S. 39th St. #HL43
SEAS '96 Systems | Philadelphia, PA 19104
Wharton '96 Finance | ijgo...@seas.upenn.edu
Walt Schmidt
ijgo...@seas.upenn.edu (Ian J. Gordon) wrote:
>Here's a theory: It has to do with the rotation of the Earth. In the northern
>hemisphere it's easier for the machinery to rotate ccw. For the same reason,
>we run around a running track ccw as well. It's easier for us.
>
>Just a theory...
The earth's rotation has a negligible effect unless you talking about long
distances, like a low pressure system or a long flight.
BTW, the spiral going down the drain has nothing to do with the earth's
rotation.
*******************************************************
Walt Schmidt Penn State University
wjs...@psu.edu Isaiah 53:5
My home page: http://wjs116.rh.psu.edu/walt.htm
Cedar Po!nt, America's Roller Coast
*******************************************************
Steve Alcorn
>In article <ijgordon.2...@seas.upenn.edu>,
> ijgo...@seas.upenn.edu (Ian J. Gordon) wrote:
>>Here's a theory: It has to do with the rotation of the Earth. In the northern
>>hemisphere it's easier for the machinery to rotate ccw. For the same reason,
>>we run around a running track ccw as well. It's easier for us.
>>
>>Just a theory...
>The earth's rotation has a negligible effect unless you talking about long
>distances, like a low pressure system or a long flight.
>BTW, the spiral going down the drain has nothing to do with the earth's
>rotation.
I realize we're getting off-topic, but why do you say that? In the
northern hemisphere water spirals clockwise, and in the southern
counter-clockwise.
____________________________________________________________________
Steve Alcorn, Alcorn McBride Inc. | Alcorn McBride engineers
| audio, video, show and ride
"No wonder da water don't woik -- | controls for theme parks.
da pipes is full of wires!" | http://www.magicnet.net/alcorn
Walt Schmidt
>I realize we're getting off-topic, but why do you say that? In the
>northern hemisphere water spirals clockwise, and in the southern
>counter-clockwise.
Does it? If that is always the case, it's not because of the earth's
rotation. The Coriolis force is directly related to latitude and has an order
of magnitude of around 10 to the -5. Not nearly enough to affect anything
except on large scale. Those people who live on the equator and make their
living showing people the spining in either direction on opposites sides of
the equator do something to influence the direction. At the equator, there is
no Coriolis, moving a few feet to either side won't make a difference.
ROLLER10
>carousel is that a carousel goes counter-clockwise while a merry-go-round
>goes clockwise.
>Can anybody confirm/deny this theory?
>HR
I have been told the same thing, but I can't give you a hard copy that
proves it.
Robert
Tom Maglione
>Likewise, I have heard that the difference between a merry-go-round and a
>carousel is that a carousel goes counter-clockwise while a merry-go-round
>goes clockwise.
>
>Can anybody confirm/deny this theory?
>
>HR
>
round disks that rotate in the plane of the ground at playgrounds; children
push them from the outside to make them go round and round, and there are
grab bars all around the perimeter to hold onto as you go round.
Carousels are the machine-driven (powered) rotating platforms usually with
carved horses (although there are menagerie carousels with other animals
besides horses) that people ride. As far as I know, carousels in North
America rotate in a counter-clockwise direction as viewed from above.
In Europe and England, however, the carousels rotate in the opposite
direction (clockwise as viewed from above). I don't know why carousels
operate in this manner, but I have confirmed it when over in England last
year with ACE.
Happy riding and rotating,
Tom Maglione
Tom Maglione
>In article <ijgordon.2...@seas.upenn.edu>,
> ijgo...@seas.upenn.edu (Ian J. Gordon) wrote:
>
>>Here's a theory: It has to do with the rotation of the Earth. In the northern
>>hemisphere it's easier for the machinery to rotate ccw. For the same reason,
>>we run around a running track ccw as well. It's easier for us.
>>
>>Just a theory...
>
>The earth's rotation has a negligible effect unless you talking about long
>distances, like a low pressure system or a long flight.
>
>BTW, the spiral going down the drain has nothing to do with the earth's
>rotation.
>
> Walt Schmidt Penn State University
> wjs...@psu.edu Isaiah 53:5
> My home page: http://wjs116.rh.psu.edu/walt.htm
> Cedar Po!nt, America's Roller Coast
>*******************************************************
Hi Walt! I agree that the earth's rotation has a negligible effect as you
stated, and I think that the earth's rotation also has nothing to do with
the direction of rotation for carousels. But if the spiral vortex going
down the drain has nothing to do with the earth's rotation, what is the
reason that the vortex goes one direction in the northern hemisphere and
the opposite direction in the southern hemisphere?
If someone has an answer to this one, please also email me a copy, 'cuz
I don't get to login often enough to catch all the posts!
Thanks in advance,
Tom Maglione
Derek Gee
>Likewise, I have heard that the difference between a
merry-go-round and a carousel is that a carousel goes
counter-clockwise while a merry-go-round goes clockwise.
Can anybody confirm/deny this theory?
difference in the meaning of merry-go-round and carousel. Their
a many varient spellings of these terms. Carousels orginally
turned counter-clockwise so that right-handed nobles could
practice their jousting skills. How some European countries got
switched to clockwise is a mystery. I witnessed in France this
summer a carousel built around 1880 that had small children
trying to lance a ring with wooden lances. All the carousels I
saw in France were counter-clockwise. The English made carousels
I've seen were clockwise. Hope this helps...
Derek Gee
DRRounds
>Likewise, I have heard that the difference between a merry-go-round and a
>carousel is that a carousel goes counter-clockwise while a merry-go-round
>goes clockwise.
>Can anybody confirm/deny this theory?
From what I heard at "House on the Rock" in Spring Green WI, where they
claim to have the largest carousel in the world, a merry-go-round may have
horses on it but a carousel NEVER has horses, only other animals, on it.
David Rounds
Howard Fisher
<ijgo...@seas.upenn.edu> writes
>
>Here's a theory: It has to do with the rotation of the Earth. In the northern
>hemisphere it's easier for the machinery to rotate ccw. For the same reason,
>we run around a running track ccw as well. It's easier for us.
>
difference between European roundabouts and US ones because (unless my
geography teacher really got it wrong) we're all in the Northern
hemisphere.
Howard
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Howard Fisher, T U R N P I K E Ltd tel: +44 1306 747747
Dorking Business Park, DORKING, Surrey, UK. RH4 1HN fax: +44 1306 747749
Derek Gee
From what I heard at "House on the Rock" in Spring Green WI,
where they
claim to have the largest carousel in the world, a
merry-go-round may have
horses on it but a carousel NEVER has horses, only other
animals, on it.
A check of all my carousel reference books says that the words
carousel and merry-go-round are synonyms. A carousel with lots
of non-horse animals is a menagerie carousel. I'll keep looking
and see if I can find any other explanation.
Derek Gee
Scott McGrath
On 18 Apr 1995, Bill Buckley wrote:
> In terms of the Intamin Inverted coaster -- I had read that Intamin had
> worked with the B&M folks in regards to the *design* (and apparently also
> regarding some licensing agreements). I had read also that a similar
> approach was taken with Intamin's "7-up Shockwave" stand-up coaster for
> Drayton Manor last year. We know from the Drayton Manor project that
> the rolling stock was supplied by Intamin, but look closely at the design
> of the rolling stock and the loop elements (esp. the gun-barrel roll).
There is an even simpler and more convincing argument in regards to the
7Up Shockwave. Listen to the ride. You will hear the familiar roar of a
B&M ride. Then look at the track. Box-beam track with expansion joints
just like B&M track. And the rifle-barrel spiral feels exactly like the
heartline spin on B&M coasters. If Intamin didn't work with B&M, they
sure copied B&M!
-> Scott <-
Susan Mudgett aka little gator
: >Likewise, I have heard that the difference between a merry-go-round and a
: >carousel is that a carousel goes counter-clockwise while a merry-go-round
: >goes clockwise.
: >
: >Can anybody confirm/deny this theory?
According to every book I've read on the subject, the two words are
have absolutely the same meaning. Many people have trouble believing this,
and have invented arbitrary differences in definition, though.
Donald Gladstone
: >Likewise, I have heard that the difference between a merry-go-round and a
: >carousel is that a carousel goes counter-clockwise while a merry-go-round
: >goes clockwise.
: >Can anybody confirm/deny this theory?
: From what I heard at "House on the Rock" in Spring Green WI, where they
: claim to have the largest carousel in the world, a merry-go-round may have
: horses on it but a carousel NEVER has horses, only other animals, on it.
This isn't really on the subject, but Paramount's Great America has the
world's largest Carousel. IT is two stories and is very big.
PGA Michael
Susan Mudgett aka little gator
: : From what I heard at "House on the Rock" in Spring Green WI, where they
: : claim to have the largest carousel in the world, a merry-go-round may have
: : horses on it but a carousel NEVER has horses, only other animals, on it.
It's a carousel *and* a merry-go-round whether it has horse or not.
I've only heard of one without horses, at a Santa theme park where
all the animals are reindeer.
Some carousels/merry-go-rounds have horses only. If it has other animals,
whether it's Cresent Park's with one lone camel among the horses,
or Whalom with 2 to 4 each of camels, dragons, goats, greyhounds,
and giraffes, it's called a "menagerie carousel."
John Downing
>From: s...@harvee.billerica.ma.us (Susan Mudgett aka little gator)
>Subject: Re: Why carousels go [counter] clockwise...
And then there's the one at Kentucky Kingdom, with no horses OR other animals.
You ride on musical instruments.
Barry K. Swank, Jr.
>
>
>: : From what I heard at "House on the Rock" in Spring Green WI, where they
>: : claim to have the largest carousel in the world, a merry-go-round may have
>: : horses on it but a carousel NEVER has horses, only other animals, on it.
>
>It's a carousel *and* a merry-go-round whether it has horse or not.
>I've only heard of one without horses, at a Santa theme park where
>all the animals are reindeer.
>
>Some carousels/merry-go-rounds have horses only. If it has other animals,
>whether it's Cresent Park's with one lone camel among the horses,
>or Whalom with 2 to 4 each of camels, dragons, goats, greyhounds,
>and giraffes, it's called a "menagerie carousel."
>
At Knoebel's the kiddie sized one is called Stien and Goldstien
Merry-Go-Around, and the big one is called the Grand Carousel. So I think it's
a matter of size. The big ones are called carousels, and the smaller ones are
called "merry-go-around" .
Of course, this is my own opinion..
Mark L. Fendrick
ones are
>called "merry-go-around" .
>
>Of course, this is my own opinion..
NO distinction between a merry-go-round and a carousel other than M-G-R
is a british phrase while carousel originates <probable> in France.
Susan Mudgett aka little gator
Barry K. Swank, Jr. (bks...@vaxb.isc.rit.edu) wrote:
: >
: At Knoebel's the kiddie sized one is called Stien and Goldstien
: Merry-Go-Around, and the big one is called the Grand Carousel. So I think it's
: a matter of size. The big ones are called carousels, and the smaller ones are
: called "merry-go-around" .
But then, Knoebel's brags about having two "carousels". Call any one by
either name and you won't be incorrect.