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All-Excitement Team

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MATTHEW DUNSHEA

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Jul 17, 1994, 10:53:42 PM7/17/94
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F: Webber
F: Pippen
C: Robinson
G: Sprewell
G: K.Johnson

Sixth man: Kemp

Jose Isagani L. De Los Reyes

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Jul 17, 1994, 11:56:41 PM7/17/94
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SF - Mullin (because I love pure-shooters--Mullin can pass as well)
PF - Kemp
C - Bradley (No kidding)
PG - Payton (someone has to throw all those lob passes)
SG - Rider (best dunker in the NBA, college ever?)

I'm assuming Mullin regains his touch, if not, I'd put an Ellis or Miller
because I want my showtime team to put up lots of threes... really don't
care if they play out of position...

2nd team:

SF - Pippen
PF - Webber
C - Scheffler (he really gets me excited, really)
PG - Strickland
SG - Starks (he's unconscious, he's all-trash, he's crazy, I love it!)

anyway those soccer players in World Cup must have been watching the NBA
finals, that championship game was ugly, like the NBA's. Closely-contested
games are nice, but I'd rather see a high-scoring one anytime than a
low-scoring one. Oh well...

J.D.

--

ez04...@dale.ucdavis.edu

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Jul 18, 1994, 6:31:55 AM7/18/94
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SF: Xavier McDaniel
PF: Anthony Mason
C: Dikembe Mutombo
PG: Mark Price
SG: John Starks

SECOND TEAM
SF: Orlando Woolridge (A shooting machine)
PF: Stojko Vrankovich (Can touch the top of the backboard)
C: Shawn Bradley (Seven foot six inches of white excitement)
PG: Rolando Blackman (Resembles Shaft)
SG: Joe Kleine (Dead-on jump shot)

Jeffrey Piroozshad

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Jul 18, 1994, 7:26:45 PM7/18/94
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In article <msdun1.8....@MFS05.cc.monash.edu.au>,

I think that Penny Hardaway should be the backup guard. Very exciting player.

Jeff


Andrew Carter

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Jul 20, 1994, 8:34:17 AM7/20/94
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In article <Ct4t9...@ucdavis.edu>, ez04...@dale.ucdavis.edu () writes:
> SF: Xavier McDaniel
> PF: Anthony Mason
^^^^^^^ ^^^^^
What's exciting about A.M.?? How about Dennis Rodman? It's exciting
wondering what color his hair will be, who he'll club next, etc...

> C: Dikembe Mutombo
^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^
Shaq is up there too. Will he dunk it? Will he airball his F.T.???

> PG: Mark Price --> Don't agree, but have no suggestions either

> SG: John Starks
>
> SECOND TEAM
> SF: Orlando Woolridge (A shooting machine)

^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^
You're right, but I can't figure why he bounces around so much!

> PF: Stojko Vrankovich (Can touch the top of the backboard)
> C: Shawn Bradley (Seven foot six inches of white excitement)
> PG: Rolando Blackman (Resembles Shaft)
> SG: Joe Kleine (Dead-on jump shot)
>

It's kind of funny...how the most exciting players do not have to be stars!

Andrew

Message has been deleted

ez04...@dale.ucdavis.edu

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Jul 21, 1994, 4:18:54 AM7/21/94
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Andrew Carter (arc...@tntech.edu) wrote:
: > PF: Anthony Mason
: ^^^^^^^ ^^^^^
: What's exciting about A.M.?? How about Dennis Rodman? It's exciting
: wondering what color his hair will be, who he'll club next, etc...

I LOVE Mason: Those insanely huge arms, the way he SKIES for the rebound,
the hook shot which seems so graceful and out of place, the little
dribbling exhibitions between his legs every time he brings the ball up,
etc. Maybe I'm strange, but I find these things VERY exciting to watch.

Neil Williams

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Jul 21, 1994, 5:28:14 AM7/21/94
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> PF: Stojko Vrankovich (Can touch the top of the backboard)

I assume that this is with a jump ? :-)

How high is the top of the backboard ?

How tall is this player ? Who does he play for ?

Can anyone else in the league do this ?

Matt Mitchell

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Jul 21, 1994, 2:32:58 PM7/21/94
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In <CtAAB...@cee.hw.ac.uk> n...@cee.hw.ac.uk (Neil Williams) writes:

>> PF: Stojko Vrankovich (Can touch the top of the backboard)
>I assume that this is with a jump ? :-)
>How high is the top of the backboard ?

I think it is just over 12.5 feet (but I've never been able to get too close
a look....)

>How tall is this player ? Who does he play for ?
>Can anyone else in the league do this ?

Supposedly Drexler, in his prime, could jump up and place a quarter on the
top...then jump up again and make change. Also, one of the second round
picks in this years draft (bulls pick) is supposed to be able to do the
trick....

Matt Mitchell |\| |_ _ _______________
mm...@troi.cc.rochester.edu | | | \| || _____ __ _|
\_/| \ || ___/ | | _\ \
| ||_||____/ |_||____/
\_\

Craig Allan Paulsen

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Jul 21, 1994, 8:04:40 PM7/21/94
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>Supposedly Drexler, in his prime, could jump up and place a quarter on the
>top...then jump up again and make change. Also, one of the second round
>picks in this years draft (bulls pick) is supposed to be able to do the
>trick....

Believe it or not:

Wayman Tisdale used to be able to do this,
but I don't think I would even like to see
him try now.

Craig

Patrick Lin

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Jul 21, 1994, 7:13:43 PM7/21/94
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In article <CtAAB...@cee.hw.ac.uk>, Neil Williams <n...@cee.hw.ac.uk> wrote:
>
>In article <Ct4t9...@ucdavis.edu>, ez04...@dale.ucdavis.edu () writes:
>
>> PF: Stojko Vrankovich (Can touch the top of the backboard)
>
>I assume that this is with a jump ? :-)

Nah. He was using a step ladder. ;)

>How high is the top of the backboard ?

I don't know for sure, but I'd bet that it would be around 12'.

>How tall is this player ? Who does he play for ?

Dunno. Don't care. :P

>Can anyone else in the league do this ?

Come now. Of _course_ other players in the NBA can jump as high. Hell,
even I, at 6'1", can touch 11'. :P Surely almost every player in the NBA
can jump higher than me. ;)

Pat

--
_______________________________________________________________________
/ Patrick > ***** (415) 961-4025 ****** < 1920 Rock St. #9 /
/ Lin > **** pat...@netcom.com **** < Mountain View, CA 94043 /
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

T-Bone

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Jul 21, 1994, 8:10:04 PM7/21/94
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Matt Mitchell writes

>In <CtAAB...@cee.hw.ac.uk> n...@cee.hw.ac.uk (Neil Williams) writes:
>
>
>>In article <Ct4t9...@ucdavis.edu>, ez04...@dale.ucdavis.edu () writes:
>
>>> PF: Stojko Vrankovich (Can touch the top of the backboard)
>>I assume that this is with a jump ? :-)
>>How high is the top of the backboard ?
>
>I think it is just over 12.5 feet (but I've never been able to get too close
>a look....)
>
>>How tall is this player ? Who does he play for ?
>>Can anyone else in the league do this ?
>
>Supposedly Drexler, in his prime, could jump up and place a quarter on the
>top...then jump up again and make change. Also, one of the second round
>picks in this years draft (bulls pick) is supposed to be able to do the
>trick....

This is from Del Harris in _Loose Balls_: during his first year in the ABA
(which would have been his freshman year at college), Moses could, from a
standing jump, touch his head on the rim. In other words, Moses had a 37 inch
standing vertical. Not bad for a big 6-11 guy.

Also, there was Jumping Jackie Jackson, a New York playground legend, who
supposedly could jump up and take a quarter off the top of the backboard.
Jackson also could dunk from behind the foul line before Dr J came along.

T-Bone, just a programmer for Hughes STX
"Get your skimpy nightie out, girlfriend. It's wrasslin' time." - Cybermuffin

Corwyn Newman

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Jul 21, 1994, 11:33:46 PM7/21/94
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In article <CtAAB...@cee.hw.ac.uk>, Neil Williams <n...@cee.hw.ac.uk> wrote:
>

I don't think this is all that amazing. I've seen a photograph of Isiah
Thomas, that's right Isiah Thomas, all 6'1" of him touching the top of the box
on the backboard.
So, if Isiah who was only 73 inches tall, and surely didn't have the leagues
greatest high-jump could get that high... then imagine the heights that
Jordan, Pippen, etc. could get to. Remember, most NBA dunk championship
contestants can jump so high that their heads are within 2 to 3 inches of the
rim.

NewMan
cne...@nwu.edu

The Coz

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Jul 21, 1994, 5:00:50 PM7/21/94
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David Thompson did this when he was a Sonic.

Jeff Lee

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Jul 22, 1994, 2:34:14 AM7/22/94
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Andrew Carter (arc...@tntech.edu) wrote:

: In article <Ct4t9...@ucdavis.edu>, ez04...@dale.ucdavis.edu () writes:
: > SF: Xavier McDaniel
PIPPEN!
: > PF: Anthony Mason
: ^^^^^^^ ^^^^^
Oh man. Three choices Barkley, Rodman, or Kemp.

: > C: Dikembe Mutombo
: ^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^
Not Mutombo. Webber!

: > PG: Mark Price --> Don't agree, but have no suggestions either
Well I have a suggestion. Gary Payton. The biggest loudmouth in the league.

: > SG: John Starks
Or Reggie Miller

: > SECOND TEAM


: > SF: Orlando Woolridge (A shooting machine)

Where did this team come from? Not sure who I'd put here though.

: > PF: Stojko Vrankovich (Can touch the top of the backboard)
One of the people that loses out on the first team.

: > C: Shawn Bradley (Seven foot six inches of white excitement)
How about Alonzo kick anyone's ass Mourning?

: > PG: Rolando Blackman (Resembles Shaft)
Tim "thinks he's greatest player ever" Hardaway

: > SG: Joe Kleine (Dead-on jump shot)
Thought he was a center....
: >
: It's kind of funny...how the most exciting players do not have to be stars!

You know. Your team didn't seem very exciting. I mean Joe Kleine?
Orlando Woolridge? These players are about the boringest players in the
league. Next thing I know you'll be saying Kurt Rambiss or someone.

-jl

Bill Evans

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Jul 22, 1994, 3:40:00 AM7/22/94
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Jose Isagani L. De Los Reyes (eaf...@rigel.oac.uci.edu) wrote:

: 2nd team:

: SF - Pippen
: PF - Webber
: C - Scheffler (he really gets me excited, really)
: PG - Strickland
: SG - Starks (he's unconscious, he's all-trash, he's crazy, I love it!)

Are you Scheff's agent?

Jose Isagani L. De Los Reyes

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Jul 22, 1994, 5:57:06 AM7/22/94
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wil...@chinook.halcyon.com (Bill Evans) writes:

>Jose Isagani L. De Los Reyes (eaf...@rigel.oac.uci.edu) wrote:

>: 2nd team:

>: C - Scheffler (he really gets me excited, really)

>Are you Scheff's agent?

I wish. Excellent marketing value.

Oh yeah, and Scheffler was obviously not drafted ahead of Gill. However,
he was chosen as MVP in his conference in college-same conference as
Gill I suppose.

--

Bobby Davis

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Jul 22, 1994, 8:36:45 AM7/22/94
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>>Supposedly Drexler, in his prime, could jump up and place a quarter on the
>>top...then jump up again and make change...

It depends on the change involved. Most anyone can jump up and exchange the
quarter for a dime and three nickels. However, experiments have shown that
attempts to replace the quarter with twenty-five pennies are futile, as the
weight of the twenty-five pennies prevents the leaper from generating enough
hangtime.

The truly remarkable players are the ones who can jump up and place a credit
card on top of the backboard, wait while it is verified by computer, and sign
the purchase slip before floating gently to the ground. It is rumored that
Sidney Moncreif could do this early in his career, but this legend is quite
possibly apocryphal. On film, the most he ever did was write a check for
$44.35 and show a valid driver's license. And he cheated a little, sort of
flicking the license over the top of the backboard while his fingertips were
an inch or two too low on his descent.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Bob "The Glide" Davis Clarence Weatherspoon Update: Led the Sixers in |
| r...@flash.ece.uc.edu minutes, rebounds, blocks, and points. Spoon! |
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ed Costello

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Jul 22, 1994, 4:01:56 PM7/22/94
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In article <30n2eo$m...@charnel.ecst.CSUChico.EDU>,

cpau...@ecst.csuchico.edu (Craig Allan Paulsen) wrote:

> >Supposedly Drexler, in his prime, could jump up and place a quarter on the
> >top...then jump up again and make change. Also, one of the second round
> >picks in this years draft (bulls pick) is supposed to be able to do the
> >trick....

> Wayman Tisdale used to be able to do this,
> but I don't think I would even like to see
> him try now.
>
> Craig

I'd like to hear from anyone who's actually *seen* someone jump from the
floor and touch the top of the backboard. I've heard the "quarter and
make change" story about at least 10 different players (did you hear the
one about the coat with the nest of snakes inside?).

Some quick estimates: The net is about 14" lower than the rim, the top of
the board is, what? 12'6"?. So, from the bottom of the net to the top of
the board is 3'10" (46"). That means that if a player can stand
flat-footed and touch the net (must be 6'8"+), he must have a 46" vertical
leap to barely reach the top of the board.

Someone have the exact dimensions? How many players have those kind of hops?

--

Ed_Co...@quickmail.llnl.gov

Wade Dolphin

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Jul 22, 1994, 6:50:32 PM7/22/94
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Ed Costello (Ed_Co...@quickmail.llnl.gov) wrote:
: Some quick estimates: The net is about 14" lower than the rim, the top of

: the board is, what? 12'6"?. So, from the bottom of the net to the top of
: the board is 3'10" (46"). That means that if a player can stand
: flat-footed and touch the net (must be 6'8"+), he must have a 46" vertical
: leap to barely reach the top of the board.

: Someone have the exact dimensions? How many players have those kind of hops?

Well, I'm 6'4'' (76") and I can touch the bottom of the net (sometimes flat
footed and sometimes on my toes, depends on the net). Your 2.5 foot estimate
for rim to top of the backboard seems high to me. I thought the earlier
2 foot estimate was closer.

ez04...@dale.ucdavis.edu

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Jul 22, 1994, 7:16:41 PM7/22/94
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Ed Costello (Ed_Co...@quickmail.llnl.gov) wrote:
: I'd like to hear from anyone who's actually *seen* someone jump from the

: floor and touch the top of the backboard.

I remember seeing Vrankovich in the Olympics, when he showed off his
vertical by jumping, with outstreched arms, straight up on the left side
of the backboard for the rebound while the ball, shot from the right side,
was still in the air. However, he didn't have enough hang time, and the
ball bounced over his fingers as he fell. Scenes like this is why I love
watching giant white guys play.

John Econopouly

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Jul 22, 1994, 5:26:31 PM7/22/94
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This is unreal. Jeff, I'll try to say this gently, but it's going to
be hard. Jeff, sometimes people say things which don't appear very
sensible at first glance, because they are making a joke. Next time
you read something about how Joe Kleine is the most exciting SG ever,
try saying this: "ha ha ha".

TECHNOMASTER

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Jul 24, 1994, 6:11:08 PM7/24/94
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Wait... The original question dealt with touching the top of the backboard with
one's head, right or wrong? If touching the top of the backboard with a hand,
that's a different story, since arm lengths come into play.

I can reach around 7' just standing, and I'm about 5'6"-7"...
And... I get a vertical leap of 30+"...I can sometimes grab the rim....

Perhaps someone should figure out a formula relating flat footed reach with
one's height. Perhaps not. :)


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kevin Dolorico
-The Technomaster- kwd...@acf.nyu.edu

___....-----'---'-----....___ A Cheesy Sig...but ah well.
================================= Uhm... go NY go NY go?

Tom Watson

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Jul 25, 1994, 5:49:19 AM7/25/94
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In article <30uots$4...@cmcl2.NYU.EDU>,

TECHNOMASTER <kwd...@ACFcluster.nyu.edu> wrote:
>In article <CtD64...@boi.hp.com>, wdol...@boi.hp.com (Wade Dolphin) writes:
>>Ed Costello (Ed_Co...@quickmail.llnl.gov) wrote:
>>: Some quick estimates: The net is about 14" lower than the rim, the top of
>>: the board is, what? 12'6"?. So, from the bottom of the net to the top of
>>: the board is 3'10" (46"). That means that if a player can stand
>>: flat-footed and touch the net (must be 6'8"+), he must have a 46" vertical
>>: leap to barely reach the top of the board.

>>: Someone have the exact dimensions? How many players have those kind of
>>: hops?

>>Well, I'm 6'4'' (76") and I can touch the bottom of the net (sometimes flat
>>footed and sometimes on my toes, depends on the net). Your 2.5 foot estimate
>>for rim to top of the backboard seems high to me. I thought the earlier
>>2 foot estimate was closer.


>Wait... The original question dealt with touching the top of the backboard
>with one's head, right or wrong? If touching the top of the backboard with
>a hand, that's a different story, since arm lengths come into play.

>I can reach around 7' just standing, and I'm about 5'6"-7"...
>And... I get a vertical leap of 30+"...I can sometimes grab the rim....

>Perhaps someone should figure out a formula relating flat footed reach with
>one's height. Perhaps not. :)

Since everyone is looking for dimensions of the backboard I thought I'd give
you the actual measurements. The backboard is 3'6" high, with the bit below
the ring being 6" and the bit above being 3'.

Hence for a guy to even touch the top of the backboard he would have to
reach a point 13 feet high. Now lets say a guy who's say 6'6" (eg MJ) has
a vertical reach of say 9 feet (it would almost always be less than this)
he would have to have a vertical leap of 48" or 4 feet.

All these measurements are a bit extreme (eg a 6'6"er having a reach of 9",
and having a 4" vertical leap).

I would conclude that people who claim to have seen others reach the top of
the backboard are talking urban folklore. I believe that nobody is both
tall enough and athletic enough to do this.

However, I would believe it could very well be possible to do this with a
fan shaped backboard (the ones you get in playgrounds or some high-schools).
I would need to look up the dimensions of these backboards before I could
still believe it.

Are there any other basketball folklore stories, either from competitive
basketball or playgrounds? I'd love to here some other stories.

--
Tom Watson | I want to die peacefully in my sleep
E-mail: T.Wa...@bnr.co.uk | like my grandfather. Not screaming
Phone: 081-945-3396 | in terror like his passengers.

E Begley

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Jul 26, 1994, 7:10:06 AM7/26/94
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Yes, these measurements are a bit extreme. A reach of 9" and a 4" vertical?
Let's leave Will Perdue out of this discussion. OK?

Tom Watson

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Jul 26, 1994, 10:04:16 AM7/26/94
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> However, I would believe it could very well be possible to do this with a
> fan shaped backboard (the ones you get in playgrounds or some high-schools).
> I would need to look up the dimensions of these backboards before I could
> still believe it.

Nope, I just checked last night. The top of a regulation fan shaped
backboard is 12'8". Even though it curves down I would still not believe
that the coins on top of the backboard trick can be done.

ash...@sen.ca.gov

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Jul 26, 1994, 2:26:30 PM7/26/94
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I heard Pervis Ellison (in his prime) could do this. After the recent
knee surgery (-ies) --- forget it!

Ed Costello

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Jul 26, 1994, 4:11:36 PM7/26/94
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Does anyone have a film clip or has anyone actually, really, truly,
with-your-own-eyes witnessed someone jump from the floor and touch the top
of the backboard?

Anyone ... Buehler ... Frye ... Anyone ... Coz, how about Kemp? :)

--

Ed_Co...@quickmail.llnl.gov

The Coz

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Jul 26, 1994, 12:37:01 PM7/26/94
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>Does anyone have a film clip or has anyone actually, really, truly,
>with-your-own-eyes witnessed someone jump from the floor and touch the top
>of the backboard?

I PERSONALLY saw David Thompson do it when he was a Sonic.

>Anyone ... Buehler ... Frye ... Anyone ... Coz, how about Kemp? :)

I have seen pictures of Kemp on lobs where he was high enough to do it, but I
have not personally seen him do it. I would have to think that he could. Next
time I see Det or Kev I will ask them.

Cameron Walker

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Jul 27, 1994, 1:52:09 AM7/27/94
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In article <1994Jul25.0...@bnr.ca> to...@bnr.co.uk (Tom Watson) writes:

>I would conclude that people who claim to have seen others reach the top of
>the backboard are talking urban folklore. I believe that nobody is both
>tall enough and athletic enough to do this.

Maybe if Manute Bol put some serious time in at the Gym (I believe
he has a reach of at least 10')

+-----------------------------------------------+
|"Through the ghoul-guarded gateways of slumber,|
| Past the wan-mooned abysses of night. |
| I have lived over lives without number, | * Cameron Walker
| I have sounded all thing with my sight. | * Computer Science I
| Yet I shudder and shriek 'ere the daybreak, | * Monash University
| Being driven to madness with fright" | * Melbourne, Aust.
| - Nemesis, H.P. Lovecraft |
+-----------------------------------------------+
E-mail: crw...@mfs01.cc.monash.edu.au

The Coz

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Jul 27, 1994, 6:50:21 PM7/27/94
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In article <wood.77...@s1.elec.uq.oz.au> wo...@s1.elec.uq.oz.au (Ian Wood) writes:

>Anyway 6'4" + 36 inches = 9'4" - still 8 inches to go?
>Are you sure you ran into the rim? :)

Maybe he ran into it a few to many times. ;->

Wouldn't it be better to miss it?

Thomas Soerens

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Jul 27, 1994, 2:48:24 PM7/27/94
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crw...@MFS01.cc.monash.edu.au (Cameron Walker) writes:

>In article <1994Jul25.0...@bnr.ca> to...@bnr.co.uk (Tom Watson) writes:

>>I would conclude that people who claim to have seen others reach the top of
>>the backboard are talking urban folklore. I believe that nobody is both
>>tall enough and athletic enough to do this.

> Maybe if Manute Bol put some serious time in at the Gym (I believe
>he has a reach of at least 10')

Even Manute would have to have a vertical jump over 36".
I'm 6'4" and used to (many years and lbs ago) be able to hit my head on the
rim (with a running start) but don't remember getting close to the top of the backboard.
I play basketball at lunch and we use an official glass backboard (I measured
the height from the rim to the top of the backboard at 3') that we
crank up and down each day. I put my hand on top of the backboard as it was
being raised; when my fingers were at the top of the backboard, the rim was
chest high. Even if someone had much longer arms (Kemp, Dr. J, David Thompson,
whoever), they would have to have the rim at neck height to do it.
I could barely dunk on a korfball goal, which is 12' high, but the top of the
backboard was above my reach (at least 8", which is a lot). I agree with the
urban folklore theory.

Anyway, I always thought "take a quarter off the top of the backboard and leave
change" was an exaggeration never meant to be taken seriously. Kinda like "so
slow you need a calendar to time him" or something.
-TS

Pierre Girodias

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Jul 28, 1994, 3:57:32 AM7/28/94
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While we are on the subject of jumping, does anyone have any
suggestions on how to improve one's leap? I'm 5'11 and can barely
touch the rim: how may I gain those few extra inches to dunk? (I'll
leave the change on top of the board for someone else to grab :-)
BTW, does anyone have any idea how many of those few inches I would
need to be able to really dunk (I could lose a few pounds, say 20, and
gain one or two inches in the air :-) but that would not be enough
I fear...)

P.S. Is there any truth to those adds that promise a gain of 6 or
more inches?

Pierre, stuck on the ground.


Ed Costello

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Jul 28, 1994, 11:37:18 AM7/28/94
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In article <Ctn4r...@IRO.UMontreal.CA>, giro...@IRO.UMontreal.CA
(Pierre Girodias) wrote:
>
> [ stuff deleted]

> P.S. Is there any truth to those adds that promise a gain of 6 or
> more inches?

Noooo. Please leave it alone. Too easy.

--

Ed_Co...@quickmail.llnl.gov

Ian Wood

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Jul 27, 1994, 10:56:06 PM7/27/94
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epas...@skywarrior.ecn.uoknor.edu (Thomas Soerens) writes:

>crw...@MFS01.cc.monash.edu.au (Cameron Walker) writes:

>>In article <1994Jul25.0...@bnr.ca> to...@bnr.co.uk (Tom Watson) writes:

>>>I would conclude that people who claim to have seen others reach the top of
>>>the backboard are talking urban folklore. I believe that nobody is both
>>>tall enough and athletic enough to do this.

>> Maybe if Manute Bol put some serious time in at the Gym (I believe
>>he has a reach of at least 10')

>Even Manute would have to have a vertical jump over 36".
>I'm 6'4" and used to (many years and lbs ago) be able to hit my head on the

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


>rim (with a running start) but don't remember getting close to the top of the backboard.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


>I play basketball at lunch and we use an official glass backboard (I measured

>Anyway, I always thought "take a quarter off the top of the backboard and leave


>change" was an exaggeration never meant to be taken seriously. Kinda like "so
>slow you need a calendar to time him" or something.
>-TS

I'm impressed! I'm 6'3" and have thrown down all manner of 2-handed dunks
in practice but I doubt my head was ever any closer than 1 foot from the rim.
Even Mike didn't get that high all that often (though I have seen him duck!)

Anyway 6'4" + 36 inches = 9'4" - still 8 inches to go?
Are you sure you ran into the rim? :)

Yours in homage,
Ian Wood

he huang

unread,
Jul 29, 1994, 12:08:05 AM7/29/94
to

I posted yesterday that Scott Williams was to sign a contract with the
sixers and I thought it was a good move for the sixers. Now it turns
out SW will be making 20 mil in 7 years (I assume it's guaranteed
money?) I don't know what's in Sixers management's mind. We already
had DC deal and LJ deal, and now this. I wonder what will happen
next, GR will really sign 100mil contract?

Geesh. Apparently some managements out there want to take advantage
of the current situation that new labor agreement is being negotiated
and new salary cap is yet to be determined. But the more teams
signing unreasonably huge contract like this, the more these teams are
eager to increase the cap. In the end this puts the owners side at a
very disadvantageous situation on the bargaining table. (not that i
favor either side)

I predict Phoenix will sign Danny Manning for 70 mil in 20 years.

Harry

M. Sarowitz

unread,
Jul 29, 1994, 3:47:34 AM7/29/94
to
hh...@ellis.uchicago.edu (he huang) writes:

>I posted yesterday that Scott Williams was to sign a contract with the
>sixers and I thought it was a good move for the sixers. Now it turns
>out SW will be making 20 mil in 7 years (I assume it's guaranteed
>money?) I don't know what's in Sixers management's mind. We already
>had DC deal and LJ deal, and now this. I wonder what will happen
>next, GR will really sign 100mil contract?

Signing Williams to a long term deal seems to me like an excellent deal
for the Sixers. With some discipline he could turn into the next
Charles Oakley.

As far as money goes, it's not that much. And these guys deserve everything
they're getting. They're superstars, you know.

-Mark


Scott Lee Sing

unread,
Jul 28, 1994, 1:46:38 PM7/28/94
to

I dunno. Ask Brian Grant. Seemed to work for him.

Jazzy J


--
Jazzy J Systems Engineer Seaboard Corporation
Overland Park, KS (O) (913) 676-8962 (H) (913) 381-3173
"Desperate times mean desperate measures, and Jim Petersen was the solution..."
- ESPN special on 1986 NBA Finals, after Ralph Sampson was ejected for fighting

Owen O'Malley

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Jul 29, 1994, 10:11:57 AM7/29/94
to
In article <31ac6m$1d...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu> saro...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu (M. Sarowitz) writes:
>From: saro...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu (M. Sarowitz)
>Subject: Re: 7 years/20 millions for Scott Williams?
>Date: 29 Jul 1994 02:47:34 -0500

>hh...@ellis.uchicago.edu (he huang) writes:

>>I posted yesterday that Scott Williams was to sign a contract with the
>>sixers and I thought it was a good move for the sixers. Now it turns
>>out SW will be making 20 mil in 7 years (I assume it's guaranteed
>>money?) I don't know what's in Sixers management's mind. We already
>>had DC deal and LJ deal, and now this. I wonder what will happen
>>next, GR will really sign 100mil contract?

>Signing Williams to a long term deal seems to me like an excellent deal
>for the Sixers. With some discipline he could turn into the next
>Charles Oakley.

Signing Scott Williams was a good move in improving the ballclub. However,
he doesn't deserve the contract he received.

>As far as money goes, it's not that much. And these guys deserve
everything>they're getting. They're superstars, you know.

Hey Mark, you forgot to insert your smiley face. Well, I suppose you're
right, backup players do deserve $3 million a season.

Owen


>-Mark


Barry Glynn

unread,
Jul 29, 1994, 11:44:39 AM7/29/94
to
In article <1994Jul25.0...@bnr.ca> to...@bnr.co.uk (Tom Watson) writes:
>
>I would conclude that people who claim to have seen others reach the top of
>the backboard are talking urban folklore. I believe that nobody is both
>tall enough and athletic enough to do this.
>

how about you send me your address and once the seattle times starts running
a particular ad they ran last year i'll send it to you.

the ad shows shawn kemp grabbing a rebound, his eyes are level with the
rim, his extended arm grabbing the ball with his hand bend around the ball
is at the top of the backboard. granted i've seen some camera angles in the
past that have made things appear more radical than they are but his head
is above the rim and from the angle of the photo it is not deceptive.
now consider a 6'10" person extending their arm above their head, while
their head is already several inches above the rim.

Thomas Soerens

unread,
Jul 29, 1994, 10:53:30 AM7/29/94
to
wo...@s1.elec.uq.oz.au (Ian Wood) writes:

>epas...@skywarrior.ecn.uoknor.edu (Thomas Soerens) writes:

>>crw...@MFS01.cc.monash.edu.au (Cameron Walker) writes:
>>>>the backboard are talking urban folklore. I believe that nobody is both
>>>>tall enough and athletic enough to do this.

>>> Maybe if Manute Bol put some serious time in at the Gym (I believe
>>>he has a reach of at least 10')

>>Even Manute would have to have a vertical jump over 36".
>>I'm 6'4" and used to (many years and lbs ago) be able to hit my head on the
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I was a mediocre high jumper (~6'8") - could jump high but a total klutz
getting over the bar. I could hit my head on the rim -- or pretty close, the
only time I actually did hit my head was when I dunked and scraped my head
on the bottom of the rim, maybe with a little pull on the rim. I have hit
my elbow which is just a few inches above my head when reaching up, and I
could put a piece of tape quite a ways above the top of the square (which
is 16" above the rim) on the backboard. Anyway, what I was going to say
that I could do it with a high-jump type of approach. I couldn't get
anywhere close from a standing or 1-step jump off of two feet which is
supposed to be the definition of "vertical jump". Matter of fact, I could
barely dunk that way. Now I weigh 260 lbs and can barely dunk at all.

Speaking of high jumping, if the guy who high jumps 8' has a center of
gravity at 42" (3.5' - probably low), a reach of 8.5' (he's tall), and
raises his center of gravity to 8' when jumping, that means his reach
would be 8.5 + (8-3.5) = 13' : the top of the backboard. Actually if
3.5' c.o.g. is low and his form is good enough that he jumps higher than
his c.o.g., even he can't touch the top of the backboard.

-TS

M. Sarowitz

unread,
Jul 29, 1994, 4:20:43 PM7/29/94
to
ow...@library.health.ufl.edu (Owen O'Malley) writes:

>>As far as money goes, it's not that much. And these guys deserve
>everything>they're getting. They're superstars, you know.

> Hey Mark, you forgot to insert your smiley face. Well, I suppose you're
>right, backup players do deserve $3 million a season.

It really pisses me off when folks bitch about how much NBA players get
paid. Everybody in the NBA, from Corey Gains on up, really are superstars.
There are around 300 players in the NBA. Think about how many really
talented and hard-working ball players get stuck at the college level, or
in the CBA. These guys are the cream of the crop. You watch the NBA on NBC,
Miller Genuine Draft pays big dollars to get you to watch their ads, who
deserves those dollars more than the players?

-Mark

David Tomlinson

unread,
Jul 29, 1994, 9:36:38 AM7/29/94
to
M. Sarowitz (saro...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu) wrote:
: hh...@ellis.uchicago.edu (he huang) writes:

Get a grip! :-) We're talking about Scott Williams! He is a big banger
that can score, but he is best suited to coming off of the bench. In
addition, he has physical problems, if he starts for the 76ers, it
will be because the team has serious problems. Some superstar!

DCT
--
=David Tomlinson <dtom...@netcom.com>=
"By day fantastic birds flew through the petrified forest, and jeweled
crocodiles glittered like heraldic salamanders on the banks of the
crystalline river. By night the illuminated man raced among the trees,
his arms like golden cartwheels, his head like a spectral crown...."

Josh Stern

unread,
Jul 29, 1994, 12:19:27 PM7/29/94
to
Owen O'Malley <ow...@library.health.ufl.edu> wrote:
> saro...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu (M. Sarowitz) writes:

>>Signing Williams to a long term deal seems to me like an excellent deal
>>for the Sixers. With some discipline he could turn into the next
>>Charles Oakley.

> Signing Scott Williams was a good move in improving the ballclub. However,
>he doesn't deserve the contract he received.

What do you mean by "deserve"? Let's assume that the contract Williams
signed was basically what it took for the Sixers to get him. Are you
saying that it was a bad move strategically for the franchise? Or
are you saying something like this: if we compare a theoretical
ranking of the performance value of various NBA players in one column vs.
NBA salaries in a second column, then the ranking of Williams salary
would be higher than his performance ranking? It seems to me that
because of salary inflation the latter claim will probably be true of
most players signing new contracts in any given year. If we think
about salary levels as rising about 20-30% per year, then Williams'
21 million for 7 years is probably about right.

>>As far as money goes, it's not that much. And these guys deserve
>everything>they're getting. They're superstars, you know.

> Hey Mark, you forgot to insert your smiley face. Well, I suppose you're
>right, backup players do deserve $3 million a season.

As I mentioned in another post, since he will be the primary backup
at both PF and C, he will probably play 25-32 mins/G. Williams
is definitely not a superstar, but it's also clear that he has
potential. Last year he played mainly as a backup for Ho Grant
and logged about 1/4 of the minutes that Grant did. It's generally
acknowledged that he had a disappointing year, due to injuries and
attitude problems. But since he was backing up Grant, it's both
fair and instructive to compare the 48min stats for the two.

Player Min Pts Tnd/48 TC EJ FF PF PTS/48

grant,horace 2570 1057 27.90 0 0 0 164 19.74
williams,scott 638 289 20.74 2 0 0 112 21.74

Player AS/48 ST/48 TO/48 BK/48 OR/48 TR/48

grant,horace 4.4 1.4 2.0 1.6 5.7 14.4
williams,scott 2.9 1.2 3.3 1.6 5.2 13.6


Grant was clearly the better player - and these stats don't
reflect Grant's special ability to help out in low post defense -
but it's also clear that even in an off year, the younger and
less experienced Williams shows great potential and isn't
embarrassed in a fair comparison with an all-star PF.

- Josh

David A Crotty

unread,
Jul 30, 1994, 10:53:57 AM7/30/94
to
In article <31ac6m$1d...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu>,

M. Sarowitz <saro...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu> wrote:
>hh...@ellis.uchicago.edu (he huang) writes:
>

>
>Signing Williams to a long term deal seems to me like an excellent deal
>for the Sixers. With some discipline he could turn into the next
>Charles Oakley.
>

Yeah, all he needs is 10 more rebounds a game, a jump shot (or any kind
of offensive move whatsoever), a new body and a new attitude. Whiny
WIlliams isn't even in the same galaxy as the Oak Man.
And what's the wisdom of signing a player with chronic shoulder problems
to a long term deal?


dave


John

unread,
Jul 31, 1994, 2:12:45 AM7/31/94
to
My All-Excitement Team:

Kemp, Nique, Shaq (even though I think he is VERY overrated), Jordan
(obviously), and hmm.....John Starks (I don't like him much either :)

-John

Owen P. O'Malley

unread,
Jul 31, 1994, 10:49:58 AM7/31/94
to
In article <31boar$2h...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu> saro...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu (M. Sarowitz) writes:
>From: saro...@blue.weeg.uiowa.edu (M. Sarowitz)
>Subject: Re: 7 years/20 millions for Scott Williams?
>Date: 29 Jul 1994 15:20:43 -0500


Just because a player makes a N.B.A. roster doesn't constitute calling him
a superstar.


>-Mark


///
/////
/////\\\\\
////\\\\\\\\\
///\\\\\\\\\\\
sig under construction....
watch out for falling debris..........?

RPM

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Aug 2, 1994, 8:11:00 PM8/2/94
to
In article <31mjn4$6...@pegasus.cc.ucf.edu>, ec5...@pegasus.cc.ucf.edu (Who is John Galt?) writes...
>John (jo...@user1.IS.NET) wrote:
>: My All-Excitement Team:

>
>: Kemp, Nique, Shaq (even though I think he is VERY overrated), Jordan
>: (obviously), and hmm.....John Starks (I don't like him much either :)
>
>How overrated is Shaq?
>
>Only once before in NBA history has anyone been in the Top 6 in 4 NBA
>Stat categories before. No one has ever done it twice! Even so, I have
>Magic season tickets and watch every game. While I like Shaq, I think
>Penny is a much more _exciting_ player to watch.


who was the first? I'm wondering if Hakeem was it, but I'm not sure...
Jazzy?

Who is John Galt?

unread,
Aug 2, 1994, 7:09:24 PM8/2/94
to
John (jo...@user1.IS.NET) wrote:
: My All-Excitement Team:

: Kemp, Nique, Shaq (even though I think he is VERY overrated), Jordan
: (obviously), and hmm.....John Starks (I don't like him much either :)

How overrated is Shaq?

Dave Meeks

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Aug 5, 1994, 12:15:09 PM8/5/94
to


Well, first... unfortunately, John is very wrong... As for others who have
done it...

Wilt Chamberlain - 63-64 #1 scoring, #2FG%, #2 rebounds, #5 assists
66-67 #3 scoring, #1FG%, #1 rebounds, #3 assists
67-68 #3 scoring, #1FG%, #1 rebounds, #1 assists
NOTE - this was before steals and blocked shots were kept...

Oscar Robertson - 66-67 #2 scoring, #4FG%, #4FT%, #2 assists
67-68 #6 scoring, #6FG%, #1FT%, #3 assists
NOTE - this was before steals and blocked shots were kept...

Kareem - 73-74 #3 scoring, #2FG%, #4 rebounds, #2 blocked shots
74-75 #2 scoring, #4FG%, #5 rebounds, #1 blocked shots
many other times as well...

Bob McAdoo - 73-74 #1 scoring, #1FG%, #3 rebounds, #3 blocked shots
74-75 #1 scoring, #5FG%, #4 rebounds, #6 blocked shots

Rick Barry - 74-75 #2 scoring, #1FT%, #6 assists, #1 steals
other times as well...

As well as many others also...
And many others...
--
David T. Meeks || "There's a lot of Big Talkers
Software Engineer || But no one's really speaking up
VMark Software, Inc. || There's too many Star Trekkers
da...@vmark.com || That are boldly going to the same old stars..."

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