Biopsy question
bas...@my-dejanews.com
this
to please tell me what they did before I go in what they did during and how
they felt after. Was there any pain?
Piter
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dlc...@my-dejanews.com
heikki_ko...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> In article <6oo1gj$vfb$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
> of prostate size, not cancer. Most men who have elevated PSA blood tests do
> not have prostate cancer. Nevertheless, doctors refer most men with elevated
> PSA blood tests to urologists who insert a needle through the colon into the
> prostate and clip out a small piece to be analyzed for cancer. Recent reports
> show that this causes caner cells to spread through the blood stream (1) and
> usually causes a prostate infection that requires antibiotics.
(snip)
Where is the reference info for this (1) reference? I think you've spread a
tad of disinformation here as this has not been shown to be fact to my
knowledge...
Infectious complications from TRUS/biopsy for evaluation of an elevated PSA
are rare...maybe 1-2% occurrence...certainly not USUAL.
Best of luck.
David L. Casey, MD
Denton Urology
Denton, Texas USA
http://www.wp.com/dlcasey/urology/homeuro.htm
This communication is intended to provide general information, and in no way
is a substitute for face-to-face medical care. No implication of a
doctor-patient relationship should be assumed by the reader.
Sorry, but no questions or requests answered by private email.
dsho...@my-dejanews.com
website, but I can say that almost everything stated in this post is either
an exaggeration, a distortion or flat out wrong. There have been factual
errors in previous posts from the Mirkin site, but none as significant as
these. None of the points made with quoted references are actually supported
by the papers that they quote on the website.
(1) Shows that PC cells are transiently detectable by RT-PCR in the
bloodstream after biopsy, but the overwhelming preponderance of evidence is
that TRUS biopsy does not cause actual metastasis
(2) Testosterone level as a predictor of response to hormone therapy after
failed radiation. Says NOTHING about who should be treated in men with
prostate cancer.
(3) Statistically more aggressive cancers have a low free:total PSA ratio.
Lots of men die from metastatic prostate cancer whose intial ratio was
higher. There is no evidence that men with a high ratio can safely be left
untreated.
(4) The relationship between prostate cancer size and metastitic potential has
been known for decades. Large cancers start out as small ones.
Other errors:
In article <6osr85$uem$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
heikki_ko...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
>PSA is a measure of prostate size, not cancer.
Wrong. It is a measure of size, malignancy and inflammation (elevated in
prostatitis).
>Nevertheless, doctors refer most men with elevated
> PSA blood tests to urologists who insert a needle through the colon into the
> prostate and clip out a small piece to be analyzed for cancer.
Wrong. Through the rectum not the colon and several cores are collected
>Recent reports
> show that this causes caner cells to spread through the blood stream (1) and
> usually causes a prostate infection that requires antibiotics.
Incidence of infection after biopsy is about 1-4%.
>If they
> live long enough, most men will develop prostate cancer.
Not true of clinical prostate cancer (true for microscopic cancer found at
autopsy).
> Of men with prostate
> cancer, most will die with it, not from it.
Not true for men < age 80 who are candidates for curative therapy. The
leading cause of death for men with prostate cancer who have been enrolled in
"watchful waiting" studies who would have otherwise been candidates for
curative therapy die OF prostate cancer.
Again, these are the classic type of errors that are made when people select
out individual abstracts from a medline search without actually reading the
paper or putting it into the context of the other published literature which
may refute it. I have read through most of the prostate related essays in the
Mirkin site and every one that I have seen draws unsupported or erroneous
conclusions for this reason.
I really don't want to get into a discussion about prostate cancer in this
newsgroup, but I really felt I had to respond to this (probably my post would
have been deleted if this were a moderated group <g>!).
Daniel Shoskes MD
UCLA
http://www.ben2.ucla.edu/~dshoskes
Institute for Male Urology
http://www.urol.com
dlc...@my-dejanews.com
heikki_ko...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> In article <6ot4lp$900$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
> dlc...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> > In article <6osr85$uem$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
> > heikki_ko...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> > > bas...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> > > > I have to go for a prostate biopsy. I wanted someone that has been
> through
> > > > this
> > > > to please tell me what they did before I go in what they did during and
> how
> > > > they felt after. Was there any pain?
> > > > Piter
> > > >
> > > > http://www.dejanews.com/rg_mkgrp.xp Create Your Own Free Member Forum
> > > >
> > >
measure
> > > of prostate size, not cancer. Most men who have elevated PSA blood tests
do
elevated
> > > PSA blood tests to urologists who insert a needle through the colon into
the
> reports
> > > show that this causes caner cells to spread through the blood stream (1)
and
> > > usually causes a prostate infection that requires antibiotics.
> >
> >
> > Where is the reference info for this (1) reference? I think you've spread a
> > tad of disinformation here as this has not been shown to be fact to my
> > knowledge...
> >
> > Infectious complications from TRUS/biopsy for evaluation of an elevated PSA
> > are rare...maybe 1-2% occurrence...certainly not USUAL.
> >
> > Best of luck.
> >
> > David L. Casey, MD
> > Denton Urology
> > Denton, Texas USA
> > http://www.wp.com/dlcasey/urology/homeuro.htm
> >
> > This communication is intended to provide general information, and in no way
> > is a substitute for face-to-face medical care. No implication of a
> > doctor-patient relationship should be assumed by the reader.
> >
> > Sorry, but no questions or requests answered by private email.
> >
> > http://www.dejanews.com/rg_mkgrp.xp Create Your Own Free Member Forum
> >
>
>
> 1) JG Moreno, SM Ohara, JP Long, RW Veltri, XX Ning, AA Alexander, LG
> Gomella. Transrectal ultrasound-guided biopsy causes hematogenous
> dissemination of prostate cells as determined by RT-PCR. Urology 49: 4 (APR
> 1997):515-520. Address DW Ebling, Hosp Univ Penn, Dept Radiat Oncol, 3400
> Spruce St, 2 Donner, Philadelphia, PA 19104 USA.
>
> Or you could just click-on the given URL, which I believe was:
> http://www.wdn.com/mirkin/7112.html to get all the references mentioned in
> said Mirkin article.
>
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>
RT-PCR detects messenger RNA that codes for PSA production...meaning it could
be benign prostatic cells in the circulation just as likely as cancer cells.
This modality has proved pretty useless for prostate cancer staging. Just
because cells are in the circulation does not mean metastases in any
event...I think Dr. Mirkin has stretched a little in his interpretation of
this study...
Best of luck.
David L. Casey, MD
Denton Urology
Denton, Texas USA
http://www.wp.com/dlcasey/urology/homeuro.htm
This communication is intended to provide general information, and in no way
is a substitute for face-to-face medical care. No implication of a
doctor-patient relationship should be assumed by the reader.
Sorry, but no questions or requests answered by private email.
-----== Posted via Deja News, The Leader in Internet Discussion ==-----