Electronic Stamp Auction
Jack Wan
Jack Wan
I was wondering why no one is doing Stamp Auction online here at the
internet. There is card auction going on every day of the week. I just
want to know if this group is interested, what are the areas of
interest? Will that be mostly US or US/BR/FOR mixed.
Kaleb KEITHLEY
What they're doing in rec.collecting.cards has absolutely no bearing
on what's happening here. But I digress. If you want to try an on-line
auction, give it a try and see what happens.
--
Kaleb KEITHLEY
Eric Balkan
I'd be interested. How would it work?
- Eric
eba...@ppbbs.clark.net
Eric Balkan eba...@ppbbs.clark.net
Packet Press BBS 301-294-756
Alan Anderson
Scott Catalog Value for NH is $400. Will sell to highest bidder by July 1, 1994
Just place your bids right here (I hope this works) this is a really nice stamp
I'd hate to give it away !
Good Luck
Alan Anderson
P.S. If it works, I hope You'all won't mind if I auction off some more stuff!
Choy Heng-Wah
>
>I'll try one right here - LOT #1 Scott #477 Italy 100 Lire - VF NH Condition
>Scott Catalog Value for NH is $400. Will sell to highest bidder by July 1, 1994
>Just place your bids right here (I hope this works) this is a really nice stamp
>I'd hate to give it away !
I'd love to bid but I don't collect Italy, perhaps next time. But you
need to explain your rules here. What price would the winning bidder
pay? Normally in a mail ("non-floor"?) auction, the highest bidder only
pay one-step above the 2nd highest bidder's bid, as opposed to paying
what he actually bids. The "bid" is the highest that the bidder is
willing to pay for.
Also I don't think it'll be appropriate (eps if the response is good) to
have people posting bids to this group, it'll be better to have them
mail your their bids. Another thing is that not everyone uses Scott (I
used SG Part 1) so perhaps a more complete description including
country, year, denomination, colour and condition would be useful.
Choy Heng-Wah
Network Integration Services
Digital Equipment Corp (Asia Pacific)
Internet: hwc...@zpovc.enet.dec.com
Timezone: GMT+08:00
Carl Christensen
>In article <Z02xAiN.a...@delphi.com>, Alan Anderson <ander...@delphi.com> writes:
>>I'll try one right here - LOT #1 Scott #477 Italy 100 Lire - VF NH Condition
>>Scott Catalog Value for NH is $400. Will sell to highest bidder by July 1, 1994
>>Just place your bids right here (I hope this works) this is a really nice stamp
>>I'd hate to give it away !
>
>I'd love to bid but I don't collect Italy, perhaps next time. But you
>need to explain your rules here. What price would the winning bidder
>pay? Normally in a mail ("non-floor"?) auction, the highest bidder only
>pay one-step above the 2nd highest bidder's bid, as opposed to paying
>what he actually bids. The "bid" is the highest that the bidder is
>willing to pay for.
>
>Also I don't think it'll be appropriate (eps if the response is good) to
>have people posting bids to this group, it'll be better to have them
>mail your their bids. Another thing is that not everyone uses Scott (I
>used SG Part 1) so perhaps a more complete description including
>country, year, denomination, colour and condition would be useful.
The only thing that worries me about a lot of buying in this group
is that all the "for.sale" groups usually erupt in flame wars.
Given the nature of stamp collectors (condition can "change"
depending on who's looking at it) I can see that happening here.
We'll have to really be careful in describing, and describe the
item fully.
For expensive items, I guess a scan could be used. Most places
will scan something for a few bucks, so at least you can see
centering and color. I'm not sure if you can scan the gum side
and pick out any defects, hinge marks, etc easily. Has anyone
tried that?
Probably the best thing would be to E-mail bids to the seller by
a certain date and time. If bids are in the form of posts, then
it becomes like a "bid board" and I think it would mess up the group --
we'd have maybe 15 posts in a thread of bids, and there's always a
bunch of posts that end up elsewhere that are bids so it would make
going around r.c.s. a pain. I say go with an E-mail bid system, where
the winning bid is one advance over the 2nd highest bid. Or, if
people don't trust the seller, we'll just have to stick to the
highest bid wins at the highest bid price.
----
Carl M. Christensen Fox Chase Cancer Center
Senior Systems Analyst Department of Biostatistics
C_Chri...@fccc.edu Philadelphia, PA 19111
Choy Heng-Wah
>we'd have maybe 15 posts in a thread of bids, and there's always a
>bunch of posts that end up elsewhere that are bids so it would make
>going around r.c.s. a pain. I say go with an E-mail bid system, where
>the winning bid is one advance over the 2nd highest bid. Or, if
>people don't trust the seller, we'll just have to stick to the
>highest bid wins at the highest bid price.
Good point, we'll also have people flaming when they loose because the
seller's site lost some posts and never received some of the bids. I too
agree that bid-by-Email would be best, but would still vote for the "one
advance over the 2nd highest bid", since this is common practice, and
even if the seller is dishonest we'll at worst end up with the "highest
bid wins at the highest bid price."
What would be really nice would be a "bid-broker" software. It might
work something like this:
1. Interested bidders register their email address with the BidBroker.
2. A seller sends his description, reserve price, cut-off-date, etc to
the BidBroker.
3. The BidBroker assigns a lot number to the description, and forwards
it to the list of registered bidders.
4. On the cut-off-date, the BidBroker determines the winning bidder and
the winning price (realisation) and forwards this info to the seller
and the winning bidder. The seller and winning bidder communicate
directly to complete the transaction. The realisation price is
forwarded to all bidders who put in a bid.
To pay for the upkeep of such a system, the seller (and possibly the
purchaser) pays the operator/owner of the system a "commission" based on
percentage of realisation, or perhaps a flat handling charge per lot.
Perhaps someone like AOL might provide this as a service.
Jon O. Johnson
stamp bid boards. Seller describes lot, specifies minimum bit. Bidders
email bids. Seller posts follow up next day with name of highest bidder
and what they bid. Any day when there is no new bids, seller marks lot as
'going once', when there are two consecutive days with out any action on a
lot, seller posts 'going twice'. If no bids follow after than mark lot
sold. So if no one bid your reserve price, in three days, that lot would
be sold back to you sorta. Sellers should probably also specify minimum
increments (0.50) - ties on a given day go to the first Email, what form
of payment is accepted (there are more posters on this news group from
outside the US than on the baseball card newsgroup) -- some people have
no access to internet over weekends, so maybe weekends get lumped into
Friday. Also I wouldn't sell high value stamps here, stamps, unlike
cards, are a thing of beauty, and beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
Jon
joeluft
wa...@mary.iia.org (Jack Wan) writes:
>
> I was wondering why no one is doing Stamp Auction online here at the
> internet. There is card auction going on every day of the week. I just
> want to know if this group is interested, what are the areas of
> interest? Will that be mostly US or US/BR/
I would also be interested in both selling and buying. My interests are
early USA mint and used singles. Please post more details. Please
contact me if I can be of some assistance in setting this up or helping run.
Thanks. Joe
Jack Wan
Thank you so much to respond to my original posting on this subject. My
intention is 1. to find out if there is any interest on this subject.
2. to find out what kind of material some of you are interested.
the response were very good, but except one person who responded with the
#2 question. so i'd like to ask again,
WHAT IS YOUR INTEREST?
I really appreciate the conversation regarding the techniques needed to
conduct the auction. Since this board is not as active as the r.c.c board
i would like to propose that an auction committee should be formed to
compile all the seller's material and description. then we should have an
auction once in a specified interval, ie one or two month. as far as
condition and description concerned, it is a real problem. a stamp's
condition especially centering could make a major difference in price.
all that i can think of is that the seller must provide copies of the
stamp to the interested buyer. even with that, there might be more
hurdles to overcome:
1. settlement- who is responsible to collect money?
2. delinquent- what some one writes a rubber check?
3. forged stamp - how are we going to coordinate expetising
4. large lots - viewing here is not possible.
5. timing - all these copying stuff takes time. when do you close the
sale? suppose one stamp is in demand and several person want copies of it
but one of the buyer is in australia the other is in europe, the mailing
process may take 10 days. is the closing of the entire auction going to
be held up for this lot?
Elliot Omiya
: 1. settlement- who is responsible to collect money?
Should strictly be between seller and successful bidder. It may be advisable
to make sure that the successful top two or three bidders be given to the
seller so that s/he could sell to the 2nd high if the highest bidder could
not be convinced to "settle".
: 2. delinquent- what some one writes a rubber check?
Again, strictly between seller and high successful bidder. Personally, I
probably wouldn't transact in an on-line auction, but if I were seller or
buyer I would probably prefer FedEx COD. The seller is assured of receiving
their money and the buyer doesn't have to pay until the item actually arrives.
The only problem here is cost. $9+COD fee is a lot for small items.
: 3. forged stamp - how are we going to coordinate expetising
This is one of the reasons I wouldn't buy in an on-line auction. There
doesn't seem to be reasonable recourse in case of problems.
: 4. large lots - viewing here is not possible.i
I would suggest that viewing is never possible, no matter what the lot size.
You could send/post scans but I'm really good at Aldus Photostyler and can
do nearly anything to the scan of a stamp to alter/change its appearance.
Again, the issue is one of recourse which is hard to govern.
: 5. timing - all these copying stuff takes time. when do you close the
: sale? suppose one stamp is in demand and several person want copies of it
: but one of the buyer is in australia the other is in europe, the mailing
: process may take 10 days. is the closing of the entire auction going to
: be held up for this lot?
This seems one of the simpler problems. You post a date by which items
for sale must be "submitted". This means a complete description and
perhaps a scan if possible. Once the date is past, an on-line auction
description is posted with an invitation for bids and a published closing
date. Largest bid at end gets the lot at one advance over 2nd high bid.
They do this on Compuserve. They have the advantage, however, of having
online bidding at the end (in an online conference room) and "traceable"
bidders (i.e. their compuserve ID is known and compuserve supposedly
knows who that person is). The Internet, as you may be aware, has
tremendous opportunity for higher levels of anonymity.
Personally, I'm doubtful about this but r.c.c is doing it, so why not
r.c.s? But, for sure, it's going to take the effort of volunteer(s) who
are willing to put in a lot of time/effort to make it work.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Elliot H. Omiya, KC6DAL Borland International Inc. -=<EHO>=-
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alan Anderson
>Also I don't think it'll be appropriate (eps if the response is good) to
>have people posting bids to this group, it'll be better to have them
>mail your their bids. Another thing is that not everyone uses Scott (I
>used SG Part 1) so perhaps a more complete description including
>country, year, denomination, colour and condition would be useful.
Also, bidders can receive the item for 1 bid over the next lower bid.
Increments to be
as follows:
$1-$50 / $2.50 increments
$50- $100 / $5 increments
$100 - $250/$10 increments
over $250 / $25 increments
Sorry, but I dont know Stanley Gibbons number - Since this is an Italian Stamp,
Sassone catalogue number is #565 100 Lire Carmine scuro (color in Italian)
1992 cat price for NH is L775,000 (hinged is only L135,000).
I hope this helps. Regards,
Alan Anderson
Alan Anderson
What you say makes sense. I have posted increments today and will abide by
standard
bidding increments procedure. Also, I hope bidders will reply to me at
Anderson38@
Delphi.com. AS for scanning - My scanner is not hooked up, and I'm not sure
what format could be read by everyone. Also I have an old scanner which is 300
dpi, and I don't think you could see much. Suffice it to say, since I am not
supplyi
g a photo, the winning bidder would be on approval. If anyone wnats a Xerox,
just
send your mailing adress to me @ Ander...@delphi.com. Will send no charge.
Sorry- copying he gum just doesn't work.
Alan Anderson
necessary or a good idea. Many of us are paying for phone connect and this
should be enough. Anyone not dealing in good faith will be found out soon
enough
and would be plastered across the Net before he could blink an eye. People in
the
stamp business know who they can trust- and deals in the $100,000s are
regualrly
done with a handshake. As for proceI would expect bids to be sent by private
mail, but perhaps the results could be posted in
see- perhaps a specail area could
be set up for this by our current gracious system operator. (P.S. As for AOL -
posting these messages. If anyone from AOL is on line reading this - please
explain
why this delay is apparent!
Alan Anderson
>Other Auction rule suggestions. Auctions can be more interactive than
>stamp bid boards. Seller describes lot, specifies minimum bit. Bidders
>email bids. Seller posts follow up next day with name of highest bidder
>and what they bid. Any day when there is no new bids, seller marks lot as
>'going once', when there are two consecutive days with out any action on a
>lot, seller posts 'going twice'. If no bids follow after than mark lot
>sold. So if no one bid your reserve price, in three days, that lot would
>be sold back to you sorta. Sellers should probably also specify minimum
>increments (0.50) - ties on a given day go to the first Email, what form
>of payment is accepted (there are more posters on this news group from
to
highest bidder by July 1 (with no reserve or minimum) -yhis could result in a
great
loss- but I'm trying to get this going. Payment must be in check in US dollars
drawn
on a US bank (can be purchased from most banks around the world).
selling only low value items - sorry - but there's not enough money involved
However a $400 item may be too steep - I will try a $50
item next. However, please note that I have not received a $10 bid yet for the
$400 item- clearly, many people shoud be able to afford $10 - even if they don't
collect Italy. Yes condition is important - as mentioned before, photocopy
avail
on request.
Alan Anderson
Received your comments about guaranttes of payment, etc. Only comment I have
made
is that I have been trading stamps for 15 years, and have been stiffed only once
and then by a dealer who was financailly overextended (came with the market
crash in
early 80's) Unless really large sums are involved, I generally ship in advance
of
payment. Most crooks don't get involved in navigating all of this complicated
computer stuff about stamps. Once again - no one has yet offered even $10 to
"steal"
a $400 stamp. If your'e going to do this - why not at least pay the $10 - and
not
stiff the owner for the agreed price as well. Also, if the winner is not
prepared
to pay, we would always contact the next highest bidder!
Choy Heng-Wah
>>sold. So if no one bid your reserve price, in three days, that lot would
>>be sold back to you sorta. Sellers should probably also specify minimum
>>increments (0.50) - ties on a given day go to the first Email, what form
>
>to
>highest bidder by July 1 (with no reserve or minimum) -yhis could result in a
>great
>loss- but I'm trying to get this going. Payment must be in check in US dollars
>drawn
>on a US bank (can be purchased from most banks around the world).
I think it should be good practice to state a reserve (you can always
say it is $0!) Consider the case where you receive only one bid, how
then do you figure out the price as there will be no next highest bids.
Auction houses I use generally sell you the lot at reserve or one
increment up from reserve if you are the only bidder. I still say you
should put a reasonable reserve, after all we're here to make fair deals
and not daylight robberies nor Christmas giveaways :)
> selling only low value items - sorry - but there's not enough money involved
You might consider selling collections (country or theme) or small lots
comprising low-value items. Sometimes the low-value stuffs are
frustratingly difficult to come by (no one bothers selling them since
they're so "cheap") and way I usually get them it to buy a collection
and pick out what I want, and resell the remainder.
>However a $400 item may be too steep - I will try a $50
>item next. However, please note that I have not received a $10 bid yet for the
>$400 item- clearly, many people shoud be able to afford $10 - even if they don't
>collect Italy. Yes condition is important - as mentioned before, photocopy
I'd agree that $10 would be a real steal for a stamp cat at $400. I'd be
tempted to put in a bid too, except I wouldn't know what to do with a
$400 Italian stamp amongst my King George VI British Empire collection,
and the existent of a market for high-value Italian stamps here in
Singapore is close to none. :( sorry.
However I'd strongly urge you to not get discouraged and continue put up
other goodies to be "stolen". There must be something you have that
others crave.
rgds,
Alan Anderson
Commonwealth or Asia next. There does'nt seem to be too many Europeans on this
group (besides the Dutchman trying to sell his collection),
Anyway - I have three bids so far - highest is $20. Still a Christmas gift!
But, in ggod faith, the highest bidder will get it, and I will not bid on my
own material!
Marek Osinski
>I'll try one right here - LOT #1 Scott #477 Italy 100 Lire - VF NH Condition
>Scott Catalog Value for NH is $400. Will sell to highest bidder by July 1,
>1994 Just place your bids right here (I hope this works) this is a really
>nice stamp I'd hate to give it away !
I looked at Scott 1993, Volume 3, and found that Italy #477 is listed as
$50. I find it hard to believe that the value would change from $50 to
$400 in one year.
Alan wrote today:
>Anyway - I have three bids so far - highest is $20. Still a Christmas gift!
>But, in ggod faith, the highest bidder will get it, and I will not bid on my
>own material!
It's hardly a Christmas gift to pay $20 for a stamp listed in Scott as $50,
Alan.
Marek Osinski
Wayne Santoni
The stamp does list at $400 in the 1994 Scott. This difference between
the newly listed "never hinged" category and the previously listed
"hinged " category is not unusual, and fairly reflects the Italian stamp
market's hunger for NH material.