Jew-Bashing
Robert Arvay
These are not considered fringe radical groups.
They are mainstream.
Excerpted from FoxNews Views 2002-06-17;
Then there's the May 9, 2002, program on "discipline in the family,"
featuring one Jasem Al-Mutawah, an "expert on family matters," who
patiently describes to his viewers where on her body, how severely, with
what weapon, and under what circumstances a man should beat his wife.
(snip)
And, most harrowing of all, perhaps, especially if you have kids of your
own, there is the May 7, 2002 edition of "Muslim Woman Magazine,"
Toddler: Allah's mercy and blessing upon you.
'Amer: What's your name?
Toddler: Basmallah.
'Amer: Basmallah, how old are you?
Toddler: Three and a half.
'Amer: Are you a Muslim?
Toddler: Yes.
'Amer: Basmallah, are you familiar with the Jews?
Toddler: Yes.
'Amer: Do you like them?
Toddler: No.
'Amer: Why don't you like them?
Toddler: Because . . .
'Amer: Because they are what?
Toddler: They're apes and pigs.
'Amer: Because they are apes and pigs. Who said they are so?
Toddler: Our God.
[End Excerpts]
The FoxNews article goes on to describe the depth of racism and misogyny
which has infected the Islamic world to its core.
Can there be any hope of peace while this depravity continues?
Can the Jews ever hope for reconciliation with these people?
God save us all!
--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG
Pat Kohli
Robert Arvay wrote:
> Some samples of Islamic public media in Arab nations.
> These are not considered fringe radical groups.
> They are mainstream.
> Excerpted from FoxNews Views 2002-06-17;
>
> Then there's the May 9, 2002, program on "discipline in the family,"
> featuring one Jasem Al-Mutawah, an "expert on family matters," who
> patiently describes to his viewers where on her body, how severely, with
> what weapon, and under what circumstances a man should beat his wife.
>
> (snip)
>
> And, most harrowing of all, perhaps, especially if you have kids of your
> own, there is the May 7, 2002 edition of "Muslim Woman Magazine,"
>
I was looking for that edition, any edition, even of "Muslim Woman
Magazine". I even looked through this set of links for Muslim women,
and I
couldn't find it.
http://members.tripod.com/~jpeer/islam015.htm
Maybe you can explain where you got this information, Robert? I looked
at
FoxNews, for what it is worth, and didn't see this at 6:41pm EDT and it
was
not there: http://www.foxnews.com/
>
>
> The FoxNews article goes on to describe the depth of racism and misogyny
> which has infected the Islamic world to its core.
> Can there be any hope of peace while this depravity continues?
> Can the Jews ever hope for reconciliation with these people?
Lot's of depravity, done simply by repeating out of context quotes:
http://www.ministriesofchrist.org/Click%20Quick%20Islam1.htm
http://www.ministriesofchrist.org/Click%20Quick%20Islam2.htm
http://www.ministriesofchrist.org/Click%20Quick%20Islam3.htm
http://www.ministriesofchrist.org/Click%20Quick%20Islam4.htm
or repeating some story, w/ color fotos!
http://www.camelraces.com/
Categorizing Muslims as 'unreached'?
http://www.parousiatoday.org/unreached/30-week2.htm
http://www.bethany.com/profiles/p_code2/1815.html
Peaceful thoughts from the Zionist perspective:
THE NATURE OF THE BEAST
By David Basch
The jackal kills sheep becase he is a jackal. The jackal has
nothing personal against the sheep. Nothing the sheep can do, no gift he
can make, no appeasement will make the jackal change his mind about
this. It is the nature of the beast as everyone will recognize. The
jackal is a useful prototype to bear in mind as our attention shifts to
two other kinds of "beasts".
The first "beast" is the Muslim-Arab. In the same way that the
jackal must kill the sheep because he is a jackal, the Muslim-Arab must
attempt to destroy Israel because he is a Muslim-Arab. It is the nature
of the beast. It goes to the essence of what the Muslim-Arab is.
He is the product of his socialization that has given him a value
system and his peculiar sense of right and wrong. To him, it is wrong,
unjust, for a non-Muslim national power, a power ruled by infidels, to
exist within what he regards as the Islamic realm. What is more, his
socialization teaches that it is right and proper to endlessly expand
this Islamic realm into the domain of others, even using military force
if necessary to do so -- a doctrine called Jihad. While Muslim-Arabs
attempt to disguise this pernicious anti-social goal -- the better to
achieve it -- world class experts on Islam, like Professor Bernard Lewis
of the University of Chicago, certify that this martial aspect is indeed
the nature of Jihad.
The Muslim-Arab tends to be more observant of his creed than
persons with a Western orientation. Submerged in their own secular
culture, Westerners can scarcely imagine the mind-set of the
Muslim-Arab, a person that can appear charming, gracious, and generous.
Unfortunately, when this same sweet person answers the imperatives of
his Islamic religion, he can be transformed into a man of simmering hate
and a supporter if not a perpetrator of the terrorism for which Arabs
have by now become justly famous.
While non-Muslims will see the vile terrorist actions of the
Muslim-Arab as the savagery it is, to the Arab this same savagery meets
his definition of being "a good Muslim-Arab". Read the Gazan opinion
polls after each savage attack. Robbery and murder, which everywhere
else would be considered evils, when perpetrated by Muslims against
unsubjugated Israeli infidels are "righteous" acts. In Arab eyes, the
Jews of Israel dare to impose a non-Muslim sovereignty over what
Muslim-Arabs deem the lands of Islam. No historical evidence of two
earlier Jewish commonwealths can change this Arab opinion. Nor can
mountains of opposing historical evidence shake the opinion of the Arabs
of the territories that they are the original Canaanites. The alleged
Islamic lands in question are not just the famous "territories" but all
the lands of the State of Israel.
Since Muslim-Arabs take with deadly seriousness the idea that
Islam must triumph over its rivals, failure to achieve this goal leaves
the Muslim-Arab's life incomplete, moreso, and especially, when that
unachieved triumph concerns infidels in a place as conspicuous as a
standing Israel.
Yes, like the jackal to the sheep, the Muslim-Arab has a murderous
design toward unsubjugated infidels. This is given exquisite expression
in the current designs of the Arabs toward the destruction of the State
of Israel, the religious nature of which goal the Muslim-Arab tries hard
to disguise as some secular matter of historical justice -- the better
to achieve it.
The second of the two "beasts" of interest is the "universalist"
Jew. Like the jackal and the Muslim-Arab, this beast is also programmed
and predictable. He is an animal obsessed with finding brotherhood among
all men in accordance with utopian doctrines of the nature of mankind.
Driven by a desparate need to demonstrate a moral superiority -- he
obviously knows himself as the opposite -- he is programmed to find
traits of brotherhood in others, even if he has to invent the evidence
for it.
Overly righteous to a fault, this is the kind of Jew who would
fight on principle to the death to enable an Adolph Hitler to come to
power by democratic means, against the objections of Jewish
"troublemakers". Only clear history has forced such Jews to take note of
the Nazi horror as the mass behavior of a supposedly enlightened nation
in violation of utopian assumptions about man. But learning this the
hard way, they cannot apply such knowledge to new, prospective cases.
Thus, today, the Jewish universalists find many "good" Muslim-Arabs that
do not wish to destroy Israel. That is what the "nice Arabs" tell them
to their face as they support Arab terror behind the scenes. It is to
such persons that the universalists want to surrender to demonstrate
their nobility, to show those "nice" savages and the world that there
are indeed good, high-minded, righteous Jews like themselves, the
universalists.
Not peculiarly -- since it is probably of the essence of his
flawed, corrupted character -- though the universalist Jew is blind to
the savagery of the Arab strangers who want to kill him and his people,
he remains finely tuned to detecting "the evil ones" of his own people
who would guard the Jewish community against the savages this liberal
Jew has adopted as his brothers in humanity. Uncovering the reality of
the Arab threat and his savage capabilities would shatter the emotional
balance and world view of the universalist. (Peres has not discovered it
yet even at this late date.) Hence, he strives mightly to prevent
himself from learning of this reality. It is the nature of this beast.
It is instructive to recognize the role of the two aforementioned
"beasts" in making the Oslo process possible:
The Muslim-Arab has seen in the universalist Jews allies, par
excellence, in fulfilling his heart's desire to destroy Israel. All the
Muslim-Arab needed to do was to speak in a language of idealism resonant
to the ears of this kind of Jew. In the process that emerged, the
universalist Jew saw a means to gratify his neurotic need to pose as a
moral giant in creating a new utopian Middle East. He was willing on
behalf of his illusions to trade to the Arabs the strategic positions
Israel had been using to hold her enemies at bay for an illusion of
peace. Like a sheep opening the gate to the jackal, the universalist Jew
agreed to hopelessly weaken his nation in the name of his utopian dream
of mankind in an illusion of a peace that jackals cannot deliver.
The psychic rewards to the universalist Jew of actualizing his
imagined ideals must not be underestimated. It is probably as great as
the reward the Arab imagines to be gained from Muslim-Arab triumph. That
is why such universalist Jews are virtually impervious to recognizing
reality, unless forced by an Arab knife against his own neck, if then.
Shimon Peres has not recognized this to this day after the tragic murder
of almost 300 Jews.
The universalist Jew surrenders to his enemy because he is the
sick universalist beast he is. The Jews of Israel who trust the
governance of their land to persons of this ilk, as they did four years
ago when they elected the Labor Party to office, sell out their own
future. To do so, they threw out of office the Likud Shamir government
that had given the nation unprecedented levels of security, gone today.
No doubt, a Western media creates confusion by carefully painting
a false picture of events in support of the Jewish universalists who
champion the foreign policy of others -- not Israel's. Haven't the Jews
of Israel wised up to the fact that this media is "free" to do the
bidding of the foreign policy establishment it serves, establishments
quite willing to take gambles with Israel's future for the sake of oil.
If there were really an Arab peace partner at the other side of the
negotiation table, would it be necessary for a CIA infiltrated press
corps and the falsifications, distortions, and omissions that
characterize "news" coverage to obscure the nature of the Muslim-Arab
and his ominous goals?
It is time for Israelis and their government to wake up. The
Muslim-Arab has designs on Israel because he is Muslim-Arab, not because
of a few dunams of sand in the territories of Judea and Samaria that he
calls the "West Bank" that he says he wants. He had those territories
prior to 1967, including Jerusalem. When enough Israelis are brought to
the recognition of the enduring nature of the Muslim-Arab enemy, they
will see that appeasing the belligerant Arab "no-people", a
pseudo-people invented to sow moral confusion among the leftists,
facilitating Israeli surrender, cannot bring peace. It will only bring
the front lines of the enemy forward, to Israel's disadvantage.
The idea that Israel must leave herself open to the mercy of
murderers is as irrational as leaving the sheep pen open to the jackal.
What is more, guarding the sheep from the jackal offers the pattern for
guarding Israel against the ravages of the Muslim-Arabs.
When this understanding becomes common currency, I have no doubt
that Israelis will find the means to counter the dangerous Arab forces
arrayed against them -- forces that will only become ever more ominous
to the extent that the raging furnace of Arab demands are vainly
gratified.
http://www.yahoodi.com/peace/automorphism.html
This is the real American Muslim perspective, not the hate-mongering
that suits your expectation, and feeds Zionism.
http://www.fas.org/irp/congress/1995_cr/h950329-terror.htm
Randy Burns
news:7aae11037fdc64a43db...@mygate.mailgate.org...
> The FoxNews article goes on to describe the depth of racism and misogyny
> which has infected the Islamic world to its core.
> Can there be any hope of peace while this depravity continues?
> Can the Jews ever hope for reconciliation with these people?
What's interesting about these problems is that they are late developments
in the history of Islam, basically only coming about as a type of
retaliation and resistance to Western European development. What's funny is
that Christian fundamentalists also have had the same reaction in relation
to the place of women in society and to race.
In other words there are great similiarities between fundamentalist Muslims,
Jews and Christians in terms of their interaction with the modern world,
almost as if they were of the same religion and belief!
Cheers, Randy
Dermod Ryder
"Randy Burns" <randy....@gte.net> wrote in message
news:uJuP8.57641$uX3....@nwrddc01.gnilink.net...
> Robert Arvay <rober...@msn.com> wrote in message
> news:7aae11037fdc64a43db...@mygate.mailgate.org...
> > The FoxNews article goes on to describe the depth of racism and
misogyny
> > which has infected the Islamic world to its core.
> > Can there be any hope of peace while this depravity continues?
> > Can the Jews ever hope for reconciliation with these people?
>
> What's interesting about these problems is that they are late
developments
> in the history of Islam, basically only coming about as a type of
> retaliation and resistance to Western European development. What's
funny is
> that Christian fundamentalists also have had the same reaction in
relation
> to the place of women in society and to race.
>
> In other words there are great similiarities between fundamentalist
Muslims,
> Jews and Christians in terms of their interaction with the modern
world,
> almost as if they were of the same religion and belief!
But they all are, Randy - adherents of the faith of
self-righteousness, the self appointed and anointed elect and elite,
of bigotry, intolerance and an inspired belief that nobody possesses
truth the way they possess truth.
Dermod.
> > God save us all!
Said Tiny Tim, mistakenly believing he was to be the stuffing for that
huge turkey that a born again Scrooge had bought!
Robert Arvay
"Randy Burns" <randy....@gte.net> wrote in message news:<uJuP8.57641$uX3....@nwrddc01.gnilink.net>...
> Robert Arvay <rober...@msn.com> wrote in message
> news:7aae11037fdc64a43db...@mygate.mailgate.org...
> > The FoxNews article goes on to describe the depth of racism and misogyny
> > which has infected the Islamic world to its core.
> > Can there be any hope of peace while this depravity continues?
> > Can the Jews ever hope for reconciliation with these people?
> What's interesting about these problems is that they are late developments
> in the history of Islam,
Really? The Koran does not say that Jews are apes and pigs? Women
are only recently chattel?
> basically only coming about as a type of
> retaliation and resistance to Western European development.
Here we go again. Everything bad--- everything--- is the fault of
Western Civ.
> What's funny is
> that Christian fundamentalists also have had the same reaction in relation
> to the place of women in society and to race.
And so has every other category of sinners. But the point here is
that you have, juxtaposed, two societies in violent conflict--- Israel
and Palestine--- and it's the Israelis who are being told that, if
ONLY they would make one more concession in return for another promise
in a long line of broken promises from the PA, that the Palestinians
would live peacefully with the Israelis. No, they won't. The PA will
never be satisfied until every Jew is dead, preferably in some
horrible way.
> In other words there are great similiarities between fundamentalist Muslims,
> Jews and Christians in terms of their interaction with the modern world,
> almost as if they were of the same religion and belief!
There are great similarities between Muslim, Jew, Christian, and
Secularist fanatics. At least to those who would paint with a broad
brush.
Truly, though, Fundamentalist Christians have not been good stewards
of God's word, myself worst of all. And we must never lose sight of
the fact--- as we so often have--- that God loves every Muslim, Jew,
Baha'i, atheist etc etc with infinite love and yearning. And that we
are commanded to "love one another."
As the End Times seem to be approaching at an accelerating rate, it
behooves us all to recognize the intractable depths of hatred which
fester in the hearts of men--- the flames of which are being fanned in
the madrassas and in the examples cited in my preveious post--- and to
try through prayer and action, to bring the world God's message of
love.
May it begin with me!
Randy Burns
news:457ff776.02061...@posting.google.com...
> And so has every other category of sinners. But the point here is
> that you have, juxtaposed, two societies in violent conflict--- Israel
> and Palestine--- and it's the Israelis who are being told that, if
> ONLY they would make one more concession in return for another promise
> in a long line of broken promises from the PA, that the Palestinians
> would live peacefully with the Israelis. No, they won't. The PA will
> never be satisfied until every Jew is dead, preferably in some
> horrible way.
The solution to this problem becomes obvious when posed this way! (Kill them
before they kill us). A typical Christian solution.
Cheers, Randy
Robert Arvay
Muslim bashing (or Arab bashing) is every bit as poisonous as
Jew-bashing, Fundamentalist Christian bashing, gay bashing and on and
on.
And undoubtedly there is too much of it within every large group.
But the items I presented were an order of magnitude beyond that.
What is now happening in the Arab world is much like the venomous and
murderous Jew-hating that expressed itself in the Nazi death camps of
the 1933-45 era. It is the pervasiveness, the intensity, and the
state sponsorship of anti-Jewishness that is producing the
suicide/homicide bombers.
I am sure you have seen the TV news documentaries about the
madrassas--- small Muslim schools where young boys are taught hatred.
Undoubtedly you have read the Western news accounts--- of Arab press
reports--- that Jews drink the blood of Arab children. These press
reports could never be printed without the approval of the dictatorial
Arab states in which they are published (and where there is no freedom
of the press). And no doubt you are aware of the rampant belief among
many Palestinians and Arabs that no Jews died at the WTC--- because
they supposedly planned and carried out the atrocity, and stayed home
from work that day.
Despite all that, a great many Arabs come to the USA and mingle
without rancor in our multi-ethnic and multi-religious society. Only
a small minority of them have hostilities toward their Jewish
neighbors. But most of them are afraid to speak out, because the
fanatics among them are murderous to the point of suicide.
Indeed, many Palestinians are in the West because at home their
moderate persuasions would get them killed. Surely you are aware that
in Palestine territory, it is not enough to be lukewarm in favor of
terrorism. Anyone suspected of disloyalty is subject to summary
execution in the streets.
Contrast this to the state of Israel, where despite propaganda to the
contrary, there is respect for everyone's human rights, the rule of
law prevails, Jews are arrested and punished for crimes against
Palestinians (not one Palestinian has been arrested and punished by
the PA for crimes against Jews, except when forced to do so at virtual
gunpoint).
Note: I regret not having cut and pasted the URL, and author, of the
FoxNews item from its Views section. It has been rotated off the
site. However, if you go to the Jewish World Review site, you will
find there the archived writings of many (about 40-50?) nationally
syndicated columnists, many of whom have documented and detailed a
large body of evidence, perhaps including the items I mentioned.
These authors include John Leo, Mort Kondracke, Nat Hentoff, and many
others well respected for their journalistic integrity.
Also, new evidence gets reported every day, it seems, as I'm sure your
alertness will prove me out.
Once again, I am not anti-Arab. I am not aware of any Semitic
heritage in my past. While I regard Islam as a false religion, I do
not doubt the sincerity and humaneness of many of its practitioners.
It's just that I see as absurd the claims that Israel should bare its
throat to the daggers of fanatics who have shown no hesitation to shed
innocent blood in the pursuit of their aims.
To try to put those people on a moral level with Israelis (and
Fundamentalist Christians in general) is simply a diversionary ploy to
remove attention from the obvious--- terrorists are not freedom
fighters. They are murderers.
================
Pat Kohli <kohliCUT...@ameritel.net> wrote in message news:<3D0E74A5...@ameritel.net>...
(snip)
Mr Mahdi
Christians started WWI and WWII where hundreds of millions of people died.
Christian started every major world war in the past 2000 years, which proves
that Christianity produces cold-blooded killers in the name of their religion.
Christianity is the most racially segegrated religion on earth. Sunday, when
church services are held is the most segegrated hour in the world. Even racist
groups like the KKK and other white supremists are themselves Christian
fundamentalists.
In every single Christian country, the overwhelming majority of scientists and
thinkers are atheists, agnostics, etc. Most of them are ex-Christians and
consider the Bible to be a masterpiece of scientific inaccuracy.
The Church used to kill and oppress people who believed in things like the
earth being round. It was the Muslims that evil Christian Europe owed a
gratitude for rescuing these filthy, paganistic heathens from utter ignorance
of the Dark Ages.
Christians started wars like the Crusades and the Inquisition where they forced
non Christians to be Christians. They stole hundreds of millions of Africans
and forced them to be slaves and Christian.
All of the colonial nations were Christian. They stole the land of the people,
subjugated them to second class citizens in their own lands and forced the
inhabitants to embrace the Christian way.
Both South Africa and Israel are apartheid nations. While South Africa has
abolished apartheid, the Zionist nation which has support by the majority of
white Christian fundamentalists is still an apartheid nation.
Christianity has caused more people to become atheists than Communism. The
Bible is regularly being burned and the religion ridiculed, proving that
Christianity has no effect in the lives of those who think.
Christians by far has killed, raped, enslaved and destroyed more people and
nations than other group in the history of mankind combined. This and MANY
other factors prove that Christianity by far is a false, evil religion created
by evil people and have nothing to do with the noble teachings of Jesus (as).
Christianity is really Paulianity and that of evil men.
Christians worship 3 gods and claim that its all one. They call Jesus Lord
when Jesus called God Lord. According to the Bible, Jesus was saved on the
cross by God (this is refuted in the Quran of course; Jesus was never crucified
or killed) but Christians call Jesus and not God the Saviour. Jesus even is
shown praying to God in the Bible but yet Christians worship Jesus and not God.
Jesus (as) was reported to of have said in the Bible that he did not come to
change the Covenant but to fulfil it. These misguided Christians break almost
every law in the Covenant while claiming to of have followed the Prophet Jesus
(as).
Christian fundamentalists like Robert Arvay are the most hypocritical,
oppoturnistic bunch of devils in the planet. They overlook the evil of their
people and religion and yet have the nerve to call Islam "a false religion." I
can easily prove the mistakes and contradictions in the Bible to prove the
Bible is not from God. I can show the fallacies of Christian dogma. I can
show the scientific errors and historical blunders in the Bible to prove that
the book is not from God.
But since when intellectual proof meant to these evil, Christian
fundamentalists?
I want this hypocrite to quote Matthew 10:34 in the Bible to see if Bible
promotes peace. Matthew 10:34 said that Jesus didn't come to bring peace but
the sword. No wonder why Christians have a track record in killing the most
people. They are just following their own Bible.
I suggest that Robert Avray study his own religion before calling Islam as a
false religion.
Mahdi Muhammad
Pat Kohli
Robert Arvay wrote:
> Greetings;
>
> Muslim bashing (or Arab bashing) is every bit as poisonous as
> Jew-bashing, Fundamentalist Christian bashing, gay bashing and on and
> on.
Great! So stop it, then!
(more Muslim bashing snipped)
Robert Arvay
mrm...@aol.com (Mr Mahdi) wrote in message news:<20020618200305...@mb-df.aol.com>...
> The Bible said you shall know them by their fruits:
>
> Christians started WWI and WWII where hundreds of millions of people died.
Actually, it was Europeans who were violating the teachings of Jesus
who did this.
(Snip)
> Christianity is the most racially segegrated religion on earth. Sunday, when
> church services are held is the most segegrated hour in the world.
I can only speak for my congregation, which is integrated. In the
several churches I occasionally visit, they, too, have multi-racial
composition.
> Even racist
> groups like the KKK and other white supremists are themselves Christian
> fundamentalists.
They call themselves that. Are there no Muslims with whom you are
embarrassed to be associated?
(snip)
>
> Christian fundamentalists like Robert Arvay are the most hypocritical,
> oppoturnistic bunch of devils in the planet. They overlook the evil of their
> people and religion and yet have the nerve to call Islam "a false religion."
I think that if you review my posts, I have not overlooked the evils
of myself, nor of people associated with me. The Bible teaches that
we are all sinners in need of a forgiveness which none of us could
ever earn.
Sir, I am a Christian. If I did not view Islam to be a false
religion, I would be a Muslim. The two beliefs are clearly
incompatible. Nevertheless, as a Christian, I am commanded by God to
love every human being on this earth, even those who would do me harm.
Furthermore, whatever someone's religious belief, I believe I always
give them credit for the sincerity of that belief. I may criticize
someone's politics or economic philosophy. I try never to attack
their person or the sincerity of their beliefs. To the extent that I
may fail in meeting this standard, I can only beg forgiveness.
(snip)
> I want this hypocrite to quote Matthew 10:34 in the Bible to see if Bible
> promotes peace. Matthew 10:34 said that Jesus didn't come to bring peace but
> the sword. No wonder why Christians have a track record in killing the most
> people. They are just following their own Bible.
I believe you are misinterpreting that passage. Taken in context with
the entire Gospels, Jesus calls upon us all to boldly wage war against
evil, but to do so with love for every individual. Our war is not
against governments, nor for territory, but against evil. And our
weapons are the virtues and the truth of God's word, not weapons of
destruction. That we have failed to achieve this high standard is
disastrous. But God is merciful.
> I suggest that Robert Avray study his own religion before calling Islam as a
> false religion.
> Mahdi Muhammad
> http://brothermahdi.tripod.com/index.html
Sir, with sincerity, I ask God's blessings on you and yours.
Robert Arvay
You missed the point. It's the PA (Palestinian Authority) which
cannot survive without fomenting hatred. The solution then is to
remove the PA and find some moderate and competent leaders who can
develop Palestine economically (without getting assassinated by the
present Palestinian powers). The Palestinians I come in contact with
here in the USA seem to be quite adept at functioning peacefully in a
democratic economy. I'm sure that, given opportunities in their own
land, they could become wealthy enough that they would rather trade
and barter than send their kids out to die.
While the history of conflict using Jesus as an emblem is shameful,
the TYPICAL Christian way is to follow Jesus.
May we all learn to do that, and soon.
===============
"Randy Burns" <randy....@gte.net> wrote in message news:<s1JP8.61780$uX3....@nwrddc01.gnilink.net>...
"Randy Burns" <randy....@gte.net> wrote in message news:<s1JP8.61780$uX3....@nwrddc01.gnilink.net>...
Randy Burns
is no point in it. Only the Palestinians can find a solution to their side
of the conflict. Are there Christian groups in the West Bank helping
moderate Arabs build businesses?
Cheers, Randy
--
Pat Kohli
Robert Arvay wrote:
> Greetings;
>
> You missed the point. It's the PA (Palestinian Authority) which
> cannot survive without fomenting hatred. (snip)
I think I hear your dog barking?
Adelard R
<snip>
> The solution to this problem becomes obvious when posed this way! (Kill
them
> before they kill us). A typical Christian solution.
>
> Cheers, Randy
>
Hi Randy,
I really don't think this is a typical Christian solution. Growing up in the
third world countries, in Christian environment, Christians were more loving
and compassionate.
When I first came here to the West, I felt there is something wrong with
these fundamentalist Christians of West, they are not at all compassionate,
rather they are into materialism and they are so fearful of diversity
because of lack of ignorance of other people traditions. If they could
understand and experience the power of Unity maybe they can understand and
practice the gospel of Jesus which is based on love and compassion.
Peace
Adelard
Adelard R
forced
> non Christians to be Christians.
Just look yourself in mirror. Let's me ask you a question. Didn't you say "
Death to Baha'is" last time?
>They stole hundreds of millions of Africans
> and forced them to be slaves and Christian.
Don't forget that the Arabs Muslims were major players in the slave trading.
How about Sudan and Mauritania, two Muslims nations which are still
practicing slavery. You should just read your Qu'ran, and you would
recognize that the practice of owning slaves was not abolished. Those
Christians pretend using the Bible like Muslims in Sudan pretend using the
Qu'ran.
<snip>
> Christian fundamentalists like Robert Arvay are the most hypocritical,
> oppoturnistic bunch of devils in the planet. They overlook the evil of
their
> people and religion and yet have the nerve to call Islam "a false
religion."
People like Robert are not that Christians, but they are driven by a kind of
political ideology, pretending to believe in Bible.
If you read the Bible or the Gospel, you will see nothing but love and
compassion of Jesus.
If you go to the third world countries, you would see that Christians are
loving and compassionate.
<snip>
Peace
Adelard
Mr Mahdi
>If you go to the third world countries, you would see that Christians are
>loving and compassionate.
LOL, just like the Christians in Rwanda who killed a million people in a few
weeks? I have a friend who is Muslim from Rwanda and he told me the only time
a Huti would protect and Tutsi and vice versa were if they were Muslims.
Muslims were the only ones who didn't care for what ethnic group one came from,
while the Christians were busy killing each other off. Plus, Christians have
killed and raped people in Bosnia, Kosovo and Russia. I guess 300,000 Muslims
killed and raped by the Christian Serbs in Bosnia and Kosovo were a sign of how
Christians were loving and compassionate?
Mahdi Muhammad
Robert Arvay
> Like it or not, the Palestinians have to choose their own leaders or there
> is no point in it. Only the Palestinians can find a solution to their side
> of the conflict. Are there Christian groups in the West Bank helping
> moderate Arabs build businesses?
>
> Cheers, Randy
I like it. And let's remember that the freedom to choose is the
freedom to choose rightly OR wrongly. Remember that Hitler was
elected.
Also, the power to choose entails accountability for that choice. If
the Palestinians choose to continue along the path of terrorism,
heedless of the cliff at the end of that road, they should not enjoy
the support of Western sympathizers, but rather, endure their
reproach, which might eventually save them from disaster.
As for building businesses among the Palestinians, that would be an
excellent idea. But it would take courage. Success engenders envy,
and among the thugs in the PA, envy breeds murder.
Unfortunately, the PA profits from the misery of the Palestinian
people.
Adelard R
"Mr Mahdi" <mrm...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20020620043220...@mb-df.aol.com...
> (typical Adelard BS snipped)
>
> >If you go to the third world countries, you would see that Christians are
> >loving and compassionate.
>
> LOL, just like the Christians in Rwanda who killed a million people in a
few
> weeks? I have a friend who is Muslim from Rwanda and he told me the only
time
> a Huti would protect and Tutsi and vice versa were if they were Muslims.
The Genocide of Rwanda was caused by the Rwanda government in Power. Rwanda
Radio which was manipulated by the Rwanda government was the only way of
getting news and this Radio propagated a lot of hate and fear between Hutus
and Tutsis. At that time, People from Tutsi background were in exile, trying
to go back to Rwanda and the Rwanda government of which majority ( 99%) were
Hutus didn't want it and began a propaganda of hear and hate.
When they tried to return to go back to Rwanda, that's when war began.
You may read the history of former Rwanda Colonialist, Beligium on the
Rwanda history, you would have a good understand about the problem the
ethnic divisions of Rwanda.
Take look in many countries in Africa, like Zaire, Kenya, Gabon, Christians
people come from different background and they live side by side in peace
and harmony
The Problem was the Rwanda government, in the case of USA, the situation is
completely different, the USA government abolished all the laws of racism,
but still many people are still ignorant of oneness of humankind and don't
have any compassion at all for the deprived ones.
The USA has one of the best constitution in the world and there is a freedom
of expression and it's easier to know the truth from the falsehood because
of advanced communication ( ie, internet, etc ) and but still many people
are still holding their prejudices.
> Muslims were the only ones who didn't care for what ethnic group one came
from,
Who told you that Mahdi? He didn't tell you the truth. Tutsi Baha'is and
Hutu Baha'is are the only hope for Rwanda. As I said before, only
Baha'u'llah can provide the healing of humanity. I experienced first hand
this revelation in middle of critical time of disunity, so I know it's
power, this faith is nothing but a miracle for the world.
> while the Christians were busy killing each other off. Plus, Christians
have
> killed and raped people in Bosnia, Kosovo and Russia. I guess 300,000
Muslims
> killed and raped by the Christian Serbs in Bosnia and Kosovo were a sign
of how
> Christians were loving and compassionate?
This is a good point. And again I believe that the power of love and
compassion of Christianity can't eradicate all the major problems facing the
world. A new medicine need to be applied as the the Manifestation of this
age said. A more powerful degree of love and compassion need to be applied.
In this case the Power of Unity need to be taught and experienced when
people from different culture and religion are living side by side in this
age of communication.. So that's when the revelation of Baha'u'llah comes in
picture to bring a high degree of love and compassion through it's teaching
of the power of Unity and understanding of the needs of humankind.
Peace
Adelard
Mark Elderkin
head. Adelard seems to have a great sense of spirituality about him. As is
always the case....... being Christian or a Baha'i is a state of action and
not merely a category. I would like to suggest that those who have managed
to kill, torture and pillage those people who may have different ethnic
values or backgrounds are certainly not representing any teachings of Christ
or Mohammed that I'm aware of. When you step out of the realm of spiritual
values and into the sub-human characteristics of greed.... lust ...... and
striving of power, then you certainly don't maintain the title of Christian
or Muslem or Baha'i. The greatest evil in the world is the evil commited in
the name of Allah........
Mark
Mahdi said:."........killed and raped by the Christian Serbs in Bosnia and
Kosovo were a sign
> of how
> > Christians were loving and compassionate?"
>
Adelkard said: " This is a good point. And again I believe that the power
Paul Hammond
Robert Arvay <Rober...@Msn.Com> wrote in message
news:457ff776.02061...@posting.google.com...
> many Palestinians and Arabs that no Jews died at the WTC--- because
> they supposedly planned and carried out the atrocity, and stayed home
> from work that day.
I saw a rather interesting programme, in a series by a British
journalist, called "Langan behind the lines" - in which, considering
that he knew little about the realities of life in the middle
eastern states, he went on a trip - to Iran, Iraq and Palestine
- to find out what life was *really* like there.
I could digress, because the whole series was wonderful, and
about Iran, particularly hopeful - there's a real "Prague spring"
type atmosphere there.
Anyway, he was in Palestine just before the intafada started,
and he was talking to a group of young lads on the beach. They
refused to believe him when he talked with them about Hitler
and the gas chambers - as far as they are concerned this
is merely Jewish propaganda. So, I can well believe that
such a patently ridiculous theory is widely believed in
Palestine.
However, I would tend to tolerance of such demonising of
their enemies, considering that their only impression of
the Jewish people is in the effects they experience
daily of the Israeli Palestinian policy.
> Despite all that, a great many Arabs come to the USA and mingle
> without rancor in our multi-ethnic and multi-religious society. Only
> a small minority of them have hostilities toward their Jewish
> neighbors.
Yes, this is quite often the case. Greeks and Turks living in
another country often get on very well with each other, when
away from the context of the political disagreements between
their countries. Arabs living in the USA have no reason to
hate the Jews that also live there, and don't need to talk
about Palestine if they want a quiet life.
But most of them are afraid to speak out, because the
> fanatics among them are murderous to the point of suicide.
> Indeed, many Palestinians are in the West because at home their
> moderate persuasions would get them killed. Surely you are aware that
> in Palestine territory, it is not enough to be lukewarm in favor of
> terrorism. Anyone suspected of disloyalty is subject to summary
> execution in the streets.
I haven't heard of this happening, though what I've heard of
the IRA would lead me to lend credence to it. Surely, it's
people who are suspected of collaborating with Israel
that are in danger, just like French collaborators were
strung up from the lampposts after WWII.
>
> Once again, I am not anti-Arab. I am not aware of any Semitic
> heritage in my past. While I regard Islam as a false religion, I do
> not doubt the sincerity and humaneness of many of its practitioners.
> It's just that I see as absurd the claims that Israel should bare its
> throat to the daggers of fanatics who have shown no hesitation to shed
> innocent blood in the pursuit of their aims.
> To try to put those people on a moral level with Israelis (and
> Fundamentalist Christians in general) is simply a diversionary ploy to
> remove attention from the obvious--- terrorists are not freedom
> fighters. They are murderers.
But, you are forgetting that one man's terrorist is another man's
freedom fighter.
Of course, it is absurd to say that Israel should surrender to
Palestinian aggression - but there has been aggression on
both sides. Sharon came to power on the back of frustration,
promising security. He cannot deliver that security with his
tanks. The developments of the day will only make things
worse (in fact, AIUI, on the very day his tanks have moved
back into occupying Palestinian land, the "retribution" for
this has already started). In the words of another
cliche, violence only breeds more violence.
Paul
Freethought110
"Robert Arvay" <Rober...@Msn.Com> wrote in message
>Success engenders envy,
> and among the thugs in the PA, envy breeds murder.
> Unfortunately, the PA profits from the misery of the Palestinian
> people.
Interestingly, that is EXACTLY what the internal enemies of Arafat and the
Palestinian Authority, i.e. HAMAS and Islamic Jihad, say about it as well.
--
Freethought110
Paul Hammond
LOL Mahdi,
Can we crosspost this everywhere now as an example of
"muslim hatespeech", like you just did with the sayings
of one "Joel Smith".
"Anti-Christian hate-speech by A. Muslim".
Nice one!
Paul
Robert Arvay
"Freethought110" <Freetho...@bohemian.org> wrote in message news:<newscache$ph71yg$azf1$1...@elise.onthenet.com.au>...
I'm not sure what the point is. So, if Hamas says that the PA is
holding on to power by keeping the Palestinian people in poverty--- ?
Freethought110
"Robert Arvay" <rober...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:67f4dff6.0206...@posting.google.com...
> > Interestingly, that is EXACTLY what the internal enemies of Arafat and
the
> > Palestinian Authority, i.e. HAMAS and Islamic Jihad, say about it as
well.
>
> I'm not sure what the point is. So, if Hamas says that the PA is
> holding on to power by keeping the Palestinian people in poverty--- ?
Your overall perspective on this conflict is so typical of a provincial
(nay, hick) uninformed American Christian fundamentalist zealot simpleton
WASP brainwashed rightwing Republican goon, like your hero (the illegitimate
(p)resident of 1600 Pennsylvannia Avenue) words do not begin to express your
utter ignorance of the players and actors nor the complexity of the issues
of this conflict. You parrot lines from the American corporate media
propaganda machine such as the crappola that is daily churned out by
Murdoch's FOX news network, on the one hand, as if it is the truth without
in anyway realizing that you have no idea what you are talking about but are
merely regurgitating a rehearsed and simplistic party-line; then pronounce
slogans and platitudes of a nature which might as well have come out of the
offices of HAMAS and Islamic Jihad, on the other. In other words you have
your head so far up where the sun doesn't shine that you are looking at the
other end sounding like the Islamic fundamentalists. You don't seem to
understand something as basic as the fact that the Palestinian Authority is
composed of multiple actors with diverse approaches, not just Yasser Arafat
and his al-Fatah, some of whom are as against the suicide bombings and
violence (and have been from the beginning of this second Intifadah) than
any Israeli. You lump the PA, just as that war criminal fascist Ariel Sharon
does, into a single bloc, not realizing their are people in the PA (such as
Ashrawi or Barakat, to name just two) who are mortal enemies of the
religious fascists who intiate the terrorism. Then you have the temerity,
without any knowledge of the complex facts, to blame the economic woes of
the Palestinian people on this Palestinian Authority, in no way realizing
that the PA has only been constituted since 1994, and that these economic
problems which have impoverished the people of Palestine have causes which
go back to 1948 and prior. Do you geddit, Mr fundie? Probably not.
God willing, if there is a god, those Americans with a conscience will show
George Dumbya Shrub the door and he will be ousted from office come November
2004 so that the rest of the world can get on with it and will no longer
have to put up with the jerk-off Christian fascist idiots and their screwey
agenda of fascizing this world like you people have been doing since January
20th 2001.
HAIL TO THE THIEF!
--
Freethought110
Denis Giron
> (typical Adelard BS snipped)
>
> >If you go to the third world countries, you would see that Christians are
> >loving and compassionate.
>
> LOL, just like the Christians in Rwanda who killed a million people in a few
> weeks? I have a friend who is Muslim from Rwanda and he told me the only time
> a Huti would protect and Tutsi and vice versa were if they were Muslims.
> Muslims were the only ones who didn't care for what ethnic group one came
> from, while the Christians were busy killing each other off.
WOW! Adelard needs to give up now, since Mahdi is citing such
irrefutable sources as some anonymous Rwandan Muslim he knows. Maybe
after that we can all take a trip to alt.religion.christianity and let
some guy tell us how bad Islam really is based on what he heard from a
Pakistani Christian ("we love each other; the muhammadans kill each
other").
The Rwanda conflict was ethnic, but also political... started by the
Belgians. The reality is that while there were many murders committed
in Rwanda by people who associate themselves with Christianity, many
Christians did cross ethnic lines in love and brotherhood. If Mahdi
needs an example of Hutu-Tutsi love among Christians, he need not look
any further than Jean-Baptiste Ndahindurwa, the former King, who was a
Tutsi with a loving Hutu wife. Not only that, but there are even
Christians and Muslims working together for justice in Rwanda:
http://www.warc.ch/up014/09.html
> Plus, Christians have killed and raped people in Bosnia, Kosovo and Russia.
But wait folks, there were also many murders committed by Muslims,
Atheists and Agnostics... I guess only the Bahais are free of sin on
this one! Bosnia, Kosovo, the whole Yugoslav area... all that was
political and ethnic. Since we can cite people we know, I know a
Croatian Muslim who is quite proud of his role in killing Albanians.
Is Mahdi confused? Didn't he read in his Hizbut-Tahrir pamphlettes
that all Albanians are Muslims? More below...
> I guess 300,000 Muslims killed and raped by the Christian Serbs in Bosnia and
> Kosovo were a sign of how Christians were loving and compassionate?
As I understand it, hundreds of thousands of Albanians were killed,
but not all of them were Muslim. Many were Atheists, many more were
Catholic or Orthodox Christian. This was ethnic an political violence.
Furthermore, not all the Serbs were Christian. Mahdi is making things
too simple as usual.
Denis Giron
>
> The Bible said you shall know them by their fruits:
>
> Christians started WWI and WWII where hundreds of millions of people died.
The Christians started these wars? Christians certainly took part (as
did many Muslims), but how did the Christians start them? It seems to
me that, with the exception of the Ottoman Empire, most of the parties
taking part in either war represented secular nations.
> Christian started every major world war in the past 2000 years,
Every major world war? All two of them? Anyway, you haven't really
proven this; rather you just asserted such.
> which proves that Christianity produces cold-blooded killers in the name
> of their religion.
WOW! And the fighting for second place in the race to commit the most
murders would be the Atheists and the Muslims... can we make similar
leaps like Mahdi did above? By the way folks, I'm an Atheist...
Regardless, let's play with Mahdi's logic...
Christians have committed murders, which proves that Christianity
produces cold blooded killers.
Many Buddhists have been pacifists, which proves that Buddhism turns
people into pacifists.
There have been many Muslims who commit acts of terrorism, which
proves Islam produces terrorists... Oh wait, I bet Mahdi doesn't like
this sort of argument. Surely it is fallacious, but Mahdi ignores this
fact when he's attacking another faith.
> Christianity is the most racially segegrated religion on earth. Sunday, when
> church services are held is the most segegrated hour in the world.
You say this so much, which makes me wonder if you have ever been in a
Church. I used to be a member of the NYC Church of Christ, and it was
not segregated in any sense... not by race, not by financial status,
not by gender (no, the Christians don't send their women to the
partition).
> Even racist groups like the KKK and other white supremists are themselves
> Christian fundamentalists.
There have been Muslims who associated themselves with fascism as
well. During the second world war, the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem was an
admirer of Hitler:
http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/History/muftihit.html
Does Mahdi really believe the KKK represents Christianity? Can we also
assume the NOI represents Islam?
> In every single Christian country, the overwhelming majority of scientists and
> thinkers are atheists, agnostics, etc.
And how does this lend weight to your assertion that "Christianity
killed more people than all the groups combined"? Did you post this to
prove Christianity false? If you're so into this ad-verecundiam
approach, why not wonder what it says about Islam?
> Most of them are ex-Christians and
> consider the Bible to be a masterpiece
> of scientific inaccuracy.
There are also many Christian intellectuals... ever heard of Alvin
Plantinga or William Lane Craig? I have much to disagree with them
about, but they are far above you and your Caliphist goons in terms of
brilliance.
> The Church used to kill and oppress people who believed in things like the
> earth being round.
And there were Muslim authorities (self-proclaimed Islamic states,
etc) who also committed crimes against people. If you always complain
that *REAL* Islam is not iplemented, cannot the Christians also agree
that crimes committed by the Catholic Church were outside the scope of
real Christianity? Even the Church itself has admitted those acts were
unChristian. Surely non-Catholics should not have to feel guilty about
it.
> It was the Muslims that evil Christian Europe owed a
> gratitude for rescuing these filthy, paganistic heathens
> from utter ignorance of the Dark Ages.
Never heard of the enlightenment, eh?
> Christians started wars like the Crusades and the Inquisition where they
> forced non Christians to be Christians.
Many Jews, Christians and Muslims have engaged in forced conversions.
The Christians are the only ones who are willing to admit this is a
part of their history.
> They stole hundreds of millions of Africans
> and forced them to be slaves and Christian.
Islam played a major role in the African holocaust/slave-trade as
well. However, you claim Arab slave traders who oppressed and murdered
Africans were not real Muslims... so too, Christians can argue that
their coreligionists who committed these crimes weren't following the
gospel (check the Sermon on the Mount).
> All of the colonial nations were Christian.
Most, actually, were secular. Sheesh!
> They stole the land of the people,
> subjugated them to second class citizens in
> their own lands and forced the
> inhabitants to embrace the Christian way.
The African continent has been ravaged by both Christianity and Islam.
Indigenous African culture has been almost entirely wiped out, and
nearly the entire population has been assimilated.
> Both South Africa and Israel are apartheid nations.
South African abolished apartheid... and are you blaming Israel on the
Christians too?
> the Zionist nation which has support by the majority of
> white Christian fundamentalists is still an apartheid nation.
"White" Christian fundamentalists? A hint of racism? Many Christian
conservatives (and this crosses racial lines) in America support
Israel. So what?
> The Bible is regularly being burned and the religion ridiculed, proving that
> Christianity has no effect in the lives of those who think.
Actually, Christianity is on the rise in this country. Go take a
closer look at American politics. Thankfully, in America people are
free to doubt Christianity. There is no law that calls for the killing
of apostates. Think about that...
> Christians by far has killed, raped, enslaved and destroyed more people and
> nations than other group in the history of mankind combined. This and MANY
> other factors prove that Christianity by far is a false, evil religion created
> by evil people and have nothing to do with the noble teachings of Jesus (as).
WOW! Mahdi has no clue... so, do Islamic terrorists prove Islam is a
terrorist religion? Do drug dealers in Pakistan prove Islam is an evil
religion that condones drug abuse? Think hard about these silly
questions, as they show the silly leap you made in the paragraph
above.
> Christianity is really Paulianity and that of evil men.
Mahdi, you have no idea what Christianity is.
> Christians worship 3 gods and claim that its all one.
Some do, some don't. So what?
> Jesus (as) was reported to of have said in the Bible that he did not come to
> change the Covenant but to fulfil it. These misguided Christians break almost
> every law in the Covenant while claiming to of have followed the Prophet Jesus
> (as).
So wait, should Christians keep this covenant, and be even more
violent, stoning adulterers, killing homosexuals, waging war against
idolaters? That would make them too close to being like your ideal
Muslims...
> I can easily prove the mistakes and contradictions in the Bible to prove the
> Bible is not from God.
Great! Let's see it. But remember, you onced ridiculed Baha'ullaah for
saying that these contraditions stem from interpretation, not the
actual text. So, I am challenging you to show me errors and
contradictions in the actual text (not a translation, which is just an
interpretation). Put up or shut up busta; I'm waiting...
> I can show the fallacies of Christian dogma.
In the discussions on logic, you have shown that you do not even know
what a "fallacy" is.
> I can show the scientific errors and historical blunders in the Bible to
> prove that the book is not from God.
Go ahead.
> But since when intellectual proof meant to these evil, Christian
> fundamentalists?
The word "intellectual" does not mean much to you either...
Jacob T.
"Denis Giron" <kaa...@godisdead.com> wrote in message
news:bdfe7cc1.02062...@posting.google.com...
> mrm...@aol.com (Mr Mahdi) wrote in message
news:<20020618200305...@mb-df.aol.com>...
> >
> > The Bible said you shall know them by their fruits:
> >
<Muslim bullshit snipped>
The greatest Christian nation on earth -- the USA -- defeated the bad guys
in both of those wars.
By the way, all Islamic leaders almost without exception supported the NAZIS
in WWII..
FACT: Islamic leaders lined up right behind Hitler and the NAZIS in WWII
and offered their unswerving support for the Nazi regime.
FACT: Brave Jews fought alongside the British and Americans defeated the
NAZI regime and the Islamic world that had allied with the NAZIS.
FACT: Now, years later, the Islamic world again revives the vision of
Hitler and his insane ideas of genocide against the Jews.
The state-controlled Egyptian press recently praised Hitler and Nazism as
follows:
---------------------
Jews called 'accursed
forever and ever'
Egyptian newspaper columnist to Hitler: 'If only you had done it, brother'
Š 2002 WorldNetDaily.com
Hitler should have finished the job and rid the earth of the Jews' "evil and
sin," states a column in Egypt's official newspaper.
While the level of anti-Semitic rhetoric and attacks worldwide has been
rising since the Israeli incursion into the West Bank in pursuit of
terrorists and their infrastructure, nowhere is hatred of Jews more virulent
than in the Arab world, where it is currently being fanned not just in the
streets and the mosques, but in the news media.
Wednesday's edition of the official Egyptian daily newspaper, Al-Akhbar,
featured a column by Fatma Abdallah Mahmoud, titled "Accursed Forever and
Ever." Here is what the author wrote regarding the Jews, as translated by
the Middle East Media Research Institute, or MEMRI, an independent,
non-profit organization that translates and analyzes the media of the Middle
East:
They are accursed in heaven and on earth. They are accursed from the day the
human race was created and from the day their mothers bore them. They are
accursed also because they murdered the Prophets. They murdered the Prophet
John the Baptist and served up his head on a golden platter to the singer
and dancer Salome. Allah also cursed them with a thousand curses when they
argued with and resisted his words of truth, deceived the Prophet Moses, and
worshiped the golden calf that they created with their own hands!!
These accursed ones are a catastrophe for the human race. They are the virus
of the generation, doomed to a life of humiliation and wretchedness until
Judgment Day. They are also accursed because they repeatedly tried to murder
the Prophet Muhammad. They threw a stone at him, but missed. Another time,
they tried to mix poison in his food, but providence saved him from their
treachery and their crimes. Allah cursed them when they carried out the
criminal massacre of the peaceful Palestinians in Sabra and Shatilla.
They are accursed, they, their fathers, and their forefathers . until
Judgment Day, because they burst into Al-Aqsa Mosque with their defiled,
filthy feet and violated its sanctity.
Finally, they are accursed, fundamentally, because they are the plague of
the generation and the bacterium of all time. Their history always was and
always will be stained with treachery, falseness, and lying. Historical
documents prove it.
Thus, the Jews are accursed -- the Jews of our time, those who preceded them
and those who will come after them, if any Jews come after them.
With regard to the fraud of the Holocaust . Many French studies have proven
that this is no more than a fabrication, a lie, and a fraud!! That is, it is
a "scenario," the plot of which was carefully tailored, using several faked
photos completely unconnected to the truth. Yes, it is a film, no more and
no less. Hitler himself, whom they accuse of Nazism, is in my eyes no more
than a modest 'pupil' in the world of murder and bloodshed. He is completely
innocent of the charge of frying them in the hell of his false Holocaust!!
The entire matter, as many French and British scientists and researchers
have proven, is nothing more than a huge Israeli plot aimed at extorting the
German government in particular and the European countries in general. But
I, personally and in light of this imaginary tale, complain to Hitler, even
saying to him from the bottom of my heart: "If only you had done it,
brother, if only it had really happened, so that the world could sigh in
relief [without] their evil and sin."
Since their birth, the Jews [have amassed] hatred and hostility towards
Islam and the Muslims. They have always laid traps for the Muslims, woven
conspiracies and crimes against them, and been biased in favor of their
enemies and occupiers .
They always try to warp and distort everything fair and beautiful!!
Basically, they are a model of moral ugliness, debasement, and degradation.
If only Allah would curse them more and more, to the end of all generations.
Amen.
Mahmoud's comments in Al-Akhbar are only one example of the growing Arab
fury toward Jews and Israel. In recent weeks:
Arab Christian clergymen in the Middle East - including heads of churches -
have publicly accused the Jews of being "Satanic."
A Saudi government-approved newspaper published a column claiming Jews use
the blood of teenagers to make a special pastry associated with the March
holiday of Purim.
Another columnist for one of Saudi Arabia's government-controlled dailies
praised the Palestinian suicide attacker who detonated a bomb at a Passover
Seder in a hotel in Netanya, Israel.
Not only high-ranking public officials and prominent columnists in the
Middle East," but even the imam of New York's Islamic Center, claim that
Jews perpetrated the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks on New York City and the
Pentagon.
And last week, the chairman of the Arab Psychiatrists Association
enthusiastically supported Palestinian suicide attacks, called President
Bush "a stupid idiot," and promised that the Arab nations would "throw
Israel into the sea."
Robert Arvay
"Freethought110" <Freetho...@bohemian.org> wrote in message news:<newscache$pnu2yg$psi1$1...@elise.onthenet.com.au>...
> > > Interestingly, that is EXACTLY what the internal enemies of Arafat and
> the
> > > Palestinian Authority, i.e. HAMAS and Islamic Jihad, say about it as
> well.
> >
> > I'm not sure what the point is. So, if Hamas says that the PA is
> > holding on to power by keeping the Palestinian people in poverty--- ?
> Your overall perspective on this conflict is so typical of a provincial
> (nay, hick)
I are a hick. And derned prowed uv it.
> uninformed American Christian fundamentalist zealot simpleton
> WASP brainwashed rightwing Republican goon,
> (snip) words do not begin to express your
> utter ignorance of the players and actors nor the complexity of the issues
> of this conflict.
Now don't soft soap me. If you don't like me, just say so.
(snip long personal and political diatribe)
Actually, I think I expressly did state that there are complexities,
and that there are significant blocs of moderate Palestinians, many of
whom reside in my neighborhood as peaceful and valued contributors to
the community.
But in HIS neighborhood, Arafat holds the reins of power, and he is
NOT committed to the welfare of the Palestinain people. If somehow he
can be replaced by someone who would rather spend money on economic
development than on shiploads of smuggled weapons, a propserous
Palestinian people would have a stake in peace instead of in suicide
and murder. (I read somewhere that enough money has been spent on the
PA by the USA to have made--- if prudently invested in productive
assets--- every Palestinian family a millionaire by now. But that
would have made Arafat obsolete, and he does not want that--- at any
price.)
While it is a mistake to underestimate political (social, cultural,
economic, agricultural etc) complexities, it is also a mistake to
forget that at the center of any tangle of Gordian complexity, there
is also a fundamental set of principles which if not respected, will
thwart any attempt to reach a peaceful settlement. Sadly, the sword
is often the resort which cuts the knot.
Finally, I have not seen Hamas say anything about making peace---
except by killing every last Jewish man, woman and child they possibly
can.
But then, duh, wut duz ah no?
God bless you!
Denis Giron
>...
The Christian equivalent of Mahdi has chymed in... bravo, bravo...
> <Muslim bullshit snipped>
Quite a bit of profanity for a pious follower of Jesus, eh?
> The greatest Christian nation on earth -- the USA -- defeated the bad guys
> in both of those wars.
You're calling the USA a Christian nation? A representation of
Christianity? Secularism is to credit (and blame) for the U.S.
> By the way, all Islamic leaders almost without exception supported the NAZIS
> in WWII..
That's not true. It would be more accurate to say that *MANY* Muslims
aligned themselves with the Nazis. I have not seen any evidence of a
majority. Besides, many Christians, agnostics and Atheists became
fascists as well, so this is a bad argument no matter which group you
are attacking...
> FACT: Islamic leaders lined up right behind Hitler and the NAZIS in WWII
> and offered their unswerving support for the Nazi regime.
Some did, but not all... this is important, and it is a distinction
that applies to the Christians as well.
Whatever...
weeliam
shame in accepting Aid from America to the tune of $3 billions!!!
"Jacob T." <Telli...@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:r6SQ8.48622$LC3.3...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
>
Paul Hammond
news:<r6SQ8.48622$LC3.3...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>...
> >...
>
> The Christian equivalent of Mahdi has chymed in... bravo, bravo...
>
> > <Muslim bullshit snipped>
>
> Quite a bit of profanity for a pious follower of Jesus, eh?
>
> > The greatest Christian nation on earth -- the USA -- defeated the bad
guys
> > in both of those wars.
>
> You're calling the USA a Christian nation? A representation of
> Christianity? Secularism is to credit (and blame) for the U.S.
>
The USA is most definitely a Christian nation - however, the
Italians and the Germans, both also Christian nations, might
take except to the claim to be eclipsed in greatness by
the USA.
How come "the bad guys" turned out to _also_ be Christian
in that shining hour of glory JT is so proud of?
> > By the way, all Islamic leaders almost without exception supported the
NAZIS
> > in WWII..
>
> That's not true. It would be more accurate to say that *MANY* Muslims
> aligned themselves with the Nazis. I have not seen any evidence of a
> majority. Besides, many Christians, agnostics and Atheists became
> fascists as well, so this is a bad argument no matter which group you
> are attacking...
>
Ireland remained neutral in the war, in the 30s, there were many
Nazi sympathisers, and actual joiners amongst the ranks of
Germany's eventual enemies. For example, some think that
the King of England himself supported Nazi policies in those
days.
> > FACT: Islamic leaders lined up right behind Hitler and the NAZIS in
WWII
> > and offered their unswerving support for the Nazi regime.
>
> Some did, but not all... this is important, and it is a distinction
> that applies to the Christians as well.
>
I don't see how this incorrect fact should be leading you to
draw Islamophobic conclusions. So what? If they were
all Yankee's fans, would that tell us anything important
about Islam? Most Islamic nations are mad about
cricket - but that's down to the legacy of the British
Empire, rather than some effect of Islam.
Paul
Al Klein
posted in alt.atheism:
>"Jacob T." <Telli...@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message news:<r6SQ8.48622$LC3.3...@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>...
>> The greatest Christian nation on earth -- the USA -- defeated the bad guys
>> in both of those wars.
>You're calling the USA a Christian nation? A representation of
>Christianity? Secularism is to credit (and blame) for the U.S.
The U. S., by ratified treaty, is NOT a Christian nation.
>> By the way, all Islamic leaders almost without exception supported the NAZIS
>> in WWII..
>That's not true. It would be more accurate to say that *MANY* Muslims
>aligned themselves with the Nazis.
Name some Moslem leaders who didn't.
--
Al - rukbat at optonline dot net
Zymurgist # 2
Al Klein
<paha...@onetel.net.uk> posted in alt.atheism:
>The USA is most definitely a Christian nation
Proof? (Strong enough to overturn an official document that says that
we're not?)
Freethought110
to the US being a Christian _state_. In the first case we're speaking of a
preponderant social/cultural-religious adherence in the US, in the second
we're speaking of the formal instituional juridical-political governmental
mechanisms which constitute the US as a state. Paul is therefore technically
right and even Alexis De Tocqueville conceded that much about America.
--
Freethought110
"Al Klein" <ruk...@pern.org> wrote in message
news:kh0ihukm1pokuehes...@4ax.com...
Freethought110
"Robert Arvay" <Rober...@Msn.Com> wrote in message
news:457ff776.02062...@posting.google.com...
> I are a hick. And derned prowed uv it.
It definitely shows.
> Now don't soft soap me. If you don't like me, just say so.
I do not like Christian fundamentalists such as yourself. In fact, I despise
you people as much as your Muslim, Jewish and Baha'i counterparts.
> (snip long personal and political diatribe)
Which included points that you cannot address.
> Actually, I think I expressly did state that there are complexities,
> and that there are significant blocs of moderate Palestinians, many of
> whom reside in my neighborhood as peaceful and valued contributors to
> the community.
>
> But in HIS neighborhood, Arafat holds the reins of power, and he is
> NOT committed to the welfare of the Palestinain people.
That is errant nonesense and the propagandistic simplisticisms which the
American media corporate conglomerates have duped you into sheepishly
believing.
<big snip>
--
Freethought110
Brian Walker
On Fri, 21 Jun 2002 08:22:27 +0800, Paul Hammond wrote:
snip
>
> LOL Mahdi,
>
> Can we crosspost this everywhere now as an example of "muslim
> hatespeech", like you just did with the sayings of one "Joel Smith".
>
> "Anti-Christian hate-speech by A. Muslim".
>
> Nice one!
>
> Paul
I do so love to watch when Mudd-ette appears on the scene. He is living
proof of the difficulty of establishing brain death. Does anyone know if
he has all his organs still?
Brian
Paul Hammond
> <paha...@onetel.net.uk> posted in alt.atheism:
>
> >The USA is most definitely a Christian nation
>
> Proof? (Strong enough to overturn an official document that says that
> we're not?)
>
Oh, please! Look at any survey of the religions of the USA,
and you'll find that somewhere around 90% at least will
identify as "Christian", the USA, unlike the UK for example,
is a country where most people think that God and
relgion is important.
"Official document"? You mean the constitution, right? Well,
that only guarantees a person's freedom of religion - but
sociologically speaking, the USA is a Christian nation. IMV,
the *most* Christian of the western nations.
In which other western democracy do we find politicians
who would be President campaigning from churches, and
praying on the campaign trail?
Anyway, my point is that the original poster cannot make
a simple equation of "Christian= good" while calling the
Nazis the "bad guys" - like their problem was not coming
from a Christian nation.
Paul
Robert Arvay
I don't despise you, Freethought. Quite the contrary, I pray for
blessings upon you.
=================
"Freethought110" <Freetho...@bohemian.org> wrote in message news:<newscache$1psayg$cqn1$1...@elise.onthenet.com.au>...
Steven Douglas
> mrm...@aol.com (Mr Mahdi) wrote in message news:<20020618200305...@mb-df.aol.com>...
> >
> > The Bible said you shall know them by their fruits:
> >
> > Christians started WWI and WWII where hundreds of millions of people died.
>
> The Christians started these wars? Christians certainly took part (as
> did many Muslims), but how did the Christians start them? It seems to
> me that, with the exception of the Ottoman Empire, most of the parties
> taking part in either war represented secular nations.
Denis, you have given Mr Mahdi an excellent response to his post and I
don't disagree with anything you wrote. I'd just like to add a couple
of points below concerning science, KKK, the Crusades, Africa, and
when will he respond to your challenge? I had to leave your entire
post intact. It is too good to edit anything out.
KKK is not a Christian organization. Christians don't have Wizards.
> > In every single Christian country, the overwhelming majority of scientists and
> > thinkers are atheists, agnostics, etc.
>
> And how does this lend weight to your assertion that "Christianity
> killed more people than all the groups combined"? Did you post this to
> prove Christianity false? If you're so into this ad-verecundiam
> approach, why not wonder what it says about Islam?
>
> > Most of them are ex-Christians and
> > consider the Bible to be a masterpiece
> > of scientific inaccuracy.
>
> There are also many Christian intellectuals... ever heard of Alvin
> Plantinga or William Lane Craig? I have much to disagree with them
> about, but they are far above you and your Caliphist goons in terms of
> brilliance.
I believe most scientists in the US consider themselves to be
Christian. There is a difference between "science" and "scientists"
-- "science" can only rely on hard facts, but "scientists" (as
individual people) are free to have faith.
> > The Church used to kill and oppress people who believed in things like the
> > earth being round.
>
> And there were Muslim authorities (self-proclaimed Islamic states,
> etc) who also committed crimes against people. If you always complain
> that *REAL* Islam is not iplemented, cannot the Christians also agree
> that crimes committed by the Catholic Church were outside the scope of
> real Christianity? Even the Church itself has admitted those acts were
> unChristian. Surely non-Catholics should not have to feel guilty about
> it.
Some Islamic leaders TODAY kill and opress people who believe in
anything other than Islam.
> > It was the Muslims that evil Christian Europe owed a
> > gratitude for rescuing these filthy, paganistic heathens
> > from utter ignorance of the Dark Ages.
>
> Never heard of the enlightenment, eh?
>
> > Christians started wars like the Crusades and the Inquisition where they
> > forced non Christians to be Christians.
>
> Many Jews, Christians and Muslims have engaged in forced conversions.
> The Christians are the only ones who are willing to admit this is a
> part of their history.
For 400 years prior to the Crusades, Muhammad the warrior, and his
succeeding warriors, spread their culture and doctrine by force. In
1095, the Pope asked the leaders of Western Europe to *respond* to the
killings of Byzantine Christians by Muslim Turks. This *response*
became known as the Crusades.
http://orb.rhodes.edu/encyclop/religion/crusades/Crusade_Intro.html
> > They stole hundreds of millions of Africans
> > and forced them to be slaves and Christian.
>
> Islam played a major role in the African holocaust/slave-trade as
> well. However, you claim Arab slave traders who oppressed and murdered
> Africans were not real Muslims... so too, Christians can argue that
> their coreligionists who committed these crimes weren't following the
> gospel (check the Sermon on the Mount).
Today, the Taliban-like government of Sudan forces Christians to
convert to Islam under threat of death. Today, Sudanese Muslims also
abduct many Christians into slavery.
I've been waiting for his response. Maybe he doesn't have one???
Al Klein
<Freetho...@bohemian.org> posted in alt.atheism:
>"Al Klein" <ruk...@pern.org> wrote in message
>news:kh0ihukm1pokuehes...@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 23 Jun 2002 14:51:29 +0100, "Paul Hammond"
>> <paha...@onetel.net.uk> posted in alt.atheism:
>> >The USA is most definitely a Christian nation
>> Proof? (Strong enough to overturn an official document that says that
>> we're not?)
>There's a big difference in stating the US is a Christian nation as opposed
>to the US being a Christian _state_. In the first case we're speaking of a
>preponderant social/cultural-religious adherence in the US, in the second
>we're speaking of the formal instituional juridical-political governmental
>mechanisms which constitute the US as a state. Paul is therefore technically
>right and even Alexis De Tocqueville conceded that much about America.
The Treaty of Tripoli to which the U. S. is a party, states, "As the
government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded
on the Christian Religion ..."
Al Klein
<paha...@onetel.net.uk> posted in alt.atheism:
>Al Klein <ruk...@pern.org> wrote in message
>news:kh0ihukm1pokuehes...@4ax.com...
>> On Sun, 23 Jun 2002 14:51:29 +0100, "Paul Hammond"
>> <paha...@onetel.net.uk> posted in alt.atheism:
>> >The USA is most definitely a Christian nation
>> Proof? (Strong enough to overturn an official document that says that
>> we're not?)
>Oh, please! Look at any survey of the religions of the USA
So now opinions of people on the street determine the form of our
government?
"The U. S. is not a Christian nation" doesn't mean that the majority
of its citizens don't consider themselves Christians, so the number
who do so consider themselves has nothing at all to do with the
matter.
>"Official document"? You mean the constitution, right?
No, I mean the 11th article of the Treaty of Tripoli, as ratified by
the Congress of the United States..
>Anyway, my point is that the original poster cannot make
>a simple equation of "Christian= good" while calling the
>Nazis the "bad guys" - like their problem was not coming
>from a Christian nation.
A nation of Christians, yes. Whether Weimar Germany was a Christian
nation I can't say.
Freethought110
"Al Klein" <ruk...@pern.org> wrote in message
news:0arkhu0v0mggj5jlo...@4ax.com...
> The Treaty of Tripoli to which the U. S. is a party, states, "As the
> government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded
> on the Christian Religion ..."
Correct. The "...government of the United States of America is not in any
sense founded on the Christian Religion..." However the nation of peoples
constituting the United States of America are overwhelmingly a nation of
Christians and thus paying adherence thereunto. There's a big distinction
between the two.
--
Freethought110
Paul Hammond
And so what? Did you forget to read Nima's post before you
attached this reply? Does the "treaty of Tripoli" invalidate
the living experience of millions of Americans?
I don't think so!
Paul
Al Klein
<Freetho...@bohemian.org> posted in alt.atheism:
>> The Treaty of Tripoli to which the U. S. is a party, states, "As the
>> government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded
>> on the Christian Religion ..."
>Correct. The "...government of the United States of America is not in any
>sense founded on the Christian Religion..." However the nation of peoples
>constituting the United States of America are overwhelmingly a nation of
>Christians and thus paying adherence thereunto. There's a big distinction
>between the two.
And an even bigger one between freedom of religion and freedom to make
others adhere to it.
Al Klein
<paha...@onetel.net.uk> posted in alt.atheism:
>And so what? Did you forget to read Nima's post before you
>attached this reply? Does the "treaty of Tripoli" invalidate
>the living experience of millions of Americans?
Their experiences have nothing to do with those who haven't had those
experiences.
Al Klein
posted in alt.atheism:
>kaa...@godisdead.com (Denis Giron) wrote in message news:<bdfe7cc1.02062...@posting.google.com>...
>> mrm...@aol.com (Mr Mahdi) wrote in message news:<20020618200305...@mb-df.aol.com>...
>> Does Mahdi really believe the KKK represents Christianity? Can we also
>> assume the NOI represents Islam?
>KKK is not a Christian organization. Christians don't have Wizards.
Since one MUST be Christian to be a member of the KKK, one can safely
assume that it's a Christian organization, whatever it might be in
addition to being Christian. (Your argument is actually a No True
Scotsman fallacy.)
>Some Islamic leaders TODAY kill and opress people who believe in
>anything other than Islam.
Which has nothing to do with Christianity.
>Today, the Taliban-like government of Sudan forces Christians to
>convert to Islam under threat of death.
"He did it too, so it's okay that I did it." Pretty lame argument.
>> > All of the colonial nations were Christian.
>> Most, actually, were secular. Sheesh!
Most (England, France, Holland, Germany) were Christian.
>> > I can show the scientific errors and historical blunders in the Bible to
>> > prove that the book is not from God.
>> Go ahead.
>I've been waiting for his response. Maybe he doesn't have one???
All the failed prophesies. The claim that if any group of Christians
asks for something in Christ's name, they'll get it. Cud-chewing
hares. Four-legged insects. Day and night before there was a sun.
And on and on and on ...
Paul Hammond
> On Thu, 27 Jun 2002 09:34:52 +0100, "Paul Hammond"
> <paha...@onetel.net.uk> posted in alt.atheism:
>
> >And so what? Did you forget to read Nima's post before you
> >attached this reply? Does the "treaty of Tripoli" invalidate
> >the living experience of millions of Americans?
>
> Their experiences have nothing to do with those who haven't had those
> experiences.
You seem to be arguing that one sentence in a legal
document is somehow the "truth", and that the fact
that so many Americans are Christian is just
irrelevant somehow. I'm afraid I just can't get my
head around the obtuseness of that idea.
Would you seriously argue that Christianity is not
still a powerful force in American culture and politics,
and that it played a defining role in shaping and
informing the history and culture of that country?
The very founding myths of the culture, and the
*reason* why religious tolerance, and the right
to religious self-determination are so highly valued
in the founding documents of the culture involve
the migration of dissenting Christians to a place
where they could live out their Christian ideals
free from the persecutions of other Christians.
There's just no getting around that fact.
And, for the record, because I think you may be under
a misapprehension about me, I am *not* a Christian,
I'm agnostic.
Paul
Al Klein
<paha...@onetel.net.uk> posted in alt.atheism:
>Al Klein <ruk...@pern.org> wrote in message
>news:8ebnhuoblc7sujrkf...@4ax.com...
>> On Thu, 27 Jun 2002 09:34:52 +0100, "Paul Hammond"
>> <paha...@onetel.net.uk> posted in alt.atheism:
>> >And so what? Did you forget to read Nima's post before you
>> >attached this reply? Does the "treaty of Tripoli" invalidate
>> >the living experience of millions of Americans?
>> Their experiences have nothing to do with those who haven't had those
>> experiences.
>You seem to be arguing that one sentence in a legal
>document is somehow the "truth"
Since most of the founders of the U. S. weren't Christian (in fact
many of them held Christianity in contempt or worse), why would they
have founded a Christian nation?
>and that the fact
>that so many Americans are Christian is just
>irrelevant somehow.
It's totally irrelevant to whether the U. S. is a Christian nation
not, as you're arguing, to whether the U. S. is a nation of
Christians.
>Would you seriously argue that Christianity is not
>still a powerful force in American culture and politics
Of course not.
,
>and that it played a defining role in shaping and
>informing the history and culture of that country?
Originally? Only by its absence.
>The very founding myths of the culture, and the
>*reason* why religious tolerance, and the right
>to religious self-determination are so highly valued
>in the founding documents of the culture involve
>the migration of dissenting Christians to a place
>where they could live out their Christian ideals
>free from the persecutions of other Christians.
Sorry, but the founding fathers were, for the most parts, Deists, not
Christians, so they'd have no "myths of Christianity" on which to
found the nation. Christians seem to forget that one little annoying
fact and, instead, choose to believe that this nation was founded by
Christians who had escaped religious prosecution. It wasn't.
>There's just no getting around that fact.
The fact that the nation was founded by Christians, remembering the
flight of other Christians from persecution? There's no such "fact"
to get around - it never happened.
>And, for the record, because I think you may be under
>a misapprehension about me, I am *not* a Christian,
>I'm agnostic.
Atheistic agnostic or theistic agnostic? Or are you using "agnostic"
to mean that you refuse to take sides?
Randy Burns
>
> Sorry, but the founding fathers were, for the most parts, Deists, not
> Christians, so they'd have no "myths of Christianity" on which to
> found the nation. Christians seem to forget that one little annoying
> fact and, instead, choose to believe that this nation was founded by
> Christians who had escaped religious prosecution. It wasn't.
Deism is a response "within" Christianity. You can't really say that
European Deists are "non-Christians," particularly when their children and
grand children grew up to be Christians.
Cheers, Randy
Peter
I tell you what the diffference is : The Klan is a very very small
part of the Christian community, However the Radical Islam controls a
majority of the murders in Islam.
Al Klein
in alt.atheism:
Radical Islamic suicide bombers are a very small part of the Moslem
community. However the Klan controls a majority of the racists in
Christianity.
IOW, there's no difference.
Jeff Laventure
Hold it. When the US went after Osama and attacked the regime in
Afghanistan, there were many Muslims screaming it was an attack on Islam.
Now you are disassociating Islam from so-called radicals. Which is it?
Either it is wrong to blame all of Islam for the wrong doings of a few or it
is wrong to blame others for demanding the few be punished.
Admiral Bob
> community. However the Klan controls a majority of the racists in
> Christianity.
To my mind, this is reductionist gibberish. The Catholic population of
Africa alone is greater than the entire Christian community of the US.
stoney
<jef...@pacbell.net>, Message ID:
<w95V8.1209$2C4.13...@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com> wrote in
alt.atheism;
Al turned Peter's rhetoric against him.
--
Stoney
"Designated Rascal and Rapscallion
and
SCAMPERMEISTER!"
When in doubt, SCAMPER about!
When things are fair, SCAMPER everywhere!
When things are rough, can't SCAMPER enough!
Al Klein
>"Al Klein" <ruk...@pern.org> wrote in message
>news:v6a9iu0s4k4s5ht5t...@Pern.rk...
>> On Thu, 04 Jul 2002 00:54:56 GMT, Peter <PRobe...@yahoo.com> posted
>> in alt.atheism:
>> >On Sat, 29 Jun 2002 21:55:42 -0400, Al Klein <ruk...@pern.org> wrote:
>> >I tell you what the diffference is : The Klan is a very very small
>> >part of the Christian community, However the Radical Islam controls a
>> >majority of the murders in Islam.
>> Radical Islamic suicide bombers are a very small part of the Moslem
>> community. However the Klan controls a majority of the racists in
>> Christianity.
>Hold it. When the US went after Osama and attacked the regime in
>Afghanistan, there were many Muslims screaming it was an attack on Islam.
>Now you are disassociating Islam from so-called radicals. Which is it?
The radicals are as much a part of Islam as Christian radicals are a
part of Christianity.
>Either it is wrong to blame all of Islam for the wrong doings of a few or it
>is wrong to blame others for demanding the few be punished.
And EXACTLY the same is true of Christianity. We're talking about the
differences between Christianity and Islam, not the differences
between radical and mainstream Islam.
Al Klein
posted in alt.atheism:
Are you saying that the majority of Catholics in Africa are racist?