Tech Forum Summary, 8-12-02
BobaBird
Aug 12, 2002
Hosts are Mark Jackson, Sr VP E* Technology Corp and Dave Kummer, VP
Engineering.
AGENDA
- PVR721
- PVR501/508 Features
- PVR - How it Works
- Easy Remote
- iTV - What's New and What's Coming
- HD & PVR
- Q&A
Phone: 1-888-621-2078. E-mail: Tech...@Dishnetwork.com.
[Don't call now - the show's over!]
---------------
Interview with 721 design engineer Dan Rudolph, Manager of the Industrial
Design Group
The team was told to think outside the box which freed them to explore
different shapes and use plastics instead of metal. They noticed the market
trend is toward a silver/platinum color, so that will be used on high-end Dish
receivers. Front connectors detract from a product's appearance so they were
placed behind a smoked lens panel. They went to the homes of DISHPlayer owners
to see how the keyboard was used, saw that people were using the remote
simultaneously because the keys and commands were different, and decided to put
the remote's buttons on the keyboard.
---------------
PVR721 software upgrade coming in September
- PVR events sorted by date, name, or theme
- Timers sorted by name, frequency, type, or recording sequence
- Change channels while recording without having to go through PIP
---------------
PVR501/508 software
- Will send another SERF (Stealth Event Record Feature) video
- Timer and recording management. Can edit a timer by pressing Select from
EPG.
- Manage events in PVR list, sort by name or date
- Saving viewed programming
- "Go to live" warning when trying to change channels while viewing the pause
buffer
- Can rewind from Playback Over
- Local channels mapped to the OTA channel number
- Video to be sent this Tues night. Receiver must be in stand-by (aka OFF),
have at least 1/2 hour of free space, and have no timers set for that
unspecified time. The video has the lowest recording priority. Once recorded
it can viewed, deleted or saved like any other event.
---------------
Local channel re-mapping
- Available on all OpenTV models
- Makes locals easier to find
- Channel can be selected using the OTA number, 700/800 range or 8000 range
- Channels are not duplicated on the satellite and do not take extra bandwidth
that could be used by other channels. It just provides more ways to select the
channel.
They talk about the 501/508 Search feature but don't say what's new
(punctuation is ignored so looking for SG1 will match on SG-1.)
---------------
What is PVR?
Personal Video Recording. A hard drive is added to the receiver to give it VCR
features plus more.
Can Play/Stop, Pause, Watch, Rewind, Skip Back, Skip Ahead, Fast Forward, Fast
Reverse.
Pause your TV show then come back without missing anything.
Automatically records to allow rewinding up to 1 hour on the same channel.
Existing customers can upgrade for $199 and a 1-year commitment to AT150.
It will change how you watch TV and is a great way to get extra value from your
Dish subscription.
---------------
Giveaway
Prize: PVR721.
Question: What is the distance, within 100 miles, from Denver to Baikonour
Cosmodrome?
---------------
Q&A
DBSTalk: Status of HDTV upgrade from Model 5000?
A: With a pre-paid annual subscription to DiscoveryHD, exchange of your HD
modulator (you keep the 5000 itself) and $249 you get a Model 6000 with
Enhanced HD module.
George: When will the 721 keyboard and internet access be available?
A: Don't have a nationwide ISP lined up, don't really need the keyboard without
the internet. They are in talks with Earthlink.
e-mail: Is DishPro switch compatible with standard 22Khz switches?
A: No. Both use DiSEqC but DishPro is designed to handle the stacked output
from DishPro LNBs.
Alex: Will DiscoveryHD be at 148? Still have the offer for the Enhanced HD
module?
A: Yes, 2 weeks ago. Offer good until Aug 15, get the module free with
DiscoveryHD pre-paid for 1 year or 1/2 off if paid monthly.
Jim: 5C copy protection? 8VSB not seeing sub-channels or giving the wrong
audio.
A: Second part first, will look into the 8VSB problem. As for 5C, watch for
1394 announcement later in the show.
Dennis: Salesman said buying an HDTV would require also buying a $600 Model
6000.
A: Most HD sets sold are HDTV-ready meaning they need an external tuner to
display digital channels. The 6000 will get all the HD channels offered by
Dish and can get OTA with an optional module.
---------------
Easy Remote
- Available this Fall.
- Has larger buttons.
- 2 new buttons for selecting Antenna or Dish viewing, only works when using RF
hookup.
After being set-up, the Antenna button will tune your favorite OTA channel and
the Dish button will tune to Ch 3 or 4.
---------------
Interactive TV
- 4900 has Dish Home
- 3900 has Dish Home, gets Customer Support this week
- 501 has Dish Home, has Customer Support, gets Zap2it and Horoscope soon
- 301 gets upgrade in September
Several exciting features already here or coming.
- Sports: Soccer introduced 6/19, baseball on 7/2. Both provide scores and
headlines.
- Games: Rotated monthly, $5/mo subscription. Current free game is Solitaire.
Paid games are Chess, Golf, 3-Pointer, The Wall.
Coming Aug 14: Race, Extra Ball (pinball), Strike (bowling). Free game will be
BlackJack.
Future games are Johnny Megatone and Talisman.
- Dish Lottery: added 7/31. Results and jackpots for several states. Can't
buy tickets through Dish.
- My Scores: Personalized sports scores, track your favorite teams.
- Customer Support: Access your account, pay or view bill, add programming.
Unsubscribed channels will show as green instead of red on the EPG; pressing
Select will take you to the Add Programming screen.
---------------
Echostar 8 (E-VIII)
Launch was delayed due to a broken command module.
It is set to be launched from Pad 23 at Baikonour, 6500 miles away, on Tues Aug
20. Will go to the 110 orbital slot.
Has Ku-band and spot beams, additional service for AK and HI.
Launch to be broadcast on Ch 101 at 12:30am (time zone not given).
---------------
Giveaway
721 winner is Michael Aparovich (sp?) of Atlanta, GA (that's 2 in a row for
GA).
Answer is 6479. His response was e-mailed before Dave slipped the answer.
---------------
HD & PVR
Sneak preview of the JVC TU-PVR9000
- Collaboration between Dish and JVC. Built on the same chassis as the PVR721.
- 120GB hard drive records 120 hours of standard or 18 hours HDTV.
- 1394 interface (iLINK) with DTCP for connection to new JVC D-VHS VCR which
can record from the 9000 or play D-Theater tapes.
Shares a lot with the 721
- CallerID with History
- 2 tuners with PIP
- PVR functions also work on HDTV channels
- Optical digital audio output
- 7-day EPG
- More! Available in late Fall
---------------
Q&A
They have gotten many complaints about the latency of the guide. The guide has
gotten much larger with the addition of local channels. It now takes longer
for the guide to loop around to the day/time you are looking for. They hope to
find a way to improve performance on receivers not equipped with a hard drive.
On the 301 and 4900, the PIP disappears when navigating the EPG because the
guide information is streamed from a different satellite transponder than the
one the viewed channel comes from. When the guide is updated the receiver
tunes back to the channel and the PIP returns.
Steve: Internet on the 721 like WebTV or is it open? Which browser?
A from Dan Minnick, VP Software: Must use the ISP they partner with. Uses
Device Mosaic from OpenTV. They will not attempt nearly as much morphing as
WebTV to get a page to fit on the TV screen which should leave sites more
readable but the user will have to scroll across more.
David: Will 6000 get DVI upgrade? Can the 9000 record HDTV?
A: No, the expansion slots which had been somewhat secret are now both
occupied. Yes, to the hard drive or JVC's new D-VHS VCR.
Robert: How many HD channels? Reason for the Enhanced HD module?
A: Showtime, HBO, PPV, DiscoveryHD, Demo (61.5 only). Don't forget CBS if you
qualify. The module allows them to use a new compression format so they can
put more HD channels on a transponder. New HD channels will be in the Enhanced
format.
David: Are DirecTV receivers compatible with Dish?
A: The merger should be supported. Which technology the merged company will
use has not been decided. New Dish receivers should work either way, DirecTV
is starting to design in this flexibility.
Scott: Has a 75" HDTV, wants to clear up the fuzzy picture. Price on 9000?
A: It is because standard programming is being blown up on a large screen
capable of showing fine detail. 9000 price has not been announced.
John: Slow motion for the 501?
A: It's on the list, probably an early October release with frame advance and
reverse.
John: Any change in service to AK, more signal strength from 110?
A: E-VIII has a spot beam for AK locals, don't know how general programming
will be affected.
---------------
Next Charlie Chat is Mon Sep 9, 9:00pm Eastern
Daryl
Industrial
> Design Group
That interview was the worst editing job I've ever seen on anything. It
should become a classic used in video classes on how NOT to make a
video. It looked like someone got a new effects/transition generator
and wanted to try out everything it could do, over and over and over.
Daryl
73115...@compuserve.com
>Jim: 5C copy protection? 8VSB not seeing sub-channels or giving the wrong
>audio.
>A: Second part first, will look into the 8VSB problem. As for 5C, watch for
>1394 announcement later in the show.
What's this about?
--
"Does the player exist in any human endeavour
Who's been known to resist sirens of fame and possessions?
They will destroy you, not rivals, not age, not success."
Barry Brown
<da...@NOSPAMPLEASEmaurymw.com> wrote:
Agreed! Who said what about the medium and the message? I wonder how
much they paid for this abomination?
Tom Lawrence
HD content will have an embedded copy protection system, that all HD gear
will abide by. Specifically, this "copy-once" feature will allow you to
record an HD event EITHER to the 9000's hard drive, OR send it out the 1394
port to a D-VHS deck. However, you then won't be able to play it from the
D-VHS deck and record it on another device - like a DVD recorded - because
it's already been copied once. Similarly, if it's recorded to the 9000's
HD, you then won't be able to dump it out to D-VHS. The idea here is to
prevent someone from mass-duplicating content.
Bill R
You are both right on the money. That had to be one of
the WORST editing jobs ever seen on the DISH network.
My guess is that some summer intern was turned loose in
the editing room and tried to make it "artistic". It
was anything but artistic and sure did take a lot away
from Dan's interview.
--
Bill R.
Remove NO_SPAM_TO_ in e-mail address to reply by e-mail
Scott Greczkowski
Thanks! And GREAT Job!
Scott
DBSTalk.COM
On 13 Aug 2002 04:10:30 GMT, boba...@aol.comspamfree (BobaBird)
wrote:
Bob Lindabury
The 721 has just about the most basic of features in any PVR product. It's
a small step above the 508 and still behind a Tivo Version 1!
While it's feature set is ok and comes in line with the current crop of
PVR's on the market, it's certainly NOT thinking outside the box unless all
they were talking about was the actual design of the case! And even then..
pfftt!
Current Dish PVR's are nothing more than VCR's with hard drives! Sure they
have a couple more features but c'mon... none of them are *advanced*.
None of them support the ability for you to enter in some things you might
want to see in the future. Say I want to catch the next time "Forest Gump"
plays. Say I want to further refine that to have my PVR record the next
time Forest Gump plays in Letterbox with DD5.1 audio? Can't do it. Let's
get some *REAL* features into these boxes!
How about If I have 3 PVR's in various locations in my house and I've
recorded a kids show on the one in the living room but now they want to
watch it downstairs in the family room? Can't do it without running a batch
of analog cables or rabbits or some other such garbage all over the house..
but you know what, if these darn things networked, I'd just plug them into
the RJ-45 and play it from the one upstairs.. or better yet, via wireless.
Yeah.. let's think outside the box and come up with using Silver (Feh! All
my components are black! I don't want some silver abomination shining back
at me as I'm trying to watch movies in my darkened room) as the cheap box
cover color. Yeah..that's the ticket. Way to think out of the box Dish...
keep it up.. Yeah..those are some kick-ass updates to the software..
sorting.. whoohoo... more out of the box thinking.. lol Should have just
called them bug-fixes.. jesus..
The Moxie or whatever it was called is thinking outside of the box. The 721
is so inside the box it's rediculous.
A frustrated
-- Bob Lindabury
"BobaBird" <boba...@aol.comspamfree> wrote in message
news:20020813001030...@mb-fo.aol.com...
> Technical Forum
> Aug 12, 2002
>
> Hosts are Mark Jackson, Sr VP E* Technology Corp and Dave Kummer, VP
> Engineering.
>
> AGENDA
> - PVR721
John Lodge
Even Mark and Dave and made a comment. Now that I think about it maybe "I
was outside the BOX".
John
The Unthinkable
"John Lodge" <jlodge...@mindex.com> wrote in message
news:3D59271C...@mindex.com...
> Barry,
> Even Mark and Dave and made a comment. Now that I think about it maybe "I
> was outside the BOX".
>
> John
I liked the quip about someone having Tourettes Syndrome. Who says
engineers
have no sense of humor?!
Dixie Normus
"Bob Lindabury" <b...@lindabury.net-nospam> wrote in message
news:ej969.158180$D8.55...@news4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net...
Sean
That's a shame. You'd think the hard drive wouldn't count as a generation,
since it's inherently temporary.
...Sean.
SwampHHH
in the 80's I tried to achieve everything under the sun to video tape but as
I look back I think that was really stupid. I mean what was I ever going to
do with every episode of Cheers. (Especially now since I have banished all
magnetic tape from my house and no longer own a VCR.) But since you can only
hold 18 hours of HD on the drive I do think they should let you have one
copy from the tape to VCR or to DVDR in a future evolution.
"Sean" <Stalk...@excite.com> wrote in message
news:slrnalinck.j...@thehill.comcast.net...
SwampHHH
black, is a big reason I've not bought one. It would look so stupid next to
my other components. Now I know the industry has embraced silver/chrome
before. But judging from the last time I was at Tweeter's, I am not so sure
there is a switch ongoing.
Swamp
"Bob Lindabury" <b...@lindabury.net-nospam> wrote in message
news:ej969.158180
>
Cyberia
> since it's inherently temporary.
...or at least allow *one time* to transfer from HD to tape.
--
---------------
SeeYa !
--------------
Hello....... Is this thing on ?
"An unquestioned answer is more dangerous than an unanswered question." -
Unknown
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Alan Dana
Now these two things are exciting! The JVC 9000 is still real, apparently built on the 721
platform,
thus it can get to market before the long-awaiting 921. Might be interesting to
watch and see if the 921 changes form before it comes out (if ever). With
the 9000 offering HDTV, 1394, dual tuners, & more, it sounds a lot like
the 921 prototype shown at 2002 CES.
No mention of it having DVI, which is already appearing on the new DTV
HD receivers/tuners.
Although I sure hope that 120GB of hard drive cannot record 120 hours of
standard programming!!! A hint of compression to come???
And the suggestion that the 9000, and perhaps the 721, already have some capability
to use either DTV or a future standard that Echostar is considering.
Alan
"BobaBird" <boba...@aol.comspamfree> wrote in message
news:20020813001030...@mb-fo.aol.com...
> HD & PVR
> Sneak preview of the JVC TU-PVR9000
>
> - Collaboration between Dish and JVC. Built on the same chassis as the PVR721.
> - 120GB hard drive records 120 hours of standard or 18 hours HDTV.
> - 1394 interface (iLINK) with DTCP for connection to new JVC D-VHS VCR which
> can record from the 9000 or play D-Theater tapes.
>
> Shares a lot with the 721
> - CallerID with History
> - 2 tuners with PIP
> - PVR functions also work on HDTV channels
> - Optical digital audio output
> - 7-day EPG
> - More! Available in late Fall
...
Jim Pullen
I have a couple of questions regarding your summary of the PVR501/508
software. What is a SERF video, and what is the video being sent Tuesday
night?
Thanks,
Jim
----- Original Message -----
From: "BobaBird" <boba...@aol.comspamfree>
Newsgroups: alt.dbs.echostar
Sent: Monday, August 12, 2002 11:10 PM
Subject: Tech Forum Summary, 8-12-02
> Technical Forum
> Aug 12, 2002
>
>
73115...@compuserve.com
>What is a SERF video, and what is the video being sent Tuesday
>night?
Dish has the ability to send video directly to your PVR hard drive - even if you
did not explicitly select a show to be recorded. It shows up in your list of
recorded shows.
There are certain conditions before this happens - your machine must be idle and
there has to be room on the drive.
They did this about a year ago when they sent out a short recording that
described some new features in the software. I suspect they will do the same
tonight.
It's a nice feature as long as they don't abuse it by sending out advertising.
Bob Lindabury
My whole point was based on the "thinking outside the box" comment made on
the show and what I'd personally like to see in a PVR. Yes, lack of
name-based recording might not be a liability for you but it sure is for
others.
I'd just like to see one of these boxes actually deliver something other
than VCR features on steroids. There's a lot more I'd like in a PVR but I'm
not about to list a full rundown of everything I want here.
It just makes me laugh when I hear such things at the box comment and then
what they come up with is a silver box. LOL For the price of the 721 (for
existing customers), and the length of time it was in development, you'd
think it would have more advanced features. Nine day guide? Pfft..
I guess what we really need is a company that can produce an EPG that's
accurate.
Like right now.. I saw a few fall season show promos I want to catch when
they come on. I don't want to have to remember when they're going to air.
Hell, I don't give a damn when they air. I'd like to just type in the show
name and say "record show X when it comes on this fall and keep recording it
every time it airs". But alas.. the 721 with the "out of the box" thought
put into can't do that. Wait, I don't even want to type it in! I want to
see the promo and then hit a button that will automatically tell my PVR to
record the show being mentioned in the promo when it airs!
Hey.. how about Thunderbirds on Tech TV? When I FIRST heard it was going
to air I just wanted to be able to set up my PVR to record Thunderbirds on
TechTV when it airs and to NOT DUPLICATE recordings.
Is this too much to ask? I think not!
Do you see my point? I want to be able to set and forget it. Watch what I
want when I want at that point. Maybe this isn't something your interested
in but I sure am. I don't want to have to babysit my PVR like you have to
babysit a VCR.
-- Bob Lindabury.
"Ken Stuart" <kst...@ev1.net> wrote in message
news:k8lilu8g8vodu1b6e...@4ax.com...
>
> By the way, I do agree with you that the 721 is not an "advanced" product.
> However, I disagree that the lack of name-based recording is any sort of
> liability.
> --
> Cheers,
>
> Ken
> kst...@ev1.net
John Lodge
The real reason for the delay on the release of the 721 was buried late into
the show. If you were watching, the last questions related to if any of Dish
Networks current receiver would be able to use Dish, and or DirecTV's
encryption/decrpytion or a new standard. Mark stated that some of the newest
receivers would be compatible with either or, also rather sheepishly I might
add.
I would guess that this was one of the biggest reasons for the delayed
rollout of the 721 if the truth were told.
Bob Lindabury wrote:
> Ken,
>
> It just makes me laugh when I hear such things at the box comment and then
> what they come up with is a silver box. LOL For the price of the 721 (for
> existing customers), and the length of time it was in development, you'd
> think it would have more advanced features. Nine day guide? Pfft..
> (snip)
>
> -- Bob Lindabury.
>
Alan Dana
"Ken Stuart" <kst...@ev1.net> wrote:
> "Alan Dana" <alan...@hotmail.com> was kind enough to mention:
>
>> And the suggestion that the 9000, and perhaps the 721, already have some
>> capability
>> to use either DTV or a future standard that Echostar is considering.
>
> Which of the 7023032456 acronyms that come out as "DTV" are you referring to
> here?
Why the very one to whom I included a reference in my post ... DirecTV.
Alan
TNGTony
"SwampHHH" <sw...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:dde69.8268$iP2.5...@twister.southeast.rr.com...
> I couldn't agree more. The fact that the box is silver, with no option for
> black, is a big reason I've not bought one. It would look so stupid next
to
> my other components. Now I know the industry has embraced silver/chrome
> before. But judging from the last time I was at Tweeter's, I am not so
sure
> there is a switch ongoing.
It's kind of funny...when I was selling electronics back in 84, all the
electronic equipment was silver (except the crappy champaigne gold Pioneer
that flopped). Way back into the 70's and late 60's most electronics were
wooden cases with silver faces and trim then gray metal cases with silver
faces and finally in the 80's gray plastic cases with silver fronts. When
Black components started to filter in, I said EXACTLY the same thing about
black as you did about silver. "looks stupid next to silver". "No one is
going to buy them."
Well...I'm just glad I wasn't the buyer for the company. :-)
I doubt that Silver will make a come-back as the "standard" color. But I'm
not going to bet the farm on it. :-)
See ya
Tony
Ed Ellers
"HD content will have an embedded copy protection system, that all HD gear
will abide by. Specifically, this "copy-once" feature will allow you to
record an HD event EITHER to the 9000's hard drive, OR send it out the 1394
port to a D-VHS deck."
More likely, some non-broadcast programs may be encoded so that they can be
recorded on the hard disk, but not to the D-VHS VCR (or any other
removable-media device) at all -- i.e. you can time-shift, but not archive
programming.
Brian
know what channel it is?
Bob
"Bob Lindabury" <b...@lindabury.net-nospam> wrote in message
Much of what you ask for is protected by patents. Perhaps when dish and
direct TV merge, dish will be allowed to use Tivo's intellectual property
protected by patents. By the way, dish has already been sued by people for
using certain PVR technologies. (And dish won.) If dish keeps the PVR the
way it is now (a glorified VCR), then dish is safe; if they add Tivo-like
features, dish could get sued and lose.
Jeff Burris
> Think outside the box?? C'mon!
>
> The 721 has just about the most basic of features in any PVR product. It's
> a small step above the 508 and still behind a Tivo Version 1!
>
> While it's feature set is ok and comes in line with the current crop of
> PVR's on the market, it's certainly NOT thinking outside the box unless all
> they were talking about was the actual design of the case! And even then..
> pfftt!
>
> Current Dish PVR's are nothing more than VCR's with hard drives! Sure they
> have a couple more features but c'mon... none of them are *advanced*.
I don't have one of these yet, but from what I understand they still don't have
slow-motion or frame-step. So they don't even have some *basic* VCR features,
let alone *advanced*.
--
Jeff Burris
Salina, Kansas
TNGTony
"Brian" <bk...@twcny.rr.com> wrote in message
news:3D5A3085...@twcny.rr.com...
> Also mentioned that Discovery HD Theatre now being carried on 148
satellite. Anyone
> know what channel it is?
9420
--
See ya http://www.dishchannelchart.com
Tony http://www.echostaruser.com
http://echostar.swiki.net
John Lodge
Frame advance and slow motion, both forward and reverse are coming in Late
September or October, according to the Tech Chat.
John
BobaBird
>Yeah.. let's think outside the box and come up with using Silver (Feh! All
>my components are black! I don't want some silver abomination shining back
>at me as I'm trying to watch movies in my darkened room) as the cheap box
>cover color. Yeah..that's the ticket. Way to think out of the box Dish...
>keep it up..
Yep, it's a great incentive for me to buy something else. I can see how silver
might be attractive, but the last time it was widely used (thanks TNGTony) was
before stereo TV, home video, and home theater. Many people now have their A/V
components above, below, or beside their TV and so wish to keep them minimally
distracting.
Charles
p.s. Now that I got my internet access problem fixed (lonnng 36 hours) the
summary has been posted on the EKB with nicer formatting and more links.
http://echostar.swiki.net/180
MediaMills
wrote:
>Jeff,
>
> Frame advance and slow motion, both forward and reverse are coming in Late
>September or October, according to the Tech Chat.
>
>John
What year? *snicker snicker*
Paul
Milton Scritsmier
> Nice summary.
>
> Now these two things are exciting! The JVC 9000 is still real, apparently built on the 721
> platform,
> thus it can get to market before the long-awaiting 921. Might be interesting to
> watch and see if the 921 changes form before it comes out (if ever). With
> the 9000 offering HDTV, 1394, dual tuners, & more, it sounds a lot like
> the 921 prototype shown at 2002 CES.
>
> No mention of it having DVI, which is already appearing on the new DTV
> HD receivers/tuners.
The answer seems to be yes. Protos of the JVC 9000 have been shown
before, here are some comments on it:
At
http://www.dvhsmovieguide.com/messageboard/message_detail.lasso?-token=Software&msg=3
from Gary Reber (editor of Widescreen Review, which
has been pushing D-VHS and D-Theater and which has
some inside knowledge about JVC's plans) on 6/1/2002:
"JVC plans to introduce their model TU-9000 as early as
September. The TU-9000 is a HDTV PVR, which is expected to
include a 120 GB hard disk drive and an ATSC over-the-air
tuner, in addition to dual-tuner standard/high-definition
decoding for EchoStar's DISH Network services. However, the
unit is expected to only stream one high-definition channel at
a time. The TU-9000 will also include both IEEE 1394 and DVI
with HDCP digital connectors. The IEEE 1394 connector will link
the PVR to JVC's HM-DH30000U D-VHS VCR to make tape-based
copies of HDTV programs. But programming that studios have
decided to copy protect will not be recordable by the D-VHS
digital VCR.
"While it appears DISH Network HD programming may be recordable
via the IEEE 1394 interface, this does not appear to be the
case with DirecTV."
From http://www.guidetohometheater.com/shownews.cgi?1300
"May 20, 2002 - Home theater fans will enjoy perusing JVC's new
video products—especially its combination digital TV decoder
and high-def–capable hard disk recorder, due at dealers this
fall.
"At its mid-May press conference, JVC showed the TU-9000, a
prototype HDTV tuner with built-in hard drive. The consumer
version is projected to include a 120GB hard disk drive and an
ATSC over-the-air tuner, as well as dual-tuner
standard/high-definition decoding for EchoStar's DISH Network.
The TU-9000 will stream only one HD channel at a time,
according to JVC marketing executive Al Levene. Connections on
the TU-9000 will include DVI and IEEE-1394 ("FireWire"). The
1394 connector will yoke the PVR to JVC's HM-DH30000U D-VHS
VCR, allowing users to make tape copies of HDTV programs.
"JVC is also pushing a new line of HD-capable D-VHS VCRs, to
debut in June with the simultaneous launch of the first
pre-recorded HDTV D-VHS movies encoded with "D-Theater" copy
protection, a proprietary JVC technology said to prevent
unauthorized duplication of feature films and other valuable
content. Artisan, DreamWorks, Fox, and Universal have all
committed to release HDTV titles in the D-Theater format this
year. The tapes will be playable only on D-Theater machines,
according to JVC executives.
"JVC will encourage cooperation between software and hardware
retailers with a referral program, according to Consumer Video
vice president Jerry Barbera. The company expects that most
initial HDTV D-VHS movie sales will occur through electronics
stores and Internet distributors."
And from http://www.dtvmax.com/main.htm in the August newsletter
a price is mentioned:
"JVC has announced a new Dishnetwork HD set-top-box that
included a hard disc drive based high definition personal video
recorder. The model TU-9000 should be available in the
September/October 2002 timeframe for $1999. The unit will
include a IEEE 1394 (firewire) interface that will allow for HD
recording to be transferred to an external D-VHS digital VCR."
Milton Scritsmier
>
> Now these two things are exciting! The JVC 9000 is still real, apparently built on the 721
> platform,
> thus it can get to market before the long-awaiting 921. Might be interesting to
> watch and see if the 921 changes form before it comes out (if ever). With
> the 9000 offering HDTV, 1394, dual tuners, & more, it sounds a lot like
> the 921 prototype shown at 2002 CES.
>
It seems quite likely to me that the JVC 9000 and the Dish 921
are one and the same. While Echostar has announced a HDTV PVR
satellite receiver, have they ever formally announced a
"921"? At www.dishretailer.com there are some photos of a
Dish HDTV PVR receiver shown at the Dish Network Team Summit
on April 16th-20th, 2002. A features sign never mentions a "921"
that I can see, but describes many of the features of the
JVC 9000 revealed during the tech talk. Check out
http://www.dishretailer.com/ts2002/Index.html
(The pictures are labeled with a 921, but their contents
aren't that I can tell).
Why would Echostar work so closely with JVC, selling them
hardware designs, 721 code, and even packaging and then do
their own product which would likely be identical and
later to market? Besides, this is a low-volume, high-end
market. Is there room for *two* HDTV PVR Dish receivers?
Also, we know that Echostar was burned by their experience
with using outside code (from Microsoft?) on their first PVRs.
That's why they brought later PVR software development in-house.
Would they trust JVC or anybody else with a separate code branch
for a product that consumers will closely identify with Dish?
As others have noted, on a PVR the hardware is a given and the
software *is* the product.
Alan Dana
5b327120.0208...@posting.google.com, "Milton Scritsmier"
<google...@dea.spamcon.org> wrote:
Good points all. But Dish did feature the 921 at the 2002
CES, with no JVC reps in sight. Dish had their England-
based 921 development team at the show. That unit did not
appear to be based on the 721, or at least if it was, then
it was well disguised. It had a 160MB hard disk and no
DVI port. The software interface was also much different
than the 721, which was being demo'ed just a few feet away.
Also different remotes and I don't remember seeing anything
like the 721 keyboard at the 921 booth.
My take on this is that Dish/Echostar did have a different
HDTV PVR in development, the original 921. But somewhere
along the line, it may have been merged into a new
product based on the 721 platform, with development
being shifted to JVC.
At $1999, this is indeed a very limited audience product.
Alan