Voting - without the WP formatting! OOPS
GarethInVegas
>Imagine if you will a new political order where affairs of the state are
>voted on by every voting citizen as and when they arise. Important issues
>like, Joining the EU,
I dont know anyone outside the professional political classes who *really*
gives a toss about joining the Euro (that is EURO - we are already in the EU)
apart from a care in the community patient who hassled me in the street the
other day.
> Air Traffic Control
I suppose - it's again not hardly a burning issue.
>Fox Hunting
Apart from the countryside alliance and it's opponents, nobody *really* cares
one way or the other
>Moral Education
Ah - see where it is going yet?
>Transport & Freight,
Mmmmmm? Transport is an issue but frieght? Surely a transport system takes into
account freight? Why single it out, unless you are aiming for a particular
brand of law in your favour - think tr*ckers.....
>Farming Economy
OK, those poor farmers. Been subsidised for years, far more than - say - the
mines were. And yet they are still going bankrupt. Odd that, innit?
>Millennium Dome Sale
The Millennium Dome was an issue. The sale of it? Who cares, get it off our
hands. Unless of course you are slanting something against the government in
power. The real meat comes next (after some irrelevant stuff being snipped):-
>Gay rights in education, Criminal
>Justice Bill, Nurses Pay, Illegal immigrants, Rampant Aides, Tax Burden,
>Filthy ghettoes.
Ooooooh. A nice wish list of issues for the rampant right(with the exception of
"nurses pay" but then again, we have to throw something in for the
compassionate classes dont we?). Nothing there about - say - the rights of
workers - oh no, they aren't *important* are they? Nothing there about the
obscene amounts spent on defence every year, nothing there about - say -
decriminalising cannabis, or all major drugs. Look at the wording of the last
"issue" - "Filthy ghettoes" - why is the poster concerned about them? Is he
concerned for the people living in them, in filth? Or is he concerned about his
country being "dirtied" by the presence of immigrants?
Most people are worried about losing their job, being treated quickly on the
NHS, their childrens education, their mortgage and crime. Your so called list
of "important issues" is not anything that resembles these concerns. I don't
know anyone who really gives a toss one way or the other.
Of course, the list will now prove me wrong, and i will be called to task for
being unnecessarily confrontational.
Gareth
Lucky Larry
GarethInVegas <gareth...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20010114132339...@ng-fj1.aol.com...
Garry!, here is the answer to your prayers.
Here is the way for you to provide the Pollys with your personal viewpoint.
Like minded people will be able to voice their concerns,their desires and
all of you can come together as a lump to influence the minds of the pollys.
It may be a forerunner to my dream of referendum government, it certainly
bears scrutiny, it will attract deriders or critics, what doesn't, but it
provides an opportunity for those amongst us to have a much more direct
voice in government here and now.
Paul
> parliament can COMMUNICATE with the public and vice versa
How about the network of lottery terminals - they seem pretty well suited
for the job!
JHS
Paul wrote:
Brilliant! You could have votes all the time at the cost of
oh say a £1. Though I'm not sure the govt would like
the lottery being that closely linked with itself.
JHS
bald'n'fat
His posting clearly tells us that there is an electorate who have given up,
become cynical, don't care a toss
Put it to the vote, Gareth
The vote will always be the carry pigeon mate regardless of which way you
look at it
bald'n'fat
"Princess Margaret can have my condolences as long as she returns them when
I become ill from whisky swilling self abuse and unrestrained profligacy"
Michael Macpherson
<intel...@koffeemail.com> wrote:
Rather than replacing the whole democratic system with instant voting
on multiple issues would not the introduction of well-tried methods of
direct democracy be more likely to win public support, as well as being
wiser in the sense that we do not aim to replace a whole system
overnight but to gradually introduce new practices?
Taking a look at the Swiss and US-american models of citizens'
initiative and referendum is a good way to start. For Britain we do not
have to copy these exactly but there is a wealth of experience to learn
from, gathered over many years. This experience seems largely unknown
in Great Britain.
I see it as an advantage that the constituents of a political unit
(town, region, state, union), are neither expected nor compelled to
vote on all or too many public issues. Only a few, usually important
issues (those which can gather enough support for the initiative's
proposal) go forward to consideration in council or parliament, some
further to referendum. Citizen-referenda are not imposed "from above";
they are _not_ populist plebiscites called by politicians or tribunes.
Citizen-referenda originate from a broader base in the population than
do (often vaguely formulated and unreliable) statements in party
manifestos. They can arise between elections as well as at election
times (c.f. ballot issues).
There's more about how real direct democracy works at John Harvey's
website and at my new Citizens' Initiative I&R site. Sources of
reference are the University of Geneva in Switzeralnd and the
Initiative and Referendum I&R Institute in USA. (URLs at my site).
Also, my recent talk at a meeting about european governance (Assembly
of the European Regions) contains a presentation about I&R. (WWW links
below)
Digital communication could help the processes of direct democracy.
One way is to facilitate the collection of signatures for citizens'
initiative proposals. This part of the procedure is not secret
(handwritten signatures may be collected in public offices and open
spaces) so the argument against e-voting, that the identity of the
voter cannot be protected, is not relevant. More important than
e-signatures would be the capacity of digital communication to enable
better information and easier debate on the issues in question.
Cheers,
Michael Wallace-Macpherson
Citizens' Initiative I&R
http://iniref.tripod.com/index.html
Vote for more democracy at
http://www.sztaki.hu/servlets/voting/call
See seminar video at the Assembly of the European Regions AER web site
http://www.are-regions-europe.org My lecture "The possibilities of
information technology to improve and develop democracy and democratic
processes" is in second part of the video
http://www.netpres.com/aer/sali.ram The Scottish Parliament, with
queen, follows my talk. (You need a recent version of RealPlayer)
John Harvey's site is at http://www.homeusers.prestel.co.uk/rodmell/