Electra by PdF - opinions please
Dan Mordechay
Atom Legend with Techno 155 and Elecra 170 !
I'm gonna jump on in my first jump in few days.
Anyone jumped the Electra ?
how is it people ?
openinngs, steering, flares ?
can i swoop with that ? hook turn ?
opinions please!
(if u can compare it to other canopy u know or u jump with)
in a ledder from 1 to 10, what mark will U give it?
Blue Skies
Dan Mordechay
A-37509
IB1
if people tell you it's horrid, well it's too late to do anything about it..
anyway....
my very humble opinion ....
i have flown a 170 and a 150, they are very similar to the merit...
(surprise surprise)
they ... sink alot... especialy compared to a sabre or stiletto..
otherwise handle nicely, steering is positive (when loaded 1.35 anyway)...
lots of flare... fairly forgiving....opens a little hard(but i suspect dodgy
packing)....
i am of the opinion that the lines and canopy material doesn't last as long
as say a PD...
out of 10 .... i'd give it 7 (docking marks for quality and glide)
enjoy....
"Dan Mordechay" <mind...@runbox.com> wrote in message
news:9r2cdr$r8pp2$1...@ID-55969.news.dfncis.de...
Caroline Hughes
decided to share it with the group in the hope that a) it will make me feel
better! and b)
that I may find other people who have (or are still having) a similar
problem......
I ordered my Atom Legend in mid-May via my dealer and delivery was estimated
at 10 weeks. It wasn't long before I was told about a whole host of problems
occurred at PDF resulting in the delay to many rigs ordered in May and June.
During June and July, PDF repeatedly changed my expected delivery dates via
my dealer. Over the two month period my expected (verbal) delivery dates
were (in order);
1. End of November
2. End of July
3. Early September
4. Middle of September
At this point I had accepted they were experiencing problems and just sat it
out.....
In August PDF went on their national holiday for a month and I was told via
my dealer that my rig was nearing the end of the production process and I
should
expect it in September. At the beginning of September PDF told my dealer it
wouldn't be ready until mid-October.
Being pretty annoyed by this point I emailed PDF direct, explained that I
was unhappy, and asked for one final confirmed delivery date (however bad it
was) so
I could at least make plans to sell my current kit. They replied with an
apology (but offered no explanation) and promised that my rig would be with
me
by the second week of October. As a 'peace offering' they promised a free
gear bag to make up for the long wait. I accepted this offer with thanks
and prepared myself to wait a bit longer.
The second week of October has now been and gone and the latest date for
delivery is anyone's guess (although PDF via my dealer assures
that it will be in the next week or so....).
I emailed PDF again last week to ask them why yet another 'promised'
delivery date failed to materialise. I also asked them why I have recently
'been told' that there are skydivers in the UK who ordered their Atom Legend
just 10 weeks ago have received it already. Over five months have passed
for me and I am STILL waiting.....
I have received no reply yet to this latest email.
PDF are currently (and I understand, have been for some time) quoting a 10
week delivery timescale. The sad fact is that if this is true and I had
cancelled and re-ordered my Atom Legend I may have it by now..... (?)
The whole situation makes me question whether PDF have adopted a policy that
'a few VERY annoyed customers' is better than 'many slightly annoyed
customers'. Clearly, if the 'rumour' of recently honoured 10 week deliveries
since my order date are true, I am not seen as a priority - despite PDF
knowing how I feel.
So my questions to those of you who are still reading, is;
Do you know of anyone who has recently received or is still waiting for
their Atom Legend to be delivered?
If so can you let me know roughly when they ordered?
If anyone is in the same boat as me - perhaps we could set up a support
group! ;-)
Needless to say I continue to look forward to the arrival of my new
container - and to be able to finally hook it up to the main and reserve
that have been gathering dust on a shelf since July!
Blue skies,
C.
--
Caroline
http://www.geocities.com/skydivecaroline/index.htm
Gary McGuinness
but everything I hear sounds no good at all, although everybody praises the
containers.
1) Dealers are locked into a contract, which restricts them on doing deals.
2) Had a friend who phoned them as he needed to replace a few worn lines,
they flatly refused to tell him the line lengths that he wanted to know.
3) Have heard (allegedly) that 20% of canopies have to go back for
re-adjusting.
I take what you have said Caroline and what else I have heard as them coming
across as a bit arrogant.
Have been waiting for my Oxygn helmet since May/early June, it was going to
be 10 weeks, that was 21/22 weeks ago, all I wanted was an O2 mod and
blue/white lightening design.
I also queried the fact that there was no correlation between one of the 40
designs you could have, and what those designs were called (the pictures of
the designs and the names of the designs are in totally separate pages), and
got an abrupt reply.
I wonder if I get it when I go to FL next month it will be in the 24 week
zone then.
What ever happened to customer service.
Gary
"Caroline Hughes" <carolin...@btinternet.com.NOSPAM> wrote in message
news:9r3p7j$qj2$1...@pheidippides.axion.bt.co.uk...
Martin Evans
"Gary McGuinness" <NOgar...@NOwhich.SPAMnet> wrote in message
news:JreB7.47234$uh1.5...@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com...
>
>
>
> "Caroline Hughes" <carolin...@btinternet.com.NOSPAM> wrote in message
> news:9r3p7j$qj2$1...@pheidippides.axion.bt.co.uk...
> > I have had an 'interesting' experience with my Atom Legend order and
have
> > decided to share it with the group in the hope that a) it will make me
> feel
> > better! and b)
> > that I may find other people who have (or are still having) a similar
> > problem......
> I take what you have said Caroline and what else I have heard as them
coming
> across as a bit arrogant.
But of course, they are French!
> Have been waiting for my Oxygn helmet since May/early June, it was going
to
> be 10 weeks, that was 21/22 weeks ago, all I wanted was an O2 mod and
> blue/white lightening design.
> What ever happened to customer service.
Too many yuppie jumpers prepared to pay through the nose, accept shite
service and substandard work. Not only that but the next time they want
something they'll order from the same companies and dealers that they are
bitching about now!
Skydivers...ya gotta love 'em!
--
Blue ones,
Stay Safe.
Martin Evans.
For information about Sky-Eye Skydiving Services please visit our website
at:
http://www.skyeyeskydiving.com
After browsing please follow the link to Skydive Delmarva.
"Never confuse movement with action". Ernest Hemingway
> >
> > --
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
Dan Mordechay
When i ordered my rig (mid july) i was told by the dealer that the rig will
be here at Oct 21. at Oct 18 he called me and said it's here.
if i read this thread be4 i wouldnt have buy this rig.
but i'm really happy now and the service was great until now and i hope
it'll contunue that way.
i'm looking forward jumping it on the weekend.
but there was one thing....
i ordered the new color (blue light fire).
the color that arrived is more green then light blue. and it doesnt look
like fire at all. it's green with stains.
what PDF really blow up is the fact that in my dealer's computer the color
was blue light.
y????
some1 knows this color ?
Caroline Hughes
significantly later
than mine HAVE been delivered.
I wonder what possible excuse could be given for this - I am waiting for
that reply from PDF with great anticipation!
Since posting I have also learnt that I am not the only one suffering
identically
at the hands of PDF. It at least feels better to know that I am not alone.
Details of support group to follow.....
-
But what can we do apart from tell everyone?
I know I won't buy PDF kit again ..... and if I'd not been so understanding
of PDF's
predicament in the first place, or paid a large amount upfront, I'd have
cancelled the
order long ago....
C.
"Dan Mordechay" <mind...@runbox.com> wrote in message
news:9r42eu$riud0$1...@ID-55969.news.dfncis.de...
Ford1fly
finally arrived it opened incredibly hard every time..(built by precision) I
got in contact with Simon Mundell at Icarus and discussed the situation and he
promised me a brand new VX (built in Spain)..5 weeks later I have a brand new
VX.... she opens beautifully
Fordy
Geoff
"Ford1fly" <ford...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20011023134002...@mb-bk.aol.com...
freeflyer
>
> i am of the opinion that the lines and canopy material doesn't last as long
> as say a PD...
Does this opinion have basis in any tests done, or did you
just grab it out of thin air?
--
Espen
ALF#1
freeflyer
>
> Have been waiting for my Oxygn helmet since May/early June, it was going to
> be 10 weeks, that was 21/22 weeks ago, all I wanted was an O2 mod and
> blue/white lightening design.
> I also queried the fact that there was no correlation between one of the 40
> designs you could have, and what those designs were called (the pictures of
> the designs and the names of the designs are in totally separate pages), and
> got an abrupt reply.
Is this a gripe against PdF or SkySystems?
Geoff
"freeflyer" <free...@freeflyer.no> wrote in message
news:3BD5CADA...@freeflyer.no...
freeflyer
>>
>>
>>>i am of the opinion that the lines and canopy material doesn't last as
>>>
> long
>
>>>as say a PD...
>>>
>>Does this opinion have basis in any tests done, or did you
>>just grab it out of thin air?
> I thought the lines were exactly the same material, no?
That depends on what canopy you're talking about afaik. Just
saying "canopy material and lines" is way too general.
Still waiting for an answer from IB1
Caroline Hughes
wrong...... :-o
Dan Mordechay
We should send this thread to PdF. it's really not right!
Blue Ones
Dan
Caroline Hughes <carolin...@btinternet.com.NOSPAM> wrote in message
news:u4kB7.54440$uh1.6...@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com...
Simon Smith
Don't hold your breath!
This is the guy who, last month, said that French gear was not as good
quality as American, but couldn't back it up beyond saying that it was
something someone had possibly said and then stopped replying to
questions.
He may be right (I really don't think so) but if so it's pure
accident: my current container has been jumping longer than he has :)
--
Simon
si...@quintuslink.com
www.quintuslink.com/Grid.html
ql.Grid: an unbound Windows.Forms grid control
IB1
it is based on experience of jumpers at my club and riggers at my club...
and what i have seen when packing....
does not claim to be scientifically proven....
"freeflyer" <free...@freeflyer.no> wrote in message
news:3BD5CADA...@freeflyer.no...
IB1
i didn't say it was something "somone had possibly said"...
i said it was based on my experience as a packer and the experience of
riggers and jumpers i have spoken to...
you can choose to accept that or not... it's only an opinion...
"Simon Smith" <Si...@Quintuslink.com> wrote in message
news:bmocttcbg98630hh9...@4ax.com...
freeflyer
> neither....
>
> it is based on experience of jumpers at my club and riggers at my club...
> and what i have seen when packing....
>
> does not claim to be scientifically proven....
Can you please, in detail, explain what those riggers,
jumpers, and yourself have experienced?
What exactly is it that shows you that the canopy material
and lines don't last as long? I've talked with several
riggers, and I'm working on my ticket at the moment, and
have heard nothing of the sort. So I'm really interested in
hearing what's causing this, and what the "symptoms" and
"effects" are.
I'll also ask the rigger who's holding my rigger's course
this evening about it and hear what he has to say. I'll get
back to the group on this one.
Ford1fly
parameters are so fine that it is easier to get a rogue one... then again the
two I have jumped that have been built in Spain a 69 and a 79 are both awesome
on opening and in flight, where as the two I have jumped from the U.S 69 and
82 have opened very hard consistently... but still fly well...
Fordy
freeflyer
From all the bulletins and people's comments, I believe I
know enough to make damn sure I get a canopy that's made in
Spain if I ever get one from Icarus.
Gary McGuinness
them.
I think it was July/Aug 1999, maybe 2000.
Also they did, not too sure if they do it now, test jump each one (FX & VX),
hence that was the reason they stopped making them in the US, as this showed
up some flaws.
Andy got my nitrox paperwork ?
Gary
"Ford1fly" <ford...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20011024074809...@mb-mm.aol.com...
Ford1fly
got over some initial problems and felt test jumping was no longer needed....
Ralph took your Nitrox paperwork, last week, he said he would see you??
Simon Smith
<n...@spam.com> wrote:
>
>
>"Simon Smith" <Si...@Quintuslink.com> wrote in message
>news:bmocttcbg98630hh9...@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 23 Oct 2001 22:15:57 +0200, in uk.rec.skydiving freeflyer
>> <free...@freeflyer.no> wrote:
>>
>>
>> This is the guy who, last month, said that French gear was not as good
>> quality as American, but couldn't back it up beyond saying that it was
>> something someone had possibly said and then stopped replying to
>> questions.
>> He may be right (I really don't think so) but if so it's pure
>> accident: my current container has been jumping longer than he has :)
>
>no,
>
>i didn't say it was something "somone had possibly said"...
>i said it was based on my experience as a packer and the experience of
>riggers and jumpers i have spoken to...
...which is more or less what I said you said. Given that it was a
while ago I think it's pretty accurate.
>
>you can choose to accept that or not... it's only an opinion...
>
And you have never backed it up with anything beyond what can only
just be called hearsay.
Still, when my Atom starts wearing out I'll let you know.
IB1
i think it is biased and dismissive ...but moving on....
you keep referring to your container wearing out...
i never said your container would wear out...
and if you care to scroll back up to my recent post, you will see that i was
referring specifically to the canopy material and lines...
is your Atom made from canopy material??
if you are going to try and make a point, at least read the fucking post you
are referring to properly.
the 'hearsay' you refer to is actual experience of a number of jumpers,
riggers and packers...
including my own... (as a packer)
if you classify that as hearsay, then your 'good experience' of an Atom is
also hearsay...
i have never claimed to have scientific proof that PdF gear is inferior...
to be honest i don't really care that much about proof, i have no axe to
grind
i have seen and heard enough from sources that i consider reliable to
believe that while it is safe gear, that works reasonably well... the
quality is not as good as American alternatives.
when asked for an opinion that is what i will give...
feel free to give your own opinion but don't dis-respect mine.
"Simon Smith" <Si...@Quintuslink.com> wrote in message
news:ctmdtt8rvfo8tcsjg...@4ax.com...
Caroline Hughes
my last post and although the news was not good (i.e. my container has been
delayed
now until the1st week of December! :-( I am considerably happier than I
was yesterday.
Getting a personal response (by phone) really made a difference to the way
I've been feeling towards PDF - and I no longer believe they simply 'don't
care' what has happened to me and other similar orders.
PDF explained in detail about the production difficulties they've
experienced. In short, early this year PDF opened another factory with the
intention of improving output and delivery times to the customer. Despite
what sounded like a great deal of training and effort to mirror their
existing factory, things went wrong and a sequence of events led to
significant quality problems that PDF deemed as unacceptable. These
problems affected a number of orders placed earlier this year - these orders
were the ones sent to the new factory for manufacture.
As I now understand it my rig WAS getting near ready to ship in August, but
was rejected at this point due to the quality of production. The rig was
effectively 'thrown out'. They have now rectified the situation with the
factories and my (2nd) Atom Legend is being assembled as we speak.
To help me out a little they have offered to ship new demo kit over for me
to jump until it is delivered - leaving me free to go ahead with the sale of
my old rig.
Obviously what I really want though is my new container! But now that I
know exactly why this has happened and have been spoken to openly about the
situation - the bitter taste has subsided somewhat and I do believe PDF care
about my custom.
I think if I was looking at it as a prospective customer I would be
encouraged by their willingness to reject a whole rig and start again from
scratch - simply because it did not meet the high quality standards that
they strive for. The fact that I am caught in the middle changes my feeling
a little - but of course, I would rather wait and have a quality rig than
pay all that money for something that is barely worth it.
So I guess that's the end of this story - eventually my new rig will arrive
and I will start jumping it - by then this will all be history!
Blue Skies,
C.
Dan Mordechay
i got 1 question 4 u.
what about ur friend that ordered the light blue color and got green insted
? did he asked 4 the money back (u need to add more money on this color) or
did he just complained ?
Keep me posted
Dan
freeflyer
>
> the 'hearsay' you refer to is actual experience of a number of jumpers,
> riggers and packers...
> including my own... (as a packer)
Then I must ask, exactly _what_ was it about the lines and
canopy material that made _you_ believe that it wears out
faster than American made gear? You said you experienced it,
so you must have some idea of the "why"s and "what"s involved.
> i have seen and heard enough from sources that i consider reliable to
> believe that while it is safe gear, that works reasonably well... the
> quality is not as good as American alternatives.
>
> when asked for an opinion that is what i will give...
Even though you can't site one example of why it's inferior?
Do you even care if your opinion is wrong?
I prefer to find out facts before making my opinion. I
generally don't base them on what someone told me without
being able to explain why.
> feel free to give your own opinion but don't dis-respect mine.
Is it ok if we question your opinion though, as it seems
that it's not based on anything substantial?
Here's what the rigger who held my rigger's course today
told me. Older PdF zero-p canopies were made of a material
that is believed to be inferior to that of the PD canopies,
for example. This fabric is easy to recognize, as it feels
like new F-111 fabric and not like "ordinary" zero-p. After
usages it becomes very fine, almost feeling like silk.
Today's canopies from PdF are made of the exact same fabric
as other canopies, the only difference being the
denomination PdF has chosen for their canopies (PF 3000).
The lines on the PdF canopies are made of the exact same
material as other canopies, so they really shouldn't have a
different lifespan than others.
Now, IB1, if you can refute either of these claims with
facts (not opinions) please feel free to.
I could not find anything to either support these claims, or
refute them on PdF's webpage. The webpage claims that PF
3000 has been in use for 11 years, but I've noticed a clear
difference in fabric on their new canopies from the older
ones. Either they're coating the fabric differently, or PF
3000 is no longer what it once was.
My search goes on. Will yours?
Gary McGuinness
I think I have some paperwork here quoting 74 weeks to ship a container.
They were trying to move/expand and train people in the bigger facility, and
something had to give, which was delivery times.
Gary
"Caroline Hughes" <carolin...@btinternet.com.NOSPAM> wrote in message
news:9r6sft$5qi$1...@pheidippides.axion.bt.co.uk...
Caroline Hughes
happened - not sure what the result was - may not have disliked it????
"Dan Mordechay" <mind...@runbox.com> wrote in message
news:9r7fg8$re83s$1...@ID-55969.news.dfncis.de...
Simon Smith
<n...@spam.com> wrote:
>well i don't think it is pretty accurate...
>i think it is biased and dismissive ...but moving on....
>
It's just that I have difficulty getting anything actually specific
out of you.
>you keep referring to your container wearing out...
>i never said your container would wear out...
You did last month.
>
>and if you care to scroll back up to my recent post, you will see that i was
>referring specifically to the canopy material and lines...
>is your Atom made from canopy material??
So have you changed you opinion about rigs?
>if you are going to try and make a point, at least read the fucking post you
>are referring to properly.
Excellent response!
>
>the 'hearsay' you refer to is actual experience of a number of jumpers,
>riggers and packers...
>including my own... (as a packer)
But beyond saying it, you have never given any specifics: what exactly
is your experience? Which bits of what kit was sub-standard and in
what way?
>
>if you classify that as hearsay, then your 'good experience' of an Atom is
>also hearsay...
It is at least an actual experience: what are your actual experiences
with sub-standard kit?
>
>i have never claimed to have scientific proof that PdF gear is inferior...
>to be honest i don't really care that much about proof, i have no axe to
>grind
No. You just diss it quite often with no explanation given.
>
>i have seen and heard enough from sources that i consider reliable to
>believe that while it is safe gear, that works reasonably well... the
>quality is not as good as American alternatives.
This is getting boring. In what way?
>
>when asked for an opinion that is what i will give...
>
>feel free to give your own opinion but don't dis-respect mine.
>
I would love to hear something substantive.
I'll try and explain it another way. The conversation so far sounds
like this to me:
Fred: I think that new TV from Sony is not as good as Toshiba's.
Bill: Why? Mine's fine.
Fred: A number of respectable people have told me.
Bill: Aren't I respectable? And I actually have one as well...what
should I look for?
Fred: Well, it's just not as good. Anyone who know anything knows
that.
Somehow, I don't feel Bill would be very satisfied with that.
I do sincerely want to know! If I sound like I'm disrespecting your
opinion, it's because, when asking for the basis of it, all I see is
'it just is, lots of people say so'. Never anything substantive, like
the finger trapping is suspect, the line-lengths are not consistent
between different examples, or anything that actually says what makes
them not as good. You just get huffy when pressed.
So, Fred, what's wrong with Sony's TVs?
Rich Orford
Hmmmm - I see your opinions have been noticed on rec.skydiving.
He's only gone and got on the wrong side of Snuffy.
--
Have Fun & Stay Safe
Rich :o)
*******************************************************************
* Don't take life too seriously. You'll never get out of it alive *
*******************************************************************
freeflyer
>
> Hmmmm - I see your opinions have been noticed on rec.skydiving.
>
> He's only gone and got on the wrong side of Snuffy.
Didn't take him long to get on that shit-list :o)
ken
i would get them to give you a delivery date in writing and if they dont
deliver by then then get your money back on the grounds of breach of
contract. this will be easier if you paid them by credit card as the credit
card then hold some of the responibility and will help you.
"Caroline Hughes" <carolin...@btinternet.com.NOSPAM> wrote in message
news:9r6sft$5qi$1...@pheidippides.axion.bt.co.uk...
IB1
are you capable of reading?
my views have been expressed, i have no intrest in trying to convince you to
change your mind.
do you understand? is this too complicated for you?
should i use smaller words?
"Simon Smith" <Si...@Quintuslink.com> wrote in message
news:s2tftt0a1i2a70api...@4ax.com...
Simon Smith
<n...@spam.com> wrote:
>this is really getting tiresome
Yep :)
>
>are you capable of reading?
Possibly :}
>
>my views have been expressed, i have no intrest in trying to convince you to
>change your mind.
All I have been trying to do is find out the reasons for your
opinions. You consistently refuse to give any. :(
>
>do you understand? is this too complicated for you?
I think you don't understand what I'm asking. I'm not actually
disagreeing with you. Your opinions may be right - but until you give
me a bit more that just your opinion there is no way I can decide. All
I have at the moment is your opinion - and I am happy to agree that it
is your opinion - but to make any decision on it I need to know *why*
it's your opinion.
It *is* annoying having to justify things, though, isn't it?
>
>should i use smaller words?
>
>
<cheap-shot>
The odd capital might help....
</cheap-shot>
Paul Rowe
years ago, I ordered an Atom 000 from John / Janet Curtis at Langar. It took
quite a while for delivery (they had the canopies & Cypress in no time).
However, when it finally arrived, I noticed that the turquoise panels were
what I (and indeed John & Janet) can only describe as jade green.
It turns out that this is how PDF describe this colour and that I had
received what I had ordered - the 'turquoise' was in fact sky blue!
However, the rig was supplied BOC rather that pull out as I had ordered. PDF
simply made a mistake and built it wrong! Nowadays, BOC is the choice of the
majority so they built the rig possibly without looking too carefully at the
specified deployment system on the order form. I would have been fairly
happy accepting the 'jade green' mods but certainly not a change to my
preferred deployment system!
To their credit, they built & supplied a replacement container in 3 weeks
and amended the colour to sky blue. The quality of the rig is first class
(so certainly worth the wait). I believe they used my 'old' container as a
new set of demo gear.
Regards
Paul Rowe
"Dan Mordechay" <mind...@runbox.com> wrote in message
news:9r7fg8$re83s$1...@ID-55969.news.dfncis.de...
sitflyr
"Simon Smith" <Si...@Quintuslink.com> wrote in message
> On Wed, 24 Oct 2001 17:06:27 +0100, in uk.rec.skydiving "IB1"
> <n...@spam.com> wrote:
>
> >well i don't think it is pretty accurate...
> >i think it is biased and dismissive ...but moving on....
> >
>
> It's just that I have difficulty getting anything actually specific
> out of you.
>
> >you keep referring to your container wearing out...
> >i never said your container would wear out...
>
> You did last month.
>
> >
This is from July:
"IB1" <n...@spam.com> wrote in message
news:NIB47.16933$Fk7.1...@news.indigo.ie...
> i hear from alot of people that the quality and durability of PdF is no
> where close to the American gear...
> (RWS, Sun Path PD, PA etc) for both Canopies and Containers...
>
>
> "Johno" <pa...@johnson-co.prestel.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:9iumva$3s1$1...@phys-ma.sol.co.uk...
> > Has any one any experience or opinion of PDFs Electra canopy. I am
thinking
> > about getting one and I am curious to find out what people who have
jumped
> > it think.
> >
> > Your opinions are appreciated.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Paul
> >
Julie
Graham Harrison
I Ordered my new Legend in April and finally received it at the end of Sept.
Having had a series of conflicting and plainly made up delivery dates from
PdF. I too ordered the blue tie dye option, and was very disappointed when
the container arrived and it was turquoise, in fact I was so disappointed I
almost sent it back. However like Caroline I'd waited so long that I just
couldn't be bothered to wait for something else.
I am however very pleased with my container, and believe that I got value
for money, my dealer was very good to me and lent me a rig whilst I was
waiting for the PdF kit. I would however be reticent about buying from PdF
again because I feel they have no interest in supplying their customers with
any level of service both before and after delivery.
Graham Harrison C101471
"Dan Mordechay" <mind...@runbox.com> wrote in message
news:9r7fg8$re83s$1...@ID-55969.news.dfncis.de...
Gary McGuinness
Gary
"Graham Harrison" <gh...@globalnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:ZKUC7.19431$a14.1...@news6-win.server.ntlworld.com...
Graham Harrison
"Gary McGuinness" <NOgar...@NOwhich.SPAMnet> wrote in message
news:AZUC7.12418$GA.15...@news2-win.server.ntlworld.com...
Simon Smith
<sit...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>"Simon Smith" <Si...@Quintuslink.com> wrote in message
>news:s2tftt0a1i2a70api...@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 24 Oct 2001 17:06:27 +0100, in uk.rec.skydiving "IB1"
>> <n...@spam.com> wrote:
>>
>> >well i don't think it is pretty accurate...
>> >i think it is biased and dismissive ...but moving on....
>> >
>>
>> It's just that I have difficulty getting anything actually specific
>> out of you.
>>
>> >you keep referring to your container wearing out...
>> >i never said your container would wear out...
>>
>> You did last month.
>>
>> >
>
>This is from July:
>
>"IB1" <n...@spam.com> wrote in message
>news:NIB47.16933$Fk7.1...@news.indigo.ie...
>> i hear from alot of people that the quality and durability of PdF is no
>> where close to the American gear...
>> (RWS, Sun Path PD, PA etc) for both Canopies and Containers...
>>
>
Thanks, Julie.
Wow, July - I thought my hangover had lasted a bit longer than usual.
Must be more careful.
Anyway, IB1 seems to be sulking now. I wonder if he wore the paper
bag?
sitflyr
"Simon Smith" <Si...@Quintuslink.com> wrote in message
> Thanks, Julie.
>
> Wow, July - I thought my hangover had lasted a bit longer than usual.
> Must be more careful.
>
> Anyway, IB1 seems to be sulking now. I wonder if he wore the paper
> bag?
>
I doubt that they make a paper bag that large.
Julie