R-134a question

[Marc H. Po]

Does anybody know why, incompressible gasses, outgas, from the 134a after a
while? Where do you think these gases come from and how are they
liberated?
--
Regards,
Marc H. Po

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[rto...@removethis.oanet.com]

On 6 Jul 1998 00:10:31 GMT, "Marc H. Po" <LVM...@worldnet.att.net>
wrote:

>Does anybody know why, incompressible gasses, outgas, from the 134a after a
>while? Where do you think these gases come from and how are they
>liberated?
>--
>Regards,
>Marc H. Po
>
>

There is no such thing as an incompressible gas. Gases can be
dissolved in the oil as well as in the R-134a itself and will come out
after going through pressure change cycles. The filter/dryer will
also de-gas for a time after being put into use. They need several
hours under high vacuum and at an elevated temperature to get all the
air and moisture out of them - or get a new one.

[JSmart]

OK,

Let me elaborate. A large number of new cars, previously un-worked on
outside of the factory (these cars are 18 to 30 months! old). are showing
8 to22% "non compressible gases. The chemistry of the r134a gas itself is
not conducive to from water, or liberating O2 molecule is it? Can it be
the type of oil that the GM. ford Chrysler charges their products with?
Marc

This is occurring in a larger than normal number of new vehicles. And
right now we no the non compressible are showing up but not the underlying
cause and process.

Thanks\
marc

rto...@removethis.oanet.com wrote in article
<35a1538e...@news.oanet.com>...

[George Goble]

In article <6o0rlj$5...@bgtnsc03.worldnet.att.net>,

JSmart <Smar...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>OK,
>
>Let me elaborate. A large number of new cars, previously un-worked on
>outside of the factory (these cars are 18 to 30 months! old). are showing
>8 to22% "non compressible gases. The chemistry of the r134a gas itself is
>not conducive to from water, or liberating O2 molecule is it? Can it be
>the type of oil that the GM. ford Chrysler charges their products with?
>Marc

Compared to R-12 mineral oils, PAG (new OEM), and POE (retrofits) oils are
quite unstable.. Also extremely sensitive to moisture..

You meant to say "non condensible" gasses? If refrigerant is
breaking down, it would probably be H2.. The HF "acids" would
eat away at the aluminum (and the oil) and form aluminum chloride
(sludge), that would either clog the system or the evap/condenser
would "eat through".. Many 134a cars come into service right
after 3yr warranty is up, with 7 or 8 holes in evap or condenser..
PAG oil turned bright orange. Automakers seldom do a vacuum
over 1 min during the initial charge.. Moisture varies from
run to run.. Chrysler is near the worst on moisture.
Back in the R-12 days we gave a Chrysler dealer a "dry-eye"
on a quick connect.. so he could weed out all the new "wet" cars
(most of them), and recover the charge, change dryer, recharge
before the water reacted into acids and failed the system
6mo later and for sure warranty work (eaten out evap, etc).

--ghg