New Heinlein novel sold to TOR
Spider Robinson
today (11 December) Patrick LoBrutto of TOR Books won the auction for
publishing rights to "Robert A. Heinlein's VARIABLE STAR by Spider
Robinson," the new novel I will write based on Robert's extensive 1955
outline and notes. Please pass the word.
I couldn't be more pleased with house or editor. TOR currently
publishes my Callahan's Place series and a lot of my backlist--and Pat,
my friend of thirty years, edited the last two Callahan novels.
Please note: I already have another book under contract with another
house, half done, which I must complete before I can start VARIABLE
STAR. This will take awhile, in other words.
I can't wait to get started. So: back to work on the one in the
pipeline. [A Baen Book, tentatively titled OF THREE MINDS.]
Thanks for all the kind words of support you've posted here, folks.
They help, they do.
--Spider
Meffy Ellis
> Brethren and sistren,
>
> today (11 December) Patrick LoBrutto of TOR Books won the auction for
> publishing rights to "Robert A. Heinlein's VARIABLE STAR by Spider
> Robinson," the new novel I will write based on Robert's extensive 1955
> outline and notes. Please pass the word.
>
> I couldn't be more pleased with house or editor. TOR currently
> publishes my Callahan's Place series and a lot of my backlist--and Pat,
> my friend of thirty years, edited the last two Callahan novels.
"Cooool."
> Please note: I already have another book under contract with another
> house, half done, which I must complete before I can start VARIABLE
> STAR. This will take awhile, in other words.
>
> I can't wait to get started. So: back to work on the one in the
> pipeline. [A Baen Book, tentatively titled OF THREE MINDS.]
"Ah! Mated as I am to a library worker, I rarely buy non-technical
books. My partner isn't out of town, but even so for you I'll make an
exception. (Sorry, old joke.)"
> Thanks for all the kind words of support you've posted here, folks.
> They help, they do.
"You lucked out when you found this group. As it happens, most people
here are inordinately fond and supportive of ficton-wranglers named...
uh..."
--Spider
"Yes! That's it.
"Oh, yes -- thanks for posting on your website the link from which I was
able to download the Callahan's Crosstime Saloon computer game. Since I
missed the opportunity to buy it when it was still a commercial product,
buying your upcoming books will probably be the best I can do in the way
of recompense."
Meffy
saavik
wait awhile. I sometimes think it's too bad that we can read books so much
faster than our favourite authors can write them.
Margo :>)
Mike Cothran
> Brethren and sistren,
>
> today (11 December) Patrick LoBrutto of TOR Books won the auction for
> publishing rights to "Robert A. Heinlein's VARIABLE STAR by Spider
> Robinson," the new novel I will write based on Robert's extensive 1955
> outline and notes. Please pass the word.
I'll let folks know at Marie's book store... thanks!
> <snip>
> Please note: I already have another book under contract with another
> house, half done, which I must complete before I can start VARIABLE
> STAR. This will take awhile, in other words.
Waiting is long or short. Maple syrup takes a while as well.
> I can't wait to get started. So: back to work on the one in the
> pipeline. [A Baen Book, tentatively titled OF THREE MINDS.]
Great, I am looking forward to it, whatever title.
> Thanks for all the kind words of support you've posted here, folks.
> They help, they do.
Good, any help can be had free, hindrance will cost ya extra.
--
Mike C
Gregory Baker
I cannot say how delighted I will be to have Heinlein retold by Spider!
It can be the best of both worlds!
Kate Gladstone
STAR and/or OF THREE MINDS ?
--
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Kate Gladstone - Handwriting Repair - ka...@global2000.net
http://www.global2000.net/handwritingrepair
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
pixelmeow
On Fri, 12 Dec 2003 15:50:45 GMT, in alt.fan.heinlein, Spider Robinson
<spid...@shaw.ca> scribbled:
--
~teresa~
AFH Barwench
^..^ "Never try to outstubborn a cat." Robert A. Heinlein ^..^
http://pixelmeow.com/ && http://heinleinsociety.org/
http://pixelmeow.com/Book_Exchange/index.htm
http://www.storesonline.com/site/thesurvivalstation/
http://rose-n-thorn-llc.com/
aim: pixelmeow msn:pixe...@passport.com
Bill Reich
Conga-rats and other dancing rodents. I can assure you that I am
looking forward to Variable Star and Of Three Minds and to anything
else you might write. Well, a LITTLE more to Variable Star but you
should understand being a Heinlein fan yourself.
--
Will in New Haven
"You know that I never prayed before
舛ause it always seemed to me
That prayin's the same as beggin,' Lord.
I don't take no charity.
Tom Ames' Prayer by Robert Earl Keen off GRINGO HONEYMOON
bookman
>
> today (11 December) Patrick LoBrutto of TOR Books won the auction for
> publishing rights to "Robert A. Heinlein's VARIABLE STAR by Spider
> Robinson," the new novel I will write based on Robert's extensive 1955
> outline and notes. Please pass the word.
My opinion: You're a good choice to write it, but don't get it done
fast - get it done right. Waiting is, sometimes.
Regards,
Rusty the bookman
puppe...@hotmail.com
>
> today (11 December) Patrick LoBrutto of TOR Books won the auction for
> publishing rights to "Robert A. Heinlein's VARIABLE STAR by Spider
> Robinson," the new novel I will write based on Robert's extensive 1955
> outline and notes. Please pass the word.
A limp twisted sock manages to get to the chalk line carrying
a huge glass.
"To a gent who is worthy of the collaboration."
CRASH!
Simon Jester US
"bookman" <thebo...@kc.rr.comNULL>
> My opinion: You're a good choice to write it, but don't get it done
> fast - get it done right. Waiting is, sometimes.
>
Yeah, what he said...
Ian Graeme
One of the really interesting things is that someone whose politics
don't much overlap RAH's can still do a very credible job on this.
Beth Jackson
#%#%***CRASH!!!***%#%#
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"The Canvas Canary"
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
(...Because I love to paint, like to sing, am blonde and a little bit
flighty. Visit my website and see;)
Mark Ensley
Wonderful news! Whoo-hoo!
A toast to your success! (taps mug against monitor *tink*)
Thank you for letting us know what's going on! I'm looking forward to
buying both books as soon as they come out.
I have a polite question / request:
Would it be possible to include a copy (facsimile or transcript) of
Heinlein's original outline for Variable Star as an appendix to the
book? Most of us fans would dearly love to see how Robert actually
outlined his stories -- a small window into his thought processes. It
would also be a lot of fun to have it to see how you developed your
interpretation.
Whatever the motivation, I think it would add a lot of value to the
work on many levels.
Thank you again!
-Mark Ensley
Jan
Thanks so much for keeping us posted! I'm passing the word as far and wide as
I can.
Now then, dear sir, get back to work! I want both books...oh, by the end of
the year will be soon enough, I think. :-)
Jan
Jan
>Would it be possible to include a copy (facsimile or transcript) of
>Heinlein's original outline for Variable Star as an appendix to the
>book? Most of us fans would dearly love to see how Robert actually
>outlined his stories -- a small window into his thought processes. It
>would also be a lot of fun to have it to see how you developed your
>interpretation.
>
I agree completely and second the motion! That would be a great
feature/addition.
Jan
Ed Murphy
Thirded!
Wesley Struebing
wrote:
Woohoo, and Wowsers! (doing happy tigger-bounce...)
I'm getting in line, now (quitcher shoving, peeple!)
And we wouldn't support stuff if we didn't care about it, so permit
me, Spider, to turn some of the thanks back on you.
(doing another happy tigger-bounce, which at my age is, err, strange)
Kam
parliament. I think the Ayes would have it.
D.J.
Spider Robinson <spid...@shaw.ca> wrote:
] Brethren and sistren,
]
] today (11 December) Patrick LoBrutto of TOR Books won the auction for
] publishing rights to "Robert A. Heinlein's VARIABLE STAR by Spider
] Robinson," the new novel I will write based on Robert's extensive 1955
] outline and notes. Please pass the word.
Congrats !
D.J.
--
djim70 at tyhe cableone dot net. Disclaimer: Standard.
My Web pages Updated: Nov 24, 2003:
http://blue7green.crosswinds.net/crestar/index.html
Registered Linux user#185746
Miche
Spider Robinson <spid...@shaw.ca> wrote:
Woohoo!
Can't wait to see it on shelves here ("here" being New Zealand).
Miche
--
If you want to end war and stuff you got to sing loud.
-- Arlo Guthrie, "Alice's Restaurant"
TreetopAngel
Waiting with worms on my breath.
E!
(Yahoo! TWO new Spider's to look for, life is good.)
Engr Bohn
On Fri, 12 Dec 2003, Spider Robinson wrote:
> Brethren and sistren,
>
> today (11 December) Patrick LoBrutto of TOR Books won the auction for
> publishing rights to "Robert A. Heinlein's VARIABLE STAR by Spider
> Robinson," the new novel I will write based on Robert's extensive 1955
> outline and notes. Please pass the word.
Woohoo!
[...]
> Please note: I already have another book under contract with another
> house, half done, which I must complete before I can start VARIABLE
> STAR. This will take awhile, in other words.
(sigh) Waiting is.
(I was going to say "waiting builds character, but that forces me to
wonder: Why is it that everything that's supposed to "build character"
unfun? Why can't eating chocolates build character? <g>)
> I can't wait to get started. So: back to work on the one in the
> pipeline. [A Baen Book, tentatively titled OF THREE MINDS.]
Okay, good excuse :)
(but the title does make me think of a brief conversation from "Coupling"
(the BBC version, not the NBC version) wherein the three men speculate on
what to title a film in which breasts have brains...
Patrick: "The woman with two brains"
Steve: "THREE brains"
Patrick: (pauses) "Oh, right. Three.")
> Thanks for all the kind words of support you've posted here, folks.
> They help, they do.
Our pleasure. And when these books come out, I'll offer some additional
words of support: "This note is legal tender..." <g>
Thank *you*, and take care,
cb
--
Christopher A. Bohn ____________|____________
http://www.cis.ohio-state.edu/~bohn/ ' ** ** " (o) " ** ** '
"Technology and air power are integrally and synergistically
related." - P Meilinger, "Ten Propositions Regarding Air Power"
djinn
Great news! I'll be patiently waiting. Just don't take too long.
mickie fynne
*fades in from her corner and dances a credible jig*
WHOO HOO!
Now that makes me a happy camper.
I'm looking forward to both books, and am more than willing to wait
(if only because by the time they come out I might actually be able to
budget for such necessities as books, rather than the less fun
necessities, like bills. lol).
Take your time and do it write!
Mickie
--taken from an actual late night conversation at a trademarked
restaraunt
"I wish all the stupid people could be killed off."
"If all the stupid people were killed off the human race would become
extinct."
"Yeah, but think how nice and quiet the last few years would be."
Mac
Congratulations!
Now, get to work... can hardly wait.
Two good books in the pipeline.
Soon, very soon...
---Mac
Ace Lightning
>Brethren and sistren,
>today (11 December) Patrick LoBrutto of TOR Books won the auction for
>publishing rights to "Robert A. Heinlein's VARIABLE STAR by Spider
>Robinson," the new novel I will write based on Robert's extensive 1955
>outline and notes. Please pass the word.
>I couldn't be more pleased with house or editor. TOR currently
>publishes my Callahan's Place series and a lot of my backlist--and Pat,
>my friend of thirty years, edited the last two Callahan novels.
>Please note: I already have another book under contract with another
>house, half done, which I must complete before I can start VARIABLE
>STAR. This will take awhile, in other words.
>I can't wait to get started. So: back to work on the one in the
>pipeline. [A Baen Book, tentatively titled OF THREE MINDS.]
>Thanks for all the kind words of support you've posted here, folks.
>They help, they do.
> --Spider
Well, now I know what I want for my birthday *NEXT* year!
Kate Gladstone
>Would it be possible to include a copy (facsimile or transcript) of
> Heinlein's original outline for Variable Star as an appendix to the
> book? Most of us fans would dearly love to see how Robert actually
> outlined his stories -- a small window into his thought processes. It
> would also be a lot of fun to have it to see how you developed your
> interpretation.
Yes, please do this, Spider! - for the reasons Mark mentions, and to
give us all yet another chunk of never-seen-before original Heinlein.
As Mark says:
> ... it would add a lot of value to the
> work on many levels.
--
Freyja
"Meffy Ellis" <spam_t...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:9eOdnUsvsK9...@comcast.com...
| Spider Robinson wrote:
|
| > Brethren and sistren,
| >
| > today (11 December) Patrick LoBrutto of TOR Books won the auction
for
| > publishing rights to "Robert A. Heinlein's VARIABLE STAR by Spider
| > Robinson," the new novel I will write based on Robert's extensive
1955
| > outline and notes. Please pass the word.
| >
| > I couldn't be more pleased with house or editor. TOR currently
| > publishes my Callahan's Place series and a lot of my backlist--and
Pat,
| > my friend of thirty years, edited the last two Callahan novels.
|
|
| > Please note: I already have another book under contract with another
| > house, half done, which I must complete before I can start VARIABLE
| > STAR. This will take awhile, in other words.
| >
| > I can't wait to get started. So: back to work on the one in the
| > pipeline. [A Baen Book, tentatively titled OF THREE MINDS.]
|
| books. My partner isn't out of town, but even so for you I'll make an
| exception. (Sorry, old joke.)"
|
| > Thanks for all the kind words of support you've posted here, folks.
| > They help, they do.
|
| here are inordinately fond and supportive of ficton-wranglers named...
| uh..."
|
| --Spider
|
| "Yes! That's it.
|
| "Oh, yes -- thanks for posting on your website the link from which I
was
| able to download the Callahan's Crosstime Saloon computer game. Since
I
| missed the opportunity to buy it when it was still a commercial
product,
| buying your upcoming books will probably be the best I can do in the
way
| of recompense."
|
| Meffy
I was lucky enough to get the game while it was still out there. I'm
going to turn on as many friends as I can to it, too!
Meffy, are you as excited as I am about these new treasures coming out
in print? Yes, I said treasures. Anything that will engross me to the
point of not minding my pain too much is a pearl of great price.
{bounce}{pounce-hide} (Steve! Don't eat my anklets! Pounce the ankles,
fine. Don't eat the jewelry. Funny kitten.){skritchkitty}
Spider, you are loved here. Never doubt it. After all, this is The
(Usenet) Place.
--
Freyja the NurseWenchWitch (despam me)
Queen of the Sim City Realm, Royal Order of W.H.I.N.E
www.eclecticeel.com
Harmony slut: I'll sing with anybody
Meffy Ellis
> I was lucky enough to get the game while it was still out there. I'm
> going to turn on as many friends as I can to it, too!
*sigh* "I had wanted to buy the game when I saw it in a store long ago,
but hadn't any money at the time. And of course if I see a thing and
don't snap it up then and there, it _will_ be gone next time. Ah well."
> Meffy, are you as excited as I am about these new treasures coming out
> in print?
"Uh, yeah, Brain. But do we have to buy a whole bookstore to get these
two books?" :-)
Meffy
Maureen O'Danu
"Ian Graeme" <shaid...@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:oaadnXWCPIC...@aros.net...
> If this is for real, I will be one very happy camper.
>
> One of the really interesting things is that someone whose politics
> don't much overlap RAH's can still do a very credible job on this.
I take it you haven't read "For Us the Living", yet. Spider and RAH were
closer in a lot of ideas than you might think...they just approached the
ideas at right angles.
Maureen O'Danu
Dan Goodman
135645.news.uni-berlin.de:
Heinlein at which point in his life? His views shifted considerably over
the decades.
--
Dan Goodman
Journal http://dsgood.blogspot.com or
http://www.livejournal.com/users/dsgood/
Whatever you wish for me, may you have twice as much.
Maureen O'Danu
"Dan Goodman" <dsg...@visi.com> wrote in message
news:Xns945BECC7FD3...@209.98.13.60...
I agree...but they shifted more in methodology than in goal...where Spider
and RAH come together is in goal....I'm sorry I was unclear...too much flu
medicine
Maureen
Dan Goodman
>> >>
>> >> One of the really interesting things is that someone whose
>> >> politics don't much overlap RAH's can still do a very credible job
>> >> on this.
>> >
>> > I take it you haven't read "For Us the Living", yet. Spider and
>> > RAH
> were
>> > closer in a lot of ideas than you might think...they just
>> > approached the ideas at right angles.
>>
>> Heinlein at which point in his life? His views shifted considerably
>> over the decades.
>>
> Spider and RAH come together is in goal....I'm sorry I was
> unclear...too much flu medicine
>
David C Kifer
Anybody who has read Robert Heinlein will recognize that he offered
provocative commentary on our society and advocated for radical social
change. Indeed, his politics have often confused people. How could a man
who supported the Socialist Upton Sinclair and the Democrat FDR become a
supporter of arch-conservative Republicans Barry Goldwater and Jeanne
Kirkpatrick? As Heinlein once explained to Alfred Bester in 1959, "I've
simply changed from a soft-headed radical to a hard-headed radical, a
pragmatic libertarian. . ."
-- Robert James, Afterword, Robert A. Heinlein, _For Us, the Living_,
written 1939, published 2003
[published 2003 because I've already got it, but the copyright is 2004.
Go figure!]
--
Dave
"Tam multi libri, tam breve tempus!"
(Et brevis pecunia.) [Et breve spatium.]
Noah Singman
> Anybody who has read Robert Heinlein will recognize that he offered
> provocative commentary on our society and advocated for radical social
> change. Indeed, his politics have often confused people. How could a man
> who supported the Socialist Upton Sinclair and the Democrat FDR become a
> supporter of arch-conservative Republicans Barry Goldwater and Jeanne
> Kirkpatrick? As Heinlein once explained to Alfred Bester in 1959, "I've
> simply changed from a soft-headed radical to a hard-headed radical, a
> pragmatic libertarian. . ."
> -- Robert James, Afterword, Robert A. Heinlein, _For Us, the Living_,
> written 1939, published 2003
> [published 2003 because I've already got it, but the copyright is 2004.
> Go figure!]
"Perhaps the Grand Master was an example of Aristide Briand's conjecture
that he who is not a socialist at 20 has no heart, and he who is still a
socialist at 40 has no head." :-)
Noah
Denaldo
Denaldo has always preferred the Ben Tucker quote:
"In capitalism, man exploits man. In socialism, it's exactly the
opposite." :)
--
"In the pinball game of life, his flippers are a little further apart
than most." Juanita Herownself describing TX state rep C. Howard
Send POINTless responses to den...@ePOINTv1.net
Rosanne
> Brethren and sistren,
<snip!>
> --Spider
>
I'm delighted with the news, and the contact! But I'm worried about your
openly posting your email address for both devoted readers and
mechanical harvesters.
Unless you're paying somebody to wade through all the "University
Diploma" ads, the offers to enlarge various extremities, and refinance
opportunities, I'd check out the link below for free, disposable email
addresses. They work perfectly - until you get bombarded with spam and
turn them off. I create and tag a different address every time I buy
something on-line. It's amusing to watch a business claim they never
sell your email address, when you've got spam tagged with their name.
V/R,
Rosanne
Simon Jester US
"Rosanne" <93g2...@REMOVEsneakemail.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1a5b6e759...@news.verizon.net...
What!? You would pass up those great opportunitys? I myself have a huge
penis, extra large boobs, seventeen mortgages, all paid off, relief from the
IRS so much that they FEAR me, am attractive to all men, woman and dogs,
make $57,000 a day for only five minutes of work from my stay at home job
AND all tyhe free porn you could possibly have! I ~loooooove~ spam....
Hmm... Now who am I again? *tapping chin*
Is my name David, or Yisroel today?
*VEG*
Sam Robinson
"Rosanne" <93g2...@REMOVEsneakemail.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1a5b6e759...@news.verizon.net...
> > Brethren and sistren,
> <snip!>
> > --Spider
> >
>
> I'm delighted with the news, and the contact! But I'm worried about your
> openly posting your email address for both devoted readers and
> mechanical harvesters.
>
Without worrying about the specifics, I've been posting with an unmunged
email address for about a decade now. Now I will admit that I do get some
spam... yep about 100 or more missives a day from people who know far too
much about the size of my various parts and personal habits (and how
gullible ^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H trustworthy I am).
I like for my friends to be able to just hit reply should they wish to mail
me. To be honest, more of the spam seems to have come from someone
harvesting ARIN's WHOIS list. Now I do some filtering, but generally it's
just not that hard to get rid of the detritus.
I've seen a number of people who seem to think that one can not ever post
without being anonymous. I'm not saying that you shouldn't, but it isn't a
requirement.
SamR
The best rule is the one that checks the header and puts everything in a
Korean character set into the junk drawer. That cuts the pile in half for
some reason.
Pat Kight
> Without worrying about the specifics, I've been posting with an unmunged
> email address for about a decade now. Now I will admit that I do get some
> spam... yep about 100 or more missives a day from people who know far too
> much about the size of my various parts and personal habits (and how
> gullible ^H^H^H^H^H^H^H^H trustworthy I am).
>
> I like for my friends to be able to just hit reply should they wish to mail
> me. To be honest, more of the spam seems to have come from someone
> harvesting ARIN's WHOIS list. Now I do some filtering, but generally it's
> just not that hard to get rid of the detritus.
>
> I've seen a number of people who seem to think that one can not ever post
> without being anonymous. I'm not saying that you shouldn't, but it isn't a
> requirement.
The Spinster down in the Lounge nods vigorously. "For me, the convenience
of having had the same publicly identifiable e-mail address for nearly a
decade - and the same username before that - is akin to the convenience of
being listed in my local phone book. I want people who genuinely need to
reach me to be able to do so without any hassle. If that means some
scalawags can reach me, too, well, so be it.
"Mozilla mail has damned good filtering and spam-trapping capabilities, for
freeware, and my ISP has been doing an increasingly good job of trapping
spam at the server end. While I'm still inclined to fight spam when it
looks fight-able, and to lobby hard for *real* anti-spam legislation (not
the half-assed thing recently signed into law), I'm not interested in
hiding my identity or my e-mail address. If I had, I'd have missed some
wonderful contacts, including out-of-the-blue e-mails from people I went to
high school and college with, and charming correspondences with folks right
here in a.c.
"Anonymizing myself to post on Usenet, or anywhere else, feels like giving
in to the spammers. And I say the hell with that."
--
Jezebel, as ever
kig...@peak.org
Lynn allen
> "Anonymizing myself to post on Usenet, or anywhere else, feels like giving
> in to the spammers. And I say the hell with that."
I used to feel the same, until my 'tolerable' 100 messages a day became
600-700. Even the time I had to spend scanning the filtered mail for
non-spam became unsupportable.
In my case, most of the spamming came from email harvesters pulling
addresses off web pages on my site, many of which addresses had never
been in actual use. However, I get ALL mails to my domains, so you can
imagine the quantities. I have not found there were a lot of spams
emanating identifiably from Usenet posts, but it all adds up. :/
Now I use spamcop.net, and it's worth every penny.
Lymaree
spam-free since 2003!
Jan
>I'm delighted with the news, and the contact! But I'm worried about your
>openly posting your email address for both devoted readers and
>mechanical harvesters.
FWIW, Spider has more than one email address. I'm sure that at least one is
kept private for friends and family.
Jan
Sam Robinson
"Pat Kight" <kig...@peak.org> wrote in message
news:bssptp$7tf$1...@quark.scn.rain.com...
> Sam Robinson wrote:
>
[...]
> > I've seen a number of people who seem to think that one can not ever
post
> > without being anonymous. I'm not saying that you shouldn't, but it isn't
a
> > requirement.
>
> The Spinster down in the Lounge nods vigorously. "For me, the convenience
> of having had the same publicly identifiable e-mail address for nearly a
> decade - and the same username before that - is akin to the convenience of
> being listed in my local phone book. I want people who genuinely need to
> reach me to be able to do so without any hassle. If that means some
> scalawags can reach me, too, well, so be it.
>
My point exactly! My current, and final address is not quite that old,
although my primary hasn't changed since I gave up being a number at
CompuServe. If I still had that one, it'd be two decades.
> "Mozilla mail has damned good filtering and spam-trapping capabilities,
for
> freeware, and my ISP has been doing an increasingly good job of trapping
> spam at the server end. While I'm still inclined to fight spam when it
> looks fight-able, and to lobby hard for *real* anti-spam legislation (not
> the half-assed thing recently signed into law), I'm not interested in
> hiding my identity or my e-mail address. If I had, I'd have missed some
> wonderful contacts, including out-of-the-blue e-mails from people I went
to
> high school and college with, and charming correspondences with folks
right
> here in a.c.
>
> "Anonymizing myself to post on Usenet, or anywhere else, feels like giving
> in to the spammers. And I say the hell with that."
>
Again, I'm looking for real solutions. I suspect that the next evolution of
the SMTP standard will have provisions that will help us identify UCE and
scammers. My personal feeling is that the move to never relay mail except
from MTAs that provide verifiable identification is the best bet. It can
preserve casual anonymity without allowing abuse since you can block the
source.
Then again, perhaps some other answer will work best. In any event, it's
good to hear that someone agrees.
SamR
Who sometimes wonders if he's on his way to becoming a crotchety coot.
Lee S. Billings
>
>Sam Robinson wrote:
>> I've seen a number of people who seem to think that one can not ever post
>> without being anonymous. I'm not saying that you shouldn't, but it isn't a
>> requirement.
>
>The Spinster down in the Lounge nods vigorously. "For me, the convenience
>of having had the same publicly identifiable e-mail address for nearly a
>decade - and the same username before that - is akin to the convenience of
>being listed in my local phone book. I want people who genuinely need to
>reach me to be able to do so without any hassle. If that means some
>scalawags can reach me, too, well, so be it.
As long as it was only spam I had to worry about, I was pretty much in
agreement with that statement. When Swen hit, and I started getting several
*hundred* of the damn things per hour, and it was shown that it propagated by
grabbing names off newsgroup files on servers... I changed my mind. No chance
of out-of-the-blue friendly e-mails is worth having that continue.
Celine
--
Handmade jewelry at http://www.rubylane.com/shops/starcat
"Only the powers of evil claim that doing good is boring."
-- Diane Duane, _Nightfall at Algemron_
Wesley Struebing
Which is why I tried for a *very* short period of time to munge my
e-dress, then realized that I'm paying for a domain name. Why make it
unusuable? The spam I get is eminently handlable.
It works for me, but as always, ymmv, different strokes, and all
that...
Rosanne
janmsc...@aol.com says...
"solid" (ie, not webmail, not easily disposable). I realized just as I
hit "send" on my first message that it would have been a kindness to NOT
rebroadcast it... sorry. :-P
I'm not TOTALLY paranoid - I bank and shop on the Internet. But I also
run several "anti-" utilities, and keep everything as up-to-date as I
can.
I like sneakemail because it tags the original source. The disadvantage
is that I have to be non-lazy enough to create a new address whenever I
deal with a new entity. Once that's done, the control is entirely in my
hands. They screw up - I shut 'em off. If I HAVE to maintain relations
with them, I send them a nastygram and update my profile with them,
giving them a new email address and shutting the old, sold one off.
~ Rosanne
Pat Kight
> In article <bssptp$7tf$1...@quark.scn.rain.com>, kig...@peak.org says...
>
>>Sam Robinson wrote:
>
>
>>>I've seen a number of people who seem to think that one can not ever post
>>>without being anonymous. I'm not saying that you shouldn't, but it isn't a
>>>requirement.
>>
>>The Spinster down in the Lounge nods vigorously. "For me, the convenience
>>of having had the same publicly identifiable e-mail address for nearly a
>>decade - and the same username before that - is akin to the convenience of
>>being listed in my local phone book. I want people who genuinely need to
>>reach me to be able to do so without any hassle. If that means some
>>scalawags can reach me, too, well, so be it.
> As long as it was only spam I had to worry about, I was pretty much in
> agreement with that statement. When Swen hit, and I started getting several
> *hundred* of the damn things per hour, and it was shown that it propagated by
> grabbing names off newsgroup files on servers... I changed my mind. No chance
> of out-of-the-blue friendly e-mails is worth having that continue.
"I got hundreds of them, too - but never an infection, because I know what
to do with crap like that.
"I'm not too worried about Swen-like viruses. I do backups of critical
data, I use good anti-virus software, I don't use an e-mail address book
that's especially susceptible to hijacking, and I filter *all* e-mail with
attachments into a "suspect" folder until I have time to check the
addresses and see if it's from someone I actually know. I may miss a few
`cute' forwarded graphics, or somebody's baby pictures, but I don't care.
"IMO - and I realize it's not the common O - I don't think most viruses and
worms are that big a deal for smart and prudently cautious individual
recipients; the big problem is the drain they put on mail systems when they
hit the mailboxes of the not-so-savvy ... or entire organizations that rely
on Outlook ..."
--
Jezebel
kig...@peak.org
Lee S. Billings
>
>Lee S. Billings wrote:
>
>> In article <bssptp$7tf$1...@quark.scn.rain.com>, kig...@peak.org says...
>>
>>>Sam Robinson wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>I've seen a number of people who seem to think that one can not ever post
>>>>without being anonymous. I'm not saying that you shouldn't, but it isn't a
>>>>requirement.
>>>
>>>The Spinster down in the Lounge nods vigorously. "For me, the convenience
>>>of having had the same publicly identifiable e-mail address for nearly a
>>>decade - and the same username before that - is akin to the convenience of
>>>being listed in my local phone book. I want people who genuinely need to
>>>reach me to be able to do so without any hassle. If that means some
>>>scalawags can reach me, too, well, so be it.
>
>> As long as it was only spam I had to worry about, I was pretty much in
>> agreement with that statement. When Swen hit, and I started getting several
>> *hundred* of the damn things per hour, and it was shown that it propagated
>> by grabbing names off newsgroup files on servers... I changed my mind. No
>> chance of out-of-the-blue friendly e-mails is worth having that continue.
>
>"I got hundreds of them, too - but never an infection, because I know what
>to do with crap like that.
Oh, I never got infected -- it was the hundreds of huge attachments filling up
the mailbox that was the problem. I had to start leaving my e-mail running 24/7
and downloading every hour to keep *real* messages from bouncing. If you want
to talk about "giving in to the spammers", THERE is something that qualifies; I
had to change the entire way I handled e-mail, just to continue having it at
all. Maybe your ISP did a better job of filtering them than mine did, so that
you didn't have a jammed mailbox after a couple of hours' worth of spam, for
weeks on end. If you had, I think you might have reconsidered also.
Bruce
I'm considering upgrading to. Among the other services is what they call
Address Guard -- disposable e-mail addresses. You pick an alias unrelated
to your account name (your primary e-mail address on Yahoo), and append a
tag to it. That you can use as an address to anybody you choose, and the
mail will still be directed to your inbox. When spam starts creeping in on
the tag, dispose of the tag and choose another.
It looks to me, along with the other services, to be worth the increased
cost -- and it's a yearly fee, not monthly. I'm already paying GeoCities
for my Web space, so the added cost wouldn't be objectionable.
--
Bruce -- Harper Blue
Have twelve lives, will travel. Block transfer computations solved while
you wait. Ring GAllifrey 555-2368, and ask for the Doctor.
=====
Remove Tolkien to mail me
Rosanne
bjohnalenr...@harperbruce.com says...
> Actually, a good solution to the situation might be Yahoo Mail Plus, which
> I'm considering upgrading to. Among the other services is what they call
> Address Guard -- disposable e-mail addresses. You pick an alias unrelated
> to your account name (your primary e-mail address on Yahoo), and append a
> tag to it. That you can use as an address to anybody you choose, and the
> mail will still be directed to your inbox. When spam starts creeping in on
> the tag, dispose of the tag and choose another.
>
> It looks to me, along with the other services, to be worth the increased
> cost -- and it's a yearly fee, not monthly. I'm already paying GeoCities
> for my Web space, so the added cost wouldn't be objectionable.
>
>
You've just described sneakemail as well, which is free (with a 150K
limit on msg size, and 10Mb total traffic per month). You set it up to
forward to the address you want protected. I used it for over a year
and liked it so much I went ahead and "subscribed". That upped my total
traffic to 75Mb per month, and msg size to, I think, 500K. It also
kicked open some other features I haven't explored yet.
The folks that send me the huge files are family and friends, who have
my home address.
Depending on the price and your willingness to generate a fresh tagged
address for each merchant, you should be very pleased with either Yahoo
Plus or Sneakemail.
~ Rosanne
Bruce
news:bstt8s$pol$1...@quark.scn.rain.com:
> "IMO - and I realize it's not the common O - I don't think most
> viruses and worms are that big a deal for smart and prudently cautious
> individual recipients; the big problem is the drain they put on mail
> systems when they hit the mailboxes of the not-so-savvy ... or entire
> organizations that rely on Outlook ..."
That drain is the key thing. Spam increases the load on mail servers
exponentially, and is the current reason that the Imminent Death of the Net
is Predicted! The laws proposed, though, won't do diddly squat to stem the
tide, especially if most of the spammers are offshore.
What's needed is an international treaty with Teeth...such as, perhaps,
summary execution on discovery and capture. (I know, I know; but it's
tempting.)
Rosanne
Sounds like you're doing stuff right...assuming you also patch your
system as needed.
I update my protection utilities regularly and patch my OS regularly
(Windows, so it NEEDS it regularly :-).
I also run a couple of programs that report access attempts both to
mynetwatchman for reports to the offender's ISP and dshield for tracking
the overall threat environment. Just trying to be a good Internet
citizen...
The first problem is that perhaps 2/3 of the people who go online treat
their computer like they treat their TV set... "Update what???? Huh?"
The second problem is that there's no reason folks shouldn't be able to
do just that. It's sad when you have to put on virtual armor before you
turn your computer on. I like computers, but not everybody does. I had
to jack up an uber-geek for saying that if the 70+-year-old emigres I
was working with at the time couldn't learn all the fancy new computer
bells and whistles, maybe they should just retire or find another job. I
reminded him that they could do their jobs quite well with pen and
paper, thank you very much, but that without them, he'd be standing in
an unemployment line. Undersocialized idiot...
It isn't in our culture to be that paranoid. When we send a letter, we
leave security to the US Postal service. When we call our bank, we rely
on the phone system to be secure (!!!). We're not used to doing our own
policing.
Fortunately, the culture is slowly changing. Kids are growing up with
computers, and software designers are making those computers more user-
friendly and intuitive. Society is even catching up. I did some research
on identity theft back in 1998, and it was grim. Mortgage companies
threw old paperwork out unshredded (remember how you have to give them
your life story to get a loan?); the DMV threw out old drivers' licenses
intact, etc. There's an awareness of the need for information security
out there now that wasn't there 5-6 years ago. Laws to prosecute
identity theft are slowly hitting the books. Now I just worry about the
ubiquitous access that all branches of government are getting to our
personal information, thank to the Patriot Act.
<steps off her soapbox> In the meantime, I just like a clean inbox :-)
~ Rosanne
Bookwyrm
When Swen got going, it only took my ISP about 3-4 hours before they
somehow got filters (or something) in place that stripped the
attachments before they hit my mailbox.
Besides, I refuse to use Outlook or Outlook Express -- Netscape works
just fine for me.
'wyrm
Pat Kight
>>"I'm not too worried about Swen-like viruses. I do backups of critical
>>data, I use good anti-virus software, I don't use an e-mail address book
>>that's especially susceptible to hijacking, and I filter *all* e-mail with
>>attachments into a "suspect" folder until I have time to check the
>>addresses and see if it's from someone I actually know. I may miss a few
>>`cute' forwarded graphics, or somebody's baby pictures, but I don't care.
>>
>>"IMO - and I realize it's not the common O - I don't think most viruses and
>>worms are that big a deal for smart and prudently cautious individual
>>recipients; the big problem is the drain they put on mail systems when they
>>hit the mailboxes of the not-so-savvy ... or entire organizations that rely
>>on Outlook ..."
> Sounds like you're doing stuff right...assuming you also patch your
> system as needed.
"Yup. Not, needless to say, by opening e-mails purporting to be from
Microsoft." (-:
> I update my protection utilities regularly and patch my OS regularly
> (Windows, so it NEEDS it regularly :-).
"Annoying, isn't it?
> I also run a couple of programs that report access attempts both to
> mynetwatchman for reports to the offender's ISP and dshield for tracking
> the overall threat environment. Just trying to be a good Internet
> citizen...
*nod* I don't have any automatic reporting programs running, but I can
read headers, and when I get something that's traceable, I complain to
the appropriate ISP. Of course, when they're based in Singapore or Korea
or Egypt, that doesn't always do much good, but ... one does what one must.
> The first problem is that perhaps 2/3 of the people who go online treat
> their computer like they treat their TV set... "Update what???? Huh?"
*nod* "That doesn't affect how I handle my own e-mail box, or my on-line
identity, though."
> Fortunately, the culture is slowly changing. Kids are growing up with
> computers, and software designers are making those computers more user-
> friendly and intuitive. Society is even catching up. I did some research
> on identity theft back in 1998, and it was grim. Mortgage companies
> threw old paperwork out unshredded (remember how you have to give them
> your life story to get a loan?); the DMV threw out old drivers' licenses
> intact, etc. There's an awareness of the need for information security
> out there now that wasn't there 5-6 years ago. Laws to prosecute
> identity theft are slowly hitting the books. Now I just worry about the
> ubiquitous access that all branches of government are getting to our
> personal information, thank to the Patriot Act.
"While I don't *like* any of those developments, they haven't changed
the way I live my life. My telephone number and address are listed, in
the phone book and various on-line directories. I use the same e-mail
address for everything. I say what I want on line, where I want, and
don't much care who reads it or repeats it. I honestly don't give a damn
about the kind of `privacy' most people on the 'Net seem to be worried
about. Heck, I don't even especially care what the gummint knows about
me, although I find the `Patriot' Act appalling and unAmerican.
"I'm not suggesting this as a general rule for anybody else, I'm just
trying to point out that it's possible to live a relatively open
life-on-the-'Net and not have it come back to bite one on the butt. If
it does, well ... *shrug* ... I'm a grownup, I can deal with it."
--
Jezebel
kig...@peak.org
Matthew Russotto
Pat Kight <kig...@peak.org> wrote:
>"I'm not too worried about Swen-like viruses. I do backups of critical
>data, I use good anti-virus software, I don't use an e-mail address book
>that's especially susceptible to hijacking, and I filter *all* e-mail with
>attachments into a "suspect" folder until I have time to check the
>addresses and see if it's from someone I actually know. I may miss a few
>`cute' forwarded graphics, or somebody's baby pictures, but I don't care.
Yep, Swen was a pain, but as soon as I told the system to ditch any
messages over 100K, it was taken care of. If I'd had any real
messages coming in that big, there were other criteria I could have
used. The OTHER Swen annoyances were more difficult -- idiot
intermediate mailers which would strip the attachment and send me the
rest of the message (which would be tiny and thus get though), and
SWEN-related bounces for mail forged from my address. I got them,
too.
Unfortunately, SWEN contributed to the effective shutdown of the mail
server on grace.speakeasy.net, so until I get another email address I
can use for low-priority mail, that address doesn't work. The one in
the .signature continues to work, though. The issue is that far more
harvesters harvest the headers than the headers AND bodies, so I can
reduce spam on my main address (which interrupts me if it gets through
the filters there) a lot by having the header hold a secondary address.
>"IMO - and I realize it's not the common O - I don't think most viruses and
>worms are that big a deal for smart and prudently cautious individual
>recipients
<OSWar>
Of course not. Smart and prudently cautious individuals don't use
Windows :-)
</OSWar>
--
Matthew T. Russotto mrus...@speakeasy.net
"Extremism in defense of liberty is no vice, and moderation in pursuit
of justice is no virtue." But extreme restriction of liberty in pursuit of
a modicum of security is a very expensive vice.
David C. Pugh
news:deudnQ2JAcG...@speakeasy.net...
(...)
> <OSWar>
> Of course not. Smart and prudently cautious individuals don't use
> Windows :-)
> </OSWar>
Okay, Matthew, I'll play. :-)
I know myself to be a prudent and cautious individual, arrive at
airports two hours before my flight and all that, travel with a notebook
containing all conceivable information from passport number to the phone of
my cat-feeder, do manual double-entry bookkeeping on my bizz, get the
picture? So I guess it's the 'smart' part where I fall down. :-)
Seven and a half years on the Net with Windows (95, 98 and 2000) and
touch wood, not a single virus infection. God must look after fools and
horses, what? :-)
Actually, my ISP has a virus-filter that's even better than Norton,
which I have too, as a second line of defence. I never noticed the Swen
thing, except the odd stripped header and reading about it here and on the
news.
--
David C. Pugh
"From ghouls and ghosties and long-leggety beasties, and things that go bump
on the Net; Good Lord, deliver us."
To mail me, replace biblical character with his dad.