What is phenazone (antipyrine) ?
John Paul Osborne
My girlfriend is Norwegian and she gets the occasional headache. She
prefers to use an OTC pain reliever that she gets in Norway. Its
brand name is Fanalgin (made by NycoMed Pharma) and it contians
phenazone (which I've learned is also known as antipyrine).
My questions are:
-What is phenazone/antipyrine? Is there an OTC equivalent in the USA?
I don't think there is.
-If there isn't a US equivalent ... why isn't there? Are there any
dangers? Norwegian drug stores are REALLY strict (for example, NyQuil
and other cold-relief drugs are not sold in Norway at all), so I'd be
surprised if it were a "dangerous" OTC drug.
Thanks experts!
William Penrose
> -What is phenazone/antipyrine? Is there an OTC equivalent in the USA?
> I don't think there is.
Here are the trade names for antipyrine in its various commercial
forms: Acetopyrine, Acopyrine, Acetasol, Astrolin, and Pyrosal. I have
never seen them for sale OTC.
A pharmacist could give you more information, perhaps on why it is not
commonly used in the US. Ibuprofen is pretty effective. Has she tried
that?
Bill Penrose
Steve Harris sbharris@ROMAN9.netcom.com
This is an old fever/pain drug which is chemically a pyrazolone. Not
really like anything else I know of. There is no strict US equivalent
as the drug was long ago taken off the market here because it
occasionally caused agranulocytosis (no white cells in the blood).
With acetominophen and NSAIDS available as alternatives to treat fever
and pain probably more safely, out went phenazone/antipyrine. That's
the official story, anyway. In truth, it's a drug that has been
generic for a century at least, so it really had no big pharma
defenders. Drugs are victims of witchhunts too, if they have no big
money defense.
There's still some phenazone in USP otic drops for ear aches, when it
functions as a local antiinflammatory (along with benzocaine as a
local anasthetic), but since that's essentially a topical use with
less absorption, it's allowed.
Steve Harris
hanson
wrote in message news:79cf0a8.03100...@posting.google.com...
> josbo...@aol.com (John Paul Osborne) wrote in message
news:<eaf6fa94.03100...@posting.google.com>...
> > Hi.
> >
> > My girlfriend is Norwegian and she gets the occasional headache. She
> > prefers to use an OTC pain reliever that she gets in Norway. Its
> > brand name is Fanalgin (made by NycoMed Pharma) and it contians
> > phenazone (which I've learned is also known as antipyrine).
> >
> > My questions are:
> >
> > -What is phenazone/antipyrine? Is there an OTC equivalent in the USA?
> > I don't think there is.
> >
> > -If there isn't a US equivalent ... why isn't there? Are there any
> > dangers? Norwegian drug stores are REALLY strict (for example, NyQuil
> > and other cold-relief drugs are not sold in Norway at all), so I'd be
> > surprised if it were a "dangerous" OTC drug.
> >
> > Thanks experts!
>
>
> This is an old fever/pain drug which is chemically a pyrazolone. Not
> really like anything else I know of. There is no strict US equivalent
> as the drug was long ago taken off the market here because it
> occasionally caused agranulocytosis (no white cells in the blood).
> With acetominophen and NSAIDS available as alternatives to treat fever
> and pain probably more safely, out went phenazone/antipyrine. That's
> the official story, anyway. In truth, it's a drug that has been
> generic for a century at least, so it really had no big pharma
> defenders.
> Drugs are victims of witchhunts too, if they have no big money defense.
Steve, you are fucken-A right on this one. And your are correct in that
there is an entire slew of such cheap, venerable drugs, and food additives
that you can't get any longer in the USA. That is in part why seniors who
require drugs must travel to Mexico or Canada to get affordable meds,
while the folks in congress enjoy their "gifts", they get from the drug
companies, on the Caribbean beaches where they discuss the matter....
Phenazone (Antipyrine) = C11H12N2O = CAS No: 60-80-0.
It is a distant hydrazine derivative: *-C(CH3)=CH-CO-N(Ph)-N(CH3)-*
Such pharmaceutical R2>N-N<R2 molecules are always viewed with
a jaundiced eye in med safety circles because of their **potential**
carcinogenic and teratogenic effects upon prolonged, sustained and
excessive use. This remote danger was of course used to get it off
the market here in the US and replace it with much costlier drugs.
Get details:
google: "phenazone antipyrine" 632 hits
google: "phenazone " 2420 hits
google: "antipyrine" 10200 hits
google: "dangers antipyrine" 143 hits
google: "antipyrine side effects" 2430 hits
google: "antipyrine warnings" 986 hits
hanson
Beverly Erlebacher
hanson <han...@quick.net> wrote:
>"Steve Harris sbha...@ROMAN9.netcom.com" <sbha...@ix.netcom.com>
>wrote in message news:79cf0a8.03100...@posting.google.com...
>>
>> really like anything else I know of. There is no strict US equivalent
>> as the drug was long ago taken off the market here because it
>> occasionally caused agranulocytosis (no white cells in the blood).
>> With acetominophen and NSAIDS available as alternatives to treat fever
>> and pain probably more safely, out went phenazone/antipyrine. That's
>> the official story, anyway. In truth, it's a drug that has been
>> generic for a century at least, so it really had no big pharma
>> defenders.
> *********************
>> Drugs are victims of witchhunts too, if they have no big money defense.
> *********************
>Steve, you are fucken-A right on this one. And your are correct in that
>there is an entire slew of such cheap, venerable drugs, and food additives
>that you can't get any longer in the USA. That is in part why seniors who
>require drugs must travel to Mexico or Canada to get affordable meds,
>while the folks in congress enjoy their "gifts", they get from the drug
>companies, on the Caribbean beaches where they discuss the matter....
Can't you go a little further overboard?
>Phenazone (Antipyrine) = C11H12N2O = CAS No: 60-80-0.
>It is a distant hydrazine derivative: *-C(CH3)=CH-CO-N(Ph)-N(CH3)-*
>Such pharmaceutical R2>N-N<R2 molecules are always viewed with
>a jaundiced eye in med safety circles because of their **potential**
>carcinogenic and teratogenic effects upon prolonged, sustained and
>excessive use. This remote danger was of course used to get it off
>the market here in the US and replace it with much costlier drugs.
Oh, yes, costlier drugs like ASA (aspirin), an even more venerable drug.
Look, there's no point in even a generic drug manufacturer re-introducing
something like phenazone. It's known to "occasionally" cause a serious
condition, agranulocytosis. It belongs to a group of compounds that are
known to cause cancer and birth defects. It has no benefits over equally
effective drugs that don't have these problems.
People *will* take OTC drugs excessively. They *will* ignore label warnings.
When they get cancer or have a child with a birth defect, or a miscarriage,
even if totally unrelated to their drug use, they *will* blame the drug and
in your country, if they can, sue. If you were a generic drug manufacturer,
wouldn't you prefer to produce ASA, ibuprofen, vitamins and a hundred off-
patent prescription drugs instead? Who's going to buy phenazone anyway?
The huge Norwegian immigrant market? Do you think you could mount a cost-
effective marketing campaign? What could you say about it that wasn't
misleading or an outright lie? Why should people stop taking ibuprofen
or whatever, and take this stuff instead?
hanson
news:2003Oct6.0...@jarvis.cs.toronto.edu...
> In article <4B6gb.52$%E....@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
> hanson <han...@quick.net> wrote:
> >"Steve Harris sbha...@ROMAN9.netcom.com" <sbha...@ix.netcom.com>
> >wrote in message news:79cf0a8.03100...@posting.google.com...
> >>
> >> This is an old fever/pain drug which is chemically a pyrazolone. Not
> >> really like anything else I know of. There is no strict US equivalent
> >> as the drug was long ago taken off the market here because it
> >> occasionally caused agranulocytosis (no white cells in the blood).
> >> With acetominophen and NSAIDS available as alternatives to treat fever
> >> and pain probably more safely, out went phenazone/antipyrine. That's
> >> the official story, anyway. In truth, it's a drug that has been
> >> generic for a century at least, so it really had no big pharma
> >> defenders.
> > *********************
> >> Drugs are victims of witchhunts too, if they have no big money defense.
> > *********************
> >Steve, you are fucken-A right on this one. And your are correct in that
> >there is an entire slew of such cheap, venerable drugs, and food additives
> >that you can't get any longer in the USA. That is in part why seniors who
> >require drugs must travel to Mexico or Canada to get affordable meds,
> >while the folks in congress enjoy their "gifts", they get from the drug
> >companies, on the Caribbean beaches where they discuss the matter....
>
> Can't you go a little further overboard?
No, it's not me,...... this issue made some time back a full "60 Minutes"
broadcast and it's a current, hot issue in congress--- Are you one of those
gift recipients, Beverly, that you get your bloomers in a twist over this?
>
> >Phenazone (Antipyrine) = C11H12N2O = CAS No: 60-80-0.
> >It is a distant hydrazine derivative: *-C(CH3)=CH-CO-N(Ph)-N(CH3)-*
> >Such pharmaceutical R2>N-N<R2 molecules are always viewed with
> >a jaundiced eye in med safety circles because of their **potential**
> >carcinogenic and teratogenic effects upon prolonged, sustained and
> >excessive use. This remote danger was of course used to get it off
> >the market here in the US and replace it with much costlier drugs.
>
> Oh, yes, costlier drugs like ASA (aspirin), an even more venerable drug.
You just argue here for argument's sake, Bev. Nobody said anything
about ASA.
>
> Look, there's no point in even a generic drug manufacturer re-introducing
> something like phenazone. It's known to "occasionally" cause a serious
> condition, agranulocytosis. It belongs to a group of compounds that are
> known to cause cancer and birth defects. It has no benefits over equally
> effective drugs that don't have these problems.
>
> People *will* take OTC drugs excessively. They *will* ignore label warnings.
> When they get cancer or have a child with a birth defect, or a miscarriage,
> even if totally unrelated to their drug use, they *will* blame the drug and
> in your country, if they can, sue. If you were a generic drug manufacturer,
> wouldn't you prefer to produce ASA, ibuprofen, vitamins and a hundred off-
> patent prescription drugs instead? Who's going to buy phenazone anyway?
> The huge Norwegian immigrant market? Do you think you could mount a cost-
> effective marketing campaign? What could you say about it that wasn't
> misleading or an outright lie?
> Why should people stop taking ibuprofen or whatever,
> and take this stuff instead?
>
>
Why?.... because they (the OP) obviously like it, and ask for it, for it
has also obviously helped them. Why should they take new, costly &
uncertain stuff (to which they even may have allergic reactions)?
Beverly Baby, there's an old saying: "IF IT AIN'T BROKE, DON'T FIX IT".
Let me restate Steve's venerable line for your benefit:
> > *********************
> >> Drugs are victims of witchhunts too, if they have no big money defense.
> > *********************
Take care, babe,
hanson
Steve Harris sbharris@ROMAN9.netcom.com
> Look, there's no point in even a generic drug manufacturer re-introducing
> something like phenazone. It's known to "occasionally" cause a serious
> condition, agranulocytosis. It belongs to a group of compounds that are
> known to cause cancer and birth defects. It has no benefits over equally
> effective drugs that don't have these problems.
Er, yes, but those problems wouldn't include APAP and most NSAIDS,
which are all reported to occasionally cause agranulocytosis.
Including naproxen and ibuprofen. It all comes down to how often this
happens. I can't come up with any numbers for any of these drugs. I
don't think it's known. Which leads us back to my original comment. I
don't think anybody really knows if phenazone is safer than our
standard OTC NSAIDS or not. And with no money available to find out,
we're not ever going to find out. Is there then any rational reason
why this drug is not in the USP, but NSAIDS are? Considering the 10's
of thousands of deaths that OTC NSAIDS cause each and every year? I
think not. We jolly well KNOW OTC NSAIDS kill people. GI bleeding does
most of it, but you're just as dead of die from a GI bleed as if you
die from an infection.
SBH
hanson
message news:79cf0a8.03100...@posting.google.com...
"Eventual suppression of your immune system after "chronic" or prolonged
use". Anybody who uses that stuff during the flu season will tell you
the story. MD's tend to blame instead the fast mutation rate of the virus,
instead of admitting that it is the ugly side-effect of NSAID's that make
you susceptible to and suffer more than the average # of flu/cold infections.
hanson
Hillary Israeli
Steve Harris sbha...@ROMAN9.netcom.com <sbha...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
*This is an old fever/pain drug which is chemically a pyrazolone. Not
*really like anything else I know of. There is no strict US equivalent
*as the drug was long ago taken off the market here because it
*occasionally caused agranulocytosis (no white cells in the blood).
What's up with the Norwegians and Finns using drugs that cause this type
of problem?
I was pretty shocked when our last au pair, from Finland, arrived bearing
a bottle of chloramphenicol eyedrops.
--
hillary israeli vmd http://www.hillary.net in...@hillary.net
"uber vaccae in quattuor partes divisum est."
not-so-newly minted veterinarian-at-large :)
PSmith9626
From the american heritage dictionary ( web search)
A toxic white powder, C11H12N2O, formerly used to reduce fever and relieve
pain.
Note, the word "toxic"
A websearch on google gave a lot of hits.
best
penny
Beverly Erlebacher
hanson <han...@quick.net> wrote:
>"Beverly Erlebacher" <b...@cs.toronto.edu> wrote in message
>news:2003Oct6.0...@jarvis.cs.toronto.edu...
>> In article <4B6gb.52$%E....@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
>> hanson <han...@quick.net> wrote:
>> >Steve, you are fucken-A right on this one. And your are correct in that
>> >there is an entire slew of such cheap, venerable drugs, and food additives
>> >that you can't get any longer in the USA. That is in part why seniors who
>> >require drugs must travel to Mexico or Canada to get affordable meds,
>> >while the folks in congress enjoy their "gifts", they get from the drug
>> >companies, on the Caribbean beaches where they discuss the matter....
>>
>> Can't you go a little further overboard?
>
>No, it's not me,...... this issue made some time back a full "60 Minutes"
>broadcast and it's a current, hot issue in congress--- Are you one of those
>gift recipients, Beverly, that you get your bloomers in a twist over this?
Gosh, 60 Minutes, font of all truth.
I don't even live in the US. Everyone who isn't as rabid on some issue
as you are must be one of your venal corrupt evil conspiracist opponents,
right?
My underwear seems to be arranged normally. How about yours?
>> >Phenazone (Antipyrine) = C11H12N2O = CAS No: 60-80-0.
>> >It is a distant hydrazine derivative: *-C(CH3)=CH-CO-N(Ph)-N(CH3)-*
>> >Such pharmaceutical R2>N-N<R2 molecules are always viewed with
>> >a jaundiced eye in med safety circles because of their **potential**
>> >carcinogenic and teratogenic effects upon prolonged, sustained and
>> >excessive use. This remote danger was of course used to get it off
>> >the market here in the US and replace it with much costlier drugs.
>>
>> Oh, yes, costlier drugs like ASA (aspirin), an even more venerable drug.
>
>You just argue here for argument's sake, Bev. Nobody said anything
>about ASA.
Your contention is that the conspiracy is to get older cheap drugs off the
market so people will be forced to use newer more expensive drugs. ASA is
a counterexample. This is a logical response to your contention.
>> Why should people stop taking ibuprofen or whatever,
>> and take this stuff instead?
>>
>Why?.... because they (the OP) obviously like it, and ask for it, for it
>has also obviously helped them. Why should they take new, costly &
>uncertain stuff (to which they even may have allergic reactions)?
Antipyrin hasn't been available for a long time. There are many cheap
OTC alternatives: ASA, ibuprofen, acetaminophen, etc.
>Beverly Baby, there's an old saying: "IF IT AIN'T BROKE, DON'T FIX IT".
Gee, Hanson, I'd be a very impressive baby if I could already type.
Is that the gist of your response? Because you assume I'm female, my
opinions are ipso facto inferior to yours? This is called ad hominem,
and it's widely regarded as one of the last resorts of the incompetent
debater.
>Let me restate Steve's venerable line for your benefit:
Perhaps you should look up 'venerable' in a dictionary. While you're at
it, look up 'restate', too.
>> > *********************
>> >> Drugs are victims of witchhunts too, if they have no big money defense.
>> > *********************
Steve often has interesting things to say, and 90% of the time he can
say them without frothing slightly at the mouth.
>Take care, babe,
>hanson
Take care, person, and if you've got a Y chromosome, continue to depend on
it to bolster your feeling of intellectual superiority over half the human
race.
Buckleys
Most drugs are toxic. Recommended dosages are set such that the
physiological response is beneficial, rather than terminal.
Rob.
Steve Harris sbharris@ROMAN9.netcom.com
> In <79cf0a8.03100...@posting.google.com>,
> Steve Harris sbha...@ROMAN9.netcom.com <sbha...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
> *This is an old fever/pain drug which is chemically a pyrazolone. Not
> *really like anything else I know of. There is no strict US equivalent
> *as the drug was long ago taken off the market here because it
> *occasionally caused agranulocytosis (no white cells in the blood).
>
> What's up with the Norwegians and Finns using drugs that cause this type
> of problem?
>
> I was pretty shocked when our last au pair, from Finland, arrived bearing
> a bottle of chloramphenicol eyedrops.
COMMENT
ROFL! Good pickup. That's pretty bad. Can Swedish Methotrexate Vapor
Rub be far behind?
Buckleys
Does topical chloramphenicol cause amaemia too? I didn't think it did -
it is still prescribed for eye infections in Australia AFAIK, but not
for internal use.
Rob.
James Pinkerton
> > Rub be far behind?
>
> Does topical chloramphenicol cause amaemia too? I didn't think it did -
> it is still prescribed for eye infections in Australia AFAIK, but not
> for internal use.
>
> Rob.
Probably not but maybe in theory it could.. Chloramphenicol is certainly not
the only drug on the American market that can kill you. Probably the
lawyers killed the use of chloramphenicol.
Steve Harris sbharris@ROMAN9.netcom.com
The aplastic anemia very rarely and idiosyncratically caused by
chloramphenical is NOT dose-dependent. Which means it's probably some
kind of weird allergy-like autoimmune thing, and not a straightforward
toxicity at all. And yes, eyedrops (of which some is always absorbed)
have been reported to cause it. Thus, the drug is only used for
life-threatening conditions (meningitis), and should NEVER be used in
human eyedrops (where by definition it's being used for some non-life
threatening problem).
Oddly, there is an analog of chloramphenical called methamphenical
which has similar antibacterial properties but no history of causing
this aplastic anemia. However, it's never been approved in the US.
That's the old generic money problem again. So we remain stuck with
chloro.
hanson
> My underwear seems to be arranged normally.
> How about yours?
> he can say them without frothing slightly at the mouth.
>
...underwear -- gist -- Steve -- frothing -- mouth........
Your fetish about my underwear is particularly cute. Thank you.
Is this a marriage proposal, my sweet, little Beaver?
HAHAhahahaha.........ahahahahahanson
Hillary Israeli
Steve Harris sbha...@ROMAN9.netcom.com <sbha...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
*hil...@hillary.net (Hillary Israeli) wrote in message news:<slrnbo6ngg....@manx.misty.com>...
*> In <79cf0a8.03100...@posting.google.com>,
*> Steve Harris sbha...@ROMAN9.netcom.com <sbha...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
*>
*> *This is an old fever/pain drug which is chemically a pyrazolone. Not
*> *really like anything else I know of. There is no strict US equivalent
*> *as the drug was long ago taken off the market here because it
*> *occasionally caused agranulocytosis (no white cells in the blood).
*>
*> What's up with the Norwegians and Finns using drugs that cause this type
*> of problem?
*>
*> I was pretty shocked when our last au pair, from Finland, arrived bearing
*> a bottle of chloramphenicol eyedrops.
*
*
*COMMENT
*
*ROFL! Good pickup. That's pretty bad. Can Swedish Methotrexate Vapor
*Rub be far behind?
I told her to chuck it and took her to an American doctor, who prescribed
erythromicin ophthalmic ointment, which cleared up whatever her problem
was. :)
M.L.A. Bakker
> *> I was pretty shocked when our last au pair, from Finland, arrived bearing
> *> a bottle of chloramphenicol eyedrops.
>
>
> I told her to chuck it and took her to an American doctor, who prescribed
> erythromicin ophthalmic ointment, which cleared up whatever her problem
> was. :)
>
<mild irony-mode> Well yippiekayee, thank $DEITY for Yankee doctors!
</mild irony-mode>
But why is it in the USA rosiglitazone (Avandia) is combined with
insulin, when it is shown to induce the risk of developing hartfailure?
In the Netherlands this combination is contra-indicated.
But we do allow the use of chloramfenicol eyedrops en opthalmic
ointment, albeit for no longer than two weeks.
Not trying to start a transatlantic flamefest here, but just to say that
different authorities may have different methods of assesing and
weighing risks, and that one system isn't necessarily (sp?) better.
Menno
M.L.A. Bakker
> *> I was pretty shocked when our last au pair, from Finland, arrived
bearing
> *> a bottle of chloramphenicol eyedrops.
>
>
> I told her to chuck it and took her to an American doctor, who
prescribed
> erythromicin ophthalmic ointment, which cleared up whatever her problem
> was. :)
>
<mild irony-mode> Well yippiekayee, thank $DEITY for Yankee doctors!
</mild irony-mode>
But why is it in the USA rosiglitazone (Avandia) is combined with
insulin, when it is shown to induce the risk of developing hartfailure?
In the Netherlands this combination is contra-indicated.
But we do allow the use of chloramfenicol eyedrops en opthalmic
ointment, albeit for no longer than two weeks.
Not trying to start a transatlantic flamefest here, but just to say that
different authorities may have different methods of asessing and
weighing risks, and that one system isn't necessarily (sp?) better.
Menno
(this might be doubleposted due to strange behaviour of both Mozilla en
my newsserver)
Hillary Israeli
M.L.A. Bakker <bakker.ml...@wanadoo.NADASPAM.nl> wrote:
*Hillary Israeli wrote:
*
*> *> I was pretty shocked when our last au pair, from Finland, arrived bearing
*> *> a bottle of chloramphenicol eyedrops.
*>
*>
*> I told her to chuck it and took her to an American doctor, who prescribed
*> erythromicin ophthalmic ointment, which cleared up whatever her problem
*> was. :)
*>
*
*<mild irony-mode> Well yippiekayee, thank $DEITY for Yankee doctors!
*</mild irony-mode>
*But why is it in the USA rosiglitazone (Avandia) is combined with
*insulin, when it is shown to induce the risk of developing hartfailure?
*In the Netherlands this combination is contra-indicated.
I have no idea. I am not a physician.
*But we do allow the use of chloramfenicol eyedrops en opthalmic
*ointment, albeit for no longer than two weeks.
That kind of frightens me. I am willing to concede it may be an irrational
fear, but I always had to glove up to handle chloramphenicol in school and
it's kind of an ingrained reaction not to touch it.
*Not trying to start a transatlantic flamefest here, but just to say that
*different authorities may have different methods of assesing and
*weighing risks, and that one system isn't necessarily (sp?) better.
That's true. But I didn't want those eyedrops in my house especially since
she sometimes used them while watching my toddler.