Lane Departure Warning Systems
El Alumbrado
would sense lane markings and keep a vehicle centered in a traffic lane. Here's a company I found
that has developed such a product:
http://www.iteris.com/av/avindex.html
Looks like it's just a camera and some software that can recognize various lane markings.
Interesting stuff. I wonder how long it will take something like this to become as common as cruise
control? I'd sure like to have it (and a good heads-up display, too).
El Alumbrado
"Civis Texanus Sum"
GBinNC
I agree, but can you even begin to imagine the potential liability
issues?
(I can, and it's not a pretty sight.)
El Alumbrado
Can't be too much worse than cruise control, no? You're still expected to stay awake, I think. <g>
GBinNC
<el*alum...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Can't be too much worse than cruise control, no? You're still expected to stay awake, I think. <g>
LOL. I'm sitting here counting the ticks of my clock, waiting to see
how long it will take for somebody to post a "true" story about some
old dude who set the RV cruise control on and went back to make a
sandwich. Been a while since we've heard it.
(tick-tick-tick-tick-ti....)
Ed
Ed
bill horne
Once you re-educate all the dumbasses who think you should 'keep right
except to pass', it'd probably be a neat thing to have. But it would
probably get pretty exciting if merge lines sneak up on you while you're
tuning your Roady.
--
bill
Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
El Alumbrado
> El Alumbrado wrote:
> >
> > Some time ago there was a discussion in another thread regarding a simple "lane hold" feature
that
> > would sense lane markings and keep a vehicle centered in a traffic lane. Here's a company I
found
> > that has developed such a product:
> >
> > http://www.iteris.com/av/avindex.html
> >
> > Looks like it's just a camera and some software that can recognize various lane markings.
> >
> > Interesting stuff. I wonder how long it will take something like this to become as common as
cruise
> > control? I'd sure like to have it (and a good heads-up display, too).
>
> except to pass', it'd probably be a neat thing to have. But it would
> probably get pretty exciting if merge lines sneak up on you while you're
> tuning your Roady.
>
"laser-guided adaptive cruise control" that worked great. It would slow down if you were gaining on
the car in front, then speed up when he got out of the way; even flashed a light if you were gaining
too rapidly and it thought you might rear-end him. Add a GPS and we're starting to get close to an
"automated driver assistant". It would be like having a co-pilot peering over your shoulder drawing
your attention to things you may have missed("Ahhh, Skipper, watch out for that mountain!"), but one
who didn't want to stop at every outlet mall you passed.
Not that I'm arguing about being an occasional "dumbass", but what does "keeping right" have to do
with it? When I'm in the "bus", I keep right when I can. When I'm in the Porsche (occasionally at
"Splach 2", or twice the speed limit, on empty rural interstates), I tend to stay left unless
somebody even faster wants to get by. Seems the "driver assistant" would be helpful in any case, no?
Alan Balmer
<el*alum...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>Not that I'm arguing about being an occasional "dumbass", but what does "keeping right" have to do
>with it? When I'm in the "bus", I keep right when I can. When I'm in the Porsche (occasionally at
>"Splach 2", or twice the speed limit, on empty rural interstates), I tend to stay left unless
>somebody even faster wants to get by. Seems the "driver assistant" would be helpful in any case, no?
>
I wondered what the relevance was, too. For me, it depends on the
road. If there are more than 2 lanes (per direction) I prefer the
second from the right, to stay out of the way of mergers and turners.
I trust Bill isn't one of those who drives in the left-most lane no
matter what. Actually, I'd like to know one of those - I'm curious
about their reasoning (if any.)
--
Al Balmer
Balmer Consulting
removebalmerc...@att.net
GBinNC
<el*alum...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Not that I'm arguing about being an occasional "dumbass", but what does "keeping right" have to do
>with it?
You clearly don't realize what you're getting into. bill is about to
tell you that he feels no compunction at all to move to the right lane
when somebody faster comes up behind, as long as he is doing his
beloved "8 over" the limit.
Most people -- but not bill -- understand that if the car behind
obviously wants to go faster than you, you just became a"slower
traffic."
GB in NC
El Alumbrado
> I trust Bill isn't one of those who drives in the left-most lane no
> matter what. Actually, I'd like to know one of those - I'm curious
> about their reasoning (if any.)
Bill sure isn't. Can't speak for bill.
Laziness, rudeness, or arrogance would be the only rationales that come to mind. I don't think of
bill as lazy, rude, or arrogant (no more than the rest of us, anyway), so maybe he's thought of
something else.
I suspect that bill remembers a comment I made in an earlier thread about my distaste for "left-lane
cruisers", and just wants to see me hop a little. S'okay, I'm willing to oblige.
El Alumbrado - (AKA "Bill")
"Civis Texanus Sum"
El Alumbrado
>... if the car behind
> obviously wants to go faster than you, you just became a"slower
> traffic."
>
then you're "slower traffic", even if the speed limit is 60. "Slower Traffic Keep Right" is the same
thing as "Keep Right Except to Pass". It's not only the polite thing to do, it's the safe thing to
do.
Neon John
wrote:
>I think "Lane Hold" coupled with adaptive cruise control would be the hot ticket. My Q45 had
>"laser-guided adaptive cruise control" that worked great. It would slow down if you were gaining on
>the car in front, then speed up when he got out of the way; even flashed a light if you were gaining
>too rapidly and it thought you might rear-end him. Add a GPS and we're starting to get close to an
>"automated driver assistant". It would be like having a co-pilot peering over your shoulder drawing
>your attention to things you may have missed("Ahhh, Skipper, watch out for that mountain!"), but one
>who didn't want to stop at every outlet mall you passed.
Unfortunately we're a LONG way from a driving assistant. I spent a lot of
time and a bit of money on this project back in the 80s. I was driving about
60 miles one way to work back then and I thought surely I could design a
system that would follow the white line on the interstate. I succeeded. Most
of the time. It was that 0.005% of the time that was the killer. Modern
digital processing is fast enough to address many of the concerns, such as
trapping and neutralizing excursions caused by foreign objects in the camera's
field of view that look like white lines. But when the lines go away, the
system makes an instant transition to requiring manual input. Something that
may not be forthcoming in time if the drive is relaxing/dozing/whatever.
GPS isn't anywhere near accurate enough, even with WAAS. Part of the problem
is the inherent accuracy of the moving GPS fix. The other part is the
inaccuracy of available road maps. Example: I'm currently involved in a
project to map the physical plant of a rural power Co-op. This involves
visiting every pole, transformer, substation and other facility, logging the
GPS coordinates and then creating appropriate maps. One of the things the
utility wants is to be able to designate which poles can be reached with
bucket trucks and which require climbing. That meas we need to place the
poles on the map in close position to the road. In some cases the road is
over 200 ft off the GPS track. We're using both SA2004 and Mapsend. I've
talked to SA and they tell me the maps that come with SA2004 are the best they
have.
In this application a gyro/accelerometer inertial navigation system that trims
what the road sensors pick up is more appropriate. I have an instrument
designed to measure with a high degree of accuracy the dynamics of a vehicle.
It contains a high stability GPS receiver (ovenized oscillator, etc), a 3 axis
ring gyro and a 3 axis accelerometer. I believe that this instrument could do
the job. The only problem is the cost - over $2k when I bought it a year ago.
It's too bad the Intelligent Highways initiative turned into just another sty
for the consultant and political hogs to wallow in. There were several good
ideas floated around that would not have cost much money. Back in the late
80s we did a concept design of a system that would have required little money
and no experimental technology to implement. (IMNSHO)Because my company was
not a Beltway Bandit, we never got funding to take it further. Oh well.
There is a major problem with any of these systems that use the vehicle's
steering and wheels. That is, driver attention. With my experimental system,
I found that my attention wandered within minutes of turning on the control
system. Even concentrating on the equipment and the experiment instead of
daydreaming or something, I found that I quickly lost the ability to instantly
respond to an emergency. I can imagine what it would be like driving more
than a mile or two at a time.
Our system automatically attached a small "spider" to the underside of each
qualified car and took control. Cars entering the intelligent highway under
machine control would as quickly as possible coalesce into "trains" of spiders
in contact with and communicating with each other. At the predesignated exit,
the train breaks apart and the exiting car proceeds down the ramp where the
spider detaches and is recycled to the entrance lane. This system, I think,
addressed most all the problems associated with driver inattention but it did
not address the rather freak problems such as trees/deer/other objects
appearing on the highway. Modern machine vision and wireless networking can
probably now handle that problem.
Oh well, just a little off-topic diversion from the normal political geezer
bickering.
John
---
John De Armond
johngdDO...@bellsouth.net
http://bellsouthpwp.net/j/o/johngd/
Cleveland, Occupied TN
Neon John
>I wondered what the relevance was, too. For me, it depends on the
>road. If there are more than 2 lanes (per direction) I prefer the
>second from the right, to stay out of the way of mergers and turners.
>I trust Bill isn't one of those who drives in the left-most lane no
>matter what. Actually, I'd like to know one of those - I'm curious
>about their reasoning (if any.)
One of my (ex) business partner's wife drove in the left lane regardless - at
5 under the limit. Of course she was one of those Nu Joesey leftist quiche
eating, volvo driving control freak assholes that have so spoiled that part of
the country. No logic - it was her right and by God, she asserted it all the
time.
GBinNC
I'm with you. My kind of driver.
Let the record show that I never knowingly stay in front of anybody in
the fast lane any longer than absolutely necessary for me to get out
of the way safely.
Anybody behind me who wants to go faster than I'm going will get all
the help I can give them to pass me, even if I have to pull off the
road and stop.
Which I do sometimes on one particular ten-mile stretch of winding
2-lane road near here that has no passing zones at all -- and
sometimes they do it for me. Depends on who's in the bigger hurry that
day. It's not hard to figure out.
GB in NC
Bob Clark
if you pass on the right anywhere, anytime you get a citation and points if
you get caught. The fines are stiff, about what we levy for passing a
stopped school bus. I'm sure that John's Joisey Girl would get the message
real quickly. I think this move would provide immediate benefits in
reduced accidents. We've all had the little tootsie with flying blonde hair
try to race us up an on ramp.
Bob
"Neon John" <johngdDO...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:qaastvokd06gvppb8...@4ax.com...
El Alumbrado
> ...
> Oh well, just a little off-topic diversion from the normal political geezer
> bickering.
John, I wasn't suggesting "vehicle control" based on GPS, simply attention reminders. I've been a
pilot for a long time, so I'm used to electronic voices telling me to pay attention ("Pull up! Pull
up!" is my favorite). I would like to have the little voices telling me "Lane warning!" if I'm
drifting out of lane, or "Collision!" if it looks like I'm about to rear-end somebody. Basically an
electronic copilot that's shouts "Hey, pay attention!" if it sees something important that I may
have missed because I was distracted with a cell phone or radio. We already have GPS systems that
read me directions and warn me that my next turn point is coming up. I think all the pieces are
there. It's just a matter of turning them into an integrated system.
El Alumbrado
> Which I do sometimes on one particular ten-mile stretch of winding
> 2-lane road near here that has no passing zones at all -- and
> sometimes they do it for me. Depends on who's in the bigger hurry that
> day. It's not hard to figure out.
In rural Texas, we often pull over and drive on the shoulder for a bit if somebody who wants to go
faster is coming up behind (shoulder-permitting, of course). It is a legal and expected courtesy. As
is passing a left-turning car on the right shoulder. Folks from elsewhere don't always know this,
though, and don't know what to make of it when someone pulls over to let them by or passes them on
the shoulder if they're turning left. I had a woman from Kansas follow me for *miles* just to yell
at me for passing on the shoulder. I replied "Sorry, I don't speak English" in my best faux "New
Yawk" accent. She replied, dumbfounded "You don't speak English?!?". I replied "Nope. Not a word."
and drove off leaving her stunned into silence on the side of the road.
I expect that Lon would appreciate that I didn't try to reason with her <grin>.
Alan Balmer
<el*alum...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>"Alan Balmer" <alba...@att.net> wrote in message news:p33stv0v31gqtqpih...@4ax.com...
>
>> I trust Bill isn't one of those who drives in the left-most lane no
>> matter what. Actually, I'd like to know one of those - I'm curious
>> about their reasoning (if any.)
>
>Bill sure isn't. Can't speak for bill.
Unfortunately, my fingers have been trained for decades to capitalize
proper names, and won't be persuaded otherwise. If "bill" is hoping to
make himself distinguished by using lower-case, OK, but he won't get
any help from me :-)
HHamp5246
>though, and don't know what to make of it when someone pulls over to let them
>by or passes them on
>the shoulder if they're turning left.
I didn't know it when I first got to Texas, but figgered it out pretty
quick..... I pulled off onto the shoulder alot when pulling the trailer... have
to say everyone who passed me "raised a hand" to wave.... I like that. I get
peeved when people don't say "thanks" for courtesies extended to them when
driving.
< I had a woman from Kansas follow me for *miles* just to yell at me for
passing on the shoulder.>
(c: I stopped on a country road in Cincinnati to ask a mailman a quick
direction question. Within seconds a Mercedes SL pulled up and the woman
started blowing the horn.... a solid blow.
The mailman and I both looked at her and I drove off... she followed me about
300 yards up to the corner still beeping! I flipped her off at the light.
I saw a long red fingernail hit the window button and the passenger window came
down.
In a harsh NY accent she said, "What is that... your age or your IQ?"
Feeling her education was lacking I enlightened her to the exact meaning of the
one finger salute.
The fingernail hit the button and the window went back up. I went right, she
went left...
It was just a little slice of life.
El Alumbrado
news:20031215181849...@mb-m10.aol.com...
> ....everyone who passed me "raised a hand" to wave....
Out in the "Texas Outback", waving to other drivers is common. The most common way to do this is for
two drivers approaching head-on (in opposite lanes!) to simply raise their index fingers off the
wheel in a common salute. I've had more than one "outstater" misunderstand this gesture over the
years. <g>
I regulalry run local "Ranch Roads" at super-legal speeds. Now, these Ranch Roads (sometimes "Farm
To Market" roads) are usually well-built, well-maintained roads often free of traffic of any kind.
On more than one occasion I've passed Sherrif's Deputies going the opposite way when we were both
doing triple-digits. On all occasions, we gave each other the Texas Finger Salute (friendly version)
and continued on our respective ways. Courtesy and common sense are alive and well in rural texas.
Alan Balmer
wrote:
>(c: I stopped on a country road in Cincinnati to ask a mailman a quick
>direction question. Within seconds a Mercedes SL pulled up and the woman
>started blowing the horn.... a solid blow.
You stopped *on* the road? With traffic seconds behind you?
>
>The mailman and I both looked at her and I drove off... she followed me about
>300 yards up to the corner still beeping! I flipped her off at the light.
>
The "still beeping" seems over-reaction on her part, not to mention
she apparently holds a grudge <g>. However, when I see a driver
"flipping off" someone, it tells me they know they were wrong. It
means "Screw you, I'll do whatever I like."
GBinNC
<el*alum...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Out in the "Texas Outback", waving to other drivers is common. The most common way to do this is for
>two drivers approaching head-on (in opposite lanes!) to simply raise their index fingers off the
>wheel in a common salute. I've had more than one "outstater" misunderstand this gesture over the
>years. <g>
We do this in my area too.
It's funny. On a certain 18-mile stretch of back roads I travel all
the time going to and from my house (which is away from what some
folks call "civilization") almost everybody "waves" at each other like
that. But once you pass through the first little town on the way to a
bigger town, almost nobody does it anymore.
It's as if people are saying "we need to be friendly in the back
woods, but you're in civilization now -- you're on your own."
I've observed this phenomenon in detail at least weekly for several
years and find it most interesting. And it's the same "wave" you
described, too.
I don't know who decides to wave first -- it just kinda happens at the
right time...
GB in NC
GBinNC
>I know of NO decent adult who actually writes those obscenities and
>then expects to be treated respectfully.
And no doubt you'll keep reminding us of that over and over and over
and over, right? Is that how you manage to keep her in your mind all
the time?
Dirty language really turns you on, huh?
GB in NC
BD
I know of NO decent adult who actually obsesses over some cyber female's
vernacular, lifestyle and color of underwear and then expects to be treated
as normal.
BD
HHamp5246
<alba...@att.net> writes:
>You stopped *on* the road? With traffic seconds behind you?
I stopped on a deserted country road.... one car an hour kind of road.... sadly
in this case it was two cars within a few minutes. She was out of line. As soon
as she beeped I drove. Most people would have been patient enough to wait
knowing the person was asking directions from the mailman. I am one of the
least patient people on earth and I wouldn't have beeped under the same
circumstamces.
HHamp5246
<el*alum...@yahoo.com> writes:
>Out in the "Texas Outback", waving to other drivers is common. The most
>common way to do this is for
>two drivers approaching head-on (in opposite lanes!) to simply raise their
>index fingers off the
>wheel in a common salute. I've had more than one "outstater" misunderstand
>this gesture over the
>years. <g>
The same was true in SC, the truck to truck finger wave which was different
from the raise a hand because you know someone wave.
Lon VanOstran
<el*alum...@yahoo.com> writes:
>I expect that Lon would appreciate that I didn't try to reason with her
><grin>.
>
>El Alumbrado
I do! LOL
Lon
Neon John
wrote:
>John, I wasn't suggesting "vehicle control" based on GPS, simply attention reminders. I've been a
>pilot for a long time, so I'm used to electronic voices telling me to pay attention ("Pull up! Pull
>up!" is my favorite).
That would be similar to an electronic condom that screeches "pull out! Pull
out! when there's a defect....
ahem..
>I would like to have the little voices telling me "Lane warning!" if I'm
>drifting out of lane, or "Collision!" if it looks like I'm about to rear-end somebody. Basically an
>electronic copilot that's shouts "Hey, pay attention!" if it sees something important that I may
>have missed because I was distracted with a cell phone or radio. We already have GPS systems that
>read me directions and warn me that my next turn point is coming up. I think all the pieces are
>there. It's just a matter of turning them into an integrated system.
WAAS enabled GPS is sufficiently accurate (obviously, from its purpose) to do
the job. The problem is the maps, the reference the GPS must work against,
are not. A ten foot error in placement for a plane is nothing. A 10 foot
error for a car is a ditch or the other lane. The maps I have to work with
from SA and MapSend (one is supposed to be from one major geodata source and
the other from the other, though I can never keep 'em straight) are doing good
to do +- 200 feet.
GPS could sense the change in direction of a few feet or degrees without any
problem. the problem is, there is no way to know if that movement was a lane
excursion or just the normal path of the road. There has to be a local
reference. This video system that someone referred to has the best chance of
working if it can avoid false triggers.
To consider the effect of false positive alarms, consider the common car
alarm. Do you even turn your head to see where one of those obnoxious blasts
is coming from? I don't. The alarm is almost invariably false. Similarly,
it would only take a few false alarms before the driver either gets used to it
and ignores it or turns the damned thing off.
I think a valid argument can be made that if you can't maintain your lane
while wide awake then you shouldn't be driving. No alarm is likely to have
much effect in that event.
There are some interesting devices to combat drowsiness, the root cause of
most lane excursions, I think. When I was doing long haul (car, not truck)
driving I bought a couple of gadgets that really helped. One looked like a
hearing aid that beeps when the head repeatedly tilts forward at the onset of
drowsiness. The other was a tiny Peltier junction cooler that cooled a spot
between the eyes that is claimed to inhibit drowsiness. I don't know if
there's any science associated with this thing but it sure did work on me. I
ordered it from a japan oh, probably 20 years ago. Never seen it for sale in
the US. I saw the head tilting gadget in a catalog recently. Can't remember
if it was JC whitney, Rat Shack or one of the car ones. That one worked quite
well too, though I didn't need it after getting the Peltier device.
I have read about but have never seen a device that monitors the
micro-movements of the steering wheel and alarms when they slow down. The
claim is that one gets sluggish on the wheel a period of time before one
actually starts dozing. Sounds reasonable.
El Alumbrado
> "El Alumbrado" <el*alum...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>
> >John, I wasn't suggesting "vehicle control" based on GPS, simply
attention reminders. I've been a
> >pilot for a long time, so I'm used to electronic voices telling me to pay
attention ("Pull up! Pull
> >up!" is my favorite).
>
> That would be similar to an electronic condom that screeches "pull out!
Pull
> out! when there's a defect....
>
Hey, I learned to appreciate and pay attention to that little voice. When it
starts shouting "Pull up!" or "Terrain!", my ears perk right up! The only
voice that even comes close to creating that kind of adrenalin reaction is
the one that shouts "Fire!". (The only voice that causes a *greater* reation
is your wingman shouting "SAM!"). Some aircraft I've flown have deliberately
used a recorded woman's voice intended to get a man's immediate attention
(in the days when nearly all military and commercial pilots were, in fact,
men). I bet a voice that, at first flashes a warning light while calmly
saying "Closing rate", then, if I take no action and the closing rate is
getting critical, shouts" Collision!" would keep a lot of metal from getting
bent.
> >I would like to have the little voices telling me "Lane warning!" if I'm
> >drifting out of lane, or "Collision!" if it looks like I'm about to
rear-end somebody. Basically an
> >electronic copilot that's shouts "Hey, pay attention!" if it sees
something important that I may
> >have missed because I was distracted with a cell phone or radio. We
already have GPS systems that
> >read me directions and warn me that my next turn point is coming up. I
think all the pieces are
> >there. It's just a matter of turning them into an integrated system.
>
> WAAS enabled GPS is sufficiently accurate (obviously, from its purpose) to
do
> the job. The problem is the maps, the reference the GPS must work
against,
> are not.
No, no, I think you misunderstand. GPS has nothing to do with "lane hold".
The system I saw uses cameras and image processing software and is
completely organic to the vehicle (that is, it requires no off-vehicle
resources or infractructure to function). I used GPS just as an example of
one part of the "electronic driver assistant", the part that keeps you on
course (StreetAtlas works fine for me), not the part that keeps you "in
lane". GPS for route management, adaptive cruise control for traffic
seperation monitoring, and something like the Iteris system for lane
monitoring. Put them all together and you have a vigilant partner who keeps
on eye on you, making it more difficult to ram somebody from behind, drift
into somebody else's lane, or get lost.
> To consider the effect of false positive alarms, consider the common car
> alarm. Do you even turn your head to see where one of those obnoxious
blasts
> is coming from? I don't. The alarm is almost invariably false.
Similarly,
> it would only take a few false alarms before the driver either gets used
to it
> and ignores it or turns the damned thing off.
Well, as I responded to another poster, you're still expected to stay awake
and look out the window. The "electronic driver assistant" is just like
another pair of eyes in the cockpit, looking out in case you might miss
something. As with cruise control, it's not intended to let you take a nap,
eh? <g>
> I think a valid argument can be made that if you can't maintain your lane
> while wide awake then you shouldn't be driving. No alarm is likely to
have
> much effect in that event.
Strong disagreement from me. How many accidents happen every year because
somebody wasn't paying attention or got distracted (if you *were* paying
attention and *still* hit something, then I can make a strong argument that
it wasn't an "accident"). Anything that well help, helps, no? I'd like to
have a system like this looking over my shoulder. I bet that it would
eventually qualify for insurance discounts, too.
bill horne
> Not that I'm arguing about being an occasional "dumbass", but what does "keeping right" have to do
> with it? When I'm in the "bus", I keep right when I can. When I'm in the Porsche (occasionally at
> "Splach 2", or twice the speed limit, on empty rural interstates), I tend to stay left unless
> somebody even faster wants to get by. Seems the "driver assistant" would be helpful in any case, no?
>
> El Alumbrado
> "Civis Texanus Sum"
My own self would like - maybe - a driver assistant only on empty pikes
(which are getting rare these days) - but then I'd also need a tilt
detector on my head. For normal traffic, I prefer to make my own
decision as to whether to slow down and not change lanes rather than
change lanes and not slow down.
I think, that by the time a driver assistant becomes sufficiently
reliable and sufficiently cost effective for me to even consider one,
I'll be long dead.
And even should I live to be 150, I doubt that I'll be willing to turn
my vehicle over to an electronic driver assistant - I like to drive, and
am a passenger only when I have no choice.
I also predict that the logical end of driver assistants will be
controlled hiways where you are injected into the hiway, assigned a lane
and speed, and there you will stay until you're ejected at your
destination.
So, no thanks on the driver assistant. The damned automatic headlights
on my LPV are already annoying the hell out of me - not to mention the
radio that stays on until I open the door. And the interior lights that
stay on for a predetermined time after I Exit the vehicle. What the
hell's the purpose of that, anyway?
bill horne
> I trust Bill isn't one of those who drives in the left-most lane no
> matter what. Actually, I'd like to know one of those - I'm curious
> about their reasoning (if any.)
>
> --
> Al Balmer
I drive in the left lane 'almost' no matter what. I drive there for a
number of reasons:
- It's generally in the best condition.
- It generally has less traffic.
- It generally has no on/off ramp traffic to worry about.
- It generally has less lane changing occurring to and from it.
- It generally reduces the number of times I have to change lanes.
- Lane changing is one of most dangerous activities on a multilane
hiway.
- It generally has no large vehicles that I can't see over or around.
(I'm not comfortable when I can't stay way ahead of my vehicle)
- I nearly always have a place to go (the breakdown lane or median) if I
have a mechanical problem, or something sudden happens ahead of me.
- It is generally the fastest lane.
All of the above allow me to pick a lane (the left), set the CC at 8
over, relax, and stay in my chosen lane until I'm ready to leave it.
Now you're wondering about the 'almost' no matter what. When I'm driving
the speed limit or better (usually 8 over), I consider that piece of
road to be MINE. If someone comes up on me faster than 8 over, I'll move
over if I can do so safely, without slowing down, and without risking
getting boxed in. Otherwise, those driving more than 8 over - and they
are relatively rare - will have to get around me as best they can.
When I come up on someone doing the limit or better, I don't expect him
to move over for me. Usually, before he even knows I'm coming, I've
already made plans to slow down or pass him on the right - depending on
my analysis of the traffic around me, between me and him, and around and
ahead of him.
bill horne
Wrong on all counts, I think. See my reply to Alan.
Alan Balmer
<el*alum...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>"HHamp5246" <hham...@aol.comnojunk> wrote in message
>news:20031215181849...@mb-m10.aol.com...
>
>> ....everyone who passed me "raised a hand" to wave....
>
>Out in the "Texas Outback", waving to other drivers is common. The most common way to do this is for
>two drivers approaching head-on (in opposite lanes!) to simply raise their index fingers off the
>wheel in a common salute. I've had more than one "outstater" misunderstand this gesture over the
>years. <g>
>
In past years, I spent a lot of time in NC on troubleshooting trips. I
was a bit puzzled the first couple of times I approached someone -
they'd lift their hand slightly, point in my direction, and say "Hah!"
Finally figured out it was NC for "Hi."
Then there was the GA gal who said my NY accent was so bad she could
hardly understand me. She had to say it twice before I understood her
<g>.
El Alumbrado
> When I'm driving the speed limit or better (usually 8 over), I consider that piece of
> road to be MINE.
bill, as nice a guy as I think you are, as intelligent as I know you to be, and as much as I suspect
that I'd enjoy your company, you would annoy me into a rage if I found myself driving behind you. I
think it's attitudes like this that help give RV drivers reputations as being unaware of their
surroundings or uncaring about those around them (I've even seen TV commercials mocking the way
RVers drive; attitudes like yours don't do anything to dispel that perception).
Me, when I'm driving the "bus", I'll stay right on a 4-lane, or in the middle lane on a 6-lane or
more. The *only* time I'll take the left lane is if I'm actually passing somebody. I don't want to
pass anybody on the right, and I don't want anybody to pass me on the right. It's unexpected and
It's not safe.
Criticism, yes, but friendly criticism I hope.
El Alumbrado
> El Alumbrado wrote:
>
> > Not that I'm arguing about being an occasional "dumbass", but what does "keeping right" have to
do
> > with it? When I'm in the "bus", I keep right when I can. When I'm in the Porsche (occasionally
at
> > "Splach 2", or twice the speed limit, on empty rural interstates), I tend to stay left unless
> > somebody even faster wants to get by. Seems the "driver assistant" would be helpful in any case,
no?
> >
> > El Alumbrado
> > "Civis Texanus Sum"
>
> My own self would like - maybe - a driver assistant only on empty pikes
> (which are getting rare these days) - but then I'd also need a tilt
> detector on my head. For normal traffic, I prefer to make my own
> decision as to whether to slow down and not change lanes rather than
> change lanes and not slow down.
I agree. I think it would be nice to have an extra set of eyes though, in case maybe I'm not paying
attention. All I'm looking for is alerts and warnings. The decision, however, must be mine.
> I think, that by the time a driver assistant becomes sufficiently
> reliable and sufficiently cost effective for me to even consider one,
> I'll be long dead.
>
> And even should I live to be 150, I doubt that I'll be willing to turn
> my vehicle over to an electronic driver assistant - I like to drive, and
> am a passenger only when I have no choice.
I like to drive too. I'm crazy about flying my own airplane, too, but I sure appreciate a good
3-axis auto pilot. Let's me reach for a cup of coffee, look at a map, or tune a radio station
without worrying about "losing it".
> I also predict that the logical end of driver assistants will be
> controlled hiways where you are injected into the hiway, assigned a lane
> and speed, and there you will stay until you're ejected at your
> destination.
No doubt. I could live with that for long-distance "passages". In fact, I'd prob'ly enjoy it.
> So, no thanks on the driver assistant. The damned automatic headlights
> on my LPV are already annoying the hell out of me - not to mention the
> radio that stays on until I open the door. And the interior lights that
> stay on for a predetermined time after I Exit the vehicle. What the
> hell's the purpose of that, anyway?
I have *no* idea. I've got some vehicles that do that too. I can understand the headlights staying
on for a minute or two (that's actually kinda handy sometimes), but keeping the interior lights on
after everybody has left the vehicle and the doors have been closed? The only thing I can think of
is the vehicle doesn't know if you're coming or going, so plays it safe and assumes you're entering
instead of leaving. Poor software design.
bill horne
>
> "bill horne" <red...@rye.net> wrote:
>
> > When I'm driving the speed limit or better (usually 8 over), I consider that piece of
> > road to be MINE.
>
> bill, as nice a guy as I think you are, as intelligent as I know you to be, and as much as I suspect
> that I'd enjoy your company, you would annoy me into a rage if I found myself driving behind you.
As I said, if I can move over safely and without inconveniencing myself,
I will. Otherwise, rage if you must.
> I
> think it's attitudes like this that help give RV drivers reputations as being unaware of their
> surroundings or uncaring about those around them (I've even seen TV commercials mocking the way
> RVers drive; attitudes like yours don't do anything to dispel that perception).
A Safari van, a 96 PU with camper top, or an 83 PU with a camper top is
unlikely to be labeled as an "RV", so your reputation, and the
reputations of other "RV"ers is not likely to be affected.
> Me, when I'm driving the "bus", I'll stay right on a 4-lane, or in the middle lane on a 6-lane or
> more. The *only* time I'll take the left lane is if I'm actually passing somebody. I don't want to
> pass anybody on the right, and I don't want anybody to pass me on the right. It's unexpected and
> It's not safe.
Other than the lane changing, I see nothing unsafe about passing on the
right on multilaners. I went through Texas in Sep, and spent some time
on I-10, and saw no indication that passing on the right is unexpected.
It's done in TX as frequently as it's done in any other State I've
driven in.
Is it your contention that driving at more than 8 over on a multilaner
containing sufficient traffic to prevent you from going around me is
safe? Myself, I usually have no problem sliding right to pass someone in
the left lane. What if I were already in that lane? Am I supposed to
slow down, and not go by anyone in the left lane? I think not.
> Criticism, yes, but friendly criticism I hope.
>
> El Alumbrado
> "Civis Texanus Sum"
You may criticise all you like, but my personal driving philosophy is
unlikely to change. The only thing I foresee changing it is age - when
I'm no longer comfortable at 8 over in the left lane, I'll no longer be
at 8 over in the left lane.
El Alumbrado
> El Alumbrado wrote:
> > "bill horne" <red...@rye.net> wrote:
> >
> > > When I'm driving the speed limit or better (usually 8 over), I consider that piece of
> > > road to be MINE.
> >
> > bill, as nice a guy as I think you are, as intelligent as I know you to be, and as much as I
suspect
> > that I'd enjoy your company, you would annoy me into a rage if I found myself driving behind
you.
>
> As I said, if I can move over safely and without inconveniencing myself,
> I will. Otherwise, rage if you must.
Oh. OK. I'll try to do it quietly.
Personally, I try to avoid inconveniencing others, as well as myself. To each his own.
bill horne
> attention. All I'm looking for is alerts and warnings. The decision, however, must be mine.
If I can get alerts and warnings for less than $50, can adjust them, and
can turn them off, maybe I'd consider them. I'm inattentive so
infrequently when I'm driving that I think the odds are very small of me
needing a warning at one of those times.
> > I think, that by the time a driver assistant becomes sufficiently
> > reliable and sufficiently cost effective for me to even consider one,
> > I'll be long dead.
> >
> > And even should I live to be 150, I doubt that I'll be willing to turn
> > my vehicle over to an electronic driver assistant - I like to drive, and
> > am a passenger only when I have no choice.
>
> I like to drive too. I'm crazy about flying my own airplane, too, but I sure appreciate a good
> 3-axis auto pilot. Let's me reach for a cup of coffee, look at a map, or tune a radio station
> without worrying about "losing it".
I know where my coffee is, and don't have to sacrifice road attention to
reach for it. I tune my radio with buttons, and I know where they are. I
drive with a laptop mapping program, and don't glance at it unless
there's nothing happening around me. My glances are no longer than a
second, and no 'driver assistant' is going to save me if something
happens in that second.
> > I also predict that the logical end of driver assistants will be
> > controlled hiways where you are injected into the hiway, assigned a lane
> > and speed, and there you will stay until you're ejected at your
> > destination.
>
> No doubt. I could live with that for long-distance "passages". In fact, I'd prob'ly enjoy it.
I wouldn't.
The only thing I can think of
> is the vehicle doesn't know if you're coming or going, so plays it safe and assumes you're entering
> instead of leaving. Poor software design.
>
> El Alumbrado
> "Civis Texanus Sum"
And it's been poor for at least 7 years - my 96 does it, and my 03 does
it.
bill horne
> Out in the "Texas Outback", waving to other drivers is common. The most common way to do this is for
> two drivers approaching head-on (in opposite lanes!) to simply raise their index fingers off the
> wheel in a common salute. I've had more than one "outstater" misunderstand this gesture over the
> years. <g>
> El Alumbrado
> "Civis Texanus Sum"
Add GA to list of wavers.
bill horne
> Personally, I try to avoid inconveniencing others, as well as myself. To each his own.
>
> El Alumbrado
> "Civis Texanus Sum"
Good for you. You may advance one level upward on the RORT Moral
Mountain.
El Alumbrado
> El Alumbrado wrote:
>
> > Personally, I try to avoid inconveniencing others, as well as myself. To each his own.
>
> Mountain.
I'm so proud! <g>
When we get to the top, do we get to roll rocks down on everybody else? Or is that privilege
reserved for Will?
Neon John
>El Alumbrado wrote:
>>
>> "bill horne" <red...@rye.net> wrote:
>>
>> > When I'm driving the speed limit or better (usually 8 over), I consider that piece of
>> > road to be MINE.
>>
>> bill, as nice a guy as I think you are, as intelligent as I know you to be, and as much as I suspect
>> that I'd enjoy your company, you would annoy me into a rage if I found myself driving behind you.
>
>As I said, if I can move over safely and without inconveniencing myself,
>I will. Otherwise, rage if you must.
I wouldn't rage much. According to the doctrine of "don't get mad, get even",
I'd simply pick up the phone, dial 911 and, depending on my mood, report
either a drunk driver or the strong smell of pot emanating from your vehicle,
which I would describe to them in detail. I might even stay on the line to
vector 'em in. Then just smile as I slowly drive by the scene of the bust.
This is a fantastically effective method of dealing with road.*ssholes. It
simultaneously gets you off the road for a bit, diverts a cop from fee
grabbing and throws an ever so minor cog in the Drug War against the
Constitution. A triple win.
Alan Balmer
<el*alum...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>The only thing I can think of
>is the vehicle doesn't know if you're coming or going, so plays it safe and assumes you're entering
>instead of leaving. Poor software design.
I think you're correct about the reason, but how would you design it
differently? Without adding hardware.
El Alumbrado
> On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 19:28:36 GMT, "El Alumbrado"
> <el*alum...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >The only thing I can think of
> >is the vehicle doesn't know if you're coming or going, so plays it safe and assumes you're
entering
> >instead of leaving. Poor software design.
>
> I think you're correct about the reason, but how would you design it
> differently? Without adding hardware.
>
#define RECENT 30 // Interval in seconds
// If ignition has been shutdown in last RECENT seconds, assume exiting vehicle
if (last_ignition_shutdown <= RECENT ) {
setmode(exiting);
} else {
setmode(entering);
}
No?
Alan Balmer
<el*alum...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>"Alan Balmer" <alba...@att.net> wrote in message news:vlvutvs6933he0s5e...@4ax.com...
>> On Tue, 16 Dec 2003 19:28:36 GMT, "El Alumbrado"
>> <el*alum...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> >The only thing I can think of
>> >is the vehicle doesn't know if you're coming or going, so plays it safe and assumes you're
>entering
>> >instead of leaving. Poor software design.
>>
>> I think you're correct about the reason, but how would you design it
>> differently? Without adding hardware.
>>
>
>#define RECENT 30 // Interval in seconds
>
>// If ignition has been shutdown in last RECENT seconds, assume exiting vehicle
>if (last_ignition_shutdown <= RECENT ) {
> setmode(exiting);
>} else {
> setmode(entering);
>}
>
>No?
>
First, those assumptions can be wrong. Of course, this isn't a
mission-critical application, so a missed assumption is likely to do
no more than produce a "Huh?" or at most a cussword.
But I suspect it would add hardware, unless they're already using the
car's computers to interface the switch and the light. A "delayed-off"
switch is simple and cheap.
bill horne
> When we get to the top, do we get to roll rocks down on everybody else? Or is that privilege
> reserved for Will?
>
> El Alumbrado
> "Civis Texanus Sum"
You'll have to check with GB about the upper level rules and privileges
- Ah live inna holler, an spen ma time gitten rock marks offen ma
ovahawls.
bill horne
> I wouldn't rage much. According to the doctrine of "don't get mad, get even",
> I'd simply pick up the phone, dial 911 and, depending on my mood, report
> either a drunk driver or the strong smell of pot emanating from your vehicle,
> which I would describe to them in detail. I might even stay on the line to
> vector 'em in. Then just smile as I slowly drive by the scene of the bust.
>
> This is a fantastically effective method of dealing with road.*ssholes. It
> simultaneously gets you off the road for a bit, diverts a cop from fee
> grabbing and throws an ever so minor cog in the Drug War against the
> Constitution. A triple win.
>
> John
That's a good plan, but you'd better advise them that if they want to
find pot or booze, they'll have to plant it.
bill horne
> First, those assumptions can be wrong. Of course, this isn't a
> mission-critical application, so a missed assumption is likely to do
> no more than produce a "Huh?" or at most a cussword.
>
> But I suspect it would add hardware, unless they're already using the
> car's computers to interface the switch and the light. A "delayed-off"
> switch is simple and cheap.
>
> --
> Al Balmer
> Balmer Consulting
> removebalmerc...@att.net
All they've got to do to satisfy me is remove the delay entirely. I
don't need or want the delay getting in or out of the vehicle.
The old, uncomputerized door jamb switch, along with a dash switch,
worked just fine for me - and would continue to do so.
bill horne
> Similar to my POV - the way I look at it is that I don't want a
> vehicle talking to me and giving orders - I want one that listens to
> me and obeys orders.
>
> Will Sill
That reminds me - do you remember the problem of no engine braking on
throttle closure? Well, my Safari doesn't have that problem - when I let
off the gas, it slows down. And it slows down as well as my old 83 does.
So all of the theories about why it had to be that way either didn't
mean squat, or GM has fixed the problems that immediate engine braking
was supposed to cause.
It's really pleasant to not have to step on the brakes every time I let
off the throttle.
And I don't remember if I've already said so, but I've remedied the
annoyances of no interior light when the hatch is opened, and of not
being able to open the hatch from the inside.
The next annoyance to work on is getting the radio to turn off when I
turn the ignition switch off. Then there're the headlights.
And the damned automatic door lock/unlock annoyed the hell out of me
until I discovered that GM was kind enough to provide me with a way to
reprogram them. In the future, I'll try to remember to read the manual
before I waste a month bitching to myself.
I've almost got this thing like it should have been when I bought it.
Guess Who?
He'll use his cell phone to falsely report a drunk driver, or pothead
behind the wheel, to the cops....
Remember "Miss Pinky"? She said she'd do the same thing if some man
"ogled her" too enthusiastically.....
The only trouble with a fiendish plan like that, is then you have to
take time to explain what you saw to the cops yourself. If they get
someone with a big shit eating grin on their face, they'll know who the
scammer is, and retaliate by planting some dope, or stealing something
from the one who called them......
Don
Wade
"Guess Who?" <DonLa...@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:20498-3F...@storefull-3135.bay.webtv.net...
gas from to many experiments with BBQ sauce, however I would like to point
out that Criminal Harassment can be very profitable to the insured party,
and don't think for one moment that masking your number will protect you as
the first thing the dispatch board will do is strip the masking and unveil
your number, and with the newer phones your exact coordinates will also be
transmitted.
Wade
Alan Balmer
>Criminal Harassment can be very profitable to the insured party,
Do they sell insurance against criminal harassment in Canada?
Joe
> Yup. I've tried to explain before that "slower" is relative. If I'm doing 80 and you're doing 70,
> then you're "slower traffic", even if the speed limit is 60. "Slower Traffic Keep Right" is the same
> thing as "Keep Right Except to Pass". It's not only the polite thing to do, it's the safe thing to
> do.
>
> El Alumbrado
> "Civis Texanus Sum"
And it's the law in some states. There are many signs in Illinois
that reads "Stay right except to pass"
El Alumbrado
> I wouldn't rage much. According to the doctrine of "don't get mad, get
even",
> I'd simply pick up the phone, dial 911 and, depending on my mood, report
> either a drunk driver or the strong smell of pot emanating from your
vehicle,
> which I would describe to them in detail. I might even stay on the line
to
> vector 'em in. Then just smile as I slowly drive by the scene of the
bust.
>
> This is a fantastically effective method of dealing with road.*ssholes.
It
> simultaneously gets you off the road for a bit, diverts a cop from fee
> grabbing and throws an ever so minor cog in the Drug War against the
> Constitution. A triple win.
I don't think I'd go that far. The best way to deal with "road *ssholes" is
to leave them behind you. Then it doesn't matter *what* they do.
When I was a kid I did get out of a speeding ticket once, though, by telling
the officer that I had just sped up to go around a (non-existent) white
Corvette (cops *hate* Corvettes for some reason) because the guy was weaving
all over the road. Worked like a charm. He dropped me and went speeding off
after the fictional drunk (bigger fine, I guess).
Wade
No we have social programs for that, when you dis me the government
transfers all your assets in my name you get to keep the liabilities, so
what is it you would like to harass me over?
Wade
bill horne
>
> And it's the law in some states. There are many signs in Illinois
> that reads "Stay right except to pass"
Yes, there are a few states that haven't come to their senses yet. Most
say "Slower traffic keep right". This prevents a lot of unnecessary lane
changing.
HHamp5246
>When I was a kid I did get out of a speeding ticket once, though, by telling
the officer that I had just sped up to go around a (non-existent) white
Corvette (cops *hate* Corvettes for some reason) because the guy was weaving
all over the road. Worked like a charm. >
When I was a kid I was driving a friend's racing car, The Executioner... it was
written on the side in big letters. It ran B modified....
I got caught leaving rubber in all four gears.... the officer's first words
were, "That's not speeding, it's reckless driving."
I got big tears and told him it's my friend's car and it has three pedals.
Everytime I let off on the one on the left the car jumps and makes a noise.
<sniff, sniff>
He felt sorry for me and gave me a lesson in how to use a clutch..... I could
see how proud he was when I pulled away and it didn't jump or make a noise.
Hunter
El Alumbrado
> Joe wrote:
> >
>
> > And it's the law in some states. There are many signs in Illinois
> > that reads "Stay right except to pass"
>
> Yes, there are a few states that haven't come to their senses yet. Most
> say "Slower traffic keep right". This prevents a lot of unnecessary lane
> changing.
<sigh> Geez, do you deliberately try to find somebody in the middle lane to
"pace" too, just to *insure* you create a rolling road block for anybody
doing more than your "8 over"? I wish the US would adopt Germany's "keep
right" fines. They were pretty hefty for anybody caught "cruising" in the
left lane, far more than just a speeding fine. Helps keep traffic flowing
along.
But, OK, let's just say "Slower Traffic Keep Right". If you're slower than
*anybody else* on the road, keep right!
El Alumbrado - Who *still* says that keeping right is the courteous and safe
thing to do
"Civis Texanus Sum"
Alan Balmer
wrote:
>Joe wrote:
>>
>
>> And it's the law in some states. There are many signs in Illinois
>> that reads "Stay right except to pass"
>
>Yes, there are a few states that haven't come to their senses yet. Most
>say "Slower traffic keep right". This prevents a lot of unnecessary lane
>changing.
If you're doing 8 over, and I'm doing 10 over, you're slower traffic.
On the expressways around here, 10 over is about the average. Many
drive faster.
Tom Marik
was written on the side in big letters. It ran B modified....
I got caught leaving rubber in all four gears.... the officer's first words
were, "That's not speeding, it's reckless driving."
I got big tears and told him it's my friend's car and it has three pedals.
Everytime I let off on the one on the left the car jumps and makes a noise.
<sniff, sniff>
He felt sorry for me and gave me a lesson in how to use a clutch..... I could
see how proud he was when I pulled away and it didn't jump or make a noise.
Hunter >>
I never got a ticket driving my '66 Dodge hemi. And the fourth chirp of rubber
was at 95.
Most of my tickets were for slow stuff like driving Mom home from church.
Tom M
Chris Bryant
> When I was a kid I was driving a friend's racing car, The Executioner...
> it was written on the side in big letters. It ran B modified....
>
> I got caught leaving rubber in all four gears.... the officer's first
> words were, "That's not speeding, it's reckless driving."
Yeah- when I learned to drive my families cars were a '69 Volvo 144, a '64
IH TravellAll and a '49 Dodge pickup. A friend had a Road Runner with a
bored out 440, dual Holley double pumpers, high rise manifold, etc. I
tried driving it like I drove the Volvo- give it some gas as I let out the
clutch.
Yowzaa!
--
Chris Bryant
http://bryantrv.com
VW in CA
>bill horne <red...@rye.net> wrote:
>>And I don't remember if I've already said so, but I've remedied the
>>annoyances of no interior light when the hatch is opened, and of not
>>being able to open the hatch from the inside.
>
>You did say so - I have been too busy annoying Vince to get around to
>fixing ours.
Will,
Don't let me stop you from doing some real work because you are
failing in trying to annoy me.
Vince
HHamp5246
> A friend had a Road Runner with a bored out 440, dual Holley double pumpers,
high rise manifold, etc. I
tried driving it like I drove the Volvo- give it some gas as I let out the
clutch.
>Yowzaa!>
Fun huh? I miss the muscle cars. In those days they were all distinctive
looking and I loved the power.
We used to power shift The Executioner.....
Hunter
El Alumbrado
> Chris wrote:
>
> > A friend had a Road Runner with a bored out 440, dual Holley double pumpers,
> high rise manifold, etc. I
> tried driving it like I drove the Volvo- give it some gas as I let out the
> clutch.
> >Yowzaa!>
>
> Fun huh? I miss the muscle cars. In those days they were all distinctive
> looking and I loved the power.
>
> We used to power shift The Executioner.....
My favorite car (well, *one* of my favorite cars) was the 1970 Barracuda convertible I had when I
first got married. 440 with 3 2-barrel carbs. That car was faster in a straight line than a Baptist
being chased by Satan. Don't try to turn it though, or you'd be the one meeting Satan.
When I got married, my new wife (my *only* wife, so far <g>) convinced me to trade it for a "family
car". I think the dealer gave me $2K for it. That same car today is worth $40K+. I was STUPID!
STUPID! STUPID!
S'ok. Some years later I bought a Porsche 911. Almost as fast in a straight line and you could
actually *turn* it. I've been driving Porsche's ever since (but that new Ford GT-40 is calling my
name...).
HHamp5246
convertible I had when I
>
>When I got married, my new wife (my *only* wife, so far <g>) convinced me to
trade it for a "family car". I think the dealer gave me $2K for it. That same
car today is worth
>$40K+. I was STUPID! STUPID! STUPID!>
Yeah, stupid to sell the car too.
<g>
>
>S'ok. Some years later I bought a Porsche 911. Almost as fast in a straight
line and you could actually *turn* it. I've been driving Porsche's ever since
(but that new Ford
>GT-40 is calling my name...).>
I knew it wasn't calling mine... I've had a few sports cars and they do nothing
for me anymore....
My Alfa Romeo Giuletta Spyder was a stand out.... the Austin Healey too....
Truth is, I'd rather be settin' up high looking down on the roof of those
little things. I hate pulling up to a stop sign and looking over and seeing lug
nuts through the window.
Lon VanOstran
<el*alum...@yahoo.com> writes:
>When I was a kid I did get out of a speeding ticket once, though, by telling
>the officer that I had just sped up to go around a (non-existent) white
>Corvette (cops *hate* Corvettes for some reason) because the guy was weaving
>all over the road. Worked like a charm. He dropped me and went speeding off
>after the fictional drunk (bigger fine, I guess).
>
>El Alumbrado
You lied? Hey you just fell off that moral ladder.
Lon
Guess Who?
Lon is a real stickler about "honesty". He also believes that
stealing a penny, is the same as stealing a million bucks... He will
not be moved on this!
To him, the slightest diversion of "honesty", is the same as jumping
on a greased rail, rocket sled, down the slope of the Matterhorn, to
perdition! (exceptions for Will Sill only!)
He obviously never had some over weight woman ask him, "Do these
white pants make my ass look big?", or he'd learn to lie in a NY
second!
Just thought you'd like to know......
Don
Max
, I prefer to make my own
> decision as to whether to slow down and not change lanes rather than
> change lanes and not slow down.
>
> And even should I live to be 150, I doubt that I'll be willing to turn
> my vehicle over to an electronic driver assistant - I like to drive, and
> am a passenger only when I have no choice.
>
> So, no thanks on the driver assistant. The damned automatic headlights
> on my LPV are already annoying the hell out of me - not to mention the
> radio that stays on until I open the door. And the interior lights that
> stay on for a predetermined time after I Exit the vehicle. What the
> hell's the purpose of that, anyway?
>
> --
> bill
> Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
Control freak, huh? <G>
Max
Max
consider that piece of
> > > road to be MINE.
> As I said, if I can move over safely and without inconveniencing myself,
> I will. Otherwise, rage if you must.
> You may criticise all you like, but my personal driving philosophy is
> unlikely to change. The only thing I foresee changing it is age - when
> I'm no longer comfortable at 8 over in the left lane, I'll no longer be
> at 8 over in the left lane.
Max
>
> I drive in the left lane 'almost' no matter what. I drive there for a
> number of reasons:
> All of the above allow me to pick a lane (the left), set the CC at 8
> over, relax, and stay in my chosen lane until I'm ready to leave it.
>
> Now you're wondering about the 'almost' no matter what. When I'm driving
> the speed limit or better (usually 8 over), I consider that piece of
> road to be MINE. If someone comes up on me faster than 8 over, I'll move
> over if I can do so safely, without slowing down, and without risking
> getting boxed in. Otherwise, those driving more than 8 over - and they
> are relatively rare - will have to get around me as best they can.
Jan Eric Orme
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Damn....I miss those big cube beasts! Tom, you were probably like me, you were
real careful where and when you put the hammer down. I have had my share of
tickets. But in most cases not in the real big muscle I owned.
One sleeper beast I had was actually a company car. I should call it my Sunday
confession car I guess. I was hired back to a small company in So Cal in 1970
as Sales Manager. The owner had promised me a new car as part of the deal. He
asked me if I would be OK with a left over new 1969 Ford Sedan he found at the
local Ford Dealer. He took me to look at it. It was a powder blue four door.
Looked like any family sedan. He said they would deal on it because they were
having trouble selling the car because of the gas mileage. I took a look under
the hood. Lo and behold it was a 429! "Ah-ah-hem, sure boss....looks fine to
me."
The thing was a sleeper. I was raising a family with my first wife at the time
and we lived in Fountain Valley. I taught Sunday School on Sunday mornings in
Huntington Beach and drove to an early meeting down Beach Blvd. One Sunday I'm
at a stop light, little or no traffic to speak of, and a Roadrunner pulls up
next to me in the other lane. I have my 3 peice suit on and the young dude in
the Plymouth sez..."hey 'suit' wanna get that thing in gear on the green?" I
just smiled, hammered it and put the 'Runner in the weeds. At the next light
the smirk was gone from his puss. Yep! That powder blue beast was a sleeper.
I have owned lots of cars over the years. But later in life, in 1989, I
obtained another car that was in no way a sleeper. I had it for ten years. It
was 1967 Mustang Shelby GT500 (#245). Lime Gold, 4 speed.
Built 428 P.I. with two fours. 45K on the clock when I sold it. A very
beautiful car and an absolute torque beast of a car. Yeah....lots of stories.
But none of them sleeper stories. No way to hide what that car was. The thing
flat walked away regardless of what gear you were in.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jan Eric Orme
"Work like you don't need the money, love like you
have never been hurt and dance like nobody is watching!"
El Alumbrado
news:20031217210321...@mb-m04.aol.com...
Looked like too steep a climb for me, anyway.
Besides, I lied to a *cop*. That doesn't count. They're not like real
people. <g>
Lon VanOstran
DonLa...@webtv.net (Guess Who?) writes:
Don, you got it all right except the parts about Will Sill, and about the
white pants. If I see Will Sill tell a lie, I'd be all over him like stink on
sh*t. As for the pants and the ass, there is only one woman who would ask me
that question, and the answer is always the same: "Honey, you are beautiful and
sexy no matter what you wear. If you have an hour or so to spare, I'll
demonstrate the effect that sexy ass has on me."
You see, there is no lie, and from time to time, she accepts that offer.
Thankfully, while I'm not as good as I once was, I'm as good once, as I ever
was. <G> If that goes away, I may have to rethink my stategy.
Lon
bill horne
> > Yes, there are a few states that haven't come to their senses yet. Most
> > say "Slower traffic keep right". This prevents a lot of unnecessary lane
> > changing.
>
> <sigh> Geez, do you deliberately try to find somebody in the middle lane to
> "pace" too, just to *insure* you create a rolling road block for anybody
> doing more than your "8 over"?
No. Next 'question'.
> But, OK, let's just say "Slower Traffic Keep Right". If you're slower than
> *anybody else* on the road, keep right!
Right. Almost. When I'm slower than "traffic", I find another lane. The
thing is, I don't consider 1 guy in 50 going faster than I - when I'm
already going 8 over - to be faster "traffic". Like myself, he's just
another speeder, and like myself, it's up to him to find his way through
the lawabiders. But as I said, I'll move over if it's safe and
convenient for me to do so.
> El Alumbrado - Who *still* says that keeping right is the courteous and safe
> thing to do
> "Civis Texanus Sum"
Then the problem is solved. You keep right, and I'll keep left, and
we'll never interfere with each other on the pikes. That's "safe" - as
long as you don't keep whipping in and out of my lane to pass someone in
yours.
Lane changing is one of the most dangerous activities that occurs on
multilaners. If I drove in a middle lane, I'd be changing lanes much
more frequently. Why would I want to do that?
I figure there's a reason why the majority of States say "slower traffic
keep right", rather than "keep right except to pass" - on multilaners.
Tom Marik
Jan,
My next one will be 12.5 liter with 1650 ft. lbs. of torque. Dual 5" stand
pipes, twin turbos, and twelve on the floor.
Peterbilt is going to build it in January and they wisely set the limit to 2100
RPM.
Tom M
bill horne
And in places where 10 over is the "average", you'll find me in a middle
lane. Except for the occasional burst to extract myself from wolfpacks,
8 over is my upper limit.
My rule is to pick the lane where "traffic" is going about my desired
speed, and stay in it. Much more often than not, that's the left lane -
and that's where I am most of the time. And until my eyes or reflexes go
tits up, that's where I'll be in the future.
HHamp5246
jano...@aol.comnojunk (Jan Eric Orme) writes:
>I have owned lots of cars over the years. But later in life, in 1989, I
>obtained another car that was in no way a sleeper. I had it for ten years. It
was 1967 Mustang Shelby GT500 (#245). Lime Gold, 4 speed. Built 428 P.I. with
two fours. 45K on the clock when I sold it.>
<drooling on keyboard> I can't believe you sold it.
I had a 65 289 Mustang and a 69 302.... I loved those cars.
Loved the Roadrunner story.....
HHamp5246
>2100
>RPM.
>
>Tom M
What color will his beast be? Will you paint it up to match the fiver?
Be sure to have them paint "Not for Hire-Private use only"
or some such thing on the bottom of the doors or below them...small letters.
John Bell
You see, there is no lie, and from time to time, she accepts that offer.
Thankfully, while I'm not as good as I once was, I'm as good once, as I
ever was. <G> If that goes away, I may have to rethink my strategy.
Lon
Lon,
Speaking along the same lines, a friend told me that now it takes him
all night to do what he used to do all night long. Maybe youth is wasted
on the young. :-) jtb
Jan Eric Orme
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
That is going to get the chores done well for sure! I would say you can yank
anything anywhere ya can get through.
Jan Eric Orme
>jano...@aol.comnojunk (Jan Eric Orme) writes:
>
>>I have owned lots of cars over the years. But later in life, in 1989, I
>>obtained another car that was in no way a sleeper. I had it for ten years.
>It
>was 1967 Mustang Shelby GT500 (#245). Lime Gold, 4 speed. Built 428 P.I.
>with
>two fours. 45K on the clock when I sold it.>
>
><drooling on keyboard> I can't believe you sold it.
>
>I had a 65 289 Mustang and a 69 302.... I loved those cars.
>
>Loved the Roadrunner story.....
>
>Hunter
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I just didn't drive the car enough or even take it take it out for show
anymore. It lived most of it's life under a cover in a garage. And...after
getting very occupied with the Nor Cal Region Shelby Club Open Track Program,
my interests turned to road course cars and driving them. The '67 was and is a
great car but not for that.
As regards the Roadrunner Story, my So Cal Hot Rod Roots go back to the 50's,
some street racing and then running at the old Santa Ana Dragstrip and Lion's
Dragstrip in Long Beach. The dude in the Roadrunner had no clue that some
Sunday School Teacher might pull him outta the hole so bad that he was dead
meat regardless of how fast his car was. <G>
El Alumbrado
news:20031218133659...@mb-m15.aol.com...
> As regards the Roadrunner Story, my So Cal Hot Rod Roots go back to the 50's,
> some street racing and then running at the old Santa Ana Dragstrip and Lion's
> Dragstrip in Long Beach.
Ever run into Jim White? I just got off the phone with him.
Alan Balmer
Years ago, I knew a Jim White, and his colleague, Jim Brown. They used
to take great delight in the fact that Brown was white, and White was
brown :-)
Jan Eric Orme
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The name sounds familiar but I'm not sure. Is that someone from that era in So
Cal?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Carl A.
"Alan Balmer" <alba...@att.net> wrote in message
news:uj04uvgolr0kgcad7...@4ax.com...
> Years ago, I knew a Jim White, and his colleague, Jim Brown. They used
> to take great delight in the fact that Brown was white, and White was
> brown :-)
Some forty years ago I worked for the White Motor Company.
The chairman's name was Mr. Black.
The chief counsel was Mr. Green.
Head of the computer department was Mr. Brown.
A senior sales VP was Mr. Red.
No wonder that the company went belly up, come to think of it.
--
Carl A.
Enjoy photo-journals of my travels at
http://sky.prohosting.com/chainfl/index.htm
HHamp5246
>So
>Cal?
Hi Jan,
I have a name... Neely. He used to build and racing drag cars.... can't
remember the first name. They lived in El Monte.
El Alumbrado
> El Alumbrado wrote:
>
> >"Jan Eric Orme" <jano...@aol.comnojunk> wrote in message
> >news:20031218133659...@mb-m15.aol.com...
> >> As regards the Roadrunner Story, my So Cal Hot Rod Roots go back to the
> >50's,
> >> some street racing and then running at the old Santa Ana Dragstrip and
> >Lion's
> >> Dragstrip in Long Beach.
> >
> >Ever run into Jim White? I just got off the phone with him.
>
> The name sounds familiar but I'm not sure. Is that someone from that era in So
> Cal?
> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Yea, he won some NHRA championships in the 70's (was "runner-up" as late as '91, I think). I think
he's listed as the "16th Winningest Driver". Awfully nice guy, too.
Tom Marik
They are both white. New Horizons is sending the dealer a decal package and
trailer photos.
<< Be sure to have them paint "Not for Hire-Private use only" >>
I've heard about equal support for not having any writing. The guy in the
weigh station can't read the sign so the cop has to chase to read it. When I'm
solo, I don't mind stopping to educate the cops. I'm registering it as a
motorhome to keep it very clear.
Tom M
Tom Marik
anything anywhere ya can get through.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jan Eric Orme >>
I haven't run into a person who bought too much truck. Some downsized the
trailer but not the truck.
Tom M
Tom Marik
Sunday School Teacher might pull him outta the hole so bad that he was dead
meat regardless of how fast his car was. <G> >>
Clothes are important. I always wore a suit when I took my blown hemi engines
in for warranty replacement.
Tom M
Lon VanOstran
ss1a...@webtv.net (John Bell) writes:
>Maybe youth is wasted
>on the young. :-) jtb
Really!!! Can you imagine what we might accomplish with all that energy? Nah.
We'd probably waste it on fun and games just like we did the first time. LOL
Lon
Jan Eric Orme
>Hi Jan,
>
>I have a name... Neely. He used to build and racing drag cars.... can't
>remember the first name. They lived in El Monte.
>
>Hunter
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
That name is familiar also and I think I saw their cars run.
Jan Eric Orme
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
YEP! Part of the lull them to sleep image.
I recall a Black Gentleman in the 50's that ran his big Oldsmobile 98 Sedan
there. He always came to the track dressed to the Nines. Never saw him without
a tie on. And his mile long stoogie cigar and snap brim hat completed the
image. That car was way heavy, loaded with all kinds of extras like power
windows etc. etc. The unsuspecting competition looked at the car as easy
pickings. WRONG! The motor and the driver was a holy terror when the flag
dropped. He would chomp on that cigar and charge out of the hole hell bent for
election.
Re: warranty situations. Hey! The car is under warranty they need to fix it.
Right?
In the 90's I burned up all the calipers on a Chrysler LHS we owned while
getting a tad carried away doing some driver instruction on the road course at
Laguna Seca. I do confess that I fibbed some when I took it to the dealer. I
told him we had been doing a lot of twisty mountain driving. Now....that ain't
really that far off of the truth at all when you take a strong look at the
Laguna Seca Course in the Monterey Hills, the "Corkscrew" and Turn 2 after the
front straight with that nasty brake zone after you come over the T-1 hill. <G>
Joe
>
> I figure there's a reason why the majority of States say "slower traffic
> keep right", rather than "keep right except to pass" - on multilaners.
Come to think of it, I've seen those signs also....
Joe
Tom Marik
election. >>
Jan,
That must have been quite a show!
<< Re: warranty situations. Hey! The car is under warranty they need to fix it.
Right? >>
I felt a little guilty about my shifting. The redline was 6000. I'd put in
the clutch at 6800 and let it out after the shift at 7200. It would get a
little crooked even at 95.
The last engine was from over reving in fourth. It was geared for 135 put
powered for a lot more. I was foolish. I lived. I'm a little smarter now.
Tom M
Joe
>
> Once you re-educate all the dumbasses who think you should 'keep right
> except to pass', it'd probably be a neat thing to have. But it would
> probably get pretty exciting if merge lines sneak up on you while you're
> tuning your Roady.
New Illinois Laws - Drivers on interstates must use left lane only for
passing.
Here a portion of the article
It is already a violation to drive in the left lane of an interstate
highway in Illinois at a speed below the speed limit, except when
overtaking and passing another vehicle.
Under the new law, it will be a violation to stay in the left lane
even when traveling at the speed limit, except for overtaking or
passing.
Timmins said the left lane was intended for passing and use by
emergency vehicles. He said left-lane driving could annoy other
drivers and sometimes cause crashes.
"It's a safety issue," he said. "It can cause road rage."
Joe
bill horne
>
> bill horne <red...@rye.net> wrote in message news:<3FDDCBD7...@rye.net>...
>
> >
> > Once you re-educate all the dumbasses who think you should 'keep right
> > except to pass', it'd probably be a neat thing to have. But it would
> > probably get pretty exciting if merge lines sneak up on you while you're
> > tuning your Roady.
>
> New Illinois Laws - Drivers on interstates must use left lane only for
> passing.
> Joe
Too bad. It's one thing to keep a dumbass law - it's another to pass an
even dumber one.
Janet Wilder
(Joe) writes:
>New Illinois Laws - Drivers on interstates must use left lane only for
>passing.
>
>Here a portion of the article
>
>It is already a violation to drive in the left lane of an interstate
>highway in Illinois at a speed below the speed limit, except when
>overtaking and passing another vehicle.
>
>Under the new law, it will be a violation to stay in the left lane
>even when traveling at the speed limit, except for overtaking or
>passing.
>
>Timmins said the left lane was intended for passing and use by
>emergency vehicles. He said left-lane driving could annoy other
>drivers and sometimes cause crashes.
>
>"It's a safety issue," he said. "It can cause road rage."
>
That's been the law in Jersey since I got my first license (I'm the same age as
Hunter). Have gotten pulled over for not staying in the right lane. Know
people who have gotten tickets.
The Road Princess
Residentially Challenged
Spelling and punctuation is up to my editors. I take no responsibility
Rich
wrote:
>Too bad. It's one thing to keep a dumbass law - it's another to pass an
>even dumber one.
hmmm. the right lane is gonna be right (no pun intended) interesting
on the chicago area interstates during rush-hour. can't see how this
has any chanve of being enforced anywhere except the rural areas.
73,
rich, n9dko
Ed
"Janet Wilder" <pri...@aol.comupyours> wrote in message
news:20031229164350...@mb-m01.aol.com...
I believe that the law was passed in Texas and was supposed to become
effective the first of this year, but if they ever enforce it, it has not
been published.
Ed
bill horne
> That's been the law in Jersey since I got my first license (I'm the same age as
> Hunter). Have gotten pulled over for not staying in the right lane. Know
> people who have gotten tickets.
> The Road Princess
> Residentially Challenged
> Spelling and punctuation is up to my editors. I take no responsibility
It's a dumbass law. For example, how far apart do two cars have to be
before you're not "passing" both of them anymore, and are just "passing"
one car at a time?
So faugh to the law, I say. I've been riding the left lane since
Interstates first appeared. If I get a ticket in some dumbass State,
I'll just pay it, drive 20 minutes not in the left lane, and then get
back in it.
--
bill
Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
Tom Marik
Bill,
I know you aren't running for office but I'd like to see you as an advisor to
the Supreme Court on dumass laws.
Tom M, who never like a law that bill said was dumbass