Digging us a well.

[JonDYou]

I recently got mail from a young man seemingly all stoked on ZM.  Finally!  So I said, this is what we need to do.  His reply was, well, I'm just getting into the philosophy of it.  Great.  That gets a lot done.  Let's philosophize about it some more.

If there are any people out there that are ready to dig the well that Darrel speaks of above, let's get together and leave the "thinkers" behind and do a little doing.

First we need to make a list of people who REALLY are ready, not just thinking about getting ready to get ready. 

Second we need to make a list of our resources, locally, and what we can do to begin producing something, anything, food, shoes, who cares, but something. 

Those are the first steps in a long journey.  If anyone is ready to get off their fat asses and do this thing, let's do it!  As Joe from Family Guy says, "Let's do it!"

I've got some shovels.  Anyone thirsty?

Jon Youngblood

[Ray A Curtis]

Jon,
I am interested in any attempts to establish any portion of an RBE society.  Theoretically it should be more efficient than the money economy so should in time replace it.  It seems that the only way to get rid of the money economy is to demonstrate that there is a viable alternative.  I live in Hillsboro west of Portland, Oregon.  I would be interested in talking or getting together some time.
Ray Curtis
collee...@comcast.net
503-648-6561

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[Darrel Johannes]

Jon ,  There is a event coming up next weekend that I will be attending that some of you may be interested in. http://www.hempstalk.org/festival/content/about . Although I am not a user and I really don't care either way the Hemp Plant has many many good uses and I am going to learn more about that and support the hemp industry . In My other country Canada they legalized hemp farming in 1998 . Since then it has grown and prospered more every year . Frankly I am realizing more all the time that my passion is in plants . Perty basic stuff ya know , try living without them. The corporatazation  of farming is something we should all be concerned about and it is something we can all do something about right friggin now to-day . Just came across a author the other day who is top drawer when it comes to understanding the seriousness of the comodification of our food supply . Vandana Shiva , a India,n woman who has the guts to take on Monsanto head on . I am pertly sure Monsanto is one of the heads of satan himself , you would not believe what those fuckers are up to . Anywho , anyone interested in the hempfest let me know and we could go together . Its at Kellly point park near st Johns .  Darrel  503-643-2497

[Nick Polimeni]

This is an incredibly valuable project, and some of you in the northwest US, and some counter parts in Canada, should team up and plan out a course of action. The ONLY down side to Hemp, is the US prohibition. But world situation is in such chaotic way, that one must necessarily plan civil disobedience. At first, do in Canada what can't easily be done in the US. From there, methods of production and distribution can be established across the border. There is limited permission for certain aspect of processing in the US, and there maybe limits on volume of importation of finished products, but they provide an initial avenue. US/Canadian team should possibly get land in Canada for production, processing or manufacturing. This is to be studied and decided by the team.  Allow no distractions or stops. There is always a way around the problems that government throws to the people.

Cheers, and wish you lots of success.

Nick

--
Nick

[Nick Polimeni]

Great Idea.

Creating the RBE, in my educated opinion can best be accomplished by producing the abundance we say we have on the planet. Food production, and such as the Hemp project could go a long way towards that, where much food, clothing, paper, and what not can be produced in abundance, and excesses can be used to give away, or at very low prices, initially.

At some point, we'll have to set up a parallel money-like system, as a means of monitoring production, etc. I've written extensively on this subject, but it's premature at this time without real production on the ground.

Sounds like Jon is willing to coordinate people for various project... and "direct" people to projects of their interest, and ability.  Maybe Jesse, at some point will help with software to help run these projects, and facilitate the communication.

Good luck

Cheers, Nick

--
Nick

[JonDYou]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0ApfVDX-W4xpqdG9tU3RzNnZRYUkzVDlsNTMyb3hwbXc#gid=0

 

Test.  Please try link above.

 

If we are going to "nest" on google instead of ZietgiestPDX, we should use the tools availabe on the google "cloud".  The links should be above for anyone to access. 

 

Let me know if the link works.  You should be able to modify the document.  Put your phone and email there rather than here in the open group.  I'll put my info there too.

 

As far as any meetings or events, I'm more or less homebound.  I don't go out.  So what I do I have to do from here.  Which is a bummer since I have lots of goodies for alternative energy research (had an electric bike shop, gone under in '08) - if anyone whats to come all the way out here to work.

 

Food, we need space or a collection of spaces.  How to prepair and distribute (with our own policeing for cleanliness and sanitation) and cooked or dried foods.  Food automation?  (China has created the first robotic chef...)

 

Yes, I'll help coordinate people and events.  We can use the spreadsheets and documents available on Google.  Yes?

 

Jon

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[Manuel Muro]

Hi Jon,

I was unable to update the spreadsheet, I could see it, but I
could not update it! :( Are there others having issues? I am an avid
Google User...see my e-mail address!

Regards,


Manny

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[Ray A Curtis]

No response from the test link.
rac

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[JonDYou]

You should be good.  One thing pisses me off is that a simple hyperlink in the spreadsheet to other named regions is a function bunch of BS.  But maybe I'm overlooking something.

 

One thing we all need to remember, that to be an RBE, we need to have resources.  Now we can count and name the local resources in the area for if and when the current system collapes, but to really start doing it in any way at all means we need resources.

 

Anyone know some nice folks with lots and lots of acreage which we can begin to experiment?

 

Zietgiest City.  And yes, according to a European friend, it is still spelled with the "I before E" law.  so it's zietgiest, not zeitgeist.  That would be "Zeet Geest"  FYI.

 

Another reason to not use google groups is we miss out on things like the apps that are just for ZM people with links to local chapters - we are not listed.  Probably requires a connection to an actual site - which we still have as I understand it.

 

Jon

[Michael YellowBuffalo]

I am very interested in making a Resource Based Economy a reality. I was so excited to find a Portland chapter of TZM. I am very serious about this but don't know where to start. I live in Oregon City which is just south of Portland, and will be moving closer into town this spring. I am willing to talk with anyone who is wanting to make this a reality. Feel free to contact me at anytime (503) 752-3065 or myellow...@gmail.com. Thank you all. I hope to hear from you soon

[Darrel Johannes]

Michael ,  Certainly our only hope is in a resource based economy . Its all about the Earth , nothing else can keep us and save us . As far as this Zeitgeist group goes things have perty much dried up as far as I can tell . I guess my biggest concern is the amount of people in this country that are totaly clueless , I mean clueless as to the nature and extent of the mess we are in  . For me the greatest need at this time is for education of the masses . Darrel 

On Wed, Feb 6, 2013 at 10:59 AM, Michael YellowBuffalo <myellow...@gmail.com> wrote:

I am very interested in making a Resource Based Economy a reality. I was so excited to find a Portland chapter of TZM. I am very serious about this but don't know where to start. I live in Oregon City which is just south of Portland, and will be moving closer into town this spring. I am willing to talk with anyone who is wanting to make this a reality. Feel free to contact me at anytime (503) 752-3065 or myellow...@gmail.com. Thank you all. I hope to hear from you soon

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[Aaron Whipple]

I think that most people would be interested in this idea once they realized that this resource based society does not necessarily mean we have to live in a less technologically advanced society. We are not trying to go make a small Amish type community (think The Village) of farmers and hunters. The problem is that we cannot make this a reality unless we have enough professionals joining us in our efforts including civil engineers, mechanical engineers, computer scientists, scholars, scientists, and much much more than this. By getting a small group of people together and starting a society we achieve very little, because all we demonstrate to others is how much we have given up to make our society a reality, and that will effectively scare them off from the idea. People want technological advancement. Not regression.

[Darrel Johannes]

I could not agree more as far as introducing " Professionals " to Zeitgeist and the RCB . We should never go backwards  , learn and move on but we can not eat computer chips or drink some manufactured concouction . It all starts with saving the planet only then do we have a base to advance from.  

[Nick Polimeni]

This is the first time I hear about this idea that people would think we'd be in a less technically advanced society in a RBE!!!

In fact, I've been under the understanding that quite the opposite; advanced technology would be in large part what would make life on earth sustainable, and more comfortable, and so on...

Building such a RBE may require highly trained technical personnel; but  brainstroming it, designing, defining, and creating the functional specifications can be done with the participation of any group of people who are committed to do that. The barrier: Lack of clear understanding what such RBE means, and a profound understanding of basic economics, because a transition would have to be designed as well. 

What is often not addressed, possibly because there are assumptions that we understand the basic concepts of exchange, is the very idea of how to attain exchange of values for equivalent values. 

The other point is that most of us are too busy, or lazy, or not interested the moment we see something in a proposal that doesn't suit us. 

Try this one for an initial idea that maybe a reasonable transition:

http://wiki.linguisticteam.org/w/RBE_NOW

I had introduced this process from within the Global Developers' Team of TZM; but interest and participation was limited, perhaps because it was too unreal that we could get there, plus it seemed to have had a distracting effect upon other sectors of the TZM, since the thrust was 'educate the masses' first.

Cheers,

Nick

[Manuel Muro]

Hi Michael, et. al.,

I first want to let you know that there are many people in the PDX
group of the ZM that are actively working on many projects in the NW
area, they involve many off shoots from the Occupy movement including
Occupy Schools/Education (which I have been involved with for a bit)
and then there is the Community Supported Everything (friend Sam Smith
in PDX on FB) then there is the Resource Based Community that came out
of the PDX ZM (see Portland RBC-Development on FB). But one of the
really bigger efforts so far has been some PDX ZM'ers moving up to St.
Helens working on 20 acres to start a RBE movement up there see
(http://www.ingenuity.pro/). Aaron and Kate have held several events
up there and have done several projects working toward a truly
RBE..they welcome everyone there and they have a lot of projects to do
up there. I have taken my kids up there and we helps with the initial
foundation for a rather large greenhouse along with others. I plan on
going up there again very soon...so hey Darrel, things have not dried
up they are actually quite active...you will also enjoy the rocket
stove that they made up there! ;)

Keep in mind we are all experiencing a time of great change, I
highly recommend reading the works of Alvin Toffler...with a rather
quick read being "Creating A Civilization". He documents and explains
these changes in strikingly good deal along with great and accurate
predictions as he has simply identified the cycles and patterns of
human development. "Creating A Civilization" was written in 1995, but
the predictions he made back then are playing out exactly like he
predicted. I am currently reading his more resent work (2006) entitled
"Revolutionary Wealth" and he goes into even greater details on how
humanity is changing including how wealth is changing, he defines it
beyond financial terms and discusses the actually changing of
"currency" as we know it...but I still have more to read.

I have also connected with a neat Horticulturalist here in PDX at a
tech meeting (www.dorkbotpdx.org) who has invited me to help myself to
his garden as he grows more than he needs! The changes are already
happening, the Zeitgeist is everywhere and does not need to happen at
a specific meeting time or place...I encourage you and others to
simple get out and mix in as many "circles" as you can and you will
see the ZM happening everywhere!!! :)

Regards,


Manny

On Thu, Feb 7, 2013 at 6:36 PM, Aaron Whipple <arg...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Darrel Johannes]

Thanks for the update Manny . I had no idea about all those things going on . Different venue same goal and spirit. As long as we find some way to move ourselfs and the world along that's the main thing . I had a killer ( good ) experience with gardening this year . I built some mini greenhouse raised beds . Its February 7th today and I still have fresh mustard greens and radishes to harvest . We had that 2 week period where it barely got above freezing last month and everything looked gone . Then after only a couple days of some sun and a little above freezing everything came back up .   A bunch of little things make the big thing !    darrel