data wishlist: voting history, registration by congressional district

[Aaron Swartz]

Hi everybody,

Here's a piece of data I'd really like, but just haven't been able to
get my hands on. I'd like to know:

a) how many Reps/Dems are registered in each congressional district
b) which way a district voted in previous presidential elections

All of this is a matter of public record, but each state seems to
publish it in a different way and in the initial searching I've done
the only people who have collected it all are data aggregators who
charge money and won't let you republish what they found.

If anyone could help out by seeing if they could find a free source of
this data, or assembling their own from the various state sites, that
would be much appreciated!

[titanium_bones]

aaron, is there a page somewhere that lists datasets that you've
already identified and maybe rates them as, e.g., in use, usable but
not currently deployed, needs massaging, impenetrable? that would give
me a starting point for forking on this question (if it's still
unsolved).

matt

[Matt Price]

On Mon, 2008-08-11 at 03:05 -0700, titanium_bones wrote:
> me a starting point for forking on this question (if it's still

^working...

matt

[Shahin]

While Aaron gets back to us, I've started a list of state-specific
resources on the wiki:

http://watchdog.jottit.com/state-specific_resources

Feel free to update a state or two. A quick look at a few states tells
me that for the GE, county-level voting data is much more available
than congressional district-level. Some states also list data by
precinct, so if precincts are a surjective function of ZIP+4 codes
then our prospects look better.

Shahin

[Aaron Swartz]

> aaron, is there a page somewhere that lists datasets that you've
> already identified and maybe rates them as, e.g., in use, usable but
> not currently deployed, needs massaging, impenetrable? that would give
> me a starting point for forking on this question (if it's still
> unsolved).

The only data sets I've found currently are for-pay. Also, it seems
like the problem may be arguably insolvable; according to one thing I
read some states do not report results by district and the for-pay
data sets simply estimate.

[Matt Price]

hmm. everywhere i've ever voted there's been a voter's list at the
polling station -- so it seems likely that in most cases at least the
records would exist somehow. as to whether they're electronically
available anywhere, i imagine that's another question.
m

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Matt Price
matt....@utoronto.ca

[John Osborne]

In some places these lists might exist county by county, instead of
state-wise. I know that Clark county Nevada has a pretty decent and
exhaustive voter list (it includes names and addresses, in addition to
registration info, which elections a voter voted it, etc), but I don't
know if something equivalent exists for the rest of Nevada.

On Thu, Aug 14, 2008 at 8:48 PM, Matt Price <matt....@utoronto.ca> wrote:
> On Thu, 2008-08-14 at 18:58 -0400, Aaron Swartz wrote:
>> > aaron, is there a page somewhere that lists datasets that you've
>> > already identified and maybe rates them as, e.g., in use, usable but
>> > not currently deployed, needs massaging, impenetrable? that would give
>> > me a starting point for forking on this question (if it's still
>> > unsolved).
>>
>> The only data sets I've found currently are for-pay. Also, it seems
>> like the problem may be arguably insolvable; according to one thing I
>> read some states do not report results by district and the for-pay
>> data sets simply estimate.
>>
> hmm. everywhere i've ever voted there's been a voter's list at the
> polling station -- so it seems likely that in most cases at least the
> records would exist somehow. as to whether they're electronically
> available anywhere, i imagine that's another question.
> m
>
>> >>
> --

> Matt Price
> matt....@utoronto.ca
>

--
John Osborne
osbo...@ieee.org/osbo...@gmail.com/j...@freeshell.org

[Aaron Swartz]

> In some places these lists might exist county by county, instead of
> state-wise. I know that Clark county Nevada has a pretty decent and
> exhaustive voter list (it includes names and addresses, in addition to
> registration info, which elections a voter voted it, etc), but I don't
> know if something equivalent exists for the rest of Nevada.

That gets you registration info, but not what the vote totals were for
the district.

[Matt Price]

On Wed, 2008-08-13 at 23:08 -0700, Shahin wrote:

> While Aaron gets back to us, I've started a list of state-specific
> resources on the wiki:
>
> http://watchdog.jottit.com/state-specific_resources
>
> Feel free to update a state or two. A quick look at a few states tells
> me that for the GE, county-level voting data is much more available
> than congressional district-level. Some states also list data by
> precinct, so if precincts are a surjective function of ZIP+4 codes
> then our prospects look better.
>

shahin, i've done a quick run through of most of the states, mostly
using sec'y of state info. I didn't do extensive searches in most
cases, so if a piece of information is missing it means it wasn't
readily available on a website, but could be somewhere else.

as you suggested, county information is easier to find than precinct
info, precinct info is usually easier to find than district info. there
is some low-hanging fruit, e.g. Nevada, south dakota, etc. gotta go
right now...
matt

> Shahin
> --~--~---------~--~--~------~--~---
>
--
Matt Price
matt....@utoronto.ca

[Shahin Saneinejad]

Nice work! You're right, looks like only a few states give us both datasets by district. But it's good to have this information, though... probably California, South Dakota, Alaska etc should be worth parsing at some point.

Shahin

[Matt Price]

back from the woods again -- i can do more on this, e.g. emailing sec.
of state offices and so forth, but it'll be slow & labour-intensive.
how high-priority is this data?

matt

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[Aaron Swartz]

It'd certainly be useful, but I think http://watchdog.jottit.com/vrdb
is probably higher-priority.

[Matt Price]

On Wed, 2008-08-27 at 08:17 -0400, Aaron Swartz wrote:
> It'd certainly be useful, but I think http://watchdog.jottit.com/vrdb
> is probably higher-priority.

I'll work on this. I just want to make sure I'm interpreting this
paragraph right:
---
Under the Help America Vote Act, every state is required to provide a
database with every voter registered in that state. This page keeps
track of where we can buy them and how much they cost.
---
when I first read this, I thought this meant that the states were
required to make voter registration data public. Reading HAVA I don't
see any such provision. Am I right in thinking that states _don't_ need
to provide this data? just want to check before I start sending out
letters.

m

[Dan Diebolt]

I don't think this document is current, but it will probably provide a good vector into the researching in each state's vote database status

Statewide Voter Registration Database Status
http://www.pewcenteronthestates.org/uploadedFiles/voter%20reg%20db%20status.pdf

The voter databases are generally available under each state's FOIA laws although some states or municipalities may offer you an "order form" with predetermined or artificially set prices for the voter data . When requesting the voter database under FOIA, you should insist that your request be charged at the actual cost of duplicating the data. Many state FOIA laws prohibit the state from charging more than the actual cost of duplicating the data.

The prices states charge and the fields of data in the voter databases varies widely from state to state. Wisconsin wanted $10,000 while Ohio has the data online for free download. Iowa has phone numbers and Florida has race among its data fields. Most states have date or year of birth, & gender. You can expect to have problems with those states which have contracted out the voter database development to a private contractor.

[Aaron Swartz]

> ---
> Under the Help America Vote Act, every state is required to provide a
> database with every voter registered in that state. This page keeps
> track of where we can buy them and how much they cost.
> ---
> when I first read this, I thought this meant that the states were
> required to make voter registration data public. Reading HAVA I don't
> see any such provision. Am I right in thinking that states _don't_ need
> to provide this data? just want to check before I start sending out
> letters.

Sorry, I meant every state needs to have such a database; I don't
think HAVA requires them to share it. However, I know every state
does, in practice, share it, since the DNC and Barack Obama and other
national political campaigns have 50-state voter databases (e.g.
VoteForChange.com) and having spoken to the people who work on these,
this is how they get the data.

Dan suggests that we can FOIA them in states that are otherwise
uncooperative; it sounds like he knows more than I about this -- I've
only done Federal FOIA stuff.

[Dan Diebolt]

I should have posted this:

Ohio Voter Database FTP Site
http://www2.sos.state.oh.us/cf_ftp/voter_ftp_home?agree_flag=Y

>I don't think HAVA requires them to share it.

Section 303 of the HAVA of 2002 requires the states to create and use a unified statewide voter database:

Help America Vote Act
http://www.fec.gov/hava/law_ext.txt

HAVA itself is silent on the issue of the public's right to copies the various state voter database so state FOIA law controls. It is interesting that the two states that had election problems in the past (Florida and Ohio) provide the most open access to their voter databases. Florida charges $5 for the cost of the CD while Ohio gives the voter database away on the internet for free.

FWIW, some readers may be interested in this recent report to Congress on the use of HAVA funds:

http://www.eac.gov/election/HAVA%20Funds/docs/2007-report-on-hava-spending-by-states/attachment_download/file

[Dan Diebolt]

> I've only done Federal FOIA stuff.

FWIW, it is an interesting question if you could request state voter databases under federal FOIA where the state may be uncooperative (say on the issue of cost). Federal funds certainly pay for development of the state voter databases and the resulting database becomes the "official voter registration list" for federal elections (HAVA 303 (a)(1)(A)(viii)). This alone should being bring the voter databases under federal FOIA. The open issue for applying federal FOIA is does the federal government ever become the custodian of records for the voter database.

[Aaron Swartz]

> Florida charges $5 for the cost of the CD

Do you happen to know where you get it? I couldn't find anything on
their website.

> alone should being bring the voter databases under federal FOIA. The open
> issue for applying federal FOIA is does the federal government ever become
> the custodian of records for the voter database.

I've never heard of filing a federal FOIA against a state agency and
I'm not sure if there's a Federal department that has the data.

[Dan Diebolt]

The ordering info is not on the web page but you can get the contact info from this page:

http://election.dos.state.fl.us/contact-us/division-addresses.shtml

>I've never heard of filing a federal FOIA against a state agency and
>I'm not sure if there's a Federal department that has the data.

If a state was uncooperative in fulfilling a FOIA request for a voter database (like Wisconsin which charges $10,000) you might turn to filing a federal FOIA request if you could determine which federal agency or department was a custodian of the records. The question is does a federal agency or department receive copies of the state compiled voter databases.

[Joshua Gay]

If you buy these database CDs can you release the data to the public? I would totally pitch in to a fund to buy CDs if they could be put into the public domain.

-Josh

[Aaron Swartz]

> If you buy these database CDs can you release the data to the public? I
> would totally pitch in to a fund to buy CDs if they could be put into the
> public domain.

Of course -- everything we have gets put up in its entirety on the Web
with no restrictions. And we're happy to take donations for our CD and
DVD-purchasing fund. :-)

You can also make tax-deductible donations to our partner organization
in many of these projects, public.resource.org -- bulk.resource.org
has all the data they've put up. Just write me about it so I know to
credit it.