Narrowboats are no longer VAT free
greyh...@supaworld.com
from Customs & Excise that boats used for private recreational purposes
are subjected to VAT at the standard rate.
AND the vatman can claw back VAT on boats built in the past three
years.
Very clear rules on residential exempt boats, which must not have an
engine fitted or even be able to have an engine fitted.
Dutch barges too come into the scheme unless they have a proper hold
capable of carrying freight.
So that will certainly put the damper on things.
Grey
See it on narrowboatworld.co.uk
Julian
<greyh...@supaworld.com> wrote in message
news:1105721284....@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
> Real shock news on Narrowboatworld on Saturday quoting a recent missive
> from Customs & Excise that boats used for private recreational purposes
> are subjected to VAT at the standard rate.
> AND the vatman can claw back VAT on boats built in the past three
> years.
hardly think that this is a narrowboat item.......
Only an absoloute full size narrowboat 71ft6 x 7ft with a depth from the
floor to the underside of the gunnel of nearly 5 ft could ever have
qualified anyway.
J
Adrian Stott
Sorry to say that the above story is almost completely inaccurate.
1. C&E has sort-of published a new interpretation it is trying to put
on what standards a vessel must comply with to be considered a
Qualifying Ship (QS). The sale, conversion, some parts for, etc. of a
QS is zero-rated for VAT.
2.
On Fri, 14 Jan 2005 17:16:25 -0000, "Julian"
<Jul...@negearth.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>Only an absoloute full size narrowboat 71ft6 x 7ft with a depth from the
>floor to the underside of the gunnel of nearly 5 ft could ever have
>qualified anyway.
>
>J
With the exception of the very large type of craft described by
Julian (and I think none or a very tiny number exist), NO narrow boat
has ever actually been a QS. Quite a few owners have tried to *claim*
their narrow boats were QSs, and have then got zero-rated invoices as
a result, but these claims have always in fact been false. A common
(but unlawful) trick was to measure the depth of the boat (which is
not the same as the draft) from the bottom to the roof of the cabin,
instead of from the bottom to to the gunwale as Julian correctly
describes it has to be done.
However, C&E has also changed the formula for measuring tonnage, and
under the new formula NO NARROW BOAT (meaning a boat that can fit in a
narrow canal lock) AT ALL CAN EVER BE A QS.
The "claw back" referred to is where C&E has gone back to (quite) a
number of builders of narrow boats, which were sold new zero-rated,
and has demanded VAT be paid on them. I know one builder who has paid
GBP 40,000!
3. The "exempt" craft referred to is actually what C&E calls a
"houseboat". This must indeed not have an engine, and is VAT-exempt,
which is quite different from being VAT zero-rated. I'm not going to
go into that for fear of inducing sudden somnolence. A houseboat is
*not* the same as a QS, and the two should not be confused and are
covered by separate bits of legislation. A QS may have an engine.
4. The new C&E interpretation indeed says that a QS must have things
like a hold. However, tt seems unlikely this will stand up to a
challenge, as the interpretation seems not to be supported by the VAT
legislation. The book is definitely still open here.
5. This was not a shock. It has been seen coming for quite a while.
Too bad the original post will have contributed to the already serious
confusion on this.
Adrian
Bob Adams
<m...@privacy.net> writes
>>Real shock news on Narrowboatworld on Saturday quoting a recent missive
>>from Customs & Excise that boats used for private recreational purposes
>>are subjected to VAT at the standard rate.
>
First with the news again then?
Next week they will probably lead with "Titanic Sinks".
--
Bob Adams - email address: bo...@ntlworld.com
Paul Scott
"Bob Adams" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:6bVb3bCm...@ntlworld.com...
No it'll be the devastating news that there isn't really a tooth fairy...
Paul
greyh...@supaworld.com
The information is printed verbatim from Customs & Excise, Business
Brief 29 December.
All the above from Adrian relates to old rules. I hope he doesn't rush
into print again with more inacuracies.
The British Marine Federation have circulated this to members of the
Canal Boatbuilders Association, both authorities being extremely
concerned.
Read the extract from the Customs & Excise Brief in narrowboatworld.
Grey
greyh...@supaworld.com
take note of your ramblings.
What any of you don't seem to realise about the VAT on boats is that it
is a re-classification issued by Customs & Excise on the 29th December.
I had better explain: Re-classification means that the old rules no
longer apply but are superseded by the new rules. Do you understand?
Grey
Adrian Stott
>No, it is not inaccurate at all.
>
>The information is printed verbatim from Customs & Excise, Business
>Brief 29 December.
>What any of you don't seem to realise about the VAT on boats is that it
>is a re-classification issued by Customs & Excise on the 29th December.
>I had better explain: Re-classification means that the old rules no
>longer apply but are superseded by the new rules. Do you understand?
That's easy to understand, but is not what has happened. The C&E
brief explains that this is a change of *policy*, not law.
There has been no reclassification, which AIUI would require an Act of
Parliament. There has in fact been a new *interpretation* by C&E.
The "old rules", meaning the underlying VAT legislation passed by
Parliament, have not changed at all and continue to apply as ever.
>The British Marine Federation have circulated this to members of the
>Canal Boatbuilders Association, both authorities being extremely
>concerned.
>
>Read the extract from the Customs & Excise Brief in narrowboatworld.
No need. DBA has been in contact with BMF on this for some time.
Both organisations are indeed very concerned, and are working on the
situation.
Adrian
Tim Leech
Have a look at
http://www.hmce.gov.uk/channelsPortalWebApp/downloadFile?contentID=HMCE_PROD1_023425
Page 5
"4. VAT – clarification of the VAT liability of ships supplied to
customers who intend to use them as residential accommodation"
Doesn't sound like re-classification to me.
Cheers
Tim
Andrew Denny
missive
> from Customs & Excise that boats used for private recreational
purposes
> are subjected to VAT at the standard rate.
I've had estimates for new boats in the last year or so, and all have
been subject to VAT.
Perhaps I chose the wrong boatbuilders, those who were focused on
building a good boat rather than hunting for tax loopholes. But it's
hardly a shock to me. Like most people I want a boat for moving,
rather than a business barge bolted to a pontoon. And the last thing I
want when I finally take delivery is three years of 'will I/won't I?'
worrying about whether or not I've got to pay tax.
Richard Lucas
I've read the original, which clearly states that it is a clarification of
existing policy following a recent tribunal decision, not an announcement
of change. The story would still have been a useful one without your
unneccesary embellishments - why don't you just report the facts?