Kubota Engine (Aaarggghhhh!)
Linda
Kubota engine? We keep our Finesse 21 at Titchmarsh Marina at
Walton-on-the-Naze, and so far all the marine engine companies I've
contacted have heard the word 'Kubota' and looked at me as if I should be
ringing a bell shouting 'Unclean, unclean." They all mutter 'can't get the
parts, see' and that's the end of the conversation.
I've just shelled out and had all the electrics done, summer is ticking away
and I can't get anyone to service the engine. I even tried getting a plant
hire company which deals with Kubota equipment to look at it, but after 15
minutes of complaining, they said they didn't want to do it because it was a
marine engine and they do tractors and cement mixers.
Don't get me wrong, the marina is very nice - but it would be nice to be
able to get off my berth at some point this year.
PLEASE can anybody help?
Linda
Lazy Jack
>
> Linda
French Marine Motors of Brightlingsea used to have a workshop at
Titchmarsh, or were they one of the mutterers?
Jack
Sandy Morton
<linda..isaac@clara.co.uk> wrote:
> Please can anyone suggest a company/engineer/gifted child who can fix
> our Kubota engine? We keep our Finesse 21 at Titchmarsh Marina at
> Walton-on-the-Naze, and so far all the marine engine companies I've
> contacted have heard the word 'Kubota' and looked at me as if I should
> be ringing a bell shouting 'Unclean, unclean." They all mutter 'can't
> get the parts, see' and that's the end of the conversation.
IMMIC some Vetus engines are derived from Kubota.
hth
--
A T (Sandy) Morton
on the Bicycle Island
In the Global Village
http://www.sandymillport.fsnet.co.uk
Linda
too busy, couldn't get the spares, etc etc. Sometimes I feel like I've got
the engine equivalent of a pot noodle sitting in the bilge.
Linda :-|
"Lazy Jack" <vlaz...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:24f64a33.03072...@posting.google.com...
Simon Brooke
> Unfortunately French Marine at Titchmarsh were not interested. They were
> too busy, couldn't get the spares, etc etc. Sometimes I feel like I've got
> the engine equivalent of a pot noodle sitting in the bilge.
OK, does it run? If it does, change the oil (sump and gearbox) and
filters. You may need to use a pump to get the oil out of the sump as
in many boats it's difficult to get a drain tray under the sump. Yes,
it's not a perfect service and it would be good to check the timing
and the injection pump as well, but as you don't have the data on that
you can't. A yacht engine does very few hours a year and provided the
lubricant is OK it isn't going to get that far out of tune.
But for heaven's sake don't not go sailing because the engine isn't
serviced! You don't _need_ an engine in a sailing boat (although I
agree it can be very handy). Small, low stressed diesels are very
reliable, on the whole, but if it does break down it isn't a disaster
- you can still sail.
--
si...@jasmine.org.uk (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
For office use only. Please do not write or type below this line.
Tony Brooks
wrote:
>"Linda" <linda..isaac@clara.co.uk> writes:
>
>> Unfortunately French Marine at Titchmarsh were not interested. They were
>> too busy, couldn't get the spares, etc etc. Sometimes I feel like I've got
>> the engine equivalent of a pot noodle sitting in the bilge.
>
>OK, does it run? If it does, change the oil (sump and gearbox) and
>filters. You may need to use a pump to get the oil out of the sump as
>in many boats it's difficult to get a drain tray under the sump. Yes,
>it's not a perfect service and it would be good to check the timing
>and the injection pump as well, but as you don't have the data on that
>you can't. A yacht engine does very few hours a year and provided the
>lubricant is OK it isn't going to get that far out of tune.
>
>But for heaven's sake don't not go sailing because the engine isn't
>serviced! You don't _need_ an engine in a sailing boat (although I
>agree it can be very handy). Small, low stressed diesels are very
>reliable, on the whole, but if it does break down it isn't a disaster
>- you can still sail.
>
Add to that check the alternator belt for tightness, and make sure
enough water is comming from the exhaust and you preaty much have a
"normal" service.
Squeeze any hoses in case they are going hard (but you have to know
what a good one feels like first). inspect engien for oil, water and
fuel leaks & make sure everyything is tight - esp. engienmounts.
Wash/wipe down engine (so it looks as if you have done something), ant
there you have it. Top up and clean batteries.
Ignore pump timing - there is no way it can alter over a year or so -
in fact I can only think of one case where pump timing altered, and
that was on a college engine with "studentfied" adjustment.
Next winter learn how t change the fuel flters - how about a course -
plug plug - email me for info (Ł50)
Tony (ditchcrawler) Brooks
Stewart Vane-tempest
I have a Nanni Diesel in my Hunter and get regular (and very good) service
from
Marine Maintenance Ltd
Tollesbury
Maldon
Essex
CM9 8SE
Tel: 01621 860441
Fax: 01621 869441
Ask for Steve..
Regards and good luck!
Stewart
"martin" <mar...@wanadoo.nl> wrote in message
news:f188ivk887sv2gpf0...@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 27 Jul 2003 19:29:26 +0100, Sandy Morton
> <a...@sandymillport.fsnet.co.uk> wrote:
>
> >In article <105929463...@demeter.uk.clara.net>, Linda
> ><linda..isaac@clara.co.uk> wrote:
> >> Please can anyone suggest a company/engineer/gifted child who can fix
> >> our Kubota engine? We keep our Finesse 21 at Titchmarsh Marina at
> >> Walton-on-the-Naze, and so far all the marine engine companies I've
> >> contacted have heard the word 'Kubota' and looked at me as if I should
> >> be ringing a bell shouting 'Unclean, unclean." They all mutter 'can't
> >> get the parts, see' and that's the end of the conversation.
> >
> >IMMIC some Vetus engines are derived from Kubota.
>
> BETA and Nanni are based on Kubota engines.
> --
> martin
Linda
(we have just discovered), both of which need attending to. We bought the
boat a few months ago through a brokerage in Beccles. We had a full survey
and an engine report - both of which were fine. Got the boat delivered, the
engine ran just long enough to die half way across the marina leaving us
drifting helplessly having to call for assistance. Hasn't run again since.
I'm beginning to despair! No, that's a lie - I've been despairing for some
time now.
Linda
"Tony Brooks" <Mar...@reading-college.ac.uk> wrote in message
news:3f24f657...@news.cis.dfn.de...
John
be able to direct you in the right direction, I'll dig out their address for
you.
J.H.
"martin" <mar...@wanadoo.nl> wrote in message
news:f188ivk887sv2gpf0...@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 27 Jul 2003 19:29:26 +0100, Sandy Morton
> <a...@sandymillport.fsnet.co.uk> wrote:
>
> ><linda..isaac@clara.co.uk> wrote:
> >> Please can anyone suggest a company/engineer/gifted child who can fix
> >> our Kubota engine? We keep our Finesse 21 at Titchmarsh Marina at
> >> Walton-on-the-Naze, and so far all the marine engine companies I've
> >> contacted have heard the word 'Kubota' and looked at me as if I should
> >> be ringing a bell shouting 'Unclean, unclean." They all mutter 'can't
> >> get the parts, see' and that's the end of the conversation.
> >
> >IMMIC some Vetus engines are derived from Kubota.
>
Iain Hibbert
> The engine doesn't run. It's got water in the diesel and a rusty fuel tank
> (we have just discovered), both of which need attending to. We bought the
> boat a few months ago through a brokerage in Beccles. We had a full survey
> and an engine report - both of which were fine. Got the boat delivered, the
> engine ran just long enough to die half way across the marina leaving us
> drifting helplessly having to call for assistance. Hasn't run again since.
sounds like it does run, but its just got water in the diesel..
do you have a fuel filter? if not, you can get one from your local
Lucas dealer that involves a water separator - fit one, or replace
the one you have. If you had no fuel filter, could be a problem if
dirt is in the fuel pump and injectors but there could just be sludge
blocking the pipes etc, especially if the boat has been sitting for
a while pending sale. Take the hoses off and make sure they are
empty. Fit another hose directly into a bottle of clean diesel
and see if you can get it to work (put a squeezy bulb in the hose,
it will help you prime it)
dont necessarily worry about the fuel tank - the filter should take
care of it, you might find that its not that rusty inside (diesel
is oil, you see.. the inside of the tank is coated with oil!) - and
if you empty it out into some jerry cans and clean out the sludge
(if any) at the bottom it might be ok.
iain
Simon Brooke
> The engine doesn't run. It's got water in the diesel and a rusty fuel tank
> (we have just discovered), both of which need attending to. We bought the
> boat a few months ago through a brokerage in Beccles. We had a full survey
> and an engine report - both of which were fine. Got the boat delivered, the
> engine ran just long enough to die half way across the marina leaving us
> drifting helplessly having to call for assistance. Hasn't run again since.
>
> I'm beginning to despair! No, that's a lie - I've been despairing for some
> time now.
OK, let's get practical. The engine won't run and you can't in the
short term get anyone who is expert at repairing it. Although it
sounds to me as though quite probably the reasons it won't run are to
do with neglect and with contaminated fuel, so that a flush out of the
fuel lines and a replace of the filters might be a good start.
However, as you say the summer is passing and fast. What sort of boat
is it? Could you in the short term fit an outboard? I'm assuming you
keep it in a place which is very tricky to get into or out of under
sail, otherwise you wouldn't be feeling so stuck.
If you can't get an outboard you need to get that motor fixed. It's
just a small diesel and there's nothing special about small diesels -
they are used in all sorts of industrial and agricultural
applications. There must be a local tool-hire place who have a small
engine diesel mechanic on the staff. Go and chat the guy up and see
what it will take to persuade him to come and have a look.
This is not a big problem. Unless something is horribly broken you're
unlikely to need any special spare parts - just commonplace things
like belts and filters you can get anywhere. You don't need a Kubota
specialist (although of course that would be good) and you don't need
a marine specialist (although, again, that would be good). There are
diesel meachanics all over the place.
--
si...@jasmine.org.uk (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
Morning had broken, and there was nothing left for us to do
but pick up the pieces.
Linda
maintenance who are going to fix it! I'm soooo happy!!!!
Linda :-)
Marine Maintenance Ltd
Tollesbury
Maldon
Essex
CM9 8SE
Tel: 01621 860441
Fax: 01621 869441
"Linda" <linda..isaac@clara.co.uk> wrote in message
news:105929463...@demeter.uk.clara.net...
Sandy Morton
Iain Hibbert <plu...@mail.com> wrote:
> dont necessarily worry about the fuel tank - the filter should take
> care of it, you might find that its not that rusty inside (diesel
> is oil, you see.. the inside of the tank is coated with oil!) - and
> if you empty it out into some jerry cans and clean out the sludge
> (if any) at the bottom it might be ok.
Our diesel tank rusted through - from the inside out:-(
Linda
fix the Kubota engine on our Finesse 21. We eventually got Marine Services
from Tollesbury to come and sort out the mucky fuel system and the engine
runs fine now.
Our first sea trial didn't go too well - we managed to go about 100 yards at
a speed of 1 knot, before smoke started pouring out of the lockers and we
lost all power/ steerage and were drifting helplessly towards the mud. My
husband leapt into our old Avon dingy and managed to tow us to the nearest
pontoon (along with another kind soul in his dingy).
Next day we phoned Marine Services to explain that the boat still didn't go,
and they agreed to come out again (after taking my credit card number as a
precaution). It turns out that the drive belt on the hydraulic gearbox had
snapped (it didn't occur to us to check this as we thought the boat was on
fire) and produced smoke as it slipped and got hot. We couldn't get a
replacement so the engineer, Dave, borrowed the belt from the alternator.
So far so good - we now have a boat with a rotating prop and flat batteries!
That evening we decided to go out on sea trial number 2. Well the 'G' force
was incredible. My face was pushed back so far that my ears met round the
back of my head. We managed a stunning 2 knots. We went out of the marina,
turned round and came back into our berth, several sea snails overtook us on
the way in.
I know that boat used to live on the broads, but I can't believe the
previous owners installed an engine (12hp) and hydraulic drive which could
only manage 2 knots! I'm at a complete loss as to what to do next. Surely
a 12hp engine should be capable of pushing along a 21ft wooden boat! I am
rapidly running out of money and the will to live. Yesterday I thought
seriously about throwing the inboard away and sticking an outboard on the
back.
Any suggestions gratefully received!
Linda
Richard Smith
about 8-9hp and that would manage 5.5kts at 2/3rds throttle. Your
Kubota powered Finesse should almost plane! Have you tried looking at
your bum (get away from the mirror I mean the boats Bum).
Alternatively look at the prop is the engine achieving the correct
revs? Is the prop the correct pitch and diameter and is it in good
condition i.e no chunks out of the blades or the blades reduced
because electrolysis has warn them away.
Richard
Dennis Pogson
condition, the hydraulic fluid fresh and fully-topped-up, and the prop must
be of the correct diameter and pitch. Also the hydraulic oil should be
circulated thru a cooler in order to retain it's viscosity.
--
Remove "nospam" from return address.
>
>
Linda
> condition, the hydraulic fluid fresh and fully-topped-up, and the prop
must
> be of the correct diameter and pitch. Also the hydraulic oil should be
> circulated thru a cooler in order to retain it's viscosity.
So, what would be the alternative to the 'fickle' system and how much
expense am I looking at?
Linda :-(
Guy Fawkes
you've bought a pup, accept that now before you start throwing good money
after bad.......
rip the kubota and hydraulics out and flog it for whatever you can get on
ebay, and hang a decent refurbished seagull off the transom.
--
Backbone server http://www.surfbaud.org/
E-mail (rot-13) WO ng FHESONHQ qbg BET
Cable web/game server http://80.235.132.33:800/
What crap am I selling on e-bay?
http://members.ebay.co.uk/aboutme/error505sex/
EoF
Simple Simon
Yours is a typical tale of woe that's completely
unnecessary.
Had you spent a little time recognizing the fact that
an inboard diesel on a 21-foot sailboat is rather
absurd and examined the installation you would
have discovered the folly of your purchase. There's
an old saying about a stitch in time saving nine. Ever
heard of it?
Now you're stuck with a piece of crap that's
unreliable, poorly engineered and ill-suited to the
job at hand. My suggestion is to toss the lot over
the side and learn how to sail. Once you know how
to sail consider purchasing a nice, modern, 4-stroke
outboard engine (Honda or Yamaha) to hang off the
transom.
S.Simon
"Linda" <linda..isaac@clara.co.uk> wrote in message news:106180119...@lotis.uk.clara.net...
Linda
"Simple Simon" <Pie...@Mincemeat.com> wrote in message
news:0e-dnXzsH9K...@terranova.net...
> Linda,
>
> Yours is a typical tale of woe that's completely
> unnecessary.
>
> Had you spent a little time recognizing the fact that
> an inboard diesel on a 21-foot sailboat is rather
> absurd and examined the installation you would
> have discovered the folly of your purchase. There's
> an old saying about a stitch in time saving nine. Ever
> heard of it?
Yes I have actually, which is why I paid for a full survey and engine
report - both of which were 'fine'. I think you'll find there are many 21
footers with inboard diesels which work perfectly well.
> Now you're stuck with a piece of crap that's
> unreliable, poorly engineered and ill-suited to the
> job at hand. My suggestion is to toss the lot over
> the side and learn how to sail. Once you know how
> to sail consider purchasing a nice, modern, 4-stroke
> outboard engine (Honda or Yamaha) to hang off the
> transom.
>
> S.Simon
Thank you for the kind advice about learning to sail - I can actually.
However, since this particular Finesse is a motor boat - it won't do me much
good.
Linda
John Wilson
<ric...@trapidos.fsnet.co.uk> wrote:
>A friend of mine used to own a Carter 33 in which the auxillary was
>about 8-9hp and that would manage 5.5kts at 2/3rds throttle. Your
>Kubota powered Finesse should almost plane! Have you tried looking at
>your bum (get away from the mirror I mean the boats Bum).
This could well be a major part of the problem, if the hull bottom and
prop are badly fouled. It's astonishing how much fouling can slow
things down (and overload an engine).
If the bottom and prop are clean though, you need someone who really
knows about hydraulic drives - it's almost certainly cheaper to fix it
than replace, and once fixed it should be OK. Unfortunately I cant
suggest anyone.
John Wilson
jwilsonNO*SP...@yachtsnet.co.uk
Remove characters from e-mail address to reply
www.yachtsnet.co.uk - full service online yacht
brokerage with full details and multiple photos
of all boats. Free classified adverts for small
boats and genuinely useful marine links.
Simple Simon
with motor boat problems?
You're not welcome here. Go away. Post your motorboat
stuff to a motorboat newsgroup.
S.Simon
"Linda" <linda..isaac@clara.co.uk> wrote in message news:106182193...@demeter.uk.clara.net...
Linda
no sails. I have other boats with sails, which is why I use this newsgroup.
Why do you use this newsgroup? Is it because you don't get out much?
"Simple Simon" <Pie...@Mincemeat.com> wrote in message
news:N0-dnREXGqq...@terranova.net...
Ian
Simon, I think you will find it is you that is not welcome here.
--
Ian
Simple Simon
full of foreigners gays and motor boaters.
My website:
http://www.homestead.com/captneal/index.html
You should take time to read the Novice Lessons.
S.Simon
"Linda" <linda..isaac@clara.co.uk> wrote in message news:106183163...@demeter.uk.clara.net...
Simple Simon
"Ian" <spaman...@greasy.joes> wrote in message news:BB700328.E053%spaman...@greasy.joes...
> Simon, I think you will find it is you that is not welcome here.
Why's that, I wonder? I post on-topic stuff and help
weed out spam and unwanted posts from motor boat
groups as well as ignorant questions from wannabes
who don't have a clue about sailing and need to be
discouraged before they go out and drown themselves.
I've probably already saved dozens of lives.
Just because I'm brutally honest it sticks in some
people's craw. So sue me!
S.Simon
Tony Howard
>knows about hydraulic drives - it's almost certainly cheaper to fix it
>than replace, and once fixed it should be OK. Unfortunately I cant
>suggest anyone.
Hydraulic drives are all pretty much the same. You may find an
agricultural engineer who is familiar with yours. Used frequently on
farm machinery
Tony of Judicious - www.yacht-judicious.co.uk
Guy Fawkes
hydraulics are indeed pretty simple, but unless you are familiar working
with hydraulics you won't know a vane pump from a dowty pump from a swash
plate pump at 30 feet, and if you are familiar with hydraulics you won't be
able to guess flow curves and if you are good at hydraulics you will
realise that the OP's installation is in reality a pup which sounds VERY
much like a "fuck it, the boats for sale, just get the prop turning and do
it quick and do it cheap" sort of job...
certainly if the OP asked me personally to do the job I would have to;
1/ inspect the overall installation and notably the piping and valve gear
configuration to determine if it ever had a chance of performing properly.
2/ determine the approrpiate performance and flow curves of the (hydraulic)
motor and pump and of course the diesel prime mover to determine if it ever
had a chance of working properly.
3/ a partial strip and inspection of the motor and pump to determine whether
a complete strip is required.
I've been doing the job long enough to know that jobs like this one are only
ever going to be properly cured (from the engineers point of view, eg you
KNOW the client isn't going to break down or otherwise get in the shit) if
you work to the above schedule, this job sounds VERY much like there is NOT
merely one problem area that needs to be rectified...
the trouble, as always, isn't the job itself, the boat is easy enough to
fix, the problem is the client themselves.
the client in this case paid for a survey, the survey was clearly done by
stevie wonder, it was certainly (from what the OP posted here) not merely
an incompetent survey but a criminally negligent survey.
the client's first course of action in such a sutiation should be a legal
one of redress against the mickey mouse surveyor, and in the meantime a
proper competent marine engineer should have been hired to do a full hull
and machinery survey and report with which the client can club the mickey
mouse surveyor in court and give to an engineer as a job sheet to remedy
that which requires remedy, and bill the mickey mouse surveyor for this
too.
at the end of the day the client would have a seaworthy vessel in which they
can safely enjoy their hobby.
the trouble is of course the end of the day isn't soon enough for 99% of
people, they want to go sailing NOW!!!!
so the probelms go on
and on
and on
and on
and cost ten times what they would have cost to fix properly in the first
place, until the boat does a deep six for insurance purposes because it has
become no more than a garbage scow.
and ALL because the owners want to sail NOW, and not spend any money of
course.
the end result is they don't get much use out of the boat and spend a lot of
money on it.
Simon Brooke
> I know that boat used to live on the broads, but I can't believe the
> previous owners installed an engine (12hp) and hydraulic drive which could
> only manage 2 knots! I'm at a complete loss as to what to do next. Surely
> a 12hp engine should be capable of pushing along a 21ft wooden boat! I am
> rapidly running out of money and the will to live. Yesterday I thought
> seriously about throwing the inboard away and sticking an outboard on the
> back.
My last boat but three came with a two cylinder two stroke Stuart
Turner of pre-war vintage. It never ran reliably (although one could
usually make it run) so after two years I took it out and the boat was
infinitely better for the lack of it. More room in the cabin, more
stowage space, less noxious smells, less drag, and best of all better
trim. I then sailed her for another four years and many hundreds of
miles without an engine, including going in and out of the locks at
Glasson Dock under sail.
My next boat came with a clutched Seagull Century long shaft. I kept
that motor on the boat for a year before I got fed up with it. It was
reliable, but it was also fiendishly noisy and a real pain to lug out
of the cabin back to the transom when one wanted either to use the
motor or (more frequently) to use the cabin. So it got left in the
shed all year, and I sailed her for another three years with no
engine.
My last boat came with a Johnson 5 horse power two stroke outboard. It
lasted two years before I got fed up with it. It was too much weight
in the wrong part of the boat, and fundamentally I hated it. I always
thought I would get round to replacing with a lighter engine, but I
never did. I sailed her for eight years with no engine.
My present boat has an eight horsepower suzuki two stroke
outboard. It's been utterly reliable, but it's way too noisy, way too
heavy and I hate it. I haven't yet made up my mind to get rid of it
because I'm currently operating off a mooring on a very fast tidal
river, and if the wind dies when you're coming in a motor _is_
handy. But I am thinking of getting rid of it; the boat would
definitely sail better and be more comfortable without it.
But you do not need an engine on a sailing boat, and you most
certainly don't need a twelve horspower inboard on a 21 foot sailing
boat. My eight horsepower outboard drives my twenty-six foot boat at
six knots at a bit less than half throttle, and I've never tried it at
full throttle.
You are wasting your sailing season tinkering with the damn thing, and
given what boats cost every hour on the water is valuable. Get rid of
it. If you don't have the confidence to do without an engine
completely get an old Seagull.
--
si...@jasmine.org.uk (Simon Brooke) http://www.jasmine.org.uk/~simon/
;; this is not a .sig
Simple Simon
She has just another motorboat she's bothering us with.
S.Simon
"Simon Brooke" <si...@jasmine.org.uk> wrote in message news:87znhxs...@gododdin.internal.jasmine.org.uk...
Jeffers
> The Finesse 21 is a yacht, it just so happens that this particular boat
has
> no sails. I have other boats with sails, which is why I use this
newsgroup.
>
> Why do you use this newsgroup? Is it because you don't get out much?
>
> "Simple Simon" <Pie...@Mincemeat.com> wrote in message
> news:N0-dnREXGqq...@terranova.net...
Linda,
Please do not feed the troll, (we do keep him as a pet just for
entertainment value though).
I cannot offer any advice about marine diesels and hydraulics pumps because
I know nothing about them I hope you manage to get yours sorted out and get
on the water and enjoy it (but I would prefer to sail anywhere rather than
motor!)
Regards,
Paul
Ian
>
> Yes I have actually, which is why I paid for a full survey and engine
> report - both of which were 'fine'. I think you'll find there are many 21
> footers with inboard diesels which work perfectly well.
>
>
Have you any come back on the surveyor? Hydraulic drives are often used to
split the drive from a single engine on catamarans and seem to work ok, I am
in the process of fitting an inboard electric drive to my 22' sailing boat,
and have found the way to efficiency is prop size, have you checked the
prop?
--
Ian
Pete Verdon
> I'm a sailor so I use a sailor's newsgroup even if it's
> full of foreigners
Including yourself, as an American in a UK newsgroup? Or do you mean all the
Brits here - "they're not American, so they must be foreigners"?
Speaking for myself, all foreigners except Simon are very welcome.
Pete