Power Cruisers and Styling
Lucich
cruisers" -- the Harley Davidson V-Rod, Honda VTX1800C, Kawasaki Mean Streak
and the Yamaha Warrior. I won't get into the details of how each faired in
the comparison (you'll have to buy the magazine), but what was interesting
to me was a final sidebar in the article where they introduced the Yamaha
V-max into the equation.
Largely unchanged since its 1985 introduction, the V-max bested the newbies
in the areas of comfort, handling and price. The HD V-Rod tied it at the
dragstrip (a very iimpressive feat! Who would've thought that a Harley
cruiser could ever keep up with a V-max?). The Yamaha outran it on top at
148 mph to the V-Rod's 137, but who cares? These are cruisers, right?
Where it "sucked" according to the testers was in the area of styling.
I realize that motorcycling is not generally an entirely rational pursuit.
If it was, we'd probably all ride Jawas or something equally as utilitarian.
My questions are, how important is styling to most riders? How high does
styling rank on the scale of necessary attributes in their choice of a
motorcycle? What exactly constitutes styling anyway? How many ride simply
for the joy or riding, whether performance is a factor or not, in comparison
to those who place more importance on image -- how they feel their choice of
a ride makes them look to others? I look forward to your comments.
Kirby
Current rides: 1989 Kawasaki KLR-650, 2000 Buell M2 Cyclone
Previous rides: 1968 Suzuki TC-120, 1970 Kawasaki H1 500, 1971 BSA A75
Rocket 3, 1975 Suzuki T-500 Titan, 1979 Honda CX500, 1983 Honda VF750F
Interceptor
Website (non-motorcycle related): http://foodsupplements.homestead.com
Platypus
>
> The March 2002 issue of Cycle World has a comparison of "Large-caliber
> cruisers" -- the Harley Davidson V-Rod, Honda VTX1800C, Kawasaki Mean Streak
> and the Yamaha Warrior. I won't get into the details of how each faired in
> the comparison (you'll have to buy the magazine), but what was interesting
> to me was a final sidebar in the article where they introduced the Yamaha
> V-max into the equation.
>
> Largely unchanged since its 1985 introduction, the V-max bested the newbies
> in the areas of comfort, handling and price. The HD V-Rod tied it at the
> dragstrip (a very iimpressive feat! Who would've thought that a Harley
> cruiser could ever keep up with a V-max?). The Yamaha outran it on top at
> 148 mph to the V-Rod's 137, but who cares? These are cruisers, right?
> Where it "sucked" according to the testers was in the area of styling.
I was sitting on a Mean Streak the other day. I reckon that it would be
pretty close in terms of comfort to my extremely comfortable VN800
Drifter, if not quite as slow.
> I realize that motorcycling is not generally an entirely rational pursuit.
> If it was, we'd probably all ride Jawas or something equally as utilitarian.
A Jawa is not a rational, utilitarian choice. It's a perverse,
individualistic choice.
> My questions are, how important is styling to most riders? How high does
> styling rank on the scale of necessary attributes in their choice of a
> motorcycle? What exactly constitutes styling anyway? How many ride simply
> for the joy or riding, whether performance is a factor or not, in comparison
> to those who place more importance on image -- how they feel their choice of
> a ride makes them look to others? I look forward to your comments.
I think my Drifter looks great, but I appear to be in a minority. I
enjoy riding period, and what I ride is secondary. The Drifter performs
better than you would think from looking at it, in speed, acceleration,
handling etc, while still falling way behind any sportsbike you could
name. More power and better tank range would top the wishlist, but I
can live with it as it is.
--
Platypus
VN800 Drifter "The Comfy Chair"
DIABTCOOD#2 GPOTHUF#19
BOTAFOS#6 BOTAFOT#89
BOB#1 SBS#35
Platy's track du jour: Randy Newman "Short People"
Lucich
"Platypus" <plat...@ukrm.org> wrote in message
news:3C703D19...@ukrm.org...
> >
> A Jawa is not a rational, utilitarian choice. It's a perverse,
> individualistic choice.
>
> I think my Drifter looks great, but I appear to be in a minority. I
> enjoy riding period, and what I ride is secondary. The Drifter performs
> better than you would think from looking at it, in speed, acceleration,
> handling etc, while still falling way behind any sportsbike you could
> name. More power and better tank range would top the wishlist, but I
> can live with it as it is.
>
I like the Drifter's looks too, but I think you may be right about us being
in the minority, at least among people who actually buy motorcycles. I
think if I was going to buy a motorcycle that could be considered falling
into the cruiser category (it more deservedly belongs in the retro-standard
category, if there is such a thing), the Drifter would be high on my list,
although I think I'd go for the 1500.
They're sort of the motorcyle styling equivalent of the Chrysler PT Cruiser
and I don't mean that in a negative way. Besides, I've always wanted a bike
that had fenders that actually fended, as in keeping road spray off the
bike. The Drifter's look like they work anyway.
Craigers
> enjoy riding period, and what I ride is secondary. The Drifter performs
> better than you would think from looking at it, in speed, acceleration,
> handling etc, while still falling way behind any sportsbike you could
> name. More power and better tank range would top the wishlist, but I
> can live with it as it is.
eyes, being a classicicist kinda guy. The pseudo-chopper-esque lines of the
Japanese cruisers, Mean Streak included, I confess I just don't like.
That said, I always enjoyed the lines of the Honda Magna; to me this seemed
more natural than the typical cruiser, and less forced, in design sense.
--
Craigers | Dotacion
MuZ Skorpion Sport | The Axis Powers
Kawasaki ZX-11 | The Missile of Love
Vespa P200E Polini | The Italian Jobby
POW: "Lawyers, Guns, and Money", Warren Zevon
Platypus
>
> "Platypus" <plat...@ukrm.org> wrote in message
> news:3C703D19...@ukrm.org...
> > >
> > A Jawa is not a rational, utilitarian choice. It's a perverse,
> > individualistic choice.
> >
> That statement is an affront to perverse individualists! :-)
I'll consider myself affronted, then.
> > I think my Drifter looks great, but I appear to be in a minority. I
> > enjoy riding period, and what I ride is secondary. The Drifter performs
> > better than you would think from looking at it, in speed, acceleration,
> > handling etc, while still falling way behind any sportsbike you could
> > name. More power and better tank range would top the wishlist, but I
> > can live with it as it is.
> >
> I like the Drifter's looks too, but I think you may be right about us being
> in the minority, at least among people who actually buy motorcycles. I
> think if I was going to buy a motorcycle that could be considered falling
> into the cruiser category (it more deservedly belongs in the retro-standard
> category, if there is such a thing), the Drifter would be high on my list,
> although I think I'd go for the 1500.
I reckon the 800 is the better bike. You're right about retro, though -
I've expressed the same view myself, even though it's based on a
cruiser. A true art deco motorcycle.
> They're sort of the motorcyle styling equivalent of the Chrysler PT Cruiser
> and I don't mean that in a negative way. Besides, I've always wanted a bike
> that had fenders that actually fended, as in keeping road spray off the
> bike. The Drifter's look like they work anyway.
Heh. You should see my car:
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/lancia/58/gallery/fiat/multipla.htm
Verdigris
<SNIP>
> My questions are, how important is styling to most riders?
<SNIP>
Most modern bikes are so good - and competing models so close in
performance - that you might as well pay attention to all of the other
factors, including appearance.
I wouldn't buy a bike soley based on its looks but I certainly consider
it. I'd never buy a Varadero, for example, because it's just too ugly.
--
Simon - STILLV...@lineone.net.xx (Beware the spam prevention)
Triumph Tiger. Big trailees - you know they make sense.
MAG BOTAFOT#36 two#22 HLR#pi BONY#62
Lucich
> I've expressed the same view myself, even though it's based on a
> cruiser. A true art deco motorcycle.
>
> > They're sort of the motorcyle styling equivalent of the Chrysler PT
Cruiser
> > and I don't mean that in a negative way. Besides, I've always wanted a
bike
> > that had fenders that actually fended, as in keeping road spray off the
> > bike. The Drifter's look like they work anyway.
>
> Heh. You should see my car:
>
> http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/lancia/58/gallery/fiat/multipla.htm
>
if you're looking for overpriced, unique personal transportation, we do have
this http://www.corbinmotors.com/, although I think the basic idea may have
had its origins in the UK.
http://www.southward.org.nz/exhibition/cars/m_p/images/morgan1935_big.jpg
Have you seen the Suzuki GSXR4?
Lucich
"Verdigris" <verd...@deadspam.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2002.02.18.00...@deadspam.com...
> Most modern bikes are so good - and competing models so close in
> performance - that you might as well pay attention to all of the other
> factors, including appearance.
>
> I wouldn't buy a bike soley based on its looks but I certainly consider
> it. I'd never buy a Varadero, for example, because it's just too ugly.
Being isolated as I am on the other side of the Atlantic, I'm not familiar
with the Varadero. What is it?
peteh1
"Lucich" <oxbow_...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:a4pcj3$23pk6$1...@ID-30297.news.dfncis.de...
> The March 2002 issue of Cycle World has a comparison of "Large-caliber
> cruisers" -- the Harley Davidson V-Rod, Honda VTX1800C, Kawasaki Mean Streak
> and the Yamaha Warrior. I won't get into the details of how each faired in
> the comparison (you'll have to buy the magazine), but what was interesting
> to me was a final sidebar in the article where they introduced the Yamaha
> V-max into the equation.
>
> Largely unchanged since its 1985 introduction, the V-max bested the newbies
> in the areas of comfort, handling and price. The HD V-Rod tied it at the
> dragstrip (a very iimpressive feat! Who would've thought that a Harley
> cruiser could ever keep up with a V-max?). The Yamaha outran it on top at
> 148 mph to the V-Rod's 137, but who cares? These are cruisers, right?
> Where it "sucked" according to the testers was in the area of styling.
>
> I realize that motorcycling is not generally an entirely rational pursuit.
> If it was, we'd probably all ride Jawas or something equally as utilitarian.
>
> My questions are, how important is styling to most riders? How high does
> styling rank on the scale of necessary attributes in their choice of a
> motorcycle? What exactly constitutes styling anyway? How many ride simply
> for the joy or riding, whether performance is a factor or not, in comparison
> to those who place more importance on image -- how they feel their choice of
> a ride makes them look to others? I look forward to your comments.
>
> Kirby
>
> Current rides: 1989 Kawasaki KLR-650, 2000
Buell M2 Cyclone
Nice choice!
Original? or have you gone for the after-market silencer and air-box?
If so any major differences in performance?
Any apparent flat spots?
>
> Previous rides: 1968 Suzuki TC-120, 1970 Kawasaki H1 500, 1971 BSA A75
> Rocket 3, 1975 Suzuki T-500 Titan, 1979 Honda CX500, 1983 Honda VF750F
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> Interceptor
My brothers got the V45 Sabre with the cam tensioner mods:-)
--
Petel.
" The ice-man cometh "
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/peteh1/website
Alan T Gower
>
> styling rank on the scale of necessary attributes in their choice of a
> motorcycle? What exactly constitutes styling anyway? How many ride
simply
> for the joy or riding, whether performance is a factor or not, in
comparison
> to those who place more importance on image -- how they feel their choice
of
> a ride makes them look to others? I look forward to your comments.
IMO, the *name* is the most important factor, that's why Harley Davidson
sell so many bikes.
--
Alan
GSX-R1000 , Triumph Thunderbird, XLH1200, ZXR750L2 Racer (green it is).
YTC#9, DS#2 two#24, BOTAFOF#11, TGF, GYASB#1. SbS#23
http://sportsbike.org (our own endurance team) http://Team-ukrm.com
"Nemo repente fuit turpissimus"
Salad Dodger
Older Gentleman) wrote:
>Bloody great touring pseudo-trailie a la BMW R1150GS. Uses the Firestorm
>engine.
Or BlackHawk, as I think it's known over there.
Or ShiteHawk, or summat.
--
| ___ Salad Dodger
|/ \ GL1500SEV/CBR1100XXX/TS250C/exTS185C
_/_____\_ ..40427../...8496.../.19406/.spares.
|_\_____/_| IMC#4 TPPFATUICG#7 YTC#4 DIAABTCOD#9
(>|_|_|<) BOTAFOT #70 two#11 Ignoramus #0001
|__|_|__| BOTAFOF #09 IbW#0 & KotIbW# OSOS#07
\ |^| / WG* BotTOS #6
\|^|/ Replace spam with salad to reply
'^'
Champ
Older Gentleman) wrote:
>A lovely-looking bike increases the "I wanna!" factor.
>
>It increases the pleasure of ownership - I often find myself just
>gazing, looking, at my Ducati.
And of course, Ducati capitalise on this by providing owners plenty of
opportunities to gaze at their bikes...
--
Champ
GSX-R 1000, GPz 750 turbo, ZXR750 Endurance Racer
GYASB#0 BotToS#2 BOTAFO(T|F)#35 UKRMFBC#2 IHABWTMMJ#3 MCT#5 WG*#1 BONY#40 DFV#8 IbW#17 SBS#34
Site of the week : www.vhemt.org
Paul Corfield
>On Mon, 18 Feb 2002 07:54:53 +0000, chateau...@btinternet.com (The
>Older Gentleman) wrote:
>
>>A lovely-looking bike increases the "I wanna!" factor.
>>
>>It increases the pleasure of ownership - I often find myself just
>>gazing, looking, at my Ducati.
>
>And of course, Ducati capitalise on this by providing owners plenty of
>opportunities to gaze at their bikes...
... approximately every 53 feet IIRC Mr Champion?
--
Paul C - "the big camp bastard" (tm darsy)
VFR800 | ZX6R | R1150GS
BOD#5, two#4, BOTAFOT#23, BOTAFOF#4, URMSBC#09, COFF#09
Admits to working for London Underground!
Lucich
"peteh1" <pet...@no-spam.ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:Kr3c8.99586$H37.13...@news2-win.server.ntlworld.com...
>
> > Current rides: 1989 Kawasaki KLR-650, 2000
> Buell M2 Cyclone
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
> Nice choice!
> Original? or have you gone for the after-market silencer and air-box?
> If so any major differences in performance?
> Any apparent flat spots?
It's stock. I'm happy with the powerband the way it is. Wouldn't mind a
little more on top, but wouldn't want to give up the low RPM torque to get
it. If I had been looking for a horsepower monster, I wouldn't have chosen
the Buell.
> >
> > Previous rides: 1968 Suzuki TC-120, 1970 Kawasaki H1 500, 1971 BSA A75
> > Rocket 3, 1975 Suzuki T-500 Titan, 1979 Honda CX500, 1983 Honda VF750F
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> > Interceptor
>
> My brothers got the V45 Sabre with the cam tensioner mods:-)
>
Mine had a cam replaced on warranty. No further problems.
Chris Des Clayes
wrote:
>My questions are, how important is styling to most riders? How high does
>styling rank on the scale of necessary attributes in their choice of a
>motorcycle? What exactly constitutes styling anyway? How many ride simply
>for the joy or riding, whether performance is a factor or not, in comparison
>to those who place more importance on image -- how they feel their choice of
>a ride makes them look to others? I look forward to your comments.
I ride a Drifter 1500, and I love it.
I hated the looks when I first saw one, but the bike is very practical.
The big fenders do the job for which they were intended, It's
comfortable both for the rider and a pillion. It does about 130 miles to
reserve (13 litres of a 16 litre tank), maybe more depending on how you
ride it, and is easy to service.
The handling is "challenging" at legal speeds, meaning I can get an
adrenaline rush without risking my license. It doesn't actually handle
badly, but it needs a bit of planning to get around bends quickly and
smoothly without grounding out the frame rails.
--
ChrisDC VN1500-J1 Drifter "Gertrude"
Barrel Bikers Buckingham MCC http://www.barrel.fsnet.co.uk
Munged addresses, use reply-to and remove brain.
Platypus
>
> Platypus <plat...@ukrm.org> illuminated our benighted existence with
> these words of wisdom:
>
> >Heh. You should see my car:
> >
> >http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/lancia/58/gallery/fiat/multipla.htm
>
> things, and ferheaven'ssake *why*?
It's fab. I love it, wife and child love it, all of child's friends
think it's way cool, a zillion other reasons.
You obviously don't like it. Is this because it doesn't look like other
cars?
Eclipse 硎熔
wrote:
>It's fab. I love it, wife and child love it, all of child's friends
>think it's way cool, a zillion other reasons.
>
>You obviously don't like it. Is this because it doesn't look like other
>cars?
It *is* an ugly sonovabitchin vehicle, having said that, it also, on
the face of it, looks like a very practical one.
For me, Function is Beauty, style is very much secondary, nice if you
can have both though.
--
FUB#2,SBS#16. ZX-9R B1. RTFF at http://www.ukrm.net/faq/index.html
"OH GLOBBITS!" | Cure TB to email
Obviously anything not within quotes above is purely my own opinion
and could as a direct result be pure and unmitigated bullshit.
Platypus
>
> On Mon, 18 Feb 2002 23:29:12 +0000, Platypus <plat...@ukrm.org>
> wrote:
>
> >It's fab. I love it, wife and child love it, all of child's friends
> >think it's way cool, a zillion other reasons.
> >
> >You obviously don't like it. Is this because it doesn't look like other
> >cars?
>
> It *is* an ugly sonovabitchin vehicle, having said that, it also, on
No it isn't. It's just different.
> the face of it, looks like a very practical one.
Form follows function. For instance, the dip beam is the headlights in
the nose, the main beam is the high-level lamps in the bulge under the
windscreen. And very effective they are too.
> For me, Function is Beauty, style is very much secondary, nice if you
> can have both though.
Yep, it's very nice.
Champ
<ye...@dial.pipex.com> wrote:
>On Mon, 18 Feb 2002 09:40:22 +0000, Champ <ne...@champ.org.uk> wrote:
>
>>On Mon, 18 Feb 2002 07:54:53 +0000, chateau...@btinternet.com (The
>>Older Gentleman) wrote:
>>
>>>A lovely-looking bike increases the "I wanna!" factor.
>>>
>>>It increases the pleasure of ownership - I often find myself just
>>>gazing, looking, at my Ducati.
>>
>>And of course, Ducati capitalise on this by providing owners plenty of
>>opportunities to gaze at their bikes...
>
>... approximately every 53 feet IIRC Mr Champion?
Did you have to go and Murray it, Paul?
Lucich
"Chris Des Clayes" <ne...@127.0.0.1> wrote in message
news:mhv27uglf8mmv32hn...@4ax.com...
> The handling is "challenging" at legal speeds, meaning I can get an
> adrenaline rush without risking my license. It doesn't actually handle
> badly, but it needs a bit of planning to get around bends quickly and
> smoothly without grounding out the frame rails.
>
I guess when you buy a bike that looks like it was designed in the 1930s,
that's not entirely unexpected. I bet it handles better than a genuine
1930s article though.
eric the brave
>>It increases the pleasure of ownership - I often find myself just
>>gazing, looking, at my Ducati.
>
>And of course, Ducati capitalise on this by providing owners plenty of
>opportunities to gaze at their bikes...
No bites yet then...
--
SimonB
Platypus
>
> Platypus <plat...@ukrm.org> illuminated our benighted existence with
> these words of wisdom:
>
> >>
> >> On Mon, 18 Feb 2002 23:29:12 +0000, Platypus <plat...@ukrm.org>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> >It's fab. I love it, wife and child love it, all of child's friends
> >> >think it's way cool, a zillion other reasons.
> >> >
> >> >You obviously don't like it. Is this because it doesn't look like other
> >> >cars?
> >>
> >> It *is* an ugly sonovabitchin vehicle, having said that, it also, on
> >
> >No it isn't. It's just different.
> >
>
<snarl>
> IMO, too, it is rather ugly. It does look as though it has lots of
> space on the inside though. And I suppose that if one is in the car it
> saves having to look at it. :-/
If all cars were like the Multipla, and then someone came up with a
design like, say, a De Tomaso Mangusta[1], people would all go "Yuck.
And not very practical".
Lots of people love tha Multipla. They're just vastly outnumbered by
the hordes that don't get it :o)
[1]http://www.ida.liu.se/~g-robek/interests-Mangusta01_id.jpg
Champ
er, only from TOG, some 12 hours before your post
Platypus
>
> Platypus <plat...@ukrm.org> illuminated our benighted existence with
> these words of wisdom:
>
>
> That's pretty. Wonder if I could fit the kids in that? ;-)
It's a 2-seater, thinly-disguised race car. And seriously not to be
taken out in the rain - think VMax on Speedmasters...
If you want a nice Italian with a couple of extra chairs, a Maserati
Indy or Lamborghini Islero might do the job.
--
Platypus
VN800 Drifter "The Comfy Chair"
DIABTCOOD#2 GPOTHUF#19
BOTAFOS#6 BOTAFOT#89
BOB#1 SBS#35
Platy's track du jour: Steely Dan "Doctor Wu"