Do winter tyres go on sale?

[Adam Funk]

I'm thinking of getting special tyres for next winter, so I don't have
to take the bus as often. Are they likely to go on sale whenever
winter ends?

[Clive George]

In previous years they've sold out during the winter and not been
available till about October. If you're lucky this year they'll have
bought more than required, in which case yes, they'll probably drop
prices. But I don't know if you'll be lucky :-)

[Adam Funk]

That figures!

[Toom Tabard]

Why would you need to fit special tyres to the bus? If I don't want to take it
as often in winter, I just don't bother catching it.

Have you tried that approach?

Toom

[Adam Funk]

Ha ha. I've been a bit nervous about cycling in icy conditions since
I had an unpleasant accident a few years ago, so I sometimes get the
bus to work sometimes instead of cycling. I think winter tyres might
help with the physics & the psychology.

[Ian Jackson]

In article <9bpd2ax...@news.ducksburg.com>,

Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
>Ha ha. I've been a bit nervous about cycling in icy conditions since
>I had an unpleasant accident a few years ago, so I sometimes get the
>bus to work sometimes instead of cycling. I think winter tyres might
>help with the physics & the psychology.

Yes. Proper studded tyres are great. The downside is that they're
slow on tarmac, fairly expensive, and tricky to fit on some bikes with
narrow mudguards.

--
Ian Jackson personal email: <ijac...@chiark.greenend.org.uk>
These opinions are my own. http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~ijackson/
PGP2 key 1024R/0x23f5addb, fingerprint 5906F687 BD03ACAD 0D8E602E FCF37657

[Matthew Vernon]

ijac...@chiark.greenend.org.uk (Ian Jackson) writes:

> In article <9bpd2ax...@news.ducksburg.com>,
> Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
>>Ha ha. I've been a bit nervous about cycling in icy conditions since
>>I had an unpleasant accident a few years ago, so I sometimes get the
>>bus to work sometimes instead of cycling. I think winter tyres might
>>help with the physics & the psychology.
>
> Yes. Proper studded tyres are great. The downside is that they're
> slow on tarmac, fairly expensive, and tricky to fit on some bikes with
> narrow mudguards.

Also very noisy. I keep almost taking mine off, and then it gets cold
again!

Matthew

--
`O'-----0 `O'---. `O'---. `O'---.
\___| | \___|0-/ \___|/ \___|
| | /\ | | \ | |\ | |
The Dangers of modern veterinary life

[Clive George]

On 28/03/2013 14:55, Matthew Vernon wrote:
> ijac...@chiark.greenend.org.uk (Ian Jackson) writes:
>
>> In article <9bpd2ax...@news.ducksburg.com>,
>> Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
>>> Ha ha. I've been a bit nervous about cycling in icy conditions since
>>> I had an unpleasant accident a few years ago, so I sometimes get the
>>> bus to work sometimes instead of cycling. I think winter tyres might
>>> help with the physics & the psychology.
>>
>> Yes. Proper studded tyres are great. The downside is that they're
>> slow on tarmac, fairly expensive, and tricky to fit on some bikes with
>> narrow mudguards.
>
> Also very noisy. I keep almost taking mine off, and then it gets cold
> again!

I find it amusing the way that riding on tarmac with them sounds the
same as riding on crunchy ice on normal tyres. Well, slightly worrying
to start with...

[kimble]

On 28/03/13 14:09, Ian Jackson wrote:
> Yes. Proper studded tyres are great. The downside is that they're
> slow on tarmac, fairly expensive, and tricky to fit on some bikes with
> narrow mudguards.

They're not cheap by the standards of tyres, but once you consider the
potential cost of falling off on ice (in terms of replacing clothing /
bike components, physiotherapy bills or indeed lost earnings) they start
to look a lot more attractive. Plus they're unlikely to do serious
mileage, as you only need them for a few weeks a year (2013 being the
exception), so should last a very long time.

It's more difficult if they won't fit your bike. Narrower sizes are
available if you dig around a bit, but they're correspondingly less good
on packed snow. If you've got the space, a cheap single-speed mountain
bike for winter riding might be a reasonable solution.


Kim.
--

[Clive George]

On 28/03/2013 15:00, kimble wrote:
> On 28/03/13 14:09, Ian Jackson wrote:
>> Yes. Proper studded tyres are great. The downside is that they're
>> slow on tarmac, fairly expensive, and tricky to fit on some bikes with
>> narrow mudguards.
>
> They're not cheap by the standards of tyres, but once you consider the
> potential cost of falling off on ice (in terms of replacing clothing /
> bike components, physiotherapy bills or indeed lost earnings) they start
> to look a lot more attractive. Plus they're unlikely to do serious
> mileage, as you only need them for a few weeks a year (2013 being the
> exception), so should last a very long time.

I fell off on ice in Dec 2009, and didn't have any need to replace
clothing, bike components, nor physio bills or lost earnings. But I
still got some studded tyres, coz three months on crutches with a bust
hip is a bit crap :-)

[Toom Tabard]

Yeah, you get the last laugh. I used the buses today in severe cold and light
snow. Outward journey, the brake mechanism seized and we were stuck for
over an hour waiting for a replacement bus . Inward journey, the door mechanism
seized. I might see if there a any (bike) winter tyres on sale.

Toom

[Andy Morris]

On 30/03/2013 12:29, Toom Tabard wrote:
>
> Yeah, you get the last laugh. I used the buses today in severe cold and light
> snow. Outward journey, the brake mechanism seized and we were stuck for
> over an hour waiting for a replacement bus . Inward journey, the door mechanism
> seized. I might see if there a any (bike) winter tyres on sale.

You won't need them after Tuesday, I've just ordered some of these:

http://www.nextdaytyres.co.uk/details.aspx/SCHWALBE-WINTER-ROAD-700/244

So it will be warm and sunny till November

--
Andy Morris
Andy dot Jinkas at Googlemail

[Adam Funk]

On 2013-03-28, Matthew Vernon wrote:

> ijac...@chiark.greenend.org.uk (Ian Jackson) writes:
>
>> In article <9bpd2ax...@news.ducksburg.com>,
>> Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
>>>Ha ha. I've been a bit nervous about cycling in icy conditions since
>>>I had an unpleasant accident a few years ago, so I sometimes get the
>>>bus to work sometimes instead of cycling. I think winter tyres might
>>>help with the physics & the psychology.
>>
>> Yes. Proper studded tyres are great. The downside is that they're
>> slow on tarmac, fairly expensive, and tricky to fit on some bikes with
>> narrow mudguards.
>
> Also very noisy. I keep almost taking mine off, and then it gets cold
> again!

Any recommendations? I use Marathons (not Plus, which I've heard are
hard to get on & off the wheels) now; I had to adjust my mudguards a
little when I switched to them. My commute is about 6 km each way.

[Ian Jackson]

In article <4p3r2ax...@news.ducksburg.com>,
Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:

>> ijac...@chiark.greenend.org.uk (Ian Jackson) writes:
>>> Yes. Proper studded tyres are great. The downside is that they're
>>> slow on tarmac, fairly expensive, and tricky to fit on some bikes with
>>> narrow mudguards.

...

>Any recommendations? I use Marathons (not Plus, which I've heard are
>hard to get on & off the wheels) now; I had to adjust my mudguards a
>little when I switched to them. My commute is about 6 km each way.

I have a pair of Nokian A10s. I normally only bother swapping the
front unless things get really bad (which happens practically never in
Cambridge). I think they're nominally 32mm wide and they just about
fit. In the dry the moulding flash hairs thrum almost inaudibly
against the mudguard...

[Matthew Vernon]

Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> writes:

> Any recommendations? I use Marathons (not Plus, which I've heard are
> hard to get on & off the wheels) now; I had to adjust my mudguards a
> little when I switched to them. My commute is about 6 km each way.

I have Nokkian A10s, which fit on my Super Galaxy without needing to
fettle the mudguards. I keep almost removing them, then we have another
freeze or a dump of snow on the hills.

[Adam Lea]

On 28/03/13 14:09, Ian Jackson wrote:

> In article<9bpd2ax...@news.ducksburg.com>,
> Adam Funk<a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
>> Ha ha. I've been a bit nervous about cycling in icy conditions since
>> I had an unpleasant accident a few years ago, so I sometimes get the
>> bus to work sometimes instead of cycling. I think winter tyres might

>> help with the physics& the psychology.

>
> Yes. Proper studded tyres are great. The downside is that they're
> slow on tarmac, fairly expensive, and tricky to fit on some bikes with
> narrow mudguards.
>

And in the case of Marathon Winters, they don't work well in more than a
couple of inches of snow.

[Jaimie Vandenbergh]

On Fri, 05 Apr 2013 23:20:50 +0100, Adam Lea <lea...@btinternet.com>
wrote:

Not sure anything could, really. They're ice-gripping tyres more than
snow-shifting tyres.

Cheers - Jaimie
--
"The problem with defending the purity of the English language is that English
is about as pure as a cribhouse whore. We don't just borrow words; on occasion,
English has pursued other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious
and rifle their pockets for new vocabulary." -- James Nicoll, rasfw

[Clive George]

On 06/04/2013 10:38, Jaimie Vandenbergh wrote:

>> And in the case of Marathon Winters, they don't work well in more than a
>> couple of inches of snow.
>
> Not sure anything could, really. They're ice-gripping tyres more than
> snow-shifting tyres.

Snow spikers? Big rubber knobblies with studs in some of them.

I had an exciting moment crossing a lump of knobbly ice at speed on
marathon winters, but fortunately it was quite short so when I hit the
tarmac on the other side the bike righted itself again.

[Adam Funk]

On 2013-04-02, Ian Jackson wrote:

> In article <4p3r2ax...@news.ducksburg.com>,
> Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
>>> ijac...@chiark.greenend.org.uk (Ian Jackson) writes:
>>>> Yes. Proper studded tyres are great. The downside is that they're
>>>> slow on tarmac, fairly expensive, and tricky to fit on some bikes with
>>>> narrow mudguards.
> ...
>>Any recommendations? I use Marathons (not Plus, which I've heard are
>>hard to get on & off the wheels) now; I had to adjust my mudguards a
>>little when I switched to them. My commute is about 6 km each way.
>
> I have a pair of Nokian A10s. I normally only bother swapping the
> front unless things get really bad (which happens practically never in
> Cambridge). I think they're nominally 32mm wide and they just about
> fit. In the dry the moulding flash hairs thrum almost inaudibly
> against the mudguard...

(Sorry, I've been sitting on this one for a while. No snow since I
raised the question.)

So it's useful just to put a winter tyre on the front? That would
save a lot of effort & expense; also ISTR that when I last changed
tyres I had to fiddle with the back mudguard a bit but not the front
one.

[Ian Jackson]

In article <cq8h6ax...@news.ducksburg.com>,

Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com> wrote:
>On 2013-04-02, Ian Jackson wrote:
>>I have a pair of Nokian A10s. I normally only bother swapping the
>>front unless things get really bad (which happens practically never in
>>Cambridge). I think they're nominally 32mm wide and they just about
>>fit. In the dry the moulding flash hairs thrum almost inaudibly
>>against the mudguard...

...

>So it's useful just to put a winter tyre on the front?

I've found it so. I've got good balance and I can normally survive a
rear wheel skid - and of course I'm not neeming about in icy
conditions, so the resulting lack of control over direction is less of
a problem. I've cycled on sheet ice with studs on only the front.

I would say it's certainly worth trying.

[Danny Colyer]

On 17/05/2013 10:15, Adam Funk wrote:
> On 2013-04-02, Ian Jackson wrote:
>> I have a pair of Nokian A10s. I normally only bother swapping the
>> front unless things get really bad (which happens practically never in
>> Cambridge).
>

> So it's useful just to put a winter tyre on the front? That would
> save a lot of effort & expense; also ISTR that when I last changed
> tyres I had to fiddle with the back mudguard a bit but not the front
> one.

I would say not, although I should point out that I haven't actually
tried them on an upright bike. The point of winter tyres is improved
traction - if I don't have that on the back wheel then I'm not going
anywhere. And as for the grip to stop me sliding around, well, on a SWB
recumbent at least, a front wheel slide is much easier to recover from
than a rear wheel slide (I repeat, I haven't tried them on an upright bike).

--
Danny Colyer
"I'm riding a unicycle with my pants down. This should be every boy's
dream." - Bartholomew J Simpson

[kimble]

On 21/05/13 08:35, Danny Colyer wrote:
> I would say not, although I should point out that I haven't actually
> tried them on an upright bike. The point of winter tyres is improved
> traction - if I don't have that on the back wheel then I'm not going
> anywhere.

This is certainly the case on a tadpole trike, which works surprisingly
well with a single winter tyre on the rear (drive) wheel. Even with
just front wheel braking, which isn't actually a problem at the sort of
speeds you're likely to achieve in conditions that actually require a
winter tyre for traction (though obviously a rear brake helps). The
limiting factor becomes one of small wheels vs rutted re-frozen snow.

> And as for the grip to stop me sliding around, well, on a SWB
> recumbent at least, a front wheel slide is much easier to recover from
> than a rear wheel slide (I repeat, I haven't tried them on an upright
> bike).

Really? I have to strongly disagree. While I was delighted to discover
that a loss of front wheel traction on the Streetmachine was something
you *could* sometimes recover from (whereas on a DF it's pretty much
guaranteed to end in a fall), I find that as with an upright, it's still
much easier to control rear-wheel skids (especially if you sit up in the
seat so you can shift your weight around in anticipation of poor traction).

That said, while I've ridden it on mud and loose gravel, I tend to stick
to the hybrid (with two winter tyres where necessary) in winter, if only
because an aluminium frame and cheaper components (not least the amount
of chain involved) are a better match for salty slush.


Kim.
--

[Adam Funk]

On 2013-05-21, kimble wrote:

> On 21/05/13 08:35, Danny Colyer wrote:
>> I would say not, although I should point out that I haven't actually
>> tried them on an upright bike. The point of winter tyres is improved
>> traction - if I don't have that on the back wheel then I'm not going
>> anywhere.
>
> This is certainly the case on a tadpole trike, which works surprisingly
> well with a single winter tyre on the rear (drive) wheel. Even with
> just front wheel braking, which isn't actually a problem at the sort of
> speeds you're likely to achieve in conditions that actually require a
> winter tyre for traction (though obviously a rear brake helps). The
> limiting factor becomes one of small wheels vs rutted re-frozen snow.

...

> That said, while I've ridden it on mud and loose gravel, I tend to stick
> to the hybrid (with two winter tyres where necessary) in winter, if only
> because an aluminium frame and cheaper components (not least the amount
> of chain involved) are a better match for salty slush.

I just looked up some tadpole trike illustrations on the WWW. Holy
moly, that's a lot of chain! Do you mind if I ask how much a new
chain costs?

[Dave Larrington]

On 23/05/2013 13:30, Adam Funk wrote:

> I just looked up some tadpole trike illustrations on the WWW. Holy
> moly, that's a lot of chain! Do you mind if I ask how much a new
> chain costs?

They usually require about three standard-length chains.


--
Dave Larrington
<http://www.legslarry.beerdrinkers.co.uk>
(You're fired - Ed).

[Mike Causer]

On Thu, 23 May 2013 13:35:55 +0100
Dave Larrington <nos...@interllama.org.uk> wrote:

> > I just looked up some tadpole trike illustrations on the WWW. Holy
> > moly, that's a lot of chain! Do you mind if I ask how much a new
> > chain costs?
>
> They usually require about three standard-length chains.

And at e.g. the Mildenhall Rally, chains can be bought on offer at five for
about the price of two. Is it Francis Thurmer who does that jam-packed
parts tent? In fact it's double-jam-packed, once with parts and again
with people buying them. Tadpole trikes and SWB 'bents have a further
advantage of not having a/the front wheel heaving grinding-paste at the
chain too, so they stay much cleaner and last longer.


Mike

[kimble]

On 23/05/13 13:35, Dave Larrington wrote:
> On 23/05/2013 13:30, Adam Funk wrote:
>> I just looked up some tadpole trike illustrations on the WWW. Holy
>> moly, that's a lot of chain! Do you mind if I ask how much a new
>> chain costs?
>
> They usually require about three standard-length chains.

More like 2.5 with my legs...

Recumbent riders know to stockpile chains when particularly good deals
come up.


Kim.
--

[Danny Colyer]

And to make sure they buy the same kind of chain every time.

FWIW a SRAM PC-991 chain comes with 114 links and my chain is 266 links
(exactly 2 1/3 chains) long.

I quite fancy the idea of a front wheel drive bike just for the weight
reduction resulting from the shorter chain.

[David Damerell]

Quoting Adam Funk <a24...@ducksburg.com>:
>So it's useful just to put a winter tyre on the front? That would
>save a lot of effort & expense; also ISTR that when I last changed
>tyres I had to fiddle with the back mudguard a bit but not the front
>one.

Yes. The front tyre keeps you falling over (by balancing the bike
normally); on sheet ice the lack of rear studs can be vexing (loss of
traction, tendency to slip down the camber) but it's much less likely to
result in a prang. I've ridden at least one bad winter with front studs
alone.
--
David Damerell <dame...@chiark.greenend.org.uk> Kill the tomato!
Today is Teleute, June.
Tomorrow will be Oneiros, June.