Something practical
Adam Del-Monte
I've tried countless of things. The major thing that improves my quality of
life are regular 30 min rests and pacing.
One strange thing I have found to help my brain fog in the short term is a
small glass of red wine. It all started at the new years eve party before
last. I had probably for the first time in getting CFS got drunk (on
Champagne :-), not in a binge way, but pleasantly over the course of a few
hours (with rests in between!) I found that my brain fog was a lot less
severe than I expected it to be when chatting away to people (I was
celebrating at a friends home).
Over the past year I have run 'mini' experiments when socialising, at the
dinner table or in the pub and tried beer too (even a small amount makes
things worse for me). So now when I go out socialising I mostly slowly sip a
small glass of red wine over the maximum two hours I can normally socialise.
I know that if I hadn't drunk the wine by the end of the two hours listening
and talking, my head would be hurting bad and by brain would be replaced
with a pot of glue. With that small glass of red wine, usually, I'm just
fairly fuzzed.
For me, this improves my quality life that little bit. Just thought I would
share my experiences with the rest of the group. Just to confirm, I'm no way
advocating drinking lots of alcohol as a way to forget the problems
associated with CFS. In fact, for most of my adult live I've not really been
into drinking. I've just found that a small amount (a glass) of red wine
sipped slowly helps my fuzz when socialising.
I'm guessing this works on two levels, one it relaxes me a small amount, so
I'm less concerned about the fuzz, which I know actually starts up a
feedback loop of fuzziness. I've learnt in the past (before my wine
experiments) I can 'go for longer' with talking to people if when chatting I
don't get het-up by the fact that I'm thinking less well. If I just 'let go'
of the issues I have, of my need to feel that I'm intelligent, of the need
to feel that I am actually fully understanding every dynamic of this
conversation, I'm able to stay with my talking partner for longer and, to
some extent, retain a level of fuzziness that enables me to have a decent
conversation. I see this working because the concern about not being able to
think so clearly and trying harder actually makes the fuzz worse. And the
more fuzzed I become, the worse my concerns are which exacerbates my fuzz.
I think this factor is the minor point about the glass of red wine, I also
believe something else is going on physiologically, I've become very good
and letting go of my need to concentrate wonderfully and the effect of the
wine seems to be stronger that just that. This is where my guess work comes
into play, it could be the alcohol dilating brain vessels and improve blood
flow, it could be alcohol kick starting my liver to detox more, who knows!
In fact, that would be interesting - does anyone have any thoughts on this?
Well, I think I've typed far too much for a Saturday morning, off now to
think about what I can do before my next rest.
All the best,
- Adam.
icarusi
news:38b3b7F...@individual.net...
> For me, this improves my quality life that little bit. Just thought I
would
> share my experiences with the rest of the group. Just to confirm, I'm no
way
> advocating drinking lots of alcohol as a way to forget the problems
> associated with CFS. In fact, for most of my adult live I've not really
been
> into drinking. I've just found that a small amount (a glass) of red wine
> sipped slowly helps my fuzz when socialising.
Funnily enough I won a bottle of Californian red in a recent raffle. I'm not
a wine drinker, my prefered tipples are whisky or strong lager (or Woods 100
rum much less often) but I only have a single can or small glass of whisky
which I 'spin out' over 90 mins - 2 hrs. My digestion has been a bit iffy
recently so as a precaution I've laid off booze completely. So it was a good
chance to try the alternative of wine. I poured a glass of the red and
although it was labelled 'soft fruity' (Blossom Hill) it still tasted quite
acidic to me, in the same way of black tea etc. I poured it into a tumbler
probably slightly less than 1/3 pint and it's ABV is 13%. I was quite
surprised how tipsy it made me feel compared to the whisky or lager. I don't
think it ever would be my preferred tipple but it regularly gets good press
so I should probably give it a try more often and see if I can detect any
benefits.
Icarusi
--
remove the 00 to reply
Serena Blanchflower
> One strange thing I have found to help my brain fog in the short term is a
> small glass of red wine. It all started at the new years eve party before
> last. I had probably for the first time in getting CFS got drunk (on
> Champagne :-), not in a binge way, but pleasantly over the course of a few
> hours (with rests in between!) I found that my brain fog was a lot less
> severe than I expected it to be when chatting away to people (I was
> celebrating at a friends home).
Unfortunately, it doesn't work like that for me. Even when I can
tolerate alcohol, it saps any energy I have, so I have to be very
restrained, if I want to enjoy myself. Recently, I've found red wine
in particular (one of my favourite drinks) to aggravate my digestion,
so I can't tolerate it at all :(
--
Cheers, Serena
You can't be brave if you've only had wonderful things happen to you
(Mary Tyler Moore)
Hampshire Friends with ME website: <www.geocities.com/hantsmefriends>
Adam Del-Monte
> tolerate alcohol, it saps any energy I have, so I have to be very
> restrained, if I want to enjoy myself. Recently, I've found red wine
> in particular (one of my favourite drinks) to aggravate my digestion,
> so I can't tolerate it at all :(
Wow, we are all so very different. I feel sorry for anyone trying to fathom
the cause/treatment of CFS!
ttfn,
- Adam
Hayek
Piece of cake, from where I stand !
Even Spencer's "Forced Hostel Diet" explains to me
why his situation did not become worse.
Actually, eggs, spam and blackpudding are better for
cfs/me sufferers than lean muscle-meat.
Uwe Hayek.
Clair Louise Coult
I am one of the few who can tolerate alcohol and I've found a little
every now and then can be beneficial. It relaxes me just enough to take
the edge off some of the pain but I have to be careful. I like red wine
but it has a tendency to irritate my bowels. White wine is better but I
like European lager the best. Budvar (the proper Budweiser!) is my
favourite, but only in moderation of course!
In message <42225b34$0$28981$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl>, Hayek
<hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> writes
>Adam Del-Monte wrote:
>> Wow, we are all so very different. I feel sorry
>> for anyone trying to fathom the cause/treatment
>> of CFS!
>
>Piece of cake, from where I stand !
>
>Even Spencer's "Forced Hostel Diet" explains to me
>why his situation did not become worse.
>
>Actually, eggs, spam and blackpudding are better for
>cfs/me sufferers than lean muscle-meat.
So Uwe Hayek, why do you think foods containing animal derived saturated
fats are better for people with ME?
I am interested in your theory, in fact I have a few questions. I asked
them before in another thread but you must have missed them. Would you
mind answering them for me please? Sorry if you find it boring but if
you've been helping people with ME/CFS I'm sure you'll have answered
questions like this before.
What is your name?
What is the name of your business?
What is the cause of ME?
How do you cure it?
Who manufacturers your cure? (You told us is comprises of
pharmaceutical grade ingredients but not who produces it for you.)
What are the ingredients of your cure? (If you sell supplements aren't
you required to specify the ingredients by law?)
Are there any known side effects or contraindications for you cure?
You have anecdotal evidence that your cure works. What scientific
evidence do you have?
Can you provide us with testimonial statements from some of the people
you have cured?
Would any of the people you cured be willing to answer our questions
here on this newsgroup?
Could you give us a statements from any doctors or other health
professionals who could vouch for the effectiveness of your cure?
Thank you.
*Clair*
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Clair Coult cl...@dunmani.co.uk
http://www.dunmani.co.uk
Worksop, Nottinghamshire, UK
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hayek
Unpronouncable.
> What is the name of your business?
Find me a good one and get a large reward.
> What is the cause of ME?
I am 100 % sure that I know it.
For now, it is my trade secret.
In less than 5 years, I will publish it,
when 95% of the people are cured.
> How do you cure it?
With the correct nutrients.
I saw in a spam mail the name "nutraceuticals".
> Who manufacturers your cure? (You told us is comprises of
> pharmaceutical grade ingredients but not who produces it for you.)
There are several manufacturers. They supply to
pharmacies all over Europe.
> What are the ingredients of your cure? (If you sell supplements aren't
> you required to specify the ingredients by law?)
I do not sell supplements, I offer therapy.
What is your motivation btw ? Do you want to prevent
this cure reaching CFS/me sufferers ?
>
> Are there any known side effects or contraindications for you cure?
I think it is about as safe as a "nutraceutical" can
get. Vitamin C is more dangerous.
Doing nothing about your nutritional deficiency is
actually more dangerous. Not only for you but also
for your children. If you do not have enough of
these nutrients, your breast milk also lacks them.
And these nutrients are extremely important for life
that develops. I gave them to a completely starved
stray kitten that I adopted, and now it's supercat.
Muscular, energetic, bright and shiny fur.
> You have anecdotal evidence that your cure works. What scientific
> evidence do you have?
"an anecdote" proves nothing, 150 "anecdotes" are
scientific evidence.
> Can you provide us with testimonial statements from some of the people
> you have cured?
Yes. You can even meet them.
> Would any of the people you cured be willing to answer our questions
> here on this newsgroup?
That can be arranged.
> Could you give us a statements from any doctors or other health
> professionals who could vouch for the effectiveness of your cure?
Do you know of any doctors or other health
professionals that can cure cfs/me ?
> Thank you.
You're Welcome !
Uwe Hayek.
Notime
Unpronouncable.
> What is the name of your business?
Find me a good one and get a large reward.
> What is the cause of ME?
I am 100 % sure that I know it.
For now, it is my trade secret.
In less than 5 years, I will publish it,
when 95% of the people are cured.
> How do you cure it?
With the correct nutrients.
I saw in a spam mail the name "nutraceuticals".
> Who manufacturers your cure? (You told us is comprises of
> pharmaceutical grade ingredients but not who produces it for you.)
There are several manufacturers. They supply to
pharmacies all over Europe.
> What are the ingredients of your cure? (If you sell supplements aren't
> you required to specify the ingredients by law?)
I do not sell supplements, I offer therapy.
What is your motivation btw ? Do you want to prevent
this cure reaching CFS/me sufferers ?
>
> Are there any known side effects or contraindications for you cure?
I think it is about as safe as a "nutraceutical" can
get. Vitamin C is more dangerous.
Doing nothing about your nutritional deficiency is
actually more dangerous. Not only for you but also
for your children. If you do not have enough of
these nutrients, your breast milk also lacks them.
And these nutrients are extremely important for life
that develops. I gave them to a completely starved
stray kitten that I adopted, and now it's supercat.
Muscular, energetic, bright and shiny fur.
> You have anecdotal evidence that your cure works. What scientific
> evidence do you have?
"an anecdote" proves nothing, 150 "anecdotes" are
scientific evidence.
> Can you provide us with testimonial statements from some of the people
> you have cured?
Yes. You can even meet them.
> Would any of the people you cured be willing to answer our questions
> here on this newsgroup?
That can be arranged.
> Could you give us a statements from any doctors or other health
> professionals who could vouch for the effectiveness of your cure?
Do you know of any doctors or other health
professionals that can cure cfs/me ?
> Thank you.
You're Welcome !
Uwe Hayek.
> *Clair*
Serena Blanchflower
> Do you know of any doctors or other health
> professionals that can cure cfs/me ?
No, but I've seen all too many who claim that they can: with no more
evidence for the assertion than you have produced.
--
Cheers, Serena
Experience is not what happens to you, it is what you do with what
happens to you. (Aldous Huxley)
Clair Louise Coult
I know you say your intention is to cure everyone of ME/CFS but do you
realise how ridiculous you sound?
I know the cause of ME/CFS and I have a 100 percent effective cure, all
you have to do is give me thousands of Euros. I will not tell you my
name, I do not have a business, I do not have a website with more
information, all I will tell you is my mobile number and a bank account
number.
I will not tell you what the cause is. I will not tell you what the
treatment is and I will not tell you the name of the company who
manufactures it. I will tell you that I have cured 150 people but only
offer statements from them if you agree to travel hundreds of miles
overseas.
If you ask questions I will be evasive and I will not give you a
straight answer. I will reply with more questions and links to
irrelevant websites. I will criticise you and blame the lack of my
success on your apathy. I will accuse you of wanting to remain ill if
you do not put your trust in me.
I don't know of any sane person who would go for that!
I do want to believe you but you are making it very hard for me.
Everything you have said still make me suspicious. If you were a
professional person with a valuable asset to market you would not be
afraid of giving your name or answering questions. From your attitude
and behaviour on this group it looks like you are more interested in
causing controversy and arguing with people rather than promoting your
cure.
There are many other people who claim to be able to treat ME/CFS. They
have websites which give the names of the people who discovered and are
selling the treatment. They explain the theory behind their treatment,
saying how and why it works and what the ingredients are. They answer
people's questions and they show written testimonial statements from
people they have successfully treated. Why can't you do this?
Please do not take offence at my comments, I do not want to fight you.
I ask questions because I want to understand. I make criticisms if I
don't think something is right and I make suggestions to try and help
you. This is a support group after all. If you are evasive and
aggressive then people are not likely to trust you, if you are open and
honest then people are more likely to believe you. Please be honest
with us, show us we can believe what you say.
Hayek
> Uwe Hayek
>
> I know you say your intention is to cure everyone
> of ME/CFS but do you realise how ridiculous you
> sound?
This is not about sounding ridiculous or not.
> I know the cause of ME/CFS and I have a 100
> percent effective cure, all you have to do is
> give me thousands of Euros. I will not tell you
> my name, I do not have a business, I do not have
> a website with more information, all I will tell
> you is my mobile number and a bank account
> number.
Before one starts a bussiness, one looks for people
who are intrested to invest. It happpens all the
time. Look at Netscape, look at Apple.
>
> I will not tell you what the cause is. I will
> not tell you what the treatment is and I will not
> tell you the name of the company who manufactures
> it. I will tell you that I have cured 150 people
> but only offer statements from them if you agree
> to travel hundreds of miles overseas.
I can put many statements here. You would not
believe them. That is why I offered to meet them in
person. Then you probably think I hypnotised them,
or that they are take a part of the con or scam.
> If you ask questions I will be evasive and I will
> not give you a straight answer. I will reply
> with more questions and links to irrelevant
> websites. I will criticise you and blame the
> lack of my success on your apathy. I will accuse
> you of wanting to remain ill if you do not put
> your trust in me.
As such is the case. If you do not trust the one guy
coming up with the real cure, you stay ill. My cure
is not to blame, your scepticism is, then.
> I don't know of any sane person who would go for
> that!
It makes an intresting story. But not more
intresting than :
from
http://www.theperthgroup.com/FAQ/question1.html
quote
This apparently disarming question has an apparently
disarming answer. Which is "Why not?" The history
of science is replete with examples where the
majority of scientists have been proven wrong.
Especially in medicine. One need look no further
than the opposition experienced by William Harvey
[1] (circulation of the blood), Ignaz Semmelweiss
(antisepsis before the discovery of bacteria), Louis
Pasteur (fermentation versus spontaneous
generation), James Lind and Gilbert Blane (scurvy is
a deficiency disease [2]), Joseph Goldberger
(pellagra not an infectious disease) [3].
[]
1. In 1628, in chapter 8 of his book "De Motu
Cordis" (On the motion of the heart), Harvey
presciently wrote: "What remains to be said upon
the quantity and source of the blood...is of a
character so novel and unheard-of that I not only
fear injury to myself from the envy of a few, but I
tremble lest I have mankind at large for my
enemies". This has a familiar ring.
2. James Lind was the eighteenth century Scottish
naval physician who in 1753 published A Treatise on
the Scurvy. This was completely ignored by the
Royal Navy. In the preface to the Treatise he
wrote: "It appeared to me a subject of the
strictest inquiry: and I was led upon this occasion
to consult several authors who had treated of the
disease; where I perceived mistakes which have been
attended in practice, with dangerous and fatal
consequences. There appeared to me an evident
necessity of rectifying those errors, on account of
the pernicious effects they have already visibly
produced. But it is no easy matter to root out old
prejudices, or to overturn opinions which have
acquired an establishment by time, custom, and great
authorities; it became therefore requisite for this
purpose, to exhibit a full and impartial view of
what has thitherto been published on the scurvy, and
that in a chronological order, by which the sources
of those mistakes may be detected. Indeed, before
this subject could be set in a clear and proper
light, it was necessary to remove a great deal of
rubbish". In 1795, 42 years after the Treatise, Sir
Gilbert Blane finally persuaded the British
Admiralty to issue a daily ration of lemon juice to
all sailors, virtually eliminating scurvy from the
British Navy.
UNQUOTE
> I do want to believe you but you are making it
> very hard for me. Everything you have said still
> make me suspicious. If you were a professional
> person with a valuable asset to market you would
> not be afraid of giving your name or answering
> questions.
I am a person which life was and still is completely
destroyed by cfs. The Belgian government is one of
the harshest on cfs, no benefits WHATSOEVER, zero,
zilch, nil, null, in 25 years. And I never even knew
I had cfs, because I suffered from it since the age
of 10. When I was 40 I accidently took sporanox, and
sort of awoke. The Belgian government kept and still
keeps taxing me 9000 pound yearly, altough I had no
income since 1990. I have to go into hiding, or they
will even impound this crummy 120 pound second hand
laptop I am typing on. They compare me with a
healthy IT professional, and tax along.
> From your attitude and behaviour on this group it
> looks like you are more interested in causing
> controversy and arguing with people rather than
> promoting your cure.
I have an attitude ? That looks very different from
my side.
> There are many other people who claim to be able
> to treat ME/CFS.
Yes, and knowing what I know, they really sound
ridiculous.
> They have websites which give the names of the
> people who discovered and are selling the
> treatment. They explain the theory behind their
> treatment, saying how and why it works and what
> the ingredients are. They answer people's
> questions and they show written testimonial
> statements from people they have successfully
> treated. Why can't you do this?
I did this on the Dutch cfs forum
news:nl.support.chronisch-ziek.me-cvs-cfs
and they compared me with tell-sell, television
sales company that uses video testimonials. Are
these testimonials real ? I can say for shure that
the people I helped gave me real answers, looked
more energetic, some of them went back to demanding
jobs, some where able to stay in demanding jobs.
I do not believe these tell-sell testimonials,
unless I meet the people in real life. And that is
what I did.
Yesterday I went to upgrade this laptop to 256 mb,
it cost me 27,5 Euros. The laptop switches faster
between programs and is more usable, I can do more
in that one hour of battery life. I talk to the
memory guy, and tell him I am quitting IT and will
sell therapy for fatigue. He tells me he is always
tired, sleeps 10 hours, and is still tired in the
morning. His name is Maarten and runs a computer
memory wholesale shop in Antwerp.
Then I take a taxi and Wim, the taxi driver tells me
he does not have any private life anymore, he is too
tired to do anything at home, he barely can drive
taxi anymore, tries to do his 8 hours a day, but can
no longer cope with it. Two more successes at the
horizon, but it does not add up. These people pay
the Belgian government about 900 pounds health
insurance each month, and have very little money
left to pay me anything to get better. Its a crazy
world.
> Please do not take offence at my comments, I do
> not want to fight you. I ask questions because I
> want to understand. I make criticisms if I don't
> think something is right and I make suggestions
> to try and help you. This is a support group
> after all. If you are evasive and aggressive
> then people are not likely to trust you, if you
> are open and honest then people are more likely
> to believe you. Please be honest with us, show
> us we can believe what you say.
I e-mailed Ingeborg
http://www.borgofspace.com/E_index.htm
with the message to try my cure.
She did not answer me.
Too good to be true ?
Today a person called me and said : "It *IS A
MIRACLE CURE* godammit!"
You better believe it.
He was sceptical too, he had a wound that did not
heal after surgery, now 4(!) years ago. He started
on sunday 10 days ago, his wound is already half
healed now, and he can use that leg again. He used
it more like a walking stick than as a leg, he tells me.
And of course, now he wakes up in the morning at
7am, and does not feel a bit tired anymore.
He owns a tabacco shop, tobacco88 or something, in
Zeebrugge. I can give you the correct URL in the
next post.
Uwe Hayek.
Jeremy C B Nicoll
Hayek <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> wrote:
> The Belgian government kept and still keeps taxing me 9000 pound
> yearly, altough I had no income since 1990. I have to go into hiding,
> or they will even impound this crummy 120 pound second hand laptop I
> am typing on. They compare me with a healthy IT professional, and tax
> along.
Maybe the laws are different here, but regardless of what they compare
you with, surely they can only tax your income? If you have no income
how can they tax that non-existent money?
--
Jeremy C B Nicoll - my opinions are my own.
Hayek
They just do.
25% of the people voted for the nationalist party.
I could not even vote. Altough no judge ever
sentenced me to that, it is all in the bureaucratic
powers.
Uwe Hayek.
Peter Parry
wrote:
>Before one starts a bussiness, one looks for people
>who are intrested to invest. It happpens all the
>time. Look at Netscape, look at Apple.
To attract investors you produce a prospectus which explains (in
verifiable detail) what you are planning and the theory behind it.
If you are going to sell a new paint you describe the innovative
chemistry and why it is going to be a world beater.
If you say "hey - got this neat idea, not going to say anything about
it - but throw money my way" you shouldn't expect too much.
>I can put many statements here. You would not
>believe them.
If they are not supported by rational theories or verifiable research
you are absolutely correct.
>Then you probably think I hypnotised them,
>or that they are take a part of the con or scam.
Correct.
>As such is the case. If you do not trust the one guy
> coming up with the real cure, you stay ill. My cure
>is not to blame, your scepticism is, then.
You have as much chance of having found a cure as the moon has of
being made of green cheese. You have no cure.
>ly disarming question has an apparently
>disarming answer. Which is "Why not?" The history
>of science is replete with examples where the
>majority of scientists have been proven wrong.
Unfortunately the example you choose is horsefeathers.
>I am a person which life was and still is completely
> destroyed by cfs.
I thought your cure was 100% effective?
>The Belgian government is one of
>the harshest on cfs, no benefits WHATSOEVER, zero,
You are cured - why do you need them?
>The Belgian government kept and still
>keeps taxing me 9000 pound yearly, altough I had no
>income since 1990.
You really expect anyone to believe this?
>Yes, and knowing what I know, they really sound
>ridiculous.
So, unfortunately, do you so far.
>You better believe it.
Without some sensible proof why should anyone believe what you say?
>He was sceptical too, he had a wound that did not
>heal after surgery, now 4(!) years ago. He started
>on sunday 10 days ago, his wound is already half
>healed now,
Precisely what ailments do you consider this nostrum can treat in
addition to CFS/ME?
--
Peter Parry.
http://www.wpp.ltd.uk/
Jeremy C B Nicoll
Peter Parry <pe...@wpp.ltd.uk> wrote:
> Precisely what ailments do you consider this nostrum can treat in
> addition to CFS/ME?
Or, are there any ailments which it will not help?
Hayek
> On Wed, 02 Mar 2005 18:14:58 +0100, Hayek
> <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> wrote:
>
>
>> Before one starts a bussiness, one looks for
>> people who are intrested to invest. It happpens
>> all the time. Look at Netscape, look at Apple.
>
>
> To attract investors you produce a prospectus
> which explains (in verifiable detail) what you
> are planning and the theory behind it. If you are
> going to sell a new paint you describe the
> innovative chemistry and why it is going to be a
> world beater.
>
> If you say "hey - got this neat idea, not going
> to say anything about it - but throw money my
> way" you shouldn't expect too much.
You are much too far, you are talking about an ipo.
When you gou public with part of the shares.
For Google there was quite some time between A & B.
IPO=Initial Public Offering.
>
>> I can put many statements here. You would not
>> believe them.
>
>
> If they are not supported by rational theories or
> verifiable research you are absolutely correct.
They are. And the results are too.
>
>> Then you probably think I hypnotised them, or
>> that they are take a part of the con or scam.
>
>
> Correct.
I rest my case.
>
>> As such is the case. If you do not trust the
>> one guy coming up with the real cure, you stay
>> ill. My cure is not to blame, your scepticism
>> is, then.
>
>
> You have as much chance of having found a cure as
> the moon has of being made of green cheese. You
> have no cure.
I heard that argument before.
I found this cure by throwing all the dogma's
overboard and just seeing the facts. And a very
small bit of luck.
>
>> ly disarming question has an apparently
>> disarming answer. Which is "Why not?" The
>> history of science is replete with examples
>> where the majority of scientists have been
>> proven wrong.
>
>
> Unfortunately the example you choose is
> horsefeathers.
It says "replete". Add one more.
>
>> I am a person which life was and still is
>> completely destroyed by cfs.
>
>
> I thought your cure was 100% effective?
It does not cure broken family & friendship bonds.
>
>> The Belgian government is one of the harshest
>> on cfs, no benefits WHATSOEVER, zero,
>
>
> You are cured - why do you need them?
How do you make up for 25 years of practically no
income ?
>> The Belgian government kept and still keeps
>> taxing me 9000 pound yearly, altough I had no
>> income since 1990.
>
>
> You really expect anyone to believe this?
You have this problem with truth.
>
>> Yes, and knowing what I know, they really sound
>> ridiculous.
>
>
> So, unfortunately, do you so far.
>
>
>> You better believe it.
>
>
> Without some sensible proof why should anyone
> believe what you say?
You would only believe a con-artist. Good luck.
>> He was sceptical too, he had a wound that did
>> not heal after surgery, now 4(!) years ago. He
>> started on sunday 10 days ago, his wound is
>> already half healed now,
>
>
> Precisely what ailments do you consider this
> nostrum can treat in addition to CFS/ME?
I am still amazed everytime a report comes in.
It reactivates the immune system, and improves
health in general. Did I tell you what people report
about improved erections/sex? Rather logical, it
improves also health in general.
Health and immune system in general, is very wide.
Uwe Hayek.
Clair Louise Coult
<hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> writes
>How do you make up for 25 years of practically no
>income ?
Here's a thought.
You negotiate to sell your cure to a major pharmaceutical company for a
large sum of money plus a share option. You are instantly financially
better off, you continue to earn from your cure in the future through
the shares and you get what you want - a cure for everyone available
both privately and through national health services.
If your cure is as effective as you claim and treats such a wide range
of conditions then I'm sure someone would snap it up!
Hayek
> In message <42271f2a$0$28985$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl>, Hayek
> <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> writes
>
>>How do you make up for 25 years of practically no
>>income ?
>
>
> Here's a thought.
>
> You negotiate to sell your cure to a major pharmaceutical company for a
> large sum of money plus a share option. You are instantly financially
> better off, you continue to earn from your cure in the future through
> the shares and you get what you want - a cure for everyone available
> both privately and through national health services.
>
> If your cure is as effective as you claim and treats such a wide range
Claire, you are very naīve.
End of the seventies, someone found a nice and easy
cure for stomach ulcers. 7 days of amoxicilline,
which patent had expired, cured any stomach ulcer.
period.
Zantac, a drug which worked as an antiacid was the
best selling drug (over all drugs) then, as a relief
for stomach ulcers. But patients had to take it for
the rest of their lives.
What do we see now ? 25 years later, most doctors
still prescribe Zantac, and do not even know the
real cause of stomach ulcers.
Zantac is still one of the best selling drugs, I
still meet people that are scheduled for surgery, to
get rid of their stomach ulcers. When I tell them
this story, they meet me with the same contempt that
I meet here.
Uwe Hayek.
Clair Louise Coult
<hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> writes
>Claire, you are very naīve.
Perhaps, but have you tried my suggestion? Then how do you know if you
haven't tried?
I know nothing about stomach ulcers but from a cursory Google search it
looks like they are treated with both Zantac and antibiotics such as
amxoycillin.
Do you want to promote your cure? It seems like you let politics get in
the way of everything. You won't patent your cure, you won't sell it to
a pharmaceutical company, you won't sell it yourself via a website, you
won't approach the charitable organisations and you won't conduct any
clinical trials to prove how effective it is. You won't even give us a
brief synopsis of your theory or even say how the treatment is taken.
What are you going to do with it?
Spencer Spindrift
"Hayek" <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> wrote in message
news:42274952$0$28988$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl...
| Clair Louise Coult wrote:
| > In message <42271f2a$0$28985$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl>, Hayek
| > <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> writes
|
| cure for stomach ulcers. 7 days of amoxicilline,
| which patent had expired, cured any stomach ulcer.
| period.
|
| Zantac, a drug which worked as an antiacid was the
| best selling drug (over all drugs) then, as a relief
| for stomach ulcers. But patients had to take it for
| the rest of their lives.
|
| What do we see now ? 25 years later, most doctors
| still prescribe Zantac, and do not even know the
| real cause of stomach ulcers.
| Zantac is still one of the best selling drugs, I
| still meet people that are scheduled for surgery, to
| get rid of their stomach ulcers. When I tell them
| this story, they meet me with the same contempt that
| I meet here.
This is simply not true in UK. Everybody knows about that bacteria.
What I did last night:- "Tsuji Giri, Manchester noise masters celebrate
the release of their Albini recorded debut album, live sonic mayhem with
special guests and filthy DJ's"
Hayek
> "Hayek" <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> wrote in message
> news:42274952$0$28988$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl...
> | Clair Louise Coult wrote:
> | > In message <42271f2a$0$28985$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl>, Hayek
> | > <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> writes
> |
> | End of the seventies, someone found a nice and easy
> | cure for stomach ulcers. 7 days of amoxicilline,
> | which patent had expired, cured any stomach ulcer.
> | period.
> |
> | Zantac, a drug which worked as an antiacid was the
> | best selling drug (over all drugs) then, as a relief
> | for stomach ulcers. But patients had to take it for
> | the rest of their lives.
> |
> | What do we see now ? 25 years later, most doctors
> | still prescribe Zantac, and do not even know the
> | real cause of stomach ulcers.
> | Zantac is still one of the best selling drugs, I
> | still meet people that are scheduled for surgery, to
> | get rid of their stomach ulcers. When I tell them
> | this story, they meet me with the same contempt that
> | I meet here.
>
> This is simply not true in UK. Everybody knows
Everybody is your middle name, I presume?
Spencer Spindrift
| Spencer Spindrift wrote:
| > "Hayek" <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> wrote in message
| > news:42274952$0$28988$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl...
| > | Clair Louise Coult wrote:
| > | > In message <42271f2a$0$28985$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl>, Hayek
| > | > <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> writes
| > This is simply not true in UK. Everybody knows
|
| Everybody is your middle name, I presume?
|
| about that bacteria.
You know what I mean.
Don't feed the Troll anymore.
Spencer
Spencer Spindrift
Peter Parry
wrote:
>End of the seventies, someone found a nice and easy
>cure for stomach ulcers. 7 days of amoxicilline,
A bit light on facts as is much of what you say.
In 1979, Dr Robert Warren first observed the presence of small curved
bacteria on a biopsy of the gastric mucosa. In 1981, Dr Warren met
Dr (now Professor) Barry Marshall, registrar in the gastroenterology
department, and they demonstrated the clinical significance of the
bacteria Helicobacter pylori.
Warren and Marshall's first articles on Helicobacter pylori appeared
in The Lancet in 1983, interest in, and articles about, H. pylori
have proliferated since.
Helicobacter pylori is thought to be responsible for around 60 per
cent of stomach ulcers and 90 per cent of duodenal ulcers.
The use of only one medication to treat H. pylori is not recommended.
The most proven effective treatment is a 2-week course of treatment
called triple therapy. It involves taking two antibiotics to kill the
bacteria and either an acid suppressor or stomach-lining shield. The
common triplet is bismuth, imidazole, and tetracycline
>which patent had expired, cured any stomach ulcer.
>period.
Incorrect. Triplet therapy eradicates H Pylori in about 80% of
patients. Single medication is much less effective and not used.
>What do we see now ? 25 years later, most doctors
>still prescribe Zantac, and do not even know the
>real cause of stomach ulcers.
Absolute horsefeather. The recommended treatment contained in the
standard reference book in the UK present in every doctors surgery
(The British National Formulary) is triplet therapy and the National
Institute for Clinical Excellence includes it in their management
statements http://www.nice.org.uk/pdf/CG017NICEguideline.pdf. Your
assertion is nonsensical.
Hayek
Look at the answer Clair gave, after a "cursory
look" on Google.
The recommended treatment contained in the
> standard reference book in the UK present in
> every doctors surgery (The British National
> Formulary) is triplet therapy and the National
> Institute for Clinical Excellence includes it in
> their management statements
> http://www.nice.org.uk/pdf/CG017NICEguideline.pdf.
> Your assertion is nonsensical.
I asked ten nurses whwn I visited a friend in the
hospital in Belgium. Not one of them gave the
correct answer. They all answered "stress" caused
stomach ulcers.
You should try reality for once.
Uwe Hayek.
Clair Louise Coult
<hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> writes
>Look at the answer Clair gave, after a "cursory
>look" on Google.
I agree with Peter, you have taken my quote out of context.
I said I found that stomach ulcers are treated with Zantac (an antacid)
and antibiotics, such as amoxycillin. Peter said they are treated with
an antacid and antibiotics. He just gave names of different kinds of
antacid and antibiotics.
Now I shall take Spencer's very good advice. Don't feed the troll.
Peter Parry
wrote:
>Peter Parry wrote:
>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2005 18:28:31 +0100, Hayek
>> <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> wrote:
>>> What do we see now ? 25 years later, most
>>> doctors still prescribe Zantac, and do not even
>>> know the real cause of stomach ulcers.
>I asked ten nurses whwn I visited a friend in the
>hospital in Belgium. Not one of them gave the
>correct answer.
So from your extensive survey of 10 Belgian _nurses_ you concluded
that most _doctors_ don't know the cause of stomach ulcers?
Unfortunately I suspect this is indicative of the quality of your
other "research".
Hayek
> In message
> <42299224$0$28988$e4fe...@news.xs4all.nl>, Hayek
> <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> writes
>
>> Look at the answer Clair gave, after a "cursory
>> look" on Google.
>
>
> I agree with Peter, you have taken my quote out
> of context.
>
> I said I found that stomach ulcers are treated
> with Zantac (an antacid) and antibiotics, such as
> amoxycillin. Peter said they are treated with an
> antacid and antibiotics. He just gave names of
> different kinds of antacid and antibiotics.
You are completely missing the point.
Zantac was the single treatment before they found
out about the bacteria. And I say it is still
prescribed as the single treatment, by most of the
doctors. Also Peter, says nothing about the ridicule
these discoverers had to endure from other doctors.
> Now I shall take Spencer's very good advice.
> Don't feed the troll.
I draw my conclusions.
Uwe Hayek.
Hayek
> On Sat, 05 Mar 2005 12:04:01 +0100, Hayek
> <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> wrote:
>
>
>> Peter Parry wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, 03 Mar 2005 18:28:31 +0100, Hayek
>>> <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> wrote:
>
>
>>>> What do we see now ? 25 years later, most
>>>> doctors still prescribe Zantac, and do not
>>>> even know the real cause of stomach ulcers.
>>>>
>
>
>> I asked ten nurses whwn I visited a friend in
>> the hospital in Belgium. Not one of them gave
>> the correct answer.
>
>
> So from your extensive survey of 10 Belgian
> _nurses_ you concluded that most _doctors_ don't
> know the cause of stomach ulcers?
It is called a random sample. And where do nurses
get their knowledge ?
I read about this fact, about the doctors, and
decided to check with the nurses. It sort of
confirmed this fact. Actually, almost 50 % of the
nurses should have known the correct answer.
> Unfortunately I suspect this is indicative of the
> quality of your other "research".
You should try once to value the quality of the
research by the results it gets.
Uwe Hayek
Spencer Spindrift
|
| The recommended treatment contained in the
| > standard reference book in the UK present in
| > every doctors surgery (The British National
| > Formulary) is triplet therapy and the National
| > Institute for Clinical Excellence includes it in
| > their management statements
| > http://www.nice.org.uk/pdf/CG017NICEguideline.pdf.
| > Your assertion is nonsensical.
|
| I asked ten nurses whwn I visited a friend in the
| hospital in Belgium. Not one of them gave the
| correct answer. They all answered "stress" caused
| stomach ulcers.
When you say nurses you mean unquaified nursing assistants.
oops I'm feeding the troll again.
Spencer
Tony Houghton
Hayek <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> wrote:
> Peter Parry wrote:
>
>> So from your extensive survey of 10 Belgian
>> _nurses_ you concluded that most _doctors_ don't
>> know the cause of stomach ulcers?
>
> It is called a random sample. And where do nurses
> get their knowledge ?
Definitely not from doctors.
--
The address in the Reply-To is genuine and should not be edited.
See <http://www.realh.co.uk/contact.html> for more reliable contact addresses.
Hayek
Let me look at the quality of your opinion :
I offer you to read this :
http://www.theperthgroup.com/rejected.html
And you answer :
"I only read science fiction for entertainment."
You probably call that an "informed opinion".
I conclude that you do not have to read anything,
you just know what it is about, just by reading the
title. You sound like a doctor as in : "cfs, it all
in the head". You make the same mistake as the
people that do not take you seriously.
Could it be true that people that do not trust
anyone, are not to be trusted ?
Uwe Hayek.
Peter Parry
wrote:
>Peter Parry wrote:
>> So from your extensive survey of 10 Belgian
>> _nurses_ you concluded that most _doctors_ don't
>> know the cause of stomach ulcers?
>
>It is called a random sample.
I see you don't understand the word random either.
>and where do nurses get their knowledge ?
Generally from Nurse Trainers - who are not doctors. Nurses, with
one or two specialised exceptions, are not diagnosticians.
>I read about this fact,
Not another of your dodgy web sites!
>Actually, almost 50 % of the
>nurses should have known the correct answer.
Why?
>You should try once to value the quality of the
>research by the results it gets.
If we had any evidence as to the theory behind the trial, the
methodology used and the results achieved with verification by other
researchers we might well do that.
Peter Parry
wrote:
>I offer you to read this :
>http://www.theperthgroup.com/rejected.html
>
>And you answer :
>"I only read science fiction for entertainment."
>
>You probably call that an "informed opinion".
It is, I read some of the articles and it is obvious why responsible
journals refused to publish such poor quality work.
>Could it be true that people that do not trust
>anyone, are not to be trusted ?
It could be true. Whether or not it is I have no idea.
Hayek
> On Sat, 05 Mar 2005 18:17:01 +0100, Hayek
> <hay...@nospam.xs4all.nl> wrote:
>
>
>
>> I offer you to read this :
>> http://www.theperthgroup.com/rejected.html
>>
>> And you answer : "I only read science fiction
>> for entertainment."
>>
>> You probably call that an "informed opinion".
>
>
> It is, I read some of the articles and it is
> obvious why responsible journals refused to
> publish such poor quality work.
Doubting everything that is not scientifically
proven, is not dodgy work, it is the heart of
science itself. Everything else is religion.
Gallo's and Ho's "work", call *that* dodgy.
It simply does not hold water.
I was as sceptical as you, when I started reading on
virusmyth, but it did not dismiss thing right away.
I truly understood that between finding proteins
from sick people reacting with cultured ones, is
*NOT* the same as virus isolation, as Eleni
Papadopulos-Eleopulos explains in her interview by
Christine Johnson.
Read it here
http://www.virusmyth.net/aids/data/cjinterviewep.htm
or here
http://www.theperthgroup.com/INTERVIEWS/cjepe.html
From then on, I read *EVERYTHING* on virusmyth, and
I think their case is much stronger than the
believers. I became an hiv-aids dissident and
actually, I am quite proud of it.
Virusmyth home page :
http://www.virusmyth.net
Uwe Hayek.