Viola?
David Kilpatrick
I got myself a new large (16.75 inch) viola three years ago and it spent
most of that time lent to my son, who replaced the tailpiece (original
ebony with added fine tuners looking rather crude) with a modern metal
tuner-equipped one and strung it with good quality Thomastiks.
Anyway, it's come back to me, and I've spent a few hours experimenting
(having never played fiddle) to see how these things work. I have
lowered the bridge by 1/4 inch as the action was ridiculously high, but
after checking with fiddle players, I find many just use the bridge as
supplied and put up with a high action. Lowering the bridge has made it
much easier to finger, including ornaments, but harder to bow; it's also
made what was a really quite harsh and strident tone more mellow (moved
the bridge back a touch to be better placed over the soundpost as well).
Question: anyone think that the original ebony tailpiece would further
mellow the sound, compared to the modern cast metal item?
I'm beginning to be able to hit notes reliably and avoid too many
harmonics from the bowing, but bluegrass double-stop sawing and Seth
Lakeman style rythm are much easier than 'proper' tune playing. In fact
I find it easiest to use mandola chords and play it like an
accompaniment instrument. The other relatively easy thing is to use the
lower strings for a single bass line. One thing I'm fairly sure of is
that it's not something for joining in unison Scottish/Irish session
tunes, but it might be suitable for doing some kind of second part.
Not that anyone is ever likely to hear me with this in public for a long
time as it is so loud I must be 100 per cent certain of what I'm doing
and that is a long way off.
Any thoughts as to the use of viola? I really prefer the finger spacing
and the overall pitch/register to violin. It's a bit big to handle but
no way as cramped. I've never seen one in use outside an orchestra or
quartet etc. Why don't more players use them?
David
Steve
"David Kilpatrick" <icon...@btconnect.com> wrote in message
news:yomdnSz7uOV6me_V...@bt.com...
> Does anyone ever play viola in a folk context?
>
I'm sure Swarb played viola sometimes when he was with Fairport, and I
imagine there are plenty of others too.
Steve
Peter Thomas
<icon...@btconnect.com> writes
>Does anyone ever play viola in a folk context?
>
>I got myself a new large (16.75 inch) viola three years ago and it
>spent most of that time lent to my son, who replaced the tailpiece
>(original ebony with added fine tuners looking rather crude) with a
>modern metal tuner-equipped one and strung it with good quality
>Thomastiks.
>
>Anyway, it's come back to me, and I've spent a few hours experimenting
>(having never played fiddle) to see how these things work.
snip much other good stuff...........
>Any thoughts as to the use of viola? I really prefer the finger spacing
>and the overall pitch/register to violin. It's a bit big to handle but
>no way as cramped. I've never seen one in use outside an orchestra or
>quartet etc. Why don't more players use them?
>
There was indeed a lady called Beth on this summer's Guildford Folkestra
course who played viola for some of it. There was, mind you, the moment
when she mentioned that she was actually playing fiddle in that
particular session towards the end. Not unique to yourself, anyway.
--
Peter Thomas
David Kilpatrick
I was wondering - because of the very deep stuff in some Swarb
recordings with others as well - sounds more like viola bass strings
than like violin.
David
Richard Robinson
>>
>> I'm sure Swarb played viola sometimes when he was with Fairport, and I
>> imagine there are plenty of others too.
>
> I was wondering - because of the very deep stuff in some Swarb
> recordings with others as well - sounds more like viola bass strings
> than like violin.
I knew a fiddleplayer, once, who borrowed one for a few months. It made a
gorgeous noise, but he tended to complain that there were too many tunes he
couldn't play on it owing to the missing top string.
--
Richard Robinson
"The whole plan hinged upon the natural curiosity of potatoes" - S. Lem
My email address is at http://www.qualmograph.org.uk/contact.html
Arthur Marshall
from Richard Robinson <rich...@privacy.net> contains these words:
> David Kilpatrick said:
> > Steve wrote:
> >> "David Kilpatrick" <icon...@btconnect.com> wrote in message
> >>> Does anyone ever play viola in a folk context?
> >>
> >> I'm sure Swarb played viola sometimes when he was with Fairport, and I
> >> imagine there are plenty of others too.
> >
> > I was wondering - because of the very deep stuff in some Swarb
> > recordings with others as well - sounds more like viola bass strings
> > than like violin.
> I knew a fiddleplayer, once, who borrowed one for a few months. It made a
> gorgeous noise, but he tended to complain that there were too many tunes he
> couldn't play on it owing to the missing top string.
A lot of fiddlers now use five string fiddles and get the best of both
worlds. Of course, if you tune the bottom end as normal and put a high B
at the top you could make bats fall out of the rafters...
--
Arthur Marshall
Caller for Traditional Dances
nb Lord Byron's Maggot
www.users.zetnet.co.uk/barndancer
www.myspace.com/arthurhimself
Richard Robinson
> from Richard Robinson <rich...@privacy.net> contains these words:
>> David Kilpatrick said:
>> > Steve wrote:
>> >> "David Kilpatrick" <icon...@btconnect.com> wrote in message
>> >>> Does anyone ever play viola in a folk context?
>> >>
>> >> I'm sure Swarb played viola sometimes when he was with Fairport, and I
>> >> imagine there are plenty of others too.
>> >
>> > I was wondering - because of the very deep stuff in some Swarb
>> > recordings with others as well - sounds more like viola bass strings
>> > than like violin.
>
>> I knew a fiddleplayer, once, who borrowed one for a few months. It made a
>> gorgeous noise, but he tended to complain that there were too many tunes he
>> couldn't play on it owing to the missing top string.
>
> A lot of fiddlers now use five string fiddles and get the best of both
> worlds. Of course, if you tune the bottom end as normal and put a high B
> at the top you could make bats fall out of the rafters...
And everyone knows that nothing helps a session along like being
unexpectedly draped in bats.
Java Jive
On 07 Jul 2008 15:53:09 GMT, Richard Robinson <rich...@privacy.net>
wrote:
Ron(UK)
>
> And everyone knows that nothing helps a session along like being
> unexpectedly draped in bats.
Bats what?
Bonnie Shaljean
> Does anyone ever play viola in a folk context?
Jackie Oates plays 5-string viola, often as a voice accompaniment.
More info here, and also a number of other places if you Google
around: http://www.spiralearth.co.uk/reviews/oates.htm
Bonnie Shaljean
(Just tried posting this a minute ago, without success - apologies if
it appears twice)
Jackie Oates plays a 5-string viola, often as a voice accompaniment.
More info here, as well as a number of other places if you Google
around: http://www.spiralearth.co.uk/reviews/oates.htm
Bonnie Shaljean
Have tried twice, but each time after I hit Send... zilch. Trying
again in Safari. Anyway:]
Bonnie Shaljean
three times, twice in Firefox3 and once in Safari, but each time after
I hit Send... zilch. I'll give it one more go:]
wen...@cix.compulink.co.uk
icon...@btconnect.com (David Kilpatrick) wrote:
>
> Does anyone ever play viola in a folk context?
I think Suzy Thompson might. Look up www.ericandsuzy.com. Or maybe her
sister, Jane Rothfield.
Lucy Cowan played viola on a couple of Archie Fisher's recordings.
wg
www.pelicancrossing.net
resident, Twickenham Folk Club
Jacey Bedford
Robinson <rich...@privacy.net> writes
>David Kilpatrick said:
>> Steve wrote:
>>> "David Kilpatrick" <icon...@btconnect.com> wrote in message
>>>> Does anyone ever play viola in a folk context?
>>>
>>> I'm sure Swarb played viola sometimes when he was with Fairport, and I
>>> imagine there are plenty of others too.
>>
>> I was wondering - because of the very deep stuff in some Swarb
>> recordings with others as well - sounds more like viola bass strings
>> than like violin.
>
>I knew a fiddleplayer, once, who borrowed one for a few months. It made a
>gorgeous noise, but he tended to complain that there were too many tunes he
>couldn't play on it owing to the missing top string.
Tanglefoot's fiddler, Sandra Swannell, plays both fiddle and viola to
great effect. Jaime RT and Tania Opland both play five string fiddles
(Jaime calls hers a fiddola) i.e. a fiddle with the lower string added.
Jacey
>
--
Jacey Bedford
jacey at artisan hyphen harmony dot com
posting via usenet and not googlegroups, ourdebate
or any other forum that reprints usenet posts as
though they were the forum's own
Dominic Cronin
There's nothing the matter with uk.music.folk as far as I'm aware. I'd
suggest that while you are tweaking with your settings you might find
it interesting to know that there are several newsgroups which exist
speifically to support that activity. Pretty much anything with test
in its name is a good bet. You could try alt.test to get started.
--
Dominic Cronin
Amsterdam
Molly Mockford
<bonnies...@gmail.com> wrote in
<e187b487-b060-4cd5...@8g2000hse.googlegroups.com>:
>[Is anyone else having trouble posting to this group? Have tried
>three times, twice in Firefox3 and once in Safari, but each time after
>I hit Send... zilch. I'll give it one more go:]
All four of them arrived in the group, Bonnie. Do you perhaps have
GoogleGroups set not to show you your own posts?
--
Molly Mockford
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety
deserve neither liberty nor safety - Benjamin Franklin
(My Reply-To address *is* valid, though may not remain so for ever.)
David Kilpatrick
Thanks for that - I didn't know of her (I am very ignorant sometimes
about pretty high profile folk acts, as I don't have a lot of time to
listen to anything or go anywhere). Excellent, her first CD is now on
the shopping list.
David
David Kilpatrick
> In article <yomdnSz7uOV6me_V...@bt.com>,
> icon...@btconnect.com (David Kilpatrick) wrote:
>
>> Does anyone ever play viola in a folk context?
>
> I think Suzy Thompson might. Look up www.ericandsuzy.com. Or maybe her
> sister, Jane Rothfield.
>
> Lucy Cowan played viola on a couple of Archie Fisher's recordings.
Of course. I think Lucy has played viola here at some point, in some
combination maybe with Elspeth Smellie on harp or another local muso - I
have not seen Lucy for ages.
And there's also viola in Mr McFall's quartet working with Matt Seattle
on some stuff I have on my iPod!
David
Jack Campin - bogus address
In Scotland, Mairi Campbell.
> Any thoughts as to the use of viola?
The Turkish G clarinet I play is something like a wind-powered
viola (it goes a semitone lower). I use it either to octave
tunes that are basically in the range of the flute, or else to
do countermelodies.
The main folk use of the viola is the Hungarian kontra, which
has a flat bridge and a different tuning so it mainly drones
in triple stops. For some reason every kontra seems to have
the bridge area plastered with so much rosin dust that it looks
as if it had been crapped on by pigeons. It produces a huge
rhythmic chug. The guy who played it in Makvirag was amazing.
If you can lend me a portable idiotproof digicam I can probably do
you some field recordings of kontra playing in Transylvania and
Moldavia in a few weeks.
==== j a c k at c a m p i n . m e . u k === <http://www.campin.me.uk> ====
Jack Campin, 11 Third St, Newtongrange EH22 4PU, Scotland == mob 07800 739 557
CD-ROMs and free stuff: Scottish music, food intolerance, and Mac logic fonts
Chris P.
> lowered the bridge by 1/4 inch as the action was ridiculously high, but
> after checking with fiddle players, I find many just use the bridge as
> supplied and put up with a high action. Lowering the bridge has made it
> much easier to finger, including ornaments, but harder to bow; it's also
> made what was a really quite harsh and strident tone more mellow (moved
> the bridge back a touch to be better placed over the soundpost as well).
>
> Question: anyone think that the original ebony tailpiece would further
> mellow the sound, compared to the modern cast metal item?
>
> I'm beginning to be able to hit notes reliably and avoid too many
> harmonics from the bowing, but bluegrass double-stop sawing and Seth
> Lakeman style rythm are much easier than 'proper' tune playing. In fact
> I find it easiest to use mandola chords and play it like an
> accompaniment instrument. The other relatively easy thing is to use the
> lower strings for a single bass line. One thing I'm fairly sure of is
> that it's not something for joining in unison Scottish/Irish session
> tunes, but it might be suitable for doing some kind of second part.
>
> Not that anyone is ever likely to hear me with this in public for a long
> time as it is so loud I must be 100 per cent certain of what I'm doing
> and that is a long way off.
>
> Any thoughts as to the use of viola? I really prefer the finger spacing
> and the overall pitch/register to violin. It's a bit big to handle but
> no way as cramped. I've never seen one in use outside an orchestra or
> quartet etc. Why don't more players use them?
>
> David
Have a look at this fiddlers discussion group:-
Lots of answers there to all your questions, and no mention of bats.
Chris.
Chris P.
Yeah, me too. Sent messages twice and they haven't appeared yet.
However, I see yours three times! Seems to be a delay of ten minutes.
Java Jive
<Christhefidd...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> and no mention of bats.
What on oversight! :-)
TBS, I know little of fiddles, but I've often wondered, despite the
sleeve credits only mentioning 'fiddle' (though I guess generically
that could include a viola), whether Planxty's version of "The Woman I
Ne'er Forgot / The Pullet / The Ladies' Pantalettes" actually has
viola rather than a violin, especially on the cracking middle reel.
It's Track 7 on "The Woman I Loved So Well" if anyone's interested to
confirm or contradict. I'd like to know one way or another.
PS: Proposed spell-checker correction for Planxty? Panty!
anahata
Usenet is not a web-based bulletin board (like the Mudcat, for example)
where posts appear the moment you send them. Messages are distributed
over the world via thousands of servers. There was a time when it could
take days to see your own post come back, and sometimes you saw the
replies first.
If you're using Google Groups, that is only a window onto usenet.
Oh, and BTW Nancy Kerr is another viola player...
--
Anahata
ana...@treewind.co.uk ==//== 01638 720444
http://www.treewind.co.uk ==//== http://www.myspace.com/maryanahata
Bonnie Shaljean
> If you can lend me a portable idiotproof digicam
[Groan] If anyone can lend me a portable idiotproof brain...
Dunno WHAT happened! (Settings are normal & usually work fine.) But
last night, all evening, nowt. Now my messages have gone forth and
multiplied. Sorry for spamming everybody -
Jack Campin - bogus address
> [Groan] If anyone can lend me a portable idiotproof brain...
>
> Dunno WHAT happened! (Settings are normal & usually work fine.)
> But last night, all evening, nowt. Now my messages have gone
> forth and multiplied. Sorry for spamming everybody -
I've seen a lot of googlegroupers unintentionally posting multiple
copies of messages in the last day or two. Their system seems to
have become even more crap than usual. Not your fault, anyway.
Chris P.
wrote:
Perhaps someone would enlighten us tweb Johnny-come-latelies on how
not use Google groups?
Jack Campin - bogus address
> > copies of messages in the last day or two. Their system seems to
> > have become even more crap than usual. Not your fault, anyway.
> not use Google groups?
You need a different server (news.individual.net is cheap, aioe.org
is free) and appropriate software (you're on Windows so try 4titude
or Free Agent).
Ron(UK)
>>> I've seen a lot of googlegroupers unintentionally posting multiple
>>> copies of messages in the last day or two. Their system seems to
>>> have become even more crap than usual. Not your fault, anyway.
>> Perhaps someone would enlighten us tweb Johnny-come-latelies on how
>> not use Google groups?
>
> You need a different server (news.individual.net is cheap, aioe.org
> is free) and appropriate software (you're on Windows so try 4titude
> or Free Agent).
Does Demon carry newsgroups?
Ron
Jack Campin - bogus address
Yes, but their server has been appallingly unreliable lately,
in line with the increasing crappiness of every aspect of their
service (billing, helpdesk, homepages, email, fax gateway).
And as usual the shit service goes along with typically British
refusal to either acknowledge or explain any problems (services
can be dead for days with their status line saying everything's
fine).
I'm gradually migrating away from them and would certainly NOT
recommend them to anybody now.
They will probably be sold to Cable & Wireless soon, and they're
even worse. After the sale I'd expect them to drop Usenet.
Jacey Bedford
Campin - bogus address <bo...@purr.demon.co.uk> writes
>>>>> I've seen a lot of googlegroupers unintentionally posting multiple
>>>>> copies of messages in the last day or two. Their system seems to
>>>>> have become even more crap than usual. Not your fault, anyway.
>>>> Perhaps someone would enlighten us tweb Johnny-come-latelies on how
>>>> not use Google groups?
>>> You need a different server (news.individual.net is cheap, aioe.org
>>> is free) and appropriate software (you're on Windows so try 4titude
>>> or Free Agent).
>> Does Demon carry newsgroups?
>
>Yes, but their server has been appallingly unreliable lately,
>in line with the increasing crappiness of every aspect of their
>service (billing, helpdesk, homepages, email, fax gateway).
>And as usual the shit service goes along with typically British
>refusal to either acknowledge or explain any problems (services
>can be dead for days with their status line saying everything's
>fine).
>
>I'm gradually migrating away from them and would certainly NOT
>recommend them to anybody now.
>
>They will probably be sold to Cable & Wireless soon, and they're
>even worse. After the sale I'd expect them to drop Usenet.
Yes Demon carries newsgroups.
I also still use their Turnpike front end software which deals well with
newsgroups, too.
Jack's experience isn't mine. I've found Demon's service to be
consistent and though they're not the cheapest I'm reluctant to change
from them while everything continues to run smoothly. I think I've only
had about half a day this year when I couldn't get on the net and I use
my machine all day every day.
Ron(UK)
There are plenty of free newsgroup providers tho, I`m sure that the OP
can find one which carries uk.m.f with a bit of Googling or as I thnk
someone has already mentioned there is http://news.individual.net/ for
10 euros a year.
Ron
Gill.Sm...@googlemail.com
Haven't really been following this thread so, if not already
suggested, you might want to team up with Amy Lavere (double bass)
Jim Lawton
<icon...@btconnect.com> wrote:
>Does anyone ever play viola in a folk context?
>
>I got myself a new large (16.75 inch) viola three years ago and it spent
>most of that time lent to my son, who replaced the tailpiece (original
>ebony with added fine tuners looking rather crude) with a modern metal
>tuner-equipped one and strung it with good quality Thomastiks.
>
>Anyway, it's come back to me, and I've spent a few hours experimenting
>(having never played fiddle) to see how these things work. I have
Well, I remember Keith Hancock had an excellent viola player - Jo
Hamilton " in his band Famous Last Words.
Also I find : http://www.folkviola.com if no one else has mentioned it.
--
Jim
The Yorkshire Polymoth
David Kilpatrick
Well, ten days after picking up the thing I risked it in a session on
Saturday night. To my amazement, having people playing songs makes it
500 per easier to hit the right pitch every time. I did several
accompaniment parts to songs without getting told to sling it, then got
asked to do a solo verse - and it went fine, more an instrumental break
than actually doing to full tune correctly, but I play all instruments
mainly by ear and it seems to work fine, and it fits in.
I got asked why I was playing with a 13 inch long baroque psaltery bow
with the hairs totally slackened off - that's my secret, having tried
all the bows I've got! Nothing works as well as the psaltery bow for the
rythmic double/triple stop chording effect I'm after, and it manages
single string solos OK with care.
David