Foot and Mouth Disease
>kat<
on Maurice <jus...@jiwalu.demon.co.uk> who squeaked:
>I live in North East England. All public parks here are closed because
>of foot and mouth disease. Most of these parks are used only by the
>public to exercise both themselves and their dogs. They are often
>surrounded only by urban housing. What astonishes me is that all of our
>golf courses are open and being used. Most of these courses border on
>farm land and golf balls must invariably end up on that land. Animals
>too often overgraze fences surrounding golf courses. What on earth is
>going on here? Could it be that the decision making powers play golf and
>dont want their pastime affected by the disease?
>
>For more bent decisions visit http://www.jiwalu.demon.co.uk
>
I wonder if you heard the farmer on Radio 4 yesterday morning insisting
that that MAFF's handling of the crisis is all wrong.
He said that there was absolute scientific evidence (provided by
independent people) which shows that the use of vaccination would have
the whole thing under control within a few weeks.
The problem seems to be that our export markets won't accept vaccinated
animals. The Netherlands introduced vaccination earlier today but have
now been prevented from continuing by the EU.
It would seem, once again, that politics and governmental dithering are
getting in the way of a quick and easy solution.
I noticed also that as the farmer was trying to give out the address of
his web site he was very quickly stopped by the interviewer.
If anyone else heard the interview and the web address I'd like to know
it.
--
>kat< "An expert is a man who has stopped thinking -- he knows!"
©
Frank Lloyd Wright, American architect
Marian
>kat< <$news$@kat22.clara.co.uk> schrieb in im Newsbeitrag:
DFdVkgIb...@ntlworld.com...
> Twas Thu, 22 Mar 2001 when >kat< sat at the mousehole, ready to pounce
> on Maurice <jus...@jiwalu.demon.co.uk> who squeaked:
> >I live in North East England. All public parks here are closed because
> >of foot and mouth disease. Most of these parks are used only by the
> >public to exercise both themselves and their dogs. They are often
> >surrounded only by urban housing. What astonishes me is that all of our
> >golf courses are open and being used. Most of these courses border on
> >farm land and golf balls must invariably end up on that land. Animals
> >too often overgraze fences surrounding golf courses. What on earth is
> >going on here? Could it be that the decision making powers play golf and
> >dont want their pastime affected by the disease?
> >
> >For more bent decisions visit http://www.jiwalu.demon.co.uk
> >
> I wonder if you heard the farmer on Radio 4 yesterday morning insisting
> that that MAFF's handling of the crisis is all wrong.
> He said that there was absolute scientific evidence (provided by
> independent people) which shows that the use of vaccination would have
> the whole thing under control within a few weeks.
> The problem seems to be that our export markets won't accept vaccinated
> animals.
I am sure it's all Franz Fischler's fault. Just like BSE!
Fuck Brussels!
Eat tofu!
--
Marian
Eric Jarvis
there is a major flaw in the idea of vaccination
it would take a world wide agreement to find a new way of
differentiating between disease free herds and the rest...since
vaccination produces genuine foot and mouth antibodies there is no
way of distinguishing with any real degree of certainty between
vaccinated animals and ones that have been infected
once you change the main method of control over to vaccination you
have to stick with it...that means keeping a large amount of a wide
range of foot and mouth vaccines permanently in stock...there are a
number of varieties of the disease...they all need different
vaccines
if you find this guys web site it may be very interesting to do a
whois and find out who owns it, and what their financial interest in
vaccine production or distribution is...if it ever does happen
somebody is going to make a shitload of money
--
eric
"live fast, die only if strictly necessary"
Euan Bayliss
> The problem seems to be that our export markets won't accept
> vaccinated animals. The Netherlands introduced vaccination earlier
> today but have now been prevented from continuing by the EU.
> It would seem, once again, that politics and governmental dithering
> are getting in the way of a quick and easy solution.
From what I've heard, the problem with vaccinated animals is that they
are impossible to differentiate with tests from infected ones. Hence
the tests being discontinued.
If that's wrong please correct me, but that's how I recall it being
explained.
Euan
--
*from* Euan Bayliss, aka euan.b...@btinternet.com
in Bradford, West Yorkshire, England
"Blue Moon, you saw me standing alone..."
Euan Bayliss
> From what I've heard, the problem with vaccinated animals is that they
> are impossible to differentiate with tests from infected ones. Hence
> the tests being discontinued.
^^^^^
I meant to say 'hence the vaccinations being discontinued'. Someone
remind me it's not good to be posting to Usenet at 2am!!!
Alistair Mann
>Euan Bayliss <euan.b...@btinternet.com> writes:
>
>> From what I've heard, the problem with vaccinated animals is that they
>> are impossible to differentiate with tests from infected ones. Hence
>> the tests being discontinued.
> ^^^^^
>I meant to say 'hence the vaccinations being discontinued'. Someone
>remind me it's not good to be posting to Usenet at 2am!!!
Get yourself off to bed, Euan!
--
Alistair Mann
uk.local.london
Tony Walton
(That's not Kat as in W of B, is it? If so you'll know what I mean, if
not sorry for bothering you)
> I wonder if you heard the farmer on Radio 4 yesterday morning insisting
> that that MAFF's handling of the crisis is all wrong.
> He said that there was absolute scientific evidence (provided by
> independent people) which shows that the use of vaccination would have
> the whole thing under control within a few weeks.
> The problem seems to be that our export markets won't accept vaccinated
> animals. The Netherlands introduced vaccination earlier today but have
> now been prevented from continuing by the EU.
> It would seem, once again, that politics and governmental dithering are
> getting in the way of a quick and easy solution.
> I noticed also that as the farmer was trying to give out the address of
> his web site he was very quickly stopped by the interviewer.
> If anyone else heard the interview and the web address I'd like to know
> it.
Might that be http://www.sheepdrove.com ? A publisher/organic farmer
was interviewed yesterday and was promoting that website quite heavily.
--
Tony
Sam Nelson
Tony Walton <tony....@uk.sun.com> writes:
> Might that be http://www.sheepdrove.com ? A publisher/organic farmer
> was interviewed yesterday and was promoting that website quite heavily.
The actual page, at http://www.sheepdrove.com/fam.htm makes interesting
reading. It _might_ all be bollocks, but it doesn't look it.
--
SAm. (Insert bandwidth-wasting disclaimer here)
...and knew a new nomad near the nearside window of his Mitsubishi
>kat<
on Tony Walton <tony....@uk.sun.com> who squeaked:
>">kat<" wrote:
>> I wonder if you heard the farmer on Radio 4 yesterday morning insisting
>> that that MAFF's handling of the crisis is all wrong.
>> He said that there was absolute scientific evidence (provided by
>> independent people) which shows that the use of vaccination would have
>> the whole thing under control within a few weeks.
>Might that be http://www.sheepdrove.com ? A publisher/organic farmer
>was interviewed yesterday and was promoting that website quite heavily.
>
>
That's the one... thanks a lot Tony..
--
>kat< "Art is the unceasing effort to compete with the beauty of flowers
© and never succeeding."
Marc Chagall, Russian-French painter and graphic artist
Tony Walton
>
>
> >Might that be http://www.sheepdrove.com ? A publisher/organic farmer
> >was interviewed yesterday and was promoting that website quite heavily.
> >
> >
> That's the one... thanks a lot Tony..
You're welcome. Can anyone remember the bloke's name? I know the
publisher does a lot of organic agriculture and horticulture books (and
IIRC some New Age stuff as well) but I'm blowed if I can remember what
he's called...
fu set to umr.bbc-r4 only
--
Tony
Bob Sims
Eric Jarvis <er...@last.dircon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:MPG.1524774a5...@news.dircon.co.uk...
---------------------------------------------------------------
No, Eric. Somebody is going to stop losing a "shitload" of
money. Namely our farmers.
Interesting that the bbc censored the man who tried to give his
web site.
I wonder if the penny is dropping with anybody in this newsgroup
yet ?
Bob
------------------------------------------------------------
Eric Jarvis
Peter Kindersley?
Alistair Mann
>I wonder if the penny is dropping with anybody in this newsgroup
>yet ?
>
>Bob
It clearly isn't you; this thread is in /two/ newsgroups.
HTH,
--
Alistair Mann
Eric Jarvis
no point trying to present him with a clue...he's seen something on
a website so everyone else in the entire world must be wrong and
conspiring to keep the truth from the public
Ophelia
"Bob Sims" <b...@bscserv.com> wrote in message
news:985377571.19736.0...@news.demon.co.uk...
Oh do shut up Bob.. we really don't need you as our saviour. Just because
we are not interested in your rants does NOT mean we don't have brains or
our own views
Not sure who the hell you think you are but we managed very well before you
arrived and will manage much better if you bugger off
Ophelia
Eric Jarvis
> "Bob Sims" <b...@bscserv.com> wrote:
>
> >No, Eric. Somebody is going to stop losing a "shitload" of
> >money. Namely our farmers.
> >
> >Interesting that the bbc censored the man who tried to give his
> >web site.
>
>
> who mentioned sheepfold.com, or whatever it is, at least 6 times on
> the Today programe the other morning?
isn't it interesting how every crisis produces one or two very rich
people who seem to have unlimited time to go around proposing a very
simple solution that involves the state spending a lot of money on
something
not that foot and mouth isn't going to cost us lots of money as a
nation...but Kindersley (the publisher) isn't a complete fool...so
if he's proposing something which is scientifically ridiculous when
you look at it in detail, I am wary of assuming that is because he's
too stupid to understand it
that implies on of two likely things going on...one is that the vast
(almost unanimous) bulk of experts are all less clever than he
is...or that he stands to gain something out of a vaccination
programme
but I'm a cynical barsteward
Bill Davidson
Eric Jarvis wrote in message ...
>loobyloo-nice-but-dim-Cliff wrote:
>
>isn't it interesting how every crisis produces one or two very rich
>people who seem to have unlimited time to go around proposing a very
>simple solution that involves the state spending a lot of money on
>something
>
>not that foot and mouth isn't going to cost us lots of money as a
>nation...but Kindersley (the publisher)
Being a publishing house, the pronoun "he" isn't quite right.
I don't know the right solution, and if I did, I'd be making lots more money
than I am at the moment. But the fact is it's a national disaster as well as
a personal one for many farmers. Make no mistake - we are all going to pay
for this one way or another. The tourist industry will be the hidden (and
uncompensated victims), and it's not going to help the unemployment
statistics either. This pestilence is a nothing less than a national
disaster on an unprecedented scale.
Despite the fuzzy logic of our government, at least Gordon Brown's economic
policies have been consistent and bearing fruit. Now this! No-one can plan
for something like this. The final cost will run into billions, and those
billions might have ended up in our pockets, or in new schools and
hospitals. Instead, it will be spent on compensating farmers and eliminating
foci of foot and mouth disease.
But we did not invent the disease nor introduce it to this country or the
continent. We had been disease free for over thirty years, and then in less
than a month, two major - and previously thriving - sectors of our economy
have been devastated. Somebody, somewhere, introduced foot and mouth into
this country via animal feed from a dubious source simply in order to make a
few grand more in profit. I hope that whoever did this is brought to justice
and sent to jail for the rest of his/her natural life.
BD
Alistair Mann
>
>Eric Jarvis wrote in message ...
>>loobyloo-nice-but-dim-Cliff wrote:
>>
>>isn't it interesting how every crisis produces one or two very rich
>>people who seem to have unlimited time to go around proposing a very
>>simple solution that involves the state spending a lot of money on
>>something
>>
>>not that foot and mouth isn't going to cost us lots of money as a
>>nation...but Kindersley (the publisher)
>
>Being a publishing house, the pronoun "he" isn't quite right.
>
>I don't know the right solution, and if I did, I'd be making lots more money
>than I am at the moment. But the fact is it's a national disaster as well as
>a personal one for many farmers. Make no mistake - we are all going to pay
>for this one way or another. The tourist industry will be the hidden (and
>uncompensated victims), and it's not going to help the unemployment
>statistics either. This pestilence is a nothing less than a national
>disaster on an unprecedented scale.
One of many. So what if you all eat spuds for a while? England has seen
far, far worse than that. And shat down it's throat.
>Despite the fuzzy logic of our government, at least Gordon Brown's economic
>policies have been consistent and bearing fruit. Now this! No-one can plan
>for something like this. The final cost will run into billions, and those
>billions might have ended up in our pockets, or in new schools and
>hospitals. Instead, it will be spent on compensating farmers and eliminating
>foci of foot and mouth disease.
Err, headline losses are /potential/ losses. They money 'lost' has never
actually existed for paying for other things. And I very much doubt what
few landowners actually still at work at home are inline for 'billions' in
compensation. No doubt Nu-Lab' TB will be only too glad to claim they
would though, but just wait until it comes time to cut the cheque!
>But we did not invent the disease nor introduce it to this country or the
>continent. We had been disease free for over thirty years, and then in less
>than a month, two major - and previously thriving - sectors of our economy
>have been devastated. Somebody, somewhere, introduced foot and mouth into
>this country via animal feed from a dubious source simply in order to make a
>few grand more in profit. I hope that whoever did this is brought to justice
>and sent to jail for the rest of his/her natural life.
We'll see. It's a global economy now, with all the benefits -- and
problems -- that implies.
--
Alistair Mann
Jim Guthrie
<brazi...@lineone.net> wrote:
>This pestilence is a nothing less than a national
>disaster on an unprecedented scale.
What constitutes a disaster on an unprecedented scale?
According to figures being quoted at the moment, about one per cent
of the national herd is, or has been, affected by the outbreak. If
the number of cases rises to 4000, as has been predicted, then that
will affect about 8% of the national herd (on the assumption that the
present number of cases of about 500 constitutes 1%).
Jim.
Alistair Mann
>hOn Sun, 25 Mar 2001 04:00:33 +0100, "Bill Davidson"
><brazi...@lineone.net> wrote:
>
>>This pestilence is a nothing less than a national
>>disaster on an unprecedented scale.
>
>What constitutes a disaster on an unprecedented scale?
Whatever happens to sell newspapers / advertising time / strengthen the
case (hah!) for the telly tax.
--
Alistair Mann
Ian Sharrock
, Alistair Mann <alis...@3legsbandit.com> writes
> So what if you all eat spuds for a while? England has seen
>far, far worse than that. And shat down it's throat.
I wouldn't say that to some of the Irish people I know.....
Ian
--
Ian Sharrock. Permission to send unsolicited commercial e-mail to this
host is explicitly *withdrawn*
Alistair Mann
>In article <Pine.LNX.4.30.01032...@lgeezer.demon.co.uk>
>, Alistair Mann <alis...@3legsbandit.com> writes
>> So what if you all eat spuds for a while? England has seen
>>far, far worse than that. And shat down it's throat.
>
>I wouldn't say that to some of the Irish people I know.....
Why's that then? Have the Irish got some kind of monopoly on heroically
suffering adversity?
Better not tell the millions of non-Irish who died of the Bubonic Plague
in the 14th century. Or who died of Chicken Flu at the start of the 20th.
Both of which England, and other countries including Ireland, overcame.
Best not tell many on the mainland who had little more than spuds to eat
during the rationing of World War 2. Dig for victory! said the famous
advert at that time. Why do you think we did that? To bury treasure?
F&M today has /nothing/ on what we've seen in the past. Nothing on the
Black Death. Nothing on Flu pandemics. Nothing on the Potato Famine.
What's the largest effect for most of us? Eating more veg, more chips,
more potatoes. If you cannot bear to hear or repeat that truth for fear
of offending the Irish, then your problems go far beyond your diet.
Tell you what, next time you see one of your Irish friends, why don't you
ask them if they are offended by you eating more potatoes?
--
Alistair Mann
Howard Beale
Alistair Mann <alis...@3legsbandit.com> wrote in message
news:Pine.LNX.4.30.01032...@lgeezer.demon.co.uk...
You should spend some time on soc.culture.irish. You'll see it doesn't take
much to offend them :-)
--
Howard Beale
"I'm as mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore"
Get mad @ www.mad-as-hell.com
Tony Walton
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------
>
> No, Eric. Somebody is going to stop losing a "shitload" of
> money. Namely our farmers.
>
> Interesting that the bbc censored the man who tried to give his
> web site.
They didn't. Peter Kindersley (I finally remembered the name) mentioned
the Sheepdrove site (http://www.sheepdrove.com) very clearly on several
occasions. What they did try to stop was him saying it repeatedly about
seventeen times in the middle of what was turning into a rather
ill-considered rant so the other bloke could get a word in edgeways.
They did Kindersley a favour, IMO - he was destroying his own argument
by getting all swivelly-eyed and ranty.
--
Tony Walton
Alun Jones
>
> You should spend some time on soc.culture.irish. You'll see it doesn't take
> much to offend them :-)
In fact, those two sentences alone are almost certainly enough.
Alun.
~~~~
[Note that answers to questions in newsgroups are not generally
invitations to contact me personally for help in the future.]
--
Texas Imperial Software | Try WFTPD, the Windows FTP Server. Find us at
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Rogi
wrote:
>In article <57qv6.21192$PF4....@news.iol.ie>, "Howard Beale"
><how...@REMOVEmad-as-hell.com> wrote:
>>
>> You should spend some time on soc.culture.irish. You'll see it doesn't take
>> much to offend them :-)
>
>In fact, those two sentences alone are almost certainly enough.
That has to be the most insane ng on the planet doesn't it? ;-)
--
Rob.
Howard Beale
Rogi <ro...@rogis.com> wrote in message
news:3Yu=OsErtOvFPsZCNAY=HzTy...@4ax.com...
No wonder I'm as mad as hell
Alistair Mann
>
>Rogi <ro...@rogis.com> wrote in message
>news:3Yu=OsErtOvFPsZCNAY=HzTy...@4ax.com...
>> On Mon, 26 Mar 2001 15:32:25 GMT, alu...@texis.com (Alun Jones)
>> wrote:
>>
>> >In article <57qv6.21192$PF4....@news.iol.ie>, "Howard Beale"
>> ><how...@REMOVEmad-as-hell.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> You should spend some time on soc.culture.irish. You'll see it doesn't
>take
>> >> much to offend them :-)
>> >
>> >In fact, those two sentences alone are almost certainly enough.
>>
>> That has to be the most insane ng on the planet doesn't it? ;-)
>
>No wonder I'm as mad as hell
I went and had a bit of a gander. I think I'll agree with Rogi there! They
are definitely a bit batty. I love especially that I had to work hard to
find anyone then who would defend their own position through all the posts
attacking other people's positions!
I tell you tis madness gone mad
--
Alistair Mann
Howard Beale
Alistair Mann <alis...@3legsbandit.com> wrote in message
news:Pine.LNX.4.30.01032...@lgeezer.demon.co.uk...
Shame you didn't X-post :-)))))
Rogi
Isn't it just. I spent a couple of years around there, though I tried
desperately to avoid our Howard with his naming and shaming of bent
politicians. It's a barmy ng - I once started a thread as an <ahem>
'social experiment' titled something like 'Americans get out of our
group!' (most ppl there are ex-pat Paddys in the states), and fuck me,
it was feckin bedlam......
;-)
--
Rob.
Rogi
What like this? ;-)
(Hi Howard BTW, how's the lovely Isle these days? ;-))
--
Rob.
Howard Beale
Not bad, but Alisair's original comments might have been more fun
> (Hi Howard BTW, how's the lovely Isle these days? ;-))
Cold and wet as usual.
The pro-life nutters are lobbying for yet another abortion referendum.
Yet another bent politician had to resign from the Public Accounts
Committee.
(proved in libel court of assisting people to avoid paying tax)
Junior agriculture minister had to resign because he didn't let on that he
was feeding his pigs meat and bone meal, when he voted against banning it.
(Owner of the largest piggery in Ireland)
We now have foot and mouth beacause of successive governments turning a
blind eye to farmers (and terrorists) smuggling livestock to fiddle EU
payments. (We blamed the evil Brits for that)
We gave foot and mouth to the French, after calling Britain the lepers of
Europe.
My neighbour has just bought a brand new Isuzu Trooper, to help him on his
farm and in his building contracting business. Of course, he also uses it
when signing on. Sorry, got that wrong. Farmers don't have to travel sign on
now, because of the fear of spreading F&M.
The teachers are on strike, looking for a 30% pay rise. (seriously
disrupting the leaving cert exams)
Somone put in an offer for my house, but my estate agent persuaded him to
buy a more expensive one down the road.
One day last month, the Irish police farce announced that they would be
mounting nationwide road blocks to detect uninsured, untaxed and
unroadworthy vehicles. The country ground to a halt as most people stayed
home that day.
You can keep up to date with all the goings on @ www.mad-as-hell.com
All in all, words couldn't describe how homesick I am for Twickenham and Eel
Pie Island.
Rogi
<how...@REMOVEmad-as-hell.com> wrote:
>> What like this? ;-)
<snip>
Ah, so everything is still the same then.. :-)
<x-posted to SCI again>
--
Rob.
Eric Jarvis
I wouldn't be...just about all of that sounded VERY familiar
'course the accents are different here and the Guinness isn't as
good
Ian Sharrock
Alistair Mann <alis...@3legsbandit.com> writes
>
>>
>>Rogi <ro...@rogis.com> wrote in message
>>news:3Yu=OsErtOvFPsZCNAY=HzTy...@4ax.com...
>>> On Mon, 26 Mar 2001 15:32:25 GMT, alu...@texis.com (Alun Jones)
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> >In article <57qv6.21192$PF4....@news.iol.ie>, "Howard Beale"
>>> ><how...@REMOVEmad-as-hell.com> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> You should spend some time on soc.culture.irish. You'll see it doesn't
>>take
>>> >> much to offend them :-)
>>> >
>>> >In fact, those two sentences alone are almost certainly enough.
>>>
>>> That has to be the most insane ng on the planet doesn't it? ;-)
>>
>>No wonder I'm as mad as hell
>
>I went and had a bit of a gander. I think I'll agree with Rogi there! They
>are definitely a bit batty.
>I tell you tis madness gone mad
I warned you.... My grandfather, ahem, "was invited to leave" many,
many decades ago after pissing off a certain set of people. It says a
lot that he ended up as a subsistence farmer in a remote area of
Derbyshire - he went to his grave without anyone in the family knowing
what he got up to.
I've been advised more than once not to mention this to some people, for
fear of "consequences". You just discovered that some of the
inhabitants of that island could win Olympic medals for holding a
Grudge. I believe there are some Scots that feel the same way about
shoes.
Put it this way - I know people who, upon being told you're Jewish, will
want to know if you're Catholic Jew or a Protestant Jew - go figure :-)
Ken Tough
>Junior agriculture minister had to resign because he didn't let on that he
>was feeding his pigs meat and bone meal, when he voted against banning it.
>(Owner of the largest piggery in Ireland)
strange... Given that people must have known he was a big pig
owner, what's the logic here? If he'd voted to ban it but
continued to use it, that would be one thing. But doesn't it
just show the strength of his convictions?
--
Ken Tough
Howard Beale
Ken Tough <k...@objectech.co.uk> wrote in message
news:3DGzwZLk...@panix.com...
Before the EU finally decided to ban it, it was considered pretty bad form
to use the stuff for feeding pigs, and most farmers didn't. O'Keefe is just
another in a long line of Irish politicians who don't give a damn about
public health. (It's no time since 80,000 children here were given polio
vaccine made with the blood of a British donor later diagnosed with vCJD, a
vaccine that even the British authorities considered too risky) You need to
bear in mind the present political climate over here, we have tribunals
investigating massive political corruption that has taken 20 years to be
exposed, the surface of which is only just being scratched.
Eric Jarvis
nope...it shows his inability to know when to admit that he has a
vested interest before a debate
even if people know it you have to formally register a vested
interest in just about every sensible parliament the world
over...it's not so much a matter of keeping something secret as a
matter of publicly admitting to being biased
Rogi
wrote:
<snipped all over>
> I believe there are some Scots that feel the same way about
>shoes.
Eh? Sorry but even though admittedly I only just woke up, what the
hell is that all about??
LOL...
--
Rob.
Ian Sharrock
<ro...@rogis.com> writes
Imagine "invading" army from guess where (with crap footwear), chances
upon Scottish village and nicks all their shoes. Literally.
They still bitch about it today, apparently.
The story is best recanted by the Big Yin in his World Tour of Scotland.