looks like he found his story
nacsa chair
TRAGEDY OF FAILED CHILD SUPPORT AGENCY
EXCLUSIVE CSA left Dad with £12 a week to live on.. I blame them for his
suicide
By Clare Raymond
STACEY McKay was just five years old when her father Jim strung a nylon
washing line from the loft and hanged himself.
His suicide was the sixth in a shocking register of 100 desperate fathers
who are believed to have killed themselves because of the demands of the
notorious Child Support Agency.
Now, as government ministers finally admit the Tory-inspired and much-hated
CSA needs a radical shake-up, Stacey has spoken of the lifelong heartache
caused by the inept system which has driven so many dads to despair.
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Father-of-two Jim McKay was just 35 and an unemployed painter and decorator
when he took his life back in 1994.
He had apparently been driven to suicide after Jackie Quinn, the mother of
his children, was forced to sign papers giving the CSA the right to demand
money from him, or face having her own benefits cut.
Twelve years on, Stacey, now 18, lays the blame for her father's suicide at
the door of the CSA which, after ordering him to pay almost £30 a week, had
left him with just £12 a week to live on.
"There is no way he would have taken his own life if he'd had enough money
to live," she says. "They put him under a lot of pressure. I want people to
know that the CSA has ruined my life, my little brother's life and my
mother's life.
"It is 12 years since my dad died and many other families have lost fathers
too, yet nothing has been done in all that time to change the system. They
just don't care.
"I have grown up without my father and there isn't a day that goes by when I
don't think about him and wish he was here. If it wasn't for the CSA, my dad
would still be here."
At the time of Jim's death, the agency's then boss Ros Hepplewhite denied
responsibility for a spate of suicides.
"These sorts of tragedies happened before the CSA," she said. "We are, I
think, jumping to conclusions quite wrongly."
Since her statement 12 years ago a further 93 suicides have, rightly or
wrongly, been blamed on the agency.
Last week Work and Pensions Secretary John Hutton finally admitted the CSA's
performance was "simply not acceptable" and that a "very radical shake-up"
was required.
Despite 1,000 extra staff being drafted in to clear a backlog of cases, the
number which remain unresolved has climbed to 333,000 - 6,000 higher than in
December last year.
Cases are taking an average of 38 weeks to clear and over a fifth of calls
to the agency for new cases are going unanswered. Officials have been
accused of losing files, misplacing correspondence and delaying payments.
Last year Tony Blair admitted it costs the CSA £3 for every £2 it recovers.
But John Hutton admits that while a review of the child support system is
expected to report back by the end of the month, implementing any changes
will take several years. The endless delays and frustrations enrage Stacey,
who lives in Glasgow.
"It's a joke," she says. "It's been 12 years since my father died. How many
more children are going to lose their fathers while this mess is being
sorted out?"
Jim McKay had met her mother Jackie at a dance and when they moved in
together soon afterwards he became dad to her children from a previous
relationship,John, now 22, and Rosie, 21.
"Jim was brilliant with them. He was a gentle giant," says Jackie, 40.He was
a gentle giant," says Jackie, 40. "He treated them as his own.
"Soon the couple had two children of their own - Stacey and, three years
later, her brother James, now 15.
"Before my mum and dad split up, we were a very happy family," says Stacey,
who plans to become a beauty therapist. "I remember us going to the park and
shops, and playing games at home.
"I loved my dad, he was good fun and he made me laugh. I remember he had a
bad leg and he used a walking stick.
"Then I remember waking up one day and my daddy wasn't there any more. My
mum said they had fallen out and that dad would be staying somewhere else.
"I was really upset."
They put him under so much pressure .. they ruined my life, my mum's life
and my brother's
HER mother remembers: "Jim and I had been together for eight years, but at
the time we just weren't getting on.
"We were rowing a lot and I thought it was better to separate rather than
argue in front of the children.
"In October 1993 I took them with me to stay with my brother and
sister-in-law. I used to take the children to his brother's house so Jim
could see them there. After I applied to be rehoused, I was asked to fill
out forms to apply for benefits. I didn't want any money from Jim because I
knew he was on the dole and he couldn't afford it.
"He needed an operation on his knee cartilage which meant he was unable to
work.
"I had no intention of giving the CSA any information whatsoever. So I
didn't give his current address, but wrote down an old one.
"We'd separated before, but always got back together so it probably would
have happened again."
But before they had a chance of a reconciliation, Jim took his own life,
just five months after they'd parted.
Letters from the CSA demanding maintenance payments for his kids were found
on his living room table after he died. They would have apparently reduced
his unemployment and sickness benefit from £39.90 to £12 a week.
At the time of his death, Jim's brother Edward said: "We just didn't know
how he was going to manage. He had absolutely no money."
Today Stacey cries as she remembers sitting in her uncle's living room on
March 19, 1994, as her father's best friend Frannie broke the news to her
mother.
Frannie had found Jim's body hanging from an attic hatch with a nylon rope
round his neck at his council house in Rutherglen, Glasgow.
"Even though I was very young I remember a lot," says Stacey.
"I didn't fully understand what was happening, but I knew that my daddy
wasn't coming back and that I'd never see him again. It was heartbreaking.
As a child I dealt with his death in my own way and kept my feelings to
myself.
"I became very curious about my dad and wanted to find out more about him
and how he died.
"All my friends had a dad and I didn't. I used to ask Mum what it was like
to grow up with a father and why he wasn't around.
"I wanted to know every little detail. I read all the newspaper cuttings
from the time.
"Mum has always been very open and honest about dad's death which I'm glad
about.
"But after all these years, I still can't believe that the CSA expected him
to live on less than £12 a week - nobody could live on that.
"My mum had no idea that he was being left with so little money.
"I think it's an absolute disgrace. They don't care about how many people's
lives they ruin.
"Every Christmas, birthday, holiday and when I've just been having a bad
time, I have wanted my dad to be here. I want him to be here when I get
married, to walk me down the aisle and all the other big occasions in my
life."
Her mother remembers: "It was such a shock when Jim killed himself.
"I was devastated. I felt guilty because I had left him. I blamed myself.
"Stacey became very withdrawn and started wetting the bed all the time.
James was only two and a half so he was too young to understand, he can't
remember his dad.
"I think it's shocking that they expected Jim to live on £12 a week.
"Now it's a bit late for the government to be admitting that the CSA hasn't
worked.
"But it's better now than not at all, especially after all the lives that
have been wasted.
"There are so many children out there who have had to grow up without a
father."
I knew that I'd never see my daddy again and after all these years I still
miss him.
Martin Davies
then it was £2.30 a week
As for the £3 cost to collect £2, that looks like the media are simply
twisting things again. Does anyone know where they are getting that sort of
figure from?
As for Jim, we'll perhaps never know exactly what drove him to suicide. He
had broken up from a long term relationship, he had what sounds like a crap
assessment (though back then a lot of assessments were brutal compared to
these days). But little else is known.
A hundred suicides - in 13 years?
Hey, when are prisons going to be banned? When is alcohol going to be
banned? When are drugs going to be banned? All have been blamed for
considerably more than 100 suicides in the last 13 years. Or maybe the thing
to blame is mental state?
Martin <><
--
http://www.cashisallyouneed.co.uk/
nacsa chair
all its an individuals choice to embark in those areas. But with CSA - you
face bureacracy gone mad, with powers that are vicious and often misused,
and absolutely no control over the situation.
It is a government department inflicting this level of pressure - so to make
a fair comparison we should look at how many other Government depts have
lead to people taking this course of action.
A drug addict can get rehabilitation help.
Alcoholics get rehabilitation help
Offenders get rehabilitation help
CSA victims - get blamed as deadbeats.
NACSA CHAIR
"Martin Davies" <mart...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:qJnsg.51582$181....@fe3.news.blueyonder.co.uk...
csa...@fsmail.net
on its own merits and comparisons with other situations are irrelavant.
Conceived by Parliament, even the mother lambasts its illconceived
Hammer House of Horrors child as incompetent and scandelous, yet
together they conspire to blame anything (usually computers) and anyone
(usually dads) for their own failings. Were a Supernanny to be sent
in to sort out the situation she would first deal with the parents
(MPs?), for it is they who have made the child what it is by allowing
it to get away with its outragous behaviour for so long.
You say it is bureacracy gone and that is true, but when targets are
everything more sinister goings on often come to the fore. We see it
in the manipulation of hospital waiting lists, the inequitable special
attention given to school pupils on the GCSE grade C/D boundaries, and
targetting of responsible dads by the CSA - are all indefensible. And
what of those officers at the CSA who abuse their position and/or the
luidicriously incomprehensible legislation? That the Parliamentary
Ombudsman finds in favour of 85% of cases referred to it by parents,
illustrates the Agency is totally incapable of dealing with complaints
against its own staff. That is perhaps not surprising given that
unlike any other organisation I have ever dealt with, the CSA appears
to pass on complaints to the very individuals/teams being complained
about to manage the case and answer the complaint against them. That
is why they can get away with it , why many fathers despair and some
are pushed too far.
As I said in my first paragraph, the parents have much to answer for.
Red Melons
> As for Jim, we'll perhaps never know exactly what drove him to suicide ....
You know Martin / Palladin / ???, you really don't need to bother
posting in every topic - I am sure that everybody who has participated
in this newsgroup for any length of time could write your responses word
for word.
Sometimes though you should just have the decency to keep quiet - you
really are (an) insensitive clod(s) (NACSA members will be aware of more
than one person posting as 'Paladdin').
What drives you to play this loathsome role in other peoples' misery?
You have no children, and have never had a CSA case, yet you insist upon
performing your snide little role in every forum where CSA victims look
for support (anybody who has read posts in other forums will have come
across you in one guise or another).
So other than being an ex-CSA employee what exactly is your motivation
for defending the CSA at every opportunity? Let's face it, either you
receive some incentive from the CSA, or you get some creepy pleasure out
of winding up genuine victims of the CSA. I'm not sure which is worse.
You have never known the despair of seeing your, and your family's lives
go down the pan for no other reason than a vindictive government attack
upon people unable to defend themselves PWC's and NRP's), so how about a
little bit of humility and sensitivity please? Better still, find a real
hobby!
Fletcher
to busy warmongering and brownmouthing with bush to notice anything, let
alone the child, then we have the self confessed fornicating adulterer
ensuring that a forign billionaire business man can help finacialy rack and
ruin possibly hundreds, if not thousands of families by introducing a super
gambling den, of course as gambling is heavily taxed their may be a little,
shall we say self interest as far as this government is concerned, never
mind the cowboy boots and Stetson.
These MP's are not about to do anything regarding this Gestapo agency when
their is so much fun to be had brownmouthing with the yanks, hell killing
and gambling and Christ their even going to give Tony a fucking medal to go
along with his multimillion pound retirement plan!
<csa...@fsmail.net> wrote in message
news:1152541794.8...@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
Martin Davies
> I think the analogy of prisons, drugs and alcohol are
> misconceiving...after all its an individuals choice to embark in
> those areas. But with CSA - you face bureacracy gone mad, with
> powers that are vicious and often misused, and absolutely no control
> over the situation.
No control? Or no control they are willing to take?
I wouldn't exactly say its individuals choice to embark in those areas, some
do drift into it, others make a mistake (as can happen to any of us) with
consequences.
Getting away from it isn't always easy.
> It is a government department inflicting this level of pressure - so
> to make a fair comparison we should look at how many other Government
> depts have lead to people taking this course of action.
>
> A drug addict can get rehabilitation help.
After a few weeks or months, though why should they want to unless they want
to change?
And do they go through withdrawal in the meantime, or get the next fix?
Even the treatments aren't always great - methadone is used for heroin
addiction but has been known to kill.
Yet still prescribed and given.
> Alcoholics get rehabilitation help
Again, after a few weeks or months.
> Offenders get rehabilitation help
Limited, and not always geared to the individual very much.
>
> CSA victims - get blamed as deadbeats.
Oh look, they can get help from among other things, NACSA.
Seriously, there are always outs that don't involve suicide. Just depends on
the support and help being offered at the time, and the person's own ability
and willingness to do what is necessary.
For some NRPs that involves quitting work. For others changing their
lifestyle, moving abroad, taking on extra work or whatever. And yes, some
will suicide - for whatever reason.
>
> NACSA CHAIR
>
<snipped>
Martin <><
JB
"Red Melons" <red.m...@scrap.the.csa> wrote in message
news:1041710262964050....@news.tiscali.co.uk...
I've been trying to say something similar for a while....can't do better
than the above.
csa...@fsmail.net
Martin Davies wrote:> >
> Seriously, there are always outs that don't involve suicide. Just depends on
> the support and help being offered at the time, and the person's own ability
> and willingness to do what is necessary.
> For some NRPs that involves quitting work. For others changing their
> lifestyle, moving abroad, taking on extra work or whatever. And yes, some
> will suicide - for whatever reason.
Not sure I can believe what I am reading. Is this a justification for
CSA incompetence? Is it that the deaths, poverty and missery caused by
the incompetent of a Goverment Department simply acceptable collateral
damage in aTreasury war on fathers?
I cannot buy that. It is as abohrant as racism.
*@*
>>
>Amen to that!
>I've been trying to say something similar for a while....can't do better
>than the above.
>
Same!
Martin, At times you`ve posted and given good advice, many times
though your comments have been biased away from the NRP and towards
the CSA, give some thought and consideration to some of your
postings/reply's please