Paint won't stick to bathroom ceiling
Mark & Dianne Barber-Riley
Painted it a few years back when it was newly plastered, after a short while
it started to 'craze' and some bits peeled off. I clear up the damage and
repainted, mostly successfully.
This year I went to re-decorate and I made sure I removed all the loose
paint, lots came off in sheets of just paint. Repainting produced the same
problems, the paint is crazing and peeling off.
The ceiling in the room next door, plastered at the same time has absolutely
no problem.
Any suggestions as to why or how to overcome the problem?
Thanks
Mark
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Alan McGowan
"Mark & Dianne Barber-Riley" <bri...@onetel.co.uk> wrote in message
news:3d25c...@corp.newsgroups.com...
> Why won't my paint stick to the bathroom ceiling?
>
> Painted it a few years back when it was newly plastered, after a short
while
> it started to 'craze' and some bits peeled off. I clear up the damage and
> repainted, mostly successfully.
>
> This year I went to re-decorate and I made sure I removed all the loose
> paint, lots came off in sheets of just paint. Repainting produced the same
> problems, the paint is crazing and peeling off.
>
> The ceiling in the room next door, plastered at the same time has
absolutely
> no problem.
>
> Any suggestions as to why or how to overcome the problem?
>
I have a similar problem with my dining room ceiling which is artex. When I
scraped off the flaky paint the artex underneath was very powdery. I selaed
with a brick sealer and then painted and all is now well.
Alan
Mark & Dianne Barber-Riley
"Alan McGowan" <al...@mcgowana.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:3d25e1fe$0$234$cc9e...@news.dial.pipex.com...
The underlying plaster is (IMHO) in excellent condition.
Max Bone
>
>Painted it a few years back when it was newly plastered, after a short while
>it started to 'craze' and some bits peeled off. I clear up the damage and
>repainted, mostly successfully.
>
>This year I went to re-decorate and I made sure I removed all the loose
>paint, lots came off in sheets of just paint. Repainting produced the same
>problems, the paint is crazing and peeling off.
We would need to know a bit more about the process you used to paint the
bare plaster (i.e. did you thin the first coat of emulsion?), the
condition of the plaster (i.e. smooth/shiny/hard... and/or a hot surface
- does a drop of water put on the bare surface get sucked into the
plaster immediately), the time of year which you decorated...
Usually the sort of symptoms which you describe are caused by either a
very 'hot' surface onto which you have applied an unthinned emulsion, or
over troweled plaster, which can form a very dense hard finish covered
in plaster fines which emulsions can have difficulty adhering to - not
very common now.
Additionally poor drying/ventilation and condensation at the time of
application can sometimes complicate the situation by retarding the
drying process and preventing the coating from forming a film correctly.
This is common in bathrooms where steam/moisture is likely to occur, and
particularly during the colder months of the year...
...last but not least... type/quality of paint, and the use of deep
tinted shades can contribute...
But it's hard to make a considered guess without a little more
information...
Regards
--
Max Bone Decorating Direct Ltd
http://www.decoratingdirect.co.uk/
hundreds of products - secure online ordering - delivered to your door
Mark & Dianne Barber-Riley
"Max Bone" <m...@decoratingdirect.co.uk> wrote in message
news:GO9TJRA9...@decoratingdirect.demon.co.uk...
Lots of questions -
I painted the bare plaster, first with slightly diluted white emulsion
(Dulux I think) which was sucked up. The second coat of emulsion seemed to
go on fine.
The plaster is smooth but seems a little shinny to my mind.
Painting was in the summer (I do not do UK winters) and the room always has
some ventilation.
I do wonder why one room has problems but not the other, maybe one being a
bathroom the other a work room but next to each other might be the reason.
Max Bone
>(Dulux I think) which was sucked up.
'..slightly diluted..' seems like a contributing factor, normally with a
good quality trade emulsion you would add a minimum of 5 litres of water
to 15 litres of paint... If this is not done the coating is sucked dry
before it has had time to correctly form a film and adhere to the
surface. The excess water satisfies the porosity of the plaster, whilst
allowing the coating to dry out correctly and form a proper bond with
the substrate.
>The plaster is smooth but seems a little shinny to my mind.
This seems like another factor... in which case you will need to prime
the ceiling with an oil-based primer suitable for use on new plaster to
aid adhesion before attempting to redecorate with emulsion.
In either case... once you have removed all loose and flaking coatings
and got back to a sound surface, I would prime with an oil-based primer
(as above) first... this should prevent any repeat of your problems...
Regards
--
Max Bone Decorating Direct Ltd
Mark & Dianne Barber-Riley
Thanks,
I'll go back to square one and try oil based primer.
Paul D.Smith
it's water based emulsion? Won't it just "float" on the oil base?
Paul DS.
stuart noble
Paul D.Smith wrote in message
<3d295ff3$0$234$ed9e...@reading.news.pipex.net>...
>If you prime with an oil based primer, how well will the top coat adhere if
>it's water based emulsion? Won't it just "float" on the oil base?
N. Thornton
I've had the same situation, with emulsion not sticking. First time I
made the mistake of using oil based primer, and putting emulsion on
it. It worked, but it took 3 coats of emulsion to even begin to look
reasonable. It covered very badly, but got there in the end.
The second time I used glue instead to prime. Emulsion went on
excellently once the glue was dry: easier, cleaner, cheaper... and it
is lasting better too.
Regards, NT
Max Bone
>>> adhere if it's water based emulsion? Won't it just "float" on
>>> the oil base?
>>
>> No, as long as the primer is dry.
>
>I've had the same situation, with emulsion not sticking. First time I
>made the mistake of using oil based primer, and putting emulsion on
>it. It worked, but it took 3 coats of emulsion to even begin to look
>reasonable. It covered very badly, but got there in the end.
There should be no problems using a solvent-borne primer for
plaster/concrete underneath a water-borne emulsion. The only important
rule to follow is to allow sufficient time for the solvents to evaporate
before overcoating with the emulsion... otherwise you will find the
emulsion 'sissing'.
If your emulsion 'covered very badly' this is a problem of it's
formulation... in particular its opacity (covering power), and/or your
application technique... it is certainly not related to the use of a
solvent-borne primer.
cl...@clara.co.uk
<m...@decoratingdirect.co.uk> wrote:
Snip..................................................................................
>There should be no problems using a solvent-borne primer for
>plaster/concrete underneath a water-borne emulsion. The only important
>rule to follow is to allow sufficient time for the solvents to evaporate
>before overcoating with the emulsion... otherwise you will find the
>emulsion 'sissing'.
>
>If your emulsion 'covered very badly' this is a problem of it's
>formulation... in particular its opacity (covering power), and/or your
>application technique... it is certainly not related to the use of a
>solvent-borne primer.
>
>Regards
>Max
Max
I read somewhere that it is not good practice to combine ANY water
based products with oil based ones and vise versa.
Water based with water based and oil based with oil based and no
mixing whatsoever was the message.
Your comments please.
Chris
'In effect they will be your masters,
your lawmakers - oh,and incidentally,
it will be a crime to sell goods in
pounds and ounces.....
Max Bone
>I read somewhere that it is not good practice to combine ANY water
>based products with oil based ones and vise versa.
>
>Water based with water based and oil based with oil based and no
>mixing whatsoever was the message.
Unfortunately this has become the message that people remember...
despite it being incorrect.
It seems to have developed as an easy way for manufacturers to avoid
problems with users overcoating solvent-borne systems with water-bornes
before all the solvent has evaporated (72 hours plus). To stop users
from mixing/matching and debasing manufacturers more expensive water-
borne coatings systems, and a lot of mumbo-jumbo over Moisture Vapour
Permeability of water-borne systems when they are used to overcoat a
solvent-borne system.
stuart noble
>I read somewhere that it is not good practice to combine ANY water
>based products with oil based ones and vise versa.
N. Thornton
> >N. Thornton <big...@meeow.co.uk> wrote
> If your emulsion 'covered very badly' this is a problem of it's
> formulation... in particular its opacity (covering power), and/or your
> application technique... it is certainly not related to the use of a
> solvent-borne primer.
That figures. It was some old rock bottom quality stuff we had lying
around. Actually it looked more like distemper than emulsion.
Regards, NT