Japan's new piracy laws

[Booga]

Did anyone even know about this? it is a supprise to me.

 

http://anonpr.net/opjapan-expect-us-512/

[Garrett deRosset]

Yep.  In a completely unrelated finding, isn't it interesting how HDD prices showed a jump in prices this month?

The law is enacted in October.  It only applies to visual audio media from what I understand.  Games are somehow excluded from it.  

On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 4:16 PM, Booga <boo...@gmail.com> wrote:

Did anyone even know about this? it is a supprise to me.

 

http://anonpr.net/opjapan-expect-us-512/

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TokyoHackerSpace" group.
To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/tokyohackerspace/-/NVk4bvRzMOsJ.
To post to this group, send email to tokyohac...@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tokyohackerspa...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/tokyohackerspace?hl=en.

[fakufaku]

I think I heard about it a few times.

I wonder how they are going to enforce it.

I suppose the crack down will first and foremost be on Japanese language media and JP language oriented sharing tools (winny and the like).

I don't think they'll begin with bittorrent and EN language media. Just my opinion.

[fakufaku]

For those of us who might need it, we could setup freenet nodes.
https://freenetproject.org/

[Akiba]

It was in the news about a week and a half ago when it passed:

http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2012/06/japan-download-copyright-law/

 

Akiba

FreakLabs Open Source Wireless

Web: http://www.freaklabs.org

Shop:http://www.freaklabsstore.com

Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/freaklabs

 

---

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TokyoHackerSpace" group.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/tokyohackerspace/-/USUtO1GQkhkJ.

[Usmar A Padow]

So they are spying on every citizen already? Man. This will cause trouble

Do they really need to fill the prisons with pirates?  I don't like this at all

[fakufaku]

I think it is doomed just considering the cost of enforcing the law, trying suspects, keeping them in jail.

Most likely a few people will get caught and have huge sums of money to pay and then it will be over somehow.

For foreigners however, that could be ground to be sent home I suppose... Let's be careful.

[Usmar A Padow]

You would think so.  But it is similar to criminalizing drugs. And drugs are criminalized. 

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TokyoHackerSpace" group.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/tokyohackerspace/-/SNgV_u6PXjoJ.

[fakufaku]

Good point. I think there's a difference though. I'm not sure (hard) drugs were that widespread when the war on drugs started. The war ironically helped make it a very profitable activity worth spreading to a very large market.

[fakufaku]

 http://healthland.time.com/2012/06/28/how-the-global-war-on-drugs-drives-hiv-and-aids/

[Chris Harrington]

It's a ten year jail sentence, plus fines up to 20 grand. With this
development, chances are that it is a matter of time until Bit Torrent
is simply blocked by all providers. If you use it for legitimate
purposes *cough* then you would need to sign up for a VPN service (and
remember, this is the country where they punished the guy who wrote a
file sharing program).

Sure, domestic sharing tools are higher priority in Japan, but I've
met the people who worked to get this enacted. They are not lazy
people. They are motivated, intelligent, and they believe in what they
are doing. I actually personally like the guy who heads (headed? not
sure if still) up the software industry's anti-copy group. We went out
drinking once. He reminds me of some character from The Untouchables.

Chris Harrington
chris.har...@gmail.com
http://chris.harrington.jp/
http://gplus.to/chrisharrington
090-8812-8911

[Usmar A Padow]

May I take a moment to remind everyone that deterrence has been proven not to work. Look at all the murders that are committed even-though people know the punishment is hanging here in Japan

[Taylan Ayken]

Well, it is dejavu all over again. About a year ago, they were discussing a law about anti-piracy. A part of it said that ISPs will be held responsible if a user of their service is using it for piracy. The thing is we have one ISP and it blocked access to all file sharing websites. You can get rid of that by changing DNS settings but with the same law, they made it illegal and if you changed your DNS settings a warning was displayed on your screen (Chris, is it possible to detect this? And how?). I don't know the latest developments and if the law passed (these were developments while it was being discussed, before the law passed) but I can see many parallels.

I have always found it funny that Japan has some restrictions related to Torrent. The thing is, it is the best way to share operating systems, some developers share it that way. Raspberry Pi guys were doing the same thing to ease the traffic on their server.

Heck, if someone wants to download sth illegal, change your MAC address, turn your wireless security to WEP and when they find you say that someone probably hacked your wireless and downloaded that file. Plausible deniability is a nice thing.

---

From: Chris Harrington <chris.har...@gmail.com>
To: tokyohac...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Friday, June 29, 2012 5:20 PM
Subject: Re: [THS:18725] Japan's new piracy laws

> tokyohackerspace+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/tokyohackerspace?hl=en.
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "TokyoHackerSpace" group.
> To post to this group, send email to tokyohac...@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to

> tokyohackerspace+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/tokyohackerspace?hl=en.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TokyoHackerSpace" group.
To post to this group, send email to tokyohac...@googlegroups.com.

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tokyohackerspace+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

[Usmar A Padow]

Actually just blocking bit torrent would be preferable to putting people in jail

On 2012/06/29, at 17:20, Chris Harrington <chris.har...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Torsten Wagner]

This kind of law is not to punish someone for what they were made for. These laws are made as a sort of last way to punish someone who otherwise behaves absolutely legal.

Take e.g. someone who might get to powerful for certain cooperates or politicians. How easy it is now to find someone in his closest family circle who by chance have for whatever reason a copy of a video or some mp3....
Just tell him to stop whatever he is doing and you would do him a favour and you would overlook the crime within his family.

The point is these laws can't be applied to each and every citizen. However, they are nice to have if you look for a reason to bring someone in trouble...

Bad bad bad

Totti
 
 

On Jun 29, 2012 4:16 PM, "Booga" <boo...@gmail.com> wrote:

Did anyone even know about this? it is a supprise to me.

 

http://anonpr.net/opjapan-expect-us-512/

--

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TokyoHackerSpace" group.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/tokyohackerspace/-/NVk4bvRzMOsJ.

[Kalin KOZHUHAROV]

On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 5:45 PM, Taylan Ayken <taylan...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> You can get rid of
> that by changing DNS settings but with the same law, they made it illegal
> and if you changed your DNS settings a warning was displayed on your screen
> (Chris, is it possible to detect this? And how?).
>

As easy as looking at your traffic on udp/53 ...
Get yourself a hosted server and tunnel everything to it via ssh
running on port 443, so most people will suspect you are conecting to
a https web site. Depending on how well your security policies are
written, it might actually be not denied (and I haven't consulted
TITech, so no worries) ;-D

Kalin.

[Garrett deRosset]

Any tips on where to start with a hosted server Kalin?

Kalin.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TokyoHackerSpace" group.
To post to this group, send email to tokyohac...@googlegroups.com.

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tokyohackerspa...@googlegroups.com.

[Taylan Ayken]

This problem is not related to Titech, but to Turkey. So I guess my ass is already covered. :)

But I have some other plans for Titech, a few months ago they finally gave the right to access ftp. It was blocked before, why? I have no idea!

---

From: Kalin KOZHUHAROV <me.k...@gmail.com>
To: tokyohac...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Friday, June 29, 2012 10:40 PM
Subject: Re: [THS:18736] Japan's new piracy laws

[MRE]

Its something to watch very carefully, but I suspect the nation will
have a much tougher time enforcing it than they think.

Look at how the RIAA handled it. Yeah, there are always a few
unfortunate targets, who get made an example of, but in general, it
cant be stopped.
10 years later, and we all still have MP3s, listen to music online,
and vast collections we didn't pay for.

The musicians figured it all out long ago: Money is made on live
performance. Forget about the loses of illegal downloads. Its
pointless to fight, and only serves to alienate your fans. But fans
come to shows, and buy CDs and other merch to commemorate the live
event.

For movies, its the same thing. Make good movies. Create a unique
atmosphere at the movie theater, and people will come. Reinvent the
"movie date." Yes, theaters are closing down all over the world, due
to services like netflix, pay-per-view and internet watching. But
there will ALWAYS be a desire to go OUT to a movie. Worry about
capturing THOSE profits, rather than chasing down people who download.
I am one of those people. But I still like to go to the movies. Were I
still in the US, I would be using a legal service like netflix. But I
am in Japan. It takes FOREVER for movies to make it over here. So yea,
I download the shit out of them. Same with TV shows. Heck, those
advertising dollars were already earned. I am not costing anyone
ANYTHING by watching the download 2 days later. Unless they want me to
mail them a penny for every commercial I wasnt spoon fed.

Software... same deal. Corporations will pay. They have no choice. But
they need the product. But making individuals pay for much of this
stuff is just pointless. It only alienates users. Think about it:
Microsoft gives away Visual Studio (with some small limitations) to
anyone. Lots of people pick it up and learn how to write code with it
in school. Those students become employees and explain that they are
most comfortable in Visual Studio. IF enough young talent comes out
saying the same thing, eventually corporations by Visual Studio.

Free software and free content BUILD business, rather than strip it
down of all its profit.
Its the greedy bastards shouting MORE MORE MORE that ruin it for
everyone, ultimately including themselves.

Think of it like this:
You can buy a car from anyone.
But would you really buy a car from the guy who absolutely refuses to
let you take a test drive? Would you buy a car from the guy who is a
total assholedick? Would you buy a car from the guy who keeps raising
the price every time you want to look under the hood?

[Garrett deRosset]

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TokyoHackerSpace" group.
To post to this group, send email to tokyohac...@googlegroups.com.

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tokyohackerspa...@googlegroups.com.

[Kalin KOZHUHAROV]

On Fri, Jun 29, 2012 at 11:01 PM, Garrett deRosset
<garrett...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Any tips on where to start with a hosted server Kalin?
>

I recently am using vr.org, they support Gentoo, so it saves a bit of
effort on my side.

Kalin.

[Torsten Wagner]

I wonder if those kind of laws can be easily put down by asking the
right people the right questions...

* Ask Yodobashi how they will deal with there now pirating airing of
cinema movies in there shops.
* Ask NTT, Softbank and Co how they will deal with the fact that demo
devices in there store might be misused and hence there MAC might be
on bad-list already before they start to sell the device as "display"
unit
* Ask Starbucks, Libraries and Unversities, etc. how they will deal
with pirating stuff from there PCs resp. there public wifi networks.
* Ask big companies, ask the government itself, how they plan to deal
with cases where an infringement was done from within there PC-pool.

If those groups suddenly get aware they might be at risk to be a
target... they might let there lawyer armies loose and we can sit back
and enjoy the show.

in addition people could get pro-active.
Just download like crazy 100% legal content on torrent. Log all you do
with very high accuracy and precision. Making each and every one in
the spy-chain targeting you. Then let it come down to a trial and
proof that you indeed did nothing wrong. Well I know that is not easy
going, and people who plan to do so should be well aware of the risk,
being lawyers them-self, or work with a team of supporting lawyers.

A third aspect is that you have now a rather simple weapon to bring
people in trouble... hack into there PCs. No need to search for
sensitive data... simply will there HDD with pirated stuff... ring the
tip-line of the police/lawyers and you might send him to prison ....
bad really bad

On 29 June 2012 16:16, Booga <boo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Did anyone even know about this? it is a supprise to me.
>
> http://anonpr.net/opjapan-expect-us-512/
>

> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "TokyoHackerSpace" group.

> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msg/tokyohackerspace/-/NVk4bvRzMOsJ.

[MRE]

encrypted torrents?

[MRE]

Dang.. broke the law 4 times already today.

On Jul 1, 2:15 pm, MRE <epreme...@gmail.com> wrote:
> encrypted torrents?

[fakufaku]

Starts in October.

[Kalin KOZHUHAROV]

Amendments to the law stating the fines:
http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-19767970

Kalin.

[Mikele]

also
http://boingboing.net/2012/10/01/japan-competes-with-panama-to.html

Kalin.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TokyoHackerSpace" group.

[sean toczko]

all courtesy of the local branch of the RIAA (RIAJ).

of course the tech-savvy geniuses who created this steaming pile, also claim youtube viewing is classed as "illegal downloading" if it's deemed "illegal"

raises ALL sorts of questions.

[Mikele]

conspirationist POV:
watch youtube, no prosecution (2 years jail and fine), but gets under legal and justified internet surveillance.
is 1984 getting closer?

[Torsten Wagner]

1984 is past already....
1984 relay on terminals in your house and on the fact that people spy at you
we already got much worse that this utopia
We offer our-self on social platforms and carry devices around which
allows to track us at all time...
George Orwell would have a heck of fun writing 2084
Totti

[Mikele]

ok... yes.
the BIG BROTHER show and the large audience was the insult to injury already

[Taylan Ayken]

If I may quote all the lawmakers out there: "If you are not doing something illegal, why are you worried? You got something to hide?"

No more illegal downloads guys, you have to actually buy those AKB48 albums.

---

From: Torsten Wagner <torsten...@gmail.com>
To: tokyohac...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 3, 2012 12:56 PM
Subject: Re: [THS:20507] Re: Japan's new piracy laws

>>>> tokyohackerspace+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

>>>> For more options, visit this group at
>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/tokyohackerspace?hl=en.
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>>> "TokyoHackerSpace" group.
>>> To post to this group, send email to tokyohac...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to

>>> tokyohackerspace+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

>>> For more options, visit this group at
>>> http://groups.google.com/group/tokyohackerspace?hl=en.
>>
>>
>> --
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "TokyoHackerSpace" group.
>> To post to this group, send email to tokyohac...@googlegroups.com.
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to

>> tokyohackerspace+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

>> For more options, visit this group at
>> http://groups.google.com/group/tokyohackerspace?hl=en.
>
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "TokyoHackerSpace" group.
> To post to this group, send email to tokyohac...@googlegroups.com.
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to

> tokyohackerspace+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

> For more options, visit this group at
> http://groups.google.com/group/tokyohackerspace?hl=en.

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TokyoHackerSpace" group.
To post to this group, send email to tokyohac...@googlegroups.com.

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tokyohackerspace+unsub...@googlegroups.com.

[Mikele]

yeah... but you see, I do not download stuff... never bothered with bit-torrent.
I rent my movie from the store or iTunes (flames on me)
BUT
I do watch stuff on youtube... and I have no idea what the copyright deal is there, I assume that, since it is there, it is legal... I sometime donwload youtube videos in HD for later vision... especially if they keep buffering.
and I do listen music on grooveshark ... same assumptions...
in my case, if I really like what I listen to, I do buy the plastic CD from Amazon... so I am convinced that youtube and grooveshark can fit very well in a marketing strategy to have actual sales...

in any case, life should be simpler... and not all countries follow this model.

To unsubscribe from this group, send email to tokyohackerspa...@googlegroups.com.

[sean toczko]

I think it's very possible that once people start getting arrested and charged with data transfers that are actually legal, the police will decide that the law is fucked up & bullshit. especially if the people getting nailed are LDP and DPJ staff and politicians.

The scary thing is that the RIAJ wants ISPs to filter traffic at the source, i.e. YOUR home, for which benefit the ISP will pay the RIAJ a purely 'nominal' fee.

[fakufaku]

The scary thing is that the RIAJ wants ISPs to filter traffic at the source, i.e. YOUR home, for which benefit the ISP will pay the RIAJ a purely 'nominal' fee.

Genius. This is how you make a living with music in 2012. Suck it, guitar wielding hippies! 

[MRE]

The RIAJ will go aftwr some people, make examples of them. Its unfortunate, but every cause needs martars.
Then they will put pressure on ISPs, who will try to comply. When the ISPs realize there is no legit way to monitor their users on the scale the law demands without vuolating 100 privacy laws, against hundreds of thousands of users, they will give up. Afterall, if they shut down every violator, theyd gave no paying customers. Eventually all concerned will realize going after sources rather thsn consumers would offer the most bsng for legal money.
Most Japanese file sharing sources will be scared off.
But the rule of the internet is that there will always be a "free place" or someone idealistic enough to fight the system in their country.
See constant battles of pirate bay as example. Yet still they continue.

Eventually this will all go the course of Napster: a few souls "take one for the team" in order to "stick it to the man". This is all made possible by the fact that the masses never stop demanding free content.
Its the "they cant catch all of us" theory.

Moral: If the law is wrong, following it wont affect change. You must dilliberately challenge it, in and and of court.

Laws only have lasting power when society deams the law just and fair, and a vast majority is willing to follow them. See 1920s USA
prohibition.

[sean toczko]

Point taken. Except this is not the US or other Western nation where protests have any kind of visible result - unless you want to talk about the Battle-Damaged Tokyo University Campus in Hongo.

This will ONLY change here in a Top-Down movement, or at least "Middle-Down" movement, if some major companies decide this will negatively affect their business.

Companies have a lot of control here - ever wonder why there are so few images (short answer = 0) of Japanese famous people on Wikipedia?

--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TokyoHackerSpace" group.

To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/tokyohackerspace/-/jeORAkpfqe4J.

[Taylan Ayken]

I can tell. I see Anonymous members protesting and giving speeches in Akihabara from time to time. Not a huge crowd, maybe 10 members in masks and 20-30 people listening and 1 police officer watching over but it is something.

What happens if we decide to do sth via Change.org? Me and Chris (the grumpy one) met their Japan Campaign Director, they can translate a petition prepare into Japanese (maybe) and we can promote it during Make (if we manage to join).

That's a lot of ifs but a way to act.

---

From: sean toczko <sto...@gmail.com>
To: tokyohac...@googlegroups.com
Sent: Thursday, October 4, 2012 4:39 PM
Subject: Re: [THS:20525] Re: Japan's new piracy laws

[Torsten Wagner]

Not sure about the role of ISPs,

to a certain extend they might welcome this movement. They do not like
people who download gigs of stuff. They prefer the users who pay 6.500
Yen a month to check there emails twice a week.
They couldn't deny access for heavy users and they couldn't blame them
for pirating (after all they were customers and the first ISP who
would start legal actions would loose his user base really fast).
Nobody wanted to get a bad-boy image.
Now.... they can easily claim they just follow law regulations and
kick out all the heavy users. They could do this and assure people how
much they dislike to do it... with a smile and a lot of "Sorry, its
because this new law".



Totti

> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TokyoHackerSpace" group.

> To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/tokyohackerspace/-/jeORAkpfqe4J.

[Chris Harrington]

The real problem is that this new law ignores the non local nature of
the intertubes. My expectation is that the RIAJ will at one point try
to prosecute someone who obtained content legally from an overseas
reseller (and downloaded it online), but that it was only possible
because that reseller was not enforcing regional distribution
limitations of the content, and because the RIAJ feels that it has
exclusive right to distribute that particular content in Japan, they
will flag you as an illegal downloader. In the end, that particular
individual will not go to jail, but the case will be used as an
opportunity to scare everyone else into only obtaining regulated
content from domestic online distributors. So at the time of the case,
there will be a bunch of discussion in the media of whether it is
illegal or not if you thought you legally bought it.

In just about any case, the Japanese courts will stick to the strict
letter of the law, vagueness and all, erring on the side of over doing
it, and ignore any obvious absurdity, with the understanding that,
like someone earlier in the thread said, this law will not be enforced
every day for every violator. They'll just have a few high profile
cases to scare everyone else into line.

Instead, providers, whether they use that particular monitoring system
or not, will end up blocking any music/video content source that isn't
a major corporate entity with a presence in Japan.

To me that is the real goal of the whole thing. The figures for rate
of illegal copying on which the law is based are probably bullshit.
But they sound good, and they did the job. The new laws will now be
mostly leveraged to weed out alternate, non RIAJ profiting content
sources.

Finally, content prices will go up.

Youtube won't be a problem because they basically play ball i Japan
already. It is the minor video sharing sites where the problems will
happen.

Chris Harrington
chris.har...@gmail.com
http://chris.harrington.jp/
http://gplus.to/chrisharrington
090-8812-8911

[MRE]

True.
It is damn near imposible to get a company rep to do actusl customer service.
Threaten to change phone carriers for example because the shop keeps giving you run around and they ask "oh. Is that what youd like to do? I can cancel your account today."
Its the only useful thing they CAN do.

[MRE]

I agree with both chris h and sean.. even though theyre different pov.
But id like to counter sean with:

Except for the distributedness of the internet. Also, dont underestemate the users ability to circumvent any form of restriction.

China locked out google. Yet ask any above average net user in china and youll fibd they use vpns or other forms of walking past the government blocks.

The only REAL enforcement the isp can do (other than legal action) is cut you off. Anything short of that, and people will find ways to circumvent or disguise.

Assume the isp cuts you off, like totti says. As thousands of potential customers hit the market, legal and black market isps will set up to hapilly provide services.

The only disadvantage Japan users have is being surrounded by ocean. The monent Iran went down, several illegal/diy bordercrossing hardlines, wifi boosters, radio and laser links went up. This eould be harder here.

Thankfully the young generation in Japan is more willing to question, and fight. The middle generation is questioning the cool-aid they served their kids more and more each day. Theres only one gen left thats truly passive about authority.