school reform idea
Bill Kerr
I don't see why such an idea could not be implemented - a sufficient number of parents might already exist to create such a school
Under the Howard government it has become easier to create Private schools than previously
It might be easier initially to set it up on a State by State basis since States control education in Australia
--
Bill Kerr
http://billkerr2.blogspot.com/
http://www.users.on.net/~billkerr/
skype: billkerr2006
minh mcCloy
This requires a degree of sophistication from parents that is hard to come by. Mere dissatisfaction is not even a good starting point often.
I heartily embrace this idea Bill & have trying to work with families to achieve post-dissatisfaction approaches - the kids are keen but parental responses to what you have proposed take time & real effort to work thru ....mmmm relinquish power I think would be the biggie.
And an online pedagogic environment (sorry just temporarily avoiding the S word) is going to be problematical with those families that are now adopting Ed Dept approaches to access to the Internet for their kids - or banning it altogether in a moral panic.
Fear, of course. Fear that they will disadvantage the child. If they aren't homeschoolers they tend to retain a frustrating faith in serendipity - as in, "Maybe next year the teacher will be better" or " We're checking out some other schools" .......
But where else can we go? The change has to come from the parents *&* the kids.
I've been trying to construct a new style of pedagogue who acknowledges how different from earlier generations these kids are, supports the development of autonomy thru various experiences in self-management, acts as a source of information,for parents, grandparents, friends so that they can support the process and the pedagogue moves out & the process is self-organising - because the kid's got proper hold of their own learning.
The kids I've been working with - ages 4-12.
So far there's not a living to made from it.
:)
minh
hugh davies
Hugh Davies based at the ABC in Melbourne.
I'm currently building an media education site for regional kids as
part of the ABC Rollercoaster website. Hopefully it will be a safe
youtube with instructions on how to make your own films and animations
and stuff. Im also trying to set up a community of regional educators
to contribute and moderate.
Through my own teaching experience, I have found that while the Edu
Dept firewalls locks out no end of excellent education content, ABC
online is generally accesablie on computers that have net access. With
this in mind I would be interested in persuing the role the ABC could
play in making online education available.
Hugh
Bill Kerr
You have covered a lot of good ground here, thanks
What I would hope that if their was widespread publicity for such an idea then it shouldn't be too hard to find sufficient parents and kids to create just one such online school in one state of Australia, for starters. You have to start somewhere
Computers have great unrealised potential that Schools are blocking. This takes a number of forms:
* censorware which sometimes involves blocking the read-write web, blogs, wikis etc are blocked by default in some schools - along with flickr, google images etc
* computers chained up in labs (limited access)
* focus on applications rather than higher order learning programming opportunities, eg. the sort of approach advocated by Seymour Papert and Alan Kay 20 years ago
This profile of computer use is happening in western schools at a time when one laptop per child (OLPC) based on a superior pedagogical approach is starting to happen in the developing world. Our schools are pretty much stuck in a bad place with regard to computers in education without any signs at all that anyone in charge (with the notable exception of Greg Whitby) has a worthwhile vision for the future
It also might be worthwhile looking more closely as sites such as Roger Schank's Engines of Education to understand his approach more deeply.
http://www.engines4ed.org/
The teachers and adminstrators would need to be paid for long term viability. It might be worthwhile looking at the funding provisions for setting up new Private schools.
- Bill
Leigh Blackall
Hugh, I noticed that ABC Radio National is starting an educational podcast as well. More focused on discussion and ideas like Bill's. Perhaps we could record a TALO skypecast discussing this and many other ideas Bill?
Regards
Leigh
--
Leigh Blackall
+64(0)21736539
skype - leigh_blackall
http://leighblackall.wikispaces.org/
Michael Nelson
Once upon a time, there was a kingdom that was overrun withGreat to see people putting into practise what they preach :)
dragons. The people were terrorized by the dragons, so they decided
to build a new curriculum in their finest university to train young
warriors in the art of dragon slaying.
As for private school funding - it'd be interesting to see how such a "networked" school would be classified - as a network of home schoolers, or as a distributed "school". What do you reckon would define the difference for the people providing the funding?
--
Michael Nelson
http://liveandletlearn.net/
Bill Kerr
I agree that the dragon slaying curriculum is hilarious, one of the best critiques of school curriculum that I have ever read
more info and links to roger schank material at
http://learningevolves.wikispaces.com/rogerSchank
I haven't read the guidelines on setting up a new private schools but do remember the teacher union press from a few years ago complaining about how easy Howard had made it - does anyone have more detail?
- Bill
Kylie Willison
School of the Air have been running this type of school for some time
now. http://www.oac.schools.sa.edu.au/schools/schoolofair.htm Before
the Internet the radio was used for classes. Does this model fit what
you're thinking of?
Kylie
>
> On 3/11/07, Bill Kerr <bill...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > That all parents in Australia (for instance) who are dissatisfied with the current education system create a virtual on line school for the (partial) education of their children - the other requirements could be met by home schooling or part time schooling at a physical campus
> >
> > I don't see why such an idea could not be implemented - a sufficient number of parents might already exist to create such a school
> >
> > Under the Howard government it has become easier to create Private schools than previously
> >
> > It might be easier initially to set it up on a State by State basis since States control education in Australia
> >
> > --
> > Bill Kerr
> > http://billkerr2.blogspot.com/
> > http://www.users.on.net/~billkerr/
> > skype: billkerr2006
> >
> >
--
Kylie Willison
Co Regional Director
Teen Challenge Murray Bridge
http://www.lm.net.au/~tcmb
My Blog
http://kyliewillison.blogspot.com
This email was sent from a computer running the Ubuntu Linux
operating system. The Linux operating system isn't harmed
by Windows viruses or spyware.
Kylie Willison
> The engines4ed site is pretty interesting Bill... especially the Story
> Centered Curriculum whitepaper!! For those who haven't checked it out,
> don't let the word whitepaper scare you off - here's the first
> paragraph:
> Once upon a time, there was a kingdom that was overrun with
> dragons. The people were terrorized by the dragons, so they
> decided
> to build a new curriculum in their finest university to train
> young
> warriors in the art of dragon slaying.
>
> Great to see people putting into practise what they preach :)
>
> As for private school funding - it'd be interesting to see how such a
> "networked" school would be classified - as a network of home
> schoolers, or as a distributed "school". What do you reckon would
> define the difference for the people providing the funding?
>
be a problem. I'm a homeschooling parent and in South Australia the
government doesn't provide funding for home schooling. Parents are
asked to sign a form each year stating that they take full
responsibility for their children's education - financially as well as
physically.
Also something else to keep in mind, many homeschooling parents aren't
looking for another 'school' or 'institution' to place their children
in. However there may be enough other parents who would choose this
type of learning for their children.
Kylie
Bill Kerr
thnx for your 2 messages
The idea of the school of the air and open access college (I worked in the latter for one year) is to provide the established curriculum to those who, for various reasons, can't have it delivered face to face in a regular school
As you point out in your other message home schooling is one way for parents who have a problem with regular school - but not financially supported by the government
I've read Gatto and Holt so have some understanding of some home schooling philosophies
What I'm saying - and people on this list are aware of this - is that a new situation has arisen whereby it is now possible for an independent learner to complete most of their education in a self directed manner over the internet. And that regular school is actually blocking or discouraging the full potential use of computers in this way - through school culture, expectations, curriculum, timetable, organisation, architecture etc.
IMO there needs to be new organisational arrangements (financial, accreditation) made for parents and children who want to pursue this alternative educational pathway.
OK, so this discussion has established that the government does not support this. I guess I'm not terribly surprised.
Nevertheless, with each passing day the opportunities for independent internet based education increases and in many schools the blocking of such opportunies also increases. So I think the issue that I've raised will continue to bubble up and require consideration because society and school is not static.
- Bill
minh mcCloy
Government Funding of Education is:
a) a poisoned chalice
b) catch 22
c) supping with the devil
d) scary
Your task should you choose to accept it is to add to this list. OR
Provide solutions to the dilemma.
On Mon, 2007-03-12 at 20:42 +1100, Michael Nelson wrote:
> The engines4ed site is pretty interesting Bill... especially the Story
> Centered Curriculum whitepaper!! For those who haven't checked it out,
> don't let the word whitepaper scare you off - here's the first
> paragraph:
sty> dragons. The people were terrorized by the dragons, so they
rgrozdanic
anyway - we seriously need to consider option 'e' which is to change what's wrong with the existing system, especially given that most of us actually work there. or if it's that bad, stop allowing them to use our taxes. or something.
seriously confused
r
Leigh Blackall
most people in the education system as we know it are there for the right reasons
Most people in the education system talk like this too. A vicious circle.
Revisit Deschooling Society and Pedagogy of the Oppressed
rgrozdanic
back to the drawing board...
r
seriously though - wouldn't it be good to have a debate on this or at least something substantial like a skypecast on the topic? i'm growing frustrated with the googlegroup mail thing cos it really only lends itself to short quips rather than a nice brew of ideas.
minh mcCloy
And Leigh I pulled out my 30+ year old copy of Deschooling the other day and was planning to make the same recommendation.. I've lost my copy of Friere's book but it has informed my pedagogy for decades. And I can't find my copy of Compulsory Miseducation.
My "test question" wasn't intended to slight teachers. I was thinking of the extent to which the government of the day can dictate agendas, curicula, values thru control of funding. If we/one/you/I were/was to develop an educational environment the how & who of the funding has to be addressed early. Itz a control issue.
Another book from a long time ago was Ecotopia (I think was itz name). Set in some slightly remote future where the US has been split up, balkanised as they say, & (agen I think) Northern California has formed an ecotopian society. The point for this discussion is that in Ecotopia ONLY teachers could start/own/run schools & children were funded to attend those schools - & they & their families selected which one.
Which brings us to the issue of choice. We have a fascinating couple of generations around us & as itz time agen to address kids' lib. I'm essentially a k-early teens person professionally and know the sophistication that these kids are capable of. Given the smallest opportunities & some quality information they make good decisions about their needs. Kid's rights to increasing management of their own learning, the right to choose needs to be explicit.
I also want the adult franchise to be extended to 16 year olds. And younger kids have ballolts to select specialist reps to speak for them in the power centres.
And are the schools the dragons we want to slay or transform? Thirty years of educational reform haven't got us very far.
:)
minh
ic...@purdue.edu
to get as many of them as possible on our side.
The "government" typically comprise of civil servants and they may not
wish to "rock the boat" and risk their career.
The easiest way to try to reform is to do it yourself and develop
world-class online learning program for students, but the resources
and expertise required to do this are enormous but it can be done,
albeight, very slowly.
The route I took is to get teachers in public schools interested,
because majority of students still spend most of their time in
school. There are now 40 secondary schools in Singapore using
the program which I have been developing since 2000. The small
revenue generated from initial 6 pilot schools eventually helped
to expand my resources and customer base to well over 20,000 students
through the schools. We need to target the remaining 120 secondary
schools in Singapore. Students get to access our program almost free.
I do not have time to raise funds, so the funding needs to come from
the revenue...it may not be much...but it helps to get the project
going. Currently the program only has math for Secondary 1-4
(Grades 7-10) and we'll be working on the sciences when almost all
the math content have been developed.
Ian
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Quoting minh mcCloy <miz...@gmail.com>:
> > Revisit Deschooling Society <http://reactor-core.org/deschooling.html> and
> > Pedagogy of the
> Oppressed<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pedagogy_of_the_Oppressed>
alexanderhayes
your subscription fees yet ?
Oh and the other .....Father Donnelly reckons -
http://www.andrewrobb.com.au/news/default.asp?action=article&ID=189
This is the bit that really takes the cake - got a mobile jammer
ready ?
"............Conclusion
I began this speech by talking about the world of tomorrow - about
present action and plans to set us up for the future.
A plan for our young people, for those mid-career and those in the
later years of their working life.
A plan to restore the true value of technical and vocational training,
where a trade or technical qualification is as prized as a university
degree.
A plan for training to be responsive and flexible, to provide choice.
We must continue the rapid reform of the training system and tackle
the remaining sacred cows standing in the way of all Australian
workers reaching their full potential.
END
Media contact: Andrew Coombe 0438 777 145 .........."
ic...@purdue.edu
"A plan to restore the true value of technical and vocational training,
where a trade or technical qualification is as prized as a university
degree."
If we do it right, students may be so excited about their new-found
"powers" that they may be prompted to leave school early!! The paper
qualification will not matter.
The major obstacle to empowering the young is that individual or corporate
"experts" may not wish to share their trade secrets and few professors
or craftsmen can be found who has the relevant expertise.
When I was thinking of introducing such things as exploring the nature and
use of electromagnetic waves for Physics, not a single EEE graduate interviewed
at a top university could design a simple working circuit for an IR (infra-red)
sensor. All of them could only do programming but cannot create!! Fortunately,
I eventually found someone in Purdue who was able to show me a working circuit
using less than half a dozen components. Calculus is not needed to do this kind
of things!!
Ian
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Leigh Blackall
rgrozdanic
shaggy/pgpete/colin/michael/donner/blitzen/botts/gnuchris - can't you invent something safe, simple, free and reliable for us to use?... what would it take?
r