Are you better off than 4 years ago?
Nirvana
friends and myself. I only know of maybe 1 who think that they are
better off now than they were in '99,'00
Bush 43 is the lousiest president we've had in 104 years that I can
think of. He's basically a Jimmy Carter without the brains, ethics,
principles, and patriotism.We have an immature clown in office who is
CORRUPT, not-so-patriotic, and INCOMPETENT. BTW, I don't dislike
Republicans. I actually LOVE REAGAN, Lincoln, T. Roosevelt, and
Eisenhower!
JJ
tree hugger or socialist
Good if you work, love your wife and country and play by the rules and
believe in freedom rather than "Guvment"
Sid9, Liberal
My net worth is down
My auto insurance is up.
My home owner's insurance is up.
Gasoline is up.
My great nephew is at risk for a draft.
Our soldiers are losing their lives and limbs in Iraq.
My country, which used to be most respected in the world ,is hated almost
everywhere.
Am I better off ?
NO.
Vote for Kerry-Edwards
Septer
Ray
Eisenhower! >><BR><BR>
For what it's worth, I'm doing much better than 4 years ago. I make more money
where I work (I'm sure the Gw tax cuts helped) because my company got bigger.
I don't have to put up with those *^^&& annoying sales calls to my home
anymore. I refinanced my homes while the rates were low so I'm paying much
less. I'm a little unhappy about the energy situation in this country but
other than that, I'm doing better.
cyber
"Sid9, Liberal" <si...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> My net worth is down
> My auto insurance is up.
> My home owner's insurance is up.
> Gasoline is up.
>
> My great nephew is at risk for a draft.
> Our soldiers are losing their lives and limbs in Iraq.
>
> My country, which used to be most respected in the world ,is hated almost
> everywhere.
>
> Am I better off ?
>
> NO.
>
> Vote for Kerry-Edwards
and have you ever noticed?
boy, have we had "terrorist alerts" ya know , some "chatter' about some
thing big , gonna happen and then zilch.
but, when this petrol explosion in Texas and some train derails and
no one suggests or investigates about it being terror?
the gummint is in business just to keep you terrorized. that's how they
control the sheeple.
get the DVD "Out Foxed" avail. from AlterNet.org
get informed, Vote ! and take a friend.
"If I can not dance, I want no part in your revolution." Emma Goldman
Sid9, Liberal
I saw "Outfoxed".
It needs more circulation to try to get the
message to the blind and dumb among
us that Fox is nothing but an outlet for the
Bush family owned Republican party
Ray
<< > get the DVD "Out Foxed" avail. from AlterNet.org
>
> get informed, Vote ! and take a friend.
> "If I can not dance, I want no part in your revolution." Emma Goldman
I saw "Outfoxed".
It needs more circulation to try to get the
message to the blind and dumb among
us that Fox is nothing but an outlet for the
Bush family owned Republican party >><BR><BR>
Lol, and WE are the blind ones??
Neil Kashmiri - Hindu Sikh
Nirvana <worryles...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:34e36f1b.04081...@posting.google.com...
Neil Kashmiri - Hindu Sikh
Sid9, Liberal <si...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:F_6Vc.16851$rd5....@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
TBone
I'm doing much better.
In 1998 my wife and I worked five jobs between us, just to pay the
bills.
Today, I work one job and my wife stays at home with our children and
we are doing better than we were in 1998.
kevin
> What has this election of some leader of the US got to do with India?
>
> Sid9, Liberal <si...@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
> news:F_6Vc.16851$rd5....@bignews6.bellsouth.net...
> > JJ wrote:
> > > Miserable if you are homosexual, a minority waiting on handouts or a
> > > tree hugger or socialist
LIES!
> > >
> > > Good if you work, love your wife and country and play by the rules and
> > > believe in freedom rather than "Guvment"
MORE LIES!!
kevin
Or should the question be: Was this country better of 4 years ago?
Answer=Hell No!
Vote for Kerry-Edwards
> >
> >
Roy. Just Roy.
[snip political plankton poo]
Hard to say.
I make 4 times the money I made 4 years ago, but I spend 5 times as
much.
I have a good job, but I live in constant fear of losing it.
I have a wife, but she is the primary reason I spend 5 times as much.
Personally, I can't really see how Kerry will make my life any better
or worse than it is under Bush. I just think that, no matter who wins,
the talk.politics losers will still call him a liar, and call for his
impeachment.
I'll probably just flip a coin.
Tempest
Bush is a strong proponent of outsourcing U.S. jobs to India.
The Indian government is supporting Bush.
The U.S. election has a lot to do with India.
Luft Gek?hlt
counties than you might not be doing as well, although it is difficult to
hold the current administration for job alignment due to international
pressures.
If you prefer not to work and wish to exist as wards of the state, than
without a doubt Kerry is your man. Consider the following:
July 15, 2004
WorldDaily.Com
The Democratic Socialists of America Political Action Committee is
officially urging its members to work strongly for the election of
John Kerry in the 2004 presidential election.
The largest socialist organization in the U.S. the DSA is affiliated
with Socialist International, a federation of the world's socialist,
social democratic and labor parties. It was founded as a group dedica-
ted to moving the Democratic Party to the political left, and towards
this end has worked closely with the Congressional Progressive Caucus.
Frank Llewellyn, national director of the DSA, stated that it has been
a century since a major party candidate for president had such strong
support for the principle goals of his organization ...
" Socialism: Economic and social doctrine, political movement inspired
by this doctrine, and system or order established when this doctrine is
organized in a society. The socialist doctrine supports state ownership
and control of the fundamental means of production and distribution of
wealth. In lieu of ownership, support for a system of regulations which
exert extensive controls over the means of production and distribution.
This doctrine specifically advocates nationalization of natural resources,
core industries, banking, credit, and insurance facilities, health care,
and public utilities, as well as extensive welfare programs and public
housing development. Socialism also places special emphasis on the
nationalization of monopolized branches of industry and trade, viewing
monopolies as inimical to the public welfare. "
Your vote, your choice.
The_Real_Truth
Thanks. And please stay out of the US.
George W. Hayduke
>Miserable if you are homosexual, a minority waiting on handouts or a
>tree hugger or socialist
<laughing> Yeah, as if our military families were all Commie homo
environmentalists. Yeps!
>Good if you work, love your wife and country and play by the rules and
>believe in freedom rather than "Guvment"
None of us are better off under this fascist regime except for
the rich white elite that the butcher calls his "base."
>> I think that the last 4 years have been miserable to most of my
>> friends and myself. I only know of maybe 1 who think that they are
>> better off now than they were in '99,'00
+--+
|George W. Bush is a deserter: http://www.glcq.com/bush_at_arpc1.htm
|Fascist War Criminal to stand trial: http://www.PeopleJudgeBush.org
+--+
Nirvana
Psstt...The answer should be "Hell YES!!!" Please read your rhetorical question.
Oh yeah...Don't forget to vote Kerry/Edwards - the "JOHNS"
chris
you know...this whole 'bias' argument is taking over the actual thing
we're supposed to be debating most of the time...fox news has a market
share and they provide what that market share wants to
hear...limbaugh, howard stern, the daily show...any television show
does the same exact thing.
now anyone could watch an episode of seinfeld and actually choose to
believe that kramer really did see a 'pig-man' in the hospital, or
that costanza would actually be capable of pulling a golfball out of a
whale's blowhole, but to do so would be foolish.
the news is entertainment...the second we decided to christen these
shows/networks as the 'authority' of anything was the day we lost our
minds and handed over control of them as well...if you honestly
believe anything you hear from anywhere within the media, it's at your
own risk...it's not foxnews's responsibility to guage the level of
sensitivity of the general public and report to it, but to make money.
once we give in to the notion that the issue is 'bias' instead of the
issue being 'gay marriage' or 'the upcoming election', we're handing
over our brains and conceeding victory as the network that's out to
make money has accomplished their goal of becoming the story...
so many people on usenet and in the public feed the beast with the
neverending whining and complaining about bias, yet never stop to
think whether the network even deserves the attention, the time your
mind has to spend on it...I say it doesn't...because the goal of
foxnews (which i watch just as much as cnn btw), or any other leaning
broadcast is to bury the wedge deeper amongst americans...to convince
us that we're different from one another and that in their favorite
news channel, they've joined up with a winning team...
fuck that! think for yourself and let everyone else do what they want
to do...discuss the issues and try to be good to your fellow human
beings, your neighbors...try and think of how you and someone of the
opposite political opinion are the same rather than focusing on how
you're different
i'll watch out-foxed, but that they're right leaning doesn't bother me
in the least...it's a business, and businesses have a goal, to make
money and prosper...foxnews does this extremely well
it's free speech...never forget that
chris
Ray...did you hear about that conference about how water in 2050 could
be a resource countries slice each other up over like oil is today?
don't have the link handy, but your last sentence made me think of
it...i'm sure you can find it w/ a search...
the polution aspect aside, water pressure in a lot of places is
pathetic...what's it like in ohio?
i totally forgot to thank you for sending us corey dillon...don't know
if you're a football fan or not, but he's the only legit back i've
ever seen the pats enter a season with other than curtis martin...i
guess robert edwards for a year before he blew out his knee in the
hawaii sand...
bengals record prediction? 9-7? two games vs. both cleveland and
pittsburg doesn't hurt, but that ravens team is ferocious! they
rotated bodies in and out vs. atlanta a few weeks back, were in the
3-4 and their ends just ate up both tackles all night long...if i were
a cincy fan i'd have my eyes on the ravens
Ray
<< > For what it's worth, I'm doing much better than 4 years ago. I make more
money
> where I work (I'm sure the Gw tax cuts helped) because my company got
bigger.
> I don't have to put up with those *^^&& annoying sales calls to my home
> anymore. I refinanced my homes while the rates were low so I'm paying much
> less. I'm a little unhappy about the energy situation in this country but
> other than that, I'm doing better.
Ray...did you hear about that conference about how water in 2050 could
be a resource countries slice each other up over like oil is today?
don't have the link handy, but your last sentence made me think of
it...i'm sure you can find it w/ a search...
the polution aspect aside, water pressure in a lot of places is
pathetic...what's it like in ohio? >><BR><BR>
Actually, we have the best water in the country here in Northern Ohio. Of
course, living near a lake helps quite a bit but still.....
I have heard some stuff about the water problem but I don't buy it. The reason
I don't is because I'm tired of people trying to scare the hell out of me.
It's been going on my whole life and everything is just fine.
I remember when I was in 5th grade, the newspapers scared the hell out of my
teacher so badly, that he vented on us, telling us how we are all going to die
from the Soviet nukes, we would only have time for one prayer etc,etc. Of
coruse, nothing happened and all this fright and scaring children for nothing.
Then there was the time we ran out of oil. People formed lines miles long with
their cars and you could only get gas on certain days depending on your license
plate number. People were sure this was the end of civilization as we knew it,
the automobile would become extinct and the entire country would soon have to
go back to horse and buggy. Of course, we are pumping millions of barrels of
day of oil today, so all of that hype was for nothing.
Then there was the threat of forest fires. Yes, there were so many fires that
by the year 1990, there would be no forests left in the United States. They
blamed it on many factors, smoking, climate change, ozone etc,etc. Of course
years later, they learned that forest fires are quite natural as this is the
way forests rejuvenate so now, after we put out such fires, we start them
again so that nature can once again take over where we inturrupted.
Then there was the ozone problem. We use so much product from spray cans that
by the year 2000, 90% of the people would have skin cancer. Yes, we were going
to act on ozone holes and force everybody to use roll on deodorant to save the
world. Of course, we later learned that ozone holes are quite normal, but we
didn't know that at the time since we had just discovered ozone. Everytime
lightning strikes, it creates more ozone.
And today, we have Global Warming, the new scare tactic that is going to end
the world as we know it. Once again, they want us to use public
transportation, spend billlions on pollution control and do anything to lower
greenhouse gasses (even though humans contribute only 5% of these gasses) to
save the world. Yes, we can control the weather now and we must put this to a
stop, even though it's only a theory.
And today, a new one. The water problem. Well...... I'm not going to worry
about it until it affects the process of Beer Production. I have learned in
life that scaring people means money. We go to amusement parks, get on a ride
and get the hell scared out of us and we pay for this. We take our children to
haunted houses near Halloween because our children want to get the hell scared
out of them. We go to Gorey (sorry about the pun) movies, pay for them just to
lose sleep at night having nightmares of some guy wanting to slice our throats.
And we tell stories of Hillary Clinton becoming president some day; but this
one I would even lose sleep over.
You see, when it comes to scaring people, money is always involved. Some
college wants to get a Federal grant to do some experiments due to some new
found threat, some clown wants to sell a book, some idiot wants to make a Bush
bashing movie etc, etc. But there is always money involved with scaring
people. Well, they won't get my money nor will they get my attention anymore.
If God wants this world to end, we won't have a choice in the matter. And if
God wants this world to continue, we wouldn't be able to destroy it if we
wanted.
<< i totally forgot to thank you for sending us corey dillon...don't know
if you're a football fan or not, but he's the only legit back i've
ever seen the pats enter a season with other than curtis martin...i
guess robert edwards for a year before he blew out his knee in the
hawaii sand...
bengals record prediction? 9-7? two games vs. both cleveland and
pittsburg doesn't hurt, but that ravens team is ferocious! they
rotated bodies in and out vs. atlanta a few weeks back, were in the
3-4 and their ends just ate up both tackles all night long...if i were
a cincy fan i'd have my eyes on the ravens >><BR><BR>
Well you're quite welcome. I don't follow football that much although I have
to admit to watching a few games to cheer on my team. I am more of a baseball
guy.
Neil Kashmiri - Hindu Sikh
At the end of the day Bush or Kerry will look at their own self interest.
War on terrorism has not exactly helped India, has it?
Tempest <mordacp...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:2df29c5c.04082...@posting.google.com...
Nirvana
Absolutely nobody that I know of is better off today than they were 4
years ago. We all have 15% less buying power than we did, less
professional options, less hope, and more stress.
Neil Kashmiri - Hindu Sikh
would want to go to a place where planes flying into building!
The_Real_Truth <therealt...@aol.com> wrote in message
> Thanks. And please stay out of the US.
news:aed76c4f.04082...@posting.google.com...
Neil Kashmiri - Hindu Sikh
comes around.
Nirvana <worryles...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:34e36f1b.04082...@posting.google.com...
Ray
<< I wouldn't want to go to the USA ... it's a terrorist ridden place and who
would want to go to a place where planes flying into building! >><BR><BR>
Good. Stay where you are. One less foreigner our police have to keep away
from our borders.
George Washington. Hayduke
The only people better off are the rich white Republican corporations.
Bush's elite "base," as the baby killer calls them.
Eltanin
What are you talking about they were paid mossad soldiers to do a
suicide mission so that the US would take out Israel's #1 enemy in the
middle east. The return benefit would be the oil. So in reality there
never were any terrorists in America.
In article <cg9mvd$o6e$1...@perki.connect.com.au>, Neil Kashmiri - Hindu
SneakyPete
>
> > I think that the last 4 years have been miserable to most of my
> > friends and myself. I only know of maybe 1 who think that they are
> > better off now than they were in '99,'00
> >
> >
> tree hugger or socialist
>
> Good if you work, love your wife and country and play by the rules and
> believe in freedom rather than "Guvment"
I work. I love my wife. I play by the rules. I believe in freedom.
Including the freedom of individuals to persue happiness, which would
make the ban on gay marriage unconstitutional.
The dollars I receive today are worth less.
My home can be searched without a warrant.
We are involved in an unjust war.
Although I have voted repub in the past, I am now squarely in favor of
anybody but Bush - even Nader - even Al Sharpton.
tweber2323
> That is America's problem .. they deserve what they get. What goes around
> comes around.
Man...that is one hateful Sikh.
tweber2323
Congratulations. You are a rare instance.
Many of the people I know, Professionals; Lawyers, programmers,
trainers and engineers lost their jobs in the past years. When the
unemployment ran out, they were forced to take lesser jobs. So when
you hear that more jobs are being made, just know that employers got a
great deal because people were desperate for any income at all.
I hope that you aren't one of those employers that took advantage of
an out of work professional's desperation.
ausstu
> tree hugger or socialist
>
> Good if you work, love your wife and country and play by the rules and
> believe in freedom rather than "Guvment"
Of course those who have studied history will remember this is the
same sort of hateful rhetoric that the nazi's used before they came
into power.
Ray
<<
I work. I love my wife. I play by the rules. I believe in freedom.
Including the freedom of individuals to persue happiness, which would
make the ban on gay marriage unconstitutional.
The dollars I receive today are worth less.
My home can be searched without a warrant.
We are involved in an unjust war.
Although I have voted repub in the past, I am now squarely in favor of
anybody but Bush - even Nader - even Al Sharpton.
>><BR><BR>
How in hell can your home be searched without a warrant unless suspicous
activity is obvious?
Neil Kashmiri - Hindu Sikh
would do ...
Eltanin <elt...@boxfrog.com> wrote in message
news:270820041051350584%elt...@boxfrog.com...
Neil Kashmiri - Hindu Sikh
Pakistani based terrorists and calling them freedom fighters! As I said it
is America's problem and people get what they deserve. The Americans were
busy helping terrorist nations, helped create the Taliban and Bin Laden's
network and now they have got the fruits of their labour. So what is wrong
with me saying that?
tweber2323 <twebe...@netscape.net> wrote in message
news:aad19c49.04082...@posting.google.com...
Ray
<< This is one person who has seen how the Americans were busy helping
Pakistani based terrorists and calling them freedom fighters! As I said it
is America's problem and people get what they deserve. The Americans were
busy helping terrorist nations, helped create the Taliban and Bin Laden's
network and now they have got the fruits of their labour. So what is wrong
with me saying that?
>><BR><BR>
Nothing. Just next time you say it, do so in a New York city bar some Friday
evening around 10.00 pm or so. This way you can get the fruits of your labor
for opening your mouth.
whatif
ones who were making a living wage ($30K-$50K), and none of those
thousands have been hired back even yet, the friends of mine that I
know of are now working for places like Home Depot on a wage a
teen-ager should have. They find it funny (not really) that old shrub
keeps talking about allowing all those illegals 'ammnesty' in this
country because no one here will take a job paying $10 an hour, yet,
they are working for that, not willingly, but just to have a job! If
job openings are posted for a job that only pays $10 a hour, they have
LINES of people trying to get them, so I wonder who in this country,
under what job classification is doing better than they were 4 years
ago, can't hardly believe that living on the west coast. Of course, we
also have to deal with the shrub administration turning it's back on
the west coast when it was OBVIOUS shrub and lard butt cheney's
buddies in enron were corrupting the power supply to gain record
profits, but hey, that is why the west coast just hates shrub! No
good jobs, and 300% electric rate increases under shrub so far, we can
hardly wait for the next 4 years, maybe we will have to succede from
the union to get fair treatment from shrub and his band of felons.
twebe...@netscape.net (tweber2323) wrote in message news:<aad19c49.04082...@posting.google.com>...
whatif
idea to get millions of Mexicans ammnesty so they can vote for him??
I thot it was, and that is why our border is so pourous, since he is
looking the other way.
xxxr...@aol.comspamfink (Ray) wrote in message news:<20040822093818...@mb-m24.aol.com>...
Thinker2004
> I think that the last 4 years have been miserable to most of my
> friends and myself. I only know of maybe 1 who think that they are
> better off now than they were in '99,'00
I'm doing much better now than 4 years ago. But then, I
work hard rather than bitch and whine. And my success is
because of my hard work, not because of Bush or Clinton.
The government is not here to make you successful. That's
up to you to do.
- Thinker
Deb Shanker
"Thinker2004" <TheThin...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:f7ff93e3.04083...@posting.google.com...
Bush has spent more than 200 billions in Iraq. If he had spent that much
money in US public schools or US public recreations, the future generation
of US would have gained a lot. Why build fucking hospitals, schools and such
for dumbass Iraqis who don't want american help. There were no fucking
talibans and muslim extremists in Iraq, there are thriving well in Pakistan,
all thanks to Bush.
Deb
Ray
<< Bush has spent more than 200 billions in Iraq. If he had spent that much
money in US public schools or US public recreations, the future generation
of US would have gained a lot. Why build fucking hospitals, schools and such
for dumbass Iraqis who don't want american help. There were no fucking
talibans and muslim extremists in Iraq, there are thriving well in Pakistan,
all thanks to Bush. >><BR><BR>
Yes they are, but they're not here and that's all that matters.
Bholu
> money in US public schools or US public recreations, the future generation
> of US would have gained a lot. Why build fucking hospitals, schools and such
> for dumbass Iraqis who don't want american help. There were no fucking
> talibans and muslim extremists in Iraq, there are thriving well in Pakistan,
> all thanks to Bush.
>
> Deb
Dumbya loves Muslims and he wants to spend our hard earned money on
them. So he first spends money sending our soldiers to Iraq. Then he
gives them money to rebuild what we destroyed. Then he throws money at
terrorist havens in Pakistan and Afghanistan. And hey, he sucks up to
the Saudi bastards while we are at it.
Man this guy took me for a ride in 2000. He spends and spends and he
will drive our interest rates so far up our asses that we will choke.
Anyway, I am too old to see the consequences - at 86 now, I only have
20-30 years left. Plus I did benefit from Bush's tax cuts - so I am
set. I changed my will, no money for the Republicans now - I may just
give all this money to University of Minnesota.
Thanks bud.
Echo2Drs
>> up to you to do.
>>
They just need so many to flip hamburgers and empty trash you know!!!!
Echo2Drs
Don't worry, it'll be here eventually!!!!
And when it does, just remember ole Echo told ya so!!!!
Thinker2004
That again does not change the truth of my statement. I repeat ...
>> The government is not here to make you successful. That's
>> up to you to do.
- Thinker
tweber2323
Never said it was wrong... only that I thought you were harboring a
lot of hate.
I don't disagree with you. American leaders did create these
terrorists and they do create the wars we are in.
If my family was killed because USA dropped a bomb on my neighbor
thinking he was a terrorist, I would be pissed too!
War is good for the weapons and securities industries that these
conservative have money invested in... so as long as we are at war,
they will always have cash flowing into their pockets.
The Real Diddy Pop
You must be blind, interest rates are and have been at their lowest
rates since you were a kid. I see a little latent racism directed to
our Arab friends, what's up with that? Go take your Geritol now.
Deb Shanker
"The Real Diddy Pop" <cj...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:95cdfe04.04083...@posting.google.com...
Your arab friends attacked USA in 2001. They follow a religion which calls
for the death and destruction of all non-muslims and Bush calls that
religion a religion of Bush. Bush must be a friend of Osama bin Ladin.
Deb
Ray
>><BR><BR>
Well when people had jobs, what did they do with that money to make themselves
successful? Cell Phones, high speed Internet, cable television, pagers, ATV
etc,etc. How many of you people with jobs invested your money, lived under
your means, spent money only on the necessary things etc,etc. The people who
cry the loudest are those who depended on a paycheck every single week and
assumed that they had a job forever. And when that pay was interrupted or
shortened, it's the governments responsibility to make sure you have a good
enough paying job to support your lifestyle.
TBone
I am a Systems Engineer, me and all of the IT people I know have only
moved in UP terms of pay. For example my last raise was $12,000.
Whenever an opposing political party wants to knock the other side
they say that the jobs created during that term are "minimum wage
jobs". This is what the Kerry camp is trying to get people to
believe. I just don't buy it. Minimum wage jobs make up 1.4% of the
workforce (thanks Deucerman), not a large enough section to account
for all the tens of millions that Kerry says are in this bracket.
Thinker2004
Exactly, Ray.
My brother spent his whole life watching sports on TV and
goofing around at work. Now he's unemployed, is into my pockets
for 4K and STILL has internet, cable, two cars, yada yada yada.
I spent my life working on my craft (mathematics and engineering) and so
I'm gainfully employed. I don't have internet, tv, cable, pager or an SUV.
He bitches about the state of the economy with his ass parked on the couch
watching footfall. And bitches about what the Republicans have done to him.
I praise the Republicans and continue to work hard and become more successful.
As I've stated so many times ...
It's not the role of the government to make you successful.
That's YOUR responsibility.
- Thinker
kevin
Sorry, but we are talking about "New Jobs" not ones we already have,
like you and your IT friends. According to the last job servy, 80% of
new jobs created under this administration are very low paying jobs
such as, fast food, retail, hotel, and the like with no benefits. Yea,
I get huge raises as well, but I've been at my job for some time.
Compare the new jobs created and compare the pay against the raising
cost of living; health insurance, gas, housing, ect ect ect. I don't
believ anything the Bush Admin says.
harmony
bush makes tall claims about having improved the economy, however.
so, bush is obviously lying for 2 reasons:
- govt can't make you successful in hte first place as you say.
- second, in point of truth economy has not improved, and yet he says it has
improved.
let's get a honest man in whitehouse who says he has no responsibility to
make us successful.
> - Thinker
Ray
>><BR><BR>
<< Exactly, Ray.
My brother spent his whole life watching sports on TV and
goofing around at work. Now he's unemployed, is into my pockets
for 4K and STILL has internet, cable, two cars, yada yada yada.
I spent my life working on my craft (mathematics and engineering) and so
I'm gainfully employed. I don't have internet, tv, cable, pager or an SUV.
He bitches about the state of the economy with his ass parked on the couch
watching footfall. And bitches about what the Republicans have done to him.
I praise the Republicans and continue to work hard and become more successful.
As I've stated so many times ...
It's not the role of the government to make you successful.
That's YOUR responsibility.
>><BR><BR>
And the sad part is, your brother is just one of millions in this country with
the same attitude. Don't give your brother any more money. When he loses his
cable/ phone/Internet, he will go out and work for anything and perhaps value
money.
Ray
<< Sorry, but we are talking about "New Jobs" not ones we already have,
like you and your IT friends. According to the last job servy, 80% of
new jobs created under this administration are very low paying jobs
such as, fast food, retail, hotel, and the like with no benefits. Yea,
I get huge raises as well, but I've been at my job for some time.
Compare the new jobs created and compare the pay against the raising
cost of living; health insurance, gas, housing, ect ect ect. I don't
believ anything the Bush Admin says. >><BR><BR>
Key word here "survey." You can make a survey state anything you want
depending on who you ask and what you ask. Facts don't lie. And facts are
consumer confidence is up. GDP is up. Unemployment is down.
I seriously doubt that the booming housing market is a result of Hotel and fast
food jobs. That market has been up for over a year. And as far as "fast food"
and "Hotel" jobs, how were those jobs created? By other minimum wage earners?
Somebody must be buying this take out food and somebody must have the money to
get a Hotel for a few nights. You don't build new McDonalds, Burger Kings and
Days Inn's or hire more people for the existing ones because of the demand from
minimum wager earners do you?
Trust me, I live in the city with the highest poverty rate in the country and I
can tell you first hand that there are plenty of jobs here. Just none that
people want by choice.
George Washington Hayduke
>twebe...@netscape.net (tweber2323) wrote in message news:<aad19c49.04082...@posting.google.com>...
>> mrti...@yahoo.com (TBone) wrote in message
>>> I'm doing much better.
>> Congratulations. You are a rare instance.
>> Many of the people I know, Professionals; Lawyers, programmers,
>> trainers and engineers lost their jobs in the past years. When the
>> unemployment ran out, they were forced to take lesser jobs. So when
>> you hear that more jobs are being made, just know that employers got a
>> great deal because people were desperate for any income at all.
>> I hope that you aren't one of those employers that took advantage of
>> an out of work professional's desperation.
>I am a Systems Engineer, me and all of the IT people I know have only
>moved in UP terms of pay. For example my last raise was $12,000.
You're obviously a liar.
+--+
|George W. Bush is a deserter: http://www.glcq.com/bush_at_arpc1.htm
|Fascist War Criminal to stand trial: http://www.PeopleJudgeBush.org
|Hezbollah endorses George W. Bush: http://www.hezbollah.ws/
|"Do you want a president who will duck? Vote Bush." -- Michael Moore
|Some information the Bush fascists want to hide: http://rncdelegates.com
+--+
chris
> << From: kevi...@yahoo.com (kevin) >><BR><BR>
>
>
> << Sorry, but we are talking about "New Jobs" not ones we already have,
> like you and your IT friends. According to the last job servy, 80% of
> new jobs created under this administration are very low paying jobs
> such as, fast food, retail, hotel, and the like with no benefits. Yea,
> I get huge raises as well, but I've been at my job for some time.
> Compare the new jobs created and compare the pay against the raising
> cost of living; health insurance, gas, housing, ect ect ect. I don't
> believ anything the Bush Admin says. >><BR><BR>
>
>
> Key word here "survey." You can make a survey state anything you want
> depending on who you ask and what you ask. Facts don't lie. And facts are
> consumer confidence is up.
Ray, isn't that compiled by a survey as well? i belive it's called
the 'Labor Department's household survey'
GDP is up.
That it is
Unemployment is down.
This isn't a factor that you can analyze accumulitavely - - - again,
they don't count you once the checks stop rolling in...ohio is in a
recession, i know that...can't go on about it for too long, but while
i'll agree completely with GDP being up, the consumer confidence
numbers are arbitrary if we're going off of your 'surveys are
arbitrary' theory
The level of salaries of these new jobs as compared to the old
ones...that's the enchilada in this argument...tax revenue, consumer
spending...all of them are affected...so if jobs are created, but pay
less, the economy suffers regardless
>
> I seriously doubt that the booming housing market is a result of Hotel and fast
> food jobs. That market has been up for over a year. And as far as "fast food"
> and "Hotel" jobs, how were those jobs created? By other minimum wage earners?
> Somebody must be buying this take out food and somebody must have the money to
> get a Hotel for a few nights. You don't build new McDonalds, Burger Kings and
> Days Inn's or hire more people for the existing ones because of the demand from
> minimum wager earners do you?
>
> Trust me, I live in the city with the highest poverty rate in the country and I
> can tell you first hand that there are plenty of jobs here. Just none that
> people want by choice.
minimum wage minimum wage minimum wage
no benefits no benefits no benefits
it's not the case with all of them, but if you went to school and
worked in a field for 10 years, then are faced with taking a 20K
paycut because that's all the market is offering, that's a situation
for a true optomist...
Ray
> depending on who you ask and what you ask. Facts don't lie. And facts are
> consumer confidence is up.
Ray, isn't that compiled by a survey as well? i belive it's called
the 'Labor Department's household survey'
GDP is up.
That it is
Unemployment is down. >><BR><BR>
Consumer confidence is somewhat a survey but also compiled by the amount of
money people are spending at stores. You can tilt a survey anyway you want
simply by going to a particual demographic area or using a phone survey in a
certain area as well. This is why survey alone is no good. Although, some are
better and fairer than others.
But no matter how much you bad mouth this economy, statistics don't lie. The
unemployment rate is 5.4% which is .2% lower than 1996 when Clinton and the
Democrats were boasting about how good the economy was. Now that it's about
the same percentage with Republican leadership, it's still a bad thing. Is the
glass half full or half empty?
<< This isn't a factor that you can analyze accumulitavely - - - again,
they don't count you once the checks stop rolling in...ohio is in a
recession, i know that...can't go on about it for too long, but while
i'll agree completely with GDP being up, the consumer confidence
numbers are arbitrary if we're going off of your 'surveys are
arbitrary' theory
The level of salaries of these new jobs as compared to the old
ones...that's the enchilada in this argument...tax revenue, consumer
spending...all of them are affected...so if jobs are created, but pay
less, the economy suffers regardless >><BR><BR>
But there is no evidence of pay being less. I'm sure in some cases those jobs
do pay less and in some cases, the jobs pay more. But to make a blanket
statement that ALL of these jobs pay less doesn't fit into the calculation of
GDP, housing market and even the auto market. People are spending money, and
that's what counts.
<< > Trust me, I live in the city with the highest poverty rate in the country
and I
> can tell you first hand that there are plenty of jobs here. Just none that
> people want by choice.
minimum wage minimum wage minimum wage
no benefits no benefits no benefits
it's not the case with all of them, but if you went to school and
worked in a field for 10 years, then are faced with taking a 20K
paycut because that's all the market is offering, that's a situation
for a true optomist... >><BR><BR>
Again, that's not the case with all of these jobs. And again, this doesn't
make the case for your "minimum wage" theory either. If these (or most) of
these jobs payed less than a household could survive on, then there couldn't
possibly be a demand for minimum wage jobs. People don't go out to eat or
travel only to use hotel rooms because they are working for minimum wage do
they? If any minimum wage jobs are created, they are created by people who
have the money to use the services that have those minimum wage jobs. If
services are on the increase, then disposable income is also on the increase.
Brian Quincy Hutchings
"Democrats" will calim that it's "0.49999..." full, but
the glass is actually busted, because
of the burgeoning trade-deficit and the outsourcing
of everything, up to & including military logistics
(which is mainly supplies, not just armaments and
thier maintenance ... any figures,
on how much of each category is outsourced?)
xxxr...@aol.comspamfink (Ray) wrote in message news:<20040903205340...@mb-m22.aol.com>...
> But no matter how much you bad mouth this economy, statistics don't lie. The
> unemployment rate is 5.4% which is .2% lower than 1996 when Clinton and the
> Democrats were boasting about how good the economy was. Now that it's about
> the same percentage with Republican leadership, it's still a bad thing. Is the
> glass half full or half empty?
Chair Man George?
http://tarpley.net/bush12.htm
> They were the RNC, cheer-leading for their idol, George W. Bush, - a man
> whose policies have been the most dismal failures in recent history.
--Trickier Dick Cheeny -- out of office before an election; alive!
http://www.benfranklinbooks.com/
http://larouchepub.com/pr/2004/040505missouri_testim.html
http://larouchepub.com/other/2004/3107repeal_hava.html
http://larouchepub.com/pr/2004/040505missouri_testim.html
http://larouchepub.com/other/2003/3045dems_dive_soros.html
http://larouchepub.com/pr/2004/040505missouri_testim.html
http://larouchepub.com/other/2004/3104elect_voting.html
http://tarpley.net/bush12.htm
http://members.tripod.com/~american_almanac
http://www.rwgrayprojects.com/synergetics/plates/figs/plate02.html
Ray
<< "Republicans" will tell you that it's "0.5 full," and
"Democrats" will calim that it's "0.49999..." full, but
the glass is actually busted, because
of the burgeoning trade-deficit and the outsourcing
of everything, up to & including military logistics
(which is mainly supplies, not just armaments and
thier maintenance ... any figures,
on how much of each category is outsourced?) >><BR><BR>
Well, a conservative economics Professor made a point some time back. His name
is Walter Williams and has a weekly column at the Jewis World Review at
http://www.jewishworldreview.com/
His point was that too many times, people seem to make too much of this
"outsourcing" problem. He stated that if we were to ban or somehow limit
outsourcing, then it would only be fair to limit "insourcing" as well. What
his findings are, stated that if we put a ban on all such activity, we would be
in the negative figures when it comes to jobs. Many companies are foreign
owned here in the United States and this wouldn't be the case if we "didn't
play ball" with other countries.
The people of the United States have made a choice, they demand cheap, foreign
slave labor crap which is responsible for the success of Wallmart®, K-Mart®,
dollar stores just to name a few. This has nothing to do with Government and
nothing to do with BIG BUSINESS taking control of the White House. This
situation is the result of supply and demand and nothing more.
But let's say that an American company that makes "hangers" outsources it's
manufacturing to the tune of 150 jobs. Many believe that there is 150 jobs
lost. But this is only partly true. In reality, some jobs are created in the
process.
So we will take this situation of "hangers" and use it as an example. Who is
it that unloads these boats? American workers. Who is it that has to do the
paperwork of the material that comes off these boats? American workers. Who
is it that takes charge of examination of these products in Customs? American
workers. Who is it that takes those containers and drive them to their
destination of another warehouse? American workers. Who is it at these
warehouses that unloads these trucks and processes the paper work? American
workers. And who is it that delivers those products to the stores? American
workers.
Now, this is just one example of the jobs created by outsourced companies. Are
jobs lost in America because of outsourced "hangers?" Yes. But jobs are also
created in the process which figures are never included when considering the
outsourcing of a company.
But now, the American consumer is paying $2.99 for a dozen hangers instead of
the $4.99 it would cost them to purchase American made hangers. What this does
is provide additional disposable income for the American consumer. And this
income is used for other items or services that keeps this economy going. So
this "outsourcing" situation is not as big of a problem as many would like us
to believe.