Man spits on Hanoi Jane
Foxtrot
Mo. Man Spits Tobacco Juice at Jane Fonda
TIM CURRAN, Associated Press Writer
KANSAS CITY, Mo. - A man spit tobacco juice into the face
of Jane Fonda after waiting in line to have her sign her new
memoir. Capt. Rich Lockhart of the Kansas City Police
Department said Michael A. Smith, 54, was arrested Tuesday
night on a municipal charge of disorderly conduct.
Smith, a Vietnam veteran, told The Kansas City Star
Wednesday that Fonda was a "traitor" and that her protests
against the Vietnam War were unforgivable.
none
Michael A. Smith should have been given a hero's parade down main
street. And Liberal Hanoi Jane should have been tossed in jail for
showing her face in public.
sam bicke
"none" <no...@none.C0M> wrote in message
news:3nee61tm3m9tfams1...@4ax.com...
Traitor and Deserter Bush should be hauled off to Columbia where he can have
all the Cartels of Crack he can puff on. Same for retards like you.
Birkenstock Bolshevik
Smith should be given a medal. Fonda was responsible of giving Vietnam
POWS as much pain as the Viet Cong.
She should be sent to Abu Ghraib.....hehehe.
-
The difference between Los Angeles and yogurt is that yogurt comes with less fruit.
-Rush Limbaugh
spino...@yahoo.com
The ugliness of this psycho's act is unremarked upon, of course, in
this thread. Fonda was and remains a beautiful and intelligent woman
whose workout series enabled thousands of people to recover from
addictions through personal empowerment, but it seems there is a hard
core of losers (aged now in their fifties) who still can't deal with
female empowerment and who think spitting (an infantile and regressive
act) is a political statement.
GET OVER IT. She didn't want to go out with you. Her getting naked on
the beach wasn't about you.
The North Vietnamese played male NYT reporter David Halberstam "like an
ocarina", according to Tom Wolfe; any society at war will attempt to
reach out to people on the other side who don't agree with the war. I
conclude therefore that Jane's being manipulated by the North
Vietnamese who OF COURSE did everything they could to appeal to the
majority of Americans opposed to the undeclared and illegal war in
Vietnam is a cover story for sexual resentment.
Calling Jane Fonda "Hanoi Jane" draws a false equation in the mind,
between the war with Japan and Germany (where "Tokyo Rose" and others
broadcast to American troops from the other side). But during WWII,
there were hardly any Americans who thought the war wrong, and FDR's
asking Congress for a declaration of war made the war legal.
Whereas Jane Fonda and others traveled to North Vietnam, a country with
which the US was not formally at war, to see if the conflict could be
ended. They did in fact nothing more than Henry Kissinger.
The dishonesty in the use of the word "war" is a constant theme in
American politics. Now, for example, we're supposed to be at America's!
New! (Whitening!) War!...but Bush refuses to meet with the families of
the casualties because he's a shithead, and Dan Rather was forced out
of his job for identifying casualties by name.
"War" is in other words a convenient word for re-establishing male
sexual identity and blaming women for its loss when in fact the
military-industrial complex performs the emasculation, from sexually
abusive language in Basic to humiliation and harassment by REMFs in the
field, to jobs in defense industry eliminated whenever peace breaks
out.
WWII veterans recovered from their trauma, for the most part, and got
on with their lives. Far from supporting, in China (where I live) or
the US the rehashing of old resentments and hatreds, many WWII veterans
opposed the building of the WWII memorial because they wanted their
memorial to be their lives and children, living in peace.
This may be, in part, because WWII was the last declared war and except
perhaps for Korea the last US war that was legal under international
law.
Refusal to accept this causes that stasis, in attitudes about one small
participant, Jane Fonda, which over time becomes infantile regression.
I hope this guy is tried for aggravated assault at a minimum. I hope he
is tested for HIV and if positive is charged with murder. Fonda could
have gotten his shit in her eye.
I hope then she uses her expensive legal talent to hound him for the
rest of his miserable life. I hope she takes his trailer, his mangy
dog, his beat-up pickup truck, his goddamn guns, and his stash of
Copenhagen. I hope she leaves this loser only enough for Ramen noodles
and his child support.
spino...@yahoo.com
Birkenstock Bolshevik wrote:
> On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 23:12:02 -0700, Foxtrot <fox...@null.com> wrote:
>
> >http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/fonda_spitter
> >
> >Mo. Man Spits Tobacco Juice at Jane Fonda
> >
> >TIM CURRAN, Associated Press Writer
> >
> >KANSAS CITY, Mo. - A man spit tobacco juice into the face
> >of Jane Fonda after waiting in line to have her sign her new
> >memoir. Capt. Rich Lockhart of the Kansas City Police
> >Department said Michael A. Smith, 54, was arrested Tuesday
> >night on a municipal charge of disorderly conduct.
> >
> >Smith, a Vietnam veteran, told The Kansas City Star
> >Wednesday that Fonda was a "traitor" and that her protests
> >against the Vietnam War were unforgivable.
>
> Smith should be given a medal. Fonda was responsible of giving
Vietnam
> POWS as much pain as the Viet Cong.
How did that work? Before and after Fonda's visit to North Vietnam,
POWs got the treatment they might expect for waging an undeclared war,
mostly from the air, in which 4 million Vietnamese civilians died from
blast injuries, massive burns, axphysiation, and so on.
The treatment was legal under the Geneva convention and in fact there
are NO documented cases of North Vietnamese war crimes in the treatment
of POWs. Instead, the POWs got the treatment they might expect in a
society with few resources to spare.
The war crimes occured on the other side.
>
> She should be sent to Abu Ghraib.....hehehe.
The North Vietnames never pulled the shit that was authorized from fag
(oops, that should be flag) rank at Abu Ghraib. They never used
systematic sexual humiliation.
And yet you call yourself "Birkenstock Bolshevik". The chances are that
many posters on this issue, like the KC assailant, have been feeding
for so long on fantasies that with hearts grown brutal they no longer
have anything that might be considered a coherent world-view, only a
montage of sexual resentments...which in the case of Jane Fonda happen
to be almost forty years old.
Of course, you may be using "irony", which is more insanity.
David Hartung
<spino...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1114079083....@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
By your post you show yourself to be a fool. In a just world, Jane Fonda
would have been tried for treason, convicted, and executed.
BlackWater
No, no ... jailing Jane would just be un-American
dontchathink - free speech and all that. Now SPITTING
on her for continuing to PROFIT all these years from
idiocy, sedition and collaboration with our enemies ...
now that seems fair 'commentary' on her career - also
'free speech'.
BÎllary/2008
comeuppance. By the way before you fucking LIEberals go off the deep end.
I don't condone violence. Spitting is not violence. She got what she gave,
at the moment in her life when she is begging for understanding. Sadly this
is the very luxury she refused to give others back in the day.
BÎllary/2008
post. That fucking bitch got exactly what she deserved. And she got it at
the very moment in her adult life when she is pleading for understanding and
forgiveness. It's too bad she could not afford others this luxury back then
isn't it?
MFOgilvie
The next time Fonda has a book signing, everyone should show up and get
her to autograph their cans of Skoal.
Birkenstock Bolshevik
>
>Birkenstock Bolshevik wrote:
>> On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 23:12:02 -0700, Foxtrot <fox...@null.com> wrote:
>>
>> >http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/fonda_spitter
>> >
>> >Mo. Man Spits Tobacco Juice at Jane Fonda
>> >
>> >TIM CURRAN, Associated Press Writer
>> >
>> >KANSAS CITY, Mo. - A man spit tobacco juice into the face
>> >of Jane Fonda after waiting in line to have her sign her new
>> >memoir. Capt. Rich Lockhart of the Kansas City Police
>> >Department said Michael A. Smith, 54, was arrested Tuesday
>> >night on a municipal charge of disorderly conduct.
>> >
>> >Smith, a Vietnam veteran, told The Kansas City Star
>> >Wednesday that Fonda was a "traitor" and that her protests
>> >against the Vietnam War were unforgivable.
>>
>> Smith should be given a medal. Fonda was responsible of giving
>Vietnam
>> POWS as much pain as the Viet Cong.
>
>How did that work? Before and after Fonda's visit to North Vietnam,
>POWs got the treatment they might expect for waging an undeclared war,
>mostly from the air, in which 4 million Vietnamese civilians died from
>blast injuries, massive burns, axphysiation, and so on.
>
I see you are trying justify Fonda's betrayal of US soldiers in
Vietnam. You must be cut from traitorous cloth as Hanoi Jane.
>The treatment was legal under the Geneva convention and in fact there
>are NO documented cases of North Vietnamese war crimes in the treatment
>of POWs. Instead, the POWs got the treatment they might expect in a
>society with few resources to spare.
>
You denial of torture by the NVA shows how much you hate America.
During a 1972 trip to North Vietnam, Jane Fonda propagandized on
behalf of the North Vietnamese government, declared that American POWs
were being treated humanely and condemned U.S. soldiers as "war
criminals" and later denounced them as liars for claiming they had
been tortured.
Fonda's tour of North Vietnam in 1972, during which she cozied up to
the enemy, posing for photo ops with communist troops and broadcasting
anti-American propaganda over Radio Hanoi. She also participated in a
staged press conference with American servicemen held captive by the
Viet Cong, the purpose of which was to "prove" that the POWs were not
being mistreated by their captors. Years later when the released POWs
described the very real torture and degradation they suffered at the
hands of the North Vietnamese, Fonda called them "hypocrites and
liars."
For all you Fidel fans:
Cuban officials, under diplomatic cover in Hanoi during the Vietnam
War, brutally tortured and killed American POWs whom the y beat
senseless in a research program "sanctioned by the North Vietnamese."
Newly declassified secret CIA and Department of Defense (DOD)
intelligence documents, obtained under the Freedom of Information Act,
reveal the extent of Cuba's involvement with American POWs captured in
Vietnam.
>The war crimes occured on the other side.
>
>
>
>>
>> She should be sent to Abu Ghraib.....hehehe.
>
>The North Vietnames never pulled the shit that was authorized from fag
>(oops, that should be flag) rank at Abu Ghraib. They never used
>systematic sexual humiliation.
>
As mentioned above, there was the Cuban NVA connection,
>And yet you call yourself "Birkenstock Bolshevik". The chances are that
>many posters on this issue, like the KC assailant, have been feeding
>for so long on fantasies that with hearts grown brutal they no longer
>have anything that might be considered a coherent world-view, only a
>montage of sexual resentments...which in the case of Jane Fonda happen
>to be almost forty years old.
>
Hanoi Jane will never be forgotten. Her attempt to jumpstart her
career will be futile.
>Of course, you may be using "irony", which is more insanity.
>
Jane Fonda will always be remembered as Hanoi Jane.
George
Libby-dems who have been silent or supportive about physical assaults on
Republicans and conservatives have only themselves to blame for what will
become a sprial of counter violence.
"He pulls a knife on you, you pull a gun on him. He sends one of yours to
the hospital, you send one of his to the morgue. That's the Chicago Way."
Sean Connery to Kevin Costner (playing Eliot Ness) in "The Untouchables."
You folks started it....
"Foxtrot" <fox...@null.com> wrote in message
news:3oge61llv77r5tut7...@4ax.com...
Name Redacted
No, Poxy, the cowards and traitors were the chickenhawks.
Cheering, but refusing to fight. That left the heavy lifting
to the uninterested. Oh, and BTW, didn't your guy say
in 2000 that that nature of the government of a foreign
country isn't the business of the US. Gee, could that include
(North) Vietnam....it must because the US does a lot of
business with them. And gosh, consider China...
Boy, that Vietnam vet was really brave, going after an
elderly woman with a bad hip...Kinda like your frat boy
George.
spino...@yahoo.com
Wow, this is a just world? Hey, he keyed my car: straight to execution.
Better be careful with this form of instantaneous "justice". In a just
world, where another party takes control, Bush would have been tried
for crimes starting with evasion of military service and complicity
(through neglect or more) in Sep 11, and executed.
spino...@yahoo.com
No, it's not "free speech". It's aggravated assault and battery.
It'sassault under the law because assault is constituted in the clear
INTENTION, only, to engage in a physical attack and spitting
communicates that intention. It's battery because a projectile was
hurled. The tobacco could have got in her eye and the attacker could
have any number of foul diseases.
Flag burning is protected (by a judgement in which conservative Scalia
concurred) because the flag is an inanimate object. Jance Fonda is a
PERSON, and the guy should not have been charged with disorderly
conduct: it should have been disorderly conduct and assault with
battery.
spino...@yahoo.com
Name Redacted wrote:>
>
> No, Poxy, the cowards and traitors were the chickenhawks.
> Cheering, but refusing to fight. That left the heavy lifting
> to the uninterested. Oh, and BTW, didn't your guy say
> in 2000 that that nature of the government of a foreign
> country isn't the business of the US. Gee, could that include
> (North) Vietnam....it must because the US does a lot of
> business with them. And gosh, consider China...
>
> Boy, that Vietnam vet was really brave, going after an
> elderly woman with a bad hip...Kinda like your frat boy
> George.
Amen, Brah. During the actual conflict, actual infantry serving in the
field supported an end to the war. The servicemen who first started
this Jane-bashing were flyboys who killed civilians unavoidably as part
of their jobs and were in danger, at most, from SAM (surface to air
missile) batteries which the US learned to overcome. Most of them were
officers and when they got back to civilian life, tried to rewrite the
United States' defeat in Vietnam without the nasty bits.
These oxygen deprived fly boys were engaged in a futile and cowardly
campaign. Futile, because as Robert McNamara recently confessed, it
would have "destroyed" only an advanced industrial society whereas the
biggest factories in North Vietnam were the size of auto parts dealers
in the US. Therefore cowardly and illegal under international law.
This is why Jane Fonda said "I wish I had those murderers in my sights
right now".
spino...@yahoo.com
George wrote:
> I predicted that "tit" was going to result in "tat," libby-dems.
>
> Libby-dems who have been silent or supportive about physical assaults
on
> Republicans and conservatives have only themselves to blame for what
will
> become a sprial of counter violence.
>
> "He pulls a knife on you, you pull a gun on him. He sends one of
yours to
> the hospital, you send one of his to the morgue. That's the Chicago
Way."
> Sean Connery to Kevin Costner (playing Eliot Ness) in "The
Untouchables."
It might be the Chicago way. It's also the Fascist way.
And when did Jane physically attack Republicans and conservatives?
She said "I wish I had those murderers in my sights right now", a sort
of vicarious and foolish comment which a young Hollywood actress might
be expected to say.
Britney Spears, while popping her gum, says we should support President
Bush no matter how many people in Iraq have to die. Because of her
support for the Iraq war, a lot of fools will join up and get killed. I
would think Britney is much more responsible for people getting killed.
Eris
David, David, David, you ignorant, lying little slut. If you had been
in the Vietnam conflict as I was, instead of just reading the comic
books, you would appreciate the efforts of others to end the stupid
and unwinnable war.
Idiot, the Vietnamese beat the red Chinese army. Which movie star do
you blame for that?
Dear whore for the religious right, The people who torture the
prisoners were professionals hired to get them to say propaganda
against the U.S.. They could careless about Fonda or U.S. opinion,
this is all bullshit from the televangelist, to get you angry, so you
will send in more money.
How stupid are you people, oops I forgot you brag about your
stupidity.
spino...@yahoo.com
Even when Congress declares war (which is what is supposed to happen
under the Constitution), American citizens retain the right to speak.
>
> >The treatment was legal under the Geneva convention and in fact
there
> >are NO documented cases of North Vietnamese war crimes in the
treatment
> >of POWs. Instead, the POWs got the treatment they might expect in a
> >society with few resources to spare.
> >
> You denial of torture by the NVA shows how much you hate America.
>
> During a 1972 trip to North Vietnam, Jane Fonda propagandized on
> behalf of the North Vietnamese government, declared that American
POWs
> were being treated humanely and condemned U.S. soldiers as "war
> criminals" and later denounced them as liars for claiming they had
> been tortured.
>
> Fonda's tour of North Vietnam in 1972, during which she cozied up to
> the enemy, posing for photo ops with communist troops and
broadcasting
> anti-American propaganda over Radio Hanoi. She also participated in a
> staged press conference with American servicemen held captive by the
What kind of press conference is NOT staged? The North Vietnames were
fighting for their existence. Staging press conferences (which is the
same thing as having them in the first place) was part, for them, of
the battle. Today, each and every press conference given by the US is
stage-managed from start to finish.
> Viet Cong, the purpose of which was to "prove" that the POWs were not
> being mistreated by their captors. Years later when the released POWs
> described the very real torture and degradation they suffered at the
> hands of the North Vietnamese, Fonda called them "hypocrites and
> liars."
The torture you describe was primarily mental torture which is indeed
illegal under the Geneva convention and it was primarily dealt out by
guards at a low level, guards who had relatives being killed by US
bombing. It was being meted out on soldiers of a country which had
refused to sign the latest Geneva accords (1954) on the laws of war and
which was waging an undeclared war of aggression against North Vietnam.
>
>
> For all you Fidel fans:
>
> Cuban officials, under diplomatic cover in Hanoi during the Vietnam
> War, brutally tortured and killed American POWs whom the y beat
> senseless in a research program "sanctioned by the North Vietnamese."
> Newly declassified secret CIA and Department of Defense (DOD)
> intelligence documents, obtained under the Freedom of Information
Act,
> reveal the extent of Cuba's involvement with American POWs captured
in
> Vietnam.
>
All this means is that the North Vietnamese and Cubans invented a form
of "remanding" which is used by the US today. The problem in
retrospectively judging North Vietnames and Cuban conduct is that today
the United States is guilty of war crimes and seeks to JUSTIFY its
crimes and not END them.
The childish and regressive hatred expressed by posters here and acts
like spitting on Fonda (an act in fact neatly symmetrical to "spitting
on soldiers") MEANS that you Fascists cannot claim moral high ground
and you cannot JUDGE Fonda in any meaningful sense.
Birkenstock Bolshevik
Jane Fonda can speak., but there is no Constitutional provision that
prevents people from reacting to her speech.
>>
>> >The treatment was legal under the Geneva convention and in fact
>there
>> >are NO documented cases of North Vietnamese war crimes in the
>treatment
>> >of POWs. Instead, the POWs got the treatment they might expect in a
>> >society with few resources to spare.
>> >
>> You denial of torture by the NVA shows how much you hate America.
>>
>> During a 1972 trip to North Vietnam, Jane Fonda propagandized on
>> behalf of the North Vietnamese government, declared that American
>POWs
>> were being treated humanely and condemned U.S. soldiers as "war
>> criminals" and later denounced them as liars for claiming they had
>> been tortured.
>>
>> Fonda's tour of North Vietnam in 1972, during which she cozied up to
>> the enemy, posing for photo ops with communist troops and
>broadcasting
>> anti-American propaganda over Radio Hanoi. She also participated in a
>> staged press conference with American servicemen held captive by the
>
>What kind of press conference is NOT staged? The North Vietnames were
>fighting for their existence. Staging press conferences (which is the
>same thing as having them in the first place) was part, for them, of
>the battle. Today, each and every press conference given by the US is
>stage-managed from start to finish.
>
North Vietnam wanted South Vietnam for the Communists. Jane Fonda was
for North Vietnam. She'll have to live with that fact for the rest of
her life. Her trying to kickstart career is a waste of time. Jane
Fonda would have been better off she just made Barbarella type of
films. She could have been the 70s Pamela Lee.
The bitch is toast.
spino...@yahoo.com
There is a common law provision which the Constitution does not change
(and reinforces in the Ninth amendment) and this is the illegality of
simple assault (the credible threat to cause harm) and battery (harm
caused, including the throwing or expectoration of harmful, and
potentially harmful, projectiles).
The jagoff KC cops charged this animal with "disorderly conduct". He
was guilty of assault and battery which is NOT covered by the First
Amendment. Justice Antonin Scalia, a conservative, made this crystal
clear when he concurred that flag burning is protected speech. If the
flag is the owner's personal property then he is disposing of it as his
right and making a symbolic statement about the flag which is ALSO his
right (even in wartime according to Supreme Court jurisprudence during
WWI).
Whereas the target of damage (skin exposed to the poison nicotine, and
the additives that US Tobacco Company is known to add to Copenhagen and
similar tobacco to make it more addictive) was another PERSON.
If this incident had occured in an office, and the jagoff KC cops had
not been sympathetic to the perp, the target would have filed criminal
charges and a civil lawsuit, and I hope Fonda does this.
As I have said, the incident is strangely symmetrical in that the
jagoff perp acted out the urban legend, that protestors "spat" on
soldiers. They did not, and the incident makes clear that some MIA/POW
types are stuck in a childish past constructed more of movies and
wishful thinking than anything else.
No, North Vietnam regarded itself as the successor state to the
emperors of Annam and French Indochina and was fighting a civil war to
unify that state, while the governments of South Vietnam were gangstas,
one of whom the US had to eliminate (in a similar manner to the way it
extirpated Manuel Noriega of Panam in 1990).
There WAS no singular and unified Communist phenomenon. Russia and
China split in 1956 over the issue of Stalin and North Vietnam
preferred Russian aid to China because of fear of China. Are you even
in fact aware that China invaded North Vietnam in 1979?
The US was interfering in the internal affairs of another country in
part because the predecessor corporation to Cheney's Halliburton, Brown
and Root, wanted contracts for reconstruction in South Vietnam as today
where this company (unable to make a buck in the free market) is
sending contract employees out to DIE in helicopters, so that fat cats
can enrich themselves.
> for North Vietnam. She'll have to live with that fact for the rest of
> her life. Her trying to kickstart career is a waste of time. Jane
> Fonda would have been better off she just made Barbarella type of
Instead, she refused to be a victim and won several academy awards.
Can't stand it, can ya, loser?
Owing to her example, today women are growingly over-represented at ivy
league colleges while men waste their time with Maxim. She REFUSED to
let anybody write the screenplay for her life and avoided the fate of
Marilyn. As such, she profoundly threatens low-dominance males as did
Rosa Luxembourg.
> films. She could have been the 70s Pamela Lee.
>
> The bitch is toast.
What would YOU do if some guy in a tittie bar said to your face, "your
grandmother is toast", "your mother is toast", "your sister is toast",
or "your daughter is toast"?
George
<spino...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1114132444....@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
>
> George wrote:
> > I predicted that "tit" was going to result in "tat," libby-dems.
> >
> > Libby-dems who have been silent or supportive about physical assaults
> on
> > Republicans and conservatives have only themselves to blame for what
> will
> > become a sprial of counter violence.
> >
> > "He pulls a knife on you, you pull a gun on him. He sends one of
> yours to
> > the hospital, you send one of his to the morgue. That's the Chicago
> Way."
> > Sean Connery to Kevin Costner (playing Eliot Ness) in "The
> Untouchables."
>
> It might be the Chicago way. It's also the Fascist way.
It's the libby-dem way, as well. Get used to being on the receiving end.
YOU ass-fucks started it, after all.....
>
> And when did Jane physically attack Republicans and conservatives?
When did Ann Coulter physically attack Democrats and liberals? When did
Pat Buchanan physically attack Democrats and liberals? When did David
Horowitz physically attack Democrats and liberals? When did William Kristol
physically attack Democrats and liberals?
Not physically assaulting liberals and Democrats has *NOT* stopped you
libby-dem ass-fuck thugs from assaulting hi-visibility Republicans and
conservatives, has it?
Fonda's a FUCKING TRAITOR. She's just lucky that the disabled vet didn't
intend on taking her life.
>
> She said "I wish I had those murderers in my sights right now", a sort
> of vicarious and foolish comment which a young Hollywood actress might
> be expected to say.
HER actions led to the deaths of POWS held by the NVA. She *RATTED* them
out when they tried to slip her a note. Her broadcast was a treasonous act.
The Bitch deserves 10 years in prison or a firing squad.
>
> Britney Spears, while popping her gum, says we should support President
> Bush no matter how many people in Iraq have to die. Because of her
> support for the Iraq war, a lot of fools will join up and get killed. I
> would think Britney is much more responsible for people getting killed.
Well, I think you're a dicksucking libby-dem ASSHOLE. Wanna do something
about it, libby-dem lie-pig?
spino...@yahoo.com
BÎllary/2008 wrote:
> I agree. Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman. now back
to our
> post. That fucking bitch got exactly what she deserved. And she got
it at
It's interesting that you could write, apparently without irony, that
"Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman", and the call her a
"fucking bitch".
How can a beautiful and intelligent woman be also a fucking bitch?
I can only theorize that as false consciousness all the way down, as a
Negative Dialectic, Fascism is able to think that humanistic categories
such as beauty or intelligence are "all very well in their place" but
not useful in the lived world of the Fascist.
Men in groups under pressure are often like the Fascist general who
said "down with intelligence!"
Beauty and intelligence are to be replaced in the New World Order by
LOYALTY.
Birkenstock Bolshevik
Jane Fonda will have to deal with her traitorous legacy as long as she
lives.
>
>The jagoff KC cops charged this animal with "disorderly conduct". He
>was guilty of assault and battery which is NOT covered by the First
>Amendment. Justice Antonin Scalia, a conservative, made this crystal
>clear when he concurred that flag burning is protected speech. If the
>flag is the owner's personal property then he is disposing of it as his
>right and making a symbolic statement about the flag which is ALSO his
>right (even in wartime according to Supreme Court jurisprudence during
>WWI).
>
>Whereas the target of damage (skin exposed to the poison nicotine, and
>the additives that US Tobacco Company is known to add to Copenhagen and
>similar tobacco to make it more addictive) was another PERSON.
Oh poor baby.
>
>If this incident had occured in an office, and the jagoff KC cops had
>not been sympathetic to the perp, the target would have filed criminal
>charges and a civil lawsuit, and I hope Fonda does this.
>
Let Fonda garner all the publicity over the incident. It will remind
the public why she is one of the most hated person in America.
>As I have said, the incident is strangely symmetrical in that the
>jagoff perp acted out the urban legend, that protestors "spat" on
>soldiers. They did not, and the incident makes clear that some MIA/POW
>types are stuck in a childish past constructed more of movies and
>wishful thinking than anything else.
You are sure jumping through a lot of hoops to defend this hated
woman.
Fonda got what she deserved. This is what this is what this thread is
about not the causes of the Vietnam War.
-
>There WAS no singular and unified Communist phenomenon. Russia and
>China split in 1956 over the issue of Stalin and North Vietnam
>preferred Russian aid to China because of fear of China. Are you even
>in fact aware that China invaded North Vietnam in 1979?
>
Thread is about Fonda. Got it?
>The US was interfering in the internal affairs of another country in
>part because the predecessor corporation to Cheney's Halliburton, Brown
>and Root, wanted contracts for reconstruction in South Vietnam as today
>where this company (unable to make a buck in the free market) is
>sending contract employees out to DIE in helicopters, so that fat cats
>can enrich themselves.
>> for North Vietnam. She'll have to live with that fact for the rest of
>> her life. Her trying to kickstart career is a waste of time. Jane
>> Fonda would have been better off she just made Barbarella type of
>
>Instead, she refused to be a victim and won several academy awards.
>Can't stand it, can ya, loser?
>
>Owing to her example, today women are growingly over-represented at ivy
>league colleges while men waste their time with Maxim. She REFUSED to
>let anybody write the screenplay for her life and avoided the fate of
>Marilyn. As such, she profoundly threatens low-dominance males as did
>Rosa Luxembourg.
>
You must say you have so much bullshit to say with so little time.
Hanoi Jane is trying to jumpstart her career. All I've got to say to
the bitch....no such luck.
>> films. She could have been the 70s Pamela Lee.
>>
>> The bitch is toast.
>
>What would YOU do if some guy in a tittie bar said to your face, "your
>grandmother is toast", "your mother is toast", "your sister is toast",
>or "your daughter is toast"?
I do not go to tittie bars. You must since you know so much about
them.
I said Hanoi Jane is toast. What are going to do about it, Little Man?
Birkenstock Bolshevik
>
>BÎllary/2008 wrote:
>> I agree. Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman. now back
>to our
>> post. That fucking bitch got exactly what she deserved. And she got
>it at
>
>It's interesting that you could write, apparently without irony, that
>"Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman", and the call her a
>"fucking bitch".
>
>How can a beautiful and intelligent woman be also a fucking bitch?
>
She an aging old hag who made the idiotic move to derail her chosen
career.
spino...@yahoo.com
Fascism is precisely this lack of empathy memorialized in irony,
intended to present the speaker or writer as some sort of tough guy. I
notice that the only poster who at least says he is a military veteran
is pro-Fonda.
>
> >
> >If this incident had occured in an office, and the jagoff KC cops
had
> >not been sympathetic to the perp, the target would have filed
criminal
> >charges and a civil lawsuit, and I hope Fonda does this.
> >
> Let Fonda garner all the publicity over the incident. It will remind
> the public why she is one of the most hated person in America.
>
> >As I have said, the incident is strangely symmetrical in that the
> >jagoff perp acted out the urban legend, that protestors "spat" on
> >soldiers. They did not, and the incident makes clear that some
MIA/POW
> >types are stuck in a childish past constructed more of movies and
> >wishful thinking than anything else.
>
> You are sure jumping through a lot of hoops to defend this hated
> woman.
Yeah, I am actually thinking and not just mindlessly spewing hatred and
vitriol which tells more about the damaged fantasies of the speaker
than anything else.
Oh, so let's focus, shall we?
This way, certain people can dress up as US Patriots INDEPENDENT of
history, ourstide of history and to attack them encodes another
permanently as a "traitor" in a frozen Fascist state.
>
> -
> >There WAS no singular and unified Communist phenomenon. Russia and
> >China split in 1956 over the issue of Stalin and North Vietnam
> >preferred Russian aid to China because of fear of China. Are you
even
> >in fact aware that China invaded North Vietnam in 1979?
> >
> Thread is about Fonda. Got it?
Translation: "I am underinformed. Got it?"
Of course you don't. You get your rocks off spewing ignorance and
hatred.
>
> I said Hanoi Jane is toast. What are going to do about it, Little
Man?
I've already humiliated you. Had enough?
1566 Dead
Let's see: we have a president who claims he discharged his military
duty but lied. We have a vice president who never served because he
had better things to do.
They've killed several thousand Americans though incompetence or
malice, and they've made America into a disgraceful mockery.
Given that, I doubt Fonda has to worry about what some sniveling
little brat who puts party ahead of country has to say about her.
-
Carl M. Forti, a spokesman for the National Republican
Congressional Committee -- "A month from now,
people are not going to remember [Terri Schiavo],"
he said, and 20 months from now, in the 2006
elections, "it will be irrelevant."
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/26/politics/26delay.html?
Not dead, in jail, or a slave? Thank a liberal!
Pay your taxes so the rich don't have to.
For the finest in liberal/leftist commentary,
http://www.zeppscommentaries.com
For news feed (free, 10-20 articles a day)
http://groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/zepps_news
For essays (donations accepted, 2 articles/week)
http://groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/zepps_essays
1566 Dead
<LeftC...@GirlyMen.com> wrote:
>On 22 Apr 2005 04:45:15 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>>
>>BÎllary/2008 wrote:
>>> I agree. Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman. now back
>>to our
>>> post. That fucking bitch got exactly what she deserved. And she got
>>it at
>>
>>It's interesting that you could write, apparently without irony, that
>>"Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman", and the call her a
>>"fucking bitch".
>>
>>How can a beautiful and intelligent woman be also a fucking bitch?
>>
>She an aging old hag who made the idiotic move to derail her chosen
>career.
And yet she has a new movie coming out this summer, "Meet the
Monsters" It's expected to do well at the box office, like nearly all
of her movies have. Her book is selling well.
And your drunken, shambling hero who expresses his political hatred by
spitting on 67 year old women isn't getting much in the way of a
popularity surge, is he?
Still, he DID demonstrate what the American right wing is really like,
and so he did do the country more of a service the other day than he
probably did in Vietnam.
>
>
>-
>The difference between Los Angeles and yogurt is that yogurt comes with less fruit.
>-Rush Limbaugh
-
VRWC Destruction Machine
If you hate Fonda, you're a Fascist. You're an idiot.
>>
>> >
>> >If this incident had occured in an office, and the jagoff KC cops
>had
>> >not been sympathetic to the perp, the target would have filed
>criminal
>> >charges and a civil lawsuit, and I hope Fonda does this.
>> >
>> Let Fonda garner all the publicity over the incident. It will remind
>> the public why she is one of the most hated person in America.
>>
>> >As I have said, the incident is strangely symmetrical in that the
>> >jagoff perp acted out the urban legend, that protestors "spat" on
>> >soldiers. They did not, and the incident makes clear that some
>MIA/POW
>> >types are stuck in a childish past constructed more of movies and
>> >wishful thinking than anything else.
>>
>> You are sure jumping through a lot of hoops to defend this hated
>> woman.
>
>Yeah, I am actually thinking and not just mindlessly spewing hatred and
>vitriol which tells more about the damaged fantasies of the speaker
>than anything else.
Jane Fonda is hated. End of story.
You want to argue the Vietnam War and not discuss that Hanoi Jane is
hated. Be rest assured, you or Hanoi Jane will never be accused of
being US Patriots.
-
"Oprah is so rich, I saw John Kerry proposing to her just an hour ago."
VRWC Destruction Machine
<zepp1566#2211finestplanet.com> wrote:
>>Jane Fonda will have to deal with her traitorous legacy as long as she
>>lives.
>
>Let's see: we have a president who claims he discharged his military
>duty but lied. We have a vice president who never served because he
>had better things to do.
>
Can you say legal deferment, Zepperhead? So many draft dodgers found
sanctuary in Canada. The Cannucks love their draft dodgers.
>They've killed several thousand Americans though incompetence or
>malice, and they've made America into a disgraceful mockery.
>
The North Vietnamese government killed millions, but Cannucks like
that kid of stuff since it was a Communist government.
>Given that, I doubt Fonda has to worry about what some sniveling
>little brat who puts party ahead of country has to say about her.
You will have to deal with the fact that you're Canadian. Hanoi Jane
is trying to revitalize her career not her standing with any political
party. She has been branded with the North Vietnamese flag on her
heart. Kind of like John Kerry, who was hero to the NVA.
VRWC Destruction Machine
As I said she is an aging old hag trying to revitalize her fledgling
career.
1566 Dead
<LibB...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 19:11:18 -0700, 1566 Dead
><zepp1566#2211finestplanet.com> wrote:
>
>>>Jane Fonda will have to deal with her traitorous legacy as long as she
>>>lives.
>>
>>Let's see: we have a president who claims he discharged his military
>>duty but lied. We have a vice president who never served because he
>>had better things to do.
>>
>Can you say legal deferment, Zepperhead? So many draft dodgers found
>sanctuary in Canada. The Cannucks love their draft dodgers.
Sure I can. I had legal deferments myself. Didn't even have to go to
Canada, although it was obviously high on my list of options.
But I never wanted anyone to go in my place. Cheney did.
That's the difference between a war protester and a chickenhawk.
Canada generally benefitted from the Americans who sought refuge from
the draft. After all, they were getting people capable of independent
thought who had the resolve to act on that independent thought.
>
>>They've killed several thousand Americans though incompetence or
>>malice, and they've made America into a disgraceful mockery.
>>
>The North Vietnamese government killed millions, but Cannucks like
>that kid of stuff since it was a Communist government.
The United States government killed millions. Could you tell me what
makes them better than the Hanoi regime was?
>
>>Given that, I doubt Fonda has to worry about what some sniveling
>>little brat who puts party ahead of country has to say about her.
>
>You will have to deal with the fact that you're Canadian. Hanoi Jane
>is trying to revitalize her career not her standing with any political
>party. She has been branded with the North Vietnamese flag on her
>heart. Kind of like John Kerry, who was hero to the NVA.
I have to admit I look at you, and I feel a sense of relief that I
don't have to call you "countryman". I imagine most Americans wish
they could say the same thing when they read your stuff.
That reminds me: what did you do during the war, daddy?
>
>-
>"Oprah is so rich, I saw John Kerry proposing to her just an hour ago."
-
spino...@yahoo.com
Birkenstock Bolshevik wrote:
> On 22 Apr 2005 04:45:15 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> >
> >BÎllary/2008 wrote:
> >> I agree. Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman. now
back
> >to our
> >> post. That fucking bitch got exactly what she deserved. And she
got
> >it at
> >
> >It's interesting that you could write, apparently without irony,
that
> >"Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman", and the call her
a
> >"fucking bitch".
> >
> >How can a beautiful and intelligent woman be also a fucking bitch?
> >
> She an aging old hag who made the idiotic move to derail her chosen
> career.
As in a dream of Parzival, she then transforms back and forth from a
beautiful young woman into an aging hag.
Fonda is obviously a sick obsession of men who unlike her cannot
change.
Thus we see that increasingly, ugly and sick men IN THEIR FIFTIES as
was the KC moron dressing and acting LIKE CHILDREN. Those who are not
busy being born are busy dying.
"Fascism is the nightmare of childhood." - Adorno
spino...@yahoo.com
Wow, such a snappy precis. Anyway, your logic is all fucked up.
The claim is not "if you hate Fonda THEN you're a Fascist".
It's "if you're a Fascist, then you hate Fonda".
Some bimbo movie actress pushed out of a role because Jane still looked
great in a bikini in 1980 (Plaza Suite) might hate Fonda for reasons
unconnected to Fascism.
My claim is instead that Fascisms have certain family resemblances and
one is the destruction of civil society through the destruction of the
admiration of figures who do not in turn (like Britney) assent to the
status quo.
It is important for a Fascist state to make sure the most trivial forms
of fandom don't contradict larger power structures, therefore for a
Hollywood actress or Princess of Wales to espouse progressive causes
becomes a matter of state concern.
Peacenik
news:1114133156.0...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
>
> Birkenstock Bolshevik wrote:
> > On 21 Apr 2005 03:35:02 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > I see you are trying justify Fonda's betrayal of US soldiers in
> > Vietnam. You must be cut from traitorous cloth as Hanoi Jane.
My uncle fought in Vietnam. The experience made him a life-long liberal and
opponent of war. He also supported Jane Fonda.
REAL Vietnam veterans are liberals. Those so-called "Vietnam veterans" who
subscribe to right-wing politics are nothing but frauds and poseurs.
Steven Canyon
<zepp1566#2211finestplanet.com> wrote:
>On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 21:34:39 GMT, Birkenstock Bolshevik
><LeftC...@GirlyMen.com> wrote:
>
>>On 22 Apr 2005 04:45:15 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>BÎllary/2008 wrote:
>>>> I agree. Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman. now back
>>>to our
>>>> post. That fucking bitch got exactly what she deserved. And she got
>>>it at
>>>
>>>It's interesting that you could write, apparently without irony, that
>>>"Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman", and the call her a
>>>"fucking bitch".
>>>
>>>How can a beautiful and intelligent woman be also a fucking bitch?
>>>
>>She an aging old hag who made the idiotic move to derail her chosen
>>career.
>
>And yet she has a new movie coming out this summer, "Meet the
>Monsters" It's expected to do well at the box office, like nearly all
>of her movies have. Her book is selling well.
Actually, it';s doing pretty bad....
--
Did Zepp Jamieson really think he was going to get away with posting
as "Greywolf the Wanderer" long ago writing about his homosexual fantasies
about the startrek characters and about his belief that he was a werewolf?
The similarities are too many to be a coincidence.
First, Greywolf lived in Scotland and in B.C. Canada, as did Zepp.
Greywolf used to be a bbs sysop in Santa Barbara, as was Zepp.
Greywolf lives near Mt Shasta in California, so does Zepp.
Greywolf says he isn't a U.S. Citizen, so does Zepp.
Greywolf has a house full of cats and 3 dogs, as does Zepp
Greywolf complains of bad eyesight, as does Zepp.
Greywolf used to work at an airport, so did Zepp
Greywolf used to work as a janitor, so did Zepp
Greywolf used to work at an hospital, so did Zepp
Greywolf has a samoyed named Monk, so does Zepp
Greywolf complains of "rhuematiz", as does Zepp
Greywolf says he is dyslexic, as does Zepp.
Greywolf used Zepp's ISP account and even used Zepp's computer
Greywolf claims to be a writer, as does Zepp
Greywolf and Zepp both claim to like author Robert Heinlein
Greywolf and Zepp both like Heinlein's book "Moon is a Harsh Mistress"
Greywolf says that he's a wiccan and Zepp does a lot of writing about wiccans.
Greywolf's favorite quote is "evolution in action," Zepp used that for one of his "commentaries."
Greywolf's an alcoholic who stopped drinking, Zepp says he's had problems with alcohol
so he quit drinking a long time ago.
So is Zepp the same person as Greywolf? And if so, what does Zepp's wife think of Greywolf posting his homosexual fantasies on Usnet.
Steven Canyon
<zepp1566#2211finestplanet.com> wrote:
>On Sat, 23 Apr 2005 03:11:19 GMT, VRWC Destruction Machine
><LibB...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 19:11:18 -0700, 1566 Dead
>><zepp1566#2211finestplanet.com> wrote:
>>
>>>>Jane Fonda will have to deal with her traitorous legacy as long as she
>>>>lives.
>>>
>>>Let's see: we have a president who claims he discharged his military
>>>duty but lied. We have a vice president who never served because he
>>>had better things to do.
>>>
>>Can you say legal deferment, Zepperhead? So many draft dodgers found
>>sanctuary in Canada. The Cannucks love their draft dodgers.
>
>Sure I can. I had legal deferments myself.
Jamieson never had to worry about being drafted. All he had to do was
tell them that he was queer. They disqualified rump rangers back
then.
spino...@yahoo.com
And when did "Democrats and liberals" physically attack these clowns?
In Fascism, you get Brownshirts from the petty bourgeois and the
working class to do your "physical attacks" and the fact is that many
conservative spokesmen incuding O'Neill have come close to physical
attacks, as when O'Neill lost his temper at a guest who was a Sep 11
victim relative AND a war protestor.
Consistently, conservatives today PRIDE themselves on being ready to
attack liberals physically, as in the case of Arnold Schwarzenegger's
characterisation of opponents as "girliemen" and Jesse Ventura's
threats when he was governor of Minnesota.
But the major game, on the conservative side, is making extreme and
literally false claims which then focus losers on fantasy causes. For
example, North Vietnam as part of the Paris Peace Accords fully
repatriated POWs and accounted for all the MIAs it was able to account
for: but in order to focus anger away from the US government, the Ford
administration encouraged people to believe that there were large
numbers of POWs and MIAs unaccounted for...using the same
disinformation mechanisms that were used to create the inference from
"no proof of WMDs" in Iraq to "must be some WMDs".
Then, the Rambo films made this lie "truth" in the minds of people who
have difficulty sorting out fiction from reality and conveniently, John
Rambo (who in the first movie was almost a war protestor or Vietnam
Veteran Against the War) became instead the meme that there were large
numbers of POWs and MIAs around which people (who otherwise might have
asked hard questions about US conduct) could safely focus their anger.
The result is disturbing. It means that with hearts grown brutal a
significant minority of Americans is feeding on political fantasies.
>
> Not physically assaulting liberals and Democrats has *NOT* stopped
you
> libby-dem ass-fuck thugs from assaulting hi-visibility Republicans
and
> conservatives, has it?
When did this happen? And your verbal violence certainly indicates that
YOU are the person in need of anger management who might be the next
workplace shooter.
>
> Fonda's a FUCKING TRAITOR. She's just lucky that the disabled vet
didn't
> intend on taking her life.
You are denying your own out of control rage while accusing "libby-dem
ass-fuc thugs" of all sorts of nonexistent attacks. This is like the
state that tortures detainees in order to prevent them from informing
the media that that state uses torture. It's like the corner bully who
accuses his victims of all sorts of wild motives merely to justify
kicking their ass.
Give it a fucking rest. Admit that what you hate is weakness,
passivity, and taking it up the ass, because you haven't properly every
dealt with your own feelings of weakness...your own homosexual
impulses.
>
> >
> > She said "I wish I had those murderers in my sights right now", a
sort
> > of vicarious and foolish comment which a young Hollywood actress
might
> > be expected to say.
>
> HER actions led to the deaths of POWS held by the NVA. She *RATTED*
them
> out when they tried to slip her a note. Her broadcast was a
treasonous act.
> The Bitch deserves 10 years in prison or a firing squad.
As a matter of fact, she was investigated as were other war protestors
by the government and they found nothing that would stick. But the lie
of Hanoi Jane was never put to rest because it focuses anger away from
the US government, which is responsible for 50000 American deaths and 4
million Vietnames deaths.
As a result, soldiers are dying daily in Iraq while slobs fight the
last war and yammer on and on and on, about Hanoi Jane.
>
> >
> > Britney Spears, while popping her gum, says we should support
President
> > Bush no matter how many people in Iraq have to die. Because of her
> > support for the Iraq war, a lot of fools will join up and get
killed. I
> > would think Britney is much more responsible for people getting
killed.
>
> Well, I think you're a dicksucking libby-dem ASSHOLE. Wanna do
something
> about it, libby-dem lie-pig?
OOOh a tough guy.
Birkenstock Bolshevik
You moron. You said if you hate Fonda, that person is a Fascist.
You're the idiot that brought Fascist into the discussion.
>The claim is not "if you hate Fonda THEN you're a Fascist".
>
>It's "if you're a Fascist, then you hate Fonda".
>
That makes you an idiot, Moron.
>Some bimbo movie actress pushed out of a role because Jane still looked
>great in a bikini in 1980 (Plaza Suite) might hate Fonda for reasons
>unconnected to Fascism.
>
That's a stretch, Moron.
>My claim is instead that Fascisms have certain family resemblances and
>one is the destruction of civil society through the destruction of the
>admiration of figures who do not in turn (like Britney) assent to the
>status quo.
>
Your reasoning is idiotic, Moron.
>It is important for a Fascist state to make sure the most trivial forms
>of fandom don't contradict larger power structures, therefore for a
>Hollywood actress or Princess of Wales to espouse progressive causes
>becomes a matter of state concern.
Blah, blah, blah, Moron.
VRWC Destruction Machine
>
>BÎllary/2008 wrote:
>> I agree. Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman. now back
>to our
>> post. That fucking bitch got exactly what she deserved. And she got
>it at
>
>It's interesting that you could write, apparently without irony, that
>"Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman", and the call her a
>"fucking bitch".
>
No irony. Jane Fonda is a fucking bitch.
>How can a beautiful and intelligent woman be also a fucking bitch?
>
She an aging old hag and a fucking bitch to boot.
>I can only theorize that as false consciousness all the way down, as a
>Negative Dialectic, Fascism is able to think that humanistic categories
>such as beauty or intelligence are "all very well in their place" but
>not useful in the lived world of the Fascist.
>
Boo fucking boo hoo. Did your theories conclude you are a moron?
>Men in groups under pressure are often like the Fascist general who
>said "down with intelligence!"
>
So what. Jane Fonda is a stupid fucking bitch. She has no intelligence
to down.
>Beauty and intelligence are to be replaced in the New World Order by
>LOYALTY.
>
Where do you come up with this shit? This is about Jane Fonda not your
asinine theories.
spino...@yahoo.com
VRWC Destruction Machine wrote:
> On 22 Apr 2005 04:45:15 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> >
> >BÎllary/2008 wrote:
> >> I agree. Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman. now
back
> >to our
> >> post. That fucking bitch got exactly what she deserved. And she
got
> >it at
> >
> >It's interesting that you could write, apparently without irony,
that
> >"Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman", and the call her
a
> >"fucking bitch".
> >
> No irony. Jane Fonda is a fucking bitch.
No intelligence either.
>
> >How can a beautiful and intelligent woman be also a fucking bitch?
> >
> She an aging old hag and a fucking bitch to boot.
OK, glad you straightened that out in your mind. I think she is a
beautiful and accomplshed woman.
>
> >I can only theorize that as false consciousness all the way down, as
a
> >Negative Dialectic, Fascism is able to think that humanistic
categories
> >such as beauty or intelligence are "all very well in their place"
but
> >not useful in the lived world of the Fascist.
> >
> Boo fucking boo hoo. Did your theories conclude you are a moron?
My theories don't conclude jack shit. I do.
>
> >Men in groups under pressure are often like the Fascist general who
> >said "down with intelligence!"
> >
> So what. Jane Fonda is a stupid fucking bitch. She has no
intelligence
> to down.
Actually, part of the resentment is resentment against beauty and
intelligence *as such*.
For the lower middle class, the categories of "beauty" and
"intelligence" are perceived as oppressive therefore Brownshirts are
mobilized against same especially when not found alienated from each
other, as in the case of the polarities of Huxley's "genius" v
"goddess".
>
> >Beauty and intelligence are to be replaced in the New World Order by
> >LOYALTY.
> >
> Where do you come up with this shit? This is about Jane Fonda not
your
> asinine theories.
Well, if we're supposed to stay on target, I demur from this Orwellian
Five Minute Hate here in this ng.
spino...@yahoo.com
Fifty year old men with silly names like "Birkenstock Bolshevik" (some
confused irony?) exchange texts worthy of children in which I am an
eagle among sparrows.
>
> >Some bimbo movie actress pushed out of a role because Jane still
looked
> >great in a bikini in 1980 (Plaza Suite) might hate Fonda for reasons
> >unconnected to Fascism.
> >
> That's a stretch, Moron.
Only because it makes you think.
>
> >My claim is instead that Fascisms have certain family resemblances
and
> >one is the destruction of civil society through the destruction of
the
> >admiration of figures who do not in turn (like Britney) assent to
the
> >status quo.
> >
> Your reasoning is idiotic, Moron.
Izzat so? And in what way?
>
> >It is important for a Fascist state to make sure the most trivial
forms
> >of fandom don't contradict larger power structures, therefore for a
> >Hollywood actress or Princess of Wales to espouse progressive causes
> >becomes a matter of state concern.
>
> Blah, blah, blah, Moron.
How the text sounds to you is not an argument.
spino...@yahoo.com
Peacenik wrote:
> <spino...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:1114133156.0...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> >
> > Birkenstock Bolshevik wrote:
> > > On 21 Apr 2005 03:35:02 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
> > > I see you are trying justify Fonda's betrayal of US soldiers in
> > > Vietnam. You must be cut from traitorous cloth as Hanoi Jane.
>
> My uncle fought in Vietnam. The experience made him a life-long
liberal and
> opponent of war. He also supported Jane Fonda.
This is almost always the case! Those who profess to so "hate" Fonda
seem to be chickenhawks, REMFs (Rear Echelon Mother Fuckers) and at
best oxygen deprived flyboys with about five ex-wives, four of them
stewardesses.
Five years after the end of the war, Tom Wolfe who although a nasty
little "conservative" had a personal line to the New York gliterati,
wrote a series of articles for Esquire which later became the movie
"The Right Stuff".
Esquire, of course, as a "men's" magazine, is bought by "men" who are
in fact anxious about their status as "men", thus the article was
perfect for Esquire. This is because the magazine, to ensure return
business, needs less to allay readers' fears and more to excite them.
For this reason, The Right Stuff, as a form of what Frankfurt School
theorist Max Horkheimer called "psychoanalysis in reverse", did not say
to the anxious chickenhawk circa 1980 what actual returning war
veterans like Barry Romo (of VVAW) said in 1969. As a form of
psychoanalysis in reverse, The Right Stuff did not say what John Lennon
said in 1970: for having seen his own mates deprived of fathers serving
in the British Army during WWII, John Lennon said simply enough that he
did not need to carry a gun to prove that he was a man.
As psychoanalysis in reverse, The Right Stuff CONFIRMED irrational
fears, for it said, "yes indeed, in 1972 when you were getting your
MBA, other men were being woken up by Filipino stewards at 5:45 AM to
put it on the line over the Red River"
"They are men: you are not, except insofar as you do penance by
supporting conservative causes".
And of course one such cause, one such source of plenary indulgence,
was the pose of so "hating" Fonda.
As a result of psychoanalysis in reverse, family and social violence
continues in Amerikkka with recently an almost weekly drumbeat of
spectacular killings. Nobody wants to examine the relationship between
the way a war (especially a war like Iraq, authorized with a childish
smirk) encourages family and microsocial violence although Susan
Sontag's journalist son David Rieff documented the fact that in Serbia
(which also made the fatal equation between manhood and war) he could
hear, nightly, the screams and slaps of violence against women.
Which is what this thread is about: violence against women. Women who
oppose Fascist policies have always been subjected to the most vile and
out-of-control abuse which according to Klaus Theweilt (Male Fantasies)
encapsulate mens' fear of destruction and dissolution in the conditions
both of modern war and modern industry.
>
> REAL Vietnam veterans are liberals. Those so-called "Vietnam
veterans" who
> subscribe to right-wing politics are nothing but frauds and poseurs.
Sure, you can be a "Vietnam veteran" if you worked a keypunch or coded
BAL in Cam Ranh Bay by day while chasing bar girls and dishonoring
convent girls by night.
Today, Barry Romo, a REAL Vietnam vet, a REAL American hero, is active
in the Chicago antiwar movement. I attended a party at his place and
the guy has every book ever written, it seems, about Vietnam. Of
course, your chickenhawk doesn't read books.
George
<spino...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1114267873.6...@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
Read the papers, you fucking jagoff!
Steven Canyon
>
>Peacenik wrote:
>> <spino...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
>> news:1114133156.0...@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
>> >
>> > Birkenstock Bolshevik wrote:
>> > > On 21 Apr 2005 03:35:02 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>> > > I see you are trying justify Fonda's betrayal of US soldiers in
>> > > Vietnam. You must be cut from traitorous cloth as Hanoi Jane.
>>
>> My uncle fought in Vietnam. The experience made him a life-long
>liberal and
>> opponent of war. He also supported Jane Fonda.
>
>This is almost always the case! Those who profess to so "hate" Fonda
>seem to be chickenhawks, REMFs (Rear Echelon Mother Fuckers) and at
>best oxygen deprived flyboys with about five ex-wives, four of them
>stewardesses.
<LOL> More malarkey from the wonderful world of a leftist's fantasy
world...
Birkenstock Bolshevik
You're a turkey Spazola not an eagle. You talk as if you were not even
born during the Vietnam era which shows your ignorance.
VRWC Destruction Machine
>OK, glad you straightened that out in your mind. I think she is a
>beautiful and accomplshed woman.
Oh yeah, She was married to Roger Vadim who made movies to showcase
breast implants. She then married Tom Hayden, co-founder of the
Communist SDS and Chicago 7 Alumnus, and then married Liberal crackpot
Ted Turner and she made an exercise video. She made a name for
herself Hanoi Jane.
The bitch will always live with her traitorous legacy.
-
This morning on the United States Senate floor this morning John Kerry blasted the administration for high gas prices. He said gas is so expensive, he may have to marry Bill Gates.
spino...@yahoo.com
Whatever you say. You are living in a fantasy land because as I have
said, the US government manufactured, or allowed to be manufactured
both the myth of Fonda as traitress and the myth of POW/MIA.
It did so in the SAME way as the current government of China under Hu
Jintao is whipping up anti-Japanese sentiment by calling for repeated
Japanese "apologies" for WWII conduct for which Japanese has apologized
and made reparations and the perpertrators of which have long since
been brought to justice by the US and Britain.
Not only has Jane Fonda repeatedly apologized for her conduct (which
harmed no-one directly) her work in GI counseling after the incident in
North Vietnam more than compensated for the harm because MOST GIs in
Vietnam were not glamourous flyboys from rich families who got their
rocks off by pushing buttons and killing people.
Most GIs were from poor and middle class families who had to witness
and perform acts of savagery and Jane assisted these men to come to
terms with the bullshit they endured.
I was most assuredly a Vietnam era draft dodger, old buddy, as were
nearly all of today's chickenhawks. However, I also marched and
protested the war.
Evidence will be presented soberly on CSpan in a few weeks that the US
government caused, or allowed to happen, Sep 11. Jane Fonda, "justice
Sunday" and in China anti-Japanese riots are all examples of the sort
of recreational politics you get in states where an inner circle
refuses to share power with the people. Today, the US government's
Tianamen Square may very well be Sep 11.
spino...@yahoo.com
VRWC Destruction Machine wrote:
> On 23 Apr 2005 19:40:38 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> >OK, glad you straightened that out in your mind. I think she is a
> >beautiful and accomplshed woman.
>
> Oh yeah, She was married to Roger Vadim who made movies to showcase
> breast implants. She then married Tom Hayden, co-founder of the
> Communist SDS and Chicago 7 Alumnus, and then married Liberal
crackpot
> Ted Turner and she made an exercise video. She made a name for
> herself Hanoi Jane.
She made several exercise videos, none of which you can probably
complete.
The SDS was most explicitly not "Communist". It protested the Soviet
invasion of Czechoslovakia simultaneously with its protests against
Vietnam in August of 1968.
Founded in 1972 in Port Huron, Michigan, it was a democratic socialist
response to Kruschev's revelations of Stalin's crimes and as such
sought a way in which people could participate in the economic
decisions affecting in their lives.
>From day one, it explicitly rejected Leninist "democratic centralism"
which by 1962 had become a joke in Communist societies.
All this, of course, is probably Martian to you if you feel that people
should rightfully be subject to the whims of Communist apparatchiks or
corporations and military service on the other, and should wind up
espousing nothing but fantasy politics and woman-bashing because they
can control a computer but not their lives.
Which means nothing more than that we live in an Orwellian state in
which discussions of things like "having democratic input into the
conditions of your life" can't get started because people simply don't
have a language...for anything but envy, hatred and vituperation.
Jane Fonda had a life, courtesy of her membership, inherited from Henry
Fonda, in the pre-existing Hollywood lite coupled with her talent. Do
you have a life, or do you just post your hatred and envy?
>
> The bitch will always live with her traitorous legacy.
>
> -
> This morning on the United States Senate floor this morning John
Kerry blasted the administration for high gas prices. He said gas is so
expensive, he may have to marry Bill Gates.
I am well aware that the Bush junta, in order to get re-elected by the
thinnest of margins (a margin whose closeness to 50% indicates it may
have been fabricated as a target), had to rely not only on stealing
Ohio by high-tech means but also to announce "vote for Bush or you are
queer".
spino...@yahoo.com
What papers might those be? The Sturmbateilung Arbeiter?
And what's this "fucking jagoff"? Sounds to me someone missed his court
mandated anger management.
Give me a link to one incident in which a Democrat or liberal
physically attacked a Republican true-blue American.
goody8
<Steven...@yahaa.hahaa> wrote:
>On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 19:14:58 -0700, 1566 Dead
><zepp1566#2211finestplanet.com> wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 21:34:39 GMT, Birkenstock Bolshevik
>><LeftC...@GirlyMen.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On 22 Apr 2005 04:45:15 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>BÎllary/2008 wrote:
>>>>> I agree. Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman. now back
>>>>to our
>>>>> post. That fucking bitch got exactly what she deserved. And she got
>>>>it at
>>>>
>>>>It's interesting that you could write, apparently without irony, that
>>>>"Jane Fonda is a beautiful and intelligent woman", and the call her a
>>>>"fucking bitch".
>>>>
>>>>How can a beautiful and intelligent woman be also a fucking bitch?
>>>>
>>>She an aging old hag who made the idiotic move to derail her chosen
>>>career.
>>
>>And yet she has a new movie coming out this summer, "Meet the
>>Monsters" It's expected to do well at the box office, like nearly all
>>of her movies have. Her book is selling well.
>
>Actually, it';s doing pretty bad....
#1 on the New York Times non fiction bestseller list
Steven Canyon
That's only because the NYT doesn't compare all books and separates
them out as fiction, non-fiction, (etc)
It's 17th on the USA today list, down from 11th the week before...
14th at Amazon...
It's going down, down, down.....
omare...@aol.com
>duty but lied. We have a vice president who never served because he
>had better things to do.
That Clinton was a real coward, huh?
omare...@aol.com
>are NO documented cases of North Vietnamese war crimes in the
treatment
>of POWs.
Thanks for the laugh.
Birkenstock Bolshevik
The government manufactured? Are the black helicopters going to take
her away? Your propeller cap needs a tune up.
>Most GIs were from poor and middle class families who had to witness
>and perform acts of savagery and Jane assisted these men to come to
>terms with the bullshit they endured.
>
Jane Fonda made her bed and she will have to live with that for the
rest of her life.
>I was most assuredly a Vietnam era draft dodger, old buddy, as were
>nearly all of today's chickenhawks. However, I also marched and
>protested the war.
>
Why am I not surprised that you adore Jane Fonda for consorting with
the enemy?
>Evidence will be presented soberly on CSpan in a few weeks that the US
>government caused, or allowed to happen, Sep 11. Jane Fonda, "justice
>Sunday" and in China anti-Japanese riots are all examples of the sort
>of recreational politics you get in states where an inner circle
>refuses to share power with the people. Today, the US government's
>Tianamen Square may very well be Sep 11
More Black Helicopters, eh?
omare...@aol.com
>world, where another party takes control, Bush would have been tried
>for crimes starting with evasion of military service and complicity
>(through neglect or more) in Sep 11, and executed.
So Clinton should've been executed, eh? Stinging admission.
z
Birkenstock Bolshevik wrote:
> On Wed, 20 Apr 2005 23:12:02 -0700, Foxtrot <fox...@null.com> wrote:
>
> >http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/fonda_spitter
> >
> >Mo. Man Spits Tobacco Juice at Jane Fonda
> >
> >TIM CURRAN, Associated Press Writer
> >
> >KANSAS CITY, Mo. - A man spit tobacco juice into the face
> >of Jane Fonda after waiting in line to have her sign her new
> >memoir. Capt. Rich Lockhart of the Kansas City Police
> >Department said Michael A. Smith, 54, was arrested Tuesday
> >night on a municipal charge of disorderly conduct.
> >
> >Smith, a Vietnam veteran, told The Kansas City Star
> >Wednesday that Fonda was a "traitor" and that her protests
> >against the Vietnam War were unforgivable.
>
> Smith should be given a medal. Fonda was responsible of giving
Vietnam
> POWS as much pain as the Viet Cong.
>
I thought Abu Ghraib was just a bunch of fraternity initiation pranks.
omare...@aol.com
>physically attacked a Republican true-blue American.
You mean besides Ann Coulter being attacked by a pie? I must've missed
your outrage regarding that incident. Don't cry.
goody8
<Steven...@yahaa.hahaa> wrote:
So it's your opinion that being #1 on the New York Times bestseller
list constitutes "doing pretty bad"?
>
>
>It's 17th on the USA today list, down from 11th the week before...
>
>14th at Amazon...
And you think being #17 or #14 on national bestseller lists
constitutes "doing pretty bad"?
VRWC Destruction Machine
>
>VRWC Destruction Machine wrote:
>> On 23 Apr 2005 19:40:38 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>> >OK, glad you straightened that out in your mind. I think she is a
>> >beautiful and accomplshed woman.
>>
>> Oh yeah, She was married to Roger Vadim who made movies to showcase
>> breast implants. She then married Tom Hayden, co-founder of the
>> Communist SDS and Chicago 7 Alumnus, and then married Liberal
>crackpot
>> Ted Turner and she made an exercise video. She made a name for
>> herself Hanoi Jane.
>
>She made several exercise videos, none of which you can probably
>complete.
>
Fonda's new video will probably be called "Botox for the
Revolutionary."
>The SDS was most explicitly not "Communist". It protested the Soviet
>invasion of Czechoslovakia simultaneously with its protests against
>Vietnam in August of 1968.
>
The late-1960s-early-1970s emergence of these NCM (New Communist
Movement) groups resulted from a combination of at least three major
influences. One was the growth of support within SDS for a tightly
disciplined, Leninist-style revolutionary vanguard party, in stark
contrast to the largely unstructured organizational style that had
predominated among New Left student groups.
>Founded in 1972 in Port Huron, Michigan, it was a democratic socialist
>response to Kruschev's revelations of Stalin's crimes and as such
>sought a way in which people could participate in the economic
>decisions affecting in their lives.
>
>>From day one, it explicitly rejected Leninist "democratic centralism"
>which by 1962 had become a joke in Communist societies.
>
>All this, of course, is probably Martian to you if you feel that people
>should rightfully be subject to the whims of Communist apparatchiks or
>corporations and military service on the other, and should wind up
>espousing nothing but fantasy politics and woman-bashing because they
>can control a computer but not their lives.
>
>Which means nothing more than that we live in an Orwellian state in
>which discussions of things like "having democratic input into the
>conditions of your life" can't get started because people simply don't
>have a language...for anything but envy, hatred and vituperation.
>
>Jane Fonda had a life, courtesy of her membership, inherited from Henry
>Fonda, in the pre-existing Hollywood lite coupled with her talent. Do
>you have a life, or do you just post your hatred and envy?
Fonda's life consists of reviving a derailed career.
>>
>> The bitch will always live with her traitorous legacy.
>>
>> -
>> This morning on the United States Senate floor this morning John
>Kerry blasted the administration for high gas prices. He said gas is so
>expensive, he may have to marry Bill Gates.
>
>I am well aware that the Bush junta, in order to get re-elected by the
>thinnest of margins (a margin whose closeness to 50% indicates it may
>have been fabricated as a target), had to rely not only on stealing
>Ohio by high-tech means but also to announce "vote for Bush or you are
>queer".
More Black Helicopters. eh?
spino...@yahoo.com
VRWC Destruction Machine wrote:
> On 25 Apr 2005 05:56:09 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> >
> >VRWC Destruction Machine wrote:
> >> On 23 Apr 2005 19:40:38 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
> >>
> >> >OK, glad you straightened that out in your mind. I think she is a
> >> >beautiful and accomplshed woman.
> >>
> >> Oh yeah, She was married to Roger Vadim who made movies to
showcase
> >> breast implants. She then married Tom Hayden, co-founder of the
> >> Communist SDS and Chicago 7 Alumnus, and then married Liberal
> >crackpot
> >> Ted Turner and she made an exercise video. She made a name for
> >> herself Hanoi Jane.
> >
> >She made several exercise videos, none of which you can probably
> >complete.
> >
> Fonda's new video will probably be called "Botox for the
> Revolutionary."
We can easily deconstruct this resentment of slobs for the gliterati. I
don't think Jane uses Botox, since exercise is much more effective than
a form of the toxin Botulism.
REPUBLICAN bimbos, REPUBLICAN Fourth Wives, are the big users of Botox
because it keeps a gal lookin' pretty for the Big Man and keeps her
from looking angry.
But even if Jane uses Botox, or goes to Georgette Klinger, who cares?
Revolution used to be about personal happiness. I know that in Bush's
America, an America of Justice Sunday, personal happiness is out of
date. That's because it tends to get out of date real fast in
totalitarian dictatorships.
>
> >The SDS was most explicitly not "Communist". It protested the Soviet
> >invasion of Czechoslovakia simultaneously with its protests against
> >Vietnam in August of 1968.
> >
> The late-1960s-early-1970s emergence of these NCM (New Communist
> Movement) groups resulted from a combination of at least three major
> influences. One was the growth of support within SDS for a tightly
> disciplined, Leninist-style revolutionary vanguard party, in stark
> contrast to the largely unstructured organizational style that had
> predominated among New Left student groups.
If this was the case (and in some small part it was) they certainly
made a mess of it. I was there in Chicago (going to work after having
LEFT SDS because they did not speak to my situation as a working man
and as a computer programmer in the slightest) when the Weatherpeople
with their little clubs and sticks got on the El, all out of breath
from smoking and running.
The rest of us on the train wanted nothing to do with them precisely
because their Leninist vanguard was made up of rich kids who did not
realize that you need to work for a living.
She did a pretty good job, then. Most female actresses end up dying
unknown and forgotten. Remember Margot Kidder? She played Lois Lane in
1980 but by 1999 was found wandering in LA completely zonked out.
To the extent that an actress imbibes conventional categories, she has
only her ass to sell, and Jane realized this. She kept the ass in fine
trim for as long as humanly possible but also cultivated other areas of
her mind and spirit and the result is she can still piss people off
after all these years. Good for her.
>
> >>
> >> The bitch will always live with her traitorous legacy.
> >>
> >> -
> >> This morning on the United States Senate floor this morning John
> >Kerry blasted the administration for high gas prices. He said gas is
so
> >expensive, he may have to marry Bill Gates.
> >
> >I am well aware that the Bush junta, in order to get re-elected by
the
> >thinnest of margins (a margin whose closeness to 50% indicates it
may
> >have been fabricated as a target), had to rely not only on stealing
> >Ohio by high-tech means but also to announce "vote for Bush or you
are
> >queer".
>
> More Black Helicopters. eh?
Just because your paranoid doesn't mean you're not being followed. You
go on being skeptical until you hear the boots on the stairs.
spino...@yahoo.com
When the uninformed lose an argument, they then try the trick of taking
their opponent's facts, logic and preparation and renarrating this as a
"conspiracy theory", which works when there are a sufficient number of
uneducated morons in the audience who think that the Bible is the only
book worth reading.
Yeah, the government manufactured...as part of a process, a
bureaucratic machine which precisely to the extent it is complex, has
no teleology of which its masters are necessarily aware, but which
needs for our own survival to be narrated as such when it is turning
against us.
>
> >Most GIs were from poor and middle class families who had to witness
> >and perform acts of savagery and Jane assisted these men to come to
> >terms with the bullshit they endured.
> >
> Jane Fonda made her bed and she will have to live with that for the
> rest of her life.
Yeah, without you. Get over it.
>
> >I was most assuredly a Vietnam era draft dodger, old buddy, as were
> >nearly all of today's chickenhawks. However, I also marched and
> >protested the war.
> >
> Why am I not surprised that you adore Jane Fonda for consorting with
> the enemy?
Vietnam was an illegal war and undeclared. It was a rich man's war and
a poor man's fight. Therefore the North Vietnamese were not my enemy.
>
> >Evidence will be presented soberly on CSpan in a few weeks that the
US
> >government caused, or allowed to happen, Sep 11. Jane Fonda,
"justice
> >Sunday" and in China anti-Japanese riots are all examples of the
sort
> >of recreational politics you get in states where an inner circle
> >refuses to share power with the people. Today, the US government's
> >Tianamen Square may very well be Sep 11
>
> More Black Helicopters, eh?
It is hard to face the truth. You apparently wish to believe that
foreign governments specialize in murder while you are lucky to live in
a city on a hill.
There is a ten point scale, with 1 being "the Sep 11 attack was
completely unexpected and caused by terrorists outside the US
completely", 2 being "hmm, the 'terrorists' usedta be our Mujhadein,
how 'bout that", 5 being "perhaps the Mujhadein were pissed at us", 8
being "Bush knew it was coming, couldn't figure being dumb what to do,
decided to do nothing and make the best of the situation", 9 being
"Bush saw it coming and said haw haw, that'll put me in the catbird
seat", and 10 being the Full Monty: "Bush called Osama-Mama, his old
buddy, and said, 'old buddy, can you blow up the World Trade Center so
I can be President for two terms?', and Osama said, 'why sure, old
buddy, I am a skilled construction man who knows how to blow up a
building neat and purty-like'."
I am afraid that without being "conspiracy theorists", increasing
numbers of normal people, people like you and me, people with debts and
cars and ex-wives and jobs, are raising their "terror alert level" on
this scale every day.
Birkenstock Bolshevik
The problem is when you come up with kook assertions without any cite.
You've got to be one of those Black Helicopter types.
>Yeah, the government manufactured...as part of a process, a
>bureaucratic machine which precisely to the extent it is complex, has
>no teleology of which its masters are necessarily aware, but which
>needs for our own survival to be narrated as such when it is turning
>against us.
You had one too many shock treatments.
>>
>> >Most GIs were from poor and middle class families who had to witness
>> >and perform acts of savagery and Jane assisted these men to come to
>> >terms with the bullshit they endured.
>> >
>> Jane Fonda made her bed and she will have to live with that for the
>> rest of her life.
>
>Yeah, without you. Get over it.
Thank God. She's damaged goods.
>
>>
>> >I was most assuredly a Vietnam era draft dodger, old buddy, as were
>> >nearly all of today's chickenhawks. However, I also marched and
>> >protested the war.
>> >
>> Why am I not surprised that you adore Jane Fonda for consorting with
>> the enemy?
>
>Vietnam was an illegal war and undeclared. It was a rich man's war and
>a poor man's fight. Therefore the North Vietnamese were not my enemy.
>
Source of your info.
Of course the NVA was not your enemy, you hate the United States like
Hanoi Jane.
>>
>> >Evidence will be presented soberly on CSpan in a few weeks that the
>US
>> >government caused, or allowed to happen, Sep 11. Jane Fonda,
>"justice
>> >Sunday" and in China anti-Japanese riots are all examples of the
>sort
>> >of recreational politics you get in states where an inner circle
>> >refuses to share power with the people. Today, the US government's
>> >Tianamen Square may very well be Sep 11
>>
>> More Black Helicopters, eh?
>
>It is hard to face the truth. You apparently wish to believe that
>foreign governments specialize in murder while you are lucky to live in
>a city on a hill.
>
You haven't listed one credible cite to back up you kook theories.
>There is a ten point scale, with 1 being "the Sep 11 attack was
>completely unexpected and caused by terrorists outside the US
>completely", 2 being "hmm, the 'terrorists' usedta be our Mujhadein,
>how 'bout that", 5 being "perhaps the Mujhadein were pissed at us", 8
>being "Bush knew it was coming, couldn't figure being dumb what to do,
>decided to do nothing and make the best of the situation", 9 being
>"Bush saw it coming and said haw haw, that'll put me in the catbird
>seat", and 10 being the Full Monty: "Bush called Osama-Mama, his old
>buddy, and said, 'old buddy, can you blow up the World Trade Center so
>I can be President for two terms?', and Osama said, 'why sure, old
>buddy, I am a skilled construction man who knows how to blow up a
>building neat and purty-like'."
>
You must believe in your tripe. Nobody else does.
>I am afraid that without being "conspiracy theorists", increasing
>numbers of normal people, people like you and me, people with debts and
>cars and ex-wives and jobs, are raising their "terror alert level" on
>this scale every day.
>
The sky is falling. The sky is falling. You should be afraid.
Birkenstock Bolshevik
Selling books will not erase what Hanoi Jane did 30 years ago. She
will remain as one of most hated persons by Americans.
1566 Dead
<LeftC...@GirlyMen.com> wrote:
Let's see here: we have two confused right wingers screaming that the
book isn't selling because people hate her, and another whining that
ok, it IS selling, but people hate her anyway.
Of course, what really gets them is that despite their sour hatred,
Jane Fonda has had a long and successful life, and will continue to do
so, no matter how many white trash baccy chewers spit at her.
>
>-
>The difference between Los Angeles and yogurt is that yogurt comes with less fruit.
>-Rush Limbaugh
-
Carl M. Forti, a spokesman for the National Republican
Congressional Committee -- "A month from now,
people are not going to remember [Terri Schiavo],"
he said, and 20 months from now, in the 2006
elections, "it will be irrelevant."
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/26/politics/26delay.html?
Not dead, in jail, or a slave? Thank a liberal!
Pay your taxes so the rich don't have to.
For the finest in liberal/leftist commentary,
http://www.zeppscommentaries.com
For news feed (free, 10-20 articles a day)
http://groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/zepps_news
For essays (donations accepted, 2 articles/week)
http://groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/zepps_essays
Steven Canyon
Like I said, and what went totally over your head... It's first only
on the non-fiction hardcover list... when it's put up against all
books it's well down the list and going down....
>>It's 17th on the USA today list, down from 11th the week before...
>>
>>14th at Amazon...
>
>And you think being #17 or #14 on national bestseller lists
>constitutes "doing pretty bad"?
>
Yeah, actually.... as related to big name books.....
and since it's lower on the list it's second week there than it was on
the first week, it's already on the decline.... The success of a
book has to do with more than just getting on the list, but by staying
well up on the list for a number of weeks... In the end, a book's
success is judged by it's total sales....
spino...@yahoo.com
When the uninformed lose an argument, they are big on "cites". Ever
hear of a public library? Ever read A BRIGHT SHINING LIE? Ever crack a
fucking book?
All histories of the Vietnam war will state the facts on which my case
is based. The United States agreed to abide by the 1954 Geneva
settlement which ended the French phase of the war, and reneged under
Eisenhower.
The Viet Cong were a South Vietnamese insurgency based on hatred of
rich Catholics who were running by 1963 a police state out of Saigon so
nasty that the US overthrew Diem and replaced him with a slightly less
nasty junta.
The NVA was not significantly involved in the war until the total
defeat of the Viet Cong at Tet in 1968, at which point the NVA, because
North Vietnam had the immediate expectation of being invaded by South
Vietnam, the US and Australia, exercised its right of pre-emptive
self-defense (a right which Israel had claimed in 1967 and which the US
claimed in 2003) and invaded South Vietnam, part of their land as
Vietnamese. The North Vietnamese had the prior right to be considered
the successor power to the French colony because Diem's assassination
had demonstrated that he was a US puppet.
There was massive protest against and resistance against the war which
by 1972 had included Business Executives Against the War and in fact
Nixon and Kissinger. Kissinger was so eager to end the war, just like
Fonda, that he took premature credit in 1972 and announced the end when
the North Vietnamese government in Paris hadn't accepted his
settlement, which led to the savage 1972 "Christmas bombing" of Hanoi.
Listen, punk. I just got through working three hours on drafting a
paper for a professional conference by invitation. If you think I am
going to do your homework for you, you have another thing coming.
>
> >Yeah, the government manufactured...as part of a process, a
> >bureaucratic machine which precisely to the extent it is complex,
has
> >no teleology of which its masters are necessarily aware, but which
> >needs for our own survival to be narrated as such when it is turning
> >against us.
>
> You had one too many shock treatments.
I am well aware that today and in Amerikkka, the use of simple complete
sentences is now on the part of jagoff cops and moron psychologists who
don't read outside their field, and often not in their field, a
diagnostic criteria for mental illness, so YOU can go jump into the
lake.
>
> >>
> >> >Most GIs were from poor and middle class families who had to
witness
> >> >and perform acts of savagery and Jane assisted these men to come
to
> >> >terms with the bullshit they endured.
> >> >
> >> Jane Fonda made her bed and she will have to live with that for
the
> >> rest of her life.
> >
> >Yeah, without you. Get over it.
>
> Thank God. She's damaged goods.
> >
> >>
> >> >I was most assuredly a Vietnam era draft dodger, old buddy, as
were
> >> >nearly all of today's chickenhawks. However, I also marched and
> >> >protested the war.
> >> >
> >> Why am I not surprised that you adore Jane Fonda for consorting
with
> >> the enemy?
> >
> >Vietnam was an illegal war and undeclared. It was a rich man's war
and
> >a poor man's fight. Therefore the North Vietnamese were not my
enemy.
> >
> Source of your info.
>
> Of course the NVA was not your enemy, you hate the United States like
> Hanoi Jane.
Fascist.
>
> >>
> >> >Evidence will be presented soberly on CSpan in a few weeks that
the
> >US
> >> >government caused, or allowed to happen, Sep 11. Jane Fonda,
> >"justice
> >> >Sunday" and in China anti-Japanese riots are all examples of the
> >sort
> >> >of recreational politics you get in states where an inner circle
> >> >refuses to share power with the people. Today, the US
government's
> >> >Tianamen Square may very well be Sep 11
> >>
> >> More Black Helicopters, eh?
> >
> >It is hard to face the truth. You apparently wish to believe that
> >foreign governments specialize in murder while you are lucky to live
in
> >a city on a hill.
> >
> You haven't listed one credible cite to back up you kook theories.
As I said, crack a book. Put down the Sturmbateilung Arbeiter. Why
should I waste my time doing your homework for you when you'd reject
anything not from Fox News or the Drudge Report?
Clown.
>
> >There is a ten point scale, with 1 being "the Sep 11 attack was
> >completely unexpected and caused by terrorists outside the US
> >completely", 2 being "hmm, the 'terrorists' usedta be our Mujhadein,
> >how 'bout that", 5 being "perhaps the Mujhadein were pissed at us",
8
> >being "Bush knew it was coming, couldn't figure being dumb what to
do,
> >decided to do nothing and make the best of the situation", 9 being
> >"Bush saw it coming and said haw haw, that'll put me in the catbird
> >seat", and 10 being the Full Monty: "Bush called Osama-Mama, his old
> >buddy, and said, 'old buddy, can you blow up the World Trade Center
so
> >I can be President for two terms?', and Osama said, 'why sure, old
> >buddy, I am a skilled construction man who knows how to blow up a
> >building neat and purty-like'."
> >
> You must believe in your tripe. Nobody else does.
That's belied by posters in this ng, one of whom served in Vietnam and
supports Fonda, the other whose uncle served in Vietnam and supports
Fonda.
You still haven't told us what you did in Vietnam.
>
> >I am afraid that without being "conspiracy theorists", increasing
> >numbers of normal people, people like you and me, people with debts
and
> >cars and ex-wives and jobs, are raising their "terror alert level"
on
> >this scale every day.
> >
> The sky is falling. The sky is falling. You should be afraid.
This is in fact exactly what the US government is saying, while at the
SAME time telling everybody to keep on shopping and consuming gas, in
much the same way Bush's fat pal "Kenny-Boy" Lay told his employees to
keep buying Enron stock while selling his own.
Steven Canyon
>
>Listen, punk. I just got through working three hours on drafting a
>paper for a professional conference by invitation. If you think I am
>going to do your homework for you, you have another thing coming.
<LOL> IOWs, another loony leftist can't back up what he fantasized
about.....
Steven Canyon
<zepp1566#2211finestplanet.com> wrote:
>Jane Fonda has had a long and successful life, and will continue to do
>so, no matter how many white trash baccy chewers spit at her.
<LOL> Greywolf ought to read just a little bit of Hanoi Jane's
book... the parts where she describes what a miserable life she's
had.... Three failed marriages where her miserable husbands cheated
on her right under her nose and even brought other women into the
marriage bed with her...
Birkenstock Bolshevik
<zepp1566#2211finestplanet.com> wrote:
Learn how to read. I didn't say her book isn't selling. You must be
one ignorant Cannuck.
>
>Of course, what really gets them is that despite their sour hatred,
>Jane Fonda has had a long and successful life, and will continue to do
>so, no matter how many white trash baccy chewers spit at her.
She has had a long life, but she really hasn't done anything of note
the last several years.
1566 Dead
<LeftC...@GirlyMen.com> wrote:
Odd, but I don't remember mentioning you at all. Can't really think
of any reason why I should.
>>
>>Of course, what really gets them is that despite their sour hatred,
>>Jane Fonda has had a long and successful life, and will continue to do
>>so, no matter how many white trash baccy chewers spit at her.
>
>She has had a long life, but she really hasn't done anything of note
>the last several years.
Just written a best seller and starred in a big summer smash movie, is
all. Why, I bet you did more than that before breakfast today!
>
>-
>The difference between Los Angeles and yogurt is that yogurt comes with less fruit.
>-Rush Limbaugh
-
Steven Canyon
<zepp1566#2211finestplanet.com> wrote:
Greywolf Zepp Jamieson lives up to his reputation of running away
whenever he's challenged...
spino...@yahoo.com
Steven Canyon wrote:
> On 26 Apr 2005 07:38:44 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>
> >
> >Listen, punk. I just got through working three hours on drafting a
> >paper for a professional conference by invitation. If you think I am
> >going to do your homework for you, you have another thing coming.
>
>
> <LOL> IOWs, another loony leftist can't back up what he fantasized
> about.....
You can post it until you are blue in the face. The fact is that
neither you nor "Birkenstock Bolshevik" know your history of the
Vietnam war, probably because neither of you punks were born in 1972,
and you panty wastes spent high school smoking dope.
The evidence is not only in the form of informal cites (as I have said,
if you punks think I am going to waste my time formalizing cites unless
you pay may, you can forget about it).
It is also in the form of a clear difference in tone and style between
what I post and what you post.
It is evident from your style alone that both of you clowns are only
half-literate, and significantly uninformed, because neither of you can
form a narrative above the level of a sound byte.
In your twittering world, Jane said at one point "I wish I had those
murderers in my sights right now". Years later, you were galvanized out
of your usual torpor in front of Teevee to learn that one of your own
had spit on Jane, a story that activated your childishness and rage.
Neither of you can form a complete sentence and neither of you are able
to parse the Vietnam war, in which Jane's efforts to end the war were
on a parallel track with "Business Executives Against the War",
"Vietnam Veterans Against the War", and Nixon himself who was elected
in 1968 and on 1972 because he promised to end the war.
It is also evident from your style alone that both of you clowns have
significant anger management issues which are associated in men with
inability to narrate the real conditions of their lives, and both of
you may be "ticking time bombs" in your respective communities.
spino...@yahoo.com
A pie in the face is quite different from Copenhagen. Copenhagen
contains nicotine, a known poison, as well as unspecified chemical
additives which are trade secrets but which have been assayed as
poisonous. A pie is food.
Spitting copenhagen or skoal is far closer to assault and battery with
a burning cigarette.
A pie incident has for this reason a different meaning from a tobacco
incident and constitutes in truth "disorderly conduct" which is what
the jagoff cops in KC charged the perp with because they are of the
same ilk. This is because a pie in the face REPLACES anger and
hostility with humor.
The Coulter pie incident wasn't violence. It was a Dadaist act that
exposed her as what she is, a lying bitch.
Of course, Fascists and humor don't mix.
Got any other examples? This one don't hunt.
Fascists LOVE to make excused for their anger and violence by pointing
to the "other side". You might want to consider that the "other side",
insofar as it consists of the wretched of the earth, has a moral right
to violence that lower-middle class authoritarians do not possess. Ann
Coulter lies and destroys careers. Those harmed by her MAY share in
this right. A pie may have shown some restraint.
Peacenik
news:8ils61lk5g67v7o5n...@4ax.com...
> On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 14:44:15 GMT, Birkenstock Bolshevik
> <LeftC...@GirlyMen.com> wrote:
> >She has had a long life, but she really hasn't done anything of note
> >the last several years.
>
> Just written a best seller and starred in a big summer smash movie, is
> all. Why, I bet you did more than that before breakfast today!
I find it so funny that back during the Jane Fonda Workout days and the On
Golden Pond days, nobody complained about her being "Hanoi Jane". Seems this
Hanoi Jane idiocy has only cropped up in the last few years!
omare...@aol.com
>exposed her as what she is, a lying bitch.
I can understand how angry you are over your argument being ripped to
shreds but try to hide your hysteria better in the future, little girl.
omare...@aol.com
Just because you're losing doesn't mean you need to get so angry. Just
calm down, apologize, and I'm sure they'll lay off.
1566 Dead
Oh, it's always been around. But until they took over the media and
the GOP, nobody ever took the ravings of the loony right seriously.
Steven Canyon
>
>Steven Canyon wrote:
>> On 26 Apr 2005 07:38:44 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>>
>> >
>> >Listen, punk. I just got through working three hours on drafting a
>> >paper for a professional conference by invitation. If you think I am
>> >going to do your homework for you, you have another thing coming.
>>
>>
>> <LOL> IOWs, another loony leftist can't back up what he fantasized
>> about.....
>
>You can post it until you are blue in the face. The fact is that
>neither you nor "Birkenstock Bolshevik" know your history of the
>Vietnam war,
<LOL> Wat a moron...
>probably because neither of you punks were born in 1972,
>and you panty wastes spent high school smoking dope.
Actually, I was born in 1945.....
>The evidence is not only in the form of informal cites (as I have said,
IOW, you got nothing.....
>if you punks think I am going to waste my time formalizing cites unless
>you pay may, you can forget about it).
IOW, you know that you've got nothing....
>It is also in the form of a clear difference in tone and style between
>what I post and what you post.
Oh yeah.... <LOL> clear difference....
>It is evident from your style alone that both of you clowns are only
>half-literate, and significantly uninformed, because neither of you can
>form a narrative above the level of a sound byte.
Oh,,, you want someone to argue with you?
>In your twittering world, Jane said at one point "I wish I had those
>murderers in my sights right now". Years later, you were galvanized out
>of your usual torpor in front of Teevee to learn that one of your own
>had spit on Jane, a story that activated your childishness and rage.
>
>Neither of you can form a complete sentence and neither of you are able
>to parse the Vietnam war, in which Jane's efforts to end the war were
>on a parallel track with "Business Executives Against the War",
Fonda wasn't never bright enough.... The fact that she married three
times and got twisted, shafted and abused three times shows that she
can't even manage her own life.....
>"Vietnam Veterans Against the War", and Nixon himself who was elected
>in 1968 and on 1972 because he promised to end the war.
>
>It is also evident from your style alone that both of you clowns have
>significant anger management issues which are associated in men with
>inability to narrate the real conditions of their lives, and both of
>you may be "ticking time bombs" in your respective communities.
<LOL> The moron cam't tell the difference between when people are
angry and when people are laughing at him/her.....
Steven Canyon
<zepp1566#2211finestplanet.com> wrote:
>On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 11:30:21 +0800, "Peacenik"
><cnelso...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>"1566 Dead" <zepp1566#2211finestplanet.com> wrote in message
>>news:8ils61lk5g67v7o5n...@4ax.com...
>>> On Tue, 26 Apr 2005 14:44:15 GMT, Birkenstock Bolshevik
>>> <LeftC...@GirlyMen.com> wrote:
>>> >She has had a long life, but she really hasn't done anything of note
>>> >the last several years.
>>>
>>> Just written a best seller and starred in a big summer smash movie, is
>>> all. Why, I bet you did more than that before breakfast today!
>>
>>I find it so funny that back during the Jane Fonda Workout days and the On
>>Golden Pond days, nobody complained about her being "Hanoi Jane". Seems this
>>Hanoi Jane idiocy has only cropped up in the last few years!
>
>Oh, it's always been around. But until they took over the media and
>the GOP, nobody ever took the ravings of the loony right seriously.
Irony anyone?
spino...@yahoo.com
Logic does not seem to be their strong point.
>
>
> Of course, what really gets them is that despite their sour hatred,
> Jane Fonda has had a long and successful life, and will continue to
do
> so, no matter how many white trash baccy chewers spit at her.
And one reason is precisely her willingness to both act on her beliefs
and to admit a mistake. She was trying to bring an end to the war and
courageously traveled to North Vietnam to do so. When she realized that
this act might have genuinely hurt the feelings of good men who were in
good faith risking their lives, she apologized.
She's done so repeatedly but there are some systems with no memory. One
of them is the "addictive" system, according to organizational theorist
Anne Wilson Schaef. Another is the Fascist system.
My only regret is I can't seem to find her 1980s aerobics tapes on DVD.
They were great workouts with a lot of eye candy for both sexes to
relieve the tedium.
In particular, the Jane Fonda Challenge was a brutal 90 minute workout
which when mastered gives you a great deal of grace and strength, and I
used it extensively until the tape just wore out.
At the same time I happen to be a recovering Copenhagen addict and this
is why I know that the attacker wasn't doing something harmless like
the pie that was apparently thrown at Anne Coulter. Copenhagen is a
poison and I was able to give it up in China because most civilized
countries are signatories to a UNICEF agreement not to import the
stuff.
I am recovering courtesy of Nicorette gum and while Copenhagen is
supposed to be hard to quit, I find that the simple fact of its being
illegal makes it much easier to quit...which of course belies the
Puritan US insistence on shaming smokers and chewers, while allowing
tobacco companies to sell their shit.
This is why the incident had emotional resonance. Jane as a former
smoker and bulimic found a path out of her own addictions and shared
this with others, and that path is unconventionality and
anti-authoritarianism: disrespect for the strong and care for the weak.
Fascists, of course, never admit weakness or addiction. Instead, they
attempt without success to spit the pain of their loser lives at people
who have done something with their life.
> >
> >-
> >The difference between Los Angeles and yogurt is that yogurt comes
with less fruit.
> >-Rush Limbaugh
>
> -
>
> Carl M. Forti, a spokesman for the National Republican
> Congressional Committee -- "A month from now,
> people are not going to remember [Terri Schiavo],"
> he said, and 20 months from now, in the 2006
> elections, "it will be irrelevant."
Yeah, "the addictive system is without a memory".
> http://www.nytimes.com/2005/03/26/politics/26delay.html?
>
>
> Not dead, in jail, or a slave? Thank a liberal!
Flying "A"
> Pay your taxes so the rich don't have to.
Too true
> For the finest in liberal/leftist commentary,
> http://www.zeppscommentaries.com
Checked it out. Cool!
> For news feed (free, 10-20 articles a day)
> http://groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/zepps_news
> For essays (donations accepted, 2 articles/week)
> http://groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/zepps_essays
Maybe I will donate? What do you all need in terms of content? Send me
email.
spino...@yahoo.com
Apologize? Forget about it. And how do you know I'm angry? I am
ROTFLMAO at these guys FYI. They are blue in the face and going
splutter splut splut because they expected to post conventional,
authoritarian, and Fascist sentiments, and receive reinforcement from
total strangers. They got a rocket up their butt from a learned and
literate Spinoza1111 flamefest, and two posters, one of whom was in
Vietnam and supports Jane, and the other of whom has an uncle, who was
in Vietnam, and supports Jane.
spino...@yahoo.com
Steven Canyon wrote:
> On 26 Apr 2005 19:32:25 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> >
> >Steven Canyon wrote:
> >> On 26 Apr 2005 07:38:44 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> >Listen, punk. I just got through working three hours on drafting
a
> >> >paper for a professional conference by invitation. If you think I
am
> >> >going to do your homework for you, you have another thing coming.
> >>
> >>
> >> <LOL> IOWs, another loony leftist can't back up what he
fantasized
> >> about.....
> >
> >You can post it until you are blue in the face. The fact is that
> >neither you nor "Birkenstock Bolshevik" know your history of the
> >Vietnam war,
>
> <LOL> Wat a moron...
I think that's spelled "maroon", Elmer Fudd.
>
> >probably because neither of you punks were born in 1972,
> >and you panty wastes spent high school smoking dope.
>
> Actually, I was born in 1945.....
And where did you serve in Vietnam? Come on, the anti-Jane forces need
you if indeed you busted your hump in Vietnam.
>
> >The evidence is not only in the form of informal cites (as I have
said,
>
> IOW, you got nothing.....
You got nuttin on me coppers ya de ya ya
>
> >if you punks think I am going to waste my time formalizing cites
unless
> >you pay may, you can forget about it).
>
> IOW, you know that you've got nothing....
I got sunshine on a cloudy day when it be cold outside I gots de Munf
of May
I also have a library card. I've read the relevant texts and am a
Vietnam era draft-dodger and war protestor. Since I am not going to
waste time on doing your homework unless you pay me my standard
consulting rates, ball is in your court.
CITE that the war was even declared.
CITE that a majority of the population supported the war.
CITE that Jane even suffered any career damage as did the Dixie Chicks,
which shows that the populace in 1970 was supportive, and less
mind-controlled than today (or simply ignored by hacked elections and
lying polls).
>
> >It is also in the form of a clear difference in tone and style
between
> >what I post and what you post.
>
> Oh yeah.... <LOL> clear difference....
Duh, yeah. Look at your replies. Grunts and groans from the back of the
bus.
>
> >It is evident from your style alone that both of you clowns are only
> >half-literate, and significantly uninformed, because neither of you
can
> >form a narrative above the level of a sound byte.
>
> Oh,,, you want someone to argue with you?
Well, I am waiting for one of you punks to present anything other than
your hatred and fear, something like an argument.
>
> >In your twittering world, Jane said at one point "I wish I had those
> >murderers in my sights right now". Years later, you were galvanized
out
> >of your usual torpor in front of Teevee to learn that one of your
own
> >had spit on Jane, a story that activated your childishness and rage.
> >
> >Neither of you can form a complete sentence and neither of you are
able
> >to parse the Vietnam war, in which Jane's efforts to end the war
were
> >on a parallel track with "Business Executives Against the War",
>
> Fonda wasn't never bright enough.... The fact that she married
three
> times and got twisted, shafted and abused three times shows that she
> can't even manage her own life.....
Let's blame the victim and feel all right. In fact, Fonda took
responsibility for the way in which her addictions caused her to be
codependent with men who treated her badly and she walked out. I
suppose in your book she should have been a Republican wife like Pat
Nixon, who keeled over from smoking and booze in an attempt to maintain
a facade, or someone like Laura Bush who looks like she drinks battery
acid first thing in the morning.
>
> >"Vietnam Veterans Against the War", and Nixon himself who was
elected
> >in 1968 and on 1972 because he promised to end the war.
> >
> >It is also evident from your style alone that both of you clowns
have
> >significant anger management issues which are associated in men with
> >inability to narrate the real conditions of their lives, and both of
> >you may be "ticking time bombs" in your respective communities.
>
> <LOL> The moron cam't tell the difference between when people are
> angry and when people are laughing at him/her.....
I don't "hear" laughter in your posts. I hear hatred and fear.
>
>
>
> --
>
> Did Zepp Jamieson really think he was going to get away with posting
> as "Greywolf the Wanderer" long ago writing about his homosexual
fantasies
> about the startrek characters and about his belief that he was a
werewolf?
So like I uh care? If he's homo or bi, that's his bizness. If he thinks
he's a werewolf, that's no whackier that what Kansas wants to teach
innocent children about "creation science".
spino...@yahoo.com
"Fascism is the nightmare of childhood". It includes the reversion by
childlike adults to the categories ("little girl") of childhood, and
the idea that they will sting when hurled randomly, like Copenhagen,
into cyberspace.
An example was the last election: "vote for me or you are a queer".
Some of us can speak the truth without anger and fear. Anne Coulter is
a lying bitch, pard, and I say it with a smile.
1566 Dead
I suspect that most of the people who hate Fonda so much hate her not
because she hurt the feelings of the troops, but simply because she
thumbed her nose at authority. But they know "Mocking Nixon" won't
play, so they use the troops as an excuse to pile on.
>
>She's done so repeatedly but there are some systems with no memory. One
>of them is the "addictive" system, according to organizational theorist
>Anne Wilson Schaef. Another is the Fascist system.
Both break down into enablers and auto-destructives.
>
>My only regret is I can't seem to find her 1980s aerobics tapes on DVD.
>They were great workouts with a lot of eye candy for both sexes to
>relieve the tedium.
>
>In particular, the Jane Fonda Challenge was a brutal 90 minute workout
>which when mastered gives you a great deal of grace and strength, and I
>used it extensively until the tape just wore out.
>
>At the same time I happen to be a recovering Copenhagen addict and this
>is why I know that the attacker wasn't doing something harmless like
>the pie that was apparently thrown at Anne Coulter. Copenhagen is a
>poison and I was able to give it up in China because most civilized
>countries are signatories to a UNICEF agreement not to import the
>stuff.
Congratulations. I just celebrated my tenth year without tobacco.
Best thing I ever did was quit. Started smoking thirty years earlier.
>
>I am recovering courtesy of Nicorette gum and while Copenhagen is
>supposed to be hard to quit, I find that the simple fact of its being
>illegal makes it much easier to quit...which of course belies the
>Puritan US insistence on shaming smokers and chewers, while allowing
>tobacco companies to sell their shit.
>
>This is why the incident had emotional resonance. Jane as a former
>smoker and bulimic found a path out of her own addictions and shared
>this with others, and that path is unconventionality and
>anti-authoritarianism: disrespect for the strong and care for the weak.
>
>Fascists, of course, never admit weakness or addiction. Instead, they
>attempt without success to spit the pain of their loser lives at people
>who have done something with their life.
Precisely so.
Martin McPhillips
> On 27 Apr 2005 06:02:15 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com
> wrote:
>
>
>>And one reason is precisely her willingness to both act on
>>her beliefs
>>and to admit a mistake. She was trying to bring an end to
>>the war and
>>courageously traveled to North Vietnam to do so. When she
>>realized that
>>this act might have genuinely hurt the feelings of good
>>men who were in
>>good faith risking their lives, she apologized.
>
> I suspect that most of the people who hate Fonda so much
> hate her not
> because she hurt the feelings of the troops, but simply
> because she
> thumbed her nose at authority. But they know "Mocking
> Nixon" won't
> play, so they use the troops as an excuse to pile on.
I've never hated Fonda, but I suspect that those
who really do hate her, or who simply cannot forgive
her, are the U.S. POWs who were being tortured by
the North Vietnamese while Fonda was reassuring
everyone that they were being treated just fine.
Of course, the broadcasts she made on Radio Hanoi
were nothing short of treason.
I will say of her latest incarnation that at 69
she has never seemed so outlandishly self-absorbed
and frankly stupid. I honestly didn't expect
to see that. I expected something more, to be
honest. I was a bit shocked by it.
>>She's done so repeatedly but there are some systems with
>>no memory. One
>>of them is the "addictive" system, according to
>>organizational theorist
>>Anne Wilson Schaef. Another is the Fascist system.
>
> Both break down into enablers and auto-destructives.
Do you serve yourself in both capacities, Tubbaloosa?
<snip to the most precious moment>
>>Fascists, of course, never admit weakness or addiction.
>>Instead, they
>>attempt without success to spit the pain of their loser
>>lives at people
>>who have done something with their life.
>
> Precisely so.
That's pretty "funny." For you to say "precisely so" to
that you have to be either clinically insane or
clinically dead. Or maybe you're just acknowledging
that you are a fascist. Arguing for the second
choice, that you're clinically dead, is the
zombie-level nature of the "precisely so."
Birkenstock Bolshevik
>
>Steven Canyon wrote:
>> On 26 Apr 2005 07:38:44 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>>
>> >
>> >Listen, punk. I just got through working three hours on drafting a
>> >paper for a professional conference by invitation. If you think I am
>> >going to do your homework for you, you have another thing coming.
>>
>>
>> <LOL> IOWs, another loony leftist can't back up what he fantasized
>> about.....
>
>You can post it until you are blue in the face. The fact is that
>neither you nor "Birkenstock Bolshevik" know your history of the
>Vietnam war, probably because neither of you punks were born in 1972,
>and you panty wastes spent high school smoking dope.
>
This thread is about Hanoi Jane Fonda. Not about how much leftist
rhetoric you can spew.
>The evidence is not only in the form of informal cites (as I have said,
>if you punks think I am going to waste my time formalizing cites unless
>you pay may, you can forget about it).
>
You don't have any cites, Boy.
>It is also in the form of a clear difference in tone and style between
>what I post and what you post.
>
>It is evident from your style alone that both of you clowns are only
>half-literate, and significantly uninformed, because neither of you can
>form a narrative above the level of a sound byte.
>
Go ahead, make my day. Do you feel lucky punk?
Gives us cites. It's probably from Mao's little red book.
>In your twittering world, Jane said at one point "I wish I had those
>murderers in my sights right now". Years later, you were galvanized out
>of your usual torpor in front of Teevee to learn that one of your own
>had spit on Jane, a story that activated your childishness and rage.
>
>Neither of you can form a complete sentence and neither of you are able
>to parse the Vietnam war, in which Jane's efforts to end the war were
>on a parallel track with "Business Executives Against the War",
>"Vietnam Veterans Against the War", and Nixon himself who was elected
>in 1968 and on 1972 because he promised to end the war.
>
Boo fucking boo hoo.
>It is also evident from your style alone that both of you clowns have
>significant anger management issues which are associated in men with
>inability to narrate the real conditions of their lives, and both of
>you may be "ticking time bombs" in your respective communities.
>>
You probably spend your life beating around the bush because you over
analyze navel lint. You cannot accept the simple fact that Hanoi Jane
is hated. You continuously run in circles trying to intellectualize
that hate. Well, Moron, it doesn't work. You'll also have to accept
the fact you are an idiot.
Birkenstock Bolshevik
>
>Steven Canyon wrote:
>> On 26 Apr 2005 19:32:25 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >Steven Canyon wrote:
>> >> On 26 Apr 2005 07:38:44 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >Listen, punk. I just got through working three hours on drafting
>a
>> >> >paper for a professional conference by invitation. If you think I
>am
>> >> >going to do your homework for you, you have another thing coming.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> <LOL> IOWs, another loony leftist can't back up what he
>fantasized
>> >> about.....
>> >
>> >You can post it until you are blue in the face. The fact is that
>> >neither you nor "Birkenstock Bolshevik" know your history of the
>> >Vietnam war,
>>
>> <LOL> Wat a moron...
>
>I think that's spelled "maroon", Elmer Fudd.
You are a MORON.
>
>>
>> >probably because neither of you punks were born in 1972,
>> >and you panty wastes spent high school smoking dope.
>>
>> Actually, I was born in 1945.....
>
>And where did you serve in Vietnam? Come on, the anti-Jane forces need
>you if indeed you busted your hump in Vietnam.
>
Hanoi Jane served for the North Vietnam propaganda machine. That's why
she is hated. You defend her. That's why you are going through fits
that a boxcar of Miidol couldn't help..
>>
>> >The evidence is not only in the form of informal cites (as I have
>said,
>>
>> IOW, you got nothing.....
>
>You got nuttin on me coppers ya de ya ya
You are definitely a Moron.
>>
>> >if you punks think I am going to waste my time formalizing cites
>unless
>> >you pay may, you can forget about it).
>>
>> IOW, you know that you've got nothing....
>
>I got sunshine on a cloudy day when it be cold outside I gots de Munf
>of May
>
>I also have a library card. I've read the relevant texts and am a
>Vietnam era draft-dodger and war protestor. Since I am not going to
>waste time on doing your homework unless you pay me my standard
>consulting rates, ball is in your court.
>
>CITE that the war was even declared.
>
This thread is about Hanoi Jane Fonda, Moron. Not the Zen of the cause
and effects of Vietnam. Get out of your 70s purple haze, Moron.
>CITE that a majority of the population supported the war.
>
>CITE that Jane even suffered any career damage as did the Dixie Chicks,
>which shows that the populace in 1970 was supportive, and less
>mind-controlled than today (or simply ignored by hacked elections and
>lying polls).
>
What has she done lately except for making a few exercise videos? She
is now making the talk show circuit in hope a breathing life into a
fail career.
>>
>> >It is also in the form of a clear difference in tone and style
>between
>> >what I post and what you post.
>>
>> Oh yeah.... <LOL> clear difference....
>
>Duh, yeah. Look at your replies. Grunts and groans from the back of the
>bus.
>
You're a Moron, what do you expect?
>>
>> >It is evident from your style alone that both of you clowns are only
>> >half-literate, and significantly uninformed, because neither of you
>can
>> >form a narrative above the level of a sound byte.
>>
>> Oh,,, you want someone to argue with you?
>
>Well, I am waiting for one of you punks to present anything other than
>your hatred and fear, something like an argument.
>
That's what this thread is about, Moron. There is nothing to argue
except Hanoi Jane is loathed.
On November 21, 1970 she told a University of Michigan audience of
some two thousand students, "If you understood what communism was, you
would hope, you would pray on your knees that we would some day become
communist." At Duke University in North Carolina she repeated what she
had said in Michigan, adding "I, a socialist, think that we should
strive toward a socialist society, all the way to communism. "
Washington Times July 7, 2000
In 1972 Jane Fonda, Tom Hayden and others traveled to North Vietnam to
give their support to the North Vietnamese's Government. When she
returned to the United States, she advised the news media that all of
the American Prisoners of War were being well treated and were not
being tortured.
As the American POWs returned home in 1973, they spoke out about the
inhumane treatment and torture they had suffered as prisoners of war.
Their stories directly contradicted Jane Fonda's earlier statements of
1972. Some of the American POWs such as Senator John McCain, a
former Presidential candidate, stated that he was tortured by his
guards for refusing to meet with Jane Fonda and her group. Jane
Fonda, in her response to these new allegations, referred to the
returning POWs as being "hypocrites and liars."
The Wall Street Journal (August 3, 1995) published an interview with
Bui Tin who served on the General Staff of the North Vietnam Army and
received the unconditional surrender of South Vietnam on April 30,
1975. During the interview Mr. Tin was asked if the American antiwar
movement was important to Hanoi's victory. Mr. Tin responded "It was
essential to our strategy" referring to the war being fought on two
fronts, the Vietnam battlefield and back home in America through the
antiwar movement on college campuses and in the city streets. He
further stated the North Vietnamese leadership listened to the
American evening news broadcasts "to follow the growth of the American
antiwar movement."
Visits to Hanoi made by persons such as Jane Fonda, former Attorney
General Ramsey Clark and various church ministers "gave us confidence
that we should hold on in the face of battlefield reverses." Mr. Tin
surmised that "America lost because of its democracy; through dissent
and protest it lost the ability to mobilize a will to win." Mr. Tin
further advised that General Vo Nguyen Giap (Commanding General of the
North Vietnam Army) said the 1968 Tet Offensive was a defeat.
Birkenstock Bolshevik
<zepp1566#2211finestplanet.com> wrote:
Your response was in response to my post. That why I felt compelled to
respond to an idiot.
Birkenstock Bolshevik
Loathing Hanoi Jane is something her wide-eyed followers cannot
comprehend, especially Spazola.
1574 Dead
Let's see a cite that she ever made that claim, Marty.
Martin McPhillips
wrote in message
news:s7gv61179u35b7rse...@4ax.com...
Sure, pigpen. This is from historian Ronald Radosh's
review of Henry Mark Holzer and Erika Holzer's Aid
and Comfort: Jane Fonda in North Vietnam (Jefferson,
North Carolina: McFarland and Company, 2002).
http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=1468
====
In addition, Fonda attended forced and staged meetings with
American POWs, who refused to cooperate or talk with her,
and who went out of their way to ignore the pleas of their
captors to acquiesce in the propaganda. Nevertheless, Fonda
immediately went on the air and lied about her meetings,
presenting phony stories about how well the captured troops
were being treated at the infamous "Hanoi Hilton" POW camp.
"They are all in good health," she said in yet another
broadcast; "We had a very long.very open and casual talk. We
exchanged ideas freely," and these men told her about their
"sense of disgust of the war." None of what she said, of
course, had an ounce of truth to it. As the Holzers put it:
"These lies were simply more canned North Vietnamese
propaganda, broadcast in furtherance of Fonda's intent to
damage the United States and help the North Vietnamese."
====
Steven Canyon
>
>Steven Canyon wrote:
>> On 26 Apr 2005 19:32:25 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >Steven Canyon wrote:
>> >> On 26 Apr 2005 07:38:44 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >Listen, punk. I just got through working three hours on drafting
>a
>> >> >paper for a professional conference by invitation. If you think I
>am
>> >> >going to do your homework for you, you have another thing coming.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> <LOL> IOWs, another loony leftist can't back up what he
>fantasized
>> >> about.....
>> >
>> >You can post it until you are blue in the face. The fact is that
>> >neither you nor "Birkenstock Bolshevik" know your history of the
>> >Vietnam war,
>>
>> <LOL> Wat a moron...
>
>I think that's spelled "maroon", Elmer Fudd.
In your case, it's definitely, "moron."
>> >probably because neither of you punks were born in 1972,
>> >and you panty wastes spent high school smoking dope.
>>
>> Actually, I was born in 1945.....
>
>And where did you serve in Vietnam? Come on, the anti-Jane forces need
>you if indeed you busted your hump in Vietnam.
What business is that of yours?
>> >The evidence is not only in the form of informal cites (as I have
>said,
>>
>> IOW, you got nothing.....
>
>You got nuttin on me coppers ya de ya ya
Yeah, like I said, you're all noise with no poise....
>> >if you punks think I am going to waste my time formalizing cites
>unless
>> >you pay may, you can forget about it).
>>
>> IOW, you know that you've got nothing....
>
>I got sunshine on a cloudy day when it be cold outside I gots de Munf
>of May
Lots of noise... Lots and lots....
>I also have a library card. I've read the relevant texts and am a
>Vietnam era draft-dodger and war protestor. Since I am not going to
>waste time on doing your homework unless you pay me my standard
>consulting rates, ball is in your court.
Oh well, there you go...
>CITE that the war was even declared.
>
>CITE that a majority of the population supported the war.
>
>CITE that Jane even suffered any career damage as did the Dixie Chicks,
<LOL> well, you sure are feeling the need to defend her against
something...
>which shows that the populace in 1970 was supportive, and less
>mind-controlled than today (or simply ignored by hacked elections and
>lying polls).
>
>>
>> >It is also in the form of a clear difference in tone and style
>between
>> >what I post and what you post.
>>
>> Oh yeah.... <LOL> clear difference....
>
>Duh, yeah. Look at your replies. Grunts and groans from the back of the
>bus.
As if you had anything worth replying to with more....
>>
>> >It is evident from your style alone that both of you clowns are only
>> >half-literate, and significantly uninformed, because neither of you
>can
>> >form a narrative above the level of a sound byte.
>>
>> Oh,,, you want someone to argue with you?
>
>Well, I am waiting for one of you punks to present anything other than
>your hatred and fear, something like an argument.
Why would anyone choose to argue with your insignificant blather?
It's not as though I care, you know...
>> >In your twittering world, Jane said at one point "I wish I had those
>> >murderers in my sights right now". Years later, you were galvanized
>out
>> >of your usual torpor in front of Teevee to learn that one of your
>own
>> >had spit on Jane, a story that activated your childishness and rage.
>> >
>> >Neither of you can form a complete sentence and neither of you are
>able
>> >to parse the Vietnam war, in which Jane's efforts to end the war
>were
>> >on a parallel track with "Business Executives Against the War",
>>
>> Fonda wasn't never bright enough.... The fact that she married
>three
>> times and got twisted, shafted and abused three times shows that she
>> can't even manage her own life.....
>
>Let's blame the victim and feel all right.
I feel just fine... And I feel very good about the fact that her
husbands humiliated and generally shit on her....
>In fact, Fonda took
>responsibility for the way in which her addictions caused her to be
>codependent with men who treated her badly and she walked out. I
>suppose in your book she should have been a Republican wife like Pat
>Nixon, who keeled over from smoking and booze in an attempt to maintain
>a facade, or someone like Laura Bush who looks like she drinks battery
>acid first thing in the morning.
>
>>
>> >"Vietnam Veterans Against the War", and Nixon himself who was
>elected
>> >in 1968 and on 1972 because he promised to end the war.
>> >
>> >It is also evident from your style alone that both of you clowns
>have
>> >significant anger management issues which are associated in men with
>> >inability to narrate the real conditions of their lives, and both of
>> >you may be "ticking time bombs" in your respective communities.
>>
>> <LOL> The moron cam't tell the difference between when people are
>> angry and when people are laughing at him/her.....
>
>I don't "hear" laughter in your posts. I hear hatred and fear.
I'd bet that you feel hatred and fear just about everywhere you go...
--
Did Zepp Jamieson really think he was going to get away with posting
as "Greywolf the Wanderer" long ago writing about his homosexual fantasies
about the startrek characters and about his belief that he was a werewolf?
The similarities are too many to be a coincidence.
spino...@yahoo.com
Actually, I understand it all too well. It's a form of "mass delusion
and madness of the crowd", like a financial bubble, in which people
believe a lie.
As I've said, it is a trick (like anti-Japanese riots here in China)
that the government uses to deflect anger away from its own blunders
and crimes.
Just as Jane has repeatedly apologized, the Japanese government has
repeatedly apologized for its WWII conduct: but this is irrevelant to
men who in C. S. Lewis' words are "maddened by false promises and
soured by true miseries" and go to book signings to spit their hatred.
spino...@yahoo.com
Governments, who wish to focus anger away from their own
responsibility, often create through an absence of information, a
disinformation, a perception that the media amplifies into a reality.
At the conclusion of the Paris Peace Talks in 1973, both sides
implicitly agreed to not apply Nuremburg rules by means of which the
victor would judge the vanguished, as happened in the clear defeat of
Germany.
For if North Vietnam was the "victor" in 1973, it would then have had
significant cause of action under international law to arraign the US
before the predecessor bodies to today's world court for (1) civilian
bombing campaigns, (2) defoliation and environmental destruction, (3)
torture of NVA and Viet Cong prisoners, and of course (4) the My Lai
massacre, a war crime.
Of course, North Vietnam did not do so because as a Communist
government it did not believe in the reality of international law to
that extent although it followed it, through its physical weakness as
compared with the US, through forbearance, and for PR reasons.
But note that the US did NOT "press charges" under international law
against POW abusers as it had in both WWII theaters, because in fact
the "torture" was primarily emotional and because at the time
international law did not ban this form of torture, in which the US now
in fact specializes both at Guantanamo and in Iraq and which is now
illegal.
Even in cases where POWs like McCain reported torture, these reports
were not followed up on by Nixon or Kissinger because to do so would
have opened up the issue of the US's own culpability under
international law not only in North Vietnam but also in Iran, Guatamela
and Chile. Let him, in other words, with clean hands approach the bench
of justice.
Instead, the Nixon and Ford administrations created for domestic
consumption the lie that the torture existed and was significant, and
the POW/MIS lie to AVOID criticism from returning veterans and to
ensure that they focused their anger on strictly speaking fictional
villains, which the Hollywood dream machine manufactured.
The veterans of Vietnam were fed these lies while their material
situation deteroriated and their service, including POW status, was
used against them EVEN IN THE CASE OF JOHN MCAIN.
For when McCain challenged Bush in 2000, a black-ops whispering
campaign was conducted at the behest of Karl Rove which said that his
service as a POW had rendered him unfit for command, a prototype in
fact of "Swift Boat Veterans for Truth".
Chickenhawks don't give a shit about POWs.
>
> Of course, the broadcasts she made on Radio Hanoi
> were nothing short of treason.
Treason is aid and comfort to the enemy in time of war, but no war was
declared therefore the treason is null and void.
>
> I will say of her latest incarnation that at 69
> she has never seemed so outlandishly self-absorbed
This "outlandish self-absorption" is mere self-esteem, which is beaten
out of the lower middle class.
spino...@yahoo.com
OK, you were hiding out in business school, or in your Mom's basement.
>
> >> >The evidence is not only in the form of informal cites (as I have
> >said,
> >>
> >> IOW, you got nothing.....
> >
> >You got nuttin on me coppers ya de ya ya
>
> Yeah, like I said, you're all noise with no poise....
>
> >> >if you punks think I am going to waste my time formalizing cites
> >unless
> >> >you pay may, you can forget about it).
> >>
> >> IOW, you know that you've got nothing....
> >
> >I got sunshine on a cloudy day when it be cold outside I gots de
Munf
> >of May
>
> Lots of noise... Lots and lots....
>
> >I also have a library card. I've read the relevant texts and am a
> >Vietnam era draft-dodger and war protestor. Since I am not going to
> >waste time on doing your homework unless you pay me my standard
> >consulting rates, ball is in your court.
>
> Oh well, there you go...
>
> >CITE that the war was even declared.
> >
> >CITE that a majority of the population supported the war.
> >
> >CITE that Jane even suffered any career damage as did the Dixie
Chicks,
>
> <LOL> well, you sure are feeling the need to defend her against
> something...
Yeah, the jagoff factor.
...as your own wife cowers in a corner?
>
> >In fact, Fonda took
> >responsibility for the way in which her addictions caused her to be
> >codependent with men who treated her badly and she walked out. I
> >suppose in your book she should have been a Republican wife like Pat
> >Nixon, who keeled over from smoking and booze in an attempt to
maintain
> >a facade, or someone like Laura Bush who looks like she drinks
battery
> >acid first thing in the morning.
> >
> >>
> >> >"Vietnam Veterans Against the War", and Nixon himself who was
> >elected
> >> >in 1968 and on 1972 because he promised to end the war.
> >> >
> >> >It is also evident from your style alone that both of you clowns
> >have
> >> >significant anger management issues which are associated in men
with
> >> >inability to narrate the real conditions of their lives, and both
of
> >> >you may be "ticking time bombs" in your respective communities.
> >>
> >> <LOL> The moron cam't tell the difference between when people
are
> >> angry and when people are laughing at him/her.....
> >
> >I don't "hear" laughter in your posts. I hear hatred and fear.
>
> I'd bet that you feel hatred and fear just about everywhere you go...
Of course. The problem is you're in denial. You think women should be
slapped around if they speak up on men's issues. I hate that, and
whenever I am in America I fear the increasing religious hysteria and
violence against African Americans, women, children, old people and
gays.
And on the Internet, I have long hated and feared the way in which
anonymous posters spew their racism and hatred for the Other on their
employer's time.
spino...@yahoo.com
Birkenstock Bolshevik wrote:
> On 26 Apr 2005 19:32:25 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> >
> >Steven Canyon wrote:
> >> On 26 Apr 2005 07:38:44 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> >Listen, punk. I just got through working three hours on drafting
a
> >> >paper for a professional conference by invitation. If you think I
am
> >> >going to do your homework for you, you have another thing coming.
> >>
> >>
> >> <LOL> IOWs, another loony leftist can't back up what he
fantasized
> >> about.....
> >
> >You can post it until you are blue in the face. The fact is that
> >neither you nor "Birkenstock Bolshevik" know your history of the
> >Vietnam war, probably because neither of you punks were born in
1972,
> >and you panty wastes spent high school smoking dope.
> >
> This thread is about Hanoi Jane Fonda. Not about how much leftist
> rhetoric you can spew.
Hers was a moral act in a moral context which justified her trip and
most of her statements.
>
> >The evidence is not only in the form of informal cites (as I have
said,
> >if you punks think I am going to waste my time formalizing cites
unless
> >you pay may, you can forget about it).
> >
> You don't have any cites, Boy.
I love it when thugs invade libraries and start using librarian
language for it is amusing when certain words for thugs become ersatz
for their anxiety about a missing phallus.
You don't read, you don't study, you don't go to the library and you
didn't serve in Vietnam. That's what's bugging you.
>
> >It is also in the form of a clear difference in tone and style
between
> >what I post and what you post.
> >
> >It is evident from your style alone that both of you clowns are only
> >half-literate, and significantly uninformed, because neither of you
can
> >form a narrative above the level of a sound byte.
> >
> Go ahead, make my day. Do you feel lucky punk?
> Gives us cites. It's probably from Mao's little red book.
I have told you: do your own homework. The problem is that ALL
researchers agree on a core set of views about Vietnam as an undeclared
and unpopular war in which the sheer scale and lack of focus of the US
effort created war crimes, including the My Lai massacre and the
Christmas bombing of Hanoi, on the ground.
>
> >In your twittering world, Jane said at one point "I wish I had those
> >murderers in my sights right now". Years later, you were galvanized
out
> >of your usual torpor in front of Teevee to learn that one of your
own
> >had spit on Jane, a story that activated your childishness and rage.
> >
> >Neither of you can form a complete sentence and neither of you are
able
> >to parse the Vietnam war, in which Jane's efforts to end the war
were
> >on a parallel track with "Business Executives Against the War",
> >"Vietnam Veterans Against the War", and Nixon himself who was
elected
> >in 1968 and on 1972 because he promised to end the war.
> >
> Boo fucking boo hoo.
You adopt soldier's language as seen on Teevee so as to show how tough
you are, stud muffin, but your arguments are weak. You've hearkened to
an urban legend and you're not man enough to admit you are wrong.
>
> >It is also evident from your style alone that both of you clowns
have
> >significant anger management issues which are associated in men with
> >inability to narrate the real conditions of their lives, and both of
> >you may be "ticking time bombs" in your respective communities.
> >>
> You probably spend your life beating around the bush because you over
> analyze navel lint. You cannot accept the simple fact that Hanoi Jane
> is hated. You continuously run in circles trying to intellectualize
> that hate. Well, Moron, it doesn't work. You'll also have to accept
> the fact you are an idiot.
Of course she is hated, because as I said the hatred and anger must of
needs be deflected away from the US war machine.
By the time of the 1976 Mayaguez incident the Ford administration's
number one concern was the loss of US authority and prestige at home
and abroad as a result not only of our failure in Vietnam but also of
our failure to accept thousands of boat people.
The late 1970s saw the beginning, therefore, of Chuck Norris and Rambo,
who rewrote the history of Vietnam for morons like you as a complete
fiction.
Of course, the White House did not have direct control of the media
although today this is beginning to happen, as black ops get news
anchors fired.
Instead, the Hollywood studio system, which was being rebuilt through
consolidation in the late 1970s, approves certain scripts and rejects
others.
Jane Fonda was able to make a realistic film, Coming Home, about
Vietnam in 1978 but this type of film disappeared because MALE
executives were collectively disturbed by the idea that the
male-affirming adventure of war could in fact come out so badly.
They thus turned, in the collective and semi-systematic way of
Hollywood, to making almost as experiments movies like Rambo which
gradually, more and more, de-emphasized Rambo's anger against the brass
and emphasized that he, like Corporal Hitler, was the "real" American.
You bought into this lie and are now spewing it.
>
> -
> The difference between Los Angeles and yogurt is that yogurt comes
with less fruit.
> -Rush Limbaugh
This doesn't even make sense and is half literate because clearly
Limbaugh wants to complain that LA has "many homosexuals", but "fruit"
is a singular collective word. It's also contributed this year into a
7% increase in gat bashing in San Francisco.
Steven Canyon
Hey, guess what? My mom always used to say, "don't be influenced by
morons," given that, I can't imagine why I'd be interested in any of
your opinions about me, so I guess you can believe pretty much
whatever you want about me... OK?
Soooo, IOW, you obviously *do* believe that the negatives about Jane
Fonda has scored some damage on her. Thanks for explaining that.
My... what a fertile imagination you have....
<LOL> so it's becoming very clear that most of your "beliefs" are
based on the mysterious voices and visions that crop up while you're
under the influence of some drug.
>I hate that, and
>whenever I am in America I fear the increasing religious hysteria and
>violence against African Americans, women, children, old people and
>gays.
Ahhh, so you also have some problems with paranoia...
>And on the Internet, I have long hated and feared the way in which
>anonymous posters spew their racism and hatred for the Other on their
>employer's time.
Well goodness... <LOL> You're just full of irrational hate, too,
aren't you?
Birkenstock Bolshevik
>
>Birkenstock Bolshevik wrote:
>> On 26 Apr 2005 19:32:25 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >Steven Canyon wrote:
>> >> On 26 Apr 2005 07:38:44 -0700, spino...@yahoo.com wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >Listen, punk. I just got through working three hours on drafting
>a
>> >> >paper for a professional conference by invitation. If you think I
>am
>> >> >going to do your homework for you, you have another thing coming.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> <LOL> IOWs, another loony leftist can't back up what he
>fantasized
>> >> about.....
>> >
>> >You can post it until you are blue in the face. The fact is that
>> >neither you nor "Birkenstock Bolshevik" know your history of the
>> >Vietnam war, probably because neither of you punks were born in
>1972,
>> >and you panty wastes spent high school smoking dope.
>> >
>> This thread is about Hanoi Jane Fonda. Not about how much leftist
>> rhetoric you can spew.
>
>Hers was a moral act in a moral context which justified her trip and
>most of her statements.
Treason can never be a moral act.
>>
>> >The evidence is not only in the form of informal cites (as I have
>said,
>> >if you punks think I am going to waste my time formalizing cites
>unless
>> >you pay may, you can forget about it).
>> >
>> You don't have any cites, Boy.
>
>I love it when thugs invade libraries and start using librarian
>language for it is amusing when certain words for thugs become ersatz
>for their anxiety about a missing phallus.
>
>You don't read, you don't study, you don't go to the library and you
>didn't serve in Vietnam. That's what's bugging you.
>
You have no cites except leftist rhetoric.
>>
>> >It is also in the form of a clear difference in tone and style
>between
>> >what I post and what you post.
>> >
>> >It is evident from your style alone that both of you clowns are only
>> >half-literate, and significantly uninformed, because neither of you
>can
>> >form a narrative above the level of a sound byte.
>> >
>> Go ahead, make my day. Do you feel lucky punk?
>> Gives us cites. It's probably from Mao's little red book.
>
>I have told you: do your own homework. The problem is that ALL
>researchers agree on a core set of views about Vietnam as an undeclared
>and unpopular war in which the sheer scale and lack of focus of the US
>effort created war crimes, including the My Lai massacre and the
>Christmas bombing of Hanoi, on the ground.
>
Hanoi Jane is hated. That's a fact. You want to argue Vietnam.
Even Hanoi Jane admitted she didn't make the wisest choice. Yet, you
are trying justify she did. Keep up with the times, you cannot go
through life wearing you blue button and expect any credibility.
>>
>> >In your twittering world, Jane said at one point "I wish I had those
>> >murderers in my sights right now". Years later, you were galvanized
>out
>> >of your usual torpor in front of Teevee to learn that one of your
>own
>> >had spit on Jane, a story that activated your childishness and rage.
>> >
>> >Neither of you can form a complete sentence and neither of you are
>able
>> >to parse the Vietnam war, in which Jane's efforts to end the war
>were
>> >on a parallel track with "Business Executives Against the War",
>> >"Vietnam Veterans Against the War", and Nixon himself who was
>elected
>> >in 1968 and on 1972 because he promised to end the war.
>> >
>> Boo fucking boo hoo.
>
>You adopt soldier's language as seen on Teevee so as to show how tough
>you are, stud muffin, but your arguments are weak. You've hearkened to
>an urban legend and you're not man enough to admit you are wrong.
>
Remember, you were the first asshole to use the work fuck in this
discussion. I don't use the word unless the moron I am responding to
uses it first. You tried to be a tough guy by using the word now you
are sensitive to it. Boo fucking boo hoo. Cry me another river, Boy.
>>
>> >It is also evident from your style alone that both of you clowns
>have
>> >significant anger management issues which are associated in men with
>> >inability to narrate the real conditions of their lives, and both of
>> >you may be "ticking time bombs" in your respective communities.
>> >>
>> You probably spend your life beating around the bush because you over
>> analyze navel lint. You cannot accept the simple fact that Hanoi Jane
>> is hated. You continuously run in circles trying to intellectualize
>> that hate. Well, Moron, it doesn't work. You'll also have to accept
>> the fact you are an idiot.
>
>Of course she is hated, because as I said the hatred and anger must of
>needs be deflected away from the US war machine.
>
It won't be deflected. The left upon reflection, realize they made one
mistake. They took their anger out on the front line troops. They
tried to sing a different tune during Desert Storm. They said they
supported the troops but didn't support the war. Hanoi Jane was the
picture of the left's demeaning of the troops. With so many vets
trying to live with emotional trauma of Vietnam, Hanoi Jane reminds
them she was part of the trauma.
>By the time of the 1976 Mayaguez incident the Ford administration's
>number one concern was the loss of US authority and prestige at home
>and abroad as a result not only of our failure in Vietnam but also of
>our failure to accept thousands of boat people.
>
Acceptance of boat people? Been to Garden Grove. California in Orange
County? The city of Westminster has a part of the city called Little
Saigon. Signs on the 405 freeway identifies the area. The largest
number of Vietnamese now live in Southern California. Former South
Vietnamese vice president Nguyen Cao Ky was a resident of Southern
California.
>The late 1970s saw the beginning, therefore, of Chuck Norris and Rambo,
>who rewrote the history of Vietnam for morons like you as a complete
>fiction.
They're movies. I guess you didn't realize that. History revision in
film is left to people like Michael Moore.
>
>Of course, the White House did not have direct control of the media
>although today this is beginning to happen, as black ops get news
>anchors fired.
Ratings killed news anchors. You've got to get those black helicopters
off your mind.
>
>Instead, the Hollywood studio system, which was being rebuilt through
>consolidation in the late 1970s, approves certain scripts and rejects
>others.
>
Studio execs approve scripts.
>Jane Fonda was able to make a realistic film, Coming Home, about
>Vietnam in 1978 but this type of film disappeared because MALE
>executives were collectively disturbed by the idea that the
>male-affirming adventure of war could in fact come out so badly.
>
Memories of Hanoi Jane still followed the hag.
>They thus turned, in the collective and semi-systematic way of
>Hollywood, to making almost as experiments movies like Rambo which
>gradually, more and more, de-emphasized Rambo's anger against the brass
>and emphasized that he, like Corporal Hitler, was the "real" American.
>
You remind me of those dolls where you pull a string and it talks.
Pull your string and leftist rhetoric comes out of your mouth. You
sound like the Abbey Hoffman of Roger Ebert.
>You bought into this lie and are now spewing it.
I hated Hanoi then and I still have no regard for her now. That's no
lie, Conspiracy-Boy.
>>
>> -
>> The difference between Los Angeles and yogurt is that yogurt comes
>with less fruit.
>> -Rush Limbaugh
>
>This doesn't even make sense and is half literate because clearly
>Limbaugh wants to complain that LA has "many homosexuals", but "fruit"
>is a singular collective word. It's also contributed this year into a
>7% increase in gat bashing in San Francisco.
You must be one of the morons who don't know what a tagline is.
I use Limbaugh's quote because I found it rather funny. I don't expect
sexual deviants to find the humor in the line.
Lost Angeles and San Francrisco are sanctuaries for homosexuals and
illegal aliens. They would never be accused of being All-American
cities.