Is the Neda video a fake???
Johnny Asia
http://www.islandcrisis.net/2009/06/neda-iran-video-photos-showing-police-killing/
The Neda video is fake. Look at the vile of blood in her left hand,
she pours it and then moves her hand down.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYr2_V6R2xM&NR=1
Go to youtube and take a good look. it may take a few viewings to see
it.
-----------
I�m sorry but its fake and a bad one. There is a ton of blood at her
feet before she ever falls down. (probably from video attempt #1) Then
there is a blood squirt from the mans hands. From a gunshot wound?
Through the shirt and the mans hands?
Most obviously is people have blood come from their mouth because it
is in their lungs and they are trying to breath yet the wound seems to
be in her upper chest. It also only seeps like that from the mouth in
movies for dramatic effect. If she was trying to breathe it wounldn't
seep and if she was already dead it wouldn't back up through her
mouth.
Everyone is going to rally behind this video and when people start
realizing it is fake it will discredit the movement. If they are lying
about this why believe them about the election?
--------------------
At first, I believed the video did depict a "real" death. Now, I
realize it�s fake for the reasons already listed and also, did anyone
notice that the girl "helped" lower herself to the ground with her
left hand?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=related&v=WmS1Kk05VH4
She�s helping to support herself AFTER being shot in the heart? NO
WAY! A person shot in the heart badly enough to cause death withing
two minutes (people have survived a gunshot wound to the heart) CANNOT
"help" lower themselves to the ground. Also, you can clearly see the
girl�s left hand move up to her face then back down again AFTER she�s
supposed to be unconscious. Where are the blood streaks caused from
dragged her over to the side of the road? She rolls her eyes back in
her head like she�s dead, then opens them, then rolls them back again.
People don�t die, then close their own eyes, then die "again."
The video is so fake. I don�t even believe them about the election
now. Yes, their ruler is a madman, but this is NOT the way to change
things.
Johnny Asia
Still shot from the video:
She appears to be holding something in her left hand when you zoom
in. She moves that hand near her face right before the blood appears.
She was supposedly shot through the heart, but the look on her face
seemed to be too calm and relaxed.
Johnny Asia
<chine...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>As your blood pressure drops, you can feel calm and relaxed as your brain begins
>to shut down. Your senses can shut down so there is no pain.
Johnny Asia
<engra...@mypacks.net> wrote:
>
>
>Still shot from the video:
>
>http://eur.news1.yimg.com/eur.yimg.com/xp/afpji/20090622/newsmlmmd.e00d0c23ad40a65b89c779242e6a525d.4915_a-screen-grab-taken-from-a-video-posted-on-youtubeb.jpg
>
>
> She appears to be holding something in her left hand when you zoom
>in. She moves that hand near her face right before the blood appears.
>
Later Monday at a press conference in Washington, the son of the late
shah of Iran, Reza Pahlavi, produced an image of the slain protester
from his pocket alongside pictures of his family.
"I have added her (Neda) to the list of my daughters. She is now
forever in my pocket," the former crown prince of Iran told AFP,
fighting back tears.
The people who originally posted the video on Youtube and Facebook
said Neda was shot by a pro-government militia member.
That information, like the fate and the identity of the young woman in
the video, cannot be independently verified.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20090622/wl_mideast_afp/iranviolencemedia_20090622194333
The person who initially posted the video online was Hamed Rad, an
Iranian living in the Netherlands who was sent the video by a friend
of his in Iran,
http://open.salon.com/blog/kathy_riordan/2009/06/20/her_name_was_neda
Johnny Asia
>Still shot from the video:
>
>http://eur.news1.yimg.com/eur.yimg.com/xp/afpji/20090622/newsmlmmd.e00d0c23ad40a65b89c779242e6a525d.4915_a-screen-grab-taken-from-a-video-posted-on-youtubeb.jpg
>
>
> She appears to be holding something in her left hand when you zoom
>in. She moves that hand near her face right before the blood appears.
Hmmmm, was it her father, or her music teacher in the video??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bWHT37pQmmE
Here in this Video you can see Neda and her father before she was shot
by the Basijis, the vido has not a good quality but she is obvious
near his father in Blue T-shirt .
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20090622/ts_nm/us_iran_election_176
Her fiance, Caspian Makan, told BBC Persian TV that the woman it
identified as Neda Agha-Soltan had been caught up accidentally in the
protests.
"She was near the area, a few streets away, from where the main
protests were taking place, near the Amir Abad area. She was with her
music teacher, sitting in a car and stuck in traffic," it quoted him
as saying.
"She was feeling very tired and very hot. She got out of the car for
just for a few minutes.
Johnny Asia
>>
>>Still shot from the video:
>>
>>http://eur.news1.yimg.com/eur.yimg.com/xp/afpji/20090622/newsmlmmd.e00d0c23ad40a65b89c779242e6a525d.4915_a-screen-grab-taken-from-a-video-posted-on-youtubeb.jpg
>>
>>
>> She appears to be holding something in her left hand when you zoom
>>in. She moves that hand near her face right before the blood appears.
>>
>
"She had said many times that if she had lost her life or been shot in
the heart,...."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/persian/iran/2009/06/090622_mm_neda_soltan.shtml
And the English translation of the interview:
Kasamin Makan, Neda Agha-Setan's fiancee, was interviewed by BBC
Persia, noting that Neda would have turned 27 this year. "Neda's goal
was not Mousavi or Ahmadinejad, it was her country and was important
for her to fight for this goal. She had said many times that if she
had lost her life or been shot in the heart, which indeed what
happened, it was important for her to continue in this path," he said.
Considering her young age she has taught a lesson to us all.
About the day of the incident, Mr. Makan said: "When the clashes were
occurring, Neda was far away from the demonstrations, she was in one
of the side alleys near Amir Abad. Thirsty and tired or being cooped
up for about an hour in the car in heavy traffic with her music
instructor, she finally gets out of the car and, based on the pictures
sent in by the people, armed forces in civilian clothes and the Basiji
targeted and shot her in the heart."
"It was over in a matter of minutes, the Shariati Hospital was nearby,
the people around her tried to bring her to the emergency room by car,
but before that could even happen she died in her instructor's arms."
Mr. Makan added: "We got her body back finally yesterday with some
diffculties. Of course, her body was not at the Tehran Coroner but at
a one outside of Tehran. The medical examiners
wanted parts of her body, including a portion of her femoral bone but
the chief medical examiner would not say why and no explanations were
ever given."
Finally the family consented just so they could get her body back as
soon as possible, since just this issue could have resulted in
delaying the reception of the body. We buried the body in a small area
in the Zahra Cemetery in the late afternoon of 31 Khordad. Also, they
had brought in other people who had been killed in the protests so it
seemed that the whole event was scheduled to be such."
About payment for releasing the remains, Mr. Makan had this to say:
"No specific amount has been paid at this time, although hospitals,
clinics, surgeons and medical examiners have been ordered by the
Iranian security services, based on various orders, not to list
'bullet wound' as the cause of death on the death certificate in order
to prevent the families from filing international complaints in the
future. I haven't seen the release notice of Neda's remains yet, but I
will obtain it from her father in the coming days."
No_He_Can_Not
> Still shot from the video:
>
> http://eur.news1.yimg.com/eur.yimg.com/xp/afpji/20090622/newsmlmmd.e00d0c23ad40a65b89c779242e6a525d.4915_a-screen-grab-taken-from-a-video-posted-on-youtubeb.jpg
>
>
> She appears to be holding something in her left hand when you zoom
> in. She moves that hand near her face right before the blood appears.
>
> She was supposedly shot through the heart, but the look on her face
> seemed to be too calm and relaxed.
>
>
>
>> http://www.islandcrisis.net/2009/06/neda-iran-video-photos-showing-police-killing/
>>
>>
>>
>> The Neda video is fake. Look at the vile of blood in her left hand,
>> she pours it and then moves her hand down.
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYr2_V6R2xM&NR=1
>>
>> Go to youtube and take a good look. it may take a few viewings to see
>> it.
>>
>> -----------
>>
>> feet before she ever falls down. (probably from video attempt #1) Then
>> there is a blood squirt from the mans hands. From a gunshot wound?
>> Through the shirt and the mans hands?
>>
>> Most obviously is people have blood come from their mouth because it
>> is in their lungs and they are trying to breath yet the wound seems to
>> be in her upper chest. It also only seeps like that from the mouth in
>> movies for dramatic effect. If she was trying to breathe it wounldn't
>> seep and if she was already dead it wouldn't back up through her
>> mouth.
>>
>> Everyone is going to rally behind this video and when people start
>> realizing it is fake it will discredit the movement. If they are lying
>> about this why believe them about the election?
>>
>> --------------------
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> At first, I believed the video did depict a "real" death. Now, I
>> notice that the girl "helped" lower herself to the ground with her
>> left hand?
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=related&v=WmS1Kk05VH4
>>
>> WAY! A person shot in the heart badly enough to cause death withing
>> two minutes (people have survived a gunshot wound to the heart) CANNOT
>> "help" lower themselves to the ground. Also, you can clearly see the
>> supposed to be unconscious. Where are the blood streaks caused from
>> dragged her over to the side of the road? She rolls her eyes back in
>> People don�t die, then close their own eyes, then die "again."
>>
>> The video is so fake. I don�t even believe them about the election
>> now. Yes, their ruler is a madman, but this is NOT the way to change
>> things.
>>
comes out her mouth and then guy gets in way and then blood all over her
face that looks like it was poured on there out of a squeez bottle
Doug Bashford
in alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,
In <781045lsim8jifi11...@4ax.com>
On Mon, 22 Jun 2009 18:26:29 -0400, Johnny Asia said about:
Re: Is the Neda video a fake???
>
> >Still shot from the video:
> >
> >http://eur.news1.yimg.com/eur.yimg.com/xp/afpji/20090622/newsmlmmd.e00d0c23ad40a65b89c779242e6a525d.4915_a-screen-grab-taken-from-a-video-posted-on-youtubeb.jpg
You get the same thing by repeatedly double clicking
the play-pause button. Nothing new.
At first it appears she is looking at the camera,
but the camera moves away, her eyes do not.
> > She appears to be holding something in her left hand when you zoom
> >in. She moves that hand near her face right before the blood appears.
Or nor. It's a mass of vagueness and blurs.
At no time is an object in her hand seen. Or not.
> Hmmmm, was it her father, or her music teacher in the video??
More important, does she like diet coke?
somebody said:
>*her head like she�s dead, then opens them, then rolls them back again.
>*People don�t die, then close their own eyes, then die "again."
And you know this because you are God?
...and you also know her eyes were not closed
for her?
>*The video is so fake. I don�t even believe them about the election
>*now. Yes, their ruler is a madman, but this is NOT the way to change
>*things.
Anybody that draws ANY conclusions from this
video is a fool. We don't even know if its real,
and if it is, who shot her, and why, or if
it was an accedent.
We know nothing.
One more thing. Propaganda is not usually to
win arguments, but to instil doubt.
Don't be a fool. We know nothing.
Wisdom from 1938:
"The liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people
tolerate the growth of private power to a point where
it becomes stronger than the democratic state itself.
> That in it's essence is fascism: ownership of the
government by an individual, by a group or any
controlling private powers."
-- Franklin Delano Roosevelt, message to congress,
proposing the "Standard Oil" Monopoly Investigation, 1938
* The insane twist the facts to fit their world view.
* The rational change their world view to fit the facts.
- "Fascism should more properly be called
- corporatism, since it is the merger
- of state and corporate power."
-- - Benito Mussolini, father of fascism.
Wikking
> in alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,
> In <781045lsim8jifi11...@4ax.com>
> On Mon, 22 Jun 2009 18:26:29 -0400, Johnny Asia said about:
> Re: Is the Neda video a fake???
>
>
>>
>>> Still shot from the video:
>>>
>>> http://eur.news1.yimg.com/eur.yimg.com/xp/afpji/20090622/newsmlmmd.e00d0c23ad40a65b89c779242e6a525d.4915_a-screen-grab-taken-from-a-video-posted-on-youtubeb.jpg
>
> You get the same thing by repeatedly double clicking
> the play-pause button. Nothing new.
> At first it appears she is looking at the camera,
> but the camera moves away, her eyes do not.
>
>>> She appears to be holding something in her left hand when you zoom
>>> in. She moves that hand near her face right before the blood appears.
>
> Or nor. It's a mass of vagueness and blurs.
> At no time is an object in her hand seen. Or not.
Are you fucking mad?
--
}(:
Note to Rightwing Extremists:
When you get to your new Gettysburg, don't expect Rush, Hannity,
Perry, Goldberg or O'Reilly to be on the field with you or leading
Pickett's Charge. They won't be. They will be way at the back out of
harm's way.
Progressive American
"Johnny Asia" <engra...@mypacks.net> wrote in message
news:2jsv351mc6am09hkb...@4ax.com...
>
>
> Still shot from the video:
>
> http://eur.news1.yimg.com/eur.yimg.com/xp/afpji/20090622/newsmlmmd.e00d0c23ad40a65b89c779242e6a525d.4915_a-screen-grab-taken-from-a-video-posted-on-youtubeb.jpg
>
>
> She appears to be holding something in her left hand when you zoom
> in. She moves that hand near her face right before the blood appears.
>
> She was supposedly shot through the heart, but the look on her face
> seemed to be too calm and relaxed.
People in shock display an unusual relaxed expression sometimes before
death.
5024 Dead, 157 since 1/20/09
> In article <2jsv351mc6am09hkb...@4ax.com>,
> Johnny Asia <engra...@mypacks.net> wrote:
>
>> She was supposedly shot through the heart, but the look on her face
>> seemed to be too calm and relaxed.
>
> As your blood pressure drops, you can feel calm and relaxed as your
> brain begins to shut down. Your senses can shut down so there is no
> pain.
Actually, the expression on her face is exactly that of a person in the
early stages of deep shock. It's pretty unlikely she was feeling any
pain, and given that within a minute she was dead, she probably never
did.
--
"Well I think that they say that Rush Limbaugh is the 800 lb. gorilla in
the Republican Party. But I think that's mean-spirited to say that. ...
Because, I think he's down to 650 lbs. I think one should be fair to him
about this whole thing." -- Arnold Schwarzenegger
--
"Well I think that they say that Rush Limbaugh is the 800 lb. gorilla in
the Republican Party. But I think that's mean-spirited to say that. ...
Because, I think he's down to 650 lbs. I think one should be fair to him
about this whole thing." -- Arnold Schwarzenegger
Ian B MacLure
[snip]
> She was supposedly shot through the heart, but the look on her face
> seemed to be too calm and relaxed.
Nice try Achhhhhhhhhmed.
Doesn't alter the facts though.
She ( whoever she was ) was murdered by the Ayatollahs.
Her blood is on their hands and they will pay.
IBM
Doug Bashford
in alt.fan.rush-limbaugh, Wikking said about:
> Doug Bashford wrote:
> > in alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,
> > On Mon, Johnny Asia said
> >>> Still shot from the video:
> >>>
> >>> http://eur.news1.yimg.com/eur.yimg.com/xp/afpji/20090622/newsmlmmd.e00d0c23ad40a65b89c779242e6a525d.4915_a-screen-grab-taken-from-a-video-posted-on-youtubeb.jpg
> >
> > You get the same thing by repeatedly double clicking
> > the play-pause button. Nothing new.
> > At first it appears she is looking at the camera,
> > but the camera moves away, her eyes do not.
> >
> >>> She appears to be holding something in her left hand when you zoom
> >>> in. She moves that hand near her face right before the blood appears.
> >
> > Or nor. It's a mass of vagueness and blurs.
> > At no time is an object in her hand seen. Or not.
>
> Are you fucking mad?
People see what they want or expect to see.
$20.00 for a still with a vial or other
large solid object in her hand from that video
at a critical "pour blood point" in time.
I think the best you will do is a white spot that
might be a painted thumb nail. Or not.
What i see is video that could be a fake. Or not.
I see things I have no answer for. Like duh.
So what? Am I god?
People really need to get out of football
mode here. TV detective. Neat & simple.
James Of Tucson
damnidunno .
she is falling.
i dunno
i would really like to believe that it is fake though.
Johnny Asia
She was shot from a rootop and by 2 guys on a motorcycle:
http://open.salon.com/blog/kathy_riordan/2009/06/20/her_name_was_neda#
I have received the following updated information regarding Neda and
have removed the age information from the article accordingly:
She has been shot on heart by 2 Basijies on a motor cycle while she
was behind of others and speaking on her mobile phone.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/blog/2009/jun/22/iran-ayatollah-ali-khamenei
2.45pm:
I've just spoken to Hamed, the YouTube user who posted the now iconic
film of Neda's death on to the network. Hamed is an asylum seeker in
Holland, he says the film was taken by a friend in Tehran whose
identity he has promised not to reveal.
There were reports that Neda was shot by someone on a motorbike,
Hamed's friend said she was shot from rooftop sniper. There were no
motorbikes around.
Kurt Nicklas
>
> She appears to be holding something in her left hand when you zoom
> in. She moves that hand near her face right before the blood appears.
There's nothing in her hands, you idiot.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mf1wroSx2Q8
> She was supposedly shot through the heart, but the look on her face
> seemed to be too calm and relaxed.
She's in shock, you boob.
-----------------------------------
"El Kabong" is "Johnny Asia"
"Johnny Asia" is this guy:
http://www.angelfire.com/art2/painterny/spirit_wizard.jpg
Does he look like someone you'd believe?
"Actually, for all intents and purposes, I am the goddamn Messiah!"
---- John Owings, AKA "Johnny Asia"
Steve
Actually, he looks (and reads) like someone who's done way too much
weed.
5024 Dead, 157 since 1/20/09
One reason I suspect it's real is that it doesn't follow a propagandistic
narrative. She wasn't "standing in front of government troops" or
anywhere near any. There's nothing to suggest that she was shot by
either side, and her own political stance apparently was neutral. She
was a non-participant who caught a stray bullet from somewhere.
If the video was political theater, there would have been more blood, she
would have been screaming, or at least wearing an expression of martyred
agony, and the camera would have caught nasty looking men with guns
looking on with satisfaction.
Johnny Asia
wrote:
>
> One reason I suspect it's real is that it doesn't follow a propagandistic
> narrative.
Here's the propaganda narrative:
He said he had asked her not to go out for fear she would be arrested
or shot.
"But she said that our attendance would be worthwhile even if a bullet
hits my heart," he said.
http://www.wtop.com/?nid=105&pid=0&sid=1701815&page=1
Caspian Makan, who identified himself as Soltan's boyfriend, told The
Associated Press in a telephone interview Monday that she was not a
part of any of the groups vying for power.
"She only ever said that she wanted one thing, she wanted democracy
and freedom for the people of Iran," Makan told a reporter in the Los
Angeles bureau of the AP.
Makan, a 37-year-old photojournalist in Tehran, said he met Soltan
several months ago on a trip outside the country, and provided
photographs of himself with a woman he identified as Soltan. It was
impossible to verify his statements independently because of reporting
strictures.
He said he had asked her not to go out for fear she would be arrested
or shot.
"But she said that our attendance would be worthwhile even if a bullet
hits my heart," he said. "Unfortunately, that is how she died, a
bullet hit her heart and her lung, and maybe 5 or 6 minutes later, she
died."
Johnny Asia
wrote:
If the video was political theater, there would have been more
blood,>>>
where did the pool of blood near her feet come from?
There's no blood on her pants
Steve
Just put down the joint and back away, you fruitcake
5011 Dead, 144 since 1/20/09
> On Jun 23, 11:04 am, "5024 Dead, 157 since 1/20/09" <d...@dead.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> If the video was political theater, there would have been more blood,>>>
>
>
> where did the pool of blood near her feet come from? There's no blood
> on her pants
That's immediately where she was standing when she was hit. Hydrostatic
sprayback.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYr2_V6R2xM&NR=1
>
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/huff-wires/20090622/ml-iran-election-icon/
images/04f93618-ba90-4477-a69f-c7679878d315.jpg
--
Pay your taxes so the rich don't have to
Doug Bashford
in alt.fan.rush-limbaugh, On Mon, 22 Jun 2009 16:44:21 -0400,
Johnny Asia said about:
>
> http://www.islandcrisis.net/2009/06/neda-iran-video-photos-showing-police-killing/
>
>
>
> The Neda video is fake. Look at the vile of blood in her left hand,
> she pours it and then moves her hand down.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYr2_V6R2xM&NR=1
>
Don't all you conspiracy nutz feel silly now?
Or did they bury a stuffed doll? (Next theory!!!)
Now might be a good time to review this thread
and turn it into a learning momemt.
Yeah, right.
Neda Soltani, young Iranian woman shot
www.examiner.com/x-7528-SF-Top-News-Examiner~y2009m6d23-Neda-Soltani-young-Iranian-woman-shot
Examiner.com - 8 minutes ago
- Amateur video of Neda Agha Soltani, young Iranian woman
lying in the street has quickly become an iconic image of the
country's opposition movement. 27 years old Neda was shot by a
Basij militia member as police in riot gear were breaking up a
public gathering of about 300 protesters.
he footage is less than a minute long and it captured the woman's
death moments after she was shot at a protest. The graphic video
shows blood streaming from Neda�s nose and mouth. The bloody
images of her death have unleashed a flood of outrage at the
regime's crackdown.
Thousands of people inside and outside Iran have written online
tributes to the Neda, many condemning the government and praising
her as a martyr.
Neda worked part-time at a travel agency in Iran and that the
government barred the family from holding a public funeral
Monday. The Iranian government has banned all public gatherings,
though there was no specific information about funerals for those
killed in recent clashes.
For more articles on this subject and more,
click on links below.
Iran�s opposition leader calls for more protests
Nude photos of Neda Agha Soltani
Video of Iran's power struggle behind the scenes
====
Iranian furor boils over as militia crack down on protests,
vigils ...
New York Daily News - Helen Kennedy - 7 hours ago
Makan told BBC Persia that Neda was hastily buried Sunday and the
government had barred her family from holding a public funeral.
"The authorities are aware ...
Neda Soltan (Girl Shot in Video) Denied Proper Funeral in Iran
Associated Content
IRAN: FUNERAL PROHIBITED FOR NEDA, DEMONSTRATION AT 4PM AGI -
Agenzia Giornalistica Italia
guardian.co.uk - The Associated Press
all 789 news articles �
========
in alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,
On Tue, 23 Jun 2009 06:54:27 GMT, Doug Bashford said about:
Re: Is the Neda video a fake???
>
> in alt.fan.rush-limbaugh, Wikking said about:
> Re: Is the Neda video a fake???
>
>
> > Doug Bashford wrote:
> > > in alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,
> > > On Mon, Johnny Asia said
..............snip
> > >>> She appears to be holding something in her left hand when you zoom
> > >>> in. She moves that hand near her face right before the blood appears.
> > > Or nor. It's a mass of vagueness and blurs.
> > > At no time is an object in her hand seen. Or not.
> >
> > Are you fucking mad?
> People see what they want or expect to see.
> $20.00 for a still with a vial or other
> large solid object in her hand from that video
> at a critical "pour blood point" in time.
>
> I think the best you will do is a white spot that
> might be a painted thumb nail. Or not.
>
> What i see is video that could be a fake. Or not.
> I see things I have no answer for. Like duh.
> So what? Am I god?
>
> People really need to get out of football
> mode here. TV detective. Neat & simple.
> > >> Hmmmm, was it her father, or her music teacher in the video??
> > >
> > > More important, does she like diet coke?
> > >
> > > somebody said:
> > >
> > >> *her head like she� � �s dead, then opens them, then rolls them back again.
> > >> *People don’t die, then close their own eyes, then die "again."
> > > And you know this because you are God?
..........
5011 Dead, 144 since 1/20/09
> On Jun 23, 11:04 am, "5024 Dead, 157 since 1/20/09" <d...@dead.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>> One reason I suspect it's real is that it doesn't follow a
>> propagandistic narrative.
>
>
> Here's the propaganda narrative:
>
> He said he had asked her not to go out for fear she would be arrested or
> shot.
>
> "But she said that our attendance would be worthwhile even if a bullet
> hits my heart," he said.
>
> http://www.wtop.com/?nid=105&pid=0&sid=1701815&page=1
Uh huh. Some guy calls in to the Republican leaning AP, says he's the
boy friend, and conjures up an amazingly prescient conversation, complete
with cloying references to peace and freedom for the Iraqi people.
Well, it's hardly a surprise that people are trying to exploit it any way
they can.
But I'm just answering whether it's real or not. Which means I'm just
talking about what I'm seeing on the videos.
>
>
> Caspian Makan, who identified himself as Soltan's boyfriend, told The
> Associated Press in a telephone interview Monday that she was not a part
> of any of the groups vying for power.
>
> "She only ever said that she wanted one thing, she wanted democracy and
> freedom for the people of Iran," Makan told a reporter in the Los
> Angeles bureau of the AP.
>
> Makan, a 37-year-old photojournalist in Tehran, said he met Soltan
> several months ago on a trip outside the country, and provided
> photographs of himself with a woman he identified as Soltan. It was
> impossible to verify his statements independently because of reporting
> strictures.
>
>
> He said he had asked her not to go out for fear she would be arrested or
> shot.
>
> "But she said that our attendance would be worthwhile even if a bullet
> hits my heart," he said. "Unfortunately, that is how she died, a bullet
> hit her heart and her lung, and maybe 5 or 6 minutes later, she died."
--
Doug Bashford
in alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,
On 23 Jun 2009 12:20:17 -0400, Steve said about:
Yep That really is bad logic: "If there is
something I don't understand, why, that's proof!"
The real world is very messy, that's what I meant
by: get out of TV detective mode. No instant
replays here, no simple solutions.
Now we know her death was not faked.
...or will they claim a doll was buried?
Another common error that propagandists use, is that
the uneducated assume that in Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan,
whatever, normal logic does not apply, anything
is possible. There would have been no such
conspiracy theory (this thread) if that video
was shot in Scranton or Kent State U, Ohio.
I say "the uneducated" because they have fallen
prey to the propagandists who have dehumanized them.
From subhumans, ANYTHING is possible. That's how
we were lied into war. ...our inabilty to find
WMD was PROOF they were hiding them!
But in reality, from which group is believing
ANYTHING, possible?
Don't be so eager to swallow.
Johnny Asia
<ze...@finestplanet.com> wrote:
>> where did the pool of blood near her feet come from? There's no blood
>> on her pants
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYr2_V6R2xM&NR=1
>
>That's immediately where she was standing when she was hit. Hydrostatic
>sprayback.
It sprayed out onto the ground without getting on her pants??
The "blood" on the gound looks too caked and dried, the whole thing,
from the bullet hitting her until her "death", lasted just 2 minutes,
according to the "witnesses".
mike18492
the ground+lack of blood on pants or shirt or even dripping from
her=giant bag of garbage. Look, if you even took remedial physics in
high school, then you know it's just not possible to have a pool of
blood like that, in the way she's "falling" and not have any on
running straight down, the way gravity intended.
On Jun 23, 1:37 pm, Johnny Asia <engram52...@mypacks.net> wrote:
> On Tue, 23 Jun 2009 11:28:16 -0500, "5011 Dead, 144 since 1/20/09"
>
> <ze...@finestplanet.com> wrote:
> >> where did the pool of blood near her feet come from? There's no blood
> >> on her pants
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYr2_V6R2xM&NR=1
>
> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/huff-wires/20090622/ml-iran-election-ic...
Steve
...and the black helicopters keep coming...
>Don't be so eager to swallow.
>
Don't be so eager to inhale...
5024 Dead, 157 since 1/20/09
> Look, I'm not a dem or a rep, but he had it right, pool of blood on the
> ground+lack of blood on pants or shirt or even dripping from her=giant
> bag of garbage. Look, if you even took remedial physics in high school,
> then you know it's just not possible to have a pool of blood like that,
> in the way she's "falling" and not have any on running straight down,
> the way gravity intended.
Actually, I -have- taken physics, and what I can see in that video is
consistent. The blood on the ground was a hydrostatic "splash" from
where the bullet first struck her. The bullet looks like it would have
destroyed her inferior vena cava, which means the heart would have
nothing to pump. It also opened her esophagus, and with the lungs still
functioning, she would have aspirated blood, which is why her face was
covered in it. So after the initial impact, there would have been no
blood coming out of the entry wound, beyond a tickle as she fell, and
once fallen, gravity would have played no role in it.
Marie
> http://www.islandcrisis.net/2009/06/neda-iran-video-photos-showing-po...
>
> TheNedavideo isfake. Look at the vile of blood in her left hand,
> she pours it and then moves her hand down.
I don't think so. I tried doing it and only ended up coughing
up the mess that went inside my nose.
Here is a photo of a poor young man that was also hit in the chest
during
WWII. I suggest you download it and zoom it:
Notice that he was hit on the upper chest. Pretend to place the heel
of your hands
on his wound. You will notice that your hands will be exactly where
the hands placed
on Neda's chest were--very close to the neck.
It's clear that the medic tried to do something. The man's jacket is
open. The blood looks fresh.
However, notice the soldier's nose and mouth--blood spews out his nose
and mouth. His eyes are rolled
upward and to the side.
If you notice the picture of Nada with her face shown in pools of
blood you will notice a similar pattern.
Blood pours out of her nose and mouth but doesn't join together. It
does pool together but only where
gravity goes. Her left eye is actually open. Anyone pouring anything
on her left eye would have left it closed
as the eye muscles would instinctively blink.
From my experiments and observations, here is what I have concluded:
The video is real and not fake. There was no pouring of any blood
fake or not.
Why do I think that?
1. Gagging, coughing (instant gag and head reflex) while I poured
fake blood lying down.
2. The dead soldier with an almost identically placed wound with
similar patterns to that of Neda's.
3. Neda's left eye is open. No way that anyone with "paint" or fake
blood can keep their eye open
without blinking instinctively.
I wondered why blood left her nose and mouth so rapidly. Well,
it would seem that chest compression (like the medic did with the
soldier) would result in blood pouring out in mass amounts.
James Of Tucson
up to you to prove she's alive.
Steve
Here's an idea.. how about if all you amateur Kojak Loons just shut
up.
Johnny Asia
Have you all seen the wierd murder video on youtube made in 2006,
produced by NEDA SOLTANI, Directed by NEDA SOLTANI
Video is called: Blind Beauty It is the story of the murder of a blind
girl.
Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYpmk2qkGeg
One thing that really hit me in the Blind Beauty video are the eyes at
the beginning. They reminded me so much of the eyes on the NEDA murder
video and how they turned upward to look right at the camera when she
supposedly died.
I saved the video in case it disappears.
Marie
There are a lot of Neda Soltani's in the world. Just google it and
you will see.
One more thing about the dying process. When I worked as a
bereavement counselor
for Lifepath Hospice in Tampa, I witnessed a man in a hospital who was
just dying from
AIDS. I entered the room. His mother was stroking his head and
crying.
The man's eyes had rolled to the side and were open. I honestly
thought he wasn't dead.
He looked so alive because his eyes were opened. However, what
finally convinced me
that he was dead--in some awful way--is that his stare didn't move.
His eyes just stared
into nothing.
Neda's death certainly wasn't faked. I have seen those eyes with my
own--staring blankly
into a semi-conscious state. She seemed alive, as the man who died of
AIDS did,
but the stare is semi-hollow. Neda's left eye was pooled with blood
and stayed open.
Her face doesn't show any grimace. No way. Take some tomato sauce and
try that.
Just pour the sauce into your left eye and lay there on the floor with
a towel underneath you.
Keep your eye open. You can't. Neda's eye stayed open because she
was already dead.
I poured tomato sauce into my nose laying flat on the floor and the
first thing I did was sit
upward and cough the junk that went down my nasal cavity right up.
Neda doesn't move.
Neda was in the process of dying. There was nothing fake about that
or the young soldier who
showed the same bloody facial pattern and blank stare.
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/210/441531595_04c7aa5b19.jpg
Notice that the man doesn't really look dead. Neither does Neda.
Neither did the man who died of AIDS in the hospital I went to
in Tampa.
Johnny Asia
wrote:
>
>There are a lot of Neda Soltani's in the world. Just google it and
>you will see.
Ok, I just did. I looked through several pages and only found the one
Neda
Marie
> On Tue, 23 Jun 2009 16:29:13 -0700 (PDT), Marie <ane...@verizon.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> >There are a lot of Neda Soltani's in the world. Just google it and
> >you will see.
>
> Ok, I just did. I looked through several pages and only found the one
> Neda
>
http://www.scialert.net/qredirect.php?doi=jbs.2007.931.936&linkid=pdf
http://www.linkedin.com/pub/dir/neda/soltani
https://listserv.heanet.ie/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0210&L=algae-l&D=0&T=0&P=460
http://www.larch.ir/pg/profile/neda_soltani1983
http://en.octopop.com/nini13137
Before her murder there were many Neda Soltani's who were different
people.
Obviously Google now ranks pages with the murdered woman in front
ranks.
Johnny Asia
sack of potaoes and not act like in hollywood action movies, which is
being thrown backwards 5-10 yards.
Yes thats consistent with what you can see on the Juba clips and
similar video from Iraq: They fall down the very instant they are hit.
Its like all muscles stop functioning due to the immense trauma caused
by the high velocity rifle bullet.
Thats another thing that makes this Neda video look fishy: She doesn�t
fall like a sack of potatoes. Infact when the video starts she is
still standing, and the two guys have just started lowering her to the
ground. If you watch carefully you can see her helping them with her
left arm! She is supporting herself with the left as they lower her to
the ground.
This, together with the fact that nobody panics/runs after a bullet
has just hit someone no more than 10m away makes me think that its
fake. What are these people doing there??? A sniper is shooting at the
crowd and a bullet has hit a woman just 10m away. Yet they stand/walk
relaxed and calmly. And to top it all off, two guys get their
cellphones out, head for the woman and start filming her� yeah sure.
The only thing that made me think this vid is real at first is the
blood coming out of her nose. How did they fake that. Spitting up a
mouthful of fake blood is no big deal but how did they make the nose
bleeding?
When you watch carefully tough you can see her raise her left arm and
use some syringe-type of object with a white tip. Its clearly visible
for a split second. As sh
Johnny Asia
>
What is Neda holding in her left hand?
http://www.angelfire.com/art2/painterny/johnny/neda_left_hand.jpg
Here's the original
http://eur.news1.yimg.com/eur.yimg.com/xp/afpji/20090622/newsmlmmd.e00d0c23ad40a65b89c779242e6a525d.4915_a-screen-grab-taken-from-a-video-posted-on-youtubeb.jpg
and how is she able to hold that arm up and move it near her face,
around the 10 second mark on this video,
immediately before the blood appears on her face
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYr2_V6R2xM&NR=1
How is she keeping her knees bent, after getting shot by a high
powered rilfe?
Marie
> What is Neda holding in her left hand?
http://www.angelfire.com/art2/painterny/johnny/neda_left_hand.jpg
Well, she's wearing a musician's black "cape." My guess, since there
is a bend
in the material from end to end, is that she is wearing a musician's
hand guard, probably made
of black or dark green cloth. If you will turn the phot above so that
her face is upright,
you will notice that the piece of material goes *around* her hand.
Notice at the right bend that it is flat.
No go down a wrist a bit and see that there are *two straps* that hold
the hand guard. To me,
it looks like a homemade guard. Notice in the upright pircutre that
the so-called "vial" is twisted
like a wad of cloth. If she had fake blood soaked in a a pad, she
would have had to have a lot more
in it than was shown on her face and even more for the mysterious last
gush (the last gush which no one
explains).
Here is a leather sampling of musician's hand guards. Again, I believe
that she is wearing a homemade one:
http://www.hamilton-musical-repairs.com/Images/HandGuards.jpg
She is wearing a musician's outfit, hence the long length of the black
overcoat.
She was with her music teacher.
> and how is she able to hold that arm up and move it near her face,
> around the 10 second mark on this video,
> immediately before the blood appears on her face
It's not a vial; it's a piece of cloth wrapped around the upper palm
of her hands, and
held together with two wrist straps.
> How is she keeping her knees bent, after getting shot by a high
> powered rilfe?
I don't see her moving her hand. There's no evidence either way. If
she
is moving her hand, there's no squirting of any mysterious vial and no
half
pint of blood soaked in a cloth band .
She's not "keeping" her knees bent. They are bent because the soles of
her feet
are planted. Actually, they sort of straddle a bit. She is not
keeping them in place.
I feel sorry for her teacher, but I believe she was dead or at least
in a coma
much earlier than he suggested. I believe she went out about a few
seconds after the blood
gushed out. He vena cava was probably punctured, and her heart was no
longer pumping blood.
They just did what the medics did to the poor GI who got hit also in
the chest--pumped
the pulmonary arterial blood that was left right out of her nose and
mouth.
Fenderbass
the video than at the middle? I think that was probably from another
take (the one that had the blood on the ground in the first place).
I am not joking, watch the video, her face is almost entirely covered
with blood mid video and at the end it is just lines of stream from
the nose and mouth.
Fake. Period.
Marie
The man in front with the white shirt took his hands and wiped the
blood
away from her face. You can see it in the correct photo
(don't want to bother to provide a link). Her hair
becomes drenched after her face was wiped off. It was dark hair,
but you can see that it is drenched in her blood. She also had her
head turned
to the right.
She's dead. The mullahs cannot grab her and show what a hypocrite
she is in front of the world for one reason: she is dead. Don't you
think
that they would never, ever put up with a phony martyr, complete with
internet
photos provided by her family, to show the world how evil they are?
She will have been paraded in front of the infamous "retribution
courts"
coming up soon and complete with kangaroo justice meted out. I bet
you a million dollars Neda won't show up.
That's because she has been 12 feet underground
since last Sunday. Some of us don't want to believe she is dead
the same reason why people don't want to believe Elvis is dead: Neda
was exceptionally beautiful and quite young. In essence, and with
all
due respect to her memory, she was someone to look at more than once.
Mysterious vials of blood--killed by the BBC--even killed by the CIA.
These stories are getting more absurd by the minute.
Marie
He out his hand print on her face. He was the one who started
to clean up her face. He started by cleaning her nose and spreading
the blood apart. Then he put his hand on her head and turned it to
the left.
The palm print is proof. The blood spread to the sides, mostly the
left.
I have hair that is Neda's shade so I easily know that the sides are
drenched in blood.
Also notice that her right ear is pooled with blood.
The most important thing I recommend you do is to zoom the image and
watch
her eyes. I have seen these eyes in photos of dead WWII servicemen,
since WWII
is a hobby of mine. Those eyes are eyes of a person who is dead. It
is sad that she is
gone and understandable that some of us don't want to believe it.
There have been internet reports of Neda sightings here and there.
Add to that Elvis,
Hitler (after WWII), JFK Jr., Marilyn Monroe, JFK, and a lot of other
people.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/39786559@N04/
Who wants to bet me at least a hundred bucks that the mullahs won't
find, arrest, and
try Neda in their upcoming courts of retribution before the world to
see?
Johnny Asia
Is the Neda Soltan Video a Fake? Gary Trieste thinks it�s 85% probable
http://www.nolanchart.com/article6565.html
June 24, 2009
Was the Neda Agha-Soltan video a Hoax?
A few humble observations, and a few impertinent questions.
by Gary Trieste
(libertarian)
Wednesday, June 24, 2009
As I see it, there truly are a series of misconnects, non-sequitors,
inconsistencies, and not-quite-right factoids surrounding the videos
and backstory accompanying them.
To start off, there is what appears to be two different Nedas (photos
of two different women supposedly her), and (currently) a question of
any independent source identifying Neda as a real person.
Then, Neda was said to have been shot by a member of the Basij, an
officially sanctioned vigilante organization.
And yet, as they are not police or military, most Basiji are not
permitted to carry firearms except for special requirements and when
not in actual combat?
And then, why would they pick out a non-protesting woman, 1km from
where the protests were occuring, just stepping out of a car for a few
minutes. And, how did anyone even know it was a Basiji, since it was
claimed to be from a unseen sniper on an adjacent building.
Moving now to the video . . .
For the massive injury she supposedly sustained, a direct bullet shot
to the center of her chest, I have to wonder, where is all the blood
that would be coming from her torso or her back onto the ground, it
should have been everywhere, including the spot where they are trying
to give her CPR, all over their hands and her clothing, and a huge
pool on the ground. Yet the only pool of blood appears to be at her
feet before she falls down.
Then, most curious . . .
Shortly into the video, we see blood coming from her mouth. She is not
sputtering it out, or coughing it up, as in an inability to breathe.
Rather it appears rapidly and self flowing, and runs down both sides
of her mouth, almost exclusively. Her center teeth aren�t even
stained.
Shortly thereafter blood appears to pour out her right nostril . . .
Looking carefully in the video, it appears that both the mouth and
nostril bleed occurs right after a hand is seen pushing up onto or
into them.
These flow patterns appear more to be from a blood bladder timed for
rupture when the camera was in the correct position. And the nose
bleed appears only after what appears to be a rapid slight-of-hand
insertion of blood into her nose.
Conveniently, an anonymous doctor was on hand to provide the CPR, and
to try to save her life, provide credible medical testimony, then
disappear from the scene.
Now I am nitpicking, but this video was supposedly shot with a
cellphone videocam. It really seems a bit too high quality for that,
more like a DV camcorder.
And then, there is the almost too perfect backstory of Neda, preceding
the shooting and in preparation to go to the protests - her supposed
repeated prescient commentary about any danger there, was a flippant
�Don�t worry. It�s just one bullet and it�s over�, and that �Neda had
said that even if she lost her life and got a bullet in her heart, she
would carry on�.
Of course, we find out that she was not really political and had no
intention of active protesting, only that she was passionate about the
honesty of the election process, and wanted to be there to see. Her
fiancee said she �studied philosophy, music and tourism, was not
political�, i.e. principled, but thoroughly inoffensive.
Then on followup, there is the extreme rapid nature of her burial; no
wake, or prefuneral proceedings, no Imam attending, or even
pictures/video of that proceeding?
We now hear unsubstantiated reports that the Iranian government has
banned any memorials or gatherings in her name, which conveniently
explains why there is a dearth of public involvement in her very
public death.
I don�t want to bust anyone�s bubble, but there seems to be too many
�just right� elements to this story.
The Iranian government crackdown on foreign media reporting to the
rest of the world, and curtailment of phone services and internet
access, provides a ripe environment for just this kind of staged
tragedy. All news coming from Iran is from amateur on-the-street
participants.
The mass media, starving for news, and implicitly antipathetic toward
the Iranian regime for their actions, snatched up this story and ran
with it. It was just too good not to be true.
My oddsmaker assessment, 15% likely true, 85% likely hoax or staged.
Marie
I figured that her family was going to be harassed, but only because
they wanted
no one to make a pilgrimage to see a martyr. How did this British
reporter get to
talk to her family's neighbors? I assume that he was called by
another Iranian reporter.
As far as the BBC killing her--hilarious!
El Kabong
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jun/24/neda-soltan-iran-family-f...
>
The Guardian was unable to contact the family directly to confirm if
they had been forced to leave.
Johnny Asia
Version 1:
"Her fiance Caspian Makan told BBC Persian TV that Neda Agha-Soltan
had been caught up accidentally in the protests."
http://www.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idUSTRE55F54520090623?sp=true
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/LL104015.htm
"Her fiance Caspian Makan told BBC Persian TV that Neda Agha-Soltan
had been caught up accidentally in the protests.
"She was near the area, a few streets away, from where the main
protests were taking place, near the Amir Abad area. She was with her
music teacher, sitting in a car and stuck in traffic," it quoted him
as saying. "She was feeling very tired and very hot. She got out of
the car for just a few minutes."
Version 2:
"Makan said that they had argued in the days before her death about
her decision to attend the protests.
He said he had asked her not to go out for fear she would be arrested
or shot. "I tried to dissuade her from going out in the streets"
http://www.dailymail.com/ap/ApTopStories/200906220738
Monday June 22, 2009
Man: Woman killed in Iran protests wanted freedom
SHAYA TAYEFE MOHAJER
Associated Press Writer
Makan, a 37-year-old photojournalist in Tehran, said he met the
27-year-old music student several months ago on a trip outside the
country. The AP was unable to verify his statements independently
because of reporting strictures.
Makan said that they had argued in the days before her death about her
decision to attend the protests, which were part of the self-described
"green wave" movement that claims hardline President Mahmoud
Ahmadinejad stole his June 12 re-election.
He said he had asked her not to go out for fear she would be arrested
or shot. "I tried to dissuade her from going out in the streets
because I'd seen in my work as a journalist that, unfortunately, there
are a lot of merciless behaviors," Makan said.
"But she said that our attendance would be worthwhile even if a bullet
hits my heart," he said. "Unfortunately, that is how she died, a
bullet hit her heart and her lung, and maybe 5 or 6 minutes later, she
died."
Internet accounts say that Soltan's father was at her side during her
death. But Makan said a white-haired man who is seen pressing on her
chest in the video and repeatedly saying "don't be afraid, Neda dear,
don't be afraid" was actually her music teacher.
She'd grown dissatisfied with her theology studies and had taken up
music, as a pianist, he said.
They first met on a vacation in Izmir, Turkey, a town on the
Mediterranean, on a vacation tour from Iran.
Johnny Asia
"Mr Panahi said that he heard a distant crack and saw Miss Soltan
instantly collapse to the ground."
So, he saw her "instantly collapse to the ground", yet the video
shows him helping her to the ground:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYr2_V6R2xM&NR=1
From Times Online
From Times Online
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article6561253.ece
The attempted crackdown came as friends present as Miss Soltan died
came forward to detail what happened.
Hamid Panahi, her friend and music teacher, told the Los Angeles Times
how Miss Soltan was shot as they and two others were making their way
to a demonstration in Freedom Square in central Tehran. Their car
became stuck in traffic on Karegar Street and they got out for some
air.
Mr Panahi said that he heard a distant crack and saw Miss Soltan
instantly collapse to the ground.
"We were stuck in traffic and we got out and stood to watch and,
without her throwing a rock or anything, they shot her," he said. "It
was just one bullet."
He later heard other witnesses claiming that the gunman was not a
police officer but one of a group of plainclothes officials or Basiji
militia.
jim
believe that people aren't crticising it. It's frightening when the
whole world acts like they are swayed by this movie, when there are
obvious suspicious characteristics about it - particularly the two
below. So, why does likely faked footage like this pervade the media
and seem to be permitted to have such powerful influence on national
and internation opinion?:
Third Video?
I think the issue about the authenticity is connected with how people
view the validity of the video. When this first hit the news (google
news), the first video clips I saw showed Neda fully standing with the
wound right below her throat. She was standing straight up, and people
were looking at her, and at the red wound she had (and no sound of gun-
shot). So, now that it's getting so much coverage, the obvious
question I'm asking, is where is the original clip I saw? It gives the
impression that it's been edited out of the clip, which leaves the
question - why was it edited out in something so high-profile? And
where was the camera pointing before it was on her?
Bottle of Ketchup?
Ok, I don't want to be a pain here, but look at the hands of the
people moving up to her face before the blood comes out. On the
LiveLeak video, it doesn't seem as clear (for some reason, the YouTube
video shows it clearer). Look closely at the guy in the blue/white
striped shirt between seconds 9 - 12. Notice the bottle he is holding
in his hands (resemembling a bottle of ketchup - not saying it is
ketchup)? He puts it close to her face, and the blood appears. It's
very clear when you look at it. These two things -- the missing part
of the video I saw originally when she was standing, and the obvious
red bottle held to her face by the guy in the blue/white shirt during
seconds 9 - 12 -- make it very sad to me indeed that there is little
or no criticism of the validity of this video either here in
Wikipedia, or in the media.
Johnny Asia
ANOTHER inconsistency:
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article6562649.ece
From Times Online
June 23, 2009
Neda Salehi Agha Soltan
- She died on the way to Shariati hospital
http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/world/2009/0624/1224249417475.html
" I am a doctor, so I rushed to try to save her. But the impact of
the gunshot was so fierce that the bullet had blasted inside the
victim�s chest, and she died in less than a minute."
John Black
@mypacks.net says...
> I?m sorry but its fake and a bad one. There is a ton of blood at her
> feet before she ever falls down. (probably from video attempt #1) Then
> there is a blood squirt from the mans hands. From a gunshot wound?
> Through the shirt and the mans hands?
Enough is enough. I've grown weary over the years of left wing fools and
their idiodic conspiracy theories. 9/11 was an inside job. Bush stole Ohio
with Diebold fraud. Bush cheated in debates with wires running around his
clothing. The CIA started AIDS to kill black people. The CIA keeps blacks
and poor people drugged up. The Bush administration destroyed the levies in
New Orleans to kill black people and destroy their homes. Republicans
control (worldwide) oil and gas prices to manipulate elections. Rumors of
Bill Clinton's affairs were a "vast right wing conspiracy". Exxon
conspiracies. Haliburton conspiracies. Federal Reserve conspiracies. And
now a poor girl who gets shot in Iran was a fake conspiracy. Enough
already. You people aren't funny anymore...
John Black
philip_s
"John Black" <jbl...@texas.net> wrote in message
news:MPG.24aee8f03...@news.motzarella.org...
Enough is enough. I've grown weary over the years of right-winged morons
like you who keep your head buried in the sand and look to others for news
of the outside world. Yea, some of what you mentioned is ridiculous
conspiracy stuff. But Johnny Asia is a spammer. And most likely a republican
shill pretending to be something else. Kooks occupy positions on BOTH sides
of the fence. If you cannot admit that reality, yours is a hopeless cause.
But some of it isn't conspiracy nonsense. Instead of looking at the facts,
you'd rather believe what someone making money off of you tells you to
believe.
I know it's a difficult thing to do, to admit that you elected the morons
that got us to where we are today. If you really believe that two years of a
democratic congress and five months of a democratic president got us to
where we are now, you're beyond hope.
Doug Bashford
in alt.fan.rush-limbaugh,
On Wed, 24 Jun 2009, Johnny Asia said about:
> The victim hit by a high powered rifle will basically drop like a
> sack of potaoes and not act like in hollywood action movies, which is
> being thrown backwards 5-10 yards.
>
>
>
>
> Yes thats consistent with what you can see on the Juba clips and
> similar video from Iraq: They fall down the very instant they are hit.
> Its like all muscles stop functioning due to the immense trauma caused
> by the high velocity rifle bullet.
That's not what the police think. Police think people
fall down when they are shot because that what people
do when people get shot according to Hollywood.
There are infinite number of exceptions to that rule,
typically when the person shot was doing exceptional
things or was under an adrenaline rush, or never
knew he was shot. ...they keep on going.
According to the police and FBI, the only way to
reliably drop somebody with one shot is brain or
upper spine for an instant kill, or heart complex
or liver for a very fast bleed out.
Gun size and stopping power?
The old theory of hydrostatic shock as stopping
power has lost much favor. Today, it's all about
wound channel size, mostly depth.
The old clasic deer hunting shot, profile thru heart
shoulders and lungs gets a classic response from the deer,
which I have seen. It jumps strieght up, then sprints
about 25 - 50 yds, and dies in the deep bushes.
You track it from the lung spray droplets, find it dead.
You get wound confirmation when you dress the deer.
The new clasic deer hunting shot is to the rear
a bit to avoid the heart.
>
> Thats another thing that makes this Neda video look fishy: She doesn�t
> fall like a sack of potatoes. Infact when the video starts she is
> still standing, and the two guys have just started lowering her to the
> ground. If you watch carefully you can see her helping them with her
> left arm! She is supporting herself with the left as they lower her to
> the ground.
I don't find that the least bit surprising.
A heart shot is NOT instant death, no matter
what Hollywood says. But unconsciousness due
to bleedout is often within seconds, not minutes,
depending on damage. But there are as many exceptions
to ALL these "rules," as life is complex. For
example, shock, which is unpredictable. And damage.
And mind set, drugs, etc........
Getting shot is like a box of chocolots....
>
> This, together with the fact that nobody panics/runs after a bullet
> has just hit someone no more than 10m away makes me think that its
> fake. What are these people doing there??? A sniper is shooting at the
> crowd and a bullet has hit a woman just 10m away. Yet they stand/walk
> relaxed and calmly. And to top it all off, two guys get their
> cellphones out, head for the woman and start filming her� yeah sure.
You just about know aeverything, don'cha?
I sometimes wonder what it would be like
to live in such a simple, orderly world
that I knew everything about.
>
> The only thing that made me think this vid is real at first is the
> blood coming out of her nose. How did they fake that. Spitting up a
> mouthful of fake blood is no big deal but how did they make the nose
> bleeding?
>
> When you watch carefully tough you can see her raise her left arm and
> use some syringe-type of object with a white tip. Its clearly visible
> for a split second.
Like said a few days ago, $20 for a still
of that, from the video.
Governor Swill
>I didn't want to believe it was a fake, but now I don't want to
>believe that people aren't crticising it. It's frightening when the
>whole world acts like they are swayed by this movie, when there are
>obvious suspicious characteristics about it - particularly the two
>below. So, why does likely faked footage like this pervade the media
>and seem to be permitted to have such powerful influence on national
>and internation opinion?:
You think the Neda vid is a fake? Really?
*plonk*
Swill
--
"Obama is not some infallible chocolate Jesus.
That's Kanye West you're thinking of." -- Bill Maher
Governor Swill
>Obviously Google now ranks pages with the murdered woman in front
>ranks.
Google ranks pages based on what's being searched for and hit. There's
only one Neda the world is searching the net for.