Newsgroups: talk.origins
From: steve...@altavista.com (Steven J.)
Date: Sun, 6 Apr 2003 02:43:38 +0000 (UTC)
Local: Sat, Apr 5 2003 9:43 pm
Subject: Re: Intelligen Design
Glenn <gshel...@qwest.net> wrote in message <news:3E8F2388.80900@qwest.net>... Let me restate my position. One recognizes "design" not by > Steven J. wrote: -- [snip] > > The "design hypothesis" need not protect itself from falsification by > EH?? The "identity" of a designer is not necessary, nor are the identifying "irreducibly complexity" or "specified complexity," but by recognizing similarities to things known to be designed, in structure, composition and methods of construction, and purpose. To take Paley's famous watch example, he could tell that the watch has gears and springs, because he recognized them as members of known classes of manufactured items. He recognized that it told time, because he already had the concept of telling time. Whether he understood either how these gears and springs told time, or how they were manufactured, is another question. At the low extreme of complexity, one recognizes the crudest stone tools of early hominids because they show the sorts of chips we recognize as the results of human manipulation. Design is recognized by analogy with the work of known and observed designers. This applies, of course, to SETI as well -- the search for Now, ID proponents argue that SCI can be recognized because no natural > > That is, they have no idea how their proposed explanation is supposed > All I know is that I'm not taking your word for this. _Darwin on Trial_ , Behe's _Darwin's Black Box_, and quite a few other books, the author deals with some variant of the "panda's thumb" argument that the sort of design we see in living things is *not* the sort of design we would expect from any observed sort of intelligent designer. The response is invariably that this is a theological, not scientific, position -- that we aren't entitled to any assumptions about how the Designer would work. But if we aren't entitled to any assumptions about how the Designer would work, we surely can't make any predictions about what design will and will not look like. Therefore we can't tell design from the results of unknown, but unintelligent, causes -- or, indeed, from the results of known unintelligent causes (maybe the Designer crafts each snowflake individually and intelligently -- how would we ever know otherwise?). > > ID theory predicts *nothing* except that there will be aspects of > Unlike what Ho and Sanders claim "But a real synthesis should begin mechanisms with which to explain this or that aspect of design. Its flaws do not include finding one purpose or technique for design, and using it to explain the bacterial flagellum, while seizing on a different sort of design for a completely different purpose to explain the immune system. It does not seek mechanisms or explanations for anything at all, or make predictions detailed enough that it needs to rescue them with _ad hoc_ explanations. Rather, it simply argues that this, and that, and some other thing can't be explained in perfect detail by current models, so "theDesignerdidit" (in some unspecified manner, at some unspecified time, for some unspecified purpose) is somehow a superior explanation. -- Steven J. You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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