No Atheist can answer it
Awais Nazir
material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
ten thousand years ago.
Earth is 4-billion years old, as uranium-dating proves.
Reason 1: Humans are clever, they don't take tens of thousands of
years to develop scientifically, thus it also flaws the current
perception that humanity genes are stable for atleast past two hundred
thousand years ago.
Reason 2: a simple human intelligence can produce pottery, they should
have been well a few hundred thousand years ago. But we do not find
Pottery before ten-thousand years ago.
Reason 3: Archeology record suggests agriculture to come into scene in
just last ten thousand years, (Is human as dumb that for tens of
thousands of years they were just hunting?). Intuition says that if
there would be a first society, then it would be both hunters/farmers.
If Archeology says that agriculture started about ten-thousand years
ago, then humanity should have come about ten-thousand years ago, on
Earth.
Reason 4: Archeologists find that organised housed suddenly appeared
about ten thousand years ago, (Are humans dumb enough, that they lived
for tens of thousands of years just roaming the earth, without proper
place to settle).
Reason 5: First chinese writing came in about 1500 BC, and that first
American writing came in about 800 BC by the Zapotec people, first
Egypt writing came in about 3100 BC, (Are humans that dumb, that they
never wrote the previous socalled many tens of thousands of years).
These dates show that, the first humans should come about 10-thousand
years ago, so that they gain enough population/experience to
effectively run the commerce/government through writing.
Reason 6: Geneticists had mathematically proved that, the human gene
is stable for twenty million years into future! with current mutation
rates. Now the question is: how can a socalled series of evolution
from last couple of hundred of thousands of years, from ape to man
halt abruptly for next 20 million years?. (Monkey to man is a great
socalled leap forward in genes. Genes are so so so stable that we can
find even today the species which also existed billions of years old
in fossil records; we are making a very big statement when we say that
monkey gene became human gene in a couple of tens of thousands of
years).
Reason 7: The mesopotamian scientific trend occured about twenty-
seventh century BC, of Greece about third century BC, of Muslim about
tenth century AD, of European about Sixteenth Century BC. What rule
joins them? every next trend occured after a previous one, nearly
after half the time period between previous two trends. For example,
Meso-Greece period in 25 centuries, Greece-Muslim period is twelve and
half centuries, muslim-european period is about six centuries, and so
next trend should occur at about three centuries latter from sixteenth
centures, ie ninteenth century (which is the American Science Period).
If I call the first Science Period as Adamic, then Adamic SP should
occur about 7700 BC (approx. 8000 BC), i.e. about ten-thousand years
ago. Conclusion: The first Science Period was Adamic and it occurred
about 8000 BC. (Anthropologists suggest that the current humans, i.e.
homo-sapians, were existant on earth for atleast 200 thousand years,
according to their calculations; thus, the intelligence which humans
currently possess, was with humans for atleast 200 thousand years.
But, humanity would be colonizing other galaxies, had it been of the
age of 200 thousand years.). Humans are not dumb that they take many
tens of thousands of years to develop population/scientifically.
Reason 8: Summerian and Egyptian Civilizations started about 3500 BC;
Indus and Minoan and Akkadian and Andes Cvilisations started about
2500 BC; Chinese Civilization started about 2200 BC; doesn't it all
hint: if it took 5000-years for human to develop from past Egyptian
civilization to the development that is now, then about 5000-thousand
years should have took from a first human pair to develop into
Egyptian civilization, totalling 10-thousand years of human existence
on earth, (It is as evident as is sun).
Reason 9: Now, Pyramids as in Egypt/Amerindian can exist for many ten-
thousands of years. If humanity has an age of more than ten-thousand
years, then it can safely be argued that there should exist similar
more societies like Egyptian/Amerindian, and thus a multitude of
pyramids covering the earth, each showing its history; but we can't
find such sustaining structures as pyramids preceding the time about
3-4 thousand years ago. This all shows that, no bias: Egyptian/
Amerindian were the first to make Pyramids, if humanity was more than
ten-thousand years in age then similar pyramids should have been found
but there exist none, thus humanity can't be more than ten-thousand
years in age; no bias: God is needed to create the intelligent
creature as a human. (It is not that Stone structures before 10-
thousand years decayed, because stone/bone/fossils can date millions/
billions of years).
It may be argued that ice-age thawed about ten-thousand years ago, and
that's why one saw agriculture/etc thriving after it, (but equator
never faced the bitter of ice, so civilization should have continued
at equator, nullifying the previous argument).
God modified the mamal gene to make human. Proof? Appendix has no work
in humans, but still exists, but is required in many other mammals.
Also, sea-plant is almost 85% human gene.
The skelatons we find toaday of so-called prehumans are actually
monkeys.
The rate of the human growing has not been constant, the rate is much
higher now because of advanced medical facilities. So, if we take this
rate as constant, then this is not the right approach.
Now, there are two things, wars and famines. Which of them puts an
upper limit to the human population? Inconclusively, it is famine, not
war. Reason: war was almost common throughout the world, but famine
was more widespread in places where there is less vegetation; So,
India/China are majors in population not because they faced less wars
in past, but that they had less famines, compared to other
countries.Conclusion: wars don't diminish the human population, if it
does then it is immediately healed, but that food limits the human
population. So, we can't say that it were cannibals in past that is
why it took humanity many tens of thousands of years to develop
population/scientifically.
If incest continues of 8 generations, then the people becomes
different from eachother, as if they belong to different races. I will
not say Incest, but that different places shut people off from
eachother, and they became different after some generations. The Black
in Africa, and Blond is Sweden, occurred, because a Blond in Africa
died an early death due to ultra-violet sun ray harm, and same for the
Balck in Sweden where it died of lack of Vitamin-D.
Anti-thesis: human beings can't be from this earth, because about ten-
thousand years ago, sudden intelligence came on the surface of Earth.
So, what if Aliens came to earth about ten-thousand years ago, now
called as humans? It is very less probable, because why aliens came
not in the 4-billion history of earth and only in last ten-thousand
years? Also, Aliens most probably had to die because they are not
immune to earthly bectarias/etc. This is just one INDIRECT EVIDENCE.
There are many such other Indirect evidences at my website, www.awais-nazir.biz.
Despite the fact that I had proved the landing of Adam on Earth, ten-
thousand years ago, current Science has difficulty accepting it,
because, it then has to accept the existance of God.
Atheists say that this world is by chance; Well, what if, god intended
this world to appear as such, for some reason?
Conclusion: if this was the only INDIRECT EVIDENCE, then I would have
neglected it, but there are a host of such INDIRECT EVIDENCES
reinforcing eachother, and thus can't be ignored, especially when
chapters 5, 8, and 9 provides the evidence of the DIRECT INTERVENTION
by God.
reference: www.awais-nazir.biz
raven1
<waqas....@gmail.com> wrote:
No sane person, whether atheist or theist, can answer this incoherent
rant, because we don't speak "raving loon".
Sanity's Little Helper
913fbf...@m73g2000hsh.googlegroups.com to alt.atheism on 28 Apr 2008:
> Atheists say that this world is by chance; Well, what if, god intended
> this world to appear as such, for some reason?
OTOH, which is a damn sight more likely, what if Usenet is full of fundy
and apologetic dickheads who have overestimated their own IQ by at least
100 points?
--
David Silverman
aa #2208
Defender of Civilisation
Lord Mayor of Dis
Lawful copyright holder of the term "Earthquack".
Not authentic without this signature.
Llanzlan Klazmon
> I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> ten thousand years ago.
Wrong. The native Australians were on that continent at least forty
thousand years for a start. Even North America has had human
inhabitants for at least twelve thousand years. This is shown by
carbon dating. I note below that you accept isochron and condordia-
discordia methods of dating as you mention uranium dating below.
Humans have been around for about a hundred thousand years but the
numbers were relatively small living in hunter gatherer groups as was
happening until quite recent times (and still do in a few isolated
areas). We nearly went extinct at one stage as genetic evidence shows
a bottleneck of a few thousand individuals at seventy thousand years
ago.
>
> Earth is 4-billion years old, as uranium-dating proves.
>
> Reason 1: Humans are clever, they don't take tens of thousands of
> years to develop scientifically, thus it also flaws the current
> perception that humanity genes are stable for atleast past two hundred
> thousand years ago.
Some humans hadn't even discovered agriculture right up to the present
time. The evidence shows that human numbers increased fairly rapidly
at the end of the last ice age around twelve thousand years ago most
likely because of favourable climate.Two or three thousand years after
that there are signs of the first agriculture - rice growing in China.
<Rest of nonsense snipped>
chazwin
> I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> ten thousand years ago.
>
> Earth is 4-billion years old, as uranium-dating proves.
>
> Reason 1: Humans are clever, they don't take tens of thousands of
> years to develop scientifically, thus it also flaws the current
> perception that humanity genes are stable for atleast past two hundred
> thousand years ago.
Exactly the same science that determines the age of the earth as aged
mankind at least 100,000 years old. There were many ancestors of the
anatomically modern humans of 100,000 years and they go back at least
4 million years.
The rest of this statement reflects your lack of education.
>
> Reason 2: a simple human intelligence can produce pottery, they should
> have been well a few hundred thousand years ago. But we do not find
> Pottery before ten-thousand years ago.
The pre-Neolithic epochs are characterised by mobile populations of
pastoralist and hunter/gatherers. Pottery is too heavy to be really
useful and these communities carried their things in bags made of
skin.
>
> Reason 3: Archeology record suggests agriculture to come into scene in
> just last ten thousand years, (Is human as dumb that for tens of
> thousands of years they were just hunting?). Intuition says that if
> there would be a first society, then it would be both hunters/farmers.
> If Archeology says that agriculture started about ten-thousand years
> ago, then humanity should have come about ten-thousand years ago, on
> Earth.
For hundreds of thousands of years humans hunted and gathered all they
needed. Making permanent settlements and planting crops was their
first big mistake. Once you plant a seed you have to protect it, this
involves the invention of the idea of property, property leads to
arguments over rights to land and this leads to war. War requires
organisation, and this leads to so-called civilisation. This requires
leadership, heirarchy and expoitation and slavery.
>
> Reason 4: Archeologists find that organised housed suddenly appeared
> about ten thousand years ago, (Are humans dumb enough, that they lived
> for tens of thousands of years just roaming the earth, without proper
> place to settle).
There are many examples of paleolithic dwellings and mesolithic
dwellings. You are ignorant.
>
> Reason 5: First chinese writing came in about 1500 BC, and that first
> American writing came in about 800 BC by the Zapotec people, first
> Egypt writing came in about 3100 BC, (Are humans that dumb, that they
> never wrote the previous socalled many tens of thousands of years).
> These dates show that, the first humans should come about 10-thousand
> years ago, so that they gain enough population/experience to
> effectively run the commerce/government through writing.
So what? the art work in the cave painting in Europe dated to around
30000bc demonstrate an eye for beauty and aesthetic expression
unparalleled in Europe until the Iron age.
>
> Reason 6: Geneticists had mathematically proved that, the human gene
> is stable for twenty million years into future! with current mutation
> rates. Now the question is: how can a socalled series of evolution
> from last couple of hundred of thousands of years, from ape to man
> halt abruptly for next 20 million years?. (Monkey to man is a great
> socalled leap forward in genes. Genes are so so so stable that we can
> find even today the species which also existed billions of years old
> in fossil records; we are making a very big statement when we say that
> monkey gene became human gene in a couple of tens of thousands of
> years).
Complete bullshit. No one can "prove" the future. You are a dip-shit.
Rest of bullshit snipped
Christopher A. Lee
<waqas....@gmail.com> wrote:
>I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
>material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
>ten thousand years ago.
What is it with you morons?
MarkA
> I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> ten thousand years ago.
>
On the off chance you should wake up one morning embarrassed by your
profound ignorance, pick up a copy of "Guns, Germs, and Steel", by Jared
Diamond. He provides a comprehensive look at many of the points you raise
about the dynamics of early civilizations.
--
MarkA
Keeper of Things Put There Only Just The Night Before
About eight o'clock
DanielSan
> I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> ten thousand years ago.
That's not true.
>
> Earth is 4-billion years old, as uranium-dating proves.
>
> Reason 1: Humans are clever, they don't take tens of thousands of
> years to develop scientifically, thus it also flaws the current
> perception that humanity genes are stable for atleast past two hundred
> thousand years ago.
Science is not that important when you're hunting to survive. You just
need to know how to kill your game, not the physics behind it.
>
> Reason 2: a simple human intelligence can produce pottery, they should
> have been well a few hundred thousand years ago. But we do not find
> Pottery before ten-thousand years ago.
Why? They had no need for pottery if they were nomads.
>
> Reason 3: Archeology record suggests agriculture to come into scene in
> just last ten thousand years, (Is human as dumb that for tens of
> thousands of years they were just hunting?). Intuition says that if
> there would be a first society, then it would be both hunters/farmers.
> If Archeology says that agriculture started about ten-thousand years
> ago, then humanity should have come about ten-thousand years ago, on
> Earth.
Intuition? Based on that?
>
> Reason 4: Archeologists find that organised housed suddenly appeared
> about ten thousand years ago, (Are humans dumb enough, that they lived
> for tens of thousands of years just roaming the earth, without proper
> place to settle).
Being nomads is "dumb"? You go to the food. Also, can you cite this
"suddenly appeared" for us?
>
> Reason 5: First chinese writing came in about 1500 BC, and that first
> American writing came in about 800 BC by the Zapotec people, first
> Egypt writing came in about 3100 BC, (Are humans that dumb, that they
> never wrote the previous socalled many tens of thousands of years).
Why do you keep saying "dumb"?
> These dates show that, the first humans should come about 10-thousand
> years ago, so that they gain enough population/experience to
> effectively run the commerce/government through writing.
There was no need to write things down if they remained in small groups
and could communicate verbally.
>
> Reason 6: Geneticists had mathematically proved that, the human gene
> is stable for twenty million years into future! with current mutation
> rates. Now the question is: how can a socalled series of evolution
> from last couple of hundred of thousands of years, from ape to man
> halt abruptly for next 20 million years?. (Monkey to man is a great
> socalled leap forward in genes.
Yep. And no one but creationists suggest that we came from monkeys.
> Genes are so so so stable that we can
> find even today the species which also existed billions of years old
> in fossil records; we are making a very big statement when we say that
> monkey gene became human gene in a couple of tens of thousands of
> years).
Can you explain what you mean by "stable" genes? Also, the monkey gene
did not become the human gene. Where ARE you getting that?
>
> Reason 7: The mesopotamian scientific trend occured about twenty-
> seventh century BC, of Greece about third century BC, of Muslim about
> tenth century AD, of European about Sixteenth Century BC. What rule
> joins them? every next trend occured after a previous one, nearly
> after half the time period between previous two trends. For example,
> Meso-Greece period in 25 centuries, Greece-Muslim period is twelve and
> half centuries, muslim-european period is about six centuries, and so
> next trend should occur at about three centuries latter from sixteenth
> centures, ie ninteenth century (which is the American Science Period).
> If I call the first Science Period as Adamic, then Adamic SP should
> occur about 7700 BC (approx. 8000 BC), i.e. about ten-thousand years
> ago. Conclusion: The first Science Period was Adamic and it occurred
> about 8000 BC. (Anthropologists suggest that the current humans, i.e.
> homo-sapians, were existant on earth for atleast 200 thousand years,
> according to their calculations; thus, the intelligence which humans
> currently possess, was with humans for atleast 200 thousand years.
> But, humanity would be colonizing other galaxies, had it been of the
> age of 200 thousand years.). Humans are not dumb that they take many
> tens of thousands of years to develop population/scientifically.
Let me know why you insist on using the word "dumb".
<I'm going to snip down to here because it's more of the same>
>
> Atheists say that this world is by chance; Well, what if, god intended
> this world to appear as such, for some reason?
This is NOT a world by chance. And what is your evidence that God did
as you suggest?
>
> Conclusion: if this was the only INDIRECT EVIDENCE, then I would have
> neglected it, but there are a host of such INDIRECT EVIDENCES
> reinforcing eachother, and thus can't be ignored, especially when
> chapters 5, 8, and 9 provides the evidence of the DIRECT INTERVENTION
> by God.
>
Actually, it shows nothing of the sort. You're working backwards in an
attempt at getting at the goal. Start at the beginning and go forward.
And stop using the word "dumb".
Richo
> I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> ten thousand years ago.
>
Humans have been anatomically modern for that long.
> Earth is 4-billion years old, as uranium-dating proves.
>
> Reason 1: Humans are clever, they don't take tens of thousands of
> years to develop scientifically, thus it also flaws the current
> perception that humanity genes are stable for atleast past two hundred
> thousand years ago.
>
The people of outback australia or the jungles of the Amazon are
clever - but they never developed writing. Knowledge is passed on
grandfather/grandmother/ father mother to the child.
Knowledge is about survival - how to get food how to make a spear or a
knife or a fish trap.
If you don't think these people are clever you try surviving a month
in their world without their skills and knowledge.
> Reason 2: a simple human intelligence can produce pottery, they should
> have been well a few hundred thousand years ago. But we do not find
> Pottery before ten-thousand years ago.
>
Australian aborigines dont make pottery.
They can make spears and boomerangs - can you?
> Reason 3: Archeology record suggests agriculture to come into scene in
> just last ten thousand years, (Is human as dumb that for tens of
> thousands of years they were just hunting?). Intuition says that if
> there would be a first society, then it would be both hunters/farmers.
Hunter gatherers teach their children to survive and they teach their
children to survive.
Its very hard to change - so change comes slowly and only when it fits
into what you are already doing.
Agriculture requires a settled life - and hunter gatheres had learned
to follow the food - the game animals and the seasonal fruit.
You cant change your way of life quickly - you have this brilliant
idea "lets plant the seeds and wait for food to grow!
How many of the tribe are going to stay with you and hope the seeds
sprout? How many are going to move like their father and grandfather
have taught them?
> If Archeology says that agriculture started about ten-thousand years
> ago, then humanity should have come about ten-thousand years ago, on
> Earth.
>
The Hunter gatherers are as human as you or I. They developed a way of
life that fitted with what was possible - the swith from gathering
seeds to deliberately planting them was a slow change.
People who dont listen to their elders and learn the ways of the tribe
end up dead - you need a very very good reason to change.
Perhaps a settled agricultural life was attempted many many times
before it succeeded.
> Reason 4: Archeologists find that organised housed suddenly appeared
> about ten thousand years ago, (Are humans dumb enough, that they lived
> for tens of thousands of years just roaming the earth, without proper
> place to settle).
>
Its not dumb - they lived and survived - houses followed agriculture.
Why put enormous time and effort into building a house if you move
every few weeks to follow the food.
Think man, think!
> Reason 5: First chinese writing came in about 1500 BC, and that first
> American writing came in about 800 BC by the Zapotec people, first
> Egypt writing came in about 3100 BC, (Are humans that dumb, that they
> never wrote the previous socalled many tens of thousands of years).
> These dates show that, the first humans should come about 10-thousand
> years ago, so that they gain enough population/experience to
> effectively run the commerce/government through writing.
>
The invention of writing is a very non obvious thing - it becomes
possible after a settled agricultural society develops - but is of no
use to hunter gatherers.
It needs a critical mass of people - who are not spending all day
finding enough food for themselves just to survive.
> Reason 6: Geneticists had mathematically proved that, the human gene
> is stable for twenty million years into future! with current mutation
> rates.
I dont believe that is true - the human genome is changing.
> Now the question is: how can a socalled series of evolution
> from last couple of hundred of thousands of years, from ape to man
> halt abruptly for next 20 million years?.
I dont believe it is true.
Why do you think it is?
> (Monkey to man is a great
> socalled leap forward in genes. Genes are so so so stable that we can
> find even today the species which also existed billions of years old
> in fossil records; we are making a very big statement when we say that
> monkey gene became human gene in a couple of tens of thousands of
> years).
>
Sometimes evolution is slow sometimes rapid. Many of our ancestors
went through tough times - "bottlenecks" when there were very few
survivors - this is conducive to either extinction or rapid evolution.
Obviously we survived.
> Reason 7: The mesopotamian scientific trend occured about twenty-
> seventh century BC, of Greece about third century BC, of Muslim about
> tenth century AD, of European about Sixteenth Century BC. What rule
> joins them? every next trend occured after a previous one, nearly
> after half the time period between previous two trends. For example,
> Meso-Greece period in 25 centuries, Greece-Muslim period is twelve and
> half centuries, muslim-european period is about six centuries, and so
> next trend should occur at about three centuries latter from sixteenth
> centures, ie ninteenth century (which is the American Science Period).
> If I call the first Science Period as Adamic, then Adamic SP should
> occur about 7700 BC (approx. 8000 BC), i.e. about ten-thousand years
> ago. Conclusion: The first Science Period was Adamic and it occurred
> about 8000 BC. (Anthropologists suggest that the current humans, i.e.
> homo-sapians, were existant on earth for atleast 200 thousand years,
> according to their calculations; thus, the intelligence which humans
> currently possess, was with humans for atleast 200 thousand years.
> But, humanity would be colonizing other galaxies, had it been of the
> age of 200 thousand years.). Humans are not dumb that they take many
> tens of thousands of years to develop population/scientifically.
>
Not dumb.
Try and survive naked in the Amazon or the Australian outback for two
months.
You would die - you lack the knowledge and skills that these people
pass down father to son.
What to eat, how to hunt, when to hunt, where to hunt, how to make a
knife, a spear...
which fruits to eat, which are poison ...
The equator lacks the plants and animals that can be domesticated.
Read Jarred Diamond's "Guns Germs and Steel"
It is a most brilliant explanation of all your questions.
It took a remarkable amount of fortuitous circumstances for the people
of middle east and asia to become civilized - it was not inevitable. A
coincidence of geography and biology and good luck.
Read it - I promise it will open your eyes to many things.
Cheers, Mark.
Hatter
> Reason 2: a simple human intelligence can produce pottery, they should
> have been well a few hundred thousand years ago. But we do not find
> Pottery before ten-thousand years ago.
>
Venus of Dolni Věstonice 34000 to 25000 BC....it took me less than 2
minutes to just randomly find an error....if something this easily
checked is found to be incorrect, why should we trust anything else
you say?
There is none, because you are wrong.
Hatter
Enkidu
> I don't know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> ten thousand years ago.
Yet they made it to North America not less than 14,000 years ago.
You lose.
--
Enkidu AA#2165
EAC Chaplain and ordained minister,
ULC, Modesto, CA
A mystic is someone who wants to understand the universe, but is too lazy
to study physics.
-- Josef Balluch
Geoff
theist answer this?
dieHard
<waqas....@gmail.com> wrote:
<snip>
>
>Atheists say that this world is by chance; Well, what if, god intended
>this world to appear as such, for some reason?
>
>Conclusion: if this was the only INDIRECT EVIDENCE, then I would have
>neglected it, but there are a host of such INDIRECT EVIDENCES
>reinforcing eachother, and thus can't be ignored, especially when
>chapters 5, 8, and 9 provides the evidence of the DIRECT INTERVENTION
>by God.
>
>
>reference: www.awais-nazir.biz
conclusion:
the only possible explanation then is that some magical sky-pixie
clapped his hands, waved the magic wand, chanted the secret password
three times while clicking his ruby slippers together and poof!
people.
wow. <slapping forehead> how could I have missed that?
who can argue with logic like that?
Richard Anacker
Richo schrieb:
> If you don't think these people are clever you try surviving a month
> in their world without their skills and knowledge.
Uh, don't they have McDumb out there? Must be a godless region.^^
richie
--
Good, Fast, Cheap: Pick any two
duke
>Been looking for gods for 10k years. No word from the big guy yet. Why can't
>theist answer this?
I talk to God every day.
duke, American-American
*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****
Thurisaz, Germanic barbarian
Oh what I'd be willing to pay for a morontheist at least making some _new_
claim...
--
"To his friend a man a friend shall prove, and gifts with gifts requite;
But men shall mocking with mockery answer, and fraud with falsehood meet."
(The Poetic Edda)
Must have been written with fundies in mind...
My personal judgment of monotheism:
http://www.carcosa.de/nojebus
dieHard
>On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 09:38:22 -0400, "Geoff" <geb...@yahoo.nospam.com> wrote:
>
>>Been looking for gods for 10k years. No word from the big guy yet. Why can't
>>theist answer this?
>
>I talk to God every day.
>
I talk to my Chevy every day.
which one of us is more nuts?
Hatter
> On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 11:06:55 -0500, duke <duckgumb...@cox.net> wrote:
> >On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 09:38:22 -0400, "Geoff" <geb...@yahoo.nospam.com> wrote:
>
> >>Been looking for gods for 10k years. No word from the big guy yet. Why can't
> >>theist answer this?
>
> >I talk to God every day.
>
> I talk to my Chevy every day.
>
> which one of us is more nuts?
I could actually see and touch a Chevy so.......
Hatter
John Locke
<waqas....@gmail.com> wrote:
> The skelatons we find toaday of so-called prehumans are actually
> monkeys.
>
No. They are not. That's a fact. Our ancestors, such as Lucy, were
apelike in some respects but walked upright and had human like teeth
and skulls. We did not evolve from monkeys but we do share a common
ancestry.
"It is far better to grasp the Universe
as it really is than to persist in delusion,
however satisfying and reassuring." - Carl Sagan
James Beck
@cox.net says...
> On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 09:38:22 -0400, "Geoff" <geb...@yahoo.nospam.com> wrote:
>
> >Been looking for gods for 10k years. No word from the big guy yet. Why can't
> >theist answer this?
>
> I talk to God every day.
Kids leave teeth for the Tooth Fairy, makes about as much sense.
catbr...@yahoo.com
> I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> ten thousand years ago.
You start off with an unfounded assumption, that humans are the only
intelligent species to evolve on this planet. You can't know such a
thing.
Then you add something that is patently untrue, that humans have only
been around for ten thousand years.
If your initial premise is incorrect, nothing that follows is
relevant.
Cat
Geoff
> On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 09:38:22 -0400, "Geoff" <geb...@yahoo.nospam.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Been looking for gods for 10k years. No word from the big guy yet.
>> Why can't theist answer this?
>
> I talk to God every day.
Hallucinations aside.
Ben Kaufman
wrote:
>I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
>material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
>ten thousand years ago.
<SNIP>
Absolutely false. Humans have been around for over ten fold that t time. No
point in reading any further.
Ben
pba...@worldonline.nl
OK God made the world but didn't want us to know.
So let's make him happy and believe his setup!
If an omnipotent God exists who wants me to believe in him, I would
I don't for he doesn't!
Peter van Velzen
April 2008
Amstelveen
The Netherlands
Ben Kaufman
Actually, there is, it's called the NNTP end of text marker. :-)
Ben
Brian E. Clark
4ax.com>, Christopher A. Lee said...
> >I don?t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> >material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> >ten thousand years ago.
>
> What is it with you morons?
We're getting hit especially hard with nonsense this
week, for some reason. Perhaps someone accidentally
shut off the power to the electric fence at the Idiot
Farm?
--
-----------
Brian E. Clark
Brian E. Clark
@m73g2000hsh.googlegroups.com>, Awais Nazir said...
> Atheists say that this world is by chance; Well, what if, god intended
> this world to appear as such, for some reason?
Actually, I submit that alt.atheism regular
Christopher A. Lee created the world two days ago; he
just made the earth look old. His reasons are known
only to him.
There is not the slightest substantive difference
between my conjecture and yours.
*nemo*
> I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> ten thousand years ago.
>
BTW, your info on the date that humans developed is rather out of whack
with currently known evidence. Seriously, dude... stop embarrassing
yourself. And consider it a lucky thing that we don't look at you and
say "HA! There's proof that all Muslims are ignorant nitwits!"
panam...@hotmail.com
> I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> ten thousand years ago.
Incorrect.
http://www.geneticorigins.org/mito/intro.html
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2005/02/050223122209.htm
Perhaps all of your questions would be answered if you attempted to
cure your ignorance first.
-Panama Floyd, Atlanta.
aa#2015/KoBAAWA!
Bill M
"duke" <duckg...@cox.net> wrote in message
news:kgtb14l1te1ksu0rl...@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 09:38:22 -0400, "Geoff" <geb...@yahoo.nospam.com>
> wrote:
>
>>Been looking for gods for 10k years. No word from the big guy yet. Why
>>can't
>>theist answer this?
>
> I talk to God every day.
Does he listen and reply??? There are hundreds of psychiaric patients that
talk to there god every day.
Does this make it relaity?
David V.
> I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
Where's this question that no Atheist has been able to answer?
--
Dave
You measure a democracy by the freedom it gives its dissidents,
not the freedom it gives its assimilated conformists.
- Abbie Hoffman
DanielSan
At least we can test and verify that your Chevy exists...
DanielSan
Actually, more sense as there is physical proof that one action will
lead to another (tooth under the pillow = money in the morning). I
don't know of anything similar with God.
Preventer of Work
> I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> ten thousand years ago.
>
Sounds more like a scientology angle you have going there.
Nobody is orignial anymore.
Ben Goren
> Geoff wrote:
>
>> Been looking for gods for 10k years. No word from the big guy
>> yet. Why can't theist answer this?
>
> I talk to God every day.
Liar. I just asked my cat, and she says she's you've never /ever/
spoken to her.
And a damned good thing that is, too. I don't want you anywhere
near her.
Cheers,
b&
--
EAC Memographer
BAAWA Knight of Blasphemy
``All but God can prove this sentence true.''
----== Posted via Pronews.Com - Unlimited-Unrestricted-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.pronews.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups
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Awais Nazir
> On Apr 28, 7:38 pm, Awais Nazir <waqas.fah...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> > material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> > ten thousand years ago.
>
> thousand years for a start. Even North America has had human
> inhabitants for at least twelve thousand years. This is shown by
> carbon dating. I note below that you accept isochron and condordia-
> discordia methods of dating as you mention uranium dating below.
> Humans have been around for about a hundred thousand years but the
> numbers were relatively small living in hunter gatherer groups as was
> happening until quite recent times (and still do in a few isolated
> areas). We nearly went extinct at one stage as genetic evidence shows
> a bottleneck of a few thousand individuals at seventy thousand years
> ago.
>
>
>
> > Earth is 4-billion years old, as uranium-dating proves.
>
> > Reason 1: Humans are clever, they don't take tens of thousands of
> > years to develop scientifically, thus it also flaws the current
> > perception that humanity genes are stable for atleast past two hundred
> > thousand years ago.
>
> time. The evidence shows that human numbers increased fairly rapidly
> at the end of the last ice age around twelve thousand years ago most
> likely because of favourable climate.Two or three thousand years after
> that there are signs of the first agriculture - rice growing in China.
>
> <Rest of nonsense snipped>
or rather archeologists have mistaken the bones of monkeys (and there
are many many species among them) for humans.
Awais Nazir
> Been looking for gods for 10k years.Noword from the big guy yet. Whycan't
> theistanswerthis?
the answer is that: GOD COMMUNICATED THE HUMANITY THROUGH HIS
MESSENGERS INCLUDING MOSES/JESUS/MUHAMMAD.
Charles & Mambo Duckman
>>Been looking for gods for 10k years.Noword from the big guy yet. Whycan't
>>theistanswerthis?
>
>
> the answer is that: GOD COMMUNICATED THE HUMANITY THROUGH HIS
> MESSENGERS INCLUDING MOSES/JESUS/MUHAMMAD.
OK, we're all so impressed with your belief. As a matter of fact, as soon as
I'm done circumcising myself, I am running as fast as I can to the nearest
mosque to convert, that's how convincing your arguments were.
And now, since your work here is done, please be so kind as to piss off.
--
Come down off the cross
We can use the wood
Tom Waits, Come On Up To The House
Awais Nazir
(www.awais-nazir.biz).
>
> OK God made the world but didn't want us to know.
> So let's make him happy and believe his setup!
>
> If an omnipotent God exists who wants me to believe in him, I would
> I don't for he doesn't!
>
> Peter van Velzen
> April 2008
> Amstelveen
> The Netherlands- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
Christopher A. Lee
<waqas....@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Some humans hadn't even discovered agriculture right up to the present
>> time. The evidence shows that human numbers increased fairly rapidly
>> at the end of the last ice age around twelve thousand years ago most
>> likely because of favourable climate.Two or three thousand years after
>> that there are signs of the first agriculture - rice growing in China.
>>
>> <Rest of nonsense snipped>
>
>or rather archeologists have mistaken the bones of monkeys (and there
>are many many species among them) for humans.
Idiot.
Christopher A. Lee
PROVE IT, IN-YOUR-FACE, PIG-IGNORANT, QUESTION-BEGGING WORSHIPPER OF A
PEDOPHILE CAMEL-FUCKER.
David Flechard
> Atheists say that this world is by chance;
Actually, they don't.
--
David Flechard
Ben Kaufman
wrote:
>On Apr 28, 4:04 pm, Llanzlan Klazmon <bill.m.tho...@gmail.com> wrote:
Of course, you must surely be more experienced in the archeological sciences
than the vast majority of all the archaeologists who are only in it for the fun
and travel (wink, wink, nod, nod).
Ben
Ben Kaufman
wrote:
>On Apr 28, 6:38 pm, "Geoff" <geb...@yahoo.nospam.com> wrote:
I suggest you consider that if there was a God it actually communicated through
Darwin because Darwin figured out the game plan.
Ben
James Beck
@z72g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>, waqas....@gmail.com says...
> God is actively communicating with us through messengership,
And you can tell his messengers by their tin beanies.
Awais Nazir
> On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 23:05:22 -0700 (PDT), Awais Nazir
>
> >On Apr 28, 6:38 pm, "Geoff" <geb...@yahoo.nospam.com> wrote:
> >> Been looking for gods for 10k years.Noword from the big guy yet. Whycan't
> >> theistanswerthis?
>
> >MESSENGERS INCLUDING MOSES/JESUS/MUHAMMAD.
>
> PROVE IT, IN-YOUR-FACE, PIG-IGNORANT, QUESTION-BEGGING WORSHIPPER OF A
> PEDOPHILE CAMEL-FUCKER.
DEFINITION OF MESSENGERSHIP: Well, if Hindu/Parsi/Bible/etc scriptures
describe Muhammad in such a detail as naming him and his parents, and
also his native place, AND not only one past scripture but ALL major
scriptures of the past say such, etc., because all those major
Scriptures were revealed by the same source - God - but after each's
CORRUPTION then God send new messengership to replace the previous
Messengership; This Messengership sounds an impossibility except ONE
source God is sending there messengers. Surely, this can't be a
coincidence, given the human ego such that even if there is the truth
in front of him, human ego will not accept it, how come all the main
religions of world despite human ego foretold the comming of Muhammad,
and told their followers to follow Muhammad, in very clear words?
MESSENGERSHIP PROVES UNSEEN: Hence Muhammad is proved, so do previous
mesengers, including Jesus/Moses, so do God, so do Paradise and Hell,
so do Angels, so do Bible/Quran themselves, so do Life after Death or
Fate or Day of Resurrection, and all othe matters of the unseen, and
all what Muhammadan Islam say, in short: Belief Is No More A Blind
Belief! So, we can now say with proof, that God organized organic
evolution, or the Universe Creation, and that they were not the chance
creation. Note thE, miracles done by Jesus/Muhammad/etc can't be
proved directly, we can't know even if Jesus was real/figurative
figure, BUT Messengership. What thing, "Messengership" don't prove?
MUHAMMADAN ISLAM REPLACES PREVIOUS MESSENGERSHIPS: Secondary proof, as
previously, proved only that God existed, but they couldn't prove that
is that God really interested in us, and if he is, the how? Saying
that Muhammadan Islam say that God is Absolute is no proof, because
Judaism/Orthodox-Christianity/etc also say similar, also, what if God
himself wanted to eat/die/etc. as in hinduism/etc.? If God himself
wanted it, then no-one could deny him also; Messengership comes to
rescue here also: it proves that why only Muhammadan Islam is true,
and it says that, other major religions were true in their own times
in past.
MESSENGERSHIP CREATES HARMONY/COMMON-GROUND: The added advantage, of
Messengership, is that: Messengership propagate the unity/harmony of
religions/humanity in practial terms, thus, Hinduism/Jewish/etc. are
nothing but sent from the same source, only to be revived by latter
Messengership, once contradictions crept into them. Yet another
advantage is that: even, Budhist, Hindu, Jewish/Christian, scriptures
foretold their abrogation on the coming of Muhammadan scripture, so
all the complexity is reduced in one step.
Now, I can say, that God intended Messengership as an Absolute proof,
not the Science, as an authenticity-badge for the Muhammadan Islam.
Quran.2.35-39 implies that, when God expelled the first man from
Paradise to Earth, God intended only messengership, as a source of
guidance, not any thing else (e.g. science/logic/etc.) as the prove
that the particular message is really from God.
Quran.2.164 implies that God will not punish (nearly Eternal Hell),
when the person has not known THE messengership, of his time, and that
"nature signs" makes meaning only after "messengership".
Bible originals exist today, they blong to the time "before the time
of Muhammad", as the Carbon Dating of them proves.
Thus, if those original Bible didn't existed from the time "time
before Muhammad", then this "messengership" section of my Diary, would
be mere fake, because a doubt of uncertainity is inserted in it, what
if muslims had changed the bible for their bias?
If the KJV Bible don't suffice one, then he can always cross-check
them with the original bible manuscripts.
Though I haven't studies Parsi scriptures in detail, but a cursory
glance led me to the following prophesy about Muhammad.
In Dasatir 14 (Sasan11) we can find a very clear prophesy of Muhammad
(pbuh):
"When the Persians should sink so low in morality, a man will be born
in Arabia whose followers will upset their throne, religion and
everything. The mighty stiff-necked ones of Persia will be
overpowered. The house which was built (The Kaaba in Makkah built by
prophet Abraham) and in which many idols have been placed will be
purged of idols, and people will say their prayers facing towards it.
His followers will capture the towns of Parsis and Taus and Balkh and
other big places round about. People will embroil with one another.
The wise men of Persia and others will join his followers."
Though I haven't studies Hindu scriptures in detail, but a cursory
glance led me to the following prophesy about Muhammad.
"Just an illiterate man with the epithet Teacher, Muhammad by name,
came along with his companions. Raja (Bhoja in a vision) to that Great
Diva, that denizen of Arabia, purifying with the Ganges water and with
the five things of cow offered sandal wood and pay worship to him. O
denizen of Arabia and Lord of the holies, to thee is my adoration. O
thou who hast found many ways and means to destroy the devils of the
world. O pure one from among the illiterates, O sinless one, the
spirit of the truth and absolute master, to thee is my adoration.
Accept me at thy feet"
Bhavishya Purna Parv 3, Khand 3, Adhya 3, Shalok 5-8
Bible.Deuteronomy.33.2 implies that in the Jewish history, there will
be three most important messengers, each will revive previous
messenger's teachings. Sinai one will be the first. Seir one will be
the second. Paran one will be the third. In the following I will prove
that: Sinai means Moses' place, Seir means Jesus' place, Paran means
Muhammad's place.
Bible.Nehemiah.9.13-15 implies that, Moses received his "Moses Law" at
Sinai, (thus, Sinai mean's Moses' place.).
Bible.Luke.1.26-33 says that, Jesus was from Nazareth which is in
Galilee. Bible.Matthew.4.12-16 says that, Galilee is towards the side
of Dead sea where Jerusalem also lie. Bible.Deuteronomy.2.1-28 says
that, Seir is beside the Dead Sea. Bible.Chronicles.20.10-15 says that
Israelites will defeat Seirites. Bibile.2Chronicles.25.11 says that,
Seir is the valley of Salt, because it is beside Dead Sea which is
full of salt. Conclusion: Seir is in Galilee, and Galilee was the
place of messengership of Jesus.
Bible.Genesis.21.21 implies that Ishmaelite dwelt in the wilderness/
desert of "Paran". Muhammad was the only Ishmaelite, who was a
messenger, so there had to come a messenger to Ishmaelites i.e. paran-
one, and he must be Muhammad, because Muhammad is the only Ishmaelite
messenger. Bible don't mention even a single Jewish messenger from
Paran.
Bible.Deuteronomy.33.2 implies that, God shined from Paran, and he
came with ten thousands of the saints. Bukhari.5.59.574 describes
Muhammad accompained by Ten-thousand soldiers when he conquered his
mother-city, Mecca, which proved to be the turning point in favour of
Muhammad.
Bible.Deuteronomy.33.2 implies that God will "his right hand went a
fiery law for them"; thus Quran.5.3 implies that God completed
messengership at Muhammad, (all messengers, Adam/Moses/Jesus/etc, were
but one stock, name it muslims/else/else, but they were all in one),
and there will be no messenger any more.
Hijaz/Paran area is the mountaneous area of the western most of the
Arabian Peninsula, apart from the southern tip of Yemen. Nevertheless
"Paran" is the Western Arabia, in Bible. But neverthess, even if
people say that this "Paran" is not the real one, or this "Paran" is
there; even if "Paran" exists anywhere on the earth, nevertheless,
Bible says that Ishmael and his offsprings dwelt in "Paran". This is
the important point, shed all the other mysteries, thus, I will not
assert which "Paran" the Bible is talking about, let this argument
don't deviate us from the actual purpose. There is only one "Paran" in
Bible, no matter which one, and Ishmaelite and his offspring dwelt in
it for ever, (note that, "faran" is the arabic word used widely among
the Arabs, SEARCH, probably for the Hijaz area; because Arabic have no
'p' sound in their alphabets, so they replace 'f' for 'p'.).
Conclusion: Along with other Primary Proofs, my Intuition says that
God is really Interested in us, and God always communicated with us
through the Middle-Eastern Messengers, the last of whom was Muhammad;
the Jealous Jews/Christians would never tolerate the Ishmaelite
Muhammad in their Bible, and surprisingly whenever a future messenger
is mentioned, in 95% cases it is Muhammmd, the Warrior Messenger.
Bible.Deuteronomy, "
33:1 And this is the blessing, wherewith Moses the man of God blessed
the children of Israel before his death.
33:2 And he said, The LORD came from Sinai, and rose up from Seir unto
them; he shined forth from mount Paran, and he came with ten thousands
of saints: from his right hand went a fiery law for them.
33:3 Yea, he loved the people; all his saints are in thy hand: and
they sat down at thy feet; every one shall receive of thy words.
", bible verses end.
Bible.Nehemiah.9.13-15, "
9:13 Thou camest down also upon mount Sinai, and spakest with them
from heaven, and gavest them right judgments, and true laws, good
statutes and commandments: 9:14 And madest known unto them thy holy
sabbath, and commandedst them precepts, statutes, and laws, by the
hand of Moses thy servant: 9:15 And gavest them bread from heaven for
their hunger, and broughtest forth water for them out of the rock for
their thirst, and promisedst them that they should go in to possess
the land which thou hadst sworn to give them.
", bible verses end.
Bible.Luke, "
1:26 And in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent from God unto a
city of Galilee, named Nazareth, 1:27 To a virgin espoused to a man
whose name was Joseph, of the house of David; and the virgin's name
was Mary.
1:28 And the angel came in unto her, and said, Hail, thou that art
highly favoured, the Lord is with thee: blessed art thou among women.
1:29 And when she saw him, she was troubled at his saying, and cast in
her mind what manner of salutation this should be.
1:30 And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found
favour with God.
1:31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a
son, and shalt call his name JESUS.
1:32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest:
and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:
1:33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his
kingdom there shall be no end.
", bible verses end.
Bible.Matthew, "
4:12 Now when Jesus had heard that John was cast into prison, he
departed into Galilee; 4:13 And leaving Nazareth, he came and dwelt in
Capernaum, which is upon the sea coast, in the borders of Zabulon and
Nephthalim: 4:14 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias
the prophet, saying, 4:15 The land of Zabulon, and the land of
Nephthalim, by the way of the sea, beyond Jordan, Galilee of the
Gentiles; 4:16 The people which sat in darkness saw great light; and
to them which sat in the region and shadow of death light is sprung
up.
", bible verses end.
Bible.Deuteronomy,
2:1 Then we turned, and took our journey into the wilderness by the
way of the Red sea, as the LORD spake unto me: and we compassed mount
Seir many days.
2:2 And the LORD spake unto me, saying, 2:3 Ye have compassed this
mountain long enough: turn you northward.
2:4 And command thou the people, saying, Ye are to pass through the
coast of your brethren the children of Esau, which dwell in Seir; and
they shall be afraid of you: take ye good heed unto yourselves
therefore: 2:5 Meddle not with them; for I will not give you of their
land, no, not so much as a foot breadth; because I have given mount
Seir unto Esau for a possession.
..........
2:16 So it came to pass, when all the men of war were consumed and
dead from among the people, 2:17 That the LORD spake unto me, saying,
2:18 Thou art to pass over through Ar, the coast of Moab, this day:
2:19 And when thou comest nigh over against the children of Ammon,
distress them not, nor meddle with them: for I will not give thee of
the land of the children of Ammon any possession; because I have given
it unto the children of Lot for a possession.
..........
2:28 Thou shalt sell me meat for money, that I may eat; and give me
water for money, that I may drink: only I will pass through on my
feet; 2:29 (As the children of Esau which dwell in Seir, and the
Moabites which dwell in Ar, did unto me;) until I shall pass over
Jordan into the land which the LORD our God giveth us.
", bible verses end.
Bible.Chronicles, "
20:10 And now, behold, the children of Ammon and Moab and mount Seir,
whom thou wouldest not let Israel invade, when they came out of the
land of Egypt, but they turned from them, and destroyed them not;
20:11 Behold, I say, how they reward us, to come to cast us out of thy
possession, which thou hast given us to inherit.
20:12 O our God, wilt thou not judge them? for we have no might
against this great company that cometh against us; neither know we
what to do: but our eyes are upon thee.
20:13 And all Judah stood before the LORD, with their little ones,
their wives, and their children.
20:14 Then upon Jahaziel the son of Zechariah, the son of Benaiah, the
son of Jeiel, the son of Mattaniah, a Levite of the sons of Asaph,
came the Spirit of the LORD in the midst of the congregation; 20:15
And he said, Hearken ye, all Judah, and ye inhabitants of Jerusalem,
and thou king Jehoshaphat, Thus saith the LORD unto you, Be not afraid
nor dismayed by reason of this great multitude; for the battle is not
yours, but God's.
", bible verses end.
Bible.2Chronicles, "
25:11 And Amaziah strengthened himself, and led forth his people, and
went to the valley of salt, and smote of the children of Seir ten
thousand.
", bible verses end.
Bible.Genesis.21.1-21, "
21:1 And the LORD visited Sarah as he had said, and the LORD did unto
Sarah as he had spoken.
21:2 For Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son in his old age, at
the set time of which God had spoken to him.
21:3 And Abraham called the name of his son that was born unto him,
whom Sarah bare to him, Isaac.
21:4 And Abraham circumcised his son Isaac being eight days old, as
God had commanded him.
21:5 And Abraham was an hundred years old, when his son Isaac was born
unto him.
21:6 And Sarah said, God hath made me to laugh, so that all that hear
will laugh with me.
21:7 And she said, Who would have said unto Abraham, that Sarah should
have given children suck? for I have born him a son in his old age.
21:8 And the child grew, and was weaned: and Abraham made a great
feast the same day that Isaac was weaned.
21:9 And Sarah saw the son of Hagar the Egyptian, which she had born
unto Abraham, mocking.
21:10 Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this bondwoman and her
son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir with my son, even
with Isaac.
21:11 And the thing was very grievous in Abraham's sight because of
his son.
21:12 And God said unto Abraham, Let it not be grievous in thy sight
because of the lad, and because of thy bondwoman; in all that Sarah
hath said unto thee, hearken unto her voice; for in Isaac shall thy
seed be called.
21:13 And also of the son of the bondwoman will I make a nation,
because he is thy seed.
21:14 And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and took bread, and a
bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder,
and the child, and sent her away: and she departed, and wandered in
the wilderness of Beersheba.
21:15 And the water was spent in the bottle, and she cast the child
under one of the shrubs.
21:16 And she went, and sat her down over against him a good way off,
as it were a bow shot: for she said, Let me not see the death of the
child. And she sat over against him, and lift up her voice, and wept.
21:17 And God heard the voice of the lad; and the angel of God called
to Hagar out of heaven, and said unto her, What aileth thee, Hagar?
fear not; for God hath heard the voice of the lad where he is.
21:18 Arise, lift up the lad, and hold him in thine hand; for I will
make him a great nation.
21:19 And God opened her eyes, and she saw a well of water; and she
went, and filled the bottle with water, and gave the lad drink.
21:20 And God was with the lad; and he grew, and dwelt in the
wilderness, and became an archer.
21:21 And he dwelt in the wilderness of Paran: and his mother took him
a wife out of the land of Egypt.
, bible verses end.
Quran.5.3, "
…..This day have I perfected for you your religion and
completed My favor on you and chosen for you Islam as a
religion…..
", quran verse ends.
Bukhari.5.59.574, "
Narrated Ibn Abbas :
The Prophet left Medina (for Mecca) in the company of ten-thousand
(Muslim warriors) in (the month of) Ramadan, and that was eight and a
half years after his migration to Medina. He and the Muslims who were
with him, proceeded on their way to Mecca. He was fasting and they
were fasting, but when they reached a place called Al-Kadid which was
a place of water between 'Usfan and Kudaid, he broke his fast and so
did they. (Az-Zuhri said, "One should take the last action of Allah's
Apostle and leave his early action (while taking a verdict.")
", hadith ends.
I APOLOGIZE FOR SUCH A LONG LETTER.
Christopher A. Lee
<waqas....@gmail.com> wrote:
>On Apr 29, 12:21 pm, Christopher A. Lee <ca...@optonline.net> wrote:
>> On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 23:05:22 -0700 (PDT), Awais Nazir
>>
>> <waqas.fah...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >On Apr 28, 6:38 pm, "Geoff" <geb...@yahoo.nospam.com> wrote:
>> >> Been looking for gods for 10k years.Noword from the big guy yet. Whycan't
>> >> theistanswerthis?
>>
>> >theansweris that: GOD COMMUNICATED THE HUMANITY THROUGH HIS
>> >MESSENGERS INCLUDING MOSES/JESUS/MUHAMMAD.
>>
>> PROVE IT, IN-YOUR-FACE, PIG-IGNORANT, QUESTION-BEGGING WORSHIPPER OF A
>> PEDOPHILE CAMEL-FUCKER.
Why didn't you, worshipper of a goat-fucking pedophile (Piss Be Upon
Him)?
[More mindless Islamic stupidity deleted]
How did any of that stupid, rude preaching that presumes it in the
first place, prove anything?
Awais Nazir
James Beck
@gmail.com says...
The kid can be forgiven their ignorance, the parent has been deceiving
them about the situation. Religion is the same way except all the grown
ups are dead and they forgot to tell the kiddies that it was all just a
scan to keep them in line.
Jim
James Beck
j...@reallykillersystems.com says...
|
SCAM, fat fingers at work.
> Jim
>
MarkA
You mean the three prophets who subjected themselves to prolonged sensory
deprivation (praying in the desert), metabolic abnormalities (fasting),
and then had auditory hallucinations (heard the Voice of God)?
I'm convinced. Who do i make my check out to?
--
MarkA
Keeper of Things Put There Only Just The Night Before
About eight o'clock
pba...@worldonline.nl
>
> - Tekst uit oorspronkelijk bericht weergeven -
I would not know anything about that
As far as I can tell, he has been silent for over a thousand years.
He can call me if he wants too: 31204539071
meg
> I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> ten thousand years ago.
>
>
> Reason 1: Humans are clever, they don't take tens of thousands of
> years to develop scientifically, thus it also flaws the current
> perception that humanity genes are stable for atleast past two hundred
> thousand years ago.
>
> have been well a few hundred thousand years ago. But we do not find
> Pottery before ten-thousand years ago.
>
> Reason 3: Archeology record suggests agriculture to come into scene in
> just last ten thousand years, (Is human as dumb that for tens of
> thousands of years they were just hunting?). Intuition says that if
> there would be a first society, then it would be both hunters/farmers.
> If Archeology says that agriculture started about ten-thousand years
> ago, then humanity should have come about ten-thousand years ago, on
> Earth.
>
> Reason 4: Archeologists find that organised housed suddenly appeared
> about ten thousand years ago, (Are humans dumb enough, that they lived
> for tens of thousands of years just roaming the earth, without proper
> place to settle).
>
> Reason 5: First chinese writing came in about 1500 BC, and that first
> American writing came in about 800 BC by the Zapotec people, first
> Egypt writing came in about 3100 BC, (Are humans that dumb, that they
> never wrote the previous socalled many tens of thousands of years).
> These dates show that, the first humans should come about 10-thousand
> years ago, so that they gain enough population/experience to
> effectively run the commerce/government through writing.
>
> Reason 6: Geneticists had mathematically proved that, the human gene
> is stable for twenty million years into future! with current mutation
> rates. Now the question is: how can a socalled series of evolution
> from last couple of hundred of thousands of years, from ape to man
> halt abruptly for next 20 million years?. (Monkey to man is a great
> socalled leap forward in genes. Genes are so so so stable that we can
> find even today the species which also existed billions of years old
> in fossil records; we are making a very big statement when we say that
> monkey gene became human gene in a couple of tens of thousands of
> years).
>
> Reason 7: The mesopotamian scientific trend occured about twenty-
> seventh century BC, of Greece about third century BC, of Muslim about
> tenth century AD, of European about Sixteenth Century BC. What rule
> joins them? every next trend occured after a previous one, nearly
> after half the time period between previous two trends. For example,
> Meso-Greece period in 25 centuries, Greece-Muslim period is twelve and
> half centuries, muslim-european period is about six centuries, and so
> next trend should occur at about three centuries latter from sixteenth
> centures, ie ninteenth century (which is the American Science Period).
> If I call the first Science Period as Adamic, then Adamic SP should
> occur about 7700 BC (approx. 8000 BC), i.e. about ten-thousand years
> ago. Conclusion: The first Science Period was Adamic and it occurred
> about 8000 BC. (Anthropologists suggest that the current humans, i.e.
> homo-sapians, were existant on earth for atleast 200 thousand years,
> according to their calculations; thus, the intelligence which humans
> currently possess, was with humans for atleast 200 thousand years.
> But, humanity would be colonizing other galaxies, had it been of the
> age of 200 thousand years.). Humans are not dumb that they take many
> tens of thousands of years to develop population/scientifically.
>
> Reason 8: Summerian and Egyptian Civilizations started about 3500 BC;
> Indus and Minoan and Akkadian and Andes Cvilisations started about
> 2500 BC; Chinese Civilization started about 2200 BC; doesn't it all
> hint: if it took 5000-years for human to develop from past Egyptian
> civilization to the development that is now, then about 5000-thousand
> years should have took from a first human pair to develop into
> Egyptian civilization, totalling 10-thousand years of human existence
> on earth, (It is as evident as is sun).
>
> Reason 9: Now, Pyramids as in Egypt/Amerindian can exist for many ten-
> thousands of years. If humanity has an age of more than ten-thousand
> years, then it can safely be argued that there should exist similar
> more societies like Egyptian/Amerindian, and thus a multitude of
> pyramids covering the earth, each showing its history; but we can't
> find such sustaining structures as pyramids preceding the time about
> 3-4 thousand years ago. This all shows that, no bias: Egyptian/
> Amerindian were the first to make Pyramids, if humanity was more than
> ten-thousand years in age then similar pyramids should have been found
> but there exist none, thus humanity can't be more than ten-thousand
> years in age; no bias: God is needed to create the intelligent
> creature as a human. (It is not that Stone structures before 10-
> thousand years decayed, because stone/bone/fossils can date millions/
> billions of years).
>
> It may be argued that ice-age thawed about ten-thousand years ago, and
> that's why one saw agriculture/etc thriving after it, (but equator
> never faced the bitter of ice, so civilization should have continued
> at equator, nullifying the previous argument).
>
> God modified the mamal gene to make human. Proof? Appendix has no work
> in humans, but still exists, but is required in many other mammals.
> Also, sea-plant is almost 85% human gene.
>
> The skelatons we find toaday of so-called prehumans are actually
> monkeys.
>
> The rate of the human growing has not been constant, the rate is much
> higher now because of advanced medical facilities. So, if we take this
> rate as constant, then this is not the right approach.
>
> Now, there are two things, wars and famines. Which of them puts an
> upper limit to the human population? Inconclusively, it is famine, not
> war. Reason: war was almost common throughout the world, but famine
> was more widespread in places where there is less vegetation; So,
> India/China are majors in population not because they faced less wars
> in past, but that they had less famines, compared to other
> countries.Conclusion: wars don't diminish the human population, if it
> does then it is immediately healed, but that food limits the human
> population. So, we can't say that it were cannibals in past that is
> why it took humanity many tens of thousands of years to develop
> population/scientifically.
>
> If incest continues of 8 generations, then the people becomes
> different from eachother, as if they belong to different races. I will
> not say Incest, but that different places shut people off from
> eachother, and they became different after some generations. The Black
> in Africa, and Blond is Sweden, occurred, because a Blond in Africa
> died an early death due to ultra-violet sun ray harm, and same for the
> Balck in Sweden where it died of lack of Vitamin-D.
>
> Anti-thesis: human beings can't be from this earth, because about ten-
> thousand years ago, sudden intelligence came on the surface of Earth.
> So, what if Aliens came to earth about ten-thousand years ago, now
> called as humans? It is very less probable, because why aliens came
> not in the 4-billion history of earth and only in last ten-thousand
> years? Also, Aliens most probably had to die because they are not
> immune to earthly bectarias/etc. This is just one INDIRECT EVIDENCE.
> There are many such other Indirect evidences at my website,www.awais-nazir.biz.
>
> Despite the fact that I had proved the landing of Adam on Earth, ten-
> thousand years ago, current Science has difficulty accepting it,
> because, it then has to accept the existance of God.
>
> Atheists say that this world is by chance; Well, what if, god intended
> this world to appear as such, for some reason?
>
> Conclusion: if this was the only INDIRECT EVIDENCE, then I would have
> neglected it, but there are a host of such INDIRECT EVIDENCES
> reinforcing eachother, and thus can't be ignored, especially when
> chapters 5, 8, and 9 provides the evidence of the DIRECT INTERVENTION
> by God.
>
> reference:www.awais-nazir.biz
It is not uranium-dating it is called 'carbon dating'. The story of
your life, you got it wrong from the beginning. Kill yourself so you
can prove you were right.
Bret Cahill
> > >material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> > >ten thousand years ago.
>
>
> We're getting hit especially hard with nonsense this
> week, for some reason. Perhaps someone accidentally
> shut off the power to the electric fence at the Idiot
> Farm?
Creationists are realizing they don't have anyone to vote for in Nov.
and they have no hope of forcing school kids to kneel down and pray to
Pat Robertson.
Bret Cahill
etienne
duke
>Been looking for gods for 10k years. No word from the big guy yet. Why can't
>theist answer this?
You're 10K years old?
duke, American-American
*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****
Richo
> On Apr 28, 12:38 am, Awais Nazir <waqas.fah...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Earth is 4-billion years old, as uranium-dating proves.
>
Actually no.
Carbon dating is only useful on organic (once living) matter (not
rocks) and is only reasonably accurate back 30 thousand years.
(C14 has a half life of 5,700 years )
So its good for wood, cloth, leather, paper...
Other techniques must be employed for older material and non organics.
Radiometric dating of rocks is done on the U - Pb ratios
(Or Rb- Sr , K - Ar )
Cheers, Mark.
Smiler
"MarkA" <to...@nowhere.com> wrote in message
news:pan.2008.04.29....@nowhere.com...
> On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 23:05:22 -0700, Awais Nazir wrote:
>
>> On Apr 28, 6:38 pm, "Geoff" <geb...@yahoo.nospam.com> wrote:
>>> Been looking for gods for 10k years.Noword from the big guy yet.
>>> Whycan't
>>> theistanswerthis?
>>
>> the answer is that: GOD COMMUNICATED THE HUMANITY THROUGH HIS
>> MESSENGERS INCLUDING MOSES/JESUS/MUHAMMAD.
>
> You mean the three prophets who subjected themselves to prolonged sensory
> deprivation (praying in the desert), metabolic abnormalities (fasting),
> and then had auditory hallucinations (heard the Voice of God)?
>
> I'm convinced. Who do i make my check out to?
>
Me! Me! Me!
Smiler,
The godless one
a.a.# 2279
David V.
> God is actively communicating with us through messengership,
Which is kind of hard to do since gods do not exist.
--
Dave
You measure a democracy by the freedom it gives its dissidents,
not the freedom it gives its assimilated conformists.
- Abbie Hoffman
Awais Nazir
describe Muhammad in such a detail as naming him and his parents, and
also his native place, AND not only one past scripture but ALL major
scriptures of the past say such, etc., because all those major
Scriptures were revealed by the same source - God - but after each's
Messengership; This Messengership sounds an impossibility except ONE
source God is sending there messengers. Surely, this can't be a
coincidence, given the human ego such that even if there is the truth
in front of him, human ego will not accept it, how come all the main
religions of world despite human ego foretold the comming of Muhammad,
Major Scriptures are anticipating their "warrior messenger/image-of-
god" who will conquer the world for them, called as "warrior
messenger" by Jews, or "Kalki Avatar" by Hindus, etc.
CORRUPTED SCRIPTURES CONFIRMING? MIRACLE: Though nature may be a
chance but such a process as Messengership confirms itself through
generations of Treacherous Humanity, can't be such. I will try to
prove that Bible predicts Muhammad accurately. However one may say
that I consider Bible as corrupt, then why proving something from a
corrupt thing? It should be a miracle, definite one, not a chance,
that bible survived millenias, bible survives millions of biases,
bible survived many translations. Yet ifever Bible refers to ANY
future messenger then either it is David/Jesus/Muhammad and scant
mention of others, and no else!!! Surely, this is enough proof that
Bible is indeed word from God, with slight translation mistakes;
because if it were from men, then you will have found any kind of
proof applicable to anykind of socalled messenger in the future,
fulfilling anyking of the whims of the supposed writer/s of Bible.
JEW CRITICISM PROVES: Jews are the nation around the world, which have
the holy scriptures, which immediately precedes the Muhammadan
messengership; but God is constantly criticizing the Jews for their
bad actions. Though, one may expect such a self-criticizing from one
man on himself, but the psyche of a whole nation can't condemn itself,
it is against the social psyche. This itself is the secondary proof
that Bible is the God revealed word.
JEW JEALOUSY COULDN'T SUPPRESS MESSENGERSHIP: I personally read the
whole Bible from start till end, and noted all the possible prophesies
about ANY future messenger, and 95% of them point out to Muhammad, who
was from among the arch-rivals of Jews, i.e. Ishmaelites/Arabs; I
don't think that the jealous/proud Jews could write/change the Bible
themselves to make the coming of the only warring messenger who will
deliever them from the hands of worldly attrocities, as being from
their arch-rival tribe of Ishmaelites/Arabs, more so when they
couldn't think of messengership of going out of the jewish race.
BIBLE IS CONSISTENT, I.E. FROM GOD: If Bible was the confusion word,
then it should have said that messenger will arise from Assyria also,
and Egypt also, Arab also, etc. But, I have read all Bible, and found
that messenger will arise, every time, from the offspring of Ishmael
i.e. Arabs, and they will be from Arabian Peninsula, and that they
will be a warrior nation. Thus, Bible is consistent, not as the word
of men, because if Bible was wrote of men then there would have been
many different opinions.
BIBLE ORIGINALS EXIST TODAY: they belong to the time "before the time
of Muhammad", as the Carbon Dating of them proves. Thus, if those
original Bible didn't existed from the time "time before Muhammad",
then this "messengership" section of my Diary, would be mere fake,
because a doubt of uncertainity is inserted in it, what if muslims had
changed the bible for their bias? If the KJV Bible don't suffice one,
then he can always cross-check them with the original bible
manuscripts.
MESSENGERSHIP PROVES UNSEEN: Hence Muhammad is proved, so do previous
mesengers, including Jesus/Moses, so do God, so do Paradise and Hell,
so do Angels, so do Bible/Quran themselves, so do Life after Death or
Fate or Day of Resurrection, and all othe matters of the unseen, and
all what Muhammadan Islam say, in short: Belief Is No More A Blind
Belief! So, we can now say with proof, that God organized organic
evolution, or the Universe Creation, and that they were not the chance
creation. Note thE, miracles done by Jesus/Muhammad/etc can't be
proved directly, we can't know even if Jesus was real/figurative
figure, BUT Messengership. What thing, "Messengership" don't prove?
MUHAMMADAN ISLAM REPLACES PREVIOUS MESSENGERSHIPS: Secondary proof, as
previously, proved only that God existed, but they couldn't prove that
is that God really interested in us, and if he is, then how? Saying
that Muhammadan Islam say that God is Absolute is no proof, because
Judaism/Orthodox-Christianity/etc also say similar, also, what if God
himself wanted to eat/die/etc. as in hinduism/etc.? If God himself
wanted it, then no-one could deny him also; Messengership comes to
rescue here also: it proves that why only Muhammadan Islam is true,
and it says that, other major religions were true in their own times
in past.
MESSENGERSHIP CREATES HARMONY/COMMON-GROUND: The added advantage, of
Messengership, is that: Messengership propagate the unity/harmony of
religions/humanity in practial terms, thus, Hinduism/Jewish/etc. are
nothing but sent from the same source, only to be revived by latter
Messengership, once contradictions crept into them. Yet another
advantage is that: even, Budhist, Hindu, Jewish/Christian, scriptures
foretold their abrogation on the coming of the Muhammadan scripture,
so all the complexity is reduced in one step.
Now, I can say, that God intended Messengership as an Absolute proof,
not the Science, as an authenticity-badge for the Muhammadan Islam.
Quran.2.35-39 implies that, when God expelled the first man from
Paradise to Earth, God intended only messengership, as a source of
guidance, not any thing else (e.g. Science/logic/etc.) as the prove
that the particular message is really from God.
Quran.2.164 implies that God will not punish, when the person has not
known THE messengership, of his time, and that "nature signs" makes
meaning only after "messengership".
AN EXAMPLE OF MESSENGERSHIP FROM HINDU SCRIPTURES:
"Just an illiterate man with the epithet Teacher, Muhammad by name,
came along with his companions. Raja (Bhoja in a vision) to that Great
Diva, that denizen of Arabia, purifying with the Ganges water and with
the five things of cow offered sandal wood and pay worship to him. O
denizen of Arabia and Lord of the holies, to thee is my adoration. O
thou who hast found many ways and means to destroy the devils of the
world. O pure one from among the illiterates, O sinless one, the
spirit of the truth and absolute master, to thee is my adoration.
Accept me at thy feet" Bhavishya Purna Parv 3, Khand 3, Adhya 3,
Shalok 5-8
AN EXAMPLE OF MESSENGERSHIP FROM PARSI SCRIPTURES:
In Dasatir 14 (Sasan11) we can find a very clear prophesy of Muhammad
(pbuh): "When the Persians should sink so low in morality, a man will
be born in Arabia whose followers will upset their throne, religion
and everything. The mighty stiff-necked ones of Persia will be
overpowered. The house which was built (The Kaaba in Makkah built by
prophet Abraham) and in which many idols have been placed will be
purged of idols, and people will say their prayers facing towards it.
His followers will capture the towns of Parsis and Taus and Balkh and
other big places round about. People will embroil with one another.
The wise men of Persia and others will join his followers."
AN EXAMPLE OF MESSENGERSHIP FROM JEWISH/CHRISTIAN SCRIPTURE (BIBLE):
Bible.Deuteronomy.33.2 implies that in the Jewish history, there will
be three most important messengers, each will revive previous
messenger's teachings. Sinai one will be the first. Seir one will be
the second. Paran one will be the third. In the following I will prove
that: Sinai means Moses' place, Seir means Jesus' place, Paran means
Muhammad's place.
Bible.Nehemiah.9.13-15 implies that, Moses received his "Moses Law" at
Sinai, (thus, Sinai mean's Moses' place.).
Bible.Luke.1.26-33 says that, Jesus was from Nazareth which is in
Galilee. Bible.Matthew.4.12-16 says that, Galilee is towards the side
of Dead sea where Jerusalem also lie. Bible.Deuteronomy.2.1-28 says
that, Seir is beside the Dead Sea. Bible.Chronicles.20.10-15 says that
Israelites will defeat Seirites. Bibile.2Chronicles.25.11 says that,
Seir is the valley of Salt, because it is beside Dead Sea which is
full of salt. Conclusion: Seir is in Galilee, and Galilee was the
place of messengership of Jesus.
Bible.Genesis.21.21 implies that Ishmaelite (father of Arabs) dwelt in
the wilderness/desert of "Paran". Muhammad was the only Ishmaelite,
who was a messenger, so there had to come a messenger to Ishmaelites
i.e. paran-one, and he must be Muhammad, because Muhammad is the only
them: for I will not give thee of the land of the children of Ammon
that Sarah should have given children suck? For I have born him a son
in his old age. 21:8 And the child grew, and was weaned: and Abraham
made a great feast the same day that Isaac was weaned. 21:9 And Sarah
saw the son of Hagar the Egyptian, which she had born unto Abraham,
mocking. 21:10 Wherefore she said unto Abraham, Cast out this
bondwoman and her son: for the son of this bondwoman shall not be heir
with my son, even with Isaac. 21:11 And the thing was very grievous in
Abraham's sight because of his son. 21:12 And God said unto Abraham,
Let it not be grievous in thy sight because of the lad, and because of
thy bondwoman; in all that Sarah hath said unto thee, hearken unto her
voice; for in Isaac shall thy seed be called. 21:13 And also of the
son of the bondwoman will I make a nation, because he is thy seed.
21:14 And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and took bread, and a
bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder,
and the child, and sent her away: and she departed, and wandered in
the wilderness of Beersheba. 21:15 And the water was spent in the
bottle, and she cast the child under one of the shrubs. 21:16 And she
went, and sat her down over against him a good way off, as it were a
bow shot: for she said, Let me not see the death of the child. And she
sat over against him, and lift up her voice, and wept. 21:17 And God
heard the voice of the lad; and the angel of God called to Hagar out
of heaven, and said unto her, What aileth thee, Hagar? Fear not; for
God hath heard the voice of the lad where he is. 21:18 Arise, lift up
the lad, and hold him in thine hand; for I will make him a great
nation. 21:19 And God opened her eyes, and she saw a well of water;
and she went, and filled the bottle with water, and gave the lad
drink. 21:20 And God was with the lad; and he grew, and dwelt in the
wilderness, and became an archer. 21:21 And he dwelt in the wilderness
of Paran: and his mother took him a wife out of the land of Egypt.
, bible verses end.
Quran.5.3, "
…..This day have I perfected for you your religion and completed My
favor on you and chosen for you Islam as a religion…..
", quran verse ends.
Bukhari.5.59.574, "
Narrated Ibn Abbas : The Prophet left Medina (for Mecca) in the
company of ten-thousand (Muslim warriors) in (the month of) Ramadan,
and that was eight and a half years after his migration to Medina. He
and the Muslims who were with him, proceeded on their way to Mecca. He
was fasting and they were fasting, but when they reached a place
called Al-Kadid which was a place of water between 'Usfan and Kudaid,
he broke his fast and so did they. (Az-Zuhri said, "One should take
the last action of Allah's Apostle and leave his early action (while
taking a verdict.")
", hadith ends.
I APOLOGIZE FOR THE ABOVE ARTICLE BEING SO LONG.
Conclusion: All the above story, as I expect, will be nerve-breaking
for most of the readers. I have given the plain facts, but the
decision to convert to Muhammadan Islam is to be taken by the readers.
Oh No! If I convert to Islam, then I have to finish all enjoys? No, my
Diary shows, how to reinterpret the Islamic Law for the better, by
using tools from within Quran/Ahadith, which not even socalled muslims
scholars can deny. Get the higher of the two paradises, (you will not
know this thing, and else, from anywhere else). Wear gold/silk/silver,
pray only two salat a day not five, relaxed inter-sex relations, woman
can lead salat/country, etc, etc, etc, (www.awais-nazir.biz).
bob young
*nemo* wrote:
>
> Awais Nazir wrote:
> > I don£t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> > material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> > ten thousand years ago.
Prove it
> >
> If you had a question, why didn't you just ask it?
>
> BTW, your info on the date that humans developed is rather out of whack
> with currently known evidence. Seriously, dude... stop embarrassing
> yourself. And consider it a lucky thing that we don't look at you and
> say "HA! There's proof that all Muslims are ignorant nitwits!"
Mark K. Bilbo
> I don’t know about other planets, but for earth, humans are the first
> material intelligent beings on Earth, and came on earth not more than
> ten thousand years ago.
Wrong.
Hell, we developed language between 100 and 250,000 years ago...
Mark K. Bilbo
> for more incoherent babbling:www.awais-nazir.biz.
Indeedy...
Mark K. Bilbo
> DEFINITION OF MESSENGERSHIP:
"Spam"
Ben Goren
> Awais Nazir wrote:
>
>> DEFINITION OF MESSENGERSHIP:
>
> "Spam"
Looks like you got the message....
Cheers,
b&
--
EAC Memographer
BAAWA Knight of Blasphemy
``All but God can prove this sentence true.''
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MarkA
> DEFINITION OF MESSENGERSHIP: Well, if Hindu/Parsi/Bible/etc scriptures
>
<snip>
>
>
> I APOLOGIZE FOR THE ABOVE ARTICLE BEING SO LONG.
>
Think nothing of it. It's a sure bet nobody here read it.
--
MarkA
(This space temporarily unavailable)
David V.
> DEFINITION OF MESSENGERSHIP....
define the god first. What good is a "messenger" if the god he's
talking about does not exist?
> I APOLOGIZE FOR THE ABOVE ARTICLE BEING SO LONG.
No need to apologize, no one read it anyway.
Awais Nazir
Quran, "
[2.213] (All) people are a single nation; so Allah raised prophets as
bearers of good news and as warners, and He revealed with them the
Book with truth, that it might judge between people in that in which
they differed; and none but the very people who were given it differed
about it after clear arguments had come to them, revolting among
themselves; so Allah has guided by His will those who believe to the
truth about which they differed and Allah guides whom He pleases to
the right path. "
The Chief Instigator
> Well, then be warned, that I have delivered the message of God.\
>
> Quran, "
You're too stupid a troll to bother with the charters of the two
atheist newsgroups you refuse to obey...meanwhile, Allah eats pork and
wipes with his right hand. Shove your shari'a where the moon doesn't
shine, or I'll show you the soles of my bare feet standing on your head.
--
Patrick "The Chief Instigator" Humphrey (pat...@io.com) Houston, Texas
chiefinstigator.us.tt/aeros.php (TCI's 2007-08 Houston Aeros) AA#2273
LAST GAME: Rockford 5, Houston 2 (April 25)
NEXT GAME: The 2008-09 season opener in early October
Mark K. Bilbo
> On Tue, 29 Apr 2008 22:30:10 -0700, Awais Nazir wrote:
> > DEFINITION OF MESSENGERSHIP: Well, if Hindu/Parsi/Bible/etc scriptures
>
> <snip>
>
> > I APOLOGIZE FOR THE ABOVE ARTICLE BEING SO LONG.
>
> Think nothing of it. It's a sure bet nobody here read it.
Read what?
Mark K. Bilbo
> Well, then be warned, that I have delivered the message of God.\
Well, then be warned, we're atheists, we don't believe you either...
Ben Goren
> Well, then be warned, that I have delivered the message of God.\
<sigh>
Look -- how many times do we have to tell you?
It's not ``God,'' it's ``Dog.'' And Muhammad wasn't his prophet,
he was her pup.
Hatter
> Well, then be warned, that I have delivered the message of God.\
The message of god is silence. That should tell you something.
Hatter
Cary Kittrell
Pfft! Don't tip him. I distinctly ordered "pepperoni" on
my message of God, and what do we get?
Anybody here like anchovies?
-- cary
SkyEyes
Why would any *real* god need a "messenger"? Any god that had godly
powers could just transmit it's message straight into the brain of
every human, simultaneously and clearly and without the need for
translation or interpretation.
The very fact that a human "messenger" is involved is a tipoff to the
fact that no actual "god" is at the root the so-called "message" from
the get-go.
Brenda Nelson, A.A.#34
EAC Professor of Feline Thermometrics and Cat-Herding
skyeyes nine at cox dot net
Therion Ware
<waqas....@gmail.com> wrote:
>Well, then be warned, that I have delivered the message of God.\
Yes, a lot of people do that. Alas we have only your word that this in
fact the case.
The thing about justice you see is not so much that God even were
there one, imposes it, or even enacts it, but that we as people enable
it and make it happen.
You see we start to learn with small lies: the tooth fairy, and so
forth that me might be able to believe in better lies. But you never
got over the early lies.
As Pratchett says:
“All right,” said Susan, “I’m not stupid. You’re saying humans need …
fantasies to make life bearable.”
No. Humans need fantasy to be human. To be the place where the falling
angel meets the rising ape.
“Tooth fairies? Hogfathers?”
Yes. As practice. You have to start out learning to believe the little
lies.
“So we can believe the big ones?”
Yes. Justice. Mercy. Duty. That sort of thing.
“They’re not the same at all!”
Take the universe and grind it down to the finest powder and sieve it
through with the finest sieve and then show me one
atom of justice, one molecule of mercy. And yet you act as if there
were some sort of rightness in the universe by which it
may be judged.
“Yes. But people have got to believe that or what’s the point?”
My point exactly.
>Quran, "
>[2.213] (All) people are a single nation; so Allah raised prophets as
>bearers of good news and as warners, and He revealed with them the
>Book with truth, that it might judge between people in that in which
>they differed; and none but the very people who were given it differed
>about it after clear arguments had come to them, revolting among
>themselves; so Allah has guided by His will those who believe to the
>truth about which they differed and Allah guides whom He pleases to
>the right path. "
If mercy, justice and so on, exist, it because we make them exist. And
you aren't even trying.
Cary Kittrell
> On Apr 30, 11:36=A0pm, Awais Nazir <waqas.fah...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Well, then be warned, that I have delivered the message of God.\
> >
> > Quran, "
> > [2.213] (All) people are a single nation; so Allah raised prophets as
> > bearers of good news and as warners, and He revealed with them the
> > they differed; and none but the very people who were given it differed
> > themselves; so Allah has guided by His will those who believe to the
> > the right path. "
>
> Why would any *real* god need a "messenger"? Any god that had godly
> powers could just transmit it's message straight into the brain of
> every human, simultaneously and clearly and without the need for
> translation or interpretation.
And do so in such a manner to render disbelief impossible.
So either Allah is incapable of this, or else He enjoys toying
with the fates of mortals.
-- cary
dieHard
wrote:
not unlike the "mediums" who act as go-betweens for stupid people and
their dead family members in the "afterlife" - and they make a fair
living at it too...
How long do you think churches and their religions would exist if they
weren't profitable?
Ben Kaufman
Unless... could it be.... God works through spammers?
Ben
Smiler
"Cary Kittrell" <ca...@afone.as.arizona.edu> wrote in message
news:fvcrjl$qla$1...@onion.ccit.arizona.edu...
Yuck! No way.
Best flush them, like his message of God.
Smiler
"Therion Ware" <autod...@city-of-dis.com> wrote in message
news:sqlj149o5sujv7q3d...@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 30 Apr 2008 23:36:48 -0700 (PDT), Awais Nazir
> <waqas....@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Well, then be warned, that I have delivered the message of God.\
>
> Yes, a lot of people do that. Alas we have only your word that this in
> fact the case.
>
> The thing about justice you see is not so much that God even were
> there one, imposes it, or even enacts it, but that we as people enable
> it and make it happen.
>
> You see we start to learn with small lies: the tooth fairy, and so
> forth that me might be able to believe in better lies. But you never
> got over the early lies.
>
> As Pratchett says:
>
But he is. Very trying.
Awais Nazir
> Take the universe and grind it down to the finest powder and sieve it
> through with the finest sieve and then show me one
> atom of justice, one molecule of mercy. And yet you act as if there
> were some sort of rightness in the universe by which it
> may be judged.
>
Well, can't you see, that all major religions accept the updatation of
the messengership of God through Muhammadan Islam.
God is just waiting, till after death, there will be no more chance
back, but eternal torment only. Be Warned!
God is communicating through messengers, not directly, because it is
our test.
This is the story of humanity,
quran, "
[2.35] And We said: O Adam! Dwell you and your wife in the garden and
eat from it a plenteous (food) wherever you wish and do not approach
this tree, for then you will be of the unjust.
[2.36] But the Shaitan made them both fall from it, and caused them to
depart from that (state) in which they were; and We said: Get forth,
some of you being the enemies of others, and there is for you in the
earth an abode and a provision for a time.
[2.37] Then Adam received (some) words from his Lord, so He turned to
him mercifully; surely He is Oft-returning (to mercy), the Merciful.
[2.38] We said: Go forth from this (state) all; so surely there will
come to you a guidance from Me, then whoever follows My guidance, no
fear shall come upon them, nor shall they grieve.
[2.39] And (as to) those who disbelieve in and reject My
communications, they are the inmates of the fire, in it they shall
abide.
"
DanielSan
>> Take the universe and grind it down to the finest powder and sieve it
>> through with the finest sieve and then show me one
>> atom of justice, one molecule of mercy. And yet you act as if there
>> were some sort of rightness in the universe by which it
>> may be judged.
>>
>
> Well, can't you see, that all major religions accept the updatation of
> the messengership of God through Muhammadan Islam.
>
> God is just waiting, till after death, there will be no more chance
> back, but eternal torment only. Be Warned!
I don't respond to petty childishness attributed to deities. They
aren't threats. They aren't promises. They aren't predictions about
the future. They are the result of petty and childish inventors of
deities (or, if you wish, the pettiness and childishness of the people
attributing certain traits to deities).
No, you don't scare me.
No, God does not scare me.
No, Allah does not scare me.
No, no deity at all scares me.
Leave what you perceive to be threats (or promises) out of alt.atheism,
okay? We've heard it all before.
Get some new material.
MarkA
>
> God is just waiting, till after death, there will be no more chance
> back, but eternal torment only. Be Warned!
>
Any god who has to insure the loyalty of his followers thru threats of
torture is no god worthy of respect. He might make a good Mafia boss, but
as for Supreme Being, he doesn't cut it.
--
MarkA
Keeper of Things Put There Only Just The Night Before
About eight o'clock
MarkA
My favorite is the story of Harry Houdini's mom supposedly writing a
letter to Harry after her death, thru a medium. She wrote in English,
which his mom didn't speak, and included a Xtian cross on the letter,
which his mom wasn't. Needless to say, Harry was not impressed.
> How long do you think churches and their religions would exist if they
> weren't profitable?
--
MarkA
That's it! God created the Internet so that his minions could spam
millions of people at once. So much more efficient than going
door-to-door.
duke
>Been looking for gods for 10k years. No word from the big guy yet. Why can't
>theist answer this?
10 thousand years???? Wow, you must have really dry skin.
duke, American-American
*****
"The Mass is the most perfect form of Prayer."
Pope Paul VI
*****
dieHard
>On Thu, 01 May 2008 22:49:54 -0700, Awais Nazir wrote:
>
>>
>> God is just waiting, till after death, there will be no more chance
>> back, but eternal torment only. Be Warned!
>>
>
>Any god who has to insure the loyalty of his followers thru threats of
>torture is no god worthy of respect. He might make a good Mafia boss, but
>as for Supreme Being, he doesn't cut it.
4 entities run the world, and in this order;
big business, big government, organized religion and organized crime.
- all have 2 things in common; they all prey on peoples' fears and
weaknesses and they -ALL PROFIT- from it.
- of the 4, only organized crime is "legitimate" in that they don't
ever pretend to be something they're not - ie; pretending to be your
friend while they're sticking it to you.
- if you borrow $$ from Lefty the loan shark and don't pay him back,
he'll break both your legs - something he most certainly will have
explained in advance.
James Beck
@cox.net says...
> On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 09:38:22 -0400, "Geoff" <geb...@yahoo.nospam.com> wrote:
>
> >Been looking for gods for 10k years. No word from the big guy yet. Why can't
> >theist answer this?
>
> 10 thousand years???? Wow, you must have really dry skin.
>
> duke, American-American
Well at least he doesn't have calluses on his knees from kneeling in
front of those priests.
Ben Goren
> Puke puked:
>> Geoff wrote:
>>
>>> Been looking for gods for 10k years. No word from the big guy
>>> yet. Why can't theist answer this?
>>
>> 10 thousand years???? Wow, you must have really dry skin.
>
> Well at least he doesn't have calluses on his knees from
> kneeling in front of those priests.
Oh, Puke has *lots* of calluses from kneeling in front of his
priests.
And most of them aren't even below the belt....
Smiler
"Ben Goren" <b...@trumpetpower.com> wrote in message
news:1209740566_1286@isp.n...
> James Beck wrote:
>
> > Puke puked:
> >> Geoff wrote:
> >>
> >>> Been looking for gods for 10k years. No word from the big guy
> >>> yet. Why can't theist answer this?
> >>
> >> 10 thousand years???? Wow, you must have really dry skin.
> >
> > Well at least he doesn't have calluses on his knees from
> > kneeling in front of those priests.
>
> Oh, Puke has *lots* of calluses from kneeling in front of his
> priests.
>
> And most of them aren't even below the belt....
>
Just curious, but can one get callouses on the anus?
Geoff
> Well, then be warned, that I have delivered the message of God.\
OK...thanks for stopping by...tell God we miss him.
Geoff
>> Take the universe and grind it down to the finest powder and sieve it
>> through with the finest sieve and then show me one
>> atom of justice, one molecule of mercy. And yet you act as if there
>> were some sort of rightness in the universe by which it
>> may be judged.
>>
>
> Well, can't you see, that all major religions accept the updatation of
> the messengership of God through Muhammadan Islam.
What the fuck is an "updation"?
> God is just waiting, till after death, there will be no more chance
> back, but eternal torment only. Be Warned!
>
> God is communicating through messengers, not directly, because it is
> our test.
It's a failing strategy. Guess he's not so smart.
Geoff
> On Mon, 28 Apr 2008 09:38:22 -0400, "Geoff" <geb...@yahoo.nospam.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Been looking for gods for 10k years. No word from the big guy yet.
>> Why can't theist answer this?
>
> 10 thousand years???? Wow, you must have really dry skin.
And after all this searching with nothing to show for it, you still believe.
Wow, you must have a really dry brain.
turtoni
meg
I can write stories too
About 569 AD Allah and his faithful companion Clyde (the camel) was
wandering the desert looking for his misplaced lantern (hence: genie)
so he could get back to paradise. It had been a long time and he had
looked many places and was tired and lonely you understand, missing
his 37 virgins in paradise. Late one evening as He and Clyde snuggled
around the campfire (it gets cold in the desert at night) Allah was
overcome with longings and Clyde was starting to look pretty good.
Well, first is was sharing tea and a little chit chat about life back
home and missed opportunities and before he knew it, Clyde and Allah
were more than friends. Mohammad was born the following year, so it
is understandable why having sex with a Camel is not forbidden in the
Koran. We like to call him "Mo."
Smiler
"turtoni" <tur...@fastmail.net> wrote in message
news:68e2e704-0541-4a77...@b1g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teMlv3ripSM
I saw the original and have seen it many times since. It's still good,
though, but it doesn't answer my question about callouses :-)