The First Tool-Using Invertebrate - And it's an Octopus of Course!

Budikka666

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Dec 15, 2009, 4:58:08 PM12/15/09

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http://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822%2809%2901914-9

Budikka

Firelock

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Dec 15, 2009, 6:15:59 PM12/15/09

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On Dec 15, 4:58 pm, Budikka666 <budik...@netscape.net> wrote:
> http://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822%2809%2901914-9
>

I love what they did with these guys in that sci-fi show "The Future
is Wild".
Far future with humans gone, Octopi were slated to work their way up
to next intelligent species...they had a pride of tree-octopi swinging
through the branches.

--
Walt

Mark Evans

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Dec 15, 2009, 11:48:05 PM12/15/09

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Northwest Tree Octopi?

Tim McGaughy

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Dec 16, 2009, 9:40:58 AM12/16/09

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Budikka666 wrote:
> http://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822%2809%2901914-9
>
> Budikka

I seriously don't get why people are so surprised by this. We've already
got craploads of studies showing that they're clever problem solvers.
And really, this is one of the simplest behaviors they could exhibit, on
par with a hermit crab finding a shell to live in.

harry k

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Dec 16, 2009, 10:47:35 AM12/16/09

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Exactly and what is the difference between the hermit crab and the
octopus. Both are using tools. The hermit crab even decorates the
shell.

There are also the octopi that use jars and cans as houses.

Harry K

Budikka666

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Dec 17, 2009, 4:44:15 PM12/17/09

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On Dec 16, 9:47 am, harry k <turnkey4...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Dec 16, 6:40 am, Tim McGaughy <tee...@toast.net> wrote:
>
> > Budikka666 wrote:
> > >http://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822%2809%2901914-9
>
> > > Budikka
>
> > I seriously don't get why people are so surprised by this. We've already
> > got craploads of studies showing that they're clever problem solvers.
> > And really, this is one of the simplest behaviors they could exhibit, on
> > par with a hermit crab finding a shell to live in.
>
> Exactly and what is the difference between the hermit crab and the
> octopus.

One's in the phylum Mollusca, and the other's in Arthropoda. I'll
leave it up to you to work it out!

Seriously, the question about how this differs from a hermit crab is
addressed in the science blogs. I'm not sure if it's in the one I
referenced, but there are several other current blogs on the topic.

Budikka

Richo

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Dec 17, 2009, 4:54:56 PM12/17/09

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On Dec 16, 8:58 am, Budikka666 <budik...@netscape.net> wrote:
> http://www.cell.com/current-biology/fulltext/S0960-9822%2809%2901914-9
>

> Budikka

Great story.
Cephalopods are just too cool.

Mark.

Richo

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Dec 17, 2009, 5:42:27 PM12/17/09

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We can still learn/ be suprised by how clever cephalapods are - cause
we can see them doing new things and observe new behaviour. We dont
know everything there is to know yet.

There is also a possible difference between this behaviour and the
hermit crab - the hermit crab is programmed by instinct and the the
octopus is using ineligence/planning.
A spiders web is an amazing structure - but each new spider isnt a
genius for re-inventing the web.
Its an amazingly sophisticated robot following its programming.

Each octopus that figures out - "hey I can use a shell as a hardhat" -
may be showing off her inteligence.

Is the octopus like the hermit crab or is it like the chimp that uses
a twig to fish out termites?
Pure instinct or inteligence/learning or ...what?
Interesting question.

Mark