Police rescue Canadian sex slave
Bacchae
http://www.canada.com/calgaryherald/news/story.html?id=56732a85-7ecc-4b27-92eb-d0fbee96658b&k=17873
"Police in Britain have rescued a "trapped" Canadian woman from a
sex-slavery sect in northeast England.
Durham Police raided a house in Darlington after receiving reports a
29-year-old Canadian "slave" could not leave because she had burned her
passport and airline ticket.
The woman met the group's leader, Lee Thompson, through the Internet and
quickly moved to Darlington, 400 kilometres north of London. Members of the
subculture call themselves Kaotians and follow the Chronicles of Gor, 26
science fiction novels from the 1960s filled with explicit sex scenes
involving slavery, sadism and bondage.
...
Mr. Thompson's Kaotian sect is an offshoot of the Goreans, who adhere to the
belief system in the Gor novels of John Lange Jr., a U.S. college professor
who uses the pen name John Norman. Society in the books is organized into
castes."
- Sandy
Jez
overpowered the fantasy, so they should have let her go. Safe, Sane,
Consentual; but you all know that......but on the other side....it was
kind of silly to burn her passort and plane ticket home.
If a Dom told me to do that I think I'd tell them to get stuffed; ah
well, live and learn. I hope she's ok.
Brian Downstairs
committed, so I'd suggest this is probably a bit of a much ado about
nothing.
It is indeed funny though how the same incident can be treated in many
different ways by the media.
I personally think the main problem with this guy is not appreciating that
the locals where they live are going be freaked out by a girl on a leash.
I havre listened to several local radio reports about this and the one from
a Brighton (Sussex) resident more or less said that the sight of a girl or
boy, for that matter, on a leash is nothing out of the ordinary here.
Brian
--
switc...@blueyonder.co.uk
Brian's private email.
Only my Eyes are blind...
Bring on the spam!
"Bacchae" <bac...@nopamtelusplanet.net> wrote in message
news:odJbg.32177$fV1.2272@edtnps82...
Brian Downstairs
it when whe was sure. Too hasty, and yes, some people are just a bit naive
about things .
Brian
--
switc...@blueyonder.co.uk
Brian's private email.
Only my Eyes are blind...
Bring on the spam!
"Jez" <puzzl...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1148179126....@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
M. Shirley Chong
> From:
> http://www.canada.com/calgaryherald/news/story.html?id=56732a85-7ecc-4b27-92eb-d0fbee96658b&k=17873
I was this on BBC:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/4996410.stm
Despite the dramatic headlines, the story is fairly tame. A Canadian
woman went to live there and burned her passport and return ticket.
When she decided she wanted to leave, she contacted a friend in
Texas who may have over-reacted.
Police filed no charges and the Canadian embassy got her back home
again.
Shirley
M. Shirley Chong
> she did say she changed her mind once she got there and the reality
> overpowered the fantasy, so they should have let her go.
The BBC report made it clear that she was a willing participant and
not being held against her will. It sounds to me like the biggest
thing holding her back was the missing passport and not having her
return ticket. It sounds like her friend in Texas may have
over-reacted by contacting the police.
I doubt the police would have failed to file charges if they'd
thought she had been held against her will.
> Safe, Sane,
> Consentual; but you all know that......but on the other side....it was
> kind of silly to burn her passort and plane ticket home.
>
> If a Dom told me to do that I think I'd tell them to get stuffed; ah
> well, live and learn. I hope she's ok.
She's back in Canada and, one hopes, somewhat wiser now.
Shirley
Stephen Harris
> return ticket. It sounds like her friend in Texas may have
> over-reacted by contacting the police.
A few people have used the word "over-reacted" here (and in other
forums), but if I had set up a safety call, or regular contact, and that
person thought I was in distress or in trouble then I would _want_ them
to over-react, call the police, scream murder. If it turns out to be an
over-reaction then the police can be calmed down later.
Doing so may even cost my any reputation (because of harm to the
dominant that this action may cause) and preclude me from ever playing
in the scene again (as a dangerous player) but it's my life on the line,
after all.
This _is_ what a safety call is all about!
Of course I've never gotten myself into a situation where my safety-call
has had to do anything except worry about me, so the question has never
arose.
--
rgds, Stephen "Pleasure, little treasure"
An Englishman in New York, and loving slave to his Mistress, Tori.
BDSM thoughts, writings, poems and stuff: http://bdsm.spuddy.org/
Newsgroup charter, FAQs etc at http://bdsm.spuddy.org/newsgroups/
Ron
the police had been called before, but could not find 'illegal'
activities
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2-2186588,00.html
Ron
M. Shirley Chong
>>return ticket. It sounds like her friend in Texas may have
>>over-reacted by contacting the police.
Stephen Harris wrote:
> A few people have used the word "over-reacted" here (and in other
> forums), but if I had set up a safety call, or regular contact, and that
> person thought I was in distress or in trouble then I would _want_ them
> to over-react, call the police, scream murder. If it turns out to be an
> over-reaction then the police can be calmed down later.
Yes, after the dominant has been thoroughly outed to their
neighbors, community and possibly (probably, considering the news
coverage) employer. Do you have any plan for remedying the harm caused?
The story made it clear that the problem was *NOT* that she was
being held against her will. The police raided and investigated and
are convinced she was not being held against her will.
As the problem concerned a missing passport and return ticket, I'd
think the reasonable thing to do would be to refer the woman to the
Canadian embassy rather than the police. The Canadian embassy can
actually remedy the situation (as they did).
> Doing so may even cost my any reputation (because of harm to the
> dominant that this action may cause) and preclude me from ever playing
> in the scene again (as a dangerous player) but it's my life on the line,
> after all.
>
> This _is_ what a safety call is all about!
>
> Of course I've never gotten myself into a situation where my safety-call
> has had to do anything except worry about me, so the question has never
> arose.
I hope that anyone you trusted enough to act as your safety call
would be sensible enough to tell you "Stephen, contact the British
embassy, they'll straighten out your passport and figure out how to
get you home again. Do you have any reason to think that the person
you're staying with won't allow you to contact the British Embassy?"
Shirley
Golden California Girls
> I wrote:
>
>>> return ticket. It sounds like her friend in Texas may have
>>> over-reacted by contacting the police.
>
> Stephen Harris wrote:
>
>> A few people have used the word "over-reacted" here (and in other
>> forums), but if I had set up a safety call, or regular contact, and that
>> person thought I was in distress or in trouble then I would _want_ them
>> to over-react, call the police, scream murder. If it turns out to be an
>> over-reaction then the police can be calmed down later.
>
> Yes, after the dominant has been thoroughly outed to their neighbors,
> community and possibly (probably, considering the news coverage)
> employer. Do you have any plan for remedying the harm caused?
What harm? The dominant was walking his slaves around town on leashes.
That is as out as you can get except maybe doing your scenes in the
front yard.
> The story made it clear that the problem was *NOT* that she was being
> held against her will. The police raided and investigated and are
> convinced she was not being held against her will.
>
> As the problem concerned a missing passport and return ticket, I'd think
> the reasonable thing to do would be to refer the woman to the Canadian
> embassy rather than the police. The Canadian embassy can actually remedy
> the situation (as they did).
>
>> Doing so may even cost my any reputation (because of harm to the
>> dominant that this action may cause) and preclude me from ever playing
>> in the scene again (as a dangerous player) but it's my life on the line,
>> after all.
>>
>> This _is_ what a safety call is all about!
>>
>> Of course I've never gotten myself into a situation where my safety-call
>> has had to do anything except worry about me, so the question has never
>> arose.
>
> I hope that anyone you trusted enough to act as your safety call would
> be sensible enough to tell you "Stephen, contact the British embassy,
> they'll straighten out your passport and figure out how to get you home
> again. Do you have any reason to think that the person you're staying
> with won't allow you to contact the British Embassy?"
You are making a huge unwarranted assumption about what the woman said
to the safety call person. Second you are assuming this second person
was a safety call person. Third you are assuming the embassy would do
anything absent police intervention. Fourth you are assuming that if
this woman walked out the door of the slave house that she could somehow
support herself long enough for the embassy to get around to getting her
a replacement passport and have the funds to purchase a replacement
airline ticket. Fifth leaving a country on a passport that doesn't have
an entry stamp isn't always easy.
These facts are not in evidence and the conclusion is not warranted.
> Shirley
Steve Pope
been wondering: if the woman had been American instead
of Canadian, would our U.S. consular officials had acted
on her friend's request to look into it and help her
return home?
My guess is they would have done diddly-squat. Or
perhaps started wiretapping her friend.
Steve
M. Shirley Chong
>>> A few people have used the word "over-reacted" here (and in other
>>> forums), but if I had set up a safety call, or regular contact, and that
>>> person thought I was in distress or in trouble then I would _want_ them
>>> to over-react, call the police, scream murder. If it turns out to be an
>>> over-reaction then the police can be calmed down later.
I wrote:
>> Yes, after the dominant has been thoroughly outed to their neighbors,
>> community and possibly (probably, considering the news coverage)
>> employer. Do you have any plan for remedying the harm caused?
Golden California Girls wrote:
> What harm? The dominant was walking his slaves around town on leashes.
> That is as out as you can get except maybe doing your scenes in the
> front yard.
Mileage varies, I guess. Having lived in two college towns, I don't
assume that someone leading someone else around on a leash and
collar is into BDSM or into anything else other than putting a leash
on someone else.
One incident was cited, which does not to me add up to a pattern.
> You are making a huge unwarranted assumption about what the woman said
> to the safety call person.
I'm assuming it was something that caused someone to call the
police. Which seems a little overboard for the reality of the matter.
> Second you are assuming this second person
> was a safety call person.
Stephen made that assumption. For the sake of discussion, I went
along with it.
> Third you are assuming the embassy would do
> anything absent police intervention.
Huh? That's pretty much what embassies *do*. Although I should have
used the term consulate (couldn't remember it before, memory like a
steel sieve anymore).
Embassies and consulates are more than just envoys to another
nation, they're also there to give assistance to citizens of their
own country who need help. No police intervention needed, just a
citizen who contacts them and tells them they need help. There's no
requirement for a police report in order to obtain assistance from a
USAn consulate or embassy in replacing a passport or getting
financial assistance.
I am assuming that Canada's consulates and embassies operate in much
the same manner as the USAn. I know that the Korean embassies and
consulates operate under pretty much the same rules as USAn ones, so
assuming that Canada (which resembles the USA more than it resembles
South Korea) is likely to be pretty similar.
> Fourth you are assuming that if
> this woman walked out the door of the slave house that she could somehow
> support herself long enough for the embassy to get around to getting her
> a replacement passport and have the funds to purchase a replacement
> airline ticket.
Again, HUH? That's what embassies and consulates *do*. A lot of
their work is basically social work for the international traveller.
Yes, she'd have to support herself for a few days. If she had run
out of funds, the consulate will generally refer her to a place to
stay on the cheap and loan her the funds to do so. In some places,
the embassy or consulate will provide housing; in a place like
England, with generously available safe housing options for
travellers, they'd be more likely to refer than to provide.
With a USAn consulate or embassy, unless there's a life and death
situation involved (for instance, the imminent death of a family
member back home) a petitioner has to wait until normal business
hours. That could be as long as three days.
In an emergency situation, every USAn embassy or consulate has a
duty officer whose job is to expedite things like passport
replacements and/or travel arrangements.
Once the application for replacement of a passport is made, it's
generally completed by the end of that business day. If there's any
doubts about some aspect of the replacement, the duty officer can
choose to issue a temporary passport; that is a passport that is
only good for 3 months (rather than the standard 10 years) and can
only be used for travel back to the USA. Again, I'm assuming
Canadian rules are probably pretty similar.
> Fifth leaving a country on a passport that doesn't have
> an entry stamp isn't always easy.
Well, it requires one to make a detour to the embassy/consulate and
a wait of up to several hours while one's story is confirmed. If
full confirmation (in the opinion of the duty officer) can't be
obtained that day, you might end up with a temporary passport rather
than a full passport. Which would limit the carrier to returning to
their own country rather than travelling on to another country.
Leaving a country like Great Britain to return home again is not
difficult at all. The British don't want to keep the citizens of
other countries and they figure that if there's a problem, the port
of entry personnel at the destination can deal with it.
I wonder if most people are so full of misconceptions about the role
that embassies and consulates play? I learned all this stuff by
travelling overseas and by having family members in three different
countries who have done the same. I am guilty of thinking that
anyone who travels outside their own country would exercise a bit of
due prudence and learn about these things, just in case.
Shirley
Canis Ridiculous
-0500
<e4tbck$dg2$1...@news.netins.net>
>I wonder if most people are so full of misconceptions about the role
>that embassies and consulates play?
Interesting twist: what's more relevant, the services the consulate
provides, or the services the traveller *thinks* it provides?
--
Canis perro...@yahoo.com
Ridiculous
"Look at the habtual masturbator ... feel his damp and chilling hand!"
--Henry Guernsey
M. Shirley Chong
>>I wonder if most people are so full of misconceptions about the role
>>that embassies and consulates play?
Canis Ridiculous wrote:
> Interesting twist: what's more relevant, the services the consulate
> provides, or the services the traveller *thinks* it provides?
Probably the services that the traveller thinks are available.
However, I think a traveller of average intelligence would at least
go online to read about their country's consular services before
departure, just in case.
Doesn't have to involve a "sex cult." People lose or misplace their
passports a lot. You name it and a consulate officer has probably
heard it.
The consulate doesn't want people stuck any longer than they have to
be. Countries don't want to involuntarily host other nation's
citizens. Basically, everyone just wants people to get home again as
quickly as possible.
Shirley
Golden California Girls
> Stephen Harris wrote:
>
>>>> A few people have used the word "over-reacted" here (and in other
>>>> forums), but if I had set up a safety call, or regular contact, and
>>>> that
>>>> person thought I was in distress or in trouble then I would _want_ them
>>>> to over-react, call the police, scream murder. If it turns out to
>>>> be an
>>>> over-reaction then the police can be calmed down later.
>
> I wrote:
>
>>> Yes, after the dominant has been thoroughly outed to their neighbors,
>>> community and possibly (probably, considering the news coverage)
>>> employer. Do you have any plan for remedying the harm caused?
>
> Golden California Girls wrote:
>
>> What harm? The dominant was walking his slaves around town on
>> leashes. That is as out as you can get except maybe doing your scenes
>> in the front yard.
>
> Mileage varies, I guess. Having lived in two college towns, I don't
> assume that someone leading someone else around on a leash and collar is
> into BDSM or into anything else other than putting a leash on someone else.
>
> One incident was cited, which does not to me add up to a pattern.
I thought I saw that he was known for this until he went somewhere less
appropriate for this to be seen by vanilla's and someone called the cops
to investigate him. That would be a pattern.
>> You are making a huge unwarranted assumption about what the woman said
>> to the safety call person.
>
> I'm assuming it was something that caused someone to call the police.
> Which seems a little overboard for the reality of the matter.
It is for the woman in question, but not necessarily for the person on
the other end of the phone who could have heard "held captive" and
"burned my passport and ticket home" and not heard "made myself a captive."
>> Second you are assuming this second person was a safety call person.
>
> Stephen made that assumption. For the sake of discussion, I went along
> with it.
>
>> Third you are assuming the embassy would do anything absent police
>> intervention.
>
> Huh? That's pretty much what embassies *do*. Although I should have used
> the term consulate (couldn't remember it before, memory like a steel
> sieve anymore).
You show up at consulate without ID and tell them you deliberately
burned your passport and return ticket. (I'm assuming that the "cult"
made her burn not only her passport but her ID.) Deliberately burning
your own passport is likely going to be taken as an act renouncing your
citizenship. No ID and it is going to be a some extended period of time
while that gets verified.
Now if you tell them it was because you wanted to be a sex slave,
suddenly you will be the target of an investigation to see if you have
broken any laws of your home country. (USA n's get busted all the time
for hiring under US age but legal by host country law prostitutes.)
Also the embassy may notify the host country and have their police start
an investigation which could lead to you being arrested for breaking the
host countries laws, overstay?!
Never mind you do have to have the means to travel to the consulate to
request aid in the first place.
> Embassies and consulates are more than just envoys to another nation,
> they're also there to give assistance to citizens of their own country
> who need help. No police intervention needed, just a citizen who
> contacts them and tells them they need help. There's no requirement for
> a police report in order to obtain assistance from a USAn consulate or
> embassy in replacing a passport or getting financial assistance.
Perhaps, but I'm betting that you get better service if you tell them it
was lost/stolen rather than you deliberately destroyed it yourself.
GB to Canada is likely very easy. I meant in general as there are
nations who assume everyone from western democracies are spies.
Anything out of order and you aren't going for a while. That could mean
local police reports in hand on the theft of your passport and even a
replacement visa. Crossing some borders is more difficult that others.
(Try to enter certain Arab countries with an Israeli visa stamp in
your passport!)
M. Shirley Chong
> I thought I saw that he was known for this until he went somewhere less
> appropriate for this to be seen by vanilla's and someone called the cops
> to investigate him. That would be a pattern.
The news accounts I read said he'd been asked not to return to the
butcher's shop because he led a woman in there on lead.
> You show up at consulate without ID and tell them you deliberately
> burned your passport and return ticket. (I'm assuming that the "cult"
> made her burn not only her passport but her ID.) Deliberately burning
> your own passport is likely going to be taken as an act renouncing your
> citizenship. No ID and it is going to be a some extended period of time
> while that gets verified.
Yes, it may well take eight hours for the duty officer to come to a
final decision and it's quite likely that the victim will come away
with a temporary passport rather than a regular passport.
If at all possible, the consulates try to get people in and out
again in one business day. They don't want someone hanging around
and neither does the host country.
For USAn citizens, the duty officer only needs to be able to reach
*one* person who is in the USA and will verify that the person in
their office is indeed their family member/former co-worker/friend,
who is a USAn citizen. They also check the State Department's list
of suspicious persons. If all is well, they issue a temporary or
regular passport.
When the victim returns to the USA, they may well face a period of
questioning by Office of Homeland Security officials and/or the FBI.
The consulates don't really want to get involved in all that. The
vast majority of the people they help every single day are normal
folks who have had some mishap or done something foolish--like burn
their passport and return ticket (believe me, they've heard it all).
> Now if you tell them it was because you wanted to be a sex slave,
> suddenly you will be the target of an investigation to see if you have
> broken any laws of your home country. (USA n's get busted all the time
> for hiring under US age but legal by host country law prostitutes.) Also
> the embassy may notify the host country and have their police start an
> investigation which could lead to you being arrested for breaking the
> host countries laws, overstay?!
I doubt that would happen. Consulate officers have heard it all.
Someone who appears to be over 21 and claims to have wanted to be a
sex slave (as opposed to being kidnapped to be a sex slave) is
unlikely to trigger a criminal investigation. What exactly would be
the crime involved? Criminal stupidity isn't a prosecutable offense.
Overstaying a visa is usually hot a high level problem. Unless the
host country has good reason to think you're a criminal (more than
simply admitting you travelled voluntarily to the host country to
live voluntarily as a sex slave), they'd rather just get rid of you.
If you're in the consulate asking to go home, the quickest way for
the host country to get rid of you is to let the consulate deal with it.
You may well be warned that you won't be welcome back but even
that's not a given.
> Never mind you do have to have the means to travel to the consulate to
> request aid in the first place.
You can apply by telephone and the consulate will extend a loan to
cover public transportation if necessary.
> Perhaps, but I'm betting that you get better service if you tell them it
> was lost/stolen rather than you deliberately destroyed it yourself.
It would probably avert a certain amount of embarrassment and
perhaps a little covert eye rolling by the duty officer but that's
about it.
> GB to Canada is likely very easy.
We were discussing Great Britain to Canada or the USA, I thought.
What I've said so far also applies to the Republic of Korea's
consulates and embassies as well. In fact, my experience with Korean
consulates is the most extensive.
> I meant in general as there are
> nations who assume everyone from western democracies are spies. Anything
> out of order and you aren't going for a while.
But we were talking about Great Britain, Canada or the USA.
As for other countries, it depends largely on the political
situation at the time along with the judgment of the individual
officials you meet along the way.
In most third world countries, so long as there's no whiff of drug
smuggling about you, you're probably fine. They don't have money, so
they're likely to shake you down for any loose cash you have and
then let your consulate deal with you.
> That could mean local
> police reports in hand on the theft of your passport and even a
> replacement visa.
We were discussing Great Britain, Canada and the USA. For the USA,
you do not need to make a police report in order to receive
assistance. You just don't have to, period.
If all you want to do is return home as quickly as possible, the
host country is likely to just let you go.
> Crossing some borders is more difficult that others.
> (Try to enter certain Arab countries with an Israeli visa stamp in your
> passport!)
However, we weren't discussing the Arab world or Israel. We were
discussing Great Britain, Canada and the USA.
As a point of interest, my sister was travelling in Europe in 1974.
She crossed from Cyprus into Turkey two days before Turkey invaded
Cyprus. With no problems at all.
Shirley
Canis Ridiculous
-0500
<e4tpmb$nj7$1...@news.netins.net>
>Doesn't have to involve a "sex cult."
Well, there go *my* plans for the evening.