'boy' and 'restraint'
ri...@snowcrest.net
I was thinking about a couple of things in the past week or so.
First, i was thinking about the word "boy" in terms of a domme/sub
relationship. Whenever i have been with a domme, often she refers to me
as "boy." "Good boy", "Be a good boy and...", etc. (don't hear bad boy
very often - is that good or bad?). i hear HER in conversations to other
dommes: "Oh he is a good boy". I look at magazines such as WHAP
magazine and otheres and i not only see in text the use of "Boy" in
terms of disciplining him, but also, the pictures sometimes show a woman
who must be 3 times the size of this man-boy.
My question for dommes is : Do you really see him as a boy (like a
mother disciplining a little boy) or a man whom you call "boy". What
does "boy" mean to you? What if he is a lot older than you? Is he
still "boy"
Secondly, (this has't been the first time) i have been wearing these
various cock rings for almost a month by now, (one has all these metal
nibs that push in the skin, the other is just made of leather with
snaps). While i originally starting wearing them to train myself not to
pee standing up, i now wear them to think about, respect, and honor
someone i have met recently. Since i wear them 24 hours a day, i have
been thinking about not only my reactions but about sexual control of a
male by a domme. i definitely have not forgotten that i have a penis,
that is for sure. Au contraire, i am constantly aware of my cock and
when i start getting aroused. And i don't lose focus of why it is there
(since i have not gone to the bathroom standing up for awhile now, and i
think about her all the time). My question then is what is the purpose
of this kind of control on a male? Is it to stop him from having sexual
thoughts or getting aroused? Is it to keep him in a constant state of
sexual sensitivity and/or arousal to either tease him or torture him
until you decide he should have release or not have release? Is it to
keep him focused on who owns his genitals? Is it to give you more power
over him (more a power thing) than a sexual control method? i am
curious to know what women who have their males in some sort of genital
restraint and/or sexual training think about this.
thank you
rikar
ICQ #1418297
email okay
Bacchae
ri...@snowcrest.net wrote in message <370F9743...@snowcrest.net>...
>To All:
>
>I was thinking about a couple of things in the past week or so.
>
>First, i was thinking about the word "boy" in terms of a domme/sub
>relationship. Whenever i have been with a domme, often she refers to me
>as "boy." "Good boy", "Be a good boy and...", etc. (don't hear bad boy
>very often - is that good or bad?). i hear HER in conversations to other
>dommes: "Oh he is a good boy". I look at magazines such as WHAP
>magazine and otheres and i not only see in text the use of "Boy" in
>terms of disciplining him, but also, the pictures sometimes show a woman
>who must be 3 times the size of this man-boy.
>My question for dommes is : Do you really see him as a boy (like a
>mother disciplining a little boy) or a man whom you call "boy". What
>does "boy" mean to you? What if he is a lot older than you? Is he
>still "boy"
I use the term "boy" to refer to some of *my* male submissives because, for
me, boys aren't as big and furry and stinky as *men* (not that big and furry
is always a bad thing not to mention that some male submissives ARE big and
furry but still *boys* despite that). Men are things like my Dad: thick of
neck and bullheaded of skull. I don't see many similarities between *men*
who are blustery and "must have our way or we bellow"-ish and the sweet,
gentle, obedient person I want to be domming.
I think in this context being called a "boy" is complimentary. It takes a
special mentality to consciously be as sweet, pliant, forth-coming, giving,
accepting...as a *boy*.
I have been with male submissives who aren't *boys* because they are
um....hard-cases. They may well be as accepting to certain activities but
internalize what you are doing in a way that isn't necessarily submission,
it is more like they are being ah, brave or resistant to torture. For me
there is a real sort of difference between this sort of male submissive and
a *boy*. I guess they are still a submissive because there is a nuance
there that *is* submission to the domme but it is like a dignity thing (not
that *boys* don't have dignity).
I fear I am explaining this badly. Perhaps the male submissives who I do
_not_ consider *boys* are more bottoms than submissives.
*Boys* to me are like my nephew who is still a teenager and my friend's 12
year old son. They are still sweet, active, reasonably obedient, very
attached and affectionate to you, very interactive, accepting of your
personal authority and willing. The hard-cases seem to agonize more over
their submission, it's more "painful" to them, causes more angst and they
"hook-on" to you in a different way when you are domming them.
>
>Secondly, (this has't been the first time) i have been wearing these
>various cock rings for almost a month by now, (one has all these metal
>nibs that push in the skin, the other is just made of leather with
>snaps). While i originally starting wearing them to train myself not to
>pee standing up, i now wear them to think about, respect, and honor
>someone i have met recently. Since i wear them 24 hours a day, i have
>been thinking about not only my reactions but about sexual control of a
>male by a domme. i definitely have not forgotten that i have a penis,
>that is for sure. Au contraire, i am constantly aware of my cock and
>when i start getting aroused. And i don't lose focus of why it is there
>(since i have not gone to the bathroom standing up for awhile now, and i
>think about her all the time). My question then is what is the purpose
>of this kind of control on a male? Is it to stop him from having sexual
>thoughts or getting aroused? Is it to keep him in a constant state of
>sexual sensitivity and/or arousal to either tease him or torture him
>until you decide he should have release or not have release? Is it to
>keep him focused on who owns his genitals? Is it to give you more power
>over him (more a power thing) than a sexual control method? i am
>curious to know what women who have their males in some sort of genital
>restraint and/or sexual training think about this.
Um, how about all of the above? Part of the thrill of possession is
*knowing* the male submissive is tripping on the things we have done to you.
As a dominant we _want_ you to be feeling that rubbery feeling all day long.
We want your knees weak, we want to be the source of all these confusing
emotions and sexual feelings. Our possessing those feelings are almost as
much fun as the possession of you! <if other dominants don't agree with me
lumping them into my style please feel free to consider my use of "we" as
the royal form>
The feelings of confusion you feel until you finally just submit utterly are
um....big power providers. Let's just say that you transmit on some
interesting power frequencies when you are still dealing with all these
issues. The transmission becomes more groomed and organized as you become
more comfortable with your submission.
Of course, others' views may vary.
>
>thank you
>rikar
>ICQ #1418297
>email okay
- Sandy
bacchae at cadvision dot com
MsJudi
>First, i was thinking about the word "boy" in terms of a domme/sub
>relationship. Whenever i have been with a domme, often she refers to me
>as "boy." "Good boy", "Be a good boy and...", etc. (don't hear bad boy
>very often - is that good or bad?). i hear HER in conversations to other
>dommes: "Oh he is a good boy". I look at magazines such as WHAP
>magazine and otheres and i not only see in text the use of "Boy" in
>terms of disciplining him, but also, the pictures sometimes show a woman
>who must be 3 times the size of this man-boy.
>My question for dommes is : Do you really see him as a boy (like a
>mother disciplining a little boy) or a man whom you call "boy". What
>does "boy" mean to you? What if he is a lot older than you? Is he
>still "boy"
With my current play toy, I use it as a term of humiliation and
praise. He is hardly a *boy*... he is 3 years older than I am, and
slightly taller (I have to reach *up* to grab his hair in my greedy
little fingers ;) I use it when he has been bad... "shut your mouth,
boy!" and when he has been good, "there's my good boy." I also use
other terms as well... whichever ones suit the situation... "you're my
good slut, aren't you?" ... "does precious hate that?" ... even "is he
my good little girl?"
All depends on my mood.... and my goal ;)
>My question then is what is the purpose
>of this kind of control on a male? Is it to stop him from having sexual
>thoughts or getting aroused?
Sometimes.
>Is it to keep him in a constant state of
>sexual sensitivity and/or arousal to either tease him or torture him
>until you decide he should have release or not have release?
Sometimes.
>Is it to
>keep him focused on who owns his genitals?
Sometimes.
> Is it to give you more power
>over him (more a power thing) than a sexual control method?
Sometimes.
MsJudi
SSBB Diplomatic Corps. Houston, Tx
T. Eckhart
>My question for dommes is : Do you really see him as a boy (like a
>mother disciplining a little boy) or a man whom you call "boy". What
>does "boy" mean to you? What if he is a lot older than you? Is he
>still "boy"
I use "boy" as the term has been used in historical slavery -- to
emphasis the heirarchial different in the relationship where one party
does not have the responsibilities and rights of the other similar to the
differences between adults and children but not the same of these.
Example: Greek "pais" or Latin "puer" is the same term used for "child"
or "boy" as used for "slave". The word "boy" can either be used
affectionately or negatively depending on the tone and the context and the
relationship.
The same is true for the word "girl" which many women hate to be
called because they feel it belittles their status as citizens and human
beings by denying adulthood (no comment on this now it isn't a political
forum). I think it is one of these words that can seem very negative for
vanillas and some kinky folks because of negative historical associations.
I use it in an affectionate way primarily but then I use a lot of
words which could be negative in an affectionate way. The key is to avoid
the words that are limits for my partners or, if they wish, help them
recast the word in a better light.
As to your question about cock rings and their purpose ... I can
only say that I view all sexual control and power as a powerful gift my
partner has given me, a very strong turn on but one I do not take lightly.
Generally I use such power to help my partner separate his body from his
mind and his emotions so that he can appreciate both and not be controled
by either. I see the mind as the greater sex organ when compared to the
penis so I see mental contract as more valuable but the understanding of
this needs to be achieved first and some folks might see a cock ring as a
way to this goal. Or perhaps they are just kinky?
--
--
Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips, & Chains,
TammyJo Eckhart (teck...@kiva.net)
http://www.kiva.net/~teckhart/
"I'm going to take you higher, and that's no lie." -- Savage Garden
T. Eckhart
>I fear I am explaining this badly. Perhaps the male submissives who I do
>_not_ consider *boys* are more bottoms than submissives.
*click*
Yeah, I don't use these nickname with folks I'm just topping only
when Ds is involved.
M
Bacchae <bac...@nospam.cadvision.com> wrote:
> *Boys* to me are like my nephew who is still a teenager and my friend's
> 12 year old son. They are still sweet, active, reasonably obedient,
> very attached and affectionate to you, very interactive, accepting of
> your personal authority and willing.
That doesn't describe any teen or pre-teen boy I know -- including what I
remember of me at that age.
Mike H
* Daddy, what does FORMATTING DRIVE C: mean?
--
Please do not post adverts here. Before posting here please
read the charter available at:
<http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/mharvey/bdsm/chart.html> or:
<http://www.tpe.com/ssbbf.html>
Bacchae
>In article <370fa...@news.cadvision.com>,
> Bacchae <bac...@nospam.cadvision.com> wrote:
>> *Boys* to me are like my nephew who is still a teenager and my friend's
>> 12 year old son. They are still sweet, active, reasonably obedient,
>> very attached and affectionate to you, very interactive, accepting of
>> your personal authority and willing.
>
>That doesn't describe any teen or pre-teen boy I know -- including what I
>remember of me at that age.
>
>Mike H
>
>* Daddy, what does FORMATTING DRIVE C: mean?
>--
I suppose there are a lot of young teenaged boys who aren't as described,
maybe I'm just lucky. It could also be that because I am not their parent
or around them full-time they don't feel a need to carve an autonomous niche
for themselves around me.
Both my nephew and my friend's son have been always perfectly lovely around
me. My nephew, at 16, is my favourite movie date. He gets the popcorn and
drinks, talks about interesting things before the movie starts and waits
patiently till the credits are done at the end of the movie (a personal
quirk of mine that he indulges). He is polite, well-spoken, active in
hockey, helps me make things for my website, has a great sense of humour and
even likes his sister (although he'd never admit it) who is also very dear
to me. My friend's son I know is a bit more of a handful for her but he
couldn't be any sweeter around me.
Maybe it's a Canadian thing <chuckle>.
Mistress Dalila
I hesitated to reply to this because I agree with what others have already
said and usually in those cases I stay in the shadows, but anyhow...
I use the term 'boy' sometimes, and it has different meaning depending on
the mood I'm in. It's mostly with clients thought, and I use other terms as
well (slave, slut, whore, worm, dog, I could go on for ever...), anything
but their name, to emphasize their inferiority.
With my slaves though, I prefer to use their given slave names, and I only
use 'boy', or 'girl', when they've been bad.
As for the other question, I'd say all of the above, I agree with Tammy.
/Ms Dalila
Katharine Hawks
>To All:
>
>I was thinking about a couple of things in the past week or so.
>
>First, i was thinking about the word "boy" in terms of a domme/sub
>relationship. Whenever i have been with a domme, often she refers to me
>as "boy." "Good boy", "Be a good boy and...", etc. (don't hear bad boy
>very often - is that good or bad?). i hear HER in conversations to other
>dommes: "Oh he is a good boy". I look at magazines such as WHAP
>magazine and otheres and i not only see in text the use of "Boy" in
>terms of disciplining him, but also, the pictures sometimes show a woman
>who must be 3 times the size of this man-boy.
>My question for dommes is : Do you really see him as a boy (like a
>mother disciplining a little boy) or a man whom you call "boy". What
>does "boy" mean to you? What if he is a lot older than you? Is he
>still "boy"
It really varies and depends on the energy that the bottom sends out.
I do play with one self-identified boy -- which is both a gender and
age identification for this particular biologically female boy.
"Boy" has a rich and complex set of meanings in leather culture --
from bottom-in-training to a daddy; a juvenile member of a leather
family, a service-oriented, young male identified bottom; an age play
bottom, etc.
When I use the word "boy" with biomale submissives who don't have an
overt boy identity (ie, age play), I'm usually picking up on some kind
of energy they send out. (Not all male submissives have a 'boy'
energy, btw.) Mix in one part innocence, sweetness, and acceptance.
Add a little brat or rebel. Toss in some uncontrolled libido and an
excess of hormones. That, to me, is a boy. <g>
I also think the word picks up on some cultural attitudes toward
children (in particular male children) -- that they are property, that
they are "in training", that they do NOT have rights, that they need
to be disciplined, that they need tough love, etc. I think the role
of mother-disciplinarian is probably the most 'natural' for many
femdoms -- not because of any *innate* desire, rather, simply because
so many of us have been socialized to express power and authority
through *children*, rather than grown men.
Given that, I don't find it surprising that many femdoms, in subtle
ways, treat male submissives like children.
> My question then is what is the purpose
>of this kind of control on a male?
Speaking for myself, the purpose would be this: To associate
erection/arousal with me, and to remind him of who owns that
particular cock.
> Is it to stop him from having sexual
>thoughts or getting aroused?
Again, speaking for myself, it's more likely to be the complete
opposite (ie, to keep him aroused). Men are more fun to control when
their libido is jacked up a notch or two.
> Is it to keep him in a constant state of
>sexual sensitivity and/or arousal to either tease him or torture him
>until you decide he should have release or not have release?
Maybe <g>
> Is it to
>keep him focused on who owns his genitals?
Now you're getting it.
> Is it to give you more power
>over him (more a power thing) than a sexual control method? i am
>curious to know what women who have their males in some sort of genital
>restraint and/or sexual training think about this.
richie, do you seriously think we'd give all our secrets away to you?
Think again :-)
M
Quite possibly. If so, if you could bottle it you'd have plenty of
customers.
> It could also be that because I am not their parent or around them
> full-time they don't feel a need to carve an autonomous niche for
> themselves around me.
This isn't my experience with the teen and pre-teen boys around here.
> My nephew, at 16, is my favourite movie date. He gets the popcorn and
> drinks, talks about interesting things before the movie starts and waits
> patiently till the credits are done at the end of the movie (a personal
> quirk of mine that he indulges). He is polite, well-spoken, active in
> hockey, helps me make things for my website, has a great sense of humour
He sounds like the perfect sub. I hate him already. <G>
> Maybe it's a Canadian thing <chuckle>.
Possibly, I don't have a big enough sample available to check.
Mike H
* Shin - Device for finding furniture in the dark.
roo
under his Owners feet when she gets home that she does not in any way feel a
need to be my mother....(perish the thought..))
Katharine Hawks noted:
>>Mix in one part innocence, sweetness, and acceptance.
Add a little brat or rebel. Toss in some uncontrolled libido and an
excess of hormones. That, to me, is a boy. <g>
LMAO that me to a "T" but i've never been mistaken for boyish in the
juvenile that seems to be prevalant. perhaps i have some other quality not
listed that mitigates the "boy" i donno... i pratice and practice those
"innocent doe eyes" and NOboby ever buys it.....sigh.....
>>simply because
>>so many of us have been socialized to express power and authority
>>through *children*, rather than grown men.
i agree that the social imperitives are in large measure at fault in these
matters and i suppose this should annoy me. as a male sub i get quite enough
sterotyping from both inside and outside the bdsm community. i'll have to
check and see if i have permission to get annoyed....<giggle>
>>Speaking for myself, the purpose would be this: To associate
>>erection/arousal with me, and to remind him of who owns that
>>particular cock.
for that function i have a ring through the head of my cock which attachs
nicely to the padlocked waistchain....LOLOLOL.....hard to forget who owns
what no matter What she calls me...which is usually "Yo Bitch!"
roo
---------
mouthy but useful enough to get away with it
Casey Hamilton
>>My question for dommes is : Do you really see him as a boy (like a
>>mother disciplining a little boy) or a man whom you call "boy". What
>>does "boy" mean to you? What if he is a lot older than you? Is he
>>still "boy"
<snippage>
Katharine Hawks replied, in part:
>When I use the word "boy" with biomale submissives who don't have an
>overt boy identity (ie, age play), I'm usually picking up on some kind
>of energy they send out. (Not all male submissives have a 'boy'
>energy, btw.) Mix in one part innocence, sweetness, and acceptance.
>Add a little brat or rebel. Toss in some uncontrolled libido and an
>excess of hormones. That, to me, is a boy. <g>
Good god, no *wonder* I call Ed my boy (as do *all* the Old Guard
Leather types we know). 'course, it tends to help that in lots of
ways, he's going to be 14 for all time :)
Not too sure about the innocence part, though...
As for the questions about cock-rings, well, Katie got the answers I
would have given had I actually given much brain wattage to them.
--- Casey Hamilton ------------------ ms_kate at io (dot) com ---
It looks like blind screaming hedonism won out.
N.M. Wallace
> On Sat, 10 Apr 1999 11:24:03 -0700, ri...@snowcrest.net wrote:
>
> >My question for dommes is : Do you really see him as a boy (like a
> >mother disciplining a little boy) or a man whom you call "boy". What
> >does "boy" mean to you? What if he is a lot older than you? Is he
> >still "boy"
>
> It really varies and depends on the energy that the bottom sends out.
> I do play with one self-identified boy -- which is both a gender and
> age identification for this particular biologically female boy.
>
> "Boy" has a rich and complex set of meanings in leather culture --
> from bottom-in-training to a daddy; a juvenile member of a leather
> family, a service-oriented, young male identified bottom; an age play
> bottom, etc.
"Boy" and "girl" are both terms of reference that my owner uses for me,
but they have very different feels. "Girl" is another word for "property,"
which is cumbersome for everyday use, and "slave," which I dislike for a
variety of reasons. It is definitely a status indicator for me, as
evidenced by the fact that I get *very* annoyed if anyone else calls me
girl. (I remember in my admin assistant days, someone being told that my
boss was out, and asking to speak to "his girl." I'm very glad I didn't
take the call, because I'd probably have gone ballistic on the guy.)
"Boy" is quite different. When I'm in boyspace, and the gentleman calls me
"his boy," I feel proud to be addressed as such. I was recently at a club
with him, and, during a conversation, another dominant asked if I was his
boy. It was wonderful, both to be acknowledged as his, and to have the
nature of my role recognized. (In contrast, we went to another club with
me in the same jeans, button-down shirt, and tie, and the person at the
door asked if the admission was for my owner and "the lady." I was less
than thrilled).
Darkrose
Nancy M. Wallace @}----- dark...@shore.net
"...turning the sofa into a pygmy hippo...might be very good
transfiguration, but it's rather hard on the carpets and it
confuses the hippo."
Tanya Huff, _Summon the Keeper_