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Message from discussion Challenging the Quran, What went wrong ??!
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Jeremiah McAuliffe  
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 More options Jul 15 1998, 3:00 am
Newsgroups: soc.religion.islam
From: alim...@city-net.com (Jeremiah McAuliffe)
Date: 1998/07/15
Subject: Re: Challenging the Quran, What went wrong ??!
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Jochen Katz <jk...@math.gatech.edu> wrote:

>When Muhammad put this challenge before the Meccans then
>this was meant to be decidable in a short time. THEY should
>produce something and then based on whether they could or
>not, THEY should believe. Obviously, when one has to wait a
>millenium before one can decide whether something met the
>challenge, then it was useless for the Meccans, and is just
>as wrong a criterion today.

>I hope this is logical.

Nope. This is the same hermeneutic (that important word you ignore)
put forth by "Qur'an Only" people so they may discount "obey the
Prophet".

A Muslim's assumption regarding the Qur'an, as the genre of
"religious scripture", implies that the meaning of the text
transcends any one particular period of time, or culture-- allowing
for the archtypal events during the actual period of revelation. So,
"like it" changes due simply to time-- the fact that the text,
through time and across cultures, continues to have such an impact on
actual human thought, attitude and behavior, as it did at the
beginning. Simple.

>Every criterion for deciding whether a certain text
>satisfies the challenge must in principle be decidable
>in the same way also by the Meccans to whom this
>challenge originally was given or it doesn't make
>sense.

>Don't you agree? Or do you opt for a criterion that
>would have been nonsense to the original audience?

Nope and No. Again, that famous Katzian lack of imagination....

For instance, when the prohibition against khamer or wine came down
the people of the time had no knowledge of pot, or crack, or smack or
valium or bourban or champagne, etc. I'm sure you can fill in the
rest, Jochen.

>and his religion had none of the above. His own Qur'an
>would have failed your criterion at the time it was
>issued.

Right. And as the text moves through time, and thus shows more of
what it really is and different aspects of what it really is-- and
thus what is or would be "like it"  people still fail.... it is
harder now to come up with something "like it". They couldn't do it
when it would be easier, they certainly can't do it now.

Allahu akbar.

Upgrade this Fall
Jeremiah McAuliffe/ alim...@city-net.com
Visit Dr. Jihad! Page O' Heavy Issues
http://www.city-net.com/~alimhaq/miaha.html


 
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