On 26 Jun 1998 00:00:00 GMT, Jochen Katz <jk...@math.gatech.edu>
>Anway, everyone is invited to judge for himself if SaifullahHere we go again. first I would request our poor friends to read the
>and team have been honestly given all the sources on this issue
>or been very selective to slant the picture.... Here is the
>translation of the article. The Arabic and English version
>will go up on 'Answering Islam' soon.
page they are responding to first. Which I don't think it requires any
change at the moment.
Here is first the short and general answer for their blank response,
Ibn Sarh first converted to Islam *in Madina* as shown in the
Why is this important?
Because the great part of the response the author [Jochen's friend]
Why did the interpreters of the Quran then spoken about Srah? because
Let me give you this example; There is a verse in the Quran which the
Did you get the picture yet?
Secondly, you have been proven of, shamelessly, putting words into the
and it is there for everybody to see and to compare with what's on
So instead of wasting your time on bringing what have been already
so don't forget this time.
And now let us look into the so called answer of Jochen and friend.
>2. It is clear that the author of the response did the exact same thing heAt least here we had a partial confession. and we are waiting for the
>criticizes us of doing; for he himself quotes certain sources while ignoring
full one, if you still have traces of faith. thank you.
But it is totally absurd and childish, and unfair to be comparing the
>Now, let's investigate the given response.First here is what have been established, The above chapter is a
>The author objects to us saying that the reason for revealing (sabab
meccan chapter, and Ibn Sarh was not Moslem until later on when all
the meccan chapters were revealed, isn't that a satisfactory answer?
So the author go on listing the interpretations of the mentioned
So I'll skip it.
>Even though the author mentioned these texts and even may have read them, heThat is pure imagination from the author, these are already
>totally ignored them. Yet the problem is still standing, and we didn't
>invent these texts - we just copied them.
acknowledged and answered in the above site, so read about when Sarh
first became a Moslem. unless you want a glasses to read it.
>The author did the same thing when he talked about 'Ilm Urrijaal (theThe only quotation from Usud ALghab we have brought was where it
>Science of the Folk); he quoted Usuud Ulghaabah while ignoring the others.
>So we refute his book with another book, for Ibn Ab Al-Sarh's biography was
>in "Al-Isaabah fi Tamyeez Al-Sahabah" (Volume 4, Page 109, kaf = 0, ba' = 0,
>ha' = 4714) (from the Encyclopedia of the Prophet's Hadeeth "Mawsoo'at
>Al-Hadeeth Al-Nabawi" - Al-Areesh Company for Computers "Sharikat Al-Areesh
>lil-computer" - Beirut - 1998).
speaks about when Srah came to Islam, to establish that all the Meccan
chapters weren't talking about him.
so we supposed the author, by saying the above, will give another
What did the author add? NOTHING
So I'll skip, if you want to read then go back the message.
>And we ask again, why does the author of the response ignore this text?ask yourself ;-)
>This story appears a lot in many (Quran) commentaries, and in many HadeethWill here we go again. Can you name me one Saheeh hadith of the story?
>collections - and all these sources are Islamic.
the story can be found in Ibn Daoud complete collection of hadith and
it has been marked ***weak*** so can you tell us what do you mean by
Many? and at least tell us where we can find these many hadith?
You are poor in this my dear, any way we will be waiting for an answer
Salam for now
>The proposed solution by the author with is to criticize the chain of<laughing>
>narrators of the Hadeeth creates another problem for the Muslims; which is
>the ability to trust most Islamic sources.
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