[OT] OED definition of "pogue"
Trubert
be interested to know what other definitions people have for this word.
Trubert
---------------------
pogue. slang. Also poge.
[Perh. related to pough n.]
A bag, purse, wallet or container. Also by metonymy, money, takings. Also
attrib., as
pogue-hunter, a thief who steals purses, a pickpocket.
1812 J. H. Vaux Vocab. Flash Lang. in Mem. (1964) 259 Pogue, a bag,
(probably a corruption of poke.)
1879 J. W. Horsley in Macm. Mag. XL. 504/2, I went out the next day to
Maidenhead, and touched for some wedge and a poge (purse), with over five
quid in it.
1896 A. Morrison Child of Jago xxiii. 229 The pogue-hunter, emptying the
pogues in his pocket by sense of touch.
1906 E. Pugh Spoilers vi. 66 When the tiggies made a raid for a 'ot
poge~hunter or snidesman.
1942 Berrey & Van den Bark Amer. Thes. Slang §88/15 Purse, dummy,
hide,..poge, poke.
1975 M. Crichton Great Train Robbery v. 29 What's your pogue up there,
anyway?
Ibid. vii. 39 It was the stickman's job to take the pogue once Teddy had
snaffled it, thus leaving Teddy clean, should..a constable stop him.
D. Spencer Hines
Well, those are partial definitions. Some pogues look on the OED as the
Gospel Truth. It is not.
Delightful. Since Michael Crichton himself is validated as having used
<pogue> --- not once, but twice --- it must be a Good Thing.
N'est-ce pas?
A few short weeks ago, some blackguards, bombthrowers and mollycoddles
here were accusing me of having made up the word <pogue> ---- and now we
see Michael Crichton using it in 1975. I wonder if it's in his new
novel?
You pogues here are rather slow on the uptake.
Are you _all_ from Philadelphia?
In the other newsgroups they were much quicker to pick up the scent.
--
D. Spencer Hines
Lux et Veritas et Libertas
"Probitas Laudatur et Alget" [Honesty is praised and starves.], Decimus
Junius Juvenalis (Juvenal) [c. 50 A.D.-- c.130 A.D.], _Satires, I, line
74_
Trubert <tru...@angelfire.com> wrote in message
news:80sp70$e89$1...@pegasus.csx.cam.ac.uk...
D. Spencer Hines
No, I realise you're not from Philadelphia.
What are some other non-obscene British words, slang I suppose, for
chaps who generally drag their knuckles when they walk?
Words that Sherlock Holmes would have known are preferred.
Words that William The Marshal would have known are even better. Will
Shakespeare too.
Any Cambridge favourites? What do you call the Oxford drones, when
you're joshing?
Cheers and Aloha,
--
D. Spencer Hines
Lux et Veritas et Libertas
"Probitas Laudatur et Alget" [Honesty is praised and starves.], Decimus
Junius Juvenalis (Juvenal) [c. 50 A.D.-- c.130 A.D.], _Satires, I, line
74_
Trubert <tru...@angelfire.com> wrote in message
news:80t1jo$nf8$1...@pegasus.csx.cam.ac.uk...
| Actually, one of the reasons I posted the OED definition of "pogue" is
that
| I found it rather amusing in its own right, particularly since it here
seems
| to lack most of the common [modern] usages. In other dictionaries,
however,
| the word is usually absent altogether...
|
| That said, no dictionary even can be entirely reliable: language is
dynamic;
| dictionaries are not - in fact, they represent a wholly artificial
| construct. I don't like them too much; their best use is probably
humour,
| since CD-ROM editions aren't even any use for starting fires.
|
| Oh, and I do hope you aren't suggesting I'm from Philadelphia. That
would
| be rather inaccurate, to say the least :)
|
| Regards,
| Trubert
Paul J Gans
>Trubert
>---------------------
Ah so. But we are not classed as a pogue-hunter, merely as
pogues. Could it be that the person who uses this term has
made another gaffe, a pratfall, a boo-boo?
It *is* clever of it to not define the term but to continue
on as if somehow *we* were at fault for not knowing what
it is. We *do* know what a pogue is, vide supra.
----- Paul J. Gans [ga...@panix.com]
Trubert
Jason Ehlers
word which supposedly means "to kiss."
Anyway, that's what I've been told by my
wife who hasn't had Gaelic for years, but
gets pogued quite frequenlty.
Regards:
Jason
to reply, remove "nospam" from mailing address!
ON TO VALHALLA!
Lblanch001
>Oh, and I do hope you aren't suggesting I'm from Philadelphia.
Nothing wrong with being from Philadelphia.
Regards,
Laura Blanchard
lblan...@aol.com (or lbla...@pobox.upenn.edu)
http://www.r3.org/
(see http://orb.rhodes.edu/ to reach major medieval gateway sites)
Trubert
Philadelphia...just that it would be inaccurate by a couple of thousand
miles in my case.
Regards :)
Trubert
Lblanch001 <lblan...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:19991117074255...@ng-ch1.aol.com...
Paul J Gans
>Trubert says:
>>Oh, and I do hope you aren't suggesting I'm from Philadelphia.
>Nothing wrong with being from Philadelphia.
She's right. It is like being *from* Cleveland. Many
people including Paul Newman and Bob Hope are *from*
Cleveland. Very few ever go back.
<ducks and runs for cover>
Efy leonar
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>From: Paul J Gans ga...@panix.com
>Newsgroups: soc.history.medieval
>Date: 17 Nov 1999 23:13:51 GMT
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>(i386))
Aww, c'mon Paul, you're always
telling me what a great place it is.:)
Love
E
Afropea
>She's right. It is like being *from* Cleveland. Many
>people including Paul Newman and Bob Hope are *from*
>Cleveland. Very few ever go back.
Maybe they should. Cleveland has one of the best art museums
in the US. Getting back on topic here (at least back to the
MIddle Ages) the Cleveland Art Museum has some wonderful
examples of Medieval Art. It's been a long time since I've been
there, but I seem to recall some top notch cloisonne from Limoges.
They also have an incredible collection of Asian Art.
Eve
Eric P. Fein
Afropea wrote:
> Maybe they should. Cleveland has one of the best art museums
> in the US. Getting back on topic here (at least back to the
> MIddle Ages) the Cleveland Art Museum has some wonderful
> examples of Medieval Art. It's been a long time since I've been
> there, but I seem to recall some top notch cloisonne from Limoges.
> They also have an incredible collection of Asian Art.
And Egyptian. :)
They also have the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame there, but, to be frank,
it's not even remotely worth the price of admission. Somehow, when I
went, I couldn't shake the "I just paid $12 to see John Lennon's report
card?!?!?" feeling. Neat stuff, but the place is too big and empty.
Besides, why go to Cleveland when you can go to the Met in New York?
:)
Start spreadin' the news...
eric
Liz Broadwell
: Maybe they should. Cleveland has one of the best art museums
: in the US. Getting back on topic here (at least back to the
: MIddle Ages) the Cleveland Art Museum has some wonderful
: examples of Medieval Art. It's been a long time since I've been
: there, but I seem to recall some top notch cloisonne from Limoges.
: They also have an incredible collection of Asian Art.
The Philadelphia Museum of Art recently revamped their medieval wing, and
it's great fun to visit, IMHO. The space is bright and easy to move
through, and you can get right up close to the altarpieces and try to
puzzle out the Latin. :-)
Peace,
Liz
--
Elizabeth Broadwell | "Then something Tookish woke up inside him,
(ebro...@english.upenn.edu) | and he wished to go and see the great moun-
English Department | tains, and hear the pine-trees and the wa-
34th & Walnut Streets | terfalls, and explore the caves, and wear a
University of Pennsylvania | sword instead of a walking-stick."
Philadelphia, PA | -- J.R.R. Tolkien, _The Hobbit_
Paul J Gans
>>people including Paul Newman and Bob Hope are *from*
>>Cleveland. Very few ever go back.
>>
>Aww, c'mon Paul, you're always
>telling me what a great place it is.:)
Sure. Just don't forget that I'm *from* Cleveland too...
Paul J Gans
>>people including Paul Newman and Bob Hope are *from*
>>Cleveland. Very few ever go back.
>Maybe they should. Cleveland has one of the best art museums
>in the US. Getting back on topic here (at least back to the
>MIddle Ages) the Cleveland Art Museum has some wonderful
>examples of Medieval Art. It's been a long time since I've been
>there, but I seem to recall some top notch cloisonne from Limoges.
>They also have an incredible collection of Asian Art.
Oh yes. It is a gem. Actually, Cleveland has undergone
a bit of a renaissance in the past 10 years or so. Many
of the cultural centers are located together in Wade Park.
Thus the Art Museum is but a short walk from Severance Hall
(the home of the Cleveland Orchestra) which in turn is
across the street from Case-Western Reserve University.
There are about 50 other cultural institutions within
easy walking distance of those.
Still, I too am *from* Cleveland...
Todd A. Farmerie
>
> Oh yes. It is a gem. Actually, Cleveland has undergone
> a bit of a renaissance in the past 10 years or so. Many
> of the cultural centers are located together in Wade Park.
> Thus the Art Museum is but a short walk from Severance Hall
> (the home of the Cleveland Orchestra) which in turn is
> across the street from Case-Western Reserve University.
> There are about 50 other cultural institutions within
> easy walking distance of those.
And while we are at it, (and somewhat more on topic) most Clevelanders
(Clevelandites ?) are not aware that the Cleveland Public Libraries has
a huge collection (third only to LOC and NYPL) of historical material,
including obscure local English antiquarian society publications and
arabic histories of Spain.
> Still, I too am *from* Cleveland...
Soon to be . . . .
taf
D. Spencer Hines
Spoken with the true arrogance of a New Yorker.
--
D. Spencer Hines
Lux et Veritas et Libertas
"There're two kinds of people in this life, my friend --- those who have
loaded guns and those who dig. You dig." --- Clint Eastwood as The Man
With No Name "The Good, The Bad and The Ugly" --- Sergio Leone [1966]
Lblanch001
>Besides, why go to Cleveland when you can go to the Met in New York?
Disclaimer -- I saw Eric's smiley but thought I'd answer it seriously anyhow.
New York arguably has the country's richest holdings of medieval art and
artifacts. Philadelphia, with which I am more familiar, is also in the top tier
of "U.S. medieval destination cities", and I'm more familiar with the holdings
here, so I'll use it as my example.
It'sl good to see what's in other museums, which of course is why museums
often do shows on a particular artist, school, etc., that blend their own
holdings with works borrowed from other institutions. The "Recognizing Van
Eyck" show that drew sellout crowds here at the Philadelphia Museum of Art
paired a painting of St. Francis receiving the stigmata with another on the
same subject located at Galleria Sabauda inTurin. Similarly, while the
Philadelphia Museum of Art holds the stunning Rogier Van der Weyden
crucifixion, the Cleveland Museum of Art holds another version of this painting
believed to have been done by one of his followers. Thus, a trip to Cleveland's
museum is worthwhile for me for comparison purposes, even though the
Philadelphia holdings are an order of magnitude larger than Cleveland's. Even
small museums -- at the moment I'm thinking of the Taft in Cincinnati, which is
a house museum and not the city's primary art museum -- can hold choice
gatherings of fine objects.
I wonder if anyone has compiled any sort of guide to "medieval U.S.A." It would
be a worthy enterprise, very helpful to a certain kind of traveler.
Efy leonar
>Path:
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t-for-mail
>From: "Eric P. Fein" waka-...@worldnet.att.net
>Newsgroups: soc.history.medieval
>Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:47:41 -0500
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>
>
>
>
>
>>Besides, why go to Cleveland when you can go to the Met in New York?
>
>:)
Uhhh....dunno. Actually, I do know..
to visit my friends at the Cleveland
Clinic and CWRU Medical School!
NY is a great place, but slightly
less great for the absence of those
two fine ladies.
>
>Start spreadin' the news...
>
>eric
>
Best
Efy Leonardi
>
>
>
Mike Lawson
> I wonder if anyone has compiled any sort of guide to "medieval
> U.S.A." It would be a worthy enterprise, very helpful to a
> certain kind of traveler.
There is a guide to art museums that I've seen at the Cincinnati
Art Museum gift shop; it's not a local publication, but I don't
know whether the book is published regionally or nationally.
While it doesn't cover medieval work per se, it does a blurb
on each museum in each city and identifies which works of
art you shouldn't miss in each. It does a fairly good job
of covering the feel of museums locally in about a paragraph
or two. I may quibble about the "must-see" works, though
I can understand different viewpoints; not everyone likes the
Del Greco that the Cincinnati Art Museum has.
--Mike L.
--
Michael Lawson | "We fight, get beat, rise,
Software QA Engineer II - SDRC | and fight again."
e-mail: mike....@sdrc.com | -Nathaniel Greene
Juho Mattila
> artifacts.
And some of its buildings have a medieval 'touch' - there's a peculiar site called
Medieval New York, it's very entertaining.
http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/med/medny.html
Lblanch001
Juho Mattila writes:
>And some of its buildings have a medieval 'touch' - there's a peculiar site
>called
>Medieval New York, it's very entertaining.
>http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/med/medny.html
I don't think it's peculiar at all; in fact, I thought it was a remarkably
inventive piece of pedagogy. I confess, I had Paul Halsall's "Medieval New
York" page in mind when I suggested it would be nice to have a "medieval
U.S.A." guide.
Paul J Gans
>> Still, I too am *from* Cleveland...
>Soon to be . . . .
Todd has a good point. My first forays into things
medieval were at the Cleveland Public Library, first
with an unabridged Malory and second with there nice
collection of pipe rolls.
---- Paul J. Gans [ga...@panix.com]
Afropea
>And Egyptian. :)
It's funny that you mention the Egyptian art at the
Cleveland. It's been a long long time since I've been
there, but when I last visited I spoke with the curator
who was complaining about how they were trying to
weed out all the fakes, of which there was an abundance.
There's a lot of fake Egyptian art all over. There was a
big vogue for Egyptian art in the 20s and museums
were more enthusiastic than cautious. The Cleveland, however,
tries to only show the very best and I expect by now they've
gotton rid of all the imposters.
At the time I was at the Cleveland, they prided themselves on
the quality of their holdings in all the areas represented. One
look and you'll see that they had every right to do so. If I recall,
their Medieval collection was one of the museum's cornerstones.
They also excelled in their presentations. They put a lot of work
in the galleries themselves, not just their choices of art.
Actually, my American faves for Egyptian are the Met and the
Brooklyn. The Oriental Institute in Chicago has quite a collection
of both Egyptian and Ancient Near East.
Eve
Lblanch001
>
>Todd has a good point. My first forays into things
>medieval were at the Cleveland Public Library, first
>with an unabridged Malory and second with there nice
>collection of pipe rolls.
You could see an unabridged Malory in New York, of course...as a matter of
fact, the only remaining original Caxton. It's at the Pierpont Morgan.
Brian M. Scott
> Afropea <afr...@aol.com> wrote:
[...]
> >Maybe they should. Cleveland has one of the best art museums
> >in the US. Getting back on topic here (at least back to the
> >MIddle Ages) the Cleveland Art Museum has some wonderful
> >examples of Medieval Art. It's been a long time since I've been
> >there, but I seem to recall some top notch cloisonne from Limoges.
> >They also have an incredible collection of Asian Art.
> Oh yes. It is a gem. Actually, Cleveland has undergone
> a bit of a renaissance in the past 10 years or so. Many
> of the cultural centers are located together in Wade Park.
> Thus the Art Museum is but a short walk from Severance Hall
> (the home of the Cleveland Orchestra) which in turn is
> across the street from Case-Western Reserve University.
> There are about 50 other cultural institutions within
> easy walking distance of those.
The revamped Armor Court at the the Art Museum is definitely worth a
look, and for those who like their history *really* ancient, I believe
that the Natural Science Museum has put a lot of work into its exhibits
recently.
Brian M. Scott
Paul J Gans
>>And some of its buildings have a medieval 'touch' - there's a peculiar site
>>called
>>Medieval New York, it's very entertaining.
>>http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/med/medny.html
>I don't think it's peculiar at all; in fact, I thought it was a remarkably
>inventive piece of pedagogy. I confess, I had Paul Halsall's "Medieval New
>York" page in mind when I suggested it would be nice to have a "medieval
>U.S.A." guide.
Paul put it together by assigning the finding of "medieval"
sites in New York to his students and then asked a number
of us in the New York area to add to it. The result is
a very nice page. He, of course, put it together.
Paul J Gans
>Paul says:
>>
>>Todd has a good point. My first forays into things
>>medieval were at the Cleveland Public Library, first
>>with an unabridged Malory and second with there nice
>>collection of pipe rolls.
>You could see an unabridged Malory in New York, of course...as a matter of
>fact, the only remaining original Caxton. It's at the Pierpont Morgan.
Yes, but at the time it would have been a long commute
for a 16-year old boy... ;-)
Manny Olds
> Eric Fein says
>>And Egyptian. :)
> It's funny that you mention the Egyptian art at the
> Cleveland. It's been a long long time since I've been
> there, but when I last visited I spoke with the curator
> who was complaining about how they were trying to
> weed out all the fakes, of which there was an abundance.
> There's a lot of fake Egyptian art all over.
I think it is interesting that the Rosicrucian Museum in San Jose has so
many fakes, on purpose. They seem to think that their educational mission
is primary, so if they don't have an original available to make an
important point, they use a good (and well-labeled) reproduction. It lets
you get a lot out of a very small museum.
Are there any good museums of medieval material that take this approach?
--
Manny Olds <old...@clark.net> of Riverdale Park, Maryland, USA
What does the flame think of the moth?
Edward John Schoenfeld
University of Pittsburgh -- a 1930's era skyscraper built in Gothic revival
style. It was a real kick to teach gothic architecture by pointing at the
classroom ceiling!
ED
----------
In article <19991118154200...@ng-ch1.aol.com>,
lblan...@aol.com (Lblanch001) wrote:
>>
>Juho Mattila writes:
>
>>And some of its buildings have a medieval 'touch' - there's a peculiar site
>>called
>>Medieval New York, it's very entertaining.
>>http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/med/medny.html
>
>I don't think it's peculiar at all; in fact, I thought it was a remarkably
>inventive piece of pedagogy. I confess, I had Paul Halsall's "Medieval New
>York" page in mind when I suggested it would be nice to have a "medieval
>U.S.A." guide.
>
CG Luxford
On Sat, 20 Nov 1999, Edward John Schoenfeld wrote:
> IMO one absolutely indispensable site is the Cathedral of Learning at the
> University of Pittsburgh -- a 1930's era skyscraper built in Gothic revival
> style. It was a real kick to teach gothic architecture by pointing at the
> classroom ceiling!
>
Does it actually use Gothic building methods though, or is it a 1930s
skyscraper, with gothic revival decoration.
I was told that the last Gothic Revival building to be built was the
Wills Memorial Building at the University of Bristol, it was officially
opened by the King in 1925.
Of course that may just have been referring to Britain.
Chris,
CJD.Roberts
"D. Spencer Hines" <N...@ToSpam.edu> wrote:
> Vide infra.
>
> Well, those are partial definitions. Some pogues look on the OED as
the
> Gospel Truth. It is not.
The expression obviously comes from:-
(one has bought) "a pike in a pogue"!
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Edward John Schoenfeld
>
>On Sat, 20 Nov 1999, Edward John Schoenfeld wrote:
>
>> IMO one absolutely indispensable site is the Cathedral of Learning at the
>> University of Pittsburgh -- a 1930's era skyscraper built in Gothic revival
>> style. It was a real kick to teach gothic architecture by pointing at the
>> classroom ceiling!
>>
>Does it actually use Gothic building methods though, or is it a 1930s
>skyscraper, with gothic revival decoration.
>
>I was told that the last Gothic Revival building to be built was the
>Wills Memorial Building at the University of Bristol, it was officially
>opened by the King in 1925.
>
According to the tour guides, the skeleton of the building is designed
around a central main structure (one cant really call it a nave as it is
rather square-ish) supported by buttresses. But the space between the
buttresses and the main structure had been filled in (i.e. they were not
'flying' but had been enclosed with curtain walls to add even more
office/classroom space). How accurate the tour guides were about this I am
unsure -- I personally thought that if the outer walls marked the buttresses
they were rather too close to the 34 story main structure to be effective.
But this may have been made possible by stronger materials used in a
'revival' style. I can say that walking into reading hall the first floor
gave me about the same feeling as walking into an 'authentic' cathedral,
although the use to which the building was put prevented there being lots of
stained glass windows.
In the tour guides' favor, there are quite a few revival buildings in
Pittsburgh -- one Early Romanesque revival church is now a brew pub, and it
was almost perfect -- very 11th century feeling when I was at it.
Ed